It also suggests that Pegasus Humanity was highly advanced under the Ancients before the Wraith started reverting their planets back to mediaeval levels of technology. The Travellers were simply able to avoid detection, much like the ragtag fleet from Battlestar Galactica.
@@tompearce5418 Although it suggests this, they might also have traded some stuff with other advanced civilizations. They might even buy stuff from advanced civilizations, (Sateda + 200 years?) that get killed by the wraith later and just their tech survives on the travelers ships. The travelers also might have started off with lantian ships with a Lot of "unnecessary" stuff thats tradable to advanced civs. Maybe even Something as simple as navigation Data and what places to avoid might be worth so much for a hiding spacefaring civilization
The first time I heard about the Travelers I was already aware of things like orbital infrastructure and asteroid mining so I was always curious why they didn't find asteroids with resources that they needed and build a hyperspace capable mining station on them, as in the station can take the asteroid along with itself into hyperspace. But I guess that hinders the story the show runners wanted to tell. I hope that a portion of the Travelers managed to figure something like what I mentioned above out and begin to build a self sustaining society totally in space, because I think that is awesome!
The Attero device was such a cool concept. To the point that it's difficult to understand why the atlanteans didn't win the war. Oh hey, we're going to turn the device on at these set times. Don't use a gate or hyperdrive until we turn it off again. Easier to clean up radiation damage from an exploded gate than it is to fight the Wraith in open combat.
I'm surprised we didn't see the more often after their introduction. Those guns would have been very useful and there were probably more Atlantean ships they could have fixed up after a little gene therapy. It also seemed like the show runners were shipping that captain and Shepherd.
They would also be a marketing opportunity for Earth to sell a few ships, perhaps the earlier versions of Prometheus or the various Gou'ald models which seem to be able to be manufactured by a mostly medieval society, or even just the old 1950's sublight Project Orion spaceships whose construction could be hidden amongst the production of nuclear submarines with segments shipped through the Stargate to an uninhabited world for assembly and an environment devastating ground launch.
I would have proposed a 3 way trade deal; the Travellers give the Tau'ri energy rifles similar to the partical magnum and the Tau'ri would buy ships from the Hebridians and tow them to pegasus then let the Travellers refit them as they saw fit. They could buy anything from a large cruise liner to a compact Gunship and the Travellers would have been able to use it.
@@MrDj232 we don't have that much evidence that they are fighting the wraith. the only time we see them fighting the wraith is by accident. And we could use those guns in the milkway too. No need to ship them back.
as a story element, i like the travelers. the space and resource scarcity is what makes series like battlestar galactica great. it adds interesting story elements that the cast need to work with, and it usually creates societies that would not be normal for civilisations that live on planets.
Oh haha, I bookmarked this when I saw the notification only to realize I was rewatching the original episode from Stargate Atlantis today. Great job as always!
Holy crap that traveler lady is gorgeous WOW please Wraith don't kill her LOL🤣🤣🤣 No seriously don't kill anyone no matter how they look period. Also Mass Effect is an awesome trilogy of games these travelers do have much in common with Tali's race. Other than that a great video keep up the great work👍 And greetings from the Netherlands🇳🇱
Their government actually made sense to me because, unlike land-bound organizations, they can just take all their stuff and leave at any time. I was surprised that the Travelers didn't team up with the Atlantis group more. It would have offered them a home base to safely repair their ships and operate from and they could have searched for technology together. Liberal use of the Atlantean Gene Therapy would have helped them be able to scavenge more Atlantean ships. Maybe they could have even started to build their own Atlantean ships somewhere. Something that never came up in the show I noticed.
"Cuz they might have said no" is the such a stupid excuse, I don't know who thought of it, but its in all kinds of media and stories and it drives me crazy every time I hear it. Just ask first, and IF they say no; well THEN kidnap them and force them to help fix the ship under threat of being thrown out the airlock. Win, win :D
@David Szaks I do agree that it is stupid. But I did like when she said it, as there was a pause between them. Like she knew it was wrong, but they were so desperate they couldn’t risk it. And Shepard has this look like he gets why, he still doesn’t like it, but he gets it.
Usually it's meant to show desperation and remorse. The people causing problems know they're in the wrong, but they're so used to things going badly that they assume the worst and take drastic measures before trying anything else. Although it's typically used in first contact situations where neither side knows anything about the other so this trope usually comes across as the antagonists shooting themselves in the foot by making contact through kidnapping and/or theft.
@@sg-24 My problem isn't that it's wrong in the moral sense. But wrong in the logical sense. There is literally no risk to asking first. IF they say do in fact say no, then you can switch to your original kidnapping or other equally morally suspect scheme without sacrificing anything on your end.
@David Szaks well here’s the way I look at it. Yes logically there is no issue in asking for help, but humans are not logical creatures. Sometimes we do things based on emotions like fear or envy. If they went to Atlantis (in their mind) Atlantis could have said no, or only agreed to help them for a be try high fee. And the thing is there is very much how most of human history goes. I’ve read it was common in the past during first contacts to kidnap people and force them to learn their language to have that communication. And with their fleet in constant jeopardy of being attacked by the Wraith you don’t take risk like that.
The Travelers are most likely survivors from the last Culling. The wraith hibernate for centuries. When the expedition awoke the queen she saw their tech and figured one of the planets had risen up the technology tree to the point that they could explore other planets as well as having billions of population. I imagine the Travelers where like the Tolland at one point when they encountered the wraith and caused them to awaken just like the expedition did. Remember odds are the only reason the expedition keeps finding wraith all over is because they woke them from hibernation which activated all their ships. With a major food shortage the wraith or very aggressively searching for anyone they can find to feed on. Where as if this had not happen odds are the galaxy would have been more like it was in SG1 at the start with few encounters involving the galaxy baddie. Heck they might have even meet the Genii on better terms and been able to help them carry out their plan to deal a major blow to the wraith while they still slept. Unlike the ghoul, the wraith don't care if humans advance because they beat the ancients. They only care if the population grows and technology often allows the support of much larger populations. Some of the wraith knew this and openly accepted it as that one episode where they find a civilization that is sacrificing their people to the wraith as tribute so they can be left alone.
@PyroMancer2k I like your points, and I think it’s a good idea. The only thing is the Wraith do care about technology of other races. Like with the Vanir they attacked them because they don’t tolerate other advanced groups. And we saw this with Ronan’s people, and they only reach the post WW2 era of tech. I do think you are right that some Wraith groups would be more okay with how advanced certain groups get, but they still wouldn’t let them reach the space age.
@@sg-24 I meant more that they don't care enough to actively watch other races. It's likely some remote group of humans advanced enough to the point that they could travel the stars. Perhaps they didn't have a gate on their world so the Wraith didn't notice their advancement. Also with Ronan's people I think it was once again a case of the harvest being ready. Where like SG1 alerted the ghoul to their presence with the stargate I suspect something similar happen to Ronan's people since their world had a gate and Ronan knew how to use one. After all a WW2 era tech civilization likely has hundreds of millions of people ready to be culled. The wraith aren't exactly patient as they wouldn't just think to wait a few years until those numbers become billions. Also at WW2 level there is a real chance the cattle might wipe themselves out with nuclear weapons. Sure they could become a larger threat to the wraith if left unchecked but the fact that Ronan's people even got to that point shows the wraith are not actively monitoring every world to keep them under foot. Basically I think the Travelers where like Ronan's people only they went unnoticed for a lot longer and thus got to the space age. I mean look how fast our civilization has advanced in 200 years. Who knows what more advancements might be made in the next 200 years. One thing SG and many other Sci-Fi franchises fail at is representing proper scaling. If you look at our population at the start of the industrial revolution and how it increased leading up to WW2 it's a huge increase but even then it was already in the millions which would be a tempting target to the wraith so why allow it to further advanced past industrial age? I mean they start out the series with Wraith raiding a small hunting village with probably less than 100 people in it. In order for a civilization to rise you need tons of interdependent systems. Much of our modern civilization wouldn't be possible without global trade because modern tech uses so many different materials that are mined from all over the world as there is no place that has everything in one easy to access location. What this means though is you need a LOT of people harvesting materials from all over and bringing them together to make these item. Thus civilizations like Ronan's people, the Genii, the Travelers, and etc would have needed to grow massive populations to reach their point. Which means they were not constantly harassed like tribe at the start. Also each Wraith has their own hunting grounds so some might be more proactive at culling than others.
The Travellers are interesting enough from what I remember the writers wanted to introduce more factions in SGA that could be wild cards. The Genni couldmt be because they were to primitive tevhnologically.
@Michael Kotcher it does suck we never saw these two groups interact since it seems like they would have a natural alliance. The Travelers have advance tech the Genii want, and the Genii have a way to keep their people safe from the Wrath and could extend it to the Travelers.
Katana Labrea (the captain from the Lost Tribe) is the unlucky officer who’s ship is taken. She lands her ship on a planet to trade for things they can repair the ship, and informants get word back to the Genii, who send a strike force through the gate using jeeps (they should have such tech, they can build nukes, why not?) and get their troops to the ship before the Travelers on the ground can respond. Before they realize what’s happening, Genii soldiers are onboard, and quickly overwhelm the crew and families aboard. Hostages are taken and an ho later, another full company of men are on the ground securing the ship and the gate, escape is now impossible. Science teams move in to study the vessel and reverse engineer it, as well as learn to operate it.
@@sg-24 I always felt that both sides had distinct advantages over each other. If the Travelers stay in space, the Genii can’t touch them. But the size of the Genii military means that if the Travelers land on a planet the Genii can access, they will easily overwhelm Traveler security forces.
The travellers where likely a native people group entirely isolated from the ancients. I have a feeling a large portion of their population attempted to leave the galaxy and those whom remained remained on the run without end. They might very well have set up homes on planets however the wraith where always on the hunt.
The Travelers are easily one of my favorite parts of SGA, probably because I'm jealous of them lol. I'm a wanderer myself, traveling wherever and whenever I can. I'm not the "put down roots" type. I'm a nomad lol.
I feel like stargate atlantis shot them selfs in the foot by making the wraith to strong of an enemy. I liked finding other advanced life in the milkway because of goa'uld incompetence.
The sexiest yet most painful episode in all of SGA. it almost got ridiculous with the whole no trust, im in charge, i need you but you suck attitude from Laren or whatever her name was. It really got to the point of making no sense as far as her attitude and character.
Well, there are finally some confirmation that Stargate will be coming back, although it is still up for debate if they pick up where they left off, but the rumor I heard seems to confirm at least an ending for SGU, but I bring that up because I would like to see the Travelers again. I hate that bit about the ship, it seemed like a throwaway line, maybe the writers way of making sure that only the SGA team and the Wrath had all the most powerful hardware, but I liked them, and would like to see them come back. I think they were properly utilized, but I would still like to explore them more. One thing I think you missed (but I would have to rewatch these episodes) I think they tend to be a matriarchal style of government as their leaders are almost always female, and I think its mentioned. Would be interesting to see where this would go.
@Jame M I might have to rewatch the episodes too. I don’t think they ever said anything about that. I always took the two captains we saw as being women as just a coincidence.
Well hiding from the Wraiths might be done in small groups through the Stargate as Ronin did though he was basically hunted as in on a long leash for entertainment, or underground as with the Genine. Now, if they could hide away from world's with Stargate, the chances of hiding from the Wraiths would be much greater. We do know that at least one civilization reached the space technology of our 1960's as they built a base in a small moon and retrofitted wraith technology to store a large amount of people to hide in that moon. Well, what would've been possible with 1960's or even 1950's technology and that would be the Project Orion external atomic pulse spaceship which theoretically could be scaled up to launch an entire city as a generation ship though a ground launch would involve detonating about a thousand small nuclear bombs. Such a level of technology could be enough for a civilization to effectively hide from the Wraith and then slowly salvage and retrofit other technologies such as FTL technologies. They may even had been able to develop their own FTL as we know from Stargate Universe that even the ancients once used a more primitive and presumably more easily developed FTL drive and the ancients themselves used two different versions of FTL drive and perhaps it is developing their own FTL that the Travelers did as their spaceships do not seem to be based on the Ancients, the splinter groups from the Asgards or the biological technology of the Wraith and one would assume that the technology most plentiful to be salvaged from wrecks would've been the biological tech of the wraiths and the most likely to be obtained through trade would've been through the Ancients. However, the Ancients probably knew of other FTL tech such as from the Furlongs which is often believed to be the source of Gou'ald FTL tech so the Ancients could simply have traded more primitive FTL technology instead of their own and perhaps even added measures to obfuscate the technology to make it difficult for the Travellers to understand and make their own. However, the question is why did they loose the ability to produce their own spaceships. I would suspect that it would be because most of their civilization and hence infrastructure were on those Project Orion generation ships which were likely the O'Neill Cylinder candlestick design shown in the National Geographic docudrama "Evacuate Earth" which again only requires 1950, to 1960 technology but as slower than light generation ships, if they were found, they could be easily destroyed or subjugated by the Wraith. So perhaps despite being easier to hide from the Wraith then ground based colonies and something they would already have to be able to build just to build their first Super Orion generation ship, their manufacturing base and most of their population was destroyed on these classical sunlight generation ships leaving ships only designed for temporary travel and a lack of personnel with the skills and knowledge to re-establish the ability to manufacture new ships. The Traveler's ships all seem to be fairly consistent which would not be the case with purely salvaged technology at least not until a manufacturing base was established so it's likely they once had at least one base with a large enough population to manufacture the ships they have and somehow those bases or access to those bases was lost. Keep in mind that a Super Orion generation ship or even the original 300 man Orion spaceship could've been that manufacturing base so it may simply have been that after having built a number of FTL ships, they lost that one original sublight generation ship before having built and hidden multiple O'Neill cylinders for an expanding population. Note that this also means, there may still be isolated city sized groups of the Travellers out in interstellar space gathering resources from asteroids, comets and rogue planets and even some in unpopulated star systems again harvesting materials from asteroids, comets and moons or even from territorial planets whether habitable or not if they had managed to build additional "O'Neill Cylinders". Also not all of these isolated O'Neill cylinders would have FTL technologies and even just hiding from stargates and populated world's might just be an ancient myth to them.
I kinda want to know if they were having to deal with the chaos created by Janus and his "borg" esk drones in the comics. Cuz I mean, they scrambled the stargates so every gate dial was random and we get Janus' being talked down by Weir so that he finds out that the Lantians could just "speak" to the dhd's and gates and get them to dial specific places or run various programs. And that the hub station inbetween 5 galaxies has the ability to hard reset all corlative updates in all 5 galaxies. I'm sorta hoping that we see that and the moon base full of zpm's in future series.
@@sg-24 the comics set up the "Borg" from the episode with the reality hopping ship as creations of Janus' designed to end the wraith. But then they got canceled before they could finish the season out.
The Travelers had potential but they had to be limited to work. Think about it. Space is big and there many planets and the Travellers had time. They could have looked for a planet without a gate and the Wraith dont go to and they could have live there for generation. The writers needed to introduce them and how they had conflict with Atlantis.
@sg-24 yea, but they developed high-level tech rivaling the vanair including space travel, shields, weapons, etc, all while hiding said tech from highly advanced races such as the vanair, lanterns, wraith and replicators(most of whom were actively looking for tech) within a short time by themselves.
@Kari Vi Britannia that is a good point. In the case of the Vanir we could say they are not as advanced as Asgard tech, but for the rest so don’t really have a good explanation.
The Ancients should 100% have used the Aterro device. Atlantis is the central gate in the network. They should've disabled the stargate network and turned the device back on and left it on.
@@sg-24 Even if they had to permanently disable every gate in the network they should've done it long enough to wipe out the wraith. Then they could've come back afterwords and replaced all the broken gates .
In a space faring civilization a decentralized government structure is really the only alternative that would work. You either need to be massively overwhelming to the extent you exert full control on everyone or every ship will be like its own state all operating under a unified country. I'm pretty sure if the hillbillies in florida want to go to war with mexico I don't need to get roped into it up here in new york.
With space being so vast I wonder why they didn't resettle on a world without a Stargate. The wraith probably wouldn't ever find them and it would give them a chance to rebuild
@@richardarriaga6271 Yea but the odds are basically impossible. The Goauld are expansionist but the wraith aren't. As long as the wraith aren't starving they don't really explore. The odds of the planet being found is similar to one of their ships being found. Also if the rebuilt they could have been more advanced
@@sg-24 Yes I get that but you would think a species capable of space travel would know the odds are they won't ever be found. I get the nomads in space trope is cool but it's so unlikely unless most worlds are dead which we know they aren't. The Asgard tribe is a more realistic situation. Hid from the wraith and were not found. Sadly their inability to reproduce meant they could never challenge the wraith
@@sg-24 If it's millions that makes sense. I thought it was in the thousands given they were a ship-based culture. Still, Stargate with the ships set on auto and following. Beats getting drained by the Wraith. Maybe paid for by a technology exchange if somebody gets snooty about the costs?
Well I assume millions, could be thousands, we just don’t know. A tech exchange could work, maybe upgrade a few of them and have them transport people across the void. Or just use the stargates to do it.
I think they made too little of it, why didn't they land their fleet on the planet Atlantis is on and have all the ships undergo maintenance. And built a shipyard where new ships are built, they do not understand their own technology and would have needed the help of the Terrans.
@@sg-24 Atlantis has extremely large sensor range and sees every Wraths ship that even approaches the solar system, and the population that was rescued from the natives was also brought to the planet and lived on a continent and there you also said nothing that they have to hide. When the Wraths see the people on the planet, they eat the whole population because they are all hungry.
@zainzyklon8661 true, but when a Wraith ship came coming Atlantis could cloak. If it has all these ships and shipyards hanging around it might be harder for them to hide. As for the natives, yeah that’s actually a good point. Even if the population was small the Wraith are so hungry they would probably eat them.
@AnonIllaumi okay so it’s been about 5 months since I made this video. I haven’t watch it since then. Had to do a quick rewatch. So the reason I said theory was because that’s kind of what it is. We don’t really know what the Travelers backstory or where their tech comes from. Again 5 months since I made/ did read her in this video, but they never go into detail about their history beyond the basic “we have spaceships and fled from the Wraith”. Where do the ships come from? I don’t know. I was trying to connect two points I saw in Atlantis that I thought worked well together. And even if I think it true, I say theory b/c it’s not 100% confirmed, and later writers can always change it. Like I said there was the theory from the book, and I saw an interesting one saying that the Travelers were once part of the Genii civilization (since the Genii themselves said they were once an interstellar civilization). Granted the latter idea does still work with what Weir said, but yeah. I don’t like saying 100% confirmed lore unless I am sure it is and won’t be changed later because it was left vague.
@@sg-24 well considering that even with the US being the aggressors both times, Canada has maintained a alliance with the US and has been only one of the biggest and best Allies to the US, there is no real reason to do so. However if the US did hopefully they won't make the same mistake again by only invading via land. A multi front attack works much better on a heavily entrench enemy, especially if you can split their attention.
@@entgan Yeah they used to be an ally....now they are part of the corrupt agenda of destroying the world. Canadian people are fine...their government just like ours and lots of other around the world are so corrupt and selfish it is appalling. It is the people vs the elites now. It is good vs evil. And it will be up to the citizens of these great countries to fix their country because no one else will apparently.
I like the Travelers. It makes sense that a group would free to space to avoid the Wraith.
Kinda like the Firefly with Capt. Mal.
No matter how long the arm of control gets...we just get a little further out of reach.
It also suggests that Pegasus Humanity was highly advanced under the Ancients before the Wraith started reverting their planets back to mediaeval levels of technology. The Travellers were simply able to avoid detection, much like the ragtag fleet from Battlestar Galactica.
@@tompearce5418 Although it suggests this, they might also have traded some stuff with other advanced civilizations. They might even buy stuff from advanced civilizations, (Sateda + 200 years?) that get killed by the wraith later and just their tech survives on the travelers ships. The travelers also might have started off with lantian ships with a Lot of "unnecessary" stuff thats tradable to advanced civs. Maybe even Something as simple as navigation Data and what places to avoid might be worth so much for a hiding spacefaring civilization
@@KosMir16 like the Vanir
@@tompearce5418 yes
They are a pretty cool idea in concept. I would definitely hope to see them again if we ever followed up with stories in this galaxy.
The first time I heard about the Travelers I was already aware of things like orbital infrastructure and asteroid mining so I was always curious why they didn't find asteroids with resources that they needed and build a hyperspace capable mining station on them, as in the station can take the asteroid along with itself into hyperspace. But I guess that hinders the story the show runners wanted to tell.
I hope that a portion of the Travelers managed to figure something like what I mentioned above out and begin to build a self sustaining society totally in space, because I think that is awesome!
The Attero device was such a cool concept. To the point that it's difficult to understand why the atlanteans didn't win the war. Oh hey, we're going to turn the device on at these set times. Don't use a gate or hyperdrive until we turn it off again. Easier to clean up radiation damage from an exploded gate than it is to fight the Wraith in open combat.
There might have been other side effects for the device, especially for long periods of time.
Exactly they could have just turned off the stargate system fly around picking off wraith ships then turned it back on afterwards
I'm surprised we didn't see the more often after their introduction. Those guns would have been very useful and there were probably more Atlantean ships they could have fixed up after a little gene therapy. It also seemed like the show runners were shipping that captain and Shepherd.
They would also be a marketing opportunity for Earth to sell a few ships, perhaps the earlier versions of Prometheus or the various Gou'ald models which seem to be able to be manufactured by a mostly medieval society, or even just the old 1950's sublight Project Orion spaceships whose construction could be hidden amongst the production of nuclear submarines with segments shipped through the Stargate to an uninhabited world for assembly and an environment devastating ground launch.
I would have proposed a 3 way trade deal; the Travellers give the Tau'ri energy rifles similar to the partical magnum and the Tau'ri would buy ships from the Hebridians and tow them to pegasus then let the Travellers refit them as they saw fit. They could buy anything from a large cruise liner to a compact Gunship and the Travellers would have been able to use it.
@rob Kemp Stonks 📈
@@sg-24 i just love the idea of a Hebridian Fhloston Paradise rocking up to a battle with huge guns welded to the bottom 🤣🤣🤣
You could cut out the hebridians and just tow the traveller ships to the relative safety of the milkway. (Post Ori of course)
@@samarat1 But then they wouldn't be around to help fight the Wraith. Plus Earth would have to ship the purchased guns back to Pegasus.
@@MrDj232 we don't have that much evidence that they are fighting the wraith. the only time we see them fighting the wraith is by accident.
And we could use those guns in the milkway too. No need to ship them back.
as a story element, i like the travelers. the space and resource scarcity is what makes series like battlestar galactica great. it adds interesting story elements that the cast need to work with, and it usually creates societies that would not be normal for civilisations that live on planets.
Currently I chose ship. Partially because of the exploration element that comes with it.
I want one of their guns. I heard Jason Momoa kept his after the show.
@Jon Walker see now I just want to see aqua man with one.
@@sg-24 "I prefer this." *boom*
@@knghtbrd I love how even T’elc is fan boying over it after shooting a wraith.
“I very much want a weapon such as this”
Ronin: “get in line”
Just like the Genii, I would have liked to see more of the Travelers.
Oh haha, I bookmarked this when I saw the notification only to realize I was rewatching the original episode from Stargate Atlantis today. Great job as always!
Love the Travellers, they were a great idea to do.
Holy crap that traveler lady is gorgeous WOW please Wraith don't kill her LOL🤣🤣🤣
No seriously don't kill anyone no matter how they look period.
Also Mass Effect is an awesome trilogy of games these travelers do have much in common with Tali's race.
Other than that a great video keep up the great work👍
And greetings from the Netherlands🇳🇱
Their government actually made sense to me because, unlike land-bound organizations, they can just take all their stuff and leave at any time. I was surprised that the Travelers didn't team up with the Atlantis group more. It would have offered them a home base to safely repair their ships and operate from and they could have searched for technology together. Liberal use of the Atlantean Gene Therapy would have helped them be able to scavenge more Atlantean ships. Maybe they could have even started to build their own Atlantean ships somewhere. Something that never came up in the show I noticed.
"Cuz they might have said no" is the such a stupid excuse, I don't know who thought of it, but its in all kinds of media and stories and it drives me crazy every time I hear it. Just ask first, and IF they say no; well THEN kidnap them and force them to help fix the ship under threat of being thrown out the airlock. Win, win :D
@David Szaks I do agree that it is stupid. But I did like when she said it, as there was a pause between them. Like she knew it was wrong, but they were so desperate they couldn’t risk it. And Shepard has this look like he gets why, he still doesn’t like it, but he gets it.
Usually it's meant to show desperation and remorse. The people causing problems know they're in the wrong, but they're so used to things going badly that they assume the worst and take drastic measures before trying anything else. Although it's typically used in first contact situations where neither side knows anything about the other so this trope usually comes across as the antagonists shooting themselves in the foot by making contact through kidnapping and/or theft.
@@sg-24 My problem isn't that it's wrong in the moral sense. But wrong in the logical sense. There is literally no risk to asking first. IF they say do in fact say no, then you can switch to your original kidnapping or other equally morally suspect scheme without sacrificing anything on your end.
@David Szaks well here’s the way I look at it. Yes logically there is no issue in asking for help, but humans are not logical creatures. Sometimes we do things based on emotions like fear or envy.
If they went to Atlantis (in their mind) Atlantis could have said no, or only agreed to help them for a be try high fee. And the thing is there is very much how most of human history goes. I’ve read it was common in the past during first contacts to kidnap people and force them to learn their language to have that communication.
And with their fleet in constant jeopardy of being attacked by the Wraith you don’t take risk like that.
Jill Wagner = Just Wonderful
governing council is probably more a coordination board
The Travelers are most likely survivors from the last Culling. The wraith hibernate for centuries. When the expedition awoke the queen she saw their tech and figured one of the planets had risen up the technology tree to the point that they could explore other planets as well as having billions of population. I imagine the Travelers where like the Tolland at one point when they encountered the wraith and caused them to awaken just like the expedition did.
Remember odds are the only reason the expedition keeps finding wraith all over is because they woke them from hibernation which activated all their ships. With a major food shortage the wraith or very aggressively searching for anyone they can find to feed on. Where as if this had not happen odds are the galaxy would have been more like it was in SG1 at the start with few encounters involving the galaxy baddie. Heck they might have even meet the Genii on better terms and been able to help them carry out their plan to deal a major blow to the wraith while they still slept.
Unlike the ghoul, the wraith don't care if humans advance because they beat the ancients. They only care if the population grows and technology often allows the support of much larger populations. Some of the wraith knew this and openly accepted it as that one episode where they find a civilization that is sacrificing their people to the wraith as tribute so they can be left alone.
@PyroMancer2k I like your points, and I think it’s a good idea. The only thing is the Wraith do care about technology of other races. Like with the Vanir they attacked them because they don’t tolerate other advanced groups. And we saw this with Ronan’s people, and they only reach the post WW2 era of tech.
I do think you are right that some Wraith groups would be more okay with how advanced certain groups get, but they still wouldn’t let them reach the space age.
@@sg-24 I meant more that they don't care enough to actively watch other races. It's likely some remote group of humans advanced enough to the point that they could travel the stars. Perhaps they didn't have a gate on their world so the Wraith didn't notice their advancement.
Also with Ronan's people I think it was once again a case of the harvest being ready. Where like SG1 alerted the ghoul to their presence with the stargate I suspect something similar happen to Ronan's people since their world had a gate and Ronan knew how to use one. After all a WW2 era tech civilization likely has hundreds of millions of people ready to be culled. The wraith aren't exactly patient as they wouldn't just think to wait a few years until those numbers become billions.
Also at WW2 level there is a real chance the cattle might wipe themselves out with nuclear weapons. Sure they could become a larger threat to the wraith if left unchecked but the fact that Ronan's people even got to that point shows the wraith are not actively monitoring every world to keep them under foot.
Basically I think the Travelers where like Ronan's people only they went unnoticed for a lot longer and thus got to the space age. I mean look how fast our civilization has advanced in 200 years. Who knows what more advancements might be made in the next 200 years.
One thing SG and many other Sci-Fi franchises fail at is representing proper scaling. If you look at our population at the start of the industrial revolution and how it increased leading up to WW2 it's a huge increase but even then it was already in the millions which would be a tempting target to the wraith so why allow it to further advanced past industrial age? I mean they start out the series with Wraith raiding a small hunting village with probably less than 100 people in it.
In order for a civilization to rise you need tons of interdependent systems. Much of our modern civilization wouldn't be possible without global trade because modern tech uses so many different materials that are mined from all over the world as there is no place that has everything in one easy to access location.
What this means though is you need a LOT of people harvesting materials from all over and bringing them together to make these item. Thus civilizations like Ronan's people, the Genii, the Travelers, and etc would have needed to grow massive populations to reach their point. Which means they were not constantly harassed like tribe at the start.
Also each Wraith has their own hunting grounds so some might be more proactive at culling than others.
I would love to see more of the Travelers
The Travellers are interesting enough from what I remember the writers wanted to introduce more factions in SGA that could be wild cards. The Genni couldmt be because they were to primitive tevhnologically.
I wrote a fanfic years ago about the Genii capturing a Traveler ship. Having these two groups face off against one another seemed like a good match.
@Michael Kotcher it does suck we never saw these two groups interact since it seems like they would have a natural alliance. The Travelers have advance tech the Genii want, and the Genii have a way to keep their people safe from the Wrath and could extend it to the Travelers.
Katana Labrea (the captain from the Lost Tribe) is the unlucky officer who’s ship is taken. She lands her ship on a planet to trade for things they can repair the ship, and informants get word back to the Genii, who send a strike force through the gate using jeeps (they should have such tech, they can build nukes, why not?) and get their troops to the ship before the Travelers on the ground can respond. Before they realize what’s happening, Genii soldiers are onboard, and quickly overwhelm the crew and families aboard. Hostages are taken and an ho later, another full company of men are on the ground securing the ship and the gate, escape is now impossible. Science teams move in to study the vessel and reverse engineer it, as well as learn to operate it.
@@sg-24 I always felt that both sides had distinct advantages over each other. If the Travelers stay in space, the Genii can’t touch them. But the size of the Genii military means that if the Travelers land on a planet the Genii can access, they will easily overwhelm Traveler security forces.
The travellers where likely a native people group entirely isolated from the ancients. I have a feeling a large portion of their population attempted to leave the galaxy and those whom remained remained on the run without end. They might very well have set up homes on planets however the wraith where always on the hunt.
The Travelers are easily one of my favorite parts of SGA, probably because I'm jealous of them lol. I'm a wanderer myself, traveling wherever and whenever I can. I'm not the "put down roots" type. I'm a nomad lol.
Ew, I can smell your Roma through the screen
I feel like stargate atlantis shot them selfs in the foot by making the wraith to strong of an enemy. I liked finding other advanced life in the milkway because of goa'uld incompetence.
@Matthew Evans that’s fair. The advanced ones are always more fun to talk about.
Honestly I'm surprised the Travelers have any kind of government at all outside their individual ships.
The sexiest yet most painful episode in all of SGA.
it almost got ridiculous with the whole no trust, im in charge, i need you but you suck attitude from Laren or whatever her name was.
It really got to the point of making no sense as far as her attitude and character.
Well, there are finally some confirmation that Stargate will be coming back, although it is still up for debate if they pick up where they left off, but the rumor I heard seems to confirm at least an ending for SGU, but I bring that up because I would like to see the Travelers again. I hate that bit about the ship, it seemed like a throwaway line, maybe the writers way of making sure that only the SGA team and the Wrath had all the most powerful hardware, but I liked them, and would like to see them come back. I think they were properly utilized, but I would still like to explore them more. One thing I think you missed (but I would have to rewatch these episodes) I think they tend to be a matriarchal style of government as their leaders are almost always female, and I think its mentioned. Would be interesting to see where this would go.
@Jame M I might have to rewatch the episodes too. I don’t think they ever said anything about that. I always took the two captains we saw as being women as just a coincidence.
I would have loved for Shepherd to get together with Larin
Great video!
@Stargate Untangled thank you.
The Travelers are somewhat similar(space nomads) to the Quarian species from Mass Effect
This idea comes from "the pack" (Relativity).
Well hiding from the Wraiths might be done in small groups through the Stargate as Ronin did though he was basically hunted as in on a long leash for entertainment, or underground as with the Genine. Now, if they could hide away from world's with Stargate, the chances of hiding from the Wraiths would be much greater. We do know that at least one civilization reached the space technology of our 1960's as they built a base in a small moon and retrofitted wraith technology to store a large amount of people to hide in that moon. Well, what would've been possible with 1960's or even 1950's technology and that would be the Project Orion external atomic pulse spaceship which theoretically could be scaled up to launch an entire city as a generation ship though a ground launch would involve detonating about a thousand small nuclear bombs. Such a level of technology could be enough for a civilization to effectively hide from the Wraith and then slowly salvage and retrofit other technologies such as FTL technologies. They may even had been able to develop their own FTL as we know from Stargate Universe that even the ancients once used a more primitive and presumably more easily developed FTL drive and the ancients themselves used two different versions of FTL drive and perhaps it is developing their own FTL that the Travelers did as their spaceships do not seem to be based on the Ancients, the splinter groups from the Asgards or the biological technology of the Wraith and one would assume that the technology most plentiful to be salvaged from wrecks would've been the biological tech of the wraiths and the most likely to be obtained through trade would've been through the Ancients. However, the Ancients probably knew of other FTL tech such as from the Furlongs which is often believed to be the source of Gou'ald FTL tech so the Ancients could simply have traded more primitive FTL technology instead of their own and perhaps even added measures to obfuscate the technology to make it difficult for the Travellers to understand and make their own.
However, the question is why did they loose the ability to produce their own spaceships. I would suspect that it would be because most of their civilization and hence infrastructure were on those Project Orion generation ships which were likely the O'Neill Cylinder candlestick design shown in the National Geographic docudrama "Evacuate Earth" which again only requires 1950, to 1960 technology but as slower than light generation ships, if they were found, they could be easily destroyed or subjugated by the Wraith. So perhaps despite being easier to hide from the Wraith then ground based colonies and something they would already have to be able to build just to build their first Super Orion generation ship, their manufacturing base and most of their population was destroyed on these classical sunlight generation ships leaving ships only designed for temporary travel and a lack of personnel with the skills and knowledge to re-establish the ability to manufacture new ships.
The Traveler's ships all seem to be fairly consistent which would not be the case with purely salvaged technology at least not until a manufacturing base was established so it's likely they once had at least one base with a large enough population to manufacture the ships they have and somehow those bases or access to those bases was lost. Keep in mind that a Super Orion generation ship or even the original 300 man Orion spaceship could've been that manufacturing base so it may simply have been that after having built a number of FTL ships, they lost that one original sublight generation ship before having built and hidden multiple O'Neill cylinders for an expanding population.
Note that this also means, there may still be isolated city sized groups of the Travellers out in interstellar space gathering resources from asteroids, comets and rogue planets and even some in unpopulated star systems again harvesting materials from asteroids, comets and moons or even from territorial planets whether habitable or not if they had managed to build additional "O'Neill Cylinders". Also not all of these isolated O'Neill cylinders would have FTL technologies and even just hiding from stargates and populated world's might just be an ancient myth to them.
The travellers seem to have a lot in common with the quarians of mass effect
That they do. Kind of wish we got to see more of them.
I kinda want to know if they were having to deal with the chaos created by Janus and his "borg" esk drones in the comics. Cuz I mean, they scrambled the stargates so every gate dial was random and we get Janus' being talked down by Weir so that he finds out that the Lantians could just "speak" to the dhd's and gates and get them to dial specific places or run various programs. And that the hub station inbetween 5 galaxies has the ability to hard reset all corlative updates in all 5 galaxies. I'm sorta hoping that we see that and the moon base full of zpm's in future series.
@Bale Notsalony I admittedly have read a lot of the comics and know only basic details, but that sounds awesome!
@@sg-24 the comics set up the "Borg" from the episode with the reality hopping ship as creations of Janus' designed to end the wraith. But then they got canceled before they could finish the season out.
The Travelers had potential but they had to be limited to work.
Think about it. Space is big and there many planets and the Travellers had time.
They could have looked for a planet without a gate and the Wraith dont go to and they could have live there for generation.
The writers needed to introduce them and how they had conflict with Atlantis.
I liked them. I think Ronin's gun comes from them.
They sound like a hobo version of the Quarian Migrant Fleet
I mean… kind of yeah.
The travelers gaining that level of technology in a short period seems off
@Kari Vi Britannia well they could have been in hiding for some time if the first theory is true.
@sg-24 yea, but they developed high-level tech rivaling the vanair including space travel, shields, weapons, etc, all while hiding said tech from highly advanced races such as the vanair, lanterns, wraith and replicators(most of whom were actively looking for tech) within a short time by themselves.
@Kari Vi Britannia that is a good point. In the case of the Vanir we could say they are not as advanced as Asgard tech, but for the rest so don’t really have a good explanation.
"FINALLY declared war on Canada." LMAO!
The Ancients should 100% have used the Aterro device. Atlantis is the central gate in the network. They should've disabled the stargate network and turned the device back on and left it on.
@Colton Albright but then how could they use the gates. Clearly keeping those on was the most important thing. 😉
@@sg-24 Even if they had to permanently disable every gate in the network they should've done it long enough to wipe out the wraith. Then they could've come back afterwords and replaced all the broken gates .
In a space faring civilization a decentralized government structure is really the only alternative that would work. You either need to be massively overwhelming to the extent you exert full control on everyone or every ship will be like its own state all operating under a unified country.
I'm pretty sure if the hillbillies in florida want to go to war with mexico I don't need to get roped into it up here in new york.
you should do a product placement episode
Kind of requires a sponsor, and sadly I’m not there yet.
@sg-24 no I mean in stargate, like when the lifted those products in one of the first clips you played
I know they did it a few times with beers in sg
Oh I see. Yeah that would be a cool idea I’ll have to look into.
100 generations is a long time, perhaps the tech was devolved to better hide. Like what's the diesel equivalent to a plasma core reactor?
@eik0072 I’m not sure in the SG universe
With space being so vast I wonder why they didn't resettle on a world without a Stargate. The wraith probably wouldn't ever find them and it would give them a chance to rebuild
@Eric Andes I suppose they didn’t want to take the chance. That the best answer I can think of
The Wraith still have ships. They could have been found that way. The G'ould invaded worlds with no Stargate.
@@richardarriaga6271 Yea but the odds are basically impossible. The Goauld are expansionist but the wraith aren't. As long as the wraith aren't starving they don't really explore. The odds of the planet being found is similar to one of their ships being found. Also if the rebuilt they could have been more advanced
@@sg-24 Yes I get that but you would think a species capable of space travel would know the odds are they won't ever be found. I get the nomads in space trope is cool but it's so unlikely unless most worlds are dead which we know they aren't. The Asgard tribe is a more realistic situation. Hid from the wraith and were not found. Sadly their inability to reproduce meant they could never challenge the wraith
In a society of ships the central government between them CAN'T have all that much power. People will do as much as they want to.
Destiny era technology
Why don't they cut a deal to move to the Milky Way galaxy? Post Guould there should be some descent real estate. And es, cool idea / group.
I assume getting them across the void would be hard. We don’t really know their population, but I’m guessing at least in the millions.
@@sg-24 If it's millions that makes sense. I thought it was in the thousands given they were a ship-based culture. Still, Stargate with the ships set on auto and following. Beats getting drained by the Wraith. Maybe paid for by a technology exchange if somebody gets snooty about the costs?
Well I assume millions, could be thousands, we just don’t know.
A tech exchange could work, maybe upgrade a few of them and have them transport people across the void. Or just use the stargates to do it.
Why do you think the Asgard never helped Earth make a ZPM or two?
My best guess is that they didn’t know how to make them. I don’t recall seeing the Asgard use them.
I think they at least could have helped convert from ZPMs to a new power source. Probably the biggest problem and they couldn't do it. Or didn't.
Ford was later rescued and brought back to his grand parents right?
@Matorox 003 sorry spoilers 😉
I think they made too little of it, why didn't they land their fleet on the planet Atlantis is on and have all the ships undergo maintenance. And built a shipyard where new ships are built, they do not understand their own technology and would have needed the help of the Terrans.
I assume that would have made Atlantis harder to hide.
@@sg-24 Atlantis has extremely large sensor range and sees every Wraths ship that even approaches the solar system, and the population that was rescued from the natives was also brought to the planet and lived on a continent and there you also said nothing that they have to hide. When the Wraths see the people on the planet, they eat the whole population because they are all hungry.
@zainzyklon8661 true, but when a Wraith ship came coming Atlantis could cloak. If it has all these ships and shipyards hanging around it might be harder for them to hide.
As for the natives, yeah that’s actually a good point. Even if the population was small the Wraith are so hungry they would probably eat them.
HOW IS THIS A THEORY ITS EXPLAINED IN THE SHOW!!!
@AnonIllumi I mean this video isn't really a theory video, at least I don't think it is.
@@sg-24 YOU LITERALLY SAID ITS A THEORY IN THE VIDEO
@AnonIllaumi okay so it’s been about 5 months since I made this video. I haven’t watch it since then. Had to do a quick rewatch.
So the reason I said theory was because that’s kind of what it is. We don’t really know what the Travelers backstory or where their tech comes from. Again 5 months since I made/ did read her in this video, but they never go into detail about their history beyond the basic “we have spaceships and fled from the Wraith”. Where do the ships come from? I don’t know.
I was trying to connect two points I saw in Atlantis that I thought worked well together. And even if I think it true, I say theory b/c it’s not 100% confirmed, and later writers can always change it. Like I said there was the theory from the book, and I saw an interesting one saying that the Travelers were once part of the Genii civilization (since the Genii themselves said they were once an interstellar civilization). Granted the latter idea does still work with what Weir said, but yeah. I don’t like saying 100% confirmed lore unless I am sure it is and won’t be changed later because it was left vague.
The US attacked Canada twice. 1775 and I in the war of 1812.
@entgan so 3rd times the charm.
@@sg-24 well considering that even with the US being the aggressors both times, Canada has maintained a alliance with the US and has been only one of the biggest and best Allies to the US, there is no real reason to do so. However if the US did hopefully they won't make the same mistake again by only invading via land. A multi front attack works much better on a heavily entrench enemy, especially if you can split their attention.
@@entgan Yeah they used to be an ally....now they are part of the corrupt agenda of destroying the world.
Canadian people are fine...their government just like ours and lots of other around the world are so corrupt and selfish it is appalling.
It is the people vs the elites now.
It is good vs evil.
And it will be up to the citizens of these great countries to fix their country because no one else will apparently.