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So, you don't think you need Traction Control? | Testing DSC on Goodwood Skid Pan | BMW M140i w. LSD
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- Опубліковано 13 кві 2021
- I took a BMW M140i onto the Goodwood Skid Pan and tested the different traction control settings and their effects at full throttle - the differences were incredible, and a testament to how clever the BMW traction control systems are!
Huge thanks to Goodwood Motor Circuit for the use of their skid pan facility, and a massive thanks to my buddy Reg for letting me slide and spin his BMW around while he followed in my little Civic with some cameras on!
Goodwood Spin & Slide Experience...
www.goodwood.com/experiences/...
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/ @roadreg1820
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#M140i #MDM #DSC
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Disclaimer
*Some scenes were filmed on private land with permission.
*Some scenes are edited and maybe sped up for dramatic effect.
*Always drive well within the limit of your ability.
I think a lot of people are unaware of how good, (or bad), a driver they are simply because of the existence of these driver aids.
Haha, yeah you might be right, MDM can make you look like a hero! 😎😉
@@RickTheSpud It did for me and that was only in a 120d.
@@gottliebdee263 😆😎👌
I think it depends on the car cause it isn't the same technology or quality aids. Well, depends a lot if the driver is very good or very bad... So when you go at limits it's very difficult that aids helps you but a very bad driver could be a lot easier for electronics cause the wrong imputs.
But yeah, in the case like in this video, aids helps a lot for sure. It's very wet surface and in that circumstances the electronics can help a lot more
I had a prodrive upgraded GC8 years ago along with a fast road chassis set up with German made GSD3 tyres.
Ok, no driver aids or such but the car was definitely a better driver than me 😂
It'd let you recover some outrageous moments and I took that as I was a driving god.
Right up until the point I mistook a section of road for another and came barreling in like a cretin to what I thought was the entry to a long sweeping S section and it was actually a tight right.
Never seen all four tyres smoke from a sustained sideways moment before.
A grand lighter and a month later I go it back all shiny and never drove it like a dick again... Much.
Great video mate, educational and fun 👌🎬
Thanks mate. 😘
Had the idea months ago as you know, finally did it! ❤
Great video mate. I bought a 2013 M135i about 6 months ago. I've been driving for 18 years but this is my first rear wheel drive car. The change from 200bhp front wheel drive to 300bhp+ rear wheel drive was quite a shock to the senses! I'm slowly growing into it though. I suppose the motivation to not wreck the car I've spent my life longing for is a good thing!
Yeah exactly. Great cars those M135s. Just take it easy and get your head round it, and get some skid training! 😎👌
I’m in exactly the same boat as you. I have been driving 18 years, just sold my 200bhp fwd type r and have put a deposit down on a 2015 M135i.. I have spent a lot of time on the internet learning what all the modes do and trying to prepare myself for being let loose in 320bhp of rwd madness. Hopefully I can pick it up over the weekend but I’m pretty nervous lol
@@leexr2i Congrats mate. You will be fine, just keep the traction control on til you get a feel for the power. I've got a M140i now and I've learned these cars wont bite you unless you go looking for trouble. If you are steady on the power (especially in damp) they are just like any other car. Just more amazing to drive! 😋
@@jamessmith84240
You lucky sod! Enjoy the (epic!) Ride!
Loved this. Well done buddy :-)
Ah thanks a lot mate! 🤗❤
I've recently had a go on Goodwoods skid pan and I highly recommend it to anyone. Great fun and I learned a lot unfortunately my feathering of the throttle wasn't always as good as this!
Ah brilliant! Good isn't it!
Practice makes perfect, you'll have to do it again! 👊😎
Really enjoyed this and interesting the difference in outcomes. You’ve certainly wet my appetite to do the course in my car, more to see what happens when you go over the line - it’s an M2 competition & I fear it’ll hang me out to dry 😂.
Haha. One way to find out! 😉
With an LSD on the M2 will it not be alot more controllerball?
More predictable with an LSD? Isn't spinning up one wheel more likely to shunt the car into a spin?
I have read further down that the M140i has one.
Several questions and points to answer here.
Yes this M140 has an LSD.
