I've started replying: "I'm not diagnosing anybody, only speculating about what could be happening in a situation like this" any time someone asks me how my day's going, think I need to lay off your channel for a while...
I go through my days now just listing off people's openness to experience, conscientiousness, extroversion, agreeableness, and neuroticism. It's like automatic now.
I was raised in a tiger family and that messed me up huge. Funny how many Asian immigrant parents get their kids to engage in sports and music. Mine was swimming and violin. My gripe is how many parents are so disengaged with their kids. My parents have no desire to know what I like, my interests, or even my opinions. It’s either I’m a doctor, lawyer, or a failure. I’m still battling demons to this day in my mid-life years. I was diagnosed with depression and ADHD a few years ago and thank God that I have access to therapy. I fudged my way through school and at one point was deemed “illiterate”. I was caged up and my grades started turning around but the lies and deception from both myself and my parents, and the constant fear of being rejected took a toll on me and one night I did snap and murder was in my heart. The raw rage is scary. I’m still trying to forgive my parents. It’s hard for someone to understand the pain of being rejected. Here’s one point I’d like to add to your video (nice video btw): The parents failed because they couldn’t accept failure. Jennifer failed because she couldn’t accept being seen as a failure. Daniel didn’t want to be seen as a failure in Jennifer’s eyes. So, how we view failure is probably going to be an important factor in determining one’s psychological stability (in my layman understanding of psychology). Anyways, my 2 cents. Thanks for the vid.
I went to school with a lot of Asian kids. A lot of the ones with tiger parents burned out in grad school or PhD. The ones who had chill parents and were allowed to fail became business owners. Tiger parenting instills fear of failure, and that is a recipe for failure or underperformance.
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Asian Kids might get bullied especially now with covid and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
Screw the Asian Tiger parents BS. Man. That's some BS racist crap. I have Asian parents. And also I had one of the worst violents childhood known to Men. I never thought of killing anyone... Hello she fuc ing killed someone.... Helloooo.... Ok. My best friend his parents are both Irish junkies, heroin Addict to be specific. I bet he wished he has Asian Tiger parents... Right???
I've known kids with parents like this. A household with lifelong stressors wherein the child is forbidden to have any life of their own outside of forced academic and sports achievement is truly a hollow thing. The damage these kids sustain underneath such regimes (we have to call it a regime) can and certainly do contribute to damaging others down the road. There is no doubt in my mind that Jennifer lost a piece of herself when she was no longer able to compete in figure skating, something she did indeed excel at. When one is raised in a house with a near total lack of empathy, it should be of little surprise that one grows up emulating such things. It is unfortunate that she ended up anchoring her feelings of freedom with her feelings for someone of unfortunate character traits such as Daniel. Her life was already out of control by the time they met and the only point she likely felt anywhere near grounded was when she was directing their relationship. Lying in near total fashion as she did has a way of eroding one's humanity. Watching her interviews with the police show a husk of what was once Jennifer, now a monster with no purpose other than to survive. Nurture is a thing, folks. This is what free agency can look like when it has no idea what nurture is. Tragedy and horror.
like they say she is naive like uh yeah her parents dont let her hv any experience other than "forced academic and sports achievement" what do u expect...
Detective who interrogated Jennifer Pan: "All they wanted was so much success out of you that they weren't even looking at you as a person." Asian Parenting 101.
I thought the detective did a great job of empathizing in order to build rapport with her. It was interestingly genuine. He understood the inner workings of her mind.
It's a rhetorical question, with answer understood to be that they cannot. Statistically speaking (I trust statistics), there are far too many people in prison who are innocent. That the police approach their work with the goal of arresting and convicting a person rather than an approach of convicting only actual guilty people leads to this kind of problem. Jury's are not well qualified enough to determine reasonable doubt or to overcome their own bias. I would love to live in a place that convicted 99.5% guilty people. That would be only 5 out of 1000 inmates innocent. The funny thing is that in a perfect situation 99.5% is unacceptable, it's attractive only because we sit closer to 50% than 99.9%.
I had a similar upbringing, and my only hope was to finish my schooling in order to get away from my parent’s wrath. I worked hard and put myself through college with the most minimal assistance from my parents and then eventually severed ties. To make the story short, I became estranged from my parents for 20+ years, and what brought us together again was a message from one of my siblings who had informed me that my father’s health was declining; come to find out, he had cancer. I decided to make peace with my parents in order for my father to pass without guilt feelings... Life should not be like this. And, through the years of estrangement, I had made peace with myself in the fact that my parents raised me the only way they knew how.
I applaud your decisions you made in life. I’m not sure I could have done the same. Somehow you developed an internal self that functioned well for you. You are the better person for sure.
Dr Grande, her parents are narcissistic too, I think. They raised her as a trophy, their extension and not a child. A very dysfunctional family. It is a tragedy more than the romance.
@@bad_egg000 all I've ever heard is that they were is that they were demanding, "tiger parents". Without any further info, it seems premature to dump a ton of blame on them? Not you in particular
@@keithmichael112 They created a monster. If it's cultural, then many Vietnamese children could have done that. Plus the influence of her bf and peers. So many factors to consider.
I'm sorry, there's no way that her parents get a free pass here. Children will forgive the most horrible treatment from a caregiver - even wishing to remain with an abusive parent when removed from their custody. They emotionally neglected her to the point that she had zero emotional attachment to them. Controlling some one to the level that her parents controlled her is dehumanizing. I can't relate to her choices but I also can't help but wonder how different all of their lives would have turned out if her parents had treated her more like a person and less like an "achievement". Connection and validation means EVERYTHING to children
I was thinking the same thing. I empathize with Jennifer to an extent. She is 100% responsible for the actions she took against her parents. However her parents are definitely to blame. The trauma of having a abusive/helicopter parent can lead people into doing things that you wouldn't think they are capable of. She surrounded herself with bad people which didn't help. It's sad that she didn't just leave to commit her own achievements instead she conspired to killing her parents.
I absolutely agree!!!! I have compared and contrasted all accounts. I live here in Toronto and my dad works where her dad worked!!! I’m scared of this story because it’s freaky to me how similar our lives are/were. Coming from the same Vietnamese background and born here in Toronto. Jen and I may have crossed paths even!! But she’s significantly older than I am and I am NOT a killer. I can’t relate to her actions that she must take responsibility for as well but I can’t help but feel for her too. It broke my heart when she pleaded “I thought you were on my side” and the investigator replied with “I am on your side” which was another outright lie. I wouldn’t be the person I am today without my parents but they’re not perfect beings themselves. Which ultimately has hindered my full life potential whether financially or otherwise. Gratefully I have managed well our imperfect family and see prospects for better; with or without the help of my parents.
@@LinhHueTran I find her story so fascinating. It's obvious that she grew to hate her parent's authority so much that she started to hate them! I've always wondered how her brother felt about their parents? It looks like he met their expectations. The parents seem like they had something to prove and wanted a trophy life at all cost, or at least the father, Han did. I've watched the 10 hour interrogation, twice! I hope your parents are not so extreme!
All true. But I doubt Jen’s parents had the slightest clue about their daughter’s emotional needs. Tragically, they probably thought they were very good parents.
This case was sad. I was trapped in a horrible home as a child and I had desperate thoughts. My parents completely destroyed my sister and now don’t even know where she lives. It’s not black and white.
@@judithwerner5301 When I left I went through a period of living in an unplumbed and uninsulated garage. There was no heat. It was thirty below. My hair care stuff would freeze in the bottle. But it was still better than going back there.
@@user-mq1fg5yw5r You aren’t wrong. It just hit me hard because I could have imagined my sister doing something like that. But she did leave. She didn’t kill anyone
I can relate having strict traditional family backgraound. Trying to live up to their expectations but never succeed. Living in someone else's dream but was more like a nightmare. Instead of giving moral support or encouragement they just talk down on us. Make me learn a skill which I never liked or was even good at. And there were time parents will compare me or siblings to other children success and they will ask "why can't you be more like him or her?" It felt like a competition with other kids too especially if it's your own family member. Parents would go back and forth bragging about who kid is better. Painfully it hurt me a lot. They weren't just strict on my academic but my lifestyle too. Such as who to be friends with, how to dress, speak, walk, sit, eat, sleep, laugh, laugh, smile, read, look, do your hair, who to date and etc. If I didn't follow them I would get beating. Somewhat like her, I would lie where I'm going or be just to have some moment with myself or friends. I occasionally try to be honest with them about where I be or do but it will either be dissaprove or anger them. Because of their strict upbringing it drove me to depression, rebelling, tiredness, bitterness, stress and suicide thought. But never to the point I wanted my parents gone. Have I have met their expectations? No. I'm just an ordinary 31 year old single adult working in normal decent job, with benefits,making sure to pay the Bill's on time and getting thru day by day. What kept me going? My nieces and nephews. I continue on with life for them because I love them too much. I don't want to be out of their life. Have I confronted them about it? I have few time. Sometime they will understand but mostly they will brush it off still expecting something. I do care about my parents and I appreciate everything they done. But whatever I do will never be enough even til this day. All I can do continue living and see what the future has in store for me. I do feel sorry for Jennifer Pan. If only her parents were more comforting and not strict her life could of been a little better. I'm not saying I'm lucky I didn't turn out like her, but I'm saying I can relate to the upbringing.
You express your feelings very well and have a clear insight about your upbringing..That can help in empowering iyourself and others to stay strong and go forward because you are aware now. Be blessed.
I'm sorry they put you through that and that it affected you so. With myself, I had parents who were extremely - even criminally, neglectful and I feel like a failure because I had a lot of potential which I couldn't live up to because I didn't have the resources to, being just a kid. So my feelings of failure are self-generated. That being said, I can't imagine having those feelings put upon my by my parents, that is totally unnecessary to burden you with that. I have to remind myself that life isn't all about the superficial "success", it's about being a decent person in whatever station one is in, and as long as I am, I have a lot to be proud of.
@@rockyevans1584 It’s a matter of prudence to presume deception from Vietnamese. They pretty have to learn the tricks of business because resources are scare. I’m not here for some zoo-level book appreciation of cultures. Cultures come with tendencies, some unsavory.
@@TehKaiser you have zoo level spelling, if your communication is so bad how can we trust your logic? Back to my point, the Vietnamese may have stricter parenting as part of their culture, that doesn't have a thing to do with other strict parents also producing very deceptive children. You just sound hateful, and possibly a bit racist. It's in line with how stupid you seem, I guess
I can "ID" with Pan to an extent. My parents were Tiger/Helicopter parents. I was allowed very little freedom outside of going to school. If I got "C" s or worse, which was often, my dad paddled me hard enough to bruise my backside and both parents used the silent treatment for weeks. As a result I was taught enough real fear and anxiety to make me vomit on the way home from school on report card day, to bite my nails to the quick, and to live in a dream world inside my head to self-comfort. It NEVER entered my mind to hurt or kill my parents in any way. Did I dream of running away? Sure. But never to hurt them. BTW, I think most homicide cops are lazy & will do anything legal and illegal to solicit a confession. The suspect could be perfectly innocent, but getting the case off the books is all that matters.
Also, I think your case really points out a flaw in Dr. Grande proposing Jennifer's actions as not preventable. It seems to me very unlikely that she would've plotted her parents murder if her parents weren't so overbearing; just as it's unlikely that you would have walked home from school sick if your parents had lightened up some. Yes, murder is a very rare response to "tiger parenting," but that doesn't mean it didn't play a central role in such negative behavior.
@Pisces Rising Intuition I wonder what his idea of a vacation is? Posting just one UA-cam video per day? Hahaha. When does he have time for clinical work?
It is destructive. You teach children to walk, you tell children the way, but you don't kick them down it. Personally, I was educated in a stricter way than others, one of my life's lessons was for instance, that, no matter what you do, you do it right. It is great to be an elite doctor etc., and you should absolutely go for it, but it is better to be a street sweeper who makes streets clean and safe than to be a doctor who cannot cure people - no matter what you do, do it properly, do it right. From that perspective, “tiger moms” are an utter failure, because they can “create” that genius once in a while, people who would not have become what they are had they grown up with neglectful parents, but most of the time, “tiger moms” will create psychological wrecks rather than mentioned geniuses. You can easily nurture talented children without this tiger-mom-psycho-bullshit. Poor Jennifer. She learned to value wealth and success over humanity. And so she killed her parents because she could not have the success, so at least she wanted to keep the wealth. The humanity of her parents was not relevant. No wonder. She never learned about its importance.
I feel that I honestly would’ve became just like Jennifer 3 years ago. I had tiger parents, got ostracized and bullied in high school, and had horrible grades in high school. I went from straight As in middle school to barely graduating high school. I faked my school reports and thought about matricide and running away all the time as a teen. The difference is that my parents mellowed out after I turned 20, accepted that I only got into community college, and didn’t force me to become a doctor or whatever. I was a shut-in weeb anyway so the curfews never affected me. I usually have to convince my lazy ass to leave the house most of the time if not for errands. Same for my little brother. He too is a shut in and a it too Minecraft obsessed(my parents are much more lax on him). Right now I’m 22, just trying to graduate college someday and move out, and hopefully assimilate back into society. I mentally blocked out my childhood and adolescence, but as I reached my 20s, I find it much easier to just forgive and forget.
Noel Normandin police speak to far more innocent people than they do criminals in the pursuit of a conviction. This is why we have “presumed innocent until proven guilty.” Out of six interviews, only one is the killer. Lie to the other five and you risk false confessions, especially with people who are emotionally or mentally unstable or who are young. It happens far too often. Also, criminals are still humans.
Suspicious Ned they are supposed to be impartial. If they become jaded and allow past conversations to influence the way they behave in current ones, they shouldn’t be cops.
Police who use the Reid method are destroying people’s faith in the honesty of law enforcement everywhere. They actually think that the ends justify the means. Governments and their departments nearly always work this way, as they can justify harming the few to help the many. They will torture an individual to justify saving a number of innocents. This is what the police think they are doing, problem is - they don’t seem to have a very good hit/miss record. Their own individual biases overtake their logic. I’d like to see the (true unedited) statistics on the validity of the confessions they get this way.
@@valerierodger7700 I agree, some can take pressure but I think her parents wasn't the type to help her through her hardships and patronizing. It doesn't matter what they seem like to us, because for Jennifer they're too much. But again, her boyfriend's influence contributed the most to her behaviour
ABC No, the father isn’t gone and the mother was apparently the kinder, less strict one. So the brother has had the worst of everything. I hope he is happy and independent by now, but at the age when he should have been thinking about moving out (like his sister should have) he will have been emotionally devastated and stuck with his father more than ever.
@@icturner23 No the brother had already moved out of the house by the time of the murder and attempted murder. The brother was already in University in another town so was not living at home
The reid technique should be banned everywhere in the world because it presumes the person in question is guilty. Its done purely as a way to get a confession by hook or by crook
Never talk to the police y’all. If you’re a timid person and they pressure you It helps to act like it’s out of your hands and is non-negotiable (eg: my lawyer/parents/etc. will be mad if I don’t contact my lawyer first. If my lawyer says it’s ok I’ll be happy to speak with you etc. Police are very good at guilting and shaming you, do not negotiate or compromise on this; lawyer first, then we’ll take it from there okthx)
KingofHearts literally. NEVER talk to the police. I repeat: NEVER TALK TO POLICE! They’ll tell you only guilty people ask for a lawyer, that’s a lie! DON’T TALK TO POLICE!
when I first heard about this case and I can't help but to see some degree of resemblance to how my sister and I grew up. My parents weren't as severe as Jennifer's parents were, but the after effects still haunts me till this day. My sister was the one with good grades and I was the one with not so good grades. She lived with pressures of high expectations and I lived with feeling of total failure. I still live my life that I don't deserve to be happy, or feel deserve to have good things because i'm a failure. It affects my professional life, i'm constantly mentally fogged up. I'm hesitant to go to therapy. I shut family and friends out often and forget to keep in touch. As for my sis, I can't speak for what her experience is like and what are the after effects from it. I'm not close with her either so i don't know, but i can only imagine it was a massive struggle. My heart goes out to anyone who went through tough abusive parenting.
I would love to hear your analysis on the Richardson family murders. Jasmine Richardson was 12 at the time of the murders and she ended the lives of both her parents and younger brother. This case took place in Canada, where offenders under the age of 18 receive a maximum sentence of 10 years. As a mental health educator, I would love to know your take. Thank you! ❤️
Julia DuMaurier this story of Jasmine Richardson in a way reminds me of that story I think was from California, where a teenager was apparently kidnapped by her dad's closest friend. The mum was murdered, her little brother and the family dog as well, and a fire set to cover up this tragedy. Then she and this man went on the run into the mountains where he was discovered and shot and killed by police officers. Did she actually plan this, just like Jasmine Richardson?
My dad was a police chief. Mom was the sargent. I learned very early to lie and manipulate. I had plans of "removing" dad but thought it through and decided I didn't like the outcomes. I was a pretty sick puppy by the time I left home. Several years of drinking, drugs and looking for love in all the wrong places I finally grew up using God as a perfect father. Years later (66) I'm happy to say we were best buddies at the end of his life. I was even his caregiver and was there when he took his last breath. Miss you dad.
Her parents created her. Tiger parenting is just an extreme form of narcissism. They couldn't do even a fraction of what they demand their kids to so they try to live through them as if it's their duty to please them, to follow the path they set out for them, and bring some shred of honor and dignity to them so they can turn around and brag to other parents. They never treated her like a human being with her own passions, wants, needs, and self-determination.
@@DrJ-hx7wv slavery also existed years ago should we go back to that? No parenting need to change just like how slavery laws did. Stop living in the past and let’s progress as a society.
@@DrJ-hx7wv where? Who? I can recall cases when older kids were more controlled - like in rich older families - or worked hard, in less rich families, but never both at the same time to that extreme. But that's what I can tell from central European history, not sure which culture you mean?
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Kid might get bullied and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
I watched the police interrogation and she didn’t have a chance. A lawyer, at least. This girl needed therapy, she snapped. Thank you for this one Dr. Grande. I am one of the people who requested it. A really objective yet compassionate assessment of this case.
@Lightning Star yep...Dr. Grande, True crime Loser, and JCS are my 3 go to's. They can all do a video on the same case and Ill get 3 different perspectives. I love it!
@The Dora Treating a child all her life like this is child abuse, the one thing almost every single murderer serial killer etc. have in common is they were abused as children. Not every abused person becomes a murderer, in this case this one did.
What broke my heart was when in the last interview the investigator asked her “Forget about what your parents wanted, what did you want to become? What did you wanted to do in the future?” - when she answered it was super SUPER INSIGHTFUL as to have access to her interior, to who she could have become.There is such a thing as to be held emotionally hostage, in this case, that’s why SHE DID NOT HAVE THE REASONING AS TO THINK “Ok I am going to move out, this situation have a viable solution”...
Without forging report cards and pretending to be studying pharmacology, she could’ve gradually recalibrated her parents expectations into something more realistic; by way of constant disappointment. You know, like the rest of us do.
First off, thank you for not blaming Jennifer's parents. This all could have been avoided with communication. I am Asian and my parents used to have really high expectations of me in high school, but towards the end of my senior year, I was able to recalibrate their expectations. I had many, many sit downs with my folks and explained many times why I am not academically gifted. Fast forward 20 years, I have a great relationship with my folks.
Dr. Grande, your organized model of presentation and steady voice eases my anxiety, despite the subject matter. Thank you for the work you put into making these videos.
@@hummingpylon I disagree with you that she was stone cold. In the afterword written by psychologist Dr. Betty Kershner in the book by Jeremy Grimaldi about Jennifer Pan, she strongly alludes to borderline personality disorder, not antisocial personality disorder. I think the only reason she didn't come right out and say it is because there is some rule governing psychologists that says it's unethical to diagnose someone they've never met. But she mentions a teddy bear if I recall correctly, and teddy bears are a transitional object that people with borderline personality disorder take with them to hospitals. It mentions teddy bears and BPD in the book by psychologist David Robinson. I might be misremembering though. But in Grimaldi's book it says "Greenberg says that the cutting, the suicide attempts...". Either way, the most common reason why someone has BPD is because of the parents. Either the parents didn't protect her from other people, or the parents abused or neglecter her themselves. Just my opinion.
@@cptfreeman8966 I love how ignorant you are, dont raise children please.. I mean you have chance to be president of the USA and why you are not?? see, everyone have "chance" to be anything but for some the chance is higher and for some, its astronomically low you could not even imagine so low decimal. I will diagnose you as a idiotic.
Well researched, as usual. I love this channel because, as a scientist myself, I understand the way scientists talk to other scientists. Peppered with caveats and subtle humor when applicable, but with the highest regard for truth without bias. Top notch work, Dr. Grande!
Very well stated; I concur completely. His research while concise is always both thorough, insightful and enlightening, I almost always wind up learning about new critical facts that are typically absent from media / other analysts' coverage. Thanks Dr Grande as always!
As someone coming from a similar family situation (except that I did end up going to college), I can understand where the coldness towards her parents, lying, and possible resentment comes from. Having "tiger parents" really damages your psyche and mental well being.
I went to school with a boy who was so terrified of his parents that when he would get an A- on a paper he would start to cry right then in the classroom.
If you want fewer bad things to happen, not being a shitty parent is a good way to start. Because this _was_ preventable. By not incredibly authoritarian parenting. Her development would have taken a different path if she had not been drilled to place her self-worth in some vacuous idea of success. She would not have been the unempathetic person she became without that, and that was a precondition for committing this act. (Mind you: I'm talking causality, not responsibility in a moral sense. It was still deeply wrong to try and kill her parents, obviously.)
@@valerierodger7700 Several Chinese immigrant children I knew committed suicide. But many immigrant parents still insist on requiring them children to fulfill their own failed dream of great success and recognition.
@@valerierodger7700 I don't know whether her brother had the same experience; but it doesn't matter to my argument. I did not claim the parenting she was subjected to was the direct or only cause for her act. In my opinion, it was a necessary condition, not a sufficient one.
It would be interesting to analyse her parents or other 'tiger parents'. Not every parent of Asian descent behaves like this. Personally I know a few European parents who have (pathologically) high expectations towards their children (friends of mine). Regards from Germany, dr Grande!
I also see parents this in parents who have high expectations on a kid who might be more smarter than the other. Evan though I'm not asian I have witnessed what happens when you don't allow your kid to make mistakes and learn from them the yelling was so brutal that it gave me shivers to this day
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Kid might get bullied and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
My mom tells me stories of her child hood my poor oma (rip) she left Germany here aren't were rich but cut her off because she was pregnant and to get away from bad times she went to us at age of 19 almost 20 and only knew 3 words of English hello,telephone, and bathroom from a TV show but gradually learned it more on she was so poor and when my opa(rip) they got separated it was tought on her mom but she was very German and up to her death didn't get any less German my mom sadly don't remember German because the school she went to was in Wisconsin where they told her you speak English not German because your in America made her cry but some stories I thought damn she had anger issues and very angry and my mom's liek you think but she calmed down when got older but she was 87 if lived another year 88 on new years but she may have been 87 she had stories to make her sound like she was 100 years old
I agree Dr Grande, the way the police use those tactics can make almost anyone confess to anything. My father used those tactics on me as a teenager. I confessed to things I never did 😢
I was a legal secretary in 1989 when I was given this piece of sage advice from LA County Judge Victor Barerra: "Always deny it and demand proof. If they have proof, keep your mouth shut and lawyer up." Cheers!
@Suspicious Ned I don't post anything for likes, I post because it is a choice to participate in a commentary in a channel I appreciate. My father was abusive and he past away long time ago and I forgave him and moved on to be a healthy decent human been because for me it is a choice to be better. I don't post anything with the intent to hurt anyones feelings.
I heard that a pot of money with a mechanism to get it after death motivates many to murder, be it for an inheritance or life insurance. Double Indemnity, anyone?
I watched a segment on TV about the children of tiger parents in an Asian country committing suicide because of the pressure put on them. Additionally, the show went into classrooms and showed kids falling asleep at their desks, even 9 -10 year old’s. It’s been studied and revealed that teenagers need a lot of sleep and we all know adequate sleep is essential for emotional and mental health for everybody. When I was in middle and high school, I frequently had to take a nap when I got home from school, even though I went to bed every night between 9:30 and 10 pm and slept until 7 a.m. So, take the fact these kids are getting about four hours of sleep a night and the pressure to succeed it’s no wonder teen suicide is increasing in that particular culture.
Dr Grande, I sense a higher hint of emotion in your voice when concluding this video . It is a horrendous case where many lives have been destroyed. Thanks once again ❤️
her behavior was bred into her by her parents. if you raise a person with a mindset and give them only one way to escape torment then they will take it.
@@lauras3002 she likely didn’t want to run away as how they viewed her as a failure would remain. She would be constantly reminded that she’s a failure as someone out there (her parents ) know that. It’s complicated with the mind. But some rather a person die than the person see them for what they are. The latter is more painful. I think it’s a mixture of this. Especially if she knew she would continue to disappoint them.
Although this is a perplexing crime with many unanswered questions your systematic, exhaustive analysis deepened my understanding of this case. As always, thank YOU for all the time and effort you put forth to educate and inform us!
I don't think Dr. Grande didn't mentioned this, but other videos I have watched on this case pointed out that walking away would equal being disowned. Of course this is no justification for her actions, but just pointing out the stakes were higher.
legally and physically she could have walked away, but a lot of young people just don't know how to, and culturally it may have seemed unthinkable to the extent it truly never occurred to her. Still no excuse.
i have no sympathy, with a lot of killers they had some kind of abuse, were raped, experienced head injuries etc. shes just a cold blooded killer 25 years is too short
@@wendyleeconnelly2939 Apparently she had been living and working on her own for years before she was caught lying about attending university. Regardless, it's hard to see how moving out could be more unthinkable than murder.
Hello, Dr. Grande! I'd be very interested to hear your opinions on the possible applications of psychedelics such as psilocybin and LSD on mental health. Given the recent, promising research, I believe this topic would be an interesting new area for your channel to cover.
@@taopaille-paille4992 those who are genetically predisposed to conditions like schizophrenia and psychosis may experience those symptoms earlier in life than if they'd never tried psychedelics, but there is no evidence whatsoever that psychedelics actually cause these disorders in users. Practice safe use and understand the risks that can take place based on your individual factors
The 'power' of abuse in all its possible forms... Abuse should be studied continuously and for a long time so we can, hopefully, one day get closer to the understanding of the human mind and its monstrosities. Thank you for the video, Dr. Grande! ❤
I realise she killed her parents which is mental, but I can't help but feel sorry for her. She shouldn't have been put in that kind of situation in my opinion.
Honestly why not kill her parents. Her parents did nothing but abuse and neglect her. Her parents were selfish and only cared about their image. That type of pressure on Jennifer since her birth would cause her to eventually snap and she might have killed herself. I'm glad the parents got attacked and only wish Jennifer got away with it. That is, if Jennifer really only snapped because of her abusive parents and not cuz she's evil herself. And it does seem like the case- she seemed like a regular decent person just under horrible circumstances, and anybody would snap when circumstances get horrible enough. Also nobody was helping her and nobody prolly would've helped her. She was trapped in that house with her parents and they made her codependent on them so she felt no way out. I only wish she got away with it. What can you do? Just keep obeying the parents for the rest of her life and allow all her willpower/hopes and dreams to die and just become a walking zombie? She would've succumbed to drugs or crime or would've lost her mind. And what would her parents have done? They would've blamed her for making them look bad and bringing shame to the family name. I absolutely stand by what Jennifer did she took the abuse for long enough i just wish she got away with it or better yet i wish she got saved from her parents somehow without murder taking place. Like some helpful relative who knew what she was going through. But you know how these type of cultures are- everyone's on the same program so they don't see anything wrong. But fuck her parents people like that are pieces of shit who hide behind the facade of being good family men/women with good jobs and carrying around briefcases and dressing properly. But they only do those things to look good to the public they never loved their kid.
I feel sorry for her. I think her parents’ rigid attitudes turned her into the person she was. She lied all the time because she was afraid to tell them the truth. Of course there’s no excuse for murder, but maybe - like an abuse victim - Jennifer felt so emotionally imprisoned by her parents that she believed she had no choice if she was ever going to be free. As for her co-conspirators, I can never understand the mentality of a person who would kill a stranger just to help somebody else out (although no doubt in this case there was a financial inducement too). Re the “Reid technique” - here in Britain police are not allowed to lie to a suspect, which I think is how it should be.
🙄 She has crappy parents...who, by the way, worked super hard to provide for their children, and that means it's just fine that she wanted them *MURDERED* for her inheritance. okeydokey then.
I'm a Chinese immigrant living in Austria and I have started lying early on about exams and grades bc I was afraid of my mum's reaction. She got the consequences of her actions and murdering someone should never be excused. However, they probably do something we don't know to drive her mad. I believe that she should be rehabilitated.
I'd have to say her parents played a part in her development. Of course other factors in her life built the perfect storm which eventually lead to murder.
I evaluate your videos according to the five factor model OCEAN. Are they Original, Charming, Educational Amusing, and Necessary. Again, according to the model you have delivered a great take on this case. Thanks again. Take care.
Interesting video, yet again. It made me remember the Jeremy Bamber case. It often surprises me that more parents don’t get murdered by their tormented children.
Wow listening to you always exposes me to new thoughts and insight. Love how your humour just slips into the dialogue and you keep such a straight face .. 🦘
@@Kitties_are_pretty JSC analyzes interrogation techniques and even mentions that body language is always a retrospective factor. What are you on about?
Parent having unrealistic high expectation on their children is putting very heavy pressure on their shoulder, it can create very damaging consequences to a child future psychological and emotional well beings.
Dr. Grande, I'm so glad you're on UA-cam! I learn something every time I watch one of your videos. I've seen the Reid Technique, for example, countless times in TV shows. I could always identify it in practice, but I never knew anything about it as a construct. Now, I can study it formally and with that knowledge, write better fiction stories. Thanks!
Amazing and clear perspectives and interpretations. You’re amazing Dr Grande. I absolutely agree with you regarding these young people’s lack of empathy and improbability of redemption.
Can't wait to hear your thoughts on this, as usual! The last few days I been watching a lot of videos about her so perfect timing for me! Hope you're having a great day you're awesome 💙💙
Knowledge Acquisition ...and indeed, what constitutes trauma? We can all agree that Jennifer had a restrictive upbringing, but from her parents’ point of view having a home and food and educational opportunities would have seemed like paradise. 🤷♀️
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Kid might get bullied and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
The discussion concerning deceptive strategies employed by police brought this case to a new level. It's so difficult to justify deception from the perspective of ethics, and I'm so grateful that Dr. Grande was courageous enough to broach that issue. Community confidence in law enforcement is crucial to promoting public safety--and bringing justice to truly guilty people. And in this case, the police were able to convict based on burner phone conversations, so deception was hardly necessary. I agree with Dr. Grande that the dangers of embarking on deception to achieve ends comes with consequences--regardless of who makes that choice.
People who haven’t experience living with obsessive parents have a hard time understanding how toxic life this kind of life is. It is very difficult to leave this sort of psychological hold that started at birth. I don’t know how much research is done on the dynamics of such households and how trapped the kids and even parents feel but I think it’s not right to say that Jennifer could have easily left her home. I also don’t think it’s unusual that meeting someone who makes you feel good leads to leaving a suffocating home and for it to lead to a bad result; it is usually a catalyst for wanting to get out of an oppressive situation, but it may unfortunately be misplaced emotions. Leaving a person for another is also usually seen in abusive relationships again because it highlights the differences in your reality vs. possibilities in other word hope for a better future where that person becomes your only way out in the mind of someone who is already troubled. Bad or obsessive parenting can result in fatal results.
It was so crazy to see her flip between mimicking her mother's tearful last few words with emotion and when she was asked to translate in English she was cold, robotic, no emotion on her face, no pitch changes in her voice. It was scary to see how she could flip her emotional act on and off like that.
Wait, seriously? You don't think Jennifer's parents could have prevented this? Strongly disagree with that one. Unless you're saying their overbearing methods are entirely genetic and they were destined to make these decisions. I think a few ounces of empathy, communication, and grace throughout her childhood would've greatly changed her course. (PS, still love your insights, but I'm a bit surprised by this)
In this day and age in my locality, asian parents are denying their kid’s their childhood and forcing them to do extra-school tuition. These kids though smart lack good character. I am not surprised at least one of them retaliated this way.
Oooooooooh... this one's a doozy. I remember her. I lived in Toronto at the time. The whole "eligible for parole after 25 years" thing is a technicality of life sentences, here in Canada. It just means that they get parole hearings after that period of ineligibility. Every couple of years, I think. For most, it's a technicality and they have a snowball's chance in hell of being let out. We also have a dangerous offender designation, for violent serial offenders who require indefinite detention because they're such a threat to the public. Paul Bernardo carries that designation.
@@debbielockhart7762 Karla Homolka is so evil Satan looks to her for advice. What pisses me off about the case of Karla Homolka is that the first victim of her and her husband Paul Bernardo is Karla's fifteen year old sister Tammy. The reason for this is that Karla wasn't a virgin when she and Paul were married. Their other two victims- Leslie Mahaffey and Kristen French- were victims of opportunity. Leslie Mahaffey was locked out of her parents house due to missing curfew as she was attending a friend's wake. Kristen French was abducted by Karla and Paul as she was cutting through a church parking lot on her way home from Holy Cross Secondary School in St. Catherine's, Ontario, Canada.
Thank you Dr. Grande for this analysis. It is astonishing that as many people are sympathizing with Pan as there are here. It's doubly horrifying to see people exoticizing the "Tiger Parent" (which probably has more to do with class than ethnicity, Asian immigrants to North America tend to be wealthier or higher status at home than other immigrant groups). Assuming her parents were actually abusive, Pan was an adult with a job and a friend to live with. She was in a much stronger position to leave than many children of *actually* abusive parents. It's infinitely better for a child of abusive parents to reclaim agency and leave rather than waiting on their parents to change. Even if the parents *say* they're cutting you off forever, your forever is longer than theirs and they know that. It's not true for all parents, but impending mortality does tend to mend parent-child relationships. I agree completely that Pan's parents could have done nothing to prevent this brutal attempted/actual murder. Also, I can't speak for Canadian cops, but yes, police are liars and legally not obligated to actually serve the public. PS: As you've pointed out in the Johnson case, most parricides are carried out by "battered children". But even a child who is truly driven to homicide would almost certainly be traumatized by carrying it out, *even if the homicide was the best possible choice*, because violence is inherently traumatizing if you are a normally empathetic person. The lack of trauma with both these offenders is pretty telling.
Thank you Dr. Grande for a great analysis as usual! Wondering if you could consider doing an analysis of Desmond is Amazing. Or perhaps an analysis of whether you believe his parents endorse any mental health criteria and/or if you think his parents are considering Desmond's best interests.
I love your longer videos! Great analysis per usual. Surprised you don’t believe “the tiger parent” side of things didn’t have an impact and maybe could’ve prevented this outcome. The deception she learned surely must’ve been brought on by fear and the anticipation of punishment by her parents if she hadn’t performed well? Of course her parents aren’t to blame for her actions but would she have learned and adopted pathological lying if it wasn’t for their standards, in which, she couldn’t meet
Thanks for the analysis, Dr. Grande. From what I've read about this case, I don't think she ever admitted to her parents that she didn't complete high school, though. When she was finally caught by them, she told them a half-truth--that she had completed college but had never started her pharmacy course.
dr grande i appreciate your analysis of the police in these subjects. a lot of ppl who discuss criminal cases rarely challenge the methods of the officers, but your asides on the ethics of lying to a suspect during a confession keeps us aware of the systems we live in. I am just glad you are willing to bring awareness to the idea that the police are never infallible pillars of justice and are human too.
Why didn't the school counselor or teacher help her pass that class, or change her curriculum so she didn't need calc. Also, that amount of money could've took the couple to the States, or somewhere far. I understand though, she was probably taught to stay around and take care of them & not live far.
She didn't need calculus. It is not required for an OSSD but she was probably was short of credits because she failed the class and did not take something to replace it.
I've started replying: "I'm not diagnosing anybody, only speculating about what could be happening in a situation like this" any time someone asks me how my day's going, think I need to lay off your channel for a while...
🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
Omg lol 😅
I find myself using the acronym OCEAN to introduce every interaction with colleagues.
I feel your pain.
I go through my days now just listing off people's openness to experience, conscientiousness, extroversion, agreeableness, and neuroticism. It's like automatic now.
I was raised in a tiger family and that messed me up huge. Funny how many Asian immigrant parents get their kids to engage in sports and music. Mine was swimming and violin. My gripe is how many parents are so disengaged with their kids. My parents have no desire to know what I like, my interests, or even my opinions. It’s either I’m a doctor, lawyer, or a failure.
I’m still battling demons to this day in my mid-life years. I was diagnosed with depression and ADHD a few years ago and thank God that I have access to therapy. I fudged my way through school and at one point was deemed “illiterate”. I was caged up and my grades started turning around but the lies and deception from both myself and my parents, and the constant fear of being rejected took a toll on me and one night I did snap and murder was in my heart. The raw rage is scary. I’m still trying to forgive my parents. It’s hard for someone to understand the pain of being rejected.
Here’s one point I’d like to add to your video (nice video btw):
The parents failed because they couldn’t accept failure.
Jennifer failed because she couldn’t accept being seen as a failure.
Daniel didn’t want to be seen as a failure in Jennifer’s eyes.
So, how we view failure is probably going to be an important factor in determining one’s psychological stability (in my layman understanding of psychology). Anyways, my 2 cents. Thanks for the vid.
Agreed.
my parents didnt give a crap about sports. im korean and they forced and hit me to play piano. lol it sucks
Nice response. Take care buddy.
I hope you're doing better now. I'm so sorry that you were/are going through all that.
Thanks for your honesty and insight. Underrated comment
I went to school with a lot of Asian kids. A lot of the ones with tiger parents burned out in grad school or PhD. The ones who had chill parents and were allowed to fail became business owners. Tiger parenting instills fear of failure, and that is a recipe for failure or underperformance.
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Asian Kids might get bullied especially now with covid and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
It's also abuse.
@@yoleeisbored This type of parenting doesn't even work in Asia. A lot people commit suicide because they can't live by society high standards.
Them tiger jerkoffs need to be put to the bloody sword!!
Screw the Asian Tiger parents BS. Man. That's some BS racist crap. I have Asian parents. And also I had one of the worst violents childhood known to Men. I never thought of killing anyone...
Hello she fuc ing killed someone.... Helloooo....
Ok. My best friend his parents are both Irish junkies, heroin Addict to be specific. I bet he wished he has Asian Tiger parents... Right???
I've known kids with parents like this. A household with lifelong stressors wherein the child is forbidden to have any life of their own outside of forced academic and sports achievement is truly a hollow thing. The damage these kids sustain underneath such regimes (we have to call it a regime) can and certainly do contribute to damaging others down the road. There is no doubt in my mind that Jennifer lost a piece of herself when she was no longer able to compete in figure skating, something she did indeed excel at. When one is raised in a house with a near total lack of empathy, it should be of little surprise that one grows up emulating such things. It is unfortunate that she ended up anchoring her feelings of freedom with her feelings for someone of unfortunate character traits such as Daniel. Her life was already out of control by the time they met and the only point she likely felt anywhere near grounded was when she was directing their relationship. Lying in near total fashion as she did has a way of eroding one's humanity. Watching her interviews with the police show a husk of what was once Jennifer, now a monster with no purpose other than to survive. Nurture is a thing, folks. This is what free agency can look like when it has no idea what nurture is. Tragedy and horror.
I totally agree.
I'm actually sorry for her. I think she deserves a second chance sooner than 2035...
like they say she is naive like uh yeah her parents dont let her hv any experience other than "forced academic and sports achievement" what do u expect...
Wise words
Feel sorry for her also. Her parents failed her a long time ago. Looking at her picture, her eyes look unnervingly hopeless and almost dead.
Detective who interrogated Jennifer Pan: "All they wanted was so much success out of you that they weren't even looking at you as a person." Asian Parenting 101.
I see someone watching TwoSetViolin
I thought the detective did a great job of empathizing in order to build rapport with her. It was interestingly genuine. He understood the inner workings of her mind.
It’s not Asian parents. My parents do the reverse 😂😂😂😂
@@TheJlee28 Your parents are the exception, NOT the rule.
@@iammar1159 reverse of putting me down, expert of child abuse 😝😝😝😝
I usually remember the big five traits by remembering Dr Grande remembering the big five traits through the acronym OCEAN.
🤣
Best comment ever
Yes, me too!🤩
I'm not diagnosing....
I forgot to remember to forget.
An analysis of 'tiger parents' like this would be interesting and useful.
Pam Protheroe Yes! That would be interesting.
Yes please!!!
Pure narcissism probably
We often heap praise on 'Asians' for their high-achieving offspring but everything has a price even if this is obviously an extreme example.
I do not think this explains anything. There is a large percentage of tiger parents and only 1 case related to a double homicide.
"I don't see how communities can trust law enforcement, if they're not obligated to be honest"
Neither do I Dr Grande, neither do I.
Nailed it.
It's a rhetorical question, with answer understood to be that they cannot. Statistically speaking (I trust statistics), there are far too many people in prison who are innocent. That the police approach their work with the goal of arresting and convicting a person rather than an approach of convicting only actual guilty people leads to this kind of problem. Jury's are not well qualified enough to determine reasonable doubt or to overcome their own bias. I would love to live in a place that convicted 99.5% guilty people. That would be only 5 out of 1000 inmates innocent. The funny thing is that in a perfect situation 99.5% is unacceptable, it's attractive only because we sit closer to 50% than 99.9%.
Suspicious Ned you are really, REALLY lost.
Everything in this comment is perfect OP thank you
Police are trying to get confessions. Literally no one thinks cops getting confessions is too high a cost
I had a similar upbringing, and my only hope was to finish my schooling in order to get away from my parent’s wrath. I worked hard and put myself through college with the most minimal assistance from my parents and then eventually severed ties. To make the story short, I became estranged from my parents for 20+ years, and what brought us together again was a message from one of my siblings who had informed me that my father’s health was declining; come to find out, he had cancer. I decided to make peace with my parents in order for my father to pass without guilt feelings... Life should not be like this. And, through the years of estrangement, I had made peace with myself in the fact that my parents raised me the only way they knew how.
I applaud your decisions you made in life. I’m not sure I could have done the same. Somehow you developed an internal self that functioned well for you. You are the better person for sure.
I’m glad you were able to turn your life around. Most kids grow up messed up and ruin their lives like Jennifer
Dr Grande, her parents are narcissistic too, I think. They raised her as a trophy, their extension and not a child. A very dysfunctional family. It is a tragedy more than the romance.
Maybe, but there's a huge cultural component. I'd want to know more
@@keithmichael112 I'm not sure about the Vietnamese culture but it can be. I'm just looking in their behavior and circumstances stated.
@@bad_egg000 all I've ever heard is that they were is that they were demanding, "tiger parents". Without any further info, it seems premature to dump a ton of blame on them? Not you in particular
@@keithmichael112 They created a monster. If it's cultural, then many Vietnamese children could have done that. Plus the influence of her bf and peers. So many factors to consider.
@@bad_egg000 Good point. If her parents were narcissists, then there's probably a ton of abuse to Jennifer that we don't know about
I'm sorry, there's no way that her parents get a free pass here. Children will forgive the most horrible treatment from a caregiver - even wishing to remain with an abusive parent when removed from their custody. They emotionally neglected her to the point that she had zero emotional attachment to them. Controlling some one to the level that her parents controlled her is dehumanizing.
I can't relate to her choices but I also can't help but wonder how different all of their lives would have turned out if her parents had treated her more like a person and less like an "achievement".
Connection and validation means EVERYTHING to children
I was thinking the same thing. I empathize with Jennifer to an extent. She is 100% responsible for the actions she took against her parents. However her parents are definitely to blame. The trauma of having a abusive/helicopter parent can lead people into doing things that you wouldn't think they are capable of. She surrounded herself with bad people which didn't help. It's sad that she didn't just leave to commit her own achievements instead she conspired to killing her parents.
I absolutely agree!!!! I have compared and contrasted all accounts. I live here in Toronto and my dad works where her dad worked!!! I’m scared of this story because it’s freaky to me how similar our lives are/were. Coming from the same Vietnamese background and born here in Toronto. Jen and I may have crossed paths even!! But she’s significantly older than I am and I am NOT a killer. I can’t relate to her actions that she must take responsibility for as well but I can’t help but feel for her too. It broke my heart when she pleaded “I thought you were on my side” and the investigator replied with “I am on your side” which was another outright lie. I wouldn’t be the person I am today without my parents but they’re not perfect beings themselves. Which ultimately has hindered my full life potential whether financially or otherwise. Gratefully I have managed well our imperfect family and see prospects for better; with or without the help of my parents.
@@LinhHueTran I find her story so fascinating. It's obvious that she grew to hate her parent's authority so much that she started to hate them! I've always wondered how her brother felt about their parents? It looks like he met their expectations. The parents seem like they had something to prove and wanted a trophy life at all cost, or at least the father, Han did. I've watched the 10 hour interrogation, twice! I hope your parents are not so extreme!
I can see why you're sorry.
All true. But I doubt Jen’s parents had the slightest clue about their daughter’s emotional needs. Tragically, they probably thought they were very good parents.
This case was sad. I was trapped in a horrible home as a child and I had desperate thoughts. My parents completely destroyed my sister and now don’t even know where she lives. It’s not black and white.
seriously. I totally feel you on that.
Exactly. No crime can be seen as black and white. That's just childish.
Absolutely agree. I was raised by an abusive mother and although I wouldn't commit murder, I was very glad to leave home and not look back.
@@judithwerner5301 When I left I went through a period of living in an unplumbed and uninsulated garage. There was no heat. It was thirty below. My hair care stuff would freeze in the bottle. But it was still better than going back there.
@@user-mq1fg5yw5r You aren’t wrong. It just hit me hard because I could have imagined my sister doing something like that. But she did leave. She didn’t kill anyone
Dr. Grande has that voice 🙌. Doesn't matter what the subject matter is, I have you talking in the background. 😁🤟
Same! He ends up distracting me from what i’m doing and i end up watching him 😂
The man could read terms and conditions and I'd still enjoy it
Me also .. I have him on when I’m doing my work and notes ., so interesting and calming at the same time!
Yes! But I love to get immersed.
He's a great storyteller plus super professional 🤟🏻
Ll0
I can relate having strict traditional family backgraound. Trying to live up to their expectations but never succeed. Living in someone else's dream but was more like a nightmare. Instead of giving moral support or encouragement they just talk down on us. Make me learn a skill which I never liked or was even good at. And there were time parents will compare me or siblings to other children success and they will ask "why can't you be more like him or her?" It felt like a competition with other kids too especially if it's your own family member. Parents would go back and forth bragging about who kid is better. Painfully it hurt me a lot. They weren't just strict on my academic but my lifestyle too. Such as who to be friends with, how to dress, speak, walk, sit, eat, sleep, laugh, laugh, smile, read, look, do your hair, who to date and etc. If I didn't follow them I would get beating. Somewhat like her, I would lie where I'm going or be just to have some moment with myself or friends. I occasionally try to be honest with them about where I be or do but it will either be dissaprove or anger them. Because of their strict upbringing it drove me to depression, rebelling, tiredness, bitterness, stress and suicide thought. But never to the point I wanted my parents gone. Have I have met their expectations? No. I'm just an ordinary 31 year old single adult working in normal decent job, with benefits,making sure to pay the Bill's on time and getting thru day by day. What kept me going? My nieces and nephews. I continue on with life for them because I love them too much. I don't want to be out of their life. Have I confronted them about it? I have few time. Sometime they will understand but mostly they will brush it off still expecting something. I do care about my parents and I appreciate everything they done. But whatever I do will never be enough even til this day. All I can do continue living and see what the future has in store for me. I do feel sorry for Jennifer Pan. If only her parents were more comforting and not strict her life could of been a little better. I'm not saying I'm lucky I didn't turn out like her, but I'm saying I can relate to the upbringing.
You express your feelings very well and have a clear insight about your upbringing..That can help in empowering iyourself and others to stay strong and go forward because you are aware now.
Be blessed.
I'm sorry they put you through that and that it affected you so. With myself, I had parents who were extremely - even criminally, neglectful and I feel like a failure because I had a lot of potential which I couldn't live up to because I didn't have the resources to, being just a kid.
So my feelings of failure are self-generated. That being said, I can't imagine having those feelings put upon my by my parents, that is totally unnecessary to burden you with that.
I have to remind myself that life isn't all about the superficial "success", it's about being a decent person in whatever station one is in, and as long as I am, I have a lot to be proud of.
Incredibly strict parents in my experience almost always lead to incredibly deceptive children.
Not only do over controlling parent create deceptive children, i feel like it also creates suicidal ideation.
Nope, it's simply a cultural thing with Vietnamese.
@@TehKaiser just because it's part of Vietnamese culture doesn't mean it can't be true of other strict parents. Edit out that nope, you look a fool
@@rockyevans1584 It’s a matter of prudence to presume deception from
Vietnamese. They pretty have to learn the tricks of business because resources are scare.
I’m not here for some zoo-level book appreciation of cultures. Cultures come with tendencies, some unsavory.
@@TehKaiser you have zoo level spelling, if your communication is so bad how can we trust your logic? Back to my point, the Vietnamese may have stricter parenting as part of their culture, that doesn't have a thing to do with other strict parents also producing very deceptive children. You just sound hateful, and possibly a bit racist. It's in line with how stupid you seem, I guess
I can "ID" with Pan to an extent. My parents were Tiger/Helicopter parents. I was allowed very little freedom outside of going to school. If I got "C" s or worse, which was often, my dad paddled me hard enough to bruise my backside and both parents used the silent treatment for weeks. As a result I was taught enough real fear and anxiety to make me vomit on the way home from school on report card day, to bite my nails to the quick, and to live in a dream world inside my head to self-comfort. It NEVER entered my mind to hurt or kill my parents in any way. Did I dream of running away? Sure. But never to hurt them. BTW, I think most homicide cops are lazy & will do anything legal and illegal to solicit a confession. The suspect could be perfectly innocent, but getting the case off the books is all that matters.
I’m sorry that was your experience growing up. =\
Hugs and love! ♡♡♡
❤💞❤
Sorry about your childhood. The tiger parent stuff sounds like it can go way off the rails.
Also, I think your case really points out a flaw in Dr. Grande proposing Jennifer's actions as not preventable. It seems to me very unlikely that she would've plotted her parents murder if her parents weren't so overbearing; just as it's unlikely that you would have walked home from school sick if your parents had lightened up some. Yes, murder is a very rare response to "tiger parenting," but that doesn't mean it didn't play a central role in such negative behavior.
Me: When is Dr Grande going to run out of cases to analyze?
Me again: Oh, that’s right.... the world is so messed up there’s no end.
I know right
@Pisces Rising Intuition agreed
@Pisces Rising Intuition I wonder what his idea of a vacation is? Posting just one UA-cam video per day? Hahaha. When does he have time for clinical work?
I would be drained honestly
Ryan - he has lately retired.
I am curious what your thoughts are on "tiger mom" parenting, generally. Thank you. Dr. Grande, for all of your wonderful videos!
Yes! Do a Tiger parent video!
It is destructive. You teach children to walk, you tell children the way, but you don't kick them down it. Personally, I was educated in a stricter way than others, one of my life's lessons was for instance, that, no matter what you do, you do it right. It is great to be an elite doctor etc., and you should absolutely go for it, but it is better to be a street sweeper who makes streets clean and safe than to be a doctor who cannot cure people - no matter what you do, do it properly, do it right.
From that perspective, “tiger moms” are an utter failure, because they can “create” that genius once in a while, people who would not have become what they are had they grown up with neglectful parents, but most of the time, “tiger moms” will create psychological wrecks rather than mentioned geniuses. You can easily nurture talented children without this tiger-mom-psycho-bullshit.
Poor Jennifer. She learned to value wealth and success over humanity. And so she killed her parents because she could not have the success, so at least she wanted to keep the wealth. The humanity of her parents was not relevant. No wonder. She never learned about its importance.
I wonder who made that term it’s so weird
@@iknow4913 It's an Asian thing.
@@uui219 ahh
“His favorite color is orange, so that worked out for him” 😂😂
Dr. Grande is so funny in such an understated way. Love his sense of humor.
Low key deadpan burn city
Lol the dry humor was hilarious
His dark humor is the best!
Brilliant. I almost rolled off my couch laughing.
I feel that I honestly would’ve became just like Jennifer 3 years ago. I had tiger parents, got ostracized and bullied in high school, and had horrible grades in high school. I went from straight As in middle school to barely graduating high school. I faked my school reports and thought about matricide and running away all the time as a teen. The difference is that my parents mellowed out after I turned 20, accepted that I only got into community college, and didn’t force me to become a doctor or whatever. I was a shut-in weeb anyway so the curfews never affected me. I usually have to convince my lazy ass to leave the house most of the time if not for errands. Same for my little brother. He too is a shut in and a it too Minecraft obsessed(my parents are much more lax on him). Right now I’m 22, just trying to graduate college someday and move out, and hopefully assimilate back into society. I mentally blocked out my childhood and adolescence, but as I reached my 20s, I find it much easier to just forgive and forget.
“I don’t know how communities can trust law enforcement when they do not have to be honest.”
Say it again for the people in the back, Dr. G!
👆👆👆
Noel Normandin if they actually did it, you don’t need to lie to incarcerate them. That’s where unjust incarceration of innocent people starts.
Noel Normandin police speak to far more innocent people than they do criminals in the pursuit of a conviction. This is why we have “presumed innocent until proven guilty.” Out of six interviews, only one is the killer. Lie to the other five and you risk false confessions, especially with people who are emotionally or mentally unstable or who are young. It happens far too often.
Also, criminals are still humans.
Suspicious Ned they are supposed to be impartial. If they become jaded and allow past conversations to influence the way they behave in current ones, they shouldn’t be cops.
Police who use the Reid method are destroying people’s faith in the honesty of law enforcement everywhere. They actually think that the ends justify the means. Governments and their departments nearly always work this way, as they can justify harming the few to help the many. They will torture an individual to justify saving a number of innocents. This is what the police think they are doing, problem is - they don’t seem to have a very good hit/miss record. Their own individual biases overtake their logic. I’d like to see the (true unedited) statistics on the validity of the confessions they get this way.
Oh wow, I forgot she had a brother before Dr. G's retelling. That must be so sad for him to have lost his mom by his sister's hand.
@@valerierodger7700 I agree, some can take pressure but I think her parents wasn't the type to help her through her hardships and patronizing. It doesn't matter what they seem like to us, because for Jennifer they're too much. But again, her boyfriend's influence contributed the most to her behaviour
ABC No, the father isn’t gone and the mother was apparently the kinder, less strict one. So the brother has had the worst of everything. I hope he is happy and independent by now, but at the age when he should have been thinking about moving out (like his sister should have) he will have been emotionally devastated and stuck with his father more than ever.
Valerie Rodger Well, it’s definitely awful parenting, but they didn’t deserve to be murdered/wounded as a result.
Kevin Hornbuckle Nobody has suggested what?
@@icturner23 No the brother had already moved out of the house by the time of the murder and attempted murder. The brother was already in University in another town so was not living at home
The reid technique should be banned everywhere in the world because it presumes the person in question is guilty. Its done purely as a way to get a confession by hook or by crook
Never talk to the police y’all. If you’re a timid person and they pressure you It helps to act like it’s out of your hands and is non-negotiable (eg: my lawyer/parents/etc. will be mad if I don’t contact my lawyer first. If my lawyer says it’s ok I’ll be happy to speak with you etc. Police are very good at guilting and shaming you, do not negotiate or compromise on this; lawyer first, then we’ll take it from there okthx)
KingofHearts literally. NEVER talk to the police. I repeat: NEVER TALK TO POLICE! They’ll tell you only guilty people ask for a lawyer, that’s a lie! DON’T TALK TO POLICE!
Totally agree! Never take a polygraph either!
The only thing you should say to the police is "I want my lawyer."
Fuck the police, as a mongrel i havent had one pleasant experience with them.
The parents have a part in this. Instead of getting help from her parents, they abused her. They created the monster.
when I first heard about this case and I can't help but to see some degree of resemblance to how my sister and I grew up. My parents weren't as severe as Jennifer's parents were, but the after effects still haunts me till this day. My sister was the one with good grades and I was the one with not so good grades. She lived with pressures of high expectations and I lived with feeling of total failure. I still live my life that I don't deserve to be happy, or feel deserve to have good things because i'm a failure. It affects my professional life, i'm constantly mentally fogged up. I'm hesitant to go to therapy. I shut family and friends out often and forget to keep in touch. As for my sis, I can't speak for what her experience is like and what are the after effects from it. I'm not close with her either so i don't know, but i can only imagine it was a massive struggle. My heart goes out to anyone who went through tough abusive parenting.
I would love to hear your analysis on the Richardson family murders. Jasmine Richardson was 12 at the time of the murders and she ended the lives of both her parents and younger brother. This case took place in Canada, where offenders under the age of 18 receive a maximum sentence of 10 years. As a mental health educator, I would love to know your take. Thank you! ❤️
This case happened in Alberta.
Julia DuMaurier this story of Jasmine Richardson in a way reminds me of that story I think was from California, where a teenager was apparently kidnapped by her dad's closest friend. The mum was murdered, her little brother and the family dog as well, and a fire set to cover up this tragedy. Then she and this man went on the run into the mountains where he was discovered and shot and killed by police officers. Did she actually plan this, just like Jasmine Richardson?
dianne Kalk do you remember the name of that girl? It sounds really familiar.
Julia duMaurier was it Hannah Anderson?
@@diannekalk481 Medicine Hat to be precise.
My dad was a police chief. Mom was the sargent. I learned very early to lie and manipulate. I had plans of "removing" dad but thought it through and decided I didn't like the outcomes. I was a pretty sick puppy by the time I left home. Several years of drinking, drugs and looking for love in all the wrong places I finally grew up using God as a perfect father. Years later (66) I'm happy to say we were best buddies at the end of his life. I was even his caregiver and was there when he took his last breath. Miss you dad.
@Nancy, Reconciliation brought Peace and Love to the end. My condolences.
amen
Honey, wake up!! Dr. Grande posted a new vid!!
Her parents created her. Tiger parenting is just an extreme form of narcissism. They couldn't do even a fraction of what they demand their kids to so they try to live through them as if it's their duty to please them, to follow the path they set out for them, and bring some shred of honor and dignity to them so they can turn around and brag to other parents. They never treated her like a human being with her own passions, wants, needs, and self-determination.
This is very true, but should not be confused with NPD. It's definitely narcissistic behavior, but the persons behind the behavior can be normal.
No it isn't. This is how everyone parented years ago.
@@DrJ-hx7wv slavery also existed years ago should we go back to that? No parenting need to change just like how slavery laws did. Stop living in the past and let’s progress as a society.
@@DrJ-hx7wv where? Who? I can recall cases when older kids were more controlled - like in rich older families - or worked hard, in less rich families, but never both at the same time to that extreme. But that's what I can tell from central European history, not sure which culture you mean?
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Kid might get bullied and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
I watched the police interrogation and she didn’t have a chance. A lawyer, at least. This girl needed therapy, she snapped. Thank you for this one Dr. Grande. I am one of the people who requested it. A really objective yet compassionate assessment of this case.
JCS Psychology just uploaded a video about Jennifer, and you just added so much more information, context, and perspective. Thank you
@Lightning Star yep...Dr. Grande, True crime Loser, and JCS are my 3 go to's. They can all do a video on the same case and Ill get 3 different perspectives. I love it!
This was preventable, don't treat your kids as slaves would be a good way to start...
Most asian parents are like this but you don’t see all kids murdering their parents
That's bull. She could've moved out by then, she was in college. How about not murdering people, would be a good way to start.
@@mike04574 Most people that are abused don't murder their abusers either.
@The Dora Treating a child all her life like this is child abuse, the one thing almost every single murderer serial killer etc. have in common is they were abused as children.
Not every abused person becomes a murderer, in this case this one did.
What broke my heart was when in the last interview the investigator asked her “Forget about what your parents wanted, what did you want to become? What did you wanted to do in the future?” - when she answered it was super SUPER INSIGHTFUL as to have access to her interior, to who she could have become.There is such a thing as to be held emotionally hostage, in this case, that’s why SHE DID NOT HAVE THE REASONING AS TO THINK “Ok I am going to move out, this situation have a viable solution”...
Without forging report cards and pretending to be studying pharmacology, she could’ve gradually recalibrated her parents expectations into something more realistic; by way of constant disappointment. You know, like the rest of us do.
Haha, just ease them into the idea of mediocrity. Before you know it, they'll look at you and think "well, at least they didn't commit parricide"
Oof
You speak with the wisdom of sages!
Haha haha 😂
First off, thank you for not blaming Jennifer's parents. This all could have been avoided with communication.
I am Asian and my parents used to have really high expectations of me in high school, but towards the end of my senior year, I was able to recalibrate their expectations. I had many, many sit downs with my folks and explained many times why I am not academically gifted. Fast forward 20 years, I have a great relationship with my folks.
Dr. Grande, your organized model of presentation and steady voice eases my anxiety, despite the subject matter. Thank you for the work you put into making these videos.
“THE PARENTS WANTED TROPHY CHILDREN”.
You reap what you sow. They raised a stone cold child who when got cornered struck back with all might!
antonio branch most cultures are very demanding and harsh on girls.
@@hummingpylon I disagree with you that she was stone cold. In the afterword written by psychologist Dr. Betty Kershner in the book by Jeremy Grimaldi about Jennifer Pan, she strongly alludes to borderline personality disorder, not antisocial personality disorder. I think the only reason she didn't come right out and say it is because there is some rule governing psychologists that says it's unethical to diagnose someone they've never met. But she mentions a teddy bear if I recall correctly, and teddy bears are a transitional object that people with borderline personality disorder take with them to hospitals. It mentions teddy bears and BPD in the book by psychologist David Robinson. I might be misremembering though. But in Grimaldi's book it says "Greenberg says that the cutting, the suicide attempts...". Either way, the most common reason why someone has BPD is because of the parents. Either the parents didn't protect her from other people, or the parents abused or neglecter her themselves. Just my opinion.
It sounds like she had a total mental break down...
@@cptfreeman8966 I love how ignorant you are, dont raise children please.. I mean you have chance to be president of the USA and why you are not?? see, everyone have "chance" to be anything but for some the chance is higher and for some, its astronomically low you could not even imagine so low decimal. I will diagnose you as a idiotic.
Well researched, as usual. I love this channel because, as a scientist myself, I understand the way scientists talk to other scientists. Peppered with caveats and subtle humor when applicable, but with the highest regard for truth without bias. Top notch work, Dr. Grande!
Very well stated; I concur completely. His research while concise is always both thorough, insightful and enlightening, I almost always wind up learning about new critical facts that are typically absent from media / other analysts' coverage. Thanks Dr Grande as always!
As someone coming from a similar family situation (except that I did end up going to college), I can understand where the coldness towards her parents, lying, and possible resentment comes from. Having "tiger parents" really damages your psyche and mental well being.
I went to school with a boy who was so terrified of his parents that when he would get an A- on a paper he would start to cry right then in the classroom.
If you want fewer bad things to happen, not being a shitty parent is a good way to start. Because this _was_ preventable. By not incredibly authoritarian parenting. Her development would have taken a different path if she had not been drilled to place her self-worth in some vacuous idea of success. She would not have been the unempathetic person she became without that, and that was a precondition for committing this act. (Mind you: I'm talking causality, not responsibility in a moral sense. It was still deeply wrong to try and kill her parents, obviously.)
thtben Kind of like being a family member with no rights.
@@valerierodger7700 Several Chinese immigrant children I knew committed suicide. But many immigrant parents still insist on requiring them children to fulfill their own failed dream of great success and recognition.
@@valerierodger7700 I don't know whether her brother had the same experience; but it doesn't matter to my argument. I did not claim the parenting she was subjected to was the direct or only cause for her act. In my opinion, it was a necessary condition, not a sufficient one.
This.
Pfft. Plenty of people have abusive childhoods without becoming pathological liars and murdering their parents.
"a young romance fueled with passion - as opposed to common sense" Liked that one :)
It would be interesting to analyse her parents or other 'tiger parents'. Not every parent of Asian descent behaves like this. Personally I know a few European parents who have (pathologically) high expectations towards their children (friends of mine). Regards from Germany, dr Grande!
I also see parents this in parents who have high expectations on a kid who might be more smarter than the other. Evan though I'm not asian I have witnessed what happens when you don't allow your kid to make mistakes and learn from them the yelling was so brutal that it gave me shivers to this day
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Kid might get bullied and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
My mom tells me stories of her child hood my poor oma (rip) she left Germany here aren't were rich but cut her off because she was pregnant and to get away from bad times she went to us at age of 19 almost 20 and only knew 3 words of English hello,telephone, and bathroom from a TV show but gradually learned it more on she was so poor and when my opa(rip) they got separated it was tought on her mom but she was very German and up to her death didn't get any less German my mom sadly don't remember German because the school she went to was in Wisconsin where they told her you speak English not German because your in America made her cry but some stories I thought damn she had anger issues and very angry and my mom's liek you think but she calmed down when got older but she was 87 if lived another year 88 on new years but she may have been 87 she had stories to make her sound like she was 100 years old
I agree Dr Grande, the way the police use those tactics can make almost anyone confess to anything. My father used those tactics on me as a teenager. I confessed to things I never did 😢
I was a legal secretary in 1989 when I was given this piece of sage advice from LA County Judge Victor Barerra: "Always deny it and demand proof. If they have proof, keep your mouth shut and lawyer up." Cheers!
@Suspicious Ned how's that boot taste?
@@sharonlee7055 yes I understand, is not ok but happens 💙😅
@@longwhitemane sure, wish I had that choice with my father. 💙
@Suspicious Ned I don't post anything for likes, I post because it is a choice to participate in a commentary in a channel I appreciate. My father was abusive and he past away long time ago and I forgave him and moved on to be a healthy decent human been because for me it is a choice to be better. I don't post anything with the intent to hurt anyones feelings.
I heard that kids are actually more likely to rebel against their parents if they grew up in a strict upbringing.
Depends on the temperament of the child.
I heard that a pot of money with a mechanism to get it after death motivates many to murder, be it for an inheritance or life insurance. Double Indemnity, anyone?
Jennifer
"But what's gonna happen to me?"
Pan
Young Lady, you're gonna get the Spanking of your Life, which you should have been given Years ago!!
@Emily Pace it's good that her dad survived
@@varietydelle5253 If only because he'll live with the oain and regret forever.
"I can't tell you but I can show you some chair..." :)
I watched a segment on TV about the children of tiger parents in an Asian country committing suicide because of the pressure put on them. Additionally, the show went into classrooms and showed kids falling asleep at their desks, even 9 -10 year old’s. It’s been studied and revealed that teenagers need a lot of sleep and we all know adequate sleep is essential for emotional and mental health for everybody. When I was in middle and high school, I frequently had to take a nap when I got home from school, even though I went to bed every night between 9:30 and 10 pm and slept until 7 a.m. So, take the fact these kids are getting about four hours of sleep a night and the pressure to succeed it’s no wonder teen suicide is increasing in that particular culture.
Sounds like South Korea? I remember a story where a teen jumped out the classroom window and killed himself right before an important exam.
Dr Grande, I sense a higher hint of emotion in your voice when concluding this video . It is a horrendous case where many lives have been destroyed. Thanks once again ❤️
her behavior was bred into her by her parents. if you raise a person with a mindset and give them only one way to escape torment then they will take it.
She had other ways out, she could have just left. She wanted to keep the financial benefits of living with them/in their house.
@@lauras3002 yeah but people don't think rationally.
@@lauras3002 and frankly that should be her right. Parents are morally responsible for their kids well being.
@@lauras3002 she likely didn’t want to run away as how they viewed her as a failure would remain. She would be constantly reminded that she’s a failure as someone out there (her parents ) know that. It’s complicated with the mind. But some rather a person die than the person see them for what they are. The latter is more painful. I think it’s a mixture of this. Especially if she knew she would continue to disappoint them.
Although this is a perplexing crime with many unanswered questions your systematic, exhaustive analysis deepened my understanding of this case. As always, thank YOU for all the time and effort you put forth to educate and inform us!
I have the utmost sympathy for this girl.
Until I heard that she coulda just walked away.
She chose to stay, and slay.
Bad choices.
And collect insurance...
I don't think Dr. Grande didn't mentioned this, but other videos I have watched on this case pointed out that walking away would equal being disowned. Of course this is no justification for her actions, but just pointing out the stakes were higher.
legally and physically she could have walked away, but a lot of young people just don't know how to, and culturally it may have seemed unthinkable to the extent it truly never occurred to her. Still no excuse.
i have no sympathy, with a lot of killers they had some kind of abuse, were raped, experienced head injuries etc. shes just a cold blooded killer 25 years is too short
@@wendyleeconnelly2939 Apparently she had been living and working on her own for years before she was caught lying about attending university. Regardless, it's hard to see how moving out could be more unthinkable than murder.
"Just a reminder; I'm not diagnosing anyone, but I will slay you with my razor-sharp wit."
*The UA-cam Criminal Analysis trifecta*
_That Chapter:_ timeline analysis
_Jim Can't Swim:_ interrogation analysis
_Dr. Grande:_ psychological analysis
YES!!!!!!
Yessssss 🎯🎯🎯
Thanks! I'd never heard of "That Chapter". I will be heading there now!
shaaronie you won’t regret it, one of my fave channels
TCL= interrogation analysis that will also make you laugh
His favorite color is orange...lol. Love the deadpan humor you deliver.
Hello, Dr. Grande! I'd be very interested to hear your opinions on the possible applications of psychedelics such as psilocybin and LSD on mental health. Given the recent, promising research, I believe this topic would be an interesting new area for your channel to cover.
Please! Would really love to hear your take on this. I listened to a podcast about UF studying this a while ago. Love your videos!
I agree
Also ayahuasca
Marijuana and mushrooms had terrible effects on me. Paranoia trips. Was diagnosed with schizophrenia few years after consumption of these products.
@@taopaille-paille4992 those who are genetically predisposed to conditions like schizophrenia and psychosis may experience those symptoms earlier in life than if they'd never tried psychedelics, but there is no evidence whatsoever that psychedelics actually cause these disorders in users. Practice safe use and understand the risks that can take place based on your individual factors
A case from my corner of the world, well done, and as always very interesting 👏
Never diagnosing, always speculating, it's Dr. Grande!
The 'power' of abuse in all its possible forms...
Abuse should be studied continuously and for a long time so we can, hopefully, one day get closer to the understanding of the human mind and its monstrosities.
Thank you for the video, Dr. Grande! ❤
I realise she killed her parents which is mental, but I can't help but feel sorry for her. She shouldn't have been put in that kind of situation in my opinion.
Honestly why not kill her parents. Her parents did nothing but abuse and neglect her. Her parents were selfish and only cared about their image. That type of pressure on Jennifer since her birth would cause her to eventually snap and she might have killed herself. I'm glad the parents got attacked and only wish Jennifer got away with it. That is, if Jennifer really only snapped because of her abusive parents and not cuz she's evil herself. And it does seem like the case- she seemed like a regular decent person just under horrible circumstances, and anybody would snap when circumstances get horrible enough. Also nobody was helping her and nobody prolly would've helped her. She was trapped in that house with her parents and they made her codependent on them so she felt no way out. I only wish she got away with it. What can you do? Just keep obeying the parents for the rest of her life and allow all her willpower/hopes and dreams to die and just become a walking zombie? She would've succumbed to drugs or crime or would've lost her mind. And what would her parents have done? They would've blamed her for making them look bad and bringing shame to the family name. I absolutely stand by what Jennifer did she took the abuse for long enough i just wish she got away with it or better yet i wish she got saved from her parents somehow without murder taking place. Like some helpful relative who knew what she was going through. But you know how these type of cultures are- everyone's on the same program so they don't see anything wrong. But fuck her parents people like that are pieces of shit who hide behind the facade of being good family men/women with good jobs and carrying around briefcases and dressing properly. But they only do those things to look good to the public they never loved their kid.
I feel sorry for her. I think her parents’ rigid attitudes turned her into the person she was. She lied all the time because she was afraid to tell them the truth. Of course there’s no excuse for murder, but maybe - like an abuse victim - Jennifer felt so emotionally imprisoned by her parents that she believed she had no choice if she was ever going to be free. As for her co-conspirators, I can never understand the mentality of a person who would kill a stranger just to help somebody else out (although no doubt in this case there was a financial inducement too).
Re the “Reid technique” - here in Britain police are not allowed to lie to a suspect, which I think is how it should be.
GradKat Follow the money.
🙄
She has crappy parents...who, by the way, worked super hard to provide for their children, and that means it's just fine that she wanted them *MURDERED* for her inheritance.
okeydokey then.
i cant believe you feel sorry for her lmao
I agree wholeheartedly about not lying to suspects
I'm a Chinese immigrant living in Austria and I have started lying early on about exams and grades bc I was afraid of my mum's reaction. She got the consequences of her actions and murdering someone should never be excused. However, they probably do something we don't know to drive her mad. I believe that she should be rehabilitated.
I'd have to say her parents played a part in her development. Of course other factors in her life built the perfect storm which eventually lead to murder.
Girlfriend: Hey do you wanna go to the beach?
Me: O.C.E.A.N. OPENNESS, CONSCIENTIOUSNESS, EXTRAVERSION
Agreeableness and Neuroticism
How could anyone grow up to be loving and empathic with parents like that?
I honestly don't think its the worst thing in the world. Worst case scenario she disobeys her parents n gets disowned by them
Gonna watch this before I go to bed. Hope you are well DR G. Love from the UK
I evaluate your videos according to the five factor model OCEAN. Are they Original, Charming, Educational Amusing, and Necessary. Again, according to the model you have delivered a great take on this case. Thanks again. Take care.
Interesting video, yet again. It made me remember the Jeremy Bamber case. It often surprises me that more parents don’t get murdered by their tormented children.
Wow listening to you always exposes me to new thoughts and insight. Love how your humour just slips into the dialogue and you keep such a straight face .. 🦘
I JUST watched her police interviews the other day. 😱 Fascinating!
I see someone watches Jim Can't Swim.
@@Kitties_are_pretty would you elaborate?
@@Kitties_are_pretty JSC analyzes interrogation techniques and even mentions that body language is always a retrospective factor. What are you on about?
At very least, they share an audience since we're watching both lol.
@UCifqPiptfAVAooqwSFT9XRQ its okay if your to stupid to understand
Joshua Brooks but professionals use the tactics Jim brings up. That’s actually where he gets them from lol
L
Parent having unrealistic high expectation on their children is putting very heavy pressure on their shoulder, it can create very damaging consequences to a child future psychological and emotional well beings.
Dr. Grande, I'm so glad you're on UA-cam! I learn something every time I watch one of your videos.
I've seen the Reid Technique, for example, countless times in TV shows. I could always identify it in practice, but I never knew anything about it as a construct. Now, I can study it formally and with that knowledge, write better fiction stories. Thanks!
Amazing and clear perspectives and interpretations. You’re amazing Dr Grande. I absolutely agree with you regarding these young people’s lack of empathy and improbability of redemption.
You’re one of the most consistent You Tubers🧡‼️
Wowza, this was a lit more complicated than it first appeared. Thanks Dr. Grande!
His favorite color was orange! 🤣🤣🤣 I love your witty sense of humor! Hi from Brazil.
Dr. Grande, coming through with the immaculate sense of humor as always
Tigers often dominate all they encounter, blissfully unaware that-sometimes-a hunter lurks in the tall grass.
Can't wait to hear your thoughts on this, as usual! The last few days I been watching a lot of videos about her so perfect timing for me! Hope you're having a great day you're awesome 💙💙
And me
Love that did a video on her! I now watch the interrogations of some of your subjects and it adds some depth
She actually got me on the track I am in college and for a career. I want to learn how trauma makes people do bad things.
Knowledge Acquisition ...and indeed, what constitutes trauma? We can all agree that Jennifer had a restrictive upbringing, but from her parents’ point of view having a home and food and educational opportunities would have seemed like paradise. 🤷♀️
But this isn't healthy parenting if you are raising a kid in a different country... the kid is going to grow up isolated, socially awkward, and lonely, surrounded by other kids who are not asian and are not tiger parented. Kid might get bullied and immigrant parents don't understand what their kids go through
The discussion concerning deceptive strategies employed by police brought this case to a new level. It's so difficult to justify deception from the perspective of ethics, and I'm so grateful that Dr. Grande was courageous enough to broach that issue. Community confidence in law enforcement is crucial to promoting public safety--and bringing justice to truly guilty people. And in this case, the police were able to convict based on burner phone conversations, so deception was hardly necessary. I agree with Dr. Grande that the dangers of embarking on deception to achieve ends comes with consequences--regardless of who makes that choice.
People who haven’t experience living with obsessive parents have a hard time understanding how toxic life this kind of life is. It is very difficult to leave this sort of psychological hold that started at birth. I don’t know how much research is done on the dynamics of such households and how trapped the kids and even parents feel but I think it’s not right to say that Jennifer could have easily left her home.
I also don’t think it’s unusual that meeting someone who makes you feel good leads to leaving a suffocating home and for it to lead to a bad result; it is usually a catalyst for wanting to get out of an oppressive situation, but it may unfortunately be misplaced emotions. Leaving a person for another is also usually seen in abusive relationships again because it highlights the differences in your reality vs. possibilities in other word hope for a better future where that person becomes your only way out in the mind of someone who is already troubled.
Bad or obsessive parenting can result in fatal results.
I always enjoy these elegant analyses.
Really interested in cases like these; statistically rare even within its own unusual “group”. Great content as always!
It was so crazy to see her flip between mimicking her mother's tearful last few words with emotion and when she was asked to translate in English she was cold, robotic, no emotion on her face, no pitch changes in her voice. It was scary to see how she could flip her emotional act on and off like that.
That's trauma...
She made little mouse sounds to make herself seem tiny and helpless. Oh yeah...TINY And HELPLESS as a barracuda. Don't turn ur back on her
Women..smh
I appreciate all your videos, but this one is extra special on all levels! Thank you...u r most helpful. Happy 2023
Dr Grande you are the key to understanding human psyche and ur a great speaker is so clear and simple yet so effective as well taught!!
Wait, seriously? You don't think Jennifer's parents could have prevented this? Strongly disagree with that one. Unless you're saying their overbearing methods are entirely genetic and they were destined to make these decisions. I think a few ounces of empathy, communication, and grace throughout her childhood would've greatly changed her course. (PS, still love your insights, but I'm a bit surprised by this)
In this day and age in my locality, asian parents are denying their kid’s their childhood and forcing them to do extra-school tuition. These kids though smart lack good character. I am not surprised at least one of them retaliated this way.
Oooooooooh... this one's a doozy. I remember her. I lived in Toronto at the time.
The whole "eligible for parole after 25 years" thing is a technicality of life sentences, here in Canada. It just means that they get parole hearings after that period of ineligibility. Every couple of years, I think. For most, it's a technicality and they have a snowball's chance in hell of being let out. We also have a dangerous offender designation, for violent serial offenders who require indefinite detention because they're such a threat to the public. Paul Bernardo carries that designation.
And yet his equally awful (if not even more so) wife is free as a bird. She makes me sick. Never should have been given her sweet deal.
@@debbielockhart7762 Karla Homolka is so evil Satan looks to her for advice. What pisses me off about the case of Karla Homolka is that the first victim of her and her husband Paul Bernardo is Karla's fifteen year old sister Tammy. The reason for this is that Karla wasn't a virgin when she and Paul were married. Their other two victims- Leslie Mahaffey and Kristen French- were victims of opportunity. Leslie Mahaffey was locked out of her parents house due to missing curfew as she was attending a friend's wake. Kristen French was abducted by Karla and Paul as she was cutting through a church parking lot on her way home from Holy Cross Secondary School in St. Catherine's, Ontario, Canada.
Thank you Dr. Grande for this analysis. It is astonishing that as many people are sympathizing with Pan as there are here. It's doubly horrifying to see people exoticizing the "Tiger Parent" (which probably has more to do with class than ethnicity, Asian immigrants to North America tend to be wealthier or higher status at home than other immigrant groups).
Assuming her parents were actually abusive, Pan was an adult with a job and a friend to live with. She was in a much stronger position to leave than many children of *actually* abusive parents. It's infinitely better for a child of abusive parents to reclaim agency and leave rather than waiting on their parents to change. Even if the parents *say* they're cutting you off forever, your forever is longer than theirs and they know that. It's not true for all parents, but impending mortality does tend to mend parent-child relationships. I agree completely that Pan's parents could have done nothing to prevent this brutal attempted/actual murder.
Also, I can't speak for Canadian cops, but yes, police are liars and legally not obligated to actually serve the public.
PS: As you've pointed out in the Johnson case, most parricides are carried out by "battered children". But even a child who is truly driven to homicide would almost certainly be traumatized by carrying it out, *even if the homicide was the best possible choice*, because violence is inherently traumatizing if you are a normally empathetic person. The lack of trauma with both these offenders is pretty telling.
I have many opinions to say. But please do keep making this kinds of topics. It's thrilling, informative and promotes thinking.
Thank you Dr. Grande for a great analysis as usual! Wondering if you could consider doing an analysis of Desmond is Amazing. Or perhaps an analysis of whether you believe his parents endorse any mental health criteria and/or if you think his parents are considering Desmond's best interests.
Please do a video; speculating about what could've been happening inside the minds of, Fred and Rosemary West. Those two were cray-cray!!
I love your longer videos! Great analysis per usual. Surprised you don’t believe “the tiger parent” side of things didn’t have an impact and maybe could’ve prevented this outcome. The deception she learned surely must’ve been brought on by fear and the anticipation of punishment by her parents if she hadn’t performed well? Of course her parents aren’t to blame for her actions but would she have learned and adopted pathological lying if it wasn’t for their standards, in which, she couldn’t meet
Tragic yet fascinating. Excellent in depth analysis and narrative of this unique crime.
Wonderful to listen to; easy to follow; very articulate; reassuring tone of voice; concise and informative
Thanks for the analysis, Dr. Grande. From what I've read about this case, I don't think she ever admitted to her parents that she didn't complete high school, though. When she was finally caught by them, she told them a half-truth--that she had completed college but had never started her pharmacy course.
That orange jumpsuit bit was savage Doc🤣
“Daniel’s favorite color was orange, so perhaps things really worked out for him in this case” OMG this had me LOL you are a SAVAGE and I love it. 🤣
Had to scroll to see someone mention it, was not disappointed!
Dr. Grande is at it again - Making sense of nonsense so that my mind can rest. Thank you again Sir!
dr grande i appreciate your analysis of the police in these subjects. a lot of ppl who discuss criminal cases rarely challenge the methods of the officers, but your asides on the ethics of lying to a suspect during a confession keeps us aware of the systems we live in. I am just glad you are willing to bring awareness to the idea that the police are never infallible pillars of justice and are human too.
Why didn't the school counselor or teacher help her pass that class, or change her curriculum so she didn't need calc. Also, that amount of money could've took the couple to the States, or somewhere far. I understand though, she was probably taught to stay around and take care of them & not live far.
She didn't need calculus. It is not required for an OSSD but she was probably was short of credits because she failed the class and did not take something to replace it.