You don't own your Windows PC (Microsoft owns it!)
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- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
- Used to be, when you purchased a computer or had one built, you owned the computer. You didn't need to create an online cloud account just to use the thing (you technically still don't, but it's more challenging to bypass the Microsoft Account "requirement"). When the next version of Windows was released, backwards compatibility was generally good with older systems. Windows Update would download and install updates for the operating system and drivers, but it would leave the BIOS and firmware of components untouched. As flashing the BIOS or firmware is a risky thing to do, it was best left for a tech to do. Nowadays, there's an increasingly common trend from Windows update in Windows 10 and Windows 11 to not only download and install OS updates and drivers, but also firmware updates for the system's motherboard, drives, and more. I find this trend very disturbing, as it effectively takes away control of hardware level changes from the consumer. There are times when updating the BIOS, or firmware of a component is extremely risky, such as during severe weather when power interruptions are more likely. There are also other things that can cause a BIOS update to fail. Motherboard OEMs have cautioned about BIOS updates, stating they should only be done if the update is to fix a known issue, or to allow for something such as a CPU upgrade.
You don't own your PC anymore. Microsoft effectively does.
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In some fairness: It's the OEM of the computer that decides if it actually wants to distribute firmware updates over the UEFI Update Capsule method (LVFS on linux or Windows Update for that matter)
Most business class systems like the Optiplex 3040 have the option in the UEFI menu to disable that distribution method altogether.
this can happen on custom motherboards too. Some Asus boards will download bios updated too. I think this is actually microsoft trying to integrate bios updates in windows update and has nothing to do with the oem itself
@@nushnume Its about what the mobo manufacturer wants
The Windows updates have always frustrated me. Windows requiring TPM2.0 for Win11 was the final straw that pushed me to start using Linux 100% of the time. At least with Linux I get to choose how the updates behave and when they are installed. It's quite handy having the OS pull the vendor firmware, but I want control over how that is installed.
There should be a option to choose which updates you want to install even if it is critical update and that is my opinion
I think it's good that microsoft makes it easy to install BIOS updates, especially when they include CPU security patches because no one goes out of their way to do so. They really need to throw up a warning though about how power interruptions can damage your system and make you confirm before it installs.
They should make firmware/BIOS updates optional, and not include them in the required updates. This gives the user better control over when to install these kinds of updates. And like you mentioned, there should be a warning message displayed before installing these kinds of updates. The only time the system displayed a warning message was when the BIOS update had begun.
Ah, somebody fair that also understands.
But technology has come further and they do have 2 copies of the firmware so even with a failed update, you cannot brick it!
@@pepeshopping Rubbish, you can still break a PC updating the BIOS even today if it fails, and for someone who doesn't know what they are doing this can be a serious problem
@@pepeshopping A lot do but most lower end pre builds don’t.
@@geoffmitchell1978 I will say I once bricked an old hp installing a bad bios but it could be recovered if you put the bios files on a usb and hold specific keys but that’s not something your average user would do.
A lot of modern systems have automatic bios recovery if a flash fails. Also its the vendors that push the firmware out over windows update. Additionally its a good thing that the bios is updated as it patches a lot of vulnerabilities. For my job it makes my life much easier because i then dont have to manually handle it. Dont get me wrong, you dont own your computer now if you run windows, ive daily driven linux for years now and dont regret it
yes you do own your computer .....its the software....(ms windows) that you dont own.
When i purchased this laptop it had options on the bios to turn off usb chaging feature and to control cpu fan speed, after one microsoft update to the bios the options were gone forcing me to install a piece of bloatware to manage the features from windows, another bios update later my laptop had BSOD because they turned on optane by default, ultimately i decided to run a script on windows to only get security updates, no more drivers or features updates for my windows, now i am using linux on the same laptop and every day it is harder for me to log in to windows.