On the skid pan it won't make any difference as it's so slippery that with over 300hp you're always going to spin both wheels.
So, on the road...
Yes, with an LSD it will be more predictable. Without an LSD sometimes it will spin an inside wheel, sometimes it will spin both.
No, spinning one wheel is LESS likely to spin the car. If you spin one wheel, usually the inside wheel with less load, then the outside wheel will maintain grip and you'll keep going in the direction of travel. With an LSD you can't spin up one wheel so if you break traction it will be with both wheels and the car will rotate. Which if you know what you're doing is good fun! 😉
The middle ground with an LSD is that before you spin both wheels you'll have more grip to propel you forwards without spinning an inside wheel and losing forward drive.
Hope that helps.
Great video mate. Very informative. Dying to get mine on that skid pan!
Haha. Cheers man.
They should do days where you can take your own car! That would be fun!
In the meantime you'll just have to book a Spin & Slide experience! 😉
could not have been explained better- thanks!
No worries buddy.
Please Subscribe if you haven't! 😎🙏
To anyone watching, Sport+ will still let you slide enough to spin out and crash. Don't think it's a "middle" setting, it's more like 1/4 on.
Oh Ok. Thanks mate. 👊
Thanks for clearly explaining and showing the various modes! This will help me in my m2!
Ace, no problem buddy!
Enjoy your M2!
PS. Subscribe and tell your friends!
@@RickTheSpud Definitely!
@@rosfamilyadventures Bless you Team! 👊
Such a great video! I did a skid pan last night, wish i had watched this first and slowly built up. Did some big powerslides but didnt get this very controlled slide with dsc off. Did lots of 360s though haha.
Ah brilliant! Where'd you do it? Goodwood?
Nice video Rick, entertaining. 👍
Cheers Kitey!
Don't forget to subscribe! 🤗❤
Great video and very educational, thank you
Why thank you Sir! 🤗👌
Nice one. Very interesting!
Why Thank You! 😉👌
It's nice to have the option of turning it off completely. It might not be faster ( i don't mind, if it takes me 10 seconds longer to drive to work ) but listen to him chuckling! That's 10 seconds well spent.
😂 Yeah definitely! 😉
That M140i sounds utterly beautiful 😍
Yeah good isn't it! Check out RoadReg on YT and see what mods he's done to it. 👊
@@RickTheSpud
Ooh will do! You've gotta love a hot 1 series!
Defo! 😜🍌🍌🍌
This is awesome. Well explained.
Thank you mate!
Great cars these, and clever systems! 👊
Please Subscribe if you haven't... 😉
That 360 looked epic mate 😆
Haha, thanks mate! In a time before the Insta 360 you had to do this! 😂
Great vid!
Thanks buddy, I hope you've subscribed? 😎👌
Great vid mate 👍
Thanks mate! 👌
Before watching the video I'll say I've found that at low speed I hate TC, at high speeds I prefer to have it in the "snow" setting, which keeps the TC partially off. This is based on my personal experience and having slid and having hydroplaned
Yeah, that's fair. What ever works and feels best for you. I'd say as a general rule MDM or Traction mode is a nice happy medium, it's there in the background if things go really wrong. 😉👌
Top work buddy 👏
Ah thanks mate. All made sense? First driving tuition type video I've done so I'm hoping it was accurate and made sense?...
@@RickTheSpud yeah definitely did. Love the little outtakes too. 👌
@@paulchapman6826 Haha. Always outtakes mate! 🎬🤪
Awesome video Rick! 😎
Thanks buddy. And well done for not crashing into your own car with my car when doing the tracking shots! 🤣😉
@@RickTheSpud Haha.. “What happened with your car, Reg?” ME: “I crashed into it” - THEM: “wtf?”
@@roadreg1820 🤣🤣🤣
nice video really ! educational !!!
Nice one, thank you... 👌
Best video explanation
Thank you my friend!
Subscribe and tell your friends! 👊
Great to know about the "mid DSC off"/ "traction mode".
just controls the traction control in that case, right?...
Yeah sort of, just puts the TC a bit more in the background, it's still there but it comes in slightly later and gives you a bit more slip. Very clever.
