I've seen ( and sat on) the Vote 900 yesterday in Slaidburn. The gentleman riding it was "running it in" prior to its handover to the press. It has everything included, steering damper, aluminium panniers/topbox, tyre pressure sensors, tubeless etc, etc. It was well finished, appears to be good quality, in truth it was a very nice bike. Furthermore, when l sat on it l got both feet flat on the ground, which at my age 68 and waning strength was confidence inspiring. The O.T.R. price was said to be around £ 9000 he said. As you said, Chinese bikes are here to stay, however, the problem that l see is the aging motorcycle buyers/riders. There are very few newcomers to the motorcycling world. It's grey hair or no hair.
Took delivery of mine on August 1st and have done about 1000 miles so far and I've got to say I think it's great . The only thing I've done to change it is put a non reflective screen protect on it . All the important parts as far as I'm concerned are good recognised brands tyres, suspension and ignition . The biggest surprise was the handling paired with the comfort makes it an absolute joy for all day trips. In my opinion it made too much sense to ignore , I'm not bothered in the least how much it'll be worth in 12 , 24 months time the fun factor here and now is what I'm interested in after all I once lost £2000 on a triumph street triple . It now sits alongside my yamaha fazer 1000 and ducati monster and it's not out of place and to be honest it currently the steed of choice 😂. Badge snobbery and loyalty are now proving to be expensive traits.
Recently sold my beloved BMW 1200 RT so we could keep a roof over our heads. Rode all my life and just turned 60, I think a lot of families are in a similar situation, my bike was a luxury/ hobby that I miss very much. Hopefully things will improve and I’ll get back on one in the future that being the case I’m certainly going to look at this machine 👍
Sad for your situation. At 67 I have downsized to a Meteor, Hunter and a Honda Grom. Believe it or the Grom is my #1 choice for local rides. Costs very little and nothing to run. 200 miles on 6 litres. Just keep riding. Good luck.
Interesting discussion about the ethics of buying Chinese. I’m one who wouldn’t want to buy a Chinese machine and I’m not sure that it is the simple binary decision you make out. The problem is that there are virtually no complex manufactured products which don’t contain Chinese components. So long as people are aware or are discussing the fact that China is a repressive dictatorship and its suppression of workers rights is a necessary condition to the low cost of production….. then that’s good. People need to make the intellectual link between their consumer choices and the ‘shot to bits’ UK economy.
Sold my Honda Blackbird to pay off my credit cards. It took me Ten years to get back into biking seven years ago. I lost my enthusiasm and confidence as I have now reached seventy years of age. Moral of the story is don’t leave it too long. Best wishes.
Enjoy your down to earth and clear approach to the reviews and the effortless/natural way you introduce them, none of this 'welcome to my youtube channel' cheesy nonsense. Keep up the good work!
I have just sold a 2004 multistrada 1000 and a Triumph 900 scrambler and bought a CFMOTO 800mt for £6799 and its fantastic, most comfortable bike ive ever owned and the fit and finish is as good as anything i have ever owned in 50yrs of riding, dont knock them until you have tried them. VFM speaks for its self!
I think the only thing preventing some riders, taking a punt on a Chinese brand bike, is uncertainty about continued dealer back up & part availability . One of my bikes was manufactured in China , but the difference is, it is Japanese branded , which gives me more confidence regards long term backup, plus parts availability . I have no doubts about the Chinese manufacturers ability to produce motorcycles to a good standard , they have all the latest tech & precision machinery to achieve it , as they are now proving it . They just need to back it up , like the Japanese brands did , with proper franchised dealers & sustained parts availability ,to increase the buyers confidence in the brand . Also at the moment ,the short term reviews are all we have to go on. Reviewers who actually take a punt on the budget Chinese bikes , tend to be the type of rider , that change their bikes almost as often as their underwear & get rid after a year or two of ownership , before they get lumbered with any potential issues. Next they have a new bike reveal , it certainly won’t be a budget Chinese bike , it’s more likely to be a well established brand like BMW , Triumph .an Italian jobby or Japanese . So subscribers never get to see how ,the Chinese bikes really shape up , long term all weather high mileage use after 5 to 10 years of ownership . What we need is a UA-camr , to get rid of all their bikes , & just own & ride one Chinese manufactured bike at least 5 days a week in all weather for 5 years & 50 ,000 miles at least , to get a proper test & evaluation of a bike .