Dell probably gave Microsoft the updates as a lot of manufacturers do it. Intel, realtek, AMD, etc. So it's the manufacturer of the device uploading it to Microsoft's database really
Sounds about right.
@@onepeteone well i would like to have the latest bios on my pc ( even though personality i don't have problems with my almost 5 yrs old version of bios) and i haven't never seen them appear in windows updates.
@@anarkidude9360 Yes. It's not safe and it should be your choice. Totally agree, but what Ember said is what is probably going on. I will be keeping my eyes out for Window firmware updates, that's for sure!!! Thanks for making me aware. Bless.
❤ video and new sub to channel. Just experienced this last week. My laptop's bios recently updated under Win 11 automatic update. I didn't want it bc the new bios has bugs. Ended up turning off automatic updates for drivers but left other updates on and hopefully that won't happen again. Glad my bios can back flash! Thanks for confirming what I suspected happened during the update. MS should not be updating my bios without my input. #myPC
Windows 10 needs to be supported after 2025 and 2026 the amount of E-Waste made if Microsoft ends support to windows 10.
Microsoft should be ashamed for all of this. 100%
I think you're going to see this more now that big UEFI vulnerability (LogoFAIL )has been discovered and effects both windows and linux, and we know most people never even touch the settings in that let alone update it.
I could find this feature really helpful for people that dont like flashing the conventional way. But on the other hand, remember when the Asus STRIX motherboards were frying am5 cpus? And they told you to NOT flash the new patch, otherwise it would void warranty? I could see that as a big shit show
(Edit) I think that Dell firmware update is only a dell thing. No other mobos update bios through windows update. And also to clear up any confusion, windows isnt deciding that your computer is e-waste, its not like they destroy the hardware in it. The soft lock for windows 11 is only so we didnt have another windows vista moment, like it says it will run, but in reality it ran like crap and everyone blamed vista for it. But there are ways to get around the soft lock if you do end up wanting to get the new updates and features. One thing I REALLY hate about Microsoft tho, is that they will make you add an account to anything that youre doing, almost to the point that its predatory. And even in some applications, youd sign into your microsoft account, then the local account you created would have a microsoft account attached to it. Its insane how theyre allowed to do that.
I own an ASUS Z690-P WiFi D4 motherboard, and around last year they did distribute a BIOS update through Windows Update 3 days after the BIOS version was released. Fortunately, this one was optional. My guess is that ASUS might have been testing this, but I’ll never know for sure the true reason. I definitely agree that certain updates should be forced such what you said. I also think the patches for LogoFAIL should be forced at one point, but only to the boards that have at least a recovery implementation that the user can easily understand. For Gigabyte DualBIOS, that should be seamless since it’s an automatic process. For ASUS’s CrashFree BIOS, that’s a bit iffy, as if someone was unprepared to get a backup USB formatted as Fat32 and has the file necessary to recover. Granted, they would need a secondary system that would let them do this.
As for BIOS Flashback exclusive boards, I’m not sure how that process would go if an update went wrong. If a user who has absolutely no idea what the BIOS is and just sees a black screen, I’m not sure if they would even understand what to do in that situation (mainly users who by prebuilts, I doubt this would apply to many self builders)
One time, a BIOS update installed from WIndows Update on an HP laptop I had. It restarted, installed the update, then rebooted a few more times before it automatically booted into the BIOS recovery utility, said the update "failed" and automatically reverted the changes (the laptop was plugged it during the update; it wasn't unplugged and the power didn't go out or anything during the update, so not sure what happened there). Windows Update didn't try to reinstall it again even though the BIOS update didn't work, probably because it updates the BIOS firmware Windows driver before it reboots the laptop to update the BIOS, so it "looks" like the update worked and the BIOS is up-to-date to Windows, even though it actually isn't. When a newer BIOS update came out later on, that update installed just fine, so not sure what happened with that previous update. Although to date, that's the only "failed" BIOS update I've experienced thus far (installed via Windows Update or manually), so there's that I guess.
Of course however, the only thing that saved that HP laptop from getting bricked was the BIOS recovery utility it had. If the laptop didn't have that or a fallback BIOS, and the update failed or didn't install correctly, then it would've likely been bricked. Fun!
As a computer tech and Linux user (dual boot so I can game in Windows), i have to somewhat disagree with the hate here. While I do agree with the power issue and what it can cause, now a days with UEFI firmware exploits like logo fail, I think it can be a good thing this is delivered automatically. Most all users will never update their BIOS and will therefore be vulnerable to these exploits, and let’s be honest, more are going to come.
It's not just windows. I have a similar Dell PC but is a 3040. I had Linux installed on it and it ALSO downloaded the firmware update for the BIOS. I had bought it at a pawn shop at a discount and was surprised that the firmware update option showed up when it was getting updates.
Edit: as you mentioned, the BIOS or firmware updates are only AS NEEDED they should be optional not a requirement.
Which distrobution? Are you sure it was BIOS update not the linux-firmware package?
@@neilbrideau8520 it specifically said DELL-Firmware on the update list under Zorin OS 17, long story short I was going to try and get a Minecraft Server running under Linux but sadly it was more of a hassle to setup than I had initially expected. So I have switched to Tiny11 and it works fine.
@@neilbrideau8520 fedora offers bios updates through lvfs easily
This is a VERY GOOD reason to invest in a UPS (Uninterruptible Power Supply). There you go: backup battery power for a DESKTOP PC!
Tip: you can recover a bricked bios using a USB ch341a programmer
While I agree. The average consumer is not going to be doing that. Microsoft knows this. Seems to me that Microsoft and the prebuilt market is making money by creating unnecessary E-waste while also stating they're all for saving the environment on their websites
No no no I am not suggesting that at all lol. Im just saying to cube computer channel that like if you have some knowledge not all hope is lost. Using a ch341a programmer is not exactly the easiest thing in the world to begin with@@ABizzyBYT
Rufus says Microsoft does NOT get to decide when your PC is rubbish :)
You can disable automatic BIOS and Firmware updates via GPO. Just enable "Do not include" policy.
Or if they send you the wrong BIOS even that can brick it.
Windows installed the wrong bios upgrade on my lenovo thinkpad somehow and it stopped working
Windows tried to do the same on my thinkpad, although the BIOS update just failed and everything was fine after.
Linux does this too, on KDE Plasma, in Discover, it shows I have an HP firmware update ready to install. The difference is, I can choose not to install that update. You don't get that choice on Windows. I understand why they do it, bios updates are important. They include bug fixes, stability improvements, new features (like supporting newer cpus), and security patches. I use arch btw.
I don't think the firmware updates from Windows upgrade are changing you bios. I know the naming is confusing, but there are also firmware updates in Linux. The don't change the bios. They are binary blobs required for certain parts of the hardware to work, including the CPU. I am not an expert. The one for the CPU might not be required but some other things may not work without it.
Firmware is a new name for BIOS. UEFI BIOS is commonly known as "firmware".
for you i would recommend investing Windows 10/11 pro as there you get access to group policy editor.
there you can set local policy that windows always asks before downloading or installing updates.
i have been using that since 2015 and never once has windows forcefully installed any updates and rebooted on me.
also it depends on your computer if bios/uefi gets updates from windows update or not.
for example my Clevo based Optane 3 gaming laptop from PC Specialist's never once has automatically updated it's uefi through windows update.
and i know as there had been some features removed on the newer bios versions, so i would know immediately if Windows had updated my uefi without notice.
I have a video on how to do this exact thing...
ua-cam.com/video/WkT59S7U5kU/v-deo.html
I don't think Windows 10 is as bad as Windows 11. One of my clients has a Dell gaming laptop running Windows 11 and it had about one firmware update a month, which is absolutely insane! Fortunately, when Windows 10 goes EOL there will be no more garbage downloading from the internet. I am never going to Windows 11. I am looking at migrating completely to Linux.
Windows and Microsoft have never been on my Linux Mint PC.
you use windows........what happens when you open something?.......it opens in a window :) so you are using windows to ....just not ms windows.
@@christopher480 I almost threw up reading that I don't use an operating system named windows. Is that clear enough?
I work in IT support and let me tell you
This has to be the best worst thing Microsoft has ever done in Windows update.
Best in the sense the end users computers are more secure with the latest CPU/bios patches
Worst in the sence of end users.
End uses are the worst when it comes to their IT equipment. If they can find a way to use their computers in the stupidest way possible, they will. Most end users will just hold the power button down during an update so they can use their computers again quicker, meaning on several occasions we have had computers in the office because they're no longer posting.
This is why I've held off leaving Windows 7 for so long. They started this crap long ago hijacking Windows 7 to 10 without your permission. This is why you need to manage updates yourself and not let Microsoft do it for you. Everyone should use WUA Manager or an independent program like it. Also, if you don't want feature updates, use GRC In Control. Sadly you also have to watch what updates you install also since MS has stopped testing updates before they release them. You're now the Beta testers. I do mine once a month after I determine they are safe.
it just a firmware update provided by the manufacturer. windows update just a redistribute
"Unless you want to install Linux" - It's humorous that you say that like it's a bad thing. Microsoft does not "own" your computer. An argument could surely be made that they "own" your OS given their numerous suspect policies, however that's a much different thing. If you are competent enough to understand the "danger" of flashing the BIOS of a modern machine switch your OS and stop complaining. Want change in the industry? Speak with your wallet, pretty easy.
I have been a windows user since my childhood. I went from DOS to windows 95. I am now a Linux user. Windows (Microsoft) has gone too far. Ai in Win11/12. All of the spying. I just can't do it no more. I will never go back to Windows. My PC is mine. When I get to the retirement age. You best believe I am trashing all of my online accounts.
Seem like Microsoft trying to be a Apple computer
3:52 some time you’ve to fight with windows to accept connecting new devices without updating what they want to download
I have a hp laptop, clicked restart (update) and see the bios update... (i didn't got enought batterie to be confortable installing it...)
Who in their right mind would update or do a bios update while a storm going on, smart person would wait you can tell updates to do later
The problem is Microsoft took that choice away from the user. All it would take is for there to be severe weather or winds outside of the active hours. Since this BIOS update was mandatory, it would have automatically installed on its own without any input from the user outside of active hours.
A failure of this firmware update happened to an old lady's 1 year old Dell Inspiron laptop that i had to fix. Something happened and the cpu fan would run full speed no matter if the laptop was hot or not,and it would complain that it can't detect the fan during boot. I changed the fan and it still didn't fix it,also updated the bios from Dell's website which was the latest and it didn't fix it either and to make matters worse Windows Update was downloading another firmware again even if i installed the latest one that was on Dell's own website. That laptop is literally ruined now because i can't get it to control the fan anymore so she's stuck to use it with the fan running full speed all the time
Big mistake brother.
NEVER ever press WINDOWS UPDATE.
what you should do is. Disconnect your pc to PC before you turn it of. And search service "WINDOWS UPDATE" change it from manual/automatic to disable.
and good ol boy microsoft will change that setting back to manual/automatic in 24 hour.
So make sure you also check it.
and remember disconnect your PC from internet when you not use it.
Never had a problem with a bios update. I have a PC with windows 98 on it. If you don't like it use Linux.
My HP laptop which i don't use much decided to bios update WHILE I WAS TRAVELING. It was running of of battery, and i don't know what the percentage of the battery, usually its pretty bad. I was pretty scared the entire time
You are correct. However - relax bro.
good thing I don't have a dell or a pre-built
I build my own from parts, so I can't buy dell parts unless on the used market
so windows can't update my bios at all
lenovo and hp to. and windows update on my lenovo and hp computers windows updates "donwgrades" gpu drivres.
no its not a good question.......of course i own my own computer.......but if i want to use ms windows(which ms owns) i have to give in to their eula.......but that isnt the only os out there.......i can choose whatever os i want to put on my hardware........if thats not ownership i dont what is
This is ridiculous! First was software and graphics updates that ruin your PC and now this crap??? What is wrong with Microsoft? 😡😠
This happened with my hp laptop, it almost flashed my bios, but i quickly stopped it. I hate microsoft
Stupid windows update , it happend same to me at Lenovo thinkpad and razer blade 14 . Windows push me flash BIOS , luckily nothing bad happend
i got a dell laptop 11gen and have uptdate bios at least 4 times
I've lost a few laptops to this support garbage. Keep up the great work dude, lovin' the content!
A few? You must be doing something wrong.
Ah…do tell us the specific details. Models, symptoms, steps done to brick them. Pictures…
I haven't forever lost 'em, just lost them in a sense of "support" They still run fine, but y'know.@@pepeshopping
@@pepeshopping We get it. You're perfect and have done nothing wrong. Myself, and other viewers of this video have no obligation to show you proof of anything. You have your opinions, and others have theirs.
This is why I hate dell hp as well. I have old laptop run windows 10 just excellent it’s 12 years old still great it’s called Toshiba laptop and other I have new laptop run windows 11 on asus laptop no problem I prefer laptop than desktop is easily bricks it I don’t trust it. Go laptop from desktop
OMG I hate when Windows 10 does this! Microsoft also made me update my bios which crashed my pc and I had to reinstall Windows to fix it. 🙄😤💩
Ugh! Forced windows updates are BS
Insert “Windows made me racist” meme video here
RELAX and ADMIT that if they didn’t, you would complain as well!
First, it is an OPTIONAL update!
(unless deemed critical, necessary).
Some were needed due to the vulnerabilities found in the Intel CPUs!
No! I have NEVER lost a PC due to a BIOS update (more than 100 PCs, more than 2-3 updates EACH), but that’s what ignorant wannabe techies say as they have no knowledge of what happens under the hood and the failsafes to prevent it from bricking during an update!
Don’t mention HEARSAY:
Show, prove to us your points!
No, it was not optional. It was automatically queued to install. If it was optional, it would be a different story. Automatically installing BIOS updates can definitely put the system at risk of getting bricked, especially if the update installs during severe weather.
On a clean copy of windows 10 I have never seen an optional update install itself automatically. That being said I wouldn't put it past dell or the user to alter the computer in a way that this might happen.
well you need to understand that windows is made by microsoft it is there operating system they can do whatever they want i do not see microsoft giveing you control of windows updates or not forcing you into using a microsoft account ever again
They own the operating system - not the computer it's installed on. Forcing firmware updates on something Microsoft has no ownership of crosses the line.
than why do you think that firmware updates are forced on people
@@ScottJacobs-lk7eg The firmware update in the video was *not an optional update* and was pending installation as soon as I opened Windows Update.
@@CubeComputerChannel i always thought that firmware updates where safe because every time i do firmware updates for my mom and dad it was successful but i do understand where you are coming from that
maybe it should not be forced if you have a storm coming but anyway haven't computers always down firmware updates via windows update cause it just seems for
as long as i can remember firmware updates have always been not a optional update
I struggled to watch this entire video. You don't support signed Microsoft firmware updates because they "may" be risky if you lose power in a winter storm? Your upset that an enterprise class company is not willing to support legacy hardware due to numerous reasons I don't need to explain? Who is your youtube audience? Clearly not at all business or enterprise space. Stop focusing on your enemy (Microsoft) and move to the opensource world where you feel like you have all the control :-)
I own mine... I use Linux..!