Nice video
you should make more videos like this
Thanks buddy.
Yeah I've had a few thoughts about some more skid pan videos or some sort of instructional video but I'm not sure what else I'm qualified to talk about! 🤔😆
Wow!! Thanks
No worries! 👊😎
Make sure you're subscribed! 😉
Cool Vid
Thank you!
Feel free to share, and Subscribe! 👊😎
Cool!
Nice drive 🤌🏻👍
Thanks man!
Great vid man and question does traction control automatically come back on when you turn the car on and off just got a 328i haven’t messed around with it yet
Hey thanks buddy!
Yeah I would assume so, normally whatever you touch, when you restart it then traction is back on, stop start is back on, and everything is back in comfort or normal. 😉🤓
Hello so I was thinking about getting a mini cooper S (r55) but I wanna make sure I get the right one with the right safety feature. So DSC is standard on it but does it break individual wheels around the corner to put the car straight? Or is that DTC? Here in the state’s American cars have 2 systems, TC (only limit wheel spin during take off) DSC/ESP/VSA BECAUSE MOST CAR BRANDS USES DIFFERENT NAMES(breaks 1-4 wheels cut power to help maintain stability at any speed)
Seems like Mini and bmw systems are kinda confusing
Hello mate, no I think your first guess is right. DSC is your safety systems and dynamic braking etc, DTC is dynamic traction control so that is just clever TC and allows more wheel slip while providing skids! 😉
Skids !! 🏆
You know it! 😎👌
Thanks for the Love! 🙏❤
enjoyed thanks
Thanks mate.
Please Subscribe if you haven't! 👊
Okay, done 👊 I have a F30 316i 2013, do you think 1.6 twin turbo engine can do same like this? And also I would like to learn about burnouts
Yeah definitely. On a skid pan like this. On a dry road, not sure. Wet road, probably.
Prob should do a burnout video. Super easy but easy to get it wrong!
Looks like you enjoyed yourself!
Haha. Hello mate! Welcome to the Channel! ❤
Always smiling when I'm doing a skid mate!
Check out the channel to see what I've been up to...
Catch up soon mate... 🤗
@@RickTheSpud have to see how an AWD car handles the skid pan. Let me know when you’re next having a play and you can take the A45 for a spin
@@jakemico Sounds like a plan mate... 😎❤
Hi Just wondering did the m140 have an open or locked diff? Thanks
This car has an LSD, but the Goodwood Cars have no LSD and are exactly the same.
The surface is so slippery, with 300+ bhp you're not just going to spin one wheel! 😎
Is holding the dsc button down to fully turn it off the same as putting it into sport+?
I don't believe so, I think in Sport + it's in MDM...
When Sport+ is ON, we have a Traction mode? Or some different?
Yeah I think so. If DSC is ON and you press sports plus it goes to traction mode, from memory. It's not my car! 😜
Good video. What does MDM stand for?
Cheers buddy.
MDM mode and DTC mode (Traction Mode on the dash) are a half way traction setting whereby the Traction Control/Stability Control (DSC) are still working but are more relaxed and in the background. They allow for more slip and rotation of the car before they get involved, and then allow the car to stay more out of shape.
I believe both MDM and DTC do the same thing, but MDM (M Dynamic Mode) is only on 'M' power cars (M2, M3, etc) and DTC (Dynamic Traction Mode) is on all other BMWs.
Great Content!! lsd fitted obv
Thanks buddy!
I hope you've subscribed? 😉
Yes this car has an LSD, but it makes no difference on this surface as it's so slippery, with 300+ bhp you're not just going to spin one wheel! 💪😉
@@RickTheSpud just did! agree with your comment. cheers
(edit: The difference would theor. show upon the slightest level of traction on one wheel)
@@phil3184 Ah cheers! 😎👌
Oh for sure, if there was any grip it would grip up, usually on the outside wheel where the weight is and start spinning up on the inside wheel.
Great video. Just got a 135i and definitely hitting the DTC button at start up from here on out. Wasn’t sure all it did as manual is vague (“Engage for snow and mud” or whatever).
Have a Solstice GXP and love the LSD…disappointing the 135i doesn’t come with one. Just driving around and doing some slow speed turns with throttle steer is a total blast and so much more solid and connect vs “one wheel drive”. Plus LSDs increase traction significantly in rain, snow, etc.
Hard to spring $2400 just for an aftermarket LSD for the 135i. They’re a lot because of the configuration.
Thank you! 👊
Yeah they're great fun cars for sure, plenty of power and obvs with an LSD mega for skids! 😜
I the LSD an aftermarket addition or a factory 'e-diff'....?
Nah, aftermarket I believe, find RoadReg on IG and he'll tell you everything you need to know... 😉
As you said lol LAAAVLLLYYY
Haha. Did I? Doh! I've stolen your catch phrase! 🤦♂️😆
Been looking into buying one of these ? Was your fitted with LSD? If not do you think it will best for me to get one with LSD keeping i mind i have never driven RWD?
This had an LSD but it makes no difference on the skid pan, on the road it depends how hard you push. Try it without, and get one fitted if you start to push hard enough to need one. 😎👌
Get one with an LSD..when youre not pushing for slides it will give you more traction and it will make the car more stable..most importantly it will make the car predictable which is what you want.
when driving on a track or curvy roads to have some fun, should we press for DTC and is it better to drive always that way no matter the weather? thank you
It depends if you know what you're doing when things go wrong. Half way mode is best as it's more relaxed but will try and save you if things go wrong, altho much later. Depends how good a driver you are. 👊
@@RickTheSpud but basically there is no downsides of using DTC for sporty driving correct? I am dallying a beautiful 123D E82 and getting a big more power now..
If you're a half decent driver you should be good! 👊😎
Maybe true for the skid pad but on regular wet pavement, even with DSC off, I have to actually try pretty hard to get my car to slide - it's actually a bit disappointing when I want to have fun with it cause its not as easy to slide around corners as I would like. I'm even on RWD with old tires. I am in an F30 though, bit heavier of a car, but I do have 450 whp/wtq
Oh for sure, you'll always have more grip than you think, until you don't have it when you thought you did!
Go a bit faster and pump the rears up a bit! 😉
@@RickTheSpud workin on it! its probably better that it has more grip than i expected...
Haha. That's for sure! 😉
@@arthatis its proably fear holding you back... me and my pal used to go joy riding in a clapped out 320i e46 and he'd have it all over the place sidways (we were 16)
@@cupra2Jock. I mean illegal joy riding when you're underage is prob not the best advice, but yeah, there's no shortcut to experience. 😎
Skid pan or a drift day experience is money well spent. Check out Learn2Drift or Pro Drift Academy for someone to learn to skid! 👌
When I full throttle in sport plus mode on a wet road, I felt that the rear wheels kinda shuddered the moment I floored it, is it due to traction control activated? I was in sport plus mode and did not touch the dsc button.
Sports plus I think is DSC in half way mode (MDM or Traction Mode) so the shuddering is prob rear axle tramp from the rear wheels slipping and gripping and slipping and gripping really quickly. They're on the verge of grip. If the tyres spin faster they don't do it, but you'd need everything off for that. On a closed private road near Mexico! 👊😜
@@RickTheSpud That makes sense then since I was on a wet road. Just curious, would this still happen on a hot day dry road? I have a rwd m340 with ps4s set up
They'll prob just grip, but at the point they've lost grip you'd have had to overwhelm them so much they'll be spinning much faster and not shudder! 👊😎
I understand that the MDM mode works at the condition to counter steer, if not the car will behave as the DSC was off. Is my understanding correct ?
I'm not sure what you mean buddy.
Not sure counter steer affects it, MDM just allows for more slip but still limits the slip, you can still spin out as shown...
@@RickTheSpud Actually I’ve noticed that you proceeded to two skids with MDM mode. The first time you didn’t counter steer and the car made a 180 degree. Seconde time you counter steered and obviously the MDM mode helped a lot to power slide properly
Ah I see.
Yeah true, but notice how slowly it rotated with MDM mode on, compared with MDM off!
With grip on a normal surface MDM would prob save you.
@@RickTheSpud Ah ok I understand. Thank you so much bro...it’s been a long time I was wondering how the system behaves actually and what are it’s limits. Now everything is clear thanks to you 👍
Once again thank you very much for your explanation.
@@bobalto Hey no worries buddy.
Hard to go into too much detail on here but I'm glad that helped. 😎👌
Traction mode should be the same as Sport+ regards DTC/ESP
Yeah I think you're right, I think Traction Mode is short for Dynamic Traction Control or DTC mode...
@@RickTheSpud Correct.
The difference is, in sport+ the throttle map is more like an on/off switch, but in traction completely off mode it has comfort throttle which is much better and more progressive.
@@DjNikGnashers Ah nice one buddy. Yeah that makes sense. 😎👌
Lately my f30 is cutting off throttle/auto brake if above 80km/h under wet conditions on the highway..is this normal?
Is it trying to spin up or aqua plaining?
@@RickTheSpud not sure. It is just under rain with wipers on and will “auto brake” if I go above 80km for a while.... I also understand that it has brake drying function?
Oh really. Wow. Sounds like you know more than me. 👊
@@RickTheSpud 🤣 I just google/YT it
👊😂
the winks! 😅
😂😉👌
@@RickTheSpud Enjoyed the Video, glad I found it, you've got heaps of great videos to be watched by the looks!
@@IronLungProductionsOfficial Why thank you! Make sure you subscribe and tell your friends... 😉👌
Standard Suspension?!
Nah, think it's got the Motech springs and spacers treatment... 😎❤
Wait, so this was with LSD? Curious how it would do without one.
This car has an LSD, but the Goodwood Cars have no LSD and are exactly the same.
The surface is so slippery, with 300+ bhp you're not just going to spin one wheel! 💪😉
😆
Technically you're more likely to spin out or do a 360 WITH an LSD, as without one you're more likely to just spin up one wheel and not slide at all... 😉
@@RickTheSpud Good video very interesting, but I drive EVERYWHERE in DTC OFF mode, it's the first thing I do when I get in the car, hold it down for a few seconds to turn it off completely.
My car has 455bhp/634nm and I have never lost it yet, even with an open diff, I just have fun squiggling the back end at every roundabout.
@@DjNikGnashers Then you've got more skill than most bud, good job. 😎👌
@@RickTheSpud Maybe more luck than skill my friend lol, but I have been driving RWD cars for the past 35 years so probably just second nature now !
Swugs likes this !
Haha. Cheers bro! 🥰
4:28 doesn't it harm gear box or diff ?
Nah mate. Good as gold. The gearbox electronics protect itself so if you try and put it in forwards when the wheels are still going in reverse it won't let you. That's why you let off the gas first, change direction, then the wheels are rolling forwards with the gearbox freewheeling with no power, into forwards, and away you go. And because the wheels are already moving in the right direction you don't need to use the brake to select drive. 😎👌
Stock differential?
This car has an LSD, but the Goodwood Cars have no LSD and are exactly the same.
The surface is so slippery, with 300+ bhp you're not just going to spin one wheel! 😎
@@RickTheSpud i heard that the Electronicdiff is only on dsc fully off activ... would love to see drytesting with stock diff.
@@lukatkalcec9285 I believe it's the opposite, the electronic diff is essentially a fake diff lock and is trying to help you out when DSC is on, when everything is off you're on you're own, and on a grippier surface it tries to spin one wheel. 🥴
Can you turn if x drive on and
And?
@@RickTheSpud and can we turn off x drive somehow on G30 without doing anything mechanical on it?
@@emperorsanders5744 Not sure mate. You'll have to go into the settings on the idrive. I've just had the new M3 xDrive for a week and you can do it on that from the setup button.
If not, you might be able to get it coded in from one these computer boffins like 'defined coding' etc...
Shuuu got saved by traction control in the rain yesterday. Would’ve lost the car or my life.
Ah well done. Good safety systems on the BMW in my opinion... 👊
I turned tc off one day in the wet and it didn’t end well
Oh no, what happened?
@@RickTheSpud I had a nice controlled drift up until I let off the accelerator the back gripped again and I went the opposite way probably because wheels were pointing that way so I full throttled to try pull back out and it went the opposite way again if that makes sense 🤷🏻♂️
@@J-D69 Yep, massive tank slapper, or a fish tail! 😂 Need to get on a Learn2Drift day. Proper fun!
I hope you're subscribed? 😉
@@RickTheSpud I have indeed subscribed buddy, I’m getting it back on the road soon, you wouldn’t believe it if I told you haha! And yeah I’ve had a look at that goodwood place can’t get a slot 🙃
@@J-D69 Cheers buddy.
Not Goodwood, Aldershot I think, and other places too. Goodwood is for track not skids in your own car, unless it's skid pan in a Goodwood car.
Skid pan? It’s like a feckin pond
😆 Don't want it drying out! Otherwise it's just a car park! 😉
This is basically a drifting video 😅
Kinda yeah. But in slow motion. With education. 💪😉
is that bmw RWD or FWD?
RWD mate. 👊
@@RickTheSpud thanks :) and wow that reply was quick
👊 Lunch break... 😜😋
Is that rwd or xdrive?
RWD. All M140s are rwd as far as I know... 🤷♂️
@@RickTheSpud there was xdrive version too. I think most of the sold 140s were with xdrive.
@@Robert-gg2vk In the UK? Never heard of an M140 xDrive.
@@RickTheSpud I don't know whether in UK was only rwd 🤷. I am from Slovakia and you could buy xdrive version too. You can check wiki or any web related to car specs and you will find there m140i xdrive.
@@Robert-gg2vk Ah OK. Yeah I reckon it was only rwd in the UK.
Dsc completely off made me crash, 10k repaircost..wont ever do that fault again😭☠️
Doh!
Prob wasn't just that tho, maybe a combination of a few other things... 😜
@@RickTheSpud na it literally was…went around a corner, gave a lil gaspush too early n car went flyin like in your vid…made me go over a trafficisland n crash into two other cars…with like 20kmh so not fast
@@rob0600 Oh no! That's not good!
@@RickTheSpud Yup…play stupid games, win stupid prices right…well now i have to wait at least a week for it being repaired
For the UK at least, it would be inadvisable to drive a rwd on public roads without TC. Keep all that sliding business on the race track.
In your opinion. People shouldn't be drifting like this for sure, but you can have a car moving around slightly at the rear with complete control if you know what you're doing.
He is not holding the steering wheel with one hand .. In a situation where you want to teach others
I was holding the steering wheel with one hand. 🤷♂️
Did you mean I'm not supposed to be? At some points I wasn't even looking where I was going! 😉😜
If you get the results then it doesn't matter.
Drifting with grip then you probably should do. Check out my video at Learn2Drift, definitely 2 hands on the wheel then, except when I'm on the hydro! 😎👌
LSD?
This car has an LSD, but the Goodwood Cars have no LSD and are exactly the same.
The surface is so slippery it doesn't matter.
Is this car x drive?
No buddy, M140s are just rear drive. The new M135 which sort of replaces it is X drive. 👍
@@RickTheSpud there are actually f21 140i with xdrive. I dont know about uk market tho.
@@Fabi-fd8kv Oh really, like the new M240i? That's cool. 👌
LSD on the car ?? Presumably so.
Oh yes 😎
@@roadreg1820 oh it's your car, didn't realise haha. I got my M-Perf LSD fitted just after your video.
@@legendgalaxy Yeah man! What a difference it makes. Hope you’re enjoying it with the diff fitted. Did you go for the MP?
@@roadreg1820 yeah M performance one too. The back just loves to slide now, I was surprised in Sport+ how much it lets you slip... Transformed the car none the less! Just slightly worried for my driving licence now 😂
@@legendgalaxy Don’t it just. So controllable and predictable though. Also, in normal driving, you’d never be able to tell it has the diff installed. Almost feels like they should have given it one from the factory! Driving license.. what’s that? 😜😂
B. m. w. Bring my wallet
😂👌
What's the difference between sport + and traction mode (MDM)?
Think Sport Plus is an engine/throttle setting and MDM is a traction control setting. 🤔