I love how Tolkien is so specific about certain things, even going so far as to create his own languages for the story. Then there are other things like, "How many Balrogs are there?" And Tolkien is like, "Maybe a hundred, maybe a thousand. But probably between 3 and 7."
The man tapped into real history in some dimension. No way he came up with all of it on his own. The sheer volume of words he wrote on the subject could choke a bookworm. Its insain.
@@twistedtachyon5877 False. He created the English language first, then the world and all who dwell in it. Then he starred in the theatrical LOTR release playing Orlando Bloom playing Legolas. Then somewhere along the line he created the concept of waffles and the traffic light… and that’s how babies are made. He said so himself in letter 42. Glad I could clarify.
I personally think the movie did a good job depicting the Balrog, I remember first seeing it as a child and was in awe at how powerful and grand it was.
Agreed. I think it would have been difficult to make the more human like balrog cause a similar impact. Just another example of the movie understanding that when the medium changes some detail need to also, and despite that they still capture the terrifying effect.
@@krisyannuruha5147true its really only the wings and head that isn’t humanoid. One thing I absolutely love about the movie depiction is how its roar is a literal inferno. You can just feel the power emenating from this beast
The Balrog, a really old war veteran, just chilling under the mountain in his retirement gets disturbed by digging Dwarves. Who wouldn't be grumpy after that?
They both rank as my favorite creatures in Middle Earth. They’re both easily the baddest of the bad when it comes to Morgoth’s forces. Really makes you thankful that Sauron never had them at his disposal when LOTR took place.
Durin's Bane was merely a dim echo of a far greater war back in the ancient days during Melkor's reign before he was eventually cast into the Void. Really puts Sauron into perspective, at least for me, since the wars with Melkor far outstrip the wars with his Chief Lieutenant. These videos on Saturday are a treat, so thank you.
Yeah, but the elves were also much stronger. They diminished due to giving parts of their power to their children. Which is why the old childless ones like Glorfindel and Cirdan are so special
@@laura-bianca3130 Indeed, the elves in the Elder days were most certainly superior to the elves in the later ages due to taking in the light of the two trees with exceptions like Glorfindel. And regarding the elves that diminished due to giving their children pieces of their power, if that's true, then I thank you for the enlightenment. I'm still relatively new to the Legendarium as you may or may not know from some of my past comments so learning new details is always lovely.
@@indio4-215 it is not sure, but I interpreted it as such. The more children they had, the more they were connected to the earth (including Melkor) and less whole. Less angelic (good or evil) A big example of that is Numenor. They diminished over time (due to not favoring the Valar, or the sons they had, but also because they were bound more closely to Arda through many generations). Before they turned bad, they already lost their lifespan. Another example: Hurin talks to Melkor for countless years in captivity, Aragorn uses up a lot of his lifeforce to "talk" with Sauron through the Palantir.
An interesting difference between Melkor and most villains is that apparently his underlings served him out of loyalty and not just out of fear, as evidenced by the Balrogs willingly coming to his rescue when accosted by Ungoliant.
Well that's depend on context and situation, in fact most of Melkor's follower are simply his own creation, or human slave, Balrogs are different since they are Maiar, and the relationship between Valar and Maiar weren't based on fear, but based on admiration, loyalty and ideology (although some Balrogs were used to be Maiar who got manipulated by Melkor through deceit)
Most people serving Morgoth did so out of fear or because he made them to do so, but the Balrogs were different. He convinced them and they chose to follow him of their own free will. Therefore they are his co-conspirators, not his slaves.
Morgoth's closer servants sincerely worship him. There's reason to believe Sauron really does take up his cause, and deceives himself that it's just. After all, there was no reason to tell Numenor to worship Melkor unless he actually believed it.
Not all Maiar were on board with the Valar's plan. Some of them -- especially the fire spirits -- weren't impressed with trees and nature and daffodils. They wanted fire and brimstone and sulfur and obsidian, so they joined Melkor because he had genuinely better ideas. It's like being into heavy metal but all they play in Valinor is Enya. Yeah, I'd jump over to Middle Earth to rock out with Morgoth too. This is also true for Maiar of Aule the Smith like Saruman and Sauron. They liked making things and craftsmanship, so the allure and ambition of Melkor's radical designs would have appealed to them. Aman is a boring, stuffy place where nothing happens for eons. Just a bunch of elves lying around reciting poetry. At least in Middle Earth you get to do some serious Minecraft stuff, remake the world in the manner that you want.
@@Ishkur23 Pretty astute. The description given of Melkor's type of music in the Ainulindale sounds a lot like how someone who doesn't like metal would describe metal.
It's interesting to me that Tolkien caught his OP writing and retconned it. He was so caught up in their power he realized a numbers nerf was required.
@@bobcostas6272 Perhaps one day. Geniuses like Tolkien are lightning in a bottle; their strikes are rare and irreplaceable, but their impacts are always felt far and wide.
@@principledpsychopath8461 You must really be outta the loop if the replies aren't immediately putting it into your mind lol. "They're Taking the Hobbits to Isengard"
I always find it funny how the fall of Moria is apparent ancient history to the Fellowship, yet, considering the context that it took place a couple of thousand years before LotR, would hardly be more than last week to beings who remembered the First and/or Second Ages, to say nothing of those who saw the light of the Two Trees Really puts the history of Middle-Earth in perspective; Tolkien truly had an imagination of epic scale
I mean, just think in our terms, 2000 years ago it was the year 21. It truly hurts the head to even think about. No wonder most people didn't know what a balrog was when the last one was seen *5* thousand years before them.
It's amazing that even though Tolkien never wrote a full fledged story about such matters, there's sooooooooo much fantasy history that can be adapted into films for the next 100 years. If The Hobbit was split into 3 films, imagine what can be made from the ancient history of Middle Earth
Whats truely interesting is what it says about the Dwarves. They are so isolated, and so fixated on their own lives and cities. That the knowledge of Moria's destruction seems to be unknown to some of the dwarven clans
@@angeljaceherondale yet we know so much about our history from 2000 years ago, to say elves and such can't remember 2000 years given they were alive during that entire time is really just weak-ass writing. Sorry but the elves are smarter than that with very in-depth writing and historical systems, even better than we humans have. I always found it rather odd that after such disastrous wars that the bad guys were allowed to live and replenish and their forces time and time again...it is almost like the writer was lazy and just wanted to keep bringing the same characters to the story and then claim everyone just had amnesia of world events LOL. I mean we know so much of daily life from archaeological studies and examining writings from 2000 years ago, I find it VERY hard to believe that in a Tolkien world that something like a Balrog would be forgotten and no one knew what one was, especially those who were alive the entire 2000 year period and witnessed them first hand.
@James Sutton: Who among the living ever encountered a Balrog? Anybody who fought one died. Gandalf was brought back from the dead. I’m not sure what the deal with Glorfindel in “The Fellowship of the Ring” is & how he relates to Glorfindel from “The Silmarilion”. Balrogs are things of myth. The Elves have kept the memory of Balrogs alive, since Legolas recognizes it, though he’s only about 1,000 years old during the LOTR. None of the Dwarves who fought Durin’s Bane lived to tell of it. The rest just handed down a story of a mysterious entity, without any description. Humans and Hobbits are too short lived to keep track of stories from the First Age. Also, archeological and historical knowledge, in today’s world, is not part of people’s common knowledge. You’d have to actively seek out works on those subjects, like Gandalf did, when he studied the oldest records in Gondor for clues about Bilbo’s ring.
I think the most terrifying thing about the Balrogs, in my opinion, is that, despite their appearance suggesting the contrary, they're not mindless monsters, beasts, or demons. They're sentient and powerful individuals who are fully aware of what they're doing, that chose to present themselves in such menacing and terrifying forms. Now, remember everything I just said, and imagine if one of said balrogs possessed the One Ring.
they could very easily not even be effected by the One, being as it was Sauron's binding of his powers... being they were both of the same race, it might have been like Tom... of no effect -shrug-
@@narmale Pretty sure they mean, imagine what they could do with the ring. As in use its power, not be influenced by it. Those two things aren't necessarily correlated.
@@angeljaceherondale if it even has power of its own... even Gandolf was afraid of its corruption, so is it even something that could be wielded by someone else? Or is it just booby trapped to destroy someone and remake them in evil form forever?
I don’t know how loyal Durins Bane would be once he got the ring. Most powerful being in Middle earth + your masters in the void so he can’t do shit = You ruling everything
They were mair they were spirts of fire called the Valarauka, they joined morgoth . They were his mightiest servants, if you dont count unguilant who was just very hungry and very greedy
I like the idea that the Balrogs, while initially man-shaped, could change their form thanks to being made up of shadow and flame. And, when Durin's Bane understood what Gandalf was, they changed their shape to better scare and fight him.
@@MrRenanHappy Yet Sauron could change his form... from Werewolf to Vampire to a fair elf... I think it's the power they spend that limits them over time, rather than time itself. So it's feasible that a Balrog buried deep in the earth for thousands of years could retain that power to change form. Remember, Melkor was a fast spender with his power (dragons especially) which is why he became so limited at his end. Also explaines why he (and later Sauron) would lay dormant for hundreds of years at a time inbetween battles. As they lost power; they had to increasingly rely on growing thier armies. Which is kinda the opposite of the elves; the light of Valinor gave them power, which dimmed over time. But some like Gandalf could always return for a recharge. Even if they died. Giving them the upper hand over time. Oh no, now I've gone cross-eyed. 🤪
@@danbardos3498 The Elves diminish in Middle Earth. It is unstoppable. That is how Eru created them: each individual life, each generation. Only Narya, Nenya, and Vilya helped stay the diminishing of the elves who had possessed them.
"The Balrogs were not creatures of simple brute strength, but also incredible magical power." That didn't come across to me in the movie at all. Great video!
I have always thought of that one Balrog as a self-consumed lunatic after so many millennia of isolation without any contact with its "god" nor equals. They might have fallen to animalistic rage like fallen angels they represent in the mythos. Strong beyond reason or belief but ultimately broken.
I have always wished Peter would have done the Moria fight better instead of Gandalf being spooked and fleeing he should have shown what really happened at the door. Maybe even made it more dreadful like having Gandalf thrown down the stairs coughing blood and not breathing. The dread the fellowship would have had seeing their best beaten down would have been less than what the audience,who had never read the book, would have felt.
Not all spirits of fire were corrupted into Balrogs by Morgoth. Arien, the maiden of the Sun, was probably the strongest of all, and remained pure. We can imagine how truly powerful a Maia she was, brains and brawn. Olorín, otoh, almost refused his call for he knew he was not of the same level as Sauron. A lot more brains than muscle that one. And still he vanquished the Balrog.
This proves that Gandalf is really the best wizard in middle earth: He has forseen that a creature such as the Balrog is very much gameover for them if it joins forces w/ sauron. same w/ Smaug. So while thinking of long term, he devices plans to take out those two, before the final battle. Gandalf = GOAT
Indeed. It's quality storytelling, which we all know Tolkien was a master at. There's other really smart "military" tactical details written into his works that the writer of "The Art of War" would be proud of.
Bullshit, a Balrog joining the forces of Sauron is not gameover, the real winner of the final battle was the undead army, Gandalf was a good leader but he wasn't all that. in fact he made so many tactical blunders throughout the books it is easy to understand why the writer was such a low ranking soldier in WW1, he had no tactical knowledge and was merely part of the meat grinder, which is what his books turned into, battle after battle nothing but meat grinder tactics.
@@xlr8r17 Clearly, the delusional fool hasn't a clue on what he's talking about. Especially since he's probably just an untrained civilian who has no business speaking of tactical warfare and what it entails, so just ignore him if he's got nothing useful and reasonable to say.
They are terible creatures for sure. One detail related to them that stuck to me the most is how Tolkien describes Fingon's death, saying Balrogs beat him into dust with their maces. I dont know, that detail still gives me chills, being so brutal 💔
It shows that the Balrogs are not just mindless beasts, but cruel, sadistic demons who get sick pleasure from beating their enemy’s body into a mess of blood and viscera
If Balrogs are Maiar themselves then 3-7 of them seems a lot more reasonable than hundreds. That would indeed give Melkor an overwhelming force of basically hundreds of Gandalfs. This gives a lot of context the Fellowship’s encounter with Durin’s Bane. The balrog wasn’t just a terrifying beast from deep within the earth, he was an ancient and cunning foe, of equal ilk to Ganldalf and Sauron. It’s not clear to me if Durins Bane knew or realized at any point that the ring was within his grasp, but if he were to obtain it, there would have been nothing to stop him from brining total destruction to middle earth. A terrible reign of fire and death would have begun.
I second that sentiment, since if Melkor had hundreds if not thousands of Balrogs, then there's no reason to believe why Melkor wouldn't conquer Beleriand and beyond in short order, especially with the dragons at his command, both the wingless and the winged variants. Personally, I'd say 7 in total is reasonable. That way, it presents the Balrogs, as fallen Maiar, as a more formidable and fearsome force as Melkor's generals as they should be.
As dangerous as hundreds of Gandalfs would be, it's even worse than that, it'd be hundreds of Gandalfs with no concern for restraining their power or physical form.
@@indio4-215 Balanced as it was by a time when Maiar loyal to Eru openly walked Arda, interventionism by the Valar, elven and dwarven domains at the peak of their might, the presence of many Calaquendi, undiminished men, and crafts such that swords like Orcrist and Glamdring were outstanding examples of their time rather than priceless artifacts of long-forgotten quality. The mightiest elves, who had also seen the light of the Trees, could rival a Maiar in power -- and that's not something to consider lightly. It's also important to remember that until Morgoth revealed the winged dragons, the greatest impediment to the Host of Valinor was the sheer quantity of Morgoth's force, not as much the quality. It took decades for the Host to simply cut through their numbers. Hundreds or thousands of balrogs, given Tolkien's later writing of their origins and nature, is implausible...but so too is the idea there were less than a dozen, given the scale of the conflicts of the First Age. I believe Tolkien over-corrected later in his writings and letters, and perhaps he should have come to a happier medium of a dozen or two.
I really like the idea of 300-400 of them. For one because i think an army of dwarves glad in mithril fighting those is epic. And second because i think that smaller numbers are a bit... I mean i think that there were a few thousand maia on erda in total. And that quite an amount of them followed melkor. Because if not it makes me wonder why the other ainur did not simply fight melkor. His army was a bigger threat than just orcs and some dragon. It devastated an entire landmass.
Could the balrog hold the ring though? If not then I would be scared to see him become a ring wraith. He would probably be more feared and powerful then Sauron himself. If the balrog is able to hold the ring then everyone is screwed except the other Miar who would just regenerate and flee to Valanor. If he was to awaken I imagine all the elves immediately book it to the havens thus screwing everything in a hundred mile radius of Morea dead.
Agreed. What a bit of storytelling and a great bit of revenge for Glamdring. Wish we had more information about that great sword and what happened to it, Sting and Orcrist between the fall of Gondolin and Gandalf, Bilbo and the dwaves finding them in the troll cave. Wish we also knew more about Elrond's reaction to having his great grandfather's sword in his hands when Glamdring was show to him in Rivendell.
@@marlonquintana3466 One of the great Elven Princes/Kings from the first age and a cousin of Galadriel. Also Elrond's great grandfather on his father's side. Sadly killed during the first age in the wars between the elves and Morgoth the master of Saron. Read the Silmarillion if you want to find out more about Morgoth, Turgon, Gondolin (the hidden city that Turgon founded and on which Rivendell is based) and the war between the elves and Morgoth in the first age.
@@florianschneider1860 Also the most stubborn elf to ever live (ok maybe second after Feanor). He ignored warnings from a Vala, and paid the price for it.
@@therealelderking5830 True that. Should have listened to Tuor when he first arrived in Gondolin and left the hidden city and not have remained and trusted in the city's secret location. But his pride in what he had built and protected for almost 500 years cost him almost everything. The curse of the Noldor came to roost. But in the end it also lead to the saving of all of middle earth and the final defeat of Morgoth thanks to the marriage of Tuor (a man) to Idril (Turgon's daughter) which resulted in the saviour, their son and Elrond's father Eärendil.
I like the design of a humanoid Balrog as well, specially that one you consider your favourite. But i can't lie, the design chosen for the LOTR movie is my total favourite, and the art made of it are all incredible
Legolas gave a cry of dismay and fear .2 great trolls appeared , they bore great slabs of stone , and flung them down to serve as gangways over the fire. But it was not the trolls that had filled the Elf with terror .
that's one of the things I give Orlando Bloom credit for. he looked genuinely terrified, for me just being the perfect look for how Legolas felt when he realized what was there. in the Similarian, its described that a balrog would enter the battle and the elves would flee, screaming in terror. whereas the men, either not knowing what they were or simply not caring, are like FUUUUUUCK that shit, I'm gonna stab it! so I think Orlando did a good job showing fear in that scene.
a whole group of fire demons with flame whips driving off a giant demon spider is some pretty metal imagery. Not hard to see why Tolkien's work has inspired so many rock and metal bands.
The Fellowship is my favorite part of the trilogy and this is certainly a strong reason why. Even as a kid, I felt a stronger sense of dread towards the Balrog than Shelob or the Nazgul. It's amazing to think how perhaps the most formidable foe appears so early into the adventure.
Evil incarnate (Balrogs) is more fearsome than animalistic evil (Shelob), which cant really be considered evil (given animals have no sense of morality), or mortals who aligned with evil (Nazgul). This is why we fear serial killers more than lions, despite the latter being more likely to kill you in one on one encounter.
I enjoy the artistic interpretation of most of the balrog's we see drawn these days. I like the idea of them cloaked in Shadow and flame and creatures of sorcery because, at least to me gives the impression they could wreathe themselves into whatever shape they chose really.
@@MountainFisher I feel like Gandalf's cloaking is much less evil though. Like, sure he can do it to an extent but it's not based on Morgoth's teachings of dark sorcery if you get me? He's learned it from a very different source.
I was just thinking that being creatures of two amorphous things, always in flux and motion (shadow and flame) that they could alter their outward appearance into whatever they wanted given enough time and motivation. It would certainly help them in terrifying their opponents. With sorcery they could even perhaps project false images of themselves into an enemy's mind or create illusions to mislead an enemy into ruin.
Despite me being familiar with the majority of the details you've talked about, your presentation with the maps, dates and pictures, interspersed with voice acted dialogue really elevates the experience. Excellent job as always, really enjoyed the video. Also yes I as well really prefer the more humanoid depictions of balrogs. Aside from your favorite from this vid, there is this image with Gothmog looking like a giant humanoid with lava like body (doesn't show his face) with two troll body guards that stand only up to his elbows. That is my other favorite depiction.
Gandalf: I am weary. I cast a spell and something countered it. I must rest. Also Gandalf: Leave me. Proceeds to fight the same being for multiple days without rest until they both die and destroys a mountain.
Considering Sauron spread the Cult of Melkor to Numenor and in Rhun while the Balrogs stayed hidden underground, I think there is a reasonable argument to be made here.
@@KingOfSciliy you're not wrong, but if it wasn't for the Balrogs Ungoliant would have consumed Morgoth, then Melkor, after they destroyed the trees in Aman. Preventing Morgoth from even creating his legacy of evil
@@KingOfSciliy Sauron getting the Númenóreans to worship Melkor was an opportunistic move because it would raise him from captive to high priest. He wasn't in a position to present himself as a God. It wasn't done out of genuine loyalty. He isn't the same faithful servant to Morgoth in the Second Age as he was in the First Age. He also ran away and hid after his defeat to Huan and didn't partake in the War of Wrath during the First Age, which doesn't seem very loyal to me, leaving Morgoth to his fate.