@@stevet599 Owners will have no choice but to dispose of Chinese bikes in the medium term , unless the bikes have sustainable and consistent manufacturer / dealer & parts back up equal to the established popular brands .
Nice one Dave, yes Chinese built MC's are here to stay the build quality has improved, they cost less and you get a lot of extras for your money. For example, with the CF Moto Adventure 700, that I test rode recently, (what a suprise that was), you get fully adjustable KYB suspension front and rear, Bosch ignition, Pirelli tyres, Juan brakes and a Kawasaki designed bored out engine, also a 4 year warranty. Yes the twin engine is an old design with a 180 degree crank, but it's bullet proof and has been thoroughly tested.
Morning Dave. One word, "accessibility". Somewhat overused - but in the case of bikes like the Voge DS525X entirely appropriate. I've never owned a 1200GS, but I've had a couple of RT's. I'm not a very big fella, and these bikes were always at the limit of what I could manage due to their size and weight. Whilst a slightly different use case (tourer) I was always confident enough whilst on the go, but it definitely caused me a subconscious mental block with regards to where I'd take them. But, I reckon even bigger fellas feel this too if they're being completely honest? My Classic 350 changed everything for me as the ideal adventure tool and consequently I've put more miles on that little bike in 18 months than any other bike I've owned in recent times. But it has it's limits of course. For true adventures, further afield you might need something with a little more capability. Bikes like the DS525X might be the perfect solution. Light, capable, well-equipped and such good value - they might just be the ideal bike for exploring, solo or two-up.
Absolutely right. It's a mixture of brand snobbery and prejudice. We probably all own products either made in China or containing Chinese components, so people just need to get over themselves and celebrate the fact these bikes make motorcycling more accessible.
I own a Guzzi and a CFMoto. Happy with both bikes. They are different but they both have their quirks. I've been waiting 10 months for a body panel for the Guzzi (2022) not good for a company that's been around for over 100 years. The CF could do with better fueling. This is common across their models. 2 software updates later and it's still not perfect, but at least you don't have to go into the dealer for the updates.We don't get all the Chinese brands here in Australia but I would be happy to try any of them. Thanks for your video. It's true and honest. The bikes are built well at a great price. The top brands need to get with the program or lose sales, it's already happening with KTM.
Got one a few months ago, to accompany my BMW tourer in the garage, and impressed so far. Easy to ride from day 1, nice light clutch (as arthritis sets in), almost too low seat height as I’m 6ft, it’s capable and economical, good features, good fairing, handling, tyres, brakes, instrumentation…..all good. Fuel economy amazing. The lighting is brilliant too. Try one!
Great video and awesome little bike. Haven't seen this brand in my neck of the woods but i have noticed its hard to find any product these days that wasn't at least in part produced in China. I remember talking to my mates about this coming to fruition about 20 years ago.
Good Morning Dave , i agree with you 100% , back in 1973 i bought a brand new suzuki 250 because i couldn't buy a british 250 , now in the present day i won't think twice about buying a chinese bike they offer great value for your money & are full spec'd up , whats not to like , as always take care & ride safe
Not had a problem with my Chinese Zontes in 4 years. I have a Honda and a Harley but I use the Zontes the most. The rear shocks on the Zontes are crap, they had crazy hard compression, my wife found it back breaking as a passenger, so I changed them for €60. I hate to think what's been spent on my Harley to still end up with an average motorcycle, whereas the Zontes has been great, straight out of the box.
I am a red-blooded patriotic American and I own a jawa and an oral that's made in Russia. I started with Japanese bikes and rode Japanese motorcycles for 20 years before I bought my first English motorcycle and now I have nine English motorcycles one jawa the URL and my Harley-Davidson Sportster as well as my genuine Vespa scooter. I don't care where it's built as long as it has quality built in. What cost $2 an hour to make in China cost $100 an hour to fix in the Western country
Totally agree with your conclusions. The fact is that most if not all mainstream manufacturers make either all or some part of their products in the developing world whether that be Thailand, Malaysia, China or elsewhere.
I do you like your style! I have ridden two voges, a 300 rally which vibrated my nuts off and a ac525x. Which i liked. However i found them unrefined. Yes, i want affordability as i also have a family, a house, a car, like you said. So, I have bought a used honda deauville 700. It has all the useability I need, it looks lovely in red and it still costs less than the two chinese bikes! Go figure!!! I approached my criteria as what will cause me the least amount of financial stress.
Heyho Dave! Motorcycles used to be working class transport, nowadays it seems that "big brands" are only interested in catering to the wealthy who perceive bikes as toys or fashion accessories. If (🙄) there's another major economic "correction" many of the old brands may disappear because we'll all be riding the chinese equivalent of the Honda CT90.
I recall owners getting financially hurt by Chinese bike manufacturers, it's fresh in my memory. But everything changes, l spend a lot of time in Spain and Chinese bikes are everywhere now, these are commuting tools, not leisure bikes like in the UK, so the reliabity must be there for them to be succeeding, great. Still, they don't have anything l want to buy yet in the UK market (retro/cruiser) so l am happy for other brave buyers to do the long term test riding. It's about market share, they are not doing Joe public a favour with these prices, and when that share grows so will their prices. Brand snobbery? I am happy to admit to that, it's nothing to be ashamed of either, buying into something with a proven past & future worth is sensible and that market place positioning can only be achieved over a very long period. So right now l open my garage door & get a thrill out of owning a Moto Guzzi, a Chinese bike (even one better) isn't going to give me that, nothing wrong with being aspirational & wanting a product. I could wear a Casio but l wear an Ollech & Wajs, they both tell the time adequately.....
Most manufacturers use Chinese parts or indeed the majority of parts are Chinese in origin including some premium brands .the current Chinese manufacturers have really upped their game and offer very competent motorcycles at a price point that is hard to ignore. The people that have the moral affectation do as you say only do so until it becomes to difficult to apply to real everyday life ,much the same with the stop oil protests all stud there in their man made clothing having driven there ect ect ,any way rant over .Great video and some very relevant points well made Dave 👍
Because in main land Europe we aren`t such snobs like british are sorry to say but it is true how many morons with money have BMW`S 10 years old but only 2 or 3000 miles cos just ride a few times to some event to show off, many Voge 900 and CFmotos 800MTS in Europe have over 20000 miles not kilometers in less than 2 years
Japanese bikes of the 1970’s - the ones that finished off the British bike industry - had multiple faults. They were expensive - remember the days of Hire Purchase? - the chrome rusted at the first sign of rain, the tyres were made of plastic, the spark plug caps earthed out and disintegrated in the wet, the disc brakes didn’t work, they had abysmal handling until the shocks were changed out, your exhaust blew its innards out and rusted through on a regular basis, etc, etc. We’ve forgotten how much better all bikes are compared to years ago.
The Honda nx 500 is not £3000 more can be had for £6895.00 and I suspect if you bought both bikes new today the Honda will be worth a lot more in two years time. If Chinese bikes proof to be good this will only become apparent over the next 5 years or so. I personally know where I would put my money at the moment. Great vid as always though showcasing our beautiful Yorkshire.
I took a test ride on the nx, and if you put the adventure pack and everything from voge on it the price you pay would reach at least £3000, I chose to pocket the difference and I sold my triumph tiger 660 for voge , and just remember all bike are made in china and then assembled in county of origin
"Second star to the right and straight on 'till morning"...Indeed, my friend. Well said and so true. A good looking mount that leaves enough in your pocket for the necessities of life. SS in commiefornia, USA.
Great post Dave, Great Bike, made in the same country as my apple I-phone, the only issue I have noticed watching many reviews of these Chinese bikes is parts availability
I totally agree Dave these chinese bikes are here to stay. I test rode the 525 great looking bike great value for money. Decided to get the benelli 702X needed that bit extra power as i do a lot of 2 up riding with the wife on the back. I found the gearbox a lot smoother on the benelli with the extra get up and go. Ive absolutly no regrets at all. real value for money without breaking the bank
Couldn’t agree more with any of your comments - as a lifelong motorcyclist of 45+ years the overriding factor for me is comfort and value for money. To start rubbishing Chinese bikes is utter hypocrisy when nobody, no one, is immune from a multitude of Chinese products being used daily. If someone’s morals are so high they’d have to chuck out half their house on that basis alone, starting with their TVs, apple and android products!
Late watching this one, we are on the same page and you have nailed the current customer's wish and need with regards to the style of bike with relation to required end use and expectations. In these current times when any distractions from the mundane requires us to spend pennies few of us have, the Chinese through a ruthless need to survive in a global motorcycle market have provided bikes at a price that we can just about rise too. As you say, a few privileged few can afford a Ducati desert storm or a new GS. But to the average motorcyclist, there is a light in the dim reality of current financial restrictions that gives us that exit door from the rabbit hole of life. These bikes will redefine current markets hopefully.
Talking about size and weight, being in my seventies i thought I'd give a DCT a go, so last month i took a NC750X DCT out for a demo. First problem was just trying to get on it, I tried mounting it like a horse but my size and weight was a problem. The seat height was no problem but getting my leg over or off certainly was. I loved the DCT but unfortunately i bruised the inside of my right leg and pulled my hamstring, getting off the thing. The bike cost 9 grand and they offered me 2600 on my 18 month old GoldStar with 675 miles on the clock. Obviously no sale.
Love my voge ds525x better than a honda 500nx, and I'm so glad I sold my triumph tiger 660 and bought this bike , I don't care where bike comes from as long as quality is there and the voge has it and yes I'm at that special age and have spare cash to go on more adventure
You can only run this bike on E5 fuel . Something I don't think the manufacturers are making clear enough . What with the short service intervals and the higher cost of fuel this will soon mount up . But I that said I really like this bike 👍
Usability and affordability; these are the key issues now. Your insight into the future sounds right to me. I am starting to put behind me my inherent English aversion to all things economically Chinese, although even there, like us all, I am a hypocrite. I have a pair of Quad loudspeakers, designed in Britain and manufactured In ROC! and they are fantastic.The BRITISH market, such as it was immediately post-war, was soundly thrashed by Japan and we deserved what we got largely, although it was a shame that so many jobs were lost. China is fast taking over the world, not with guns and bombs but by the means of 'Economic colonialism' in Africa for example. Japanese manufacturers and others, beware! Anyway the bike looks great and I also think deliberate retailer under supply should help residual prices here. Clever again on their part, and shows they are here for the longer. term. Your review style is top notch for me🎉
For us as a nation who once dominated the world of manufacturing quality products to one that imports the scrapings from the bottom of the barrel,perfectly sums up the Britain of today quite admirably unfortunately.
Oh boy, you opened the channel to all kinds of controversy now. Something in conflict with my perception of the channel that had lovely content like the in search of inner peace video on Norman. On this video, I respectfully could not disagree more! After 40+ years in sales to manufacturing in the USA, I have seen the damage done to average working class people thanks to unbridled capitalism and free market economics. When countries subsidize manufacturers to strategically undercut other countries manufacturers and run them out of business, people lose good paying jobs as well as posing national security risks. Corporate management was happy to go along with it because they increased profits and raised their own pay at the expense of the workers. The average US CEO makes over 300 times the average worker wage in their companies. That’s why so many people are barely scraping by today. Japan did it to us in 70’s and 80’s and now China has been for the past two decades. In addition, to sell in their country, you have to give them your technology. In the USA politicians are realistically talking about tariffs in the 60-100% range which would kill this market for the Chinese made products. So forget about parts support after that. I think your view is too simplistic and misguided. Not everything is as black and white as your 100% or nothing take on Chinese products. We here I think are learning our lesson from Covid that we need to bring manufacturing back to our country for the sake of our people and national security. On another topic, the background scenery in this video is beautiful and can’t help but bring peace into this otherwise crazy world!
Manufacturing in the UK was destroyed by the Thatcher government from 1979 favouring financial services which were quickly deregulated leading eventually to the 2008 crash. Had we not followed this corrosive ideology here we might have retained a competitive edge and at least stood a fighting chance in the new world. Thatcherism and Reaganomics saw to it that the profligate greed of hedge funds, venture capitalists, equity dealers and the rest ran riot and the working and middle classes are now poorer as a result…..so now we can only afford the Chinese stuff….we no longer have a real choice
They are raving about the 900 in Spain. At last people are seeing through the Chinese prejudices. They will be pushing the main manufacturers hard very soon.
You're not wrong. For adventure biking in the UK a 450 cc may well be enough. However, for riders in say the home countires we have to ride for 200 miles before we can find any nice places to ride through. So we need a bike with a good bit of ooomph! to get us there. Big BMW, Triumphs KTMs etc are just a bit too much for riding the back roads and lanes. All in all the 450MT and the Voge you are on here are probably just right. Not forgetting the new Enfield 450 thing.
Just saw this in an article this morning: "The U.S. Commerce Department recently proposed rules that would ban vehicles with software and hardware links to China and Russia by model year 2027." So any vehicle that has connectivity to your phone or other device will be banned and we will not see the likes of bikes like this and CF Moto, etc. I wonder if this will effect KTM and BMW as well, knowing that some of their bikes have some Chinese parts that may fall into this category. So, I hope you enjoy them as we yanks soon can't.
Here in the USA, virtually everything we buy is made in China nowadays. So, why not motorcycles? For me, I think it's good for the overall motorcycle market that these Chinese brands have become available. They give us more choice, and keep the other manufacturers on their toes with respect to model offerings and price (though we are only starting to see that). I don't agree with Chinese politics, but let the politicians sort that out. We obviously have a very robust trade relationship with China that's good for both countries, depending on your point of view. Let our differences remain our differences while enjoying the trade relationship.
I took that very bike out yesterday & did 120 miles on it. In many ways I was shocked as to how good it was - the ergonomics suited me perfectly (5'9" / 31" inseam), it was comfortable, with compliant suspension & light, easy handling. Good brakes, good tyres out of the box (Metzler Tourance) , good protection from the screen/fairing/hand guards so that even at 6 / 7 degrees I didn't get cold, flexible motor with enough grunt without having to flog it & enough performance for me (same A2 compatible power output as my Interceptor) . It seemed well finished as well as well specified. And all at a very compelling price point But as it stands, I wouldn't buy one. While the ever-present vibrations didn't cause me numb fingers at the time while riding, this morning my hands are "tingling" from the experience nearly 24 hours later. The gearchange action is really out of place with the rest of the bike - while all the other controls are light & work smoothly and easily, the gearchange is stiff, rather "mushy" in feel and the lever travel overly long. It spoiled an otherwise very enjoyable ride. The first thing I noticed on getting back on my Himalayan was the light, positive short travel gearchange. And it is too loud at 98 dba according to the VIN plate, which isn't compliant with Austrian noise limits in the Tirol (95 dba). My Himalayan was noticably quieter on my return journey home & my 5 1/2 year old Interceptor is also under 95 dba. May not be an issue for some (many ? ) but motorcycle noise is something of an issue on the Continent ATM & I would not want to have a bike that I was limited in where I could use it because it was too loud for local noise limits. These points may well have been addressed already, as there was a "595" shown at EICMA recently. If (or, more likely, when) those issues get sorted, it would be difficult for me to argue against one of these and, even so, it is probably the nearest bike I have ridden for decades that comes out of the showroom "ready to tour" without having to raid the accessories catalogue or aftermarket. suppliers.
the CF 450 could have sold 10x more - the reason they are sold out is because they supplied so few - the supply for next spring is pathetic as well, very small numbers coming into the country, thousands should be landing but we will be lucky to see a couple of hundred in 2025.
I've heard that as well from 2 local dealers, one of the dealers said he wouldn't touch CFMOTO because KTM are the distributors and he didn't want to deal with them.The other couldn't get the bikes in the number he wanted, the MT range being the more desirable bikes.
l guess time will tell...l remember when if you bought a Nikon, Canon, Yashica, Minolta with the little gold sticker on the pentaprism it was made in Japan...and very good they were to. Same went for their Bikes ....they were put together like a Sewing Machine compared to most Brit Bikes......perhaps the Chinese will travel the same route.....
Bit late to this one but been to the Motorcycle 2024 show today to look for my first bike after gaining my full licence . I’m at a dilemma. I’m down to 2 bikes I really like, the DS525X and the Honda NX500. I really really like the Voge but I have some reservations. 1. What’s the resale value or trade in value gonna be in say 2 years, or will even a dealer take it in part ex? 2. Parts availability in the future for these bikes. The Voge really ticks all my boxes particularly with all the kit it has. It makes the Honda look really basic. But in 2 or 3 years time if both of these are for sale, which one is gonna sell the easiest? My heart says buy the Voge but my gut says the Honda
Great vid and sums up the status quo. I have my reservations about the Ccp but I honestly do not see me or many others making a difference to the future regarding Chinese products. Like you said there are folk who will state they would never buy one because of their strong feelings about the Chinese culture and their wrong doings but then they will support a Saudi owned football team and drive a German or Japanese car despite their tainted history. I think those that puff out their chests and shoulders are really only appealing to themselves as people will buy them as the prices are good and it looks like they are tackling the dodgy reliability reputation of previous years. And let's face it what isn't made in China now? I bought some Japanese snacks the other day only to find they were yes you guessed it, made in China! The big players in the motorcycle world will have to take a serious look at this as it is a big concern to them. However I think the road ahead for us isn't necessarily about where a bike is made and the politics behind it but whether we will be able to ride our roads or afford to with Draconian ideas floating around by governments hell bent of stopping us from travelling. We should be more focussed on that and enjoy what we have now.
I tend to agree that the mid range affordable bikes are indeed the future. Another factor that may influence this is the "average" (if there is such a thing ) motorcyclist is becoming older and the bemoth adventure bikes and tourers are just getting too much. Im fortunate enough to own a 1250 GSA and an RE Himalayan. If i didnt tour two up i wouldnt have such a big bike in my garage. In fact, my himalayan comes out more than my GSA and it never fails to put a smile on my face. This week i rode with a friend whos just bought the 450 Himalayan. It well screwed together, has a 3 year warranty and cost under 6k. Solo for sure, its all the bike id really need.
Just about anything you buy now is probably made in China , so it would be very inconvenient if you stopped buying from there on principle . Everything Ive ever bought from there has been brilliant , perhaps I have just been lucky. What really gets my goat is why we cant get our manufacturing base back so that we can make the stuff instead of paying China to do it . Madness that we make bugger all any more. Sorry for the rant, lovely video again !.
BTW Dave you have a good relationship with Appleyards so could you ask for a change of their policy of not allowing a passenger on test rides please. I prefer to take my good lady on the back whenever possible, so my choice of bike always depends on how comfortable and secure she feels on that there back seat. Thank you in advance.
Love mine to bits done a Scotland tour and a Wales tour so far, great bike after coming from a Kawasaki versus 650 don't get me wrong some of the quality is questionable compared to the Kawasaki but more than happy with the Voge 👍
Do you think MotoGB will be around long enough to provide a lasting back up service for the machines they import? It has been rumoured that the current owner is more interested in the property market and not motorcycles.
I come from an industry were upto 10years ago was dominated by Japanese, Taiwanese & European manