Come on everyone blow up the comments that both men are now officially gone with Donald Sutherland, who passed away sometime during this administration
Plutarch played Snow like a fiddle as gamemaker. He posed himself as someone just as cunning as Snow, just as ambitious, just as in control; a man equally if not more ruthless. It swept Snow off his feet, made him lower his guard and open to suggestion. The acting here is superb.
Reminds me of Azula from Avatar, but obviously Plutarch is heroic instead of vile. "You were never even a player." Snow was savvy, knew much of politics, but his hold on power died when he leaned too far into his own sense of superiority.
@@Ay-xq7mj Plutarch said in the end that he expected Coin to take care of her. It was in her letter. Regardless, I am sure Plutarch would have gotten rid of Coin one way or another even without Katniss. If he can play Snow, surely he can play Coin. lol
I’ve noticed in every film/book involving a dictator Like Snow, it’s always the brutal sweet talk that wins them over. They always want to be “one up’d” on their ideas. Plutarch was perfect for that.
Plutarch is obviously setting himself up to rule Panem - at least behind the curtain. He's the media director, which means he can effectively dictate all information flow, and produce propaganda such that he will always win elections
He didn't know Katniss would kill Coin, he just didn't care. Plutarch doesn't even get any kind of upgraded position from Coin's death, although there's some minor implications that Plutarch didn't like her
RIP Donald Sutherland (July 17, 1935 - June 20, 2024), aged 88 And RIP Philip Seymour Hoffman (July 23, 1967 - February 2, 2014), aged 46 You both will be remembered as legends.
I love that at around 0:57 Snow gives this exacerbated sigh and head roll. He thinks he's dealing with another fool like Senecca. But then his head quickly turns back to Plutarch as his attention is caught back. Before Plutarch's betrayal Snow evidently came to trust and/or even admire him
I love how much more respect he demands, even from someone as powerful as Snow, compared to the first Gamemaker. You can tell Snow seems to respect him and his opinions, while the previous guy seemed inexperienced and was scolded and lectured to like a child, this guy nearly comes off as an equal at certain points. Wonderful acting.
but it's understandable. Seneca Crane was much younger and his domain was spectacle, not politics. Plutarch was much closer to Snow and had been around the powerful people at the Capitol for far longer.
“Half the tributes were in on it” Feels like an Easter egg now when Haymitch said after the training session “good news. At least half the tributes want you as an ally”
I don't understand you. Deploying hundreds of thousands of siberians to the meat grinder is celebrated by your icon, do you root for the Capitol in these movies?
@@occono3543 bud, I was born in Russia and came here when I was 3. I’ve had that as my profile pic since I was 12 when my stepdad got me back into learning my native language and history about the town I was born in.And no I’m not a supporter of war of any kind. You might wanna cover up; your prejudice is showing. 🤡
@@occono3543 bud, I was born in Russia and came to the US when I was 3. Just because I’m Russian doesn’t mean I blindly believe in what a Russian leader is doing. Maybe you should get off the UA-cam conspiracy channels and learn how the world actually works. Now go back in your hobbit hole and cover back up now that your prejudice is showing.
@@occono3543 Don't blame citizens for the fault of their gov. unless they parrot those faults as brilliance. Not every Russian is bad. Some of them actually have family on the other side of the border and are terrified.
It all makes sense now. Lucy Gray was the Jabberjay. He made her into this icon, then he tried to kill her but she escaped. A consequence of his neglect out of his control. And now Katniss is her legacy. The mockingjay, repeating Lucy Gray's song.
Katniss and Lucy Gray had almost nothing in common as people… but the one thing they both had was the power to set the world on fire. Neither girl sought it… she just had it.
And this is why I enjoyed catching Fire more than the other sequels. It’s not about the all star game with the victors is about the backstage politics of both president snow and Katniss behind the scenes
And people who say MJ part 1 is underrated because it was a political thriller miss the fact that it was just Katniss looking at screens for like 5 scenes over and over without much substance happening making it boring and dull. Unlike Catching Fire.
The story of the Mockingjay is such a brilliant metaphor for the rebellion against the Capitol. Certain people left the Capitol (Jabberjays) when they realised how evil and oppressive the system was and sympathised and joined forces with the Districts (Mockingbirds) to create a force with the resources and numbers to take on a sustained counter attack
I'm also thinking as the ballad of songbirds and snakes have come out too that the movking jaya metaphor can also refer to and that is if Katniss is related to Lucy Gray that maybe while corio left the capital and fell in love with Lucy they had a child so like a jabberjay leaving the capital and mating with a movking bird to create the mockingjay and eventually Katniss.
I'm still angry at him and Paylor for covering up Coin's crimes and banishing Katniss, making her out to be a mentally unstable disgrace. Ruined her reputation.
Plutarch was playing devils advocate here. Since his inception, from book or film. Listen to what Plutarch said: “make her one of us!” Plutarch motives were always shrouded in mystery. Plutarch was also furiously ambitious. He straight up betrays Snow. He’s betraying Snow right now, and Snow had no damn idea. This was a good scene. He kept persuading Snow to wait. Snow could have done it, but he tell into Plutarch’s trap 🪤. Beautiful.
@@TheWPhilosopher Tywin is an example of this. He underestimates the threat of Daenerys (even Joffrey said they should act against her). He also didn't think Jamie would try to save his beloved brother
He was a master at reading people, and he sells Snow on the idea that he isn't so that Snow keeps some sense of superiority while also being able to write off the escalation the plays are causing as miscalculations. He presents himself as still competent and savvy enough to listen to despite those "slip-ups". In Snow's case, this meant talking to him on the same level, whereas many of Snow's underlings didn't present the same cerebral competence Plutarch offered him. I am pretty sure he had Coin's number too, even though Coin played her more ruthless traits much more low-key than Snow. Plutarch knew the arch Snow would take, and even without Katniss probably was contemplating the right move and time to deal with her.