@@Silver-5-0-5 Dude, please consider using punctuation properly when you write something. At the very least, please use periods and commas, as it makes whatever you write so very much easier for a potential reader to read.
I’ve read the Silmarillion, along with The Hobbit, The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers and Return of the King. There’s just something about having the details I might’ve forgotten or missed out on narrated to me that is just captivating. Thank you for putting in the time and effort, great videos.
The Silmarillion is my favorite story ( stories ) ever. I read it once a year for about 14 years. I’ve since moved on to other Mythos. Westeros , Hyboria, Chtulhu, Roshar, a few others. But I’m always brought back to Tolkien. Great channel
" I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. You cannot pass! The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udûn. Go back to the Shadow! You cannot pass! " That line gives me goosebumps every time. You covered Udûn, but what exactly is the Secret Fire? Anor is basically the sun, right?
The Secret Fire is the power that Eru has to create true life. No other being has this ability. Anor is the elvish word for Sun, but it’s kind of a mysterious use of the phrase. It could refer to the fact that he has the ring of fire in his possession, or it could have something to do with the Sun or his more pure power than the fallen Balrog.
@@NerdoftheRings I wonder if it has anything to do with the fact that Arien was originally like the Balrogs, but she remained pure, while their fires became tainted with shadow.
Sir Ein McAllen did this line beautifully he put so much passion into it that his vocal abilities cannot be understated. I heard somewhere that he got his inspiration for Gandalf's accent from actually listening to Tolkien old interviews but he is always been such a talented voice in his roles. And I think it's safe to say he made Gandalf flesh and blood.
@@Idciydhmb Ungoliant would eat you slowly, draining the fluids, at worst She might gobble you up if you're lucky And she's hungry But Morgoth might torture you, for years or even decades if you mouth off, before he shows his non-existent mercy and feed you, alive to his werewolves And that's if he's Uninterested If he's feeling innovative, he might try and torture you into a new creature or a new kind of orc Those "Slow arts of cruelty" should scare anyone shitless He might "put his power unto you" and keep you alive as long as he wants to make you, "feel everything ", as long as he wants There's a reason Ungoliant of all called him Blackheart So no suicide either The very best you can hope for when you see Morgoth is a quick death
Didn't know they came in different flaming forms. Very cool. And to think Feanor fought multiple of these Wizards/Mia spirits gone bad on Melkors front yard is something else.👌🏾
Because that was Melkor's philosophy, he thought sheer power, fear and deception were enough to overcome everything. However, Eru Illuvatar told him in the ainulindale that even he was but an instrument of Eru, but he never understood it, and rejected all of the harmony. All of his servants embody this rejection of harmony, and view of how sheer power (dragons), fear (balrogs), and deception (Sauron) can overcome everything. All of his servants have all of the three components... which are metal af.
The best argument against the balrogs having wings I've seen is that as Maiar, the balrogs sort of "chose" the form in which they'd enter the world, so it would make ZERO sense for them to have vestigial wings - which they would be, since there's no talk of them being able to fly. Why would they say "Y'know what would be cool? Wings that don't work"?
Balrog is baal which is a man controlling in the background who can not be seen and has an army at his disposal. Balrog could have close bond with the word ballot, that to have control over the balrogs you need the power of the money.
I love this video. Even though Balrogs have been covered in many other videos, this video gave me the feeling that I was rediscovering what Balrogs were all about. Well done!
Although the Balrogs are described as being vaguely human shaped cloaked in shadow in the books, I think the creative decision to make them these giant, hulking, demon-like creatures in the LOTR movies is one change that was definitely for the better. Now whenever you think of the Balrog you more than likely will think back to what happened in Fellowship.
I first read The Lord of the Rings in 1973 and I have loved everything Middle Earth since. Your channel has helped me fill in many blank spaces in my understanding of this world and the art work which you have used from so many sources is simply stunning. You have made my week finding this channel and I am happily catching up on your back catalogue. Thank you for this masterpiece of a channel.
3 Rings for the Elves, 7 Rings for the Men, 9 Rings for the Dwarves, One Ring to Rule Them All... I swear, those numbers had to be very, very timely, for good and for bad.
You’re channel has now become my favorite LOTR channel on YT. Well done, my friend. You provide excellent content and I thoroughly enjoy listening to you.
Salted Pork is the best food to eat after defeating evil. Balrogs are some of the most interesting beings tolkien created. The fear and power they had is crazy. Lord of Maps has inspired me to work on my own cartography so it’s great to see that he sponsored this!
In all the depictions of Durin's Bane, they often just go with the design shown in Peter Jackson's films, but I greatly prefer the image shown at 14:00. A creature of shadow and flame in the shape of a man, giving the Balrog a sense of fallen nobility instead of a bestial bruiser. It helps emphasize the nature of Maiar as a sort of angelic spirit, thus making Balrogs a sort of fallen angel. I'd love to know the source of the image at 14:00, it looks really cool.
Another excellent video. The detail of Tolkien's creation never ceases to amaze me. I think Tolkien's Middle Earth and Frank Herbert's Dune universe are the pinnacle of science fiction/fantasy literature.
As much as I like the film adaptation of the Balrog (I know, sue me), Gandalf's account is way creepier to me. It reads like the visitation of an evil spirit, an entity of raw malevolence..which, to be fair, that's what it is. It just comes across differently in the films than the books.
How Tolkien describes events and creatures through his characters dialogue is so well done, it’s more fascinating to hear than to actually see on screen
Gandalf: "Our interaction at the door almost broke me!" Gandalf 5min later: *Goes Godmode and puts boots to asses for 7 days straight and wins* Freaking drama queen xD xD
Is there a better "fuck yes" scene then when gandalf falls and you're like wow I didn't need to see this again...thanks two towers...but then he turns and omg he looks like he's attacking! While falling! Omg he's gone full badass! Maybe the ride of the rohirrim was more epic but idk gandalf was awesome here.
@@jakecollin5499 I also love how it seems so amazing that he stands against the it but we know what they both are so it's about the same as two crackheads fighting behind 7-Eleven. 🤣🤣
One lore video I'd love to see would be all about the Werewolves of Morgoth/Melkor, because they don't get a huge amount of information or details but it's a monster that I've a soft spot for.
Thank you for reading the part where Gandalf meets the Balrog the first time while trying to magically lock the spell and has this mysterious confrontation with an unknown power - I sorely missed this part from Jackson's movie (replaced by flights through the great hall). As of today I still think that the tension of that moment would have been a great addition (even replacing the invented hide-and-seek game with the Troll)
I love that we're talking about this because the most recent episode of the rings of power at the very end they tease the Belrog which actually brings credit to what was written in the silmarillions
From the lowest dungeon to the highest peak I fought with the Balrog of Morgoth until at last I threw down my enemy and smote his ruin upon the mountainside.
As far as sauron and the balrogs cooperation is concerned you have to remember that sauron and the balrog still submitted to morgoth and thus would work together for their masters cause. Not only that but even though sauron was the new dark lord he still pushed morgoth worship upon his subjects. Meaning sauron still followed his master morgoth and the balrog would’ve understood sauron was still carrying out morgoth’s will
I like the idea that Morgoth/Sauron and crew are lawful evil and Ungoliant is pure chaotic evil to the point that we kind of root for the rescuing Balrogs there. One of the few moments of ambiguity in Tolkien’s works.
@@bencarlson4300 yes, Tolkien's descriptions of those always gave me Lovecraft feeling, like there's something more to the world. Something Eru isn't telling us. Now that's a scary thought...
@@NerdoftheRings I know, right? Thanks for all your hard work!! All the research + the artwork, and your voice acting for dialogue, it all just makes these a joy to watch.
There is one other spirit of flame like the Balrogs that all in Middle-Earth would be familiar with, though they have forgotten her name; the Maia Arien whom Melkor was unable to corrupt, who guides the last blazing fruit of Laurelin the Gold through the sky every day.
I still don’t think they have ‘wings’ most likely it’s the shadow and flame that makes it look like it has wings. I can see there only being at least 7 with 3 being destroyed including Gothmog and the others hiding never to be seen. The part in the book where Gandalf talks about the counter spells is definitely very interesting. I wish that it was somehow portrayed in the movie. Also it seems whenever someone fought a Balrog they also ended up dying as well. Makes me wonder though where the other Balrogs ended up after the 2nd and 3rd ages. Well done video Matt!
I always thought of them having wings but not ones that enabled flight, just gliding. Which is why Durin’s bane couldn’t just fly out of Khazad Dum but also why the fall didn’t kill him.
The Silmarillion doesn't give us any detail about Ecthelion fighting Gothmog, but The Book of Lost Tales does. In it Ecthelion actually kills three balrogs before he kills Gothmog. That is four of seven killed by one elf. That would leave only one balrog left in Middle Earth going into the Fourth Age.
Great Video! Except one problem I had with your commentary was the part in which you talk about Glorfindel fighting the Balrog, you state that he is the same Glorfindel we meet in The Fellowship of the Ring which I believe to be incorrect. Then you go on to say that both fall to their deaths, and the Silmarillion states that: "Then Thorondor bore up Glorfindel's body out of the abyss, and they buried him in a mound of stones beside the pass; and a green turf came there, and yellow flowers bloomed upon it among the barrenness of stone, until the world was changed." But other then this I really enjoy listening to your commentaries! Keep up the good work!!
Correct! The Glorfindel of the Third Age took his name from the Glorfindel of the First Age, who dies in the fight :) like bearing the name of a hero or a "historical figure" of a distant past.
I license my music through artlist.io, but you can find a great deal of it on Spotify. In particular, search for Roaming the Fields by Kyle Preston. He does a lot of great music that I use.
A while back I met a couple of balrogs who moved to Nebraska after the One Ring was destroyed. Despite their reputation, they're actually really nice guys. They only served Morgoth because he offered a much better dental plan than the other Valar. But now that they run their own business they control their own benefits. The one balrog, Jeff (I think that's Sindarin for "honorable mower of lawns"), has a really successful landscaping company and the other one, Raul (Adunaic for "mighty fryer of fowl"), runs a really amazing fried chicken place in Kearney. If you go there, you absolutely MUST try the loaded baked potato salad. It's AMAZING! Who knew balrogs are such good cooks?! Anyway, Jeff married a nice lady from Dale and Raul married a lovely elvish girl from Lorien and they're expecting their first child in just a few weeks. Jeff also coaches little league on weekends and Raul recently took up bowling. Seriously guys, they're not all bad.
Your videos are incredible: well researched well edited, made with passion!!! I will use them to further introduce my 9 year old son to the fabulous world of Tolkien! Thank you so much!
listening to this guy say "Balrog" is an uncannily satisfying experience. I think I could listen to him saying "Balrog" for a significant part of the day
The crazy thing about this part of the book is that, the Balrog was... scared, worried, for it fell deeper than it had ever been in Moria, and was wary of the other deep creatures "nameless ones" that were to be found there. Gandalf was not so much as pursuing a fleeing Balrog, more like they were fleeing together, following the demon as he assumed it would know the way up the mountain better than himself, and because it was simply "going up and up the stairs" But i've always wondered, what the HELL was the Balrog so scared of down there that he literally ran for his life, no questions asked, no stopping. My guess would be, more "Ungoliant-level" creatures, far beyond what a single Balrog can handle.
I was thinking if Gandalf had not fought the Balrog in Moria and was slain by it, the Valar would not know of Saruman's treachery. Gandalf would not have been given Saruman's rank among Istari. Gandalf would not have been strong enough to free Theoden from Saruman's control and a host of other disasters for the people of Middle Earth. Its funny that Saruman steering the fellowship to Moria was actually a key component of his downfall.
@@absolutezero6423 good theory my friend but I meant the second age! As in what would have happened had the balrog been present in the wars against the numenorians and the high elves against isildur and gil galad
@@AureliusAntoninusCaracalla I should have mentioned that your theory got me thinking about the same thing happening but during the end of the third age. Sorry about that. I will try not to confuse people by leaving out important context next time lol. On the topic you described the dwarves were not mining mithril there at the time. I wonder what other possibilities could cause its unearthing and awakening?
He spent over half a century developing it. "The Silmarillion" gives a good overview if you haven't read it yet (assuming you've already read "The Lord of the Rings").
Presumably not all the Balrogs looked the same. They might have had their own distinct looks just as the Maia themselves did, or dragons and orcs do. Its kind of awesome to imagine all the different forms. I also wonder does anybody kill a Balrog without dying themselves? It sounds like no, except maybe some die in battle to nameless people.
@@morpheussandman3984 The Silmarillion doesn't give any detail. That means that Tolkien did not rewrite the battle scenes in Gondolin. I don't see why we can't accept what is written in The Book of Lost Tales if it doesn't conflict with what is written in the Silmarillion.
@@morpheussandman3984 Conflicts with what? The Silmarillion doesn't give any indication that that Ecthelion did or did not kill three balrogs before he killed Gothmog.
I love how the balrog in Moria is introduced. We have no idea what it is, but it's capable of going toe-to-toe with Gandalf, the most powerful member of the fellowship. Gandalf's account makes us think that maybe we're dealing with another wizard, but the way he describes it makes it seem like it's more than just that. The balrog, right up to its reveal, is given the treatment of a horror monster.
I would like for you to do a video about the Rings of Power. Who were they made for, what did they do, what became of them all? I know Gandalf had one that was attuned to fire, and Galadriel's ring allowed her to protect Lothlorien, but I know little beyond that.
@@dagnirglaurunga1620 maybe not. ungoliant certainly becomes an awesome power of evil if she's able to drain morgoth *AND* eats a silmaril. so no glaurung the dragon to torment the lords of dor-lomin, but a giant and clever lord of spiders instead, who knows.
@@oldfrend Melian contained Ungoliant in Canon when she was chased away by the Balrogs. If Melian temporarily allied with Sauron, the two of them would be more than enough to deal with Ungoliant, even if she ate the silmarils (which I doubt because they were hallowed by Varda).
![The History of Morgoth [COMPILATION] | Tolkien Explained](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ktet64d9O-c/mqdefault.jpg)
![The History of Morgoth [COMPILATION] | Tolkien Explained](/img/tr.png)
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Can't find any middle earth/arda maps on their site. :(
Would love to see some more non US maps there.
@@MarimbaMaurice my plan is to do all countries in the world!
Unfortunately only maps of states by they do have cool stickers.
@@isaacdushku3993 waiting for a map of Italy! nice work, anyway!
I love how Tolkien is so specific about certain things, even going so far as to create his own languages for the story. Then there are other things like, "How many Balrogs are there?" And Tolkien is like, "Maybe a hundred, maybe a thousand. But probably between 3 and 7."
False. Tolkien did not create his own languages for his story. He created his own stories for his languages.
I like it. Not having specifics on certain subjects makes the world feel real when that information passes through word of mouth.
The man tapped into real history in some dimension. No way he came up with all of it on his own. The sheer volume of words he wrote on the subject could choke a bookworm. Its insain.
@@twistedtachyon5877 no. He created the story for one language, then proceeded to write many more
@@twistedtachyon5877 False. He created the English language first, then the world and all who dwell in it. Then he starred in the theatrical LOTR release playing Orlando Bloom playing Legolas. Then somewhere along the line he created the concept of waffles and the traffic light… and that’s how babies are made. He said so himself in letter 42. Glad I could clarify.
I think the design of the balrog from fellowship couldn’t have been more perfect! It’s still my favorite movie monster, 20 years later!
Seen some of the iterations of that at the weta cave and i agree. It's also one of my favorites!
@Exar kun The dark side cosmic entity I like that design as well actually
@Exar kun The dark side cosmic entity true but still Badass
The portrayal of the Balrog was probably the only part of Jackson's interpretation of Lords I actually thought was done well, the rest I cannot watch.
@@dambrooks7578 Whats wrong with you?
Basically if you want to kill a Balrog, be prepared to fall off a ledge.
Seems like the self sacrifice is the chief way to beat one.
😭💀
That's their one weakness!
Fall damage is broken in everything
It does seem to be a repeating theme.
I personally think the movie did a good job depicting the Balrog, I remember first seeing it as a child and was in awe at how powerful and grand it was.
Agreed. I think it would have been difficult to make the more human like balrog cause a similar impact. Just another example of the movie understanding that when the medium changes some detail need to also, and despite that they still capture the terrifying effect.
@@raptorxrise5386 yea I don't think the human torch would have the same effect.
Well, balrog in the movie is also human like
@@krisyannuruha5147true its really only the wings and head that isn’t humanoid.
One thing I absolutely love about the movie depiction is how its roar is a literal inferno. You can just feel the power emenating from this beast
@@hitrapperandartistdababy It's the sound of a forge.
The Balrog, a really old war veteran, just chilling under the mountain in his retirement gets disturbed by digging Dwarves. Who wouldn't be grumpy after that?
I bet he'd was saying I'm trying to @#$&@#$ sleep you migits 🤬🤬
Balrogs are, for me, the most fascinating monsters in Tolkien universe. Dragons are awesome but Balrogs are something else.
Agree!!
They both rank as my favorite creatures in Middle Earth. They’re both easily the baddest of the bad when it comes to Morgoth’s forces.
Really makes you thankful that Sauron never had them at his disposal when LOTR took place.
They're not monsters though. They're maiar
@@7yep4336dfgvvh depends on how you define monster
@@jmp0035 monster mostly implies brute force, terrifying looks, and little brains
Durin's Bane was merely a dim echo of a far greater war back in the ancient days during Melkor's reign before he was eventually cast into the Void. Really puts Sauron into perspective, at least for me, since the wars with Melkor far outstrip the wars with his Chief Lieutenant. These videos on Saturday are a treat, so thank you.
Yeah, but the elves were also much stronger. They diminished due to giving parts of their power to their children. Which is why the old childless ones like Glorfindel and Cirdan are so special
@@laura-bianca3130 the ones who werent basked in the light of the Two Trees are also weaker
@@zeyadalbadawi8774 True. That is why the Maia and the Elves were both more powerful in the beginning.
BTW, even Melkor diminished over time
@@laura-bianca3130 Indeed, the elves in the Elder days were most certainly superior to the elves in the later ages due to taking in the light of the two trees with exceptions like Glorfindel. And regarding the elves that diminished due to giving their children pieces of their power, if that's true, then I thank you for the enlightenment. I'm still relatively new to the Legendarium as you may or may not know from some of my past comments so learning new details is always lovely.
@@indio4-215 it is not sure, but I interpreted it as such. The more children they had, the more they were connected to the earth (including Melkor) and less whole. Less angelic (good or evil)
A big example of that is Numenor. They diminished over time (due to not favoring the Valar, or the sons they had, but also because they were bound more closely to Arda through many generations). Before they turned bad, they already lost their lifespan.
Another example: Hurin talks to Melkor for countless years in captivity, Aragorn uses up a lot of his lifeforce to "talk" with Sauron through the Palantir.
An interesting difference between Melkor and most villains is that apparently his underlings served him out of loyalty and not just out of fear, as evidenced by the Balrogs willingly coming to his rescue when accosted by Ungoliant.
Well that's depend on context and situation, in fact most of Melkor's follower are simply his own creation, or human slave, Balrogs are different since they are Maiar, and the relationship between Valar and Maiar weren't based on fear, but based on admiration, loyalty and ideology (although some Balrogs were used to be Maiar who got manipulated by Melkor through deceit)
Most people serving Morgoth did so out of fear or because he made them to do so, but the Balrogs were different. He convinced them and they chose to follow him of their own free will. Therefore they are his co-conspirators, not his slaves.
Morgoth's closer servants sincerely worship him. There's reason to believe Sauron really does take up his cause, and deceives himself that it's just. After all, there was no reason to tell Numenor to worship Melkor unless he actually believed it.
Not all Maiar were on board with the Valar's plan. Some of them -- especially the fire spirits -- weren't impressed with trees and nature and daffodils. They wanted fire and brimstone and sulfur and obsidian, so they joined Melkor because he had genuinely better ideas.
It's like being into heavy metal but all they play in Valinor is Enya. Yeah, I'd jump over to Middle Earth to rock out with Morgoth too.
This is also true for Maiar of Aule the Smith like Saruman and Sauron. They liked making things and craftsmanship, so the allure and ambition of Melkor's radical designs would have appealed to them. Aman is a boring, stuffy place where nothing happens for eons. Just a bunch of elves lying around reciting poetry. At least in Middle Earth you get to do some serious Minecraft stuff, remake the world in the manner that you want.
@@Ishkur23 Pretty astute. The description given of Melkor's type of music in the Ainulindale sounds a lot like how someone who doesn't like metal would describe metal.
It's interesting to me that Tolkien caught his OP writing and retconned it. He was so caught up in their power he realized a numbers nerf was required.
A great world maker and writer who seriously loved his creation. We will never see another jrr tolkien.
@@bobcostas6272 😔
@@bobcostas6272 Perhaps one day. Geniuses like Tolkien are lightning in a bottle; their strikes are rare and irreplaceable, but their impacts are always felt far and wide.
He realized the base game was so powerful so he made a new patch that didn’t break everything
@@bobcostas6272 Echiro Oda? Frank Herbet? George R R Mrtin? Tolkien is good but y'all need to stop worshipping him
Hearing "Balrog of Morgoth" makes a certain song start playing in my head
🎶“What did you say?”🎶
@@NerdoftheRings "Tell me, where is Gandalf? For I much desire to speak with him."
Which song are you talking about , by the way ?
@@principledpsychopath8461 You must really be outta the loop if the replies aren't immediately putting it into your mind lol.
"They're Taking the Hobbits to Isengard"
"LEAVE NOW, AND NEVER COME BACK back back back"
I always find it funny how the fall of Moria is apparent ancient history to the Fellowship, yet, considering the context that it took place a couple of thousand years before LotR, would hardly be more than last week to beings who remembered the First and/or Second Ages, to say nothing of those who saw the light of the Two Trees
Really puts the history of Middle-Earth in perspective; Tolkien truly had an imagination of epic scale
I mean, just think in our terms, 2000 years ago it was the year 21. It truly hurts the head to even think about. No wonder most people didn't know what a balrog was when the last one was seen *5* thousand years before them.
It's amazing that even though Tolkien never wrote a full fledged story about such matters, there's sooooooooo much fantasy history that can be adapted into films for the next 100 years. If The Hobbit was split into 3 films, imagine what can be made from the ancient history of Middle Earth
Whats truely interesting is what it says about the Dwarves. They are so isolated, and so fixated on their own lives and cities. That the knowledge of Moria's destruction seems to be unknown to some of the dwarven clans
@@angeljaceherondale yet we know so much about our history from 2000 years ago, to say elves and such can't remember 2000 years given they were alive during that entire time is really just weak-ass writing. Sorry but the elves are smarter than that with very in-depth writing and historical systems, even better than we humans have.
I always found it rather odd that after such disastrous wars that the bad guys were allowed to live and replenish and their forces time and time again...it is almost like the writer was lazy and just wanted to keep bringing the same characters to the story and then claim everyone just had amnesia of world events LOL.
I mean we know so much of daily life from archaeological studies and examining writings from 2000 years ago, I find it VERY hard to believe that in a Tolkien world that something like a Balrog would be forgotten and no one knew what one was, especially those who were alive the entire 2000 year period and witnessed them first hand.
@James Sutton: Who among the living ever encountered a Balrog? Anybody who fought one died. Gandalf was brought back from the dead. I’m not sure what the deal with Glorfindel in “The Fellowship of the Ring” is & how he relates to Glorfindel from “The Silmarilion”.
Balrogs are things of myth. The Elves have kept the memory of Balrogs alive, since Legolas recognizes it, though he’s only about 1,000 years old during the LOTR.
None of the Dwarves who fought Durin’s Bane lived to tell of it. The rest just handed down a story of a mysterious entity, without any description.
Humans and Hobbits are too short lived to keep track of stories from the First Age.
Also, archeological and historical knowledge, in today’s world, is not part of people’s common knowledge. You’d have to actively seek out works on those subjects, like Gandalf did, when he studied the oldest records in Gondor for clues about Bilbo’s ring.
I think the most terrifying thing about the Balrogs, in my opinion, is that, despite their appearance suggesting the contrary, they're not mindless monsters, beasts, or demons. They're sentient and powerful individuals who are fully aware of what they're doing, that chose to present themselves in such menacing and terrifying forms. Now, remember everything I just said, and imagine if one of said balrogs possessed the One Ring.
they could very easily not even be effected by the One, being as it was Sauron's binding of his powers... being they were both of the same race, it might have been like Tom... of no effect -shrug-
@@narmale Pretty sure they mean, imagine what they could do with the ring. As in use its power, not be influenced by it. Those two things aren't necessarily correlated.
@@angeljaceherondale if it even has power of its own... even Gandolf was afraid of its corruption, so is it even something that could be wielded by someone else? Or is it just booby trapped to destroy someone and remake them in evil form forever?
I don’t know how loyal Durins Bane would be once he got the ring. Most powerful being in Middle earth + your masters in the void so he can’t do shit = You ruling everything
They were mair they were spirts of fire called the Valarauka, they joined morgoth . They were his mightiest servants, if you dont count unguilant who was just very hungry and very greedy
I like the idea that the Balrogs, while initially man-shaped, could change their form thanks to being made up of shadow and flame. And, when Durin's Bane understood what Gandalf was, they changed their shape to better scare and fight him.
@@MrRenanHappy Yet Sauron could change his form... from Werewolf to Vampire to a fair elf... I think it's the power they spend that limits them over time, rather than time itself. So it's feasible that a Balrog buried deep in the earth for thousands of years could retain that power to change form.
Remember, Melkor was a fast spender with his power (dragons especially) which is why he became so limited at his end. Also explaines why he (and later Sauron) would lay dormant for hundreds of years at a time inbetween battles.
As they lost power; they had to increasingly rely on growing thier armies.
Which is kinda the opposite of the elves; the light of Valinor gave them power, which dimmed over time. But some like Gandalf could always return for a recharge. Even if they died. Giving them the upper hand over time.
Oh no, now I've gone cross-eyed. 🤪
@@danbardos3498
The Elves diminish in Middle Earth. It is unstoppable. That is how Eru created them: each individual life, each generation. Only Narya, Nenya, and Vilya helped stay the diminishing of the elves who had possessed them.
@@danbardos3498Sauron is more powerful than the Balrogs though
"The Balrogs were not creatures of simple brute strength, but also incredible magical power."
That didn't come across to me in the movie at all. Great video!
I have always thought of that one Balrog as a self-consumed lunatic after so many millennia of isolation without any contact with its "god" nor equals.
They might have fallen to animalistic rage like fallen angels they represent in the mythos. Strong beyond reason or belief but ultimately broken.
I have always wished Peter would have done the Moria fight better instead of Gandalf being spooked and fleeing he should have shown what really happened at the door. Maybe even made it more dreadful like having Gandalf thrown down the stairs coughing blood and not breathing. The dread the fellowship would have had seeing their best beaten down would have been less than what the audience,who had never read the book, would have felt.
Not all spirits of fire were corrupted into Balrogs by Morgoth. Arien, the maiden of the Sun, was probably the strongest of all, and remained pure. We can imagine how truly powerful a Maia she was, brains and brawn. Olorín, otoh, almost refused his call for he knew he was not of the same level as Sauron. A lot more brains than muscle that one. And still he vanquished the Balrog.
I love movie version of Balrog, its so epic
@@avrace2708 I don't like it. It suggests balrogs are mere beasts
It is pretty amazing that Aragorn and Boromir were willing to stay with Gandalf and fight the Balrog.
This proves that Gandalf is really the best wizard in middle earth: He has forseen that a creature such as the Balrog is very much gameover for them if it joins forces w/ sauron. same w/ Smaug. So while thinking of long term, he devices plans to take out those two, before the final battle. Gandalf = GOAT
Indeed. It's quality storytelling, which we all know Tolkien was a master at. There's other really smart "military" tactical details written into his works that the writer of "The Art of War" would be proud of.
@@xlr8r17 Well, he was a soldier fighting in the trenches of World War 1, so clearly, Tolkien employs said tactics based on experience.
Bullshit, a Balrog joining the forces of Sauron is not gameover, the real winner of the final battle was the undead army, Gandalf was a good leader but he wasn't all that. in fact he made so many tactical blunders throughout the books it is easy to understand why the writer was such a low ranking soldier in WW1, he had no tactical knowledge and was merely part of the meat grinder, which is what his books turned into, battle after battle nothing but meat grinder tactics.
@@jamesw71 Please, enlighten us on what the proper tactics would have been, then.
@@xlr8r17 Clearly, the delusional fool hasn't a clue on what he's talking about. Especially since he's probably just an untrained civilian who has no business speaking of tactical warfare and what it entails, so just ignore him if he's got nothing useful and reasonable to say.
They are terible creatures for sure. One detail related to them that stuck to me the most is how Tolkien describes Fingon's death, saying Balrogs beat him into dust with their maces. I dont know, that detail still gives me chills, being so brutal 💔
Such a great detail! So brutal!
Cooked and pounded them simultaneously. Into char dust.
"And his banner, blue and silver, they trod into the mire of his blood."
It shows that the Balrogs are not just mindless beasts, but cruel, sadistic demons who get sick pleasure from beating their enemy’s body into a mess of blood and viscera
He got ground pound by a firy gang bang from Angband. :p
Durin's bane was already terrifyingly awesome enough, now picture SEVEN.
And one of them being even bigger and more horrific !
he must be the weakest of them all, imagine the others.
Lol
In Tolkien's erlier writing he had hundreds of them
And think, it took at least that many to bring down Fëanor
If Balrogs are Maiar themselves then 3-7 of them seems a lot more reasonable than hundreds. That would indeed give Melkor an overwhelming force of basically hundreds of Gandalfs.
This gives a lot of context the Fellowship’s encounter with Durin’s Bane. The balrog wasn’t just a terrifying beast from deep within the earth, he was an ancient and cunning foe, of equal ilk to Ganldalf and Sauron. It’s not clear to me if Durins Bane knew or realized at any point that the ring was within his grasp, but if he were to obtain it, there would have been nothing to stop him from brining total destruction to middle earth. A terrible reign of fire and death would have begun.
I second that sentiment, since if Melkor had hundreds if not thousands of Balrogs, then there's no reason to believe why Melkor wouldn't conquer Beleriand and beyond in short order, especially with the dragons at his command, both the wingless and the winged variants. Personally, I'd say 7 in total is reasonable. That way, it presents the Balrogs, as fallen Maiar, as a more formidable and fearsome force as Melkor's generals as they should be.
As dangerous as hundreds of Gandalfs would be, it's even worse than that, it'd be hundreds of Gandalfs with no concern for restraining their power or physical form.
@@indio4-215 Balanced as it was by a time when Maiar loyal to Eru openly walked Arda, interventionism by the Valar, elven and dwarven domains at the peak of their might, the presence of many Calaquendi, undiminished men, and crafts such that swords like Orcrist and Glamdring were outstanding examples of their time rather than priceless artifacts of long-forgotten quality. The mightiest elves, who had also seen the light of the Trees, could rival a Maiar in power -- and that's not something to consider lightly.
It's also important to remember that until Morgoth revealed the winged dragons, the greatest impediment to the Host of Valinor was the sheer quantity of Morgoth's force, not as much the quality. It took decades for the Host to simply cut through their numbers.
Hundreds or thousands of balrogs, given Tolkien's later writing of their origins and nature, is implausible...but so too is the idea there were less than a dozen, given the scale of the conflicts of the First Age. I believe Tolkien over-corrected later in his writings and letters, and perhaps he should have come to a happier medium of a dozen or two.
I really like the idea of 300-400 of them. For one because i think an army of dwarves glad in mithril fighting those is epic. And second because i think that smaller numbers are a bit... I mean i think that there were a few thousand maia on erda in total. And that quite an amount of them followed melkor. Because if not it makes me wonder why the other ainur did not simply fight melkor. His army was a bigger threat than just orcs and some dragon. It devastated an entire landmass.
Could the balrog hold the ring though? If not then I would be scared to see him become a ring wraith. He would probably be more feared and powerful then Sauron himself. If the balrog is able to hold the ring then everyone is screwed except the other Miar who would just regenerate and flee to Valanor. If he was to awaken I imagine all the elves immediately book it to the havens thus screwing everything in a hundred mile radius of Morea dead.
"a Balrog of Morgoth..." "what did you say?"
"a Balrog of Morgoth..." "what did you say?"
"They're taking the hobbits to Isengard!!!"
Gard gard gard gard
@@FuzzyLittleBastard 😁
Legendary
Tell me where is Gandalf
@@mvmarchiori for I much desire to speak with him
It’s so great that Gandalf slays the balrog while wielding Turgon’s sword. That fucker was almost definitely at the Fall of Gondolin.
Agreed. What a bit of storytelling and a great bit of revenge for Glamdring. Wish we had more information about that great sword and what happened to it, Sting and Orcrist between the fall of Gondolin and Gandalf, Bilbo and the dwaves finding them in the troll cave. Wish we also knew more about Elrond's reaction to having his great grandfather's sword in his hands when Glamdring was show to him in Rivendell.
Who's turgon? I'm new to LOTR lore.
@@marlonquintana3466 One of the great Elven Princes/Kings from the first age and a cousin of Galadriel. Also Elrond's great grandfather on his father's side. Sadly killed during the first age in the wars between the elves and Morgoth the master of Saron. Read the Silmarillion if you want to find out more about Morgoth, Turgon, Gondolin (the hidden city that Turgon founded and on which Rivendell is based) and the war between the elves and Morgoth in the first age.
@@florianschneider1860 Also the most stubborn elf to ever live (ok maybe second after Feanor). He ignored warnings from a Vala, and paid the price for it.
@@therealelderking5830 True that. Should have listened to Tuor when he first arrived in Gondolin and left the hidden city and not have remained and trusted in the city's secret location. But his pride in what he had built and protected for almost 500 years cost him almost everything. The curse of the Noldor came to roost. But in the end it also lead to the saving of all of middle earth and the final defeat of Morgoth thanks to the marriage of Tuor (a man) to Idril (Turgon's daughter) which resulted in the saviour, their son and Elrond's father Eärendil.
I like the design of a humanoid Balrog as well, specially that one you consider your favourite.
But i can't lie, the design chosen for the LOTR movie is my total favourite, and the art made of it are all incredible
Legolas gave a cry of dismay and fear .2 great trolls appeared , they bore great slabs of stone , and flung them down to serve as gangways over the fire. But it was not the trolls that had filled the Elf with terror .
that's one of the things I give Orlando Bloom credit for. he looked genuinely terrified, for me just being the perfect look for how Legolas felt when he realized what was there.
in the Similarian, its described that a balrog would enter the battle and the elves would flee, screaming in terror.
whereas the men, either not knowing what they were or simply not caring, are like FUUUUUUCK that shit, I'm gonna stab it!
so I think Orlando did a good job showing fear in that scene.
@@scorpionlord9175 hahaha
Elves: RUN AWAY!
Humans: LEEEEROY JENNNKINSS!!!
@@godfreemorals HAHAHHA
@@godfreemorals The Gift of Man is twofold, mortality, and massive balls.
Aiii Balrog!
a whole group of fire demons with flame whips driving off a giant demon spider is some pretty metal imagery. Not hard to see why Tolkien's work has inspired so many rock and metal bands.
The Fellowship is my favorite part of the trilogy and this is certainly a strong reason why. Even as a kid, I felt a stronger sense of dread towards the Balrog than Shelob or the Nazgul. It's amazing to think how perhaps the most formidable foe appears so early into the adventure.
Evil incarnate (Balrogs) is more fearsome than animalistic evil (Shelob), which cant really be considered evil (given animals have no sense of morality), or mortals who aligned with evil (Nazgul).
This is why we fear serial killers more than lions, despite the latter being more likely to kill you in one on one encounter.
@@sleepywolf3517well, she was offspring of Ungoliat, and Ungoliat wasn't a simple animal as far as I remember
_"Red Bull gives you wings!"_ - Balrogs
😂
*Useless wings.
That is the best explanation for Balrog wings that I have ever read 👍
@@Enerdhil It also explains why they're commonly depicted as red bulls.
@@Duiker36 Also explains the vile taste of red bull. Mashed and mangled gummibears topped up with childrens tears ;)
I enjoy the artistic interpretation of most of the balrog's we see drawn these days. I like the idea of them cloaked in Shadow and flame and creatures of sorcery because, at least to me gives the impression they could wreathe themselves into whatever shape they chose really.
@@MountainFisher I feel like Gandalf's cloaking is much less evil though. Like, sure he can do it to an extent but it's not based on Morgoth's teachings of dark sorcery if you get me? He's learned it from a very different source.
@@MountainFisher oh yeah that totally makes sense! I was just commenting on your comment! Lmao.
I was just thinking that being creatures of two amorphous things, always in flux and motion (shadow and flame) that they could alter their outward appearance into whatever they wanted given enough time and motivation. It would certainly help them in terrifying their opponents. With sorcery they could even perhaps project false images of themselves into an enemy's mind or create illusions to mislead an enemy into ruin.
I love how Tolkien make us feel how this creatures were pure horror
Despite me being familiar with the majority of the details you've talked about, your presentation with the maps, dates and pictures, interspersed with voice acted dialogue really elevates the experience. Excellent job as always, really enjoyed the video. Also yes I as well really prefer the more humanoid depictions of balrogs. Aside from your favorite from this vid, there is this image with Gothmog looking like a giant humanoid with lava like body (doesn't show his face) with two troll body guards that stand only up to his elbows. That is my other favorite depiction.
Can you send me that pic? I can't find it.
Gandalf: I am weary. I cast a spell and something countered it. I must rest.
Also Gandalf: Leave me. Proceeds to fight the same being for multiple days without rest until they both die and destroys a mountain.
Dain Ironfoot: *opens gates of moria*
Dain Ironfoot: *Sees a glimpse of the Balrog*
Dain Ironfoot: NOPE!
And that's Dain motherfucking Ironfoot we're talking about.
Smart dwarf
Imagine you've just incapacitated the Mafia--but then find Cthulhu lurking around the corner!
Greatest story ever told. In most garages you will hear folks listening to music, in mine you will hear Tolkien and Nerd of the Rings readings.
Sauron: I am the most faithful servant of Morgoth
Balrogs: *Am I a joke to you?*
Considering Sauron spread the Cult of Melkor to Numenor and in Rhun while the Balrogs stayed hidden underground, I think there is a reasonable argument to be made here.
@@KingOfSciliy you're not wrong, but if it wasn't for the Balrogs Ungoliant would have consumed Morgoth, then Melkor, after they destroyed the trees in Aman. Preventing Morgoth from even creating his legacy of evil
@@KingOfSciliy Sauron getting the Númenóreans to worship Melkor was an opportunistic move because it would raise him from captive to high priest. He wasn't in a position to present himself as a God. It wasn't done out of genuine loyalty. He isn't the same faithful servant to Morgoth in the Second Age as he was in the First Age. He also ran away and hid after his defeat to Huan and didn't partake in the War of Wrath during the First Age, which doesn't seem very loyal to me, leaving Morgoth to his fate.
@@Silver-5-0-5
Dude, please consider using punctuation properly when you write something. At the very least, please use periods and commas, as it makes whatever you write so very much easier for a potential reader to read.
Unlike most of the Balrogs, Sauron has not just one, but _two_ names.
I’ve read the Silmarillion, along with The Hobbit, The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers and Return of the King. There’s just something about having the details I might’ve forgotten or missed out on narrated to me that is just captivating. Thank you for putting in the time and effort, great videos.
Yes. Agreed.
The Silmarillion is my favorite story ( stories ) ever. I read it once a year for about 14 years. I’ve since moved on to other Mythos. Westeros , Hyboria, Chtulhu, Roshar, a few others. But I’m always brought back to Tolkien. Great channel
Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination Radiant!
Tolkien was one of a kind. His imagination incomparable to most humans in existence. Definitely was a pioneer in fantasy.
Gandalf: "Swords are no more use here" (pulls out sword)
You're definitely my favorite Tolkien deep lore channel.
" I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. You cannot pass! The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udûn. Go back to the Shadow! You cannot pass! " That line gives me goosebumps every time. You covered Udûn, but what exactly is the Secret Fire? Anor is basically the sun, right?
The Secret Fire is the power that Eru has to create true life. No other being has this ability.
Anor is the elvish word for Sun, but it’s kind of a mysterious use of the phrase. It could refer to the fact that he has the ring of fire in his possession, or it could have something to do with the Sun or his more pure power than the fallen Balrog.
Gandalf is invoking his authority as an agent of the Valar, basically.
@@NerdoftheRings I wonder if it has anything to do with the fact that Arien was originally like the Balrogs, but she remained pure, while their fires became tainted with shadow.
Sir Ein McAllen did this line beautifully he put so much passion into it that his vocal abilities cannot be understated. I heard somewhere that he got his inspiration for Gandalf's accent from actually listening to Tolkien old interviews but he is always been such a talented voice in his roles. And I think it's safe to say he made Gandalf flesh and blood.
Keep up the uploads on Saturdays lol it’s literally what I look forward to in the mornings now! Love ya NOTR ❤️
I love how this makes the Balrog fought in fellowship infinitely more terrifying.
10:09 AWESOME perspective / framing of the Balrog in this image. Love it!
Well, I look small in that image
Darn. The most scary thing besides Morgoth himself. Those are the *last* thing I’d want to see up close and personal.
I personally put them on third place. Ungoliant and her family take the second place
@@valentinkambushev4968 ungoliant is number 1 honestly
I mean, if you can place it on a metal band cover; you know it's both scary and awesome. :P
@@valentinkambushev4968 Agree
@@Idciydhmb Ungoliant would eat you slowly, draining the fluids, at worst
She might gobble you up if you're lucky
And she's hungry
But Morgoth might torture you, for years or even decades if you mouth off, before he shows his non-existent mercy and feed you, alive to his werewolves
And that's if he's Uninterested
If he's feeling innovative, he might try and torture you into a new creature or a new kind of orc
Those "Slow arts of cruelty" should scare anyone shitless
He might "put his power unto you" and keep you alive as long as he wants to make you, "feel everything ", as long as he wants
There's a reason Ungoliant of all called him Blackheart
So no suicide either
The very best you can hope for when you see Morgoth is a quick death
Didn't know they came in different flaming forms. Very cool.
And to think Feanor fought multiple of these Wizards/Mia spirits gone bad on Melkors front yard is something else.👌🏾
Feanor was for elves what elves are for humans. OP superhero celebrity and the drama queen. Feanor and Fingolfin.
He lived in Valinor. His body is still contains the power of Valinor light.
Man, why do all of Melkor's servants have to be so badass !?
Because that was Melkor's philosophy, he thought sheer power, fear and deception were enough to overcome everything. However, Eru Illuvatar told him in the ainulindale that even he was but an instrument of Eru, but he never understood it, and rejected all of the harmony. All of his servants embody this rejection of harmony, and view of how sheer power (dragons), fear (balrogs), and deception (Sauron) can overcome everything. All of his servants have all of the three components... which are metal af.
@@ChepsGaming and Morgoth came close to have also Osse by his side.... just to say
Indeed
@@bigmez83 Yess
He's basically fighting all the others of the Valar alone.
The best argument against the balrogs having wings I've seen is that as Maiar, the balrogs sort of "chose" the form in which they'd enter the world, so it would make ZERO sense for them to have vestigial wings - which they would be, since there's no talk of them being able to fly. Why would they say "Y'know what would be cool? Wings that don't work"?
Balrog is baal which is a man controlling in the background who can not be seen and has an army at his disposal. Balrog could have close bond with the word ballot, that to have control over the balrogs you need the power of the money.
@@robertagren9360 And folks if you look at the comment above you will see a stroke, in text form.
I love this video. Even though Balrogs have been covered in many other videos, this video gave me the feeling that I was rediscovering what Balrogs were all about. Well done!
Thanks so much! I really appreciate it!
Although the Balrogs are described as being vaguely human shaped cloaked in shadow in the books, I think the creative decision to make them these giant, hulking, demon-like creatures in the LOTR movies is one change that was definitely for the better. Now whenever you think of the Balrog you more than likely will think back to what happened in Fellowship.
I first read The Lord of the Rings in 1973 and I have loved everything Middle Earth since. Your channel has helped me fill in many blank spaces in my understanding of this world and the art work which you have used from so many sources is simply stunning. You have made my week finding this channel and I am happily catching up on your back catalogue. Thank you for this masterpiece of a channel.
1973 is also the year Tolkien died
3 Rings for the Elves, 7 Rings for the Men, 9 Rings for the Dwarves, One Ring to Rule Them All... I swear, those numbers had to be very, very timely, for good and for bad.
You’re channel has now become my favorite LOTR channel on YT. Well done, my friend. You provide excellent content and I thoroughly enjoy listening to you.
Thanks so much! 😊
Your*
Salted Pork is the best food to eat after defeating evil. Balrogs are some of the most interesting beings tolkien created. The fear and power they had is crazy. Lord of Maps has inspired me to work on my own cartography so it’s great to see that he sponsored this!
In all the depictions of Durin's Bane, they often just go with the design shown in Peter Jackson's films, but I greatly prefer the image shown at 14:00. A creature of shadow and flame in the shape of a man, giving the Balrog a sense of fallen nobility instead of a bestial bruiser. It helps emphasize the nature of Maiar as a sort of angelic spirit, thus making Balrogs a sort of fallen angel. I'd love to know the source of the image at 14:00, it looks really cool.
It also makes more sense for other heroes to be able to kill them.
Wow, you should narrate the entire book. I was completely mesmerized. Thank you.
Another excellent video. The detail of Tolkien's creation never ceases to amaze me. I think Tolkien's Middle Earth and Frank Herbert's Dune universe are the pinnacle of science fiction/fantasy literature.
Both were Catholic Herbert converted to Buddhism though.
@@sleepystar1638 Interesting.
As much as I like the film adaptation of the Balrog (I know, sue me), Gandalf's account is way creepier to me. It reads like the visitation of an evil spirit, an entity of raw malevolence..which, to be fair, that's what it is. It just comes across differently in the films than the books.
The movie version is about as good as we’re ever likely to get in a visual medium
How Tolkien describes events and creatures through his characters dialogue is so well done, it’s more fascinating to hear than to actually see on screen
At 14:50 at the left photo is my all time favorite depiction of a balrog... just perfect.
I’ve waited for a video on Balrogs, WELL WORTH IT. Amazing video!
Gandalf: "Our interaction at the door almost broke me!"
Gandalf 5min later: *Goes Godmode and puts boots to asses for 7 days straight and wins*
Freaking drama queen xD xD
Is there a better "fuck yes" scene then when gandalf falls and you're like wow I didn't need to see this again...thanks two towers...but then he turns and omg he looks like he's attacking! While falling! Omg he's gone full badass!
Maybe the ride of the rohirrim was more epic but idk gandalf was awesome here.
@@jakecollin5499 I also love how it seems so amazing that he stands against the it but we know what they both are so it's about the same as two crackheads fighting behind 7-Eleven. 🤣🤣
One lore video I'd love to see would be all about the Werewolves of Morgoth/Melkor, because they don't get a huge amount of information or details but it's a monster that I've a soft spot for.
"Today, we're looking at the Balrog of Morgoth..."
Gollum: "What did you say?"
Thank you for reading the part where Gandalf meets the Balrog the first time while trying to magically lock the spell and has this mysterious confrontation with an unknown power - I sorely missed this part from Jackson's movie (replaced by flights through the great hall). As of today I still think that the tension of that moment would have been a great addition (even replacing the invented hide-and-seek game with the Troll)
I love that we're talking about this because the most recent episode of the rings of power at the very end they tease the Belrog which actually brings credit to what was written in the silmarillions
From the lowest dungeon to the highest peak I fought with the Balrog of Morgoth until at last I threw down my enemy and smote his ruin upon the mountainside.
...And the Tan Maarek Stele defeated you in some other universe?
As far as sauron and the balrogs cooperation is concerned you have to remember that sauron and the balrog still submitted to morgoth and thus would work together for their masters cause. Not only that but even though sauron was the new dark lord he still pushed morgoth worship upon his subjects. Meaning sauron still followed his master morgoth and the balrog would’ve understood sauron was still carrying out morgoth’s will
Personally I love that accents you put on while reading quotes. They work. Keep up the good work my man.
I like the idea that Morgoth/Sauron and crew are lawful evil and Ungoliant is pure chaotic evil to the point that we kind of root for the rescuing Balrogs there. One of the few moments of ambiguity in Tolkien’s works.
I still don't know what the heck Ungoliant is. She's not Ainu. Out of all the things in Arda, she alone gives me eldritch horror vibes
@@Ψυχήμίασμα Same with the Watcher in the water and whatever the hell made the tunnels under Moria
@@bencarlson4300 yes, Tolkien's descriptions of those always gave me Lovecraft feeling, like there's something more to the world. Something Eru isn't telling us. Now that's a scary thought...
Ever since your vid "do balrogs have wings" I've been waiting for a vid like this!!
Sweeeet, I had literally searched just a week ago to see if you’d made a video on Balrogs, hell yeah!
Haha! Great timing!
@@NerdoftheRings I know, right? Thanks for all your hard work!! All the research + the artwork, and your voice acting for dialogue, it all just makes these a joy to watch.
47 seconds after premier, must be my personal record.
I hear that all the time
Tolkein’s description of Durin’s Bane instantly made me think of Sauron’s Necromancer appearance in the hobbit.
After Durin's wife woke him up with a song, thankfully he stretched for FIVE THOUSAND YEARS before becoming the bane of Durin.
Thats a long stretch.
15:52 gave me chills man😶😶
There is one other spirit of flame like the Balrogs that all in Middle-Earth would be familiar with, though they have forgotten her name; the Maia Arien whom Melkor was unable to corrupt, who guides the last blazing fruit of Laurelin the Gold through the sky every day.
I still don’t think they have ‘wings’ most likely it’s the shadow and flame that makes it look like it has wings. I can see there only being at least 7 with 3 being destroyed including Gothmog and the others hiding never to be seen. The part in the book where Gandalf talks about the counter spells is definitely very interesting. I wish that it was somehow portrayed in the movie. Also it seems whenever someone fought a Balrog they also ended up dying as well. Makes me wonder though where the other Balrogs ended up after the 2nd and 3rd ages. Well done video Matt!
I always thought of them having wings but not ones that enabled flight, just gliding. Which is why Durin’s bane couldn’t just fly out of Khazad Dum but also why the fall didn’t kill him.
Eönwë and company likely killed several Balrogs during the War of Wrath.
Why are there no videos on Eonwe
The Silmarillion doesn't give us any detail about Ecthelion fighting Gothmog, but The Book of Lost Tales does. In it Ecthelion actually kills three balrogs before he kills Gothmog. That is four of seven killed by one elf. That would leave only one balrog left in Middle Earth going into the Fourth Age.
@@Enerdhil there’s none going into the fourth age you have to assume the other was killed in the war of wrath even though it is scant on details
11:03 Yet, YOU'VE got a sword Gandalf! Turgon's old sword Glamdring!
Great Video! Except one problem I had with your commentary was the part in which you talk about Glorfindel fighting the Balrog, you state that he is the same Glorfindel we meet in The Fellowship of the Ring which I believe to be incorrect. Then you go on to say that both fall to their deaths, and the Silmarillion states that: "Then Thorondor bore up Glorfindel's body out of the abyss, and they buried him in a mound of stones beside the pass; and a green turf came there, and yellow flowers bloomed upon it among the barrenness of stone, until the world was changed." But other then this I really enjoy listening to your commentaries! Keep up the good work!!
Correct! The Glorfindel of the Third Age took his name from the Glorfindel of the First Age, who dies in the fight :) like bearing the name of a hero or a "historical figure" of a distant past.
Just remember what Edna said about Balrogs: "NO WINGS!"
I always thought some had wings and others didn't...
The music you use is splendid, where do you get it? I love your presentation of Tolkien’s masterpiece!
I license my music through artlist.io, but you can find a great deal of it on Spotify. In particular, search for Roaming the Fields by Kyle Preston. He does a lot of great music that I use.
@@NerdoftheRings Thanks.
@@NerdoftheRings What's the name of the piece that we hear from 11:07 onwards?
Fantastic presentation and illustration choices..overall magical and powerful video.
A while back I met a couple of balrogs who moved to Nebraska after the One Ring was destroyed. Despite their reputation, they're actually really nice guys. They only served Morgoth because he offered a much better dental plan than the other Valar. But now that they run their own business they control their own benefits. The one balrog, Jeff (I think that's Sindarin for "honorable mower of lawns"), has a really successful landscaping company and the other one, Raul (Adunaic for "mighty fryer of fowl"), runs a really amazing fried chicken place in Kearney. If you go there, you absolutely MUST try the loaded baked potato salad. It's AMAZING! Who knew balrogs are such good cooks?! Anyway, Jeff married a nice lady from Dale and Raul married a lovely elvish girl from Lorien and they're expecting their first child in just a few weeks. Jeff also coaches little league on weekends and Raul recently took up bowling. Seriously guys, they're not all bad.
I applaud you, for not attempting a fake British accent or over pronouncing Tolkienesque words, like so many other UA-cam creators. Well done.
Your videos are incredible: well researched well edited, made with passion!!! I will use them to further introduce my 9 year old son to the fabulous world of Tolkien! Thank you so much!
The art on these is incredible. Love these and thank you!
As someone who’s only a casual LotR fan, I had no idea what was going on half the video and that’s alright.
listening to this guy say "Balrog" is an uncannily satisfying experience. I think I could listen to him saying "Balrog" for a significant part of the day
If Moria has been destroyed for 500 years why was Gimli so surprised that they were all dead inside?
The crazy thing about this part of the book is that, the Balrog was... scared, worried, for it fell deeper than it had ever been in Moria, and was wary of the other deep creatures "nameless ones" that were to be found there. Gandalf was not so much as pursuing a fleeing Balrog, more like they were fleeing together, following the demon as he assumed it would know the way up the mountain better than himself, and because it was simply "going up and up the stairs"
But i've always wondered, what the HELL was the Balrog so scared of down there that he literally ran for his life, no questions asked, no stopping. My guess would be, more "Ungoliant-level" creatures, far beyond what a single Balrog can handle.
Hmm interesting 🤔
What really gets me is the balrog and Gandalf essentially went "truce until we get out of here"
You should make a video about what would have happened had Sauron and Durin’s Bane joined forces in the second age.
I was thinking if Gandalf had not fought the Balrog in Moria and was slain by it, the Valar would not know of Saruman's treachery. Gandalf would not have been given Saruman's rank among Istari. Gandalf would not have been strong enough to free Theoden from Saruman's control and a host of other disasters for the people of Middle Earth. Its funny that Saruman steering the fellowship to Moria was actually a key component of his downfall.
@@absolutezero6423 good theory my friend but I meant the second age! As in what would have happened had the balrog been present in the wars against the numenorians and the high elves against isildur and gil galad
@@AureliusAntoninusCaracalla I should have mentioned that your theory got me thinking about the same thing happening but during the end of the third age. Sorry about that. I will try not to confuse people by leaving out important context next time lol. On the topic you described the dwarves were not mining mithril there at the time. I wonder what other possibilities could cause its unearthing and awakening?
I will admit, I had no idea Tolkien had this much lore. Thanks for putting this together!
He spent over half a century developing it. "The Silmarillion" gives a good overview if you haven't read it yet (assuming you've already read "The Lord of the Rings").
Ecthelion: *destroys the lord of balrogs* Gimli: "that still only counts as one"
I wish they included a shot of Gandalf fighting the Balrog up the Endless Stairs, woulda been even more epic
I liked the balrogs in shadow of war
Presumably not all the Balrogs looked the same. They might have had their own distinct looks just as the Maia themselves did, or dragons and orcs do. Its kind of awesome to imagine all the different forms.
I also wonder does anybody kill a Balrog without dying themselves? It sounds like no, except maybe some die in battle to nameless people.
If you accept The Fall of Gondolin in The Book of Lost Tales as canon, then Ecthelion killed three balrogs before killing Gothmog and dying himself.
@@Enerdhil these are not really canon. Balrogs are only something like 'super orcs' there.
@@morpheussandman3984
The Silmarillion doesn't give any detail. That means that Tolkien did not rewrite the battle scenes in Gondolin. I don't see why we can't accept what is written in The Book of Lost Tales if it doesn't conflict with what is written in the Silmarillion.
@@Enerdhil because it conflicts, simples as that.
@@morpheussandman3984
Conflicts with what? The Silmarillion doesn't give any indication that that Ecthelion did or did not kill three balrogs before he killed Gothmog.
I love the way Tolkien refers to Balrog. Also Legolas calls the creature : Balrog of Morgoth.
Not just Balrog.
I love how the balrog in Moria is introduced. We have no idea what it is, but it's capable of going toe-to-toe with Gandalf, the most powerful member of the fellowship.
Gandalf's account makes us think that maybe we're dealing with another wizard, but the way he describes it makes it seem like it's more than just that.
The balrog, right up to its reveal, is given the treatment of a horror monster.
Gandalf knew he had to kill the thing, or it might join with Sauron.
Having a Balrog on his side would make Sauron essentially unstoppable.
I would like for you to do a video about the Rings of Power. Who were they made for, what did they do, what became of them all? I know Gandalf had one that was attuned to fire, and Galadriel's ring allowed her to protect Lothlorien, but I know little beyond that.
Some random balrog: dies epically
Gothmog: drowns in a fountain
What if the Balrogs never made it in time to save Morgoth when he was in trouble with Ungoliant...?
Lol Turin would have lived a happy life and got to be lord of dor lomin, beleg would still be alive and gwindor would be married to finduilas.
@@dagnirglaurunga1620
That is so true, not to mention NO Smaug to take over Erebor.
@@dagnirglaurunga1620 maybe not. ungoliant certainly becomes an awesome power of evil if she's able to drain morgoth *AND* eats a silmaril. so no glaurung the dragon to torment the lords of dor-lomin, but a giant and clever lord of spiders instead, who knows.
@@oldfrend I didn't consider goddamn ungoliant... But I think the elves would be better able to contain ungoliant rather than morgoth
@@oldfrend Melian contained Ungoliant in Canon when she was chased away by the Balrogs. If Melian temporarily allied with Sauron, the two of them would be more than enough to deal with Ungoliant, even if she ate the silmarils (which I doubt because they were hallowed by Varda).
I love how all the depictions of fan art are of demons when the description in the lord of the rings was a man shaped shadow wreathed in flame...