It's very interesting that Snow didn't suspect Plutarch of treachery considering how much they think alike. But maybe that's why he didn't see it coming because if he saw himself and Plutarch as one of the same, then he believed he wouldn't dare associate himself with the other districts. Further proving by Snow's viewpoint on the other districts versus the capitol in the prequel.
Ahhhh, I'm always so curious about the movie-only's. They totally set up Plutarch to be a secret villain, possibly worse than Snow, but no one knew what side he was on unless they read the book.
@@blarbkanopcious4243Oh yes! Absolutely. But that scene takes place at the end of the movie. It isn't until the end that the audience is supposed to realize Plutarch is something of a double agent. I've even had people tell me they didn't fully trust him until they saw the third movie. For most of the movie, Plutarch is seen scheming with Snow--actually, most of this very video shows him giving ideas to subdue Katniss. Those who hadn't read the books had every right to be suspicious and downright distrustful of Plutarch. Those who read the book knew every suggestion to Snow had a double meaning, all for the rebels' eventual success.
@@cirrusB612 Ohhh I see what you what you mean, I’m sorry. I assumed you were talking about each of book-firsters’ and movie-firsters’ experiences of whichever Catching Fire they read/watched first, but you were actually talking about each of their experiences of watching Catching Fire the movie. My bad completely. I’ve read and watched all the Hunger Games, but I watched the movies first, so I had the experience you described watching Catching Fire, but then knew all along who Plutarch was reading it. My dad, also a movie-firster, actually figured out Plutarch was a rebel before it was revealed, which was pretty cool. I’m curious, you as a book-firster, what did you think of Plutarch your first time reading Catching Fire before it was made clear he was a rebel?
Agreed. Phillip Seymour-Hoffman played Plutarch like a master. I've never read beyond the first book(which was quite good), but I have seen all of the movies. All the way up until the final twist, I figured that Heavensbee was a villain considerably more cunning than Seneca. Turned out he was playing Snow like a fiddle the whole time.
@@blarbkanopcious4243 I never really understood him, I don't think. Plutarch isn't as involved in the book as he is in the movie, though I imagine that now I could re-read the book and see the entire arena as an extension of Plutarch's will. But I will say that when that mockingjay flashed on his watch, I knew that he was on Katniss' side. Maybe not a rebel himself, but on her side as a supporter, like Effie, kinda. He was still Head Gamemaker, though, which meant that at the end of the day, he was still under Snow's order. So I kinda shrugged and hoped that his meeting with Katniss would mean something by the end of the book. Glad I was right.
Still not sure why the power went out, though. Maybe Plutarch? The arenas are elsewhere, spread across the country and aren't in the Capitol, and the Gamemakers aren't right next door.
@@kevinthunder3375because of the Force Field, the entire arena have massive Force Field and this takes a lot of energy. In the training center scene, Beetee (District 3 tribute who won by electrocute all of his enemy and also designed so many tech that was used by the Capitol) he mentioned to Katniss about the flickering because Force Field takes alot of energy. His original plan we're to stuck a wire into the Force Field and when the lightning hit it gonna short-circuit the entire arena for a hovercraft to pick them up, but he electrocute himself when he try to push a log with wires into the force field thats why he passed out just like when Petaa hitting the Force Field.
@@scaryghost5721 yes, but presumably the Arena was in a completely different part of the country so it wouldn't rely on the same power grid or whatever. Or shouldn't. Talk about a major infrastructure flaw.
We know Katniss visited Snow after the rebels defeated the Capitol but I wonder if Plutarch ever did as well. It would be interesting to see one last discussion between them at the end of it all.
I suspect Plutarch realized it was Coin who killed Prim and didn’t want to upset Katniss by planting any ideas in her head, rather he simply let Snow convince her of the truth and for her to piece together on her own. Plutarch said himself that the Mockingjay won’t take suggestions from anyone.
That's apart of it, he needed the districts involved for the revolution to work but he also needed Katniss to be the Mockingjay because of her rebellious nature and being loved by the people
@@fort809 And hell, Plutarch's plans for Snow could have worked. If Katniss had killed Finnick, then Plutarch's predictions would have likely come true. But she didn't, and that was the crucial part.
Yes, he encouraged Snow's natural instincts toward greater brutality to force a general rebellion spearheaded by District 13, which then presented itself as the decent and humane alternative to the Capitol. If Snow had had better advisors he would have started making real concessions before the riots spiralled out of control.
Ruling others is like holding a small bird, hold it too loosely and it flies away, hold too tight and it chokes and dies. All rulers need to be feared a little but Fear alone is a terrible tool for rulership, it breeds obedience but not loyalty. The moment the ruler shows any sign of weakness, the moment they push their followers to the point where they know they have nothing more to lose, then they're done.
Hence why the Capitol looks like pride month all year long it’s either accept their truth or get the hell out if you think any differently expect violence from their peaceful peacekeepers I mean peaceful protesters 😂 this movie made me scared of the future and now it’s slowly coming true 😅
@@geminiangel63 We are not your enemy. We are just like you. Just because we decide to express ourselves differently, or believe different things, or love different people or identify a different way... does not mean we are your enemy. These things are superficial and ultimately meaningless in the face of what really matters. Violence is not okay, but you seem to only be seeing the violence being done on those who you interpret as your "tribe" by those you interpret as your "enemy". There is violence being done on all manners of people for all kinds of nonsensical and flat out insane reasons. But there are very, very clever people who prey on your (and my own) natural instinct to make enemies out of others. These instincts are there to protect us but they are incredibly misleading and often blind people to the ultimate truth that we are not enemies. I wish you no harm, and I sure as hell hope that you don't wish me any. I think you're angry at the concept of LGBTQ+ people, but if you got to know many individuals who fit under those labels you would find that you aren't able to hate us as strongly as before. There are people in all sorts of demographics who are violent towards those they don't agree with, that is one of the biggest failings of humanity. But ultimately, the political focus on queer people (ESPECIALLY transgender people) right now is a manipulation tactic. There are some very clever people who are trying to deflect attention away from something huge. The spotlight on trans people right now is unusually intense. It wouldn't be the first time in history politicians used a particular group of people as a scapegoat for their own gains. Please, regardless of what you believe, do not fall into the trap of letting yourself get so angry you can't see certain people as people anymore. And believe you me, no matter how kind or intelligent a person is, it is so easy to fall into that trap. You could easily be caught in it right now and not realise. Anyway, do not fear the future that does not yet exist. Let's be the sort of people who help build the kind of future that benefits all and ensures everyone's safety and freedom is maintained, regardless of personal beliefs or (meaningless) labels. We might not be able to control everything, but we CAN control ourselves and how we respond to and treat others. So we can start from there.
@@fabplays6559 I’m bisexual and used to be on the left, part of the LGBTQ community, pro choice, and believed I was oppressed because I was brown so I was a full left wing liberal however their behavior pushed me more conservative 😅 so I stand by my statement this is our future and I hope to be dead before it gets like this
Plutarch is a great example of a guy playing both sides. It works because his plan is legitimately intelligent and would absolutely work for what Snow wants to accomplish. If the arena hadn't been destroyed Katniss would've been forced to start killing her allies like Finnick and Johanna which would've turned her into a hypocrite and discredited her before her eventual death. The fact that this plan would've worked is why Plutarch can pass as a double agent
You see how Plutarch even with the side he's on could've easily turned into Gaul or Coriolanus Snow, but he didn't. Not just because he's so much smarter than both and not sadistic either, but because he recognizes that with both good and evil, there's a fine line that while 100% peace can never truly be achieved, compromises to assure a legit peace that could possibly LAST is the preferable goal. Plutarch has a patience, compassion and meticulousness that allows him to plan, think and then execute his schemes to incredible success way more than anymore else and thus why he ultimately wins in the end: by establishing both an authority and foot-hole in diplomatic interest that even if not satisfying everyone, can at least be far more acceptable than what came before under any circumstances too.
i love that plutarch is working as a spy and he is one of the people. movies theater stories sometimes is a medium for the real times to reach people #reflection #hope #fear
They couldn’t have picked better actors for this. Two pros. Peter Dinklage and Viola Davis are going to be the same way in The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes. Can’t wait to see their compilation.
"Galaxy-brained" is normally an insult, but in the case of Plutarch Heavensbee it's the absolute truth. This dude was a lot more a *chessmaster* than a gamemaster, and he completely and totally buffaloed Snow. He was making suggestions that sounded like they'd acheive Snow's aims while in fact their carefully hidden purpose was to do the opposite. Snow knew politics and was a ruthless, cunning tyrant, but he made a truly fatal error: He trusted Plutarch when the guy was *already* a rebel, and Snow walked smack into his trap. That's what happens when you get high on your own supply. And he saw Coin for what she was a mile away. Snow was very late to that party, too.
yeah he used to be a peacekeeper in district 12, its crazy to think how his story would have been different if he hadnt gotten his best friend killed on both accident and purpose 😭
Watched the movie yesterday (Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes) and in the beginning, Snow seemed actually a somewhat likeable guy; he did help Lucy win the Games. But even then, he still saw the districts as subhuman and turned on Sejanus. Why? Partially for self preservation. For his own survival. But also because of power and control issues. He still has a wrong philosophy as seeing the districts as unruly children to be managed and controlled with brutal means and by his presidency, he is shown to be a snake.
I've never seen that deleted scene before, so that was cool! The dynamic between Snow and Heavensbee is certainly an interesting one! Snow seems to have a great respect for plutarch. It would be interesting to explore how that relationship first developed.
As a kid(yes me and my mom watched it together) I always saw these as just normal villain talking, but now I understood how cruel and sickening their talks can be in regards to what they are planning, and also in awe how Plutarch played Snow like a damn fiddle this wjole time while at the same time also being pretty bad due to the amount of lives destroyed along the way
Plutarch is a masterful double agent, but he also reminds me of Dumbledore. "I'm going to create a Grand Plan that relies on information that only one or two other people know, and which relies on an extremely long series of lucky breaks to keep alive the one young person I most need to stay alive. If any part of my complex, fragile plan goes wrong, that person will die and the whole plan will fall apart. But this will TOTALLY work because . . . plot armor!"
I mean I would assume he knew their was a high chance it wouldn’t succeed which is why he put as much ducks in order as he could. He assembled Allies in the tributes and others to help their odds some, he got himself into the highest position below Snow to influence as much as possible. So he probably realized the odds weren’t in their favor but played the game masterfully to give them a better chance.
i mean, not really. establishing katniss as the mockingjay certainly was his preferred-outcome, but he seemed pretty prepared for her death, too. i dont think it's unfeasible to imagine he wouldve positioned her as a martyr (given a lot of the things he says regarding her sway on the people, and what coin ultimately ends up attempting). nevertheless though, he did a lot more to ensure katniss' safety than dumbledore did harry's. as the comment below u mentions, he and haymitch meticulously-curated allies within the tributes who were prepared to protect katniss and peeta in the arena (we even see this in the case of the female morphling and mags - who literally sacrificed their lives for them). likewise, a lot of his manipulation of snow revolved around stalling for time - the film immediately establishes that snow wanted to kill katniss for her transgressions the second she inspires enough hope in the districts for the rebellion to start to pick up. everytime this happens, plutarch steps in to convince snow to be patient and go along w whatever smear-campaign he proposes for katniss, instead - buying time to get her out and make snow lose track of her before he has the opportunity to execute her
We were so lucky to get Philip Seymour Hoffman in these movies. He brings such depth and personality to a character that could otherwise be overlooked. One of the greatest actors ever
It's always so interesting when movies and tv shows have social commentary like this. Because you can look at the real world and it's the exact same thing. Yet we don't even notice/ care when it's right in front of us.
3:46-3:56 Plutarch is straight up admiring Katniss, shes the reason he came back (if you remember their first meeting, the dance in snows castle he told her maybe something brought me back” thats something was her)
Katniss in the books makes mention of how the mockingjay came to be; as mentioned, they were the result of an instrument of espionage flipped on the Capitol, and so the rebels adopted the mockingjay as a last finger to them.
RIP Donald Sutherland. I can’t believe that both of these outstanding actors are gone now.
Atleast Donald died of old age,what Philip did, however, was really sad
Come on everyone blow up the comments that both men are now officially gone with Donald Sutherland, who passed away sometime during this administration
@@Primieprimprimwhat?
@@Nikp117 look at what I said in the comment section thanks. It’s just me giving an update to Donald Sutherland
omg.... i forgot theyre both gone now :(
Plutarch played Snow like a fiddle as gamemaker. He posed himself as someone just as cunning as Snow, just as ambitious, just as in control; a man equally if not more ruthless. It swept Snow off his feet, made him lower his guard and open to suggestion. The acting here is superb.
Reminds me of Azula from Avatar, but obviously Plutarch is heroic instead of vile.
"You were never even a player."
Snow was savvy, knew much of politics, but his hold on power died when he leaned too far into his own sense of superiority.
@@NormDeMoss Thing is is whole big brain plan would have lead to Coin in power no better possibly worse than snow.
@@Ay-xq7mj im guessing that he was gambling on Coin not being an asshole
@@Ay-xq7mj Plutarch said in the end that he expected Coin to take care of her. It was in her letter. Regardless, I am sure Plutarch would have gotten rid of Coin one way or another even without Katniss. If he can play Snow, surely he can play Coin. lol
Snow would still poisoned him later on.
I just like to imagine Plutarch closing the door and immediately breaking into a sprint to the hovercraft while swearing 😅
😂😂
I was thinking the exact same thing 🤣🤣🤣
"shit shit shit shit"
Deleted 25 minute scene. Would’ve made the movie 100x funnier.
“FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK WHAT HAVE I DONE??”
Gotta admire Plutarch. He was playing Snow the whole time & Snow never even suspected
Boss moves 🙏🏾🙏🏾
2,100th like 👍
I’ve noticed in every film/book involving a dictator Like Snow, it’s always the brutal sweet talk that wins them over. They always want to be “one up’d” on their ideas. Plutarch was perfect for that.
Professor Snape to Voldemort vibes
@@zenitsuthunder3946 Good comparison. Didn’t think of that
I really enjoyed Plutarch in this series. He played his cards exactly, even knew that Katniss would kill Coin. Just an exceptional character.
And they say nobody wins the games.
Plutarch is obviously setting himself up to rule Panem - at least behind the curtain. He's the media director, which means he can effectively dictate all information flow, and produce propaganda such that he will always win elections
He's like Peter Baelish from Game of Thrones but on the good side.
@@wickdaline8668 So Varys..
He didn't know Katniss would kill Coin, he just didn't care. Plutarch doesn't even get any kind of upgraded position from Coin's death, although there's some minor implications that Plutarch didn't like her
I love how Plutarch also played on how paranoid and stressed Snow was getting. Plutarch’s ambitious yet calm and collected demeanor gained respected.
RIP Donald Sutherland (July 17, 1935 - June 20, 2024), aged 88
And
RIP Philip Seymour Hoffman (July 23, 1967 - February 2, 2014), aged 46
You both will be remembered as legends.
I fucking miss him so much
Rip to him. I saw him in Charlie Wilson’s war he was great playing a CIA agent too
I wish Philip was still alive 😢 💔 he could have played more legendary characters
Heroin is evil, and all drug heads should be imprisoned
@MrTsiolkovsky Drugs are evil
I love that at around 0:57 Snow gives this exacerbated sigh and head roll. He thinks he's dealing with another fool like Senecca. But then his head quickly turns back to Plutarch as his attention is caught back. Before Plutarch's betrayal Snow evidently came to trust and/or even admire him
Also the head shaking at 0:42 I love the detail of Snow changing his mind.
Oh yeah that's a good one too@@chrishandsome9320
I love how much more respect he demands, even from someone as powerful as Snow, compared to the first Gamemaker. You can tell Snow seems to respect him and his opinions, while the previous guy seemed inexperienced and was scolded and lectured to like a child, this guy nearly comes off as an equal at certain points. Wonderful acting.
KatnissEverdeen1979 representing district 1 Temple Grandin representing district 1.... the rebellion is spreading! We will rebuild the Jedi Order!
Seneca Crane was a new gamemaster, and was executed for his failings.
@@angelrios5897 Well, technically, it was Seneca Crane's 3rd games. So not exactly new.
we shall see in the prequel, that Heavensbee is a powerful family name in the Capitol.
but it's understandable. Seneca Crane was much younger and his domain was spectacle, not politics. Plutarch was much closer to Snow and had been around the powerful people at the Capitol for far longer.
Snow wanted a smarter gamemaker… he got his wish LOL
He wanted a smart one who agreed with him
“Half the tributes were in on it”
Feels like an Easter egg now when Haymitch said after the training session “good news. At least half the tributes want you as an ally”
I don't understand you. Deploying hundreds of thousands of siberians to the meat grinder is celebrated by your icon, do you root for the Capitol in these movies?
@@occono3543 bud, I was born in Russia and came here when I was 3. I’ve had that as my profile pic since I was 12 when my stepdad got me back into learning my native language and history about the town I was born in.And no I’m not a supporter of war of any kind. You might wanna cover up; your prejudice is showing. 🤡
@@occono3543 bud, I was born in Russia and came to the US when I was 3. Just because I’m Russian doesn’t mean I blindly believe in what a Russian leader is doing. Maybe you should get off the UA-cam conspiracy channels and learn how the world actually works. Now go back in your hobbit hole and cover back up now that your prejudice is showing.
@@occono3543 Don't blame citizens for the fault of their gov. unless they parrot those faults as brilliance. Not every Russian is bad. Some of them actually have family on the other side of the border and are terrified.
@persephonehades7547 I know, but bearing the Russian flag with that emblem is like a Confederate flag. I know what their avatar means specifically.
It all makes sense now. Lucy Gray was the Jabberjay. He made her into this icon, then he tried to kill her but she escaped. A consequence of his neglect out of his control. And now Katniss is her legacy. The mockingjay, repeating Lucy Gray's song.
No Lucy is the mockingbird, snow would be the jabber jay. And because of their actions katniss would set off the revolution.
Katniss and Lucy Gray had almost nothing in common as people… but the one thing they both had was the power to set the world on fire.
Neither girl sought it… she just had it.
super girl is super hot
You think Lucy Gray escaped? It really was left open, wasn’t it…
@@Kick-z3l i like to think she for several reasons.
And this is why I enjoyed catching Fire more than the other sequels. It’s not about the all star game with the victors is about the backstage politics of both president snow and Katniss behind the scenes
Than you have Plutarch as a complex game maker and puppet master.
Exactly
And people who say MJ part 1 is underrated because it was a political thriller miss the fact that it was just Katniss looking at screens for like 5 scenes over and over without much substance happening making it boring and dull. Unlike Catching Fire.
CF was my favorite as well. Love how it becomes so much grander than the first HG
The story of the Mockingjay is such a brilliant metaphor for the rebellion against the Capitol. Certain people left the Capitol (Jabberjays) when they realised how evil and oppressive the system was and sympathised and joined forces with the Districts (Mockingbirds) to create a force with the resources and numbers to take on a sustained counter attack
KatnissEverdeen1979 representing district 1 Temple Grandin representing district 1.... the rebellion is spreading! We will rebuild the Jedi Order!
I'm also thinking as the ballad of songbirds and snakes have come out too that the movking jaya metaphor can also refer to and that is if Katniss is related to Lucy Gray that maybe while corio left the capital and fell in love with Lucy they had a child so like a jabberjay leaving the capital and mating with a movking bird to create the mockingjay and eventually Katniss.
What are you talking about?
And makes more sense in the prequel, or I thought the prequel addresses that very well.
@@SH-zh8ehNo, he would be too old to be her father, maybe her grandpa.
PSH absolutely nailed Plutarch. He was the smartest one of them all, a master game maker. He fooled them all, even Coin and Snow.
He is honestly such a great actor and missed I love seeing him when I rewatch stuff or watch movies I haven't seen before
I'm still angry at him and Paylor for covering up Coin's crimes and banishing Katniss, making her out to be a mentally unstable disgrace. Ruined her reputation.
@@kevinthunder3375 they needed stability i guess.
@@Godfrey544 i think that was Plutarch's idea than Paylor
Plutarch was playing devils advocate here. Since his inception, from book or film. Listen to what Plutarch said: “make her one of us!” Plutarch motives were always shrouded in mystery. Plutarch was also furiously ambitious. He straight up betrays Snow. He’s betraying Snow right now, and Snow had no damn idea. This was a good scene. He kept persuading Snow to wait. Snow could have done it, but he tell into Plutarch’s trap 🪤. Beautiful.
KatnissEverdeen1979 representing district 1 Temple Grandin representing district 1.... the rebellion is spreading! We will rebuild the Jedi Order!
@@ericwilson6994what
@@milesjolly6173 It's a real game vampires play on Mars 2033 Temple Grandin Representing District 1 to free the souls of hell
Brilliant!
no matter how smart someone is, they can still be outsmarted
Ironically the smarter the person, with power, the easier it is to trip them up as they gain arrogance.
@@TheWPhilosopher Tywin is an example of this. He underestimates the threat of Daenerys (even Joffrey said they should act against her). He also didn't think Jamie would try to save his beloved brother
At 5:33 "Sir, we've lost power!" Love the double meaning 💥💥💥🔌💥💥💥👑
I imagine Plutarch saying "checkmate"😂
Yes. That was awesome.
I could also picture blue checks and checkmate as well. I could picture that.
He was a master at reading people, and he sells Snow on the idea that he isn't so that Snow keeps some sense of superiority while also being able to write off the escalation the plays are causing as miscalculations. He presents himself as still competent and savvy enough to listen to despite those "slip-ups". In Snow's case, this meant talking to him on the same level, whereas many of Snow's underlings didn't present the same cerebral competence Plutarch offered him.
I am pretty sure he had Coin's number too, even though Coin played her more ruthless traits much more low-key than Snow. Plutarch knew the arch Snow would take, and even without Katniss probably was contemplating the right move and time to deal with her.
It's very interesting that Snow didn't suspect Plutarch of treachery considering how much they think alike. But maybe that's why he didn't see it coming because if he saw himself and Plutarch as one of the same, then he believed he wouldn't dare associate himself with the other districts. Further proving by Snow's viewpoint on the other districts versus the capitol in the prequel.
Snow has too much Hubris.
the same way normally snow would have seen coin coming, he was too focused on killing katniss he was blind to the treachery around him
Ahhhh, I'm always so curious about the movie-only's. They totally set up Plutarch to be a secret villain, possibly worse than Snow, but no one knew what side he was on unless they read the book.
What are you talking about? The last scene of this very video shows him being an integral part of the revolution.
@@blarbkanopcious4243Oh yes! Absolutely. But that scene takes place at the end of the movie. It isn't until the end that the audience is supposed to realize Plutarch is something of a double agent. I've even had people tell me they didn't fully trust him until they saw the third movie. For most of the movie, Plutarch is seen scheming with Snow--actually, most of this very video shows him giving ideas to subdue Katniss. Those who hadn't read the books had every right to be suspicious and downright distrustful of Plutarch. Those who read the book knew every suggestion to Snow had a double meaning, all for the rebels' eventual success.
@@cirrusB612 Ohhh I see what you what you mean, I’m sorry.
I assumed you were talking about each of book-firsters’ and movie-firsters’ experiences of whichever Catching Fire they read/watched first, but you were actually talking about each of their experiences of watching Catching Fire the movie. My bad completely.
I’ve read and watched all the Hunger Games, but I watched the movies first, so I had the experience you described watching Catching Fire, but then knew all along who Plutarch was reading it. My dad, also a movie-firster, actually figured out Plutarch was a rebel before it was revealed, which was pretty cool.
I’m curious, you as a book-firster, what did you think of Plutarch your first time reading Catching Fire before it was made clear he was a rebel?
Agreed. Phillip Seymour-Hoffman played Plutarch like a master. I've never read beyond the first book(which was quite good), but I have seen all of the movies. All the way up until the final twist, I figured that Heavensbee was a villain considerably more cunning than Seneca. Turned out he was playing Snow like a fiddle the whole time.
@@blarbkanopcious4243 I never really understood him, I don't think. Plutarch isn't as involved in the book as he is in the movie, though I imagine that now I could re-read the book and see the entire arena as an extension of Plutarch's will. But I will say that when that mockingjay flashed on his watch, I knew that he was on Katniss' side. Maybe not a rebel himself, but on her side as a supporter, like Effie, kinda. He was still Head Gamemaker, though, which meant that at the end of the day, he was still under Snow's order. So I kinda shrugged and hoped that his meeting with Katniss would mean something by the end of the book. Glad I was right.
PSH as an actor had a real skill for making trivial or even mundane dialogue seem so fucking captivating…god damn he was so beautifully brilliant.
Can’t believe they both passed away in real life.
And Seymour was half Donald's age. Died too soon
You will too, as will I, and everyone else.
@@HOTD108_ They mean they can't believe it because their deaths are so recent
It hurts to think that neither of these two great actors are no longer here.
The very end when Katniss shoots the arrow at the ceiling and knocks out the power, people in the theater started clapping.
Mine too!
Still not sure why the power went out, though. Maybe Plutarch? The arenas are elsewhere, spread across the country and aren't in the Capitol, and the Gamemakers aren't right next door.
@@kevinthunder3375because of the Force Field, the entire arena have massive Force Field and this takes a lot of energy.
In the training center scene, Beetee (District 3 tribute who won by electrocute all of his enemy and also designed so many tech that was used by the Capitol) he mentioned to Katniss about the flickering because Force Field takes alot of energy.
His original plan we're to stuck a wire into the Force Field and when the lightning hit it gonna short-circuit the entire arena for a hovercraft to pick them up, but he electrocute himself when he try to push a log with wires into the force field thats why he passed out just like when Petaa hitting the Force Field.
@@scaryghost5721 yes, but presumably the Arena was in a completely different part of the country so it wouldn't rely on the same power grid or whatever. Or shouldn't. Talk about a major infrastructure flaw.
Plutarch in reality had the same character of snow but actually had the peoples interests at heart so basically a good version of snow
Era en lo que la nieve se pudo haber convertido
Plutarch is like Prigozhin and Snow is like Putin.
The last thing Plutarch says to Snow is "make yourself comfortable." The two had entirely different interpretations of that line.
Wait what did he really mean? “Enjoy your last days before you die?”
@@NiennaFan1I myself was thinking more along the lines of "Relax and let your guard down. It's going to be a wild ride."
These two had the least amount of screen time and yet were super iconic in their performances may they RIP
We know Katniss visited Snow after the rebels defeated the Capitol but I wonder if Plutarch ever did as well. It would be interesting to see one last discussion between them at the end of it all.
I suspect Plutarch realized it was Coin who killed Prim and didn’t want to upset Katniss by planting any ideas in her head, rather he simply let Snow convince her of the truth and for her to piece together on her own. Plutarch said himself that the Mockingjay won’t take suggestions from anyone.
@thatperformer3879
I think the other person was wondering if Snow and Plutarch talked themselves, not with Katniss
This series is so well-acted. How they got such quality performers, I’ll never know, but I’m grateful.
Am I correct that what Plutarch was trying to do was get the people in the districts more riled up?
That's apart of it, he needed the districts involved for the revolution to work but he also needed Katniss to be the Mockingjay because of her rebellious nature and being loved by the people
Yes. Snow was completely correct from the first scene, kill the hope
@@fort809
And hell, Plutarch's plans for Snow could have worked. If Katniss had killed Finnick, then Plutarch's predictions would have likely come true. But she didn't, and that was the crucial part.
Yes, he encouraged Snow's natural instincts toward greater brutality to force a general rebellion spearheaded by District 13, which then presented itself as the decent and humane alternative to the Capitol. If Snow had had better advisors he would have started making real concessions before the riots spiralled out of control.
@@tompearce5418what kind of concessions?
Ruling others is like holding a small bird, hold it too loosely and it flies away, hold too tight and it chokes and dies. All rulers need to be feared a little but Fear alone is a terrible tool for rulership, it breeds obedience but not loyalty. The moment the ruler shows any sign of weakness, the moment they push their followers to the point where they know they have nothing more to lose, then they're done.
Hence why the Capitol looks like pride month all year long it’s either accept their truth or get the hell out if you think any differently expect violence from their peaceful peacekeepers I mean peaceful protesters 😂 this movie made me scared of the future and now it’s slowly coming true 😅
@@geminiangel63 We are not your enemy. We are just like you. Just because we decide to express ourselves differently, or believe different things, or love different people or identify a different way... does not mean we are your enemy. These things are superficial and ultimately meaningless in the face of what really matters.
Violence is not okay, but you seem to only be seeing the violence being done on those who you interpret as your "tribe" by those you interpret as your "enemy". There is violence being done on all manners of people for all kinds of nonsensical and flat out insane reasons.
But there are very, very clever people who prey on your (and my own) natural instinct to make enemies out of others. These instincts are there to protect us but they are incredibly misleading and often blind people to the ultimate truth that we are not enemies. I wish you no harm, and I sure as hell hope that you don't wish me any. I think you're angry at the concept of LGBTQ+ people, but if you got to know many individuals who fit under those labels you would find that you aren't able to hate us as strongly as before. There are people in all sorts of demographics who are violent towards those they don't agree with, that is one of the biggest failings of humanity.
But ultimately, the political focus on queer people (ESPECIALLY transgender people) right now is a manipulation tactic. There are some very clever people who are trying to deflect attention away from something huge. The spotlight on trans people right now is unusually intense. It wouldn't be the first time in history politicians used a particular group of people as a scapegoat for their own gains. Please, regardless of what you believe, do not fall into the trap of letting yourself get so angry you can't see certain people as people anymore. And believe you me, no matter how kind or intelligent a person is, it is so easy to fall into that trap. You could easily be caught in it right now and not realise.
Anyway, do not fear the future that does not yet exist. Let's be the sort of people who help build the kind of future that benefits all and ensures everyone's safety and freedom is maintained, regardless of personal beliefs or (meaningless) labels. We might not be able to control everything, but we CAN control ourselves and how we respond to and treat others. So we can start from there.
@@fabplays6559 I’m bisexual and used to be on the left, part of the LGBTQ community, pro choice, and believed I was oppressed because I was brown so I was a full left wing liberal however their behavior pushed me more conservative 😅 so I stand by my statement this is our future and I hope to be dead before it gets like this
@@geminiangel63If all it takes is a few bad apples for you to disavow marriage equality and equal protection under the law, that's pretty sad😂
@@devchekhov7512 went over your head huh?
Plutarch is a great example of a guy playing both sides. It works because his plan is legitimately intelligent and would absolutely work for what Snow wants to accomplish. If the arena hadn't been destroyed Katniss would've been forced to start killing her allies like Finnick and Johanna which would've turned her into a hypocrite and discredited her before her eventual death. The fact that this plan would've worked is why Plutarch can pass as a double agent
You see how Plutarch even with the side he's on could've easily turned into Gaul or Coriolanus Snow, but he didn't. Not just because he's so much smarter than both and not sadistic either, but because he recognizes that with both good and evil, there's a fine line that while 100% peace can never truly be achieved, compromises to assure a legit peace that could possibly LAST is the preferable goal. Plutarch has a patience, compassion and meticulousness that allows him to plan, think and then execute his schemes to incredible success way more than anymore else and thus why he ultimately wins in the end: by establishing both an authority and foot-hole in diplomatic interest that even if not satisfying everyone, can at least be far more acceptable than what came before under any circumstances too.
"Sir. We've lost power."
Plutarch must have found a 300-400 year old copy of Robert Greene’s “48 Laws of Power.”
I have to admire Plutarch
he ended 2 leaders by getting Katniss out of the Arena and gaslighting Snow
Plutarch Heavensbee! Plutarch Heavensbee! He called his name like he was gonna whoop him lmao funniest scene to me 😂
Also when his proxies call the names of the tributes they always come when called, not anymore
Ha, it sounds like he would've used his middle name too if he knew it
Philip Seymour Hoffman and Donald Sutherland absolutely nailed their scenes
R.I.P. To both
RIP to two phenomenol actors🌹🌹🕊🕊
RIP Phillip Seymour Hoffman and Donald Sutherland
Donald Sutherland is am amazing. actor. He did good portraying Snow. Kiefer should be proud of being his son.
Such a good actor. I miss him so much. Hard to believe this is the sane actor that played Dusty in Twister
That is how good an actor is, you give them a role and they make it come to life. That is a true artist.
Two absolute powerhouse actors. RIP.
i love that plutarch is working as a spy and he is one of the people. movies theater stories sometimes is a medium for the real times to reach people #reflection #hope #fear
RIP two amazing actors!
They couldn’t have picked better actors for this. Two pros. Peter Dinklage and Viola Davis are going to be the same way in The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes. Can’t wait to see their compilation.
Who are they playing?
@@brennathecatlover4360 Peter Dinklage played Dean Casca Highbottom, and Viola Davis played Head Gamemaker Dr Volumnia Gaul.
This aged beautifully, both of them knocked it out of the park, IMHO.
@@Summersong2262 100% agree!
RIP Phillip Seymore Hoffman. He crushed it in his final roll
“Moves and countermoves”, I use that in everyday life.
"Galaxy-brained" is normally an insult, but in the case of Plutarch Heavensbee it's the absolute truth. This dude was a lot more a *chessmaster* than a gamemaster, and he completely and totally buffaloed Snow. He was making suggestions that sounded like they'd acheive Snow's aims while in fact their carefully hidden purpose was to do the opposite. Snow knew politics and was a ruthless, cunning tyrant, but he made a truly fatal error: He trusted Plutarch when the guy was *already* a rebel, and Snow walked smack into his trap. That's what happens when you get high on your own supply.
And he saw Coin for what she was a mile away. Snow was very late to that party, too.
That is exactly why I love the quote. “Moves and counter moves.” It sums up Plutarchs character perfectly. He’s always one step ahead
RIP Donald Sutherland and Phillip Seymour Hoffman
We can tell that Lucy Gray and his past with her have resurfaced in Snow's mind.
Not really
@@mramos1126they did.
Now we know what Snow means when he says he was in the districts once...
yeah he used to be a peacekeeper in district 12, its crazy to think how his story would have been different if he hadnt gotten his best friend killed on both accident and purpose 😭
Watched the movie yesterday (Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes) and in the beginning, Snow seemed actually a somewhat likeable guy; he did help Lucy win the Games. But even then, he still saw the districts as subhuman and turned on Sejanus.
Why? Partially for self preservation. For his own survival. But also because of power and control issues. He still has a wrong philosophy as seeing the districts as unruly children to be managed and controlled with brutal means and by his presidency, he is shown to be a snake.
I've never seen that deleted scene before, so that was cool! The dynamic between Snow and Heavensbee is certainly an interesting one! Snow seems to have a great respect for plutarch. It would be interesting to explore how that relationship first developed.
THIS was the Games. Nothing that happened in that arena ever mattered. It was about the behind the scenes.
Exactly…and Plutarch was a games maker…the best…So good he even played the president of it like a fiddle
rest easily to both Donald Sutherland and Philip Seymour. Both so incredibly talented. 🤍🕊️
This was suggested to me just after I read that Sutherland died… RIP and we won’t forget you
Both gone ten years apart, Hoffman and Sutherland.
RIP
There are no more great actors like these two😢
Miss both of them so much 😭
Plutarch has a successful basketball career.
Rest in peace to the two flawless actors portraying these characters. Impeccable performances as always.
rip to both these gentlemen
Like to have a backstory about Plutarch, since his family was very prestigious among the capitol. What turned him?
We may well get one sooner than later.
March 18, maybe?
1:38 "I should know, one time I tricked this dumbass kid I knew named Sejanus into ratting on himself with one."
snow : look at this they're holding hands . i want them dead .
every single person who is single on valentine's day feels this 😂
Speaking from experience? 😂😂
@@jamiengo2343 nope . been married for 10 years bestie . nice try being a pos though 😉
@@sarahw1179 I try my best :)
😂 At first it looked like their plans kept backfiring...then it turns out he was in on the rebellion and sabotaging Snow the entire time.
RIP to two acting legends.
"the broadcast cut out here" 1 minute later Snow fast forwards through the broadcast
Yeah the broadcast for the people stopped there not for him
Rest in power you two incredible men
He was such a good actor.
1:05 recognition and respect, two masterclass checker players. Too bad for Snow that Plutarch was playing chess all along.
I never read the books, but from the end of the series , it seems to imply that he’ll be a power behind the throne under President Paylor’s Presidency
Plutarch became Secretary of Communications after the war.
As a kid(yes me and my mom watched it together) I always saw these as just normal villain talking, but now I understood how cruel and sickening their talks can be in regards to what they are planning, and also in awe how Plutarch played Snow like a damn fiddle this wjole time while at the same time also being pretty bad due to the amount of lives destroyed along the way
Snow is right about Katniss, she doesn't want to be where she is, she just wants the war to end.
God, I love Plutarchs character. The political deceptions are amazing
Plutarch is a masterful double agent, but he also reminds me of Dumbledore. "I'm going to create a Grand Plan that relies on information that only one or two other people know, and which relies on an extremely long series of lucky breaks to keep alive the one young person I most need to stay alive. If any part of my complex, fragile plan goes wrong, that person will die and the whole plan will fall apart. But this will TOTALLY work because . . . plot armor!"
I mean I would assume he knew their was a high chance it wouldn’t succeed which is why he put as much ducks in order as he could. He assembled Allies in the tributes and others to help their odds some, he got himself into the highest position below Snow to influence as much as possible. So he probably realized the odds weren’t in their favor but played the game masterfully to give them a better chance.
😂 The magic of fiction!
@@Loganbub his plan seemed more feasible and reactionary than Dumbledore's.
i mean, not really. establishing katniss as the mockingjay certainly was his preferred-outcome, but he seemed pretty prepared for her death, too. i dont think it's unfeasible to imagine he wouldve positioned her as a martyr (given a lot of the things he says regarding her sway on the people, and what coin ultimately ends up attempting). nevertheless though, he did a lot more to ensure katniss' safety than dumbledore did harry's. as the comment below u mentions, he and haymitch meticulously-curated allies within the tributes who were prepared to protect katniss and peeta in the arena (we even see this in the case of the female morphling and mags - who literally sacrificed their lives for them). likewise, a lot of his manipulation of snow revolved around stalling for time - the film immediately establishes that snow wanted to kill katniss for her transgressions the second she inspires enough hope in the districts for the rebellion to start to pick up. everytime this happens, plutarch steps in to convince snow to be patient and go along w whatever smear-campaign he proposes for katniss, instead - buying time to get her out and make snow lose track of her before he has the opportunity to execute her
@@zaddyfaye6880 Agreed!
RIP Phillip Seymour Hoffman, you were amazing and played the smartest character in Hunger Games history
He was in Twister, too
Just heard the news that Donald passed away earlier today. RIP sir, you were a beloved person and inspiring actor! ❤🕊️
We were so lucky to get Philip Seymour Hoffman in these movies. He brings such depth and personality to a character that could otherwise be overlooked. One of the greatest actors ever
Rip both have passed.
Rest in peace to you two.
Both have passed
MASTERCLASS IN ACTING BETWEEN TWO LEGENDS
Plutarch Heavensbee is the living embodiment of “keep your friends close and your enemies closer”
philip seymour hoffman was such a brilliant actor
And now i realise how much of Donald Sutherland's heavy breathing they take out in post 😂
It's always so interesting when movies and tv shows have social commentary like this. Because you can look at the real world and it's the exact same thing. Yet we don't even notice/ care when it's right in front of us.
Plutarch is THE GAMEMAKER...my man played Snow really well
god I miss Philip Seymour Hoffman. He always elevated everything he was in, even if it was already good without him, he would raise it higher.
3:46-3:56 Plutarch is straight up admiring Katniss, shes the reason he came back (if you remember their first meeting, the dance in snows castle he told her maybe something brought me back” thats something was her)
Plutarch played Snow so well. And Snow is no slouch.
I like that they added stuff from Snow’s pov in the movies
Is Snow’s monologue about the extermination attempt of mockingjays in the movie or is that a deleted scene?
It’s a deleted scene yes, it was in the book I’m pretty sure
About the jabberjays it’s a deleted scene but it’s in the books
Yeah never remembered I've seen that scene before either.
Katniss in the books makes mention of how the mockingjay came to be; as mentioned, they were the result of an instrument of espionage flipped on the Capitol, and so the rebels adopted the mockingjay as a last finger to them.
Every scene is
Snow: "I want them dead."
Plutarch: "Nah man, just wait, you'll see."
One of the great gems of the movie adaptations that we got to see interactions like these and not just Katniss’s perspective.
I just love to see two of the greatest actors of all time sharing screentime and saying a bunch of sci-fi nonsense
5:02 didn’t realize r2-d2 was in this movie
Two of the finest actors of our time, now sadly both passed away
We will not see an actor the life of Philip Seymour Hoffman in our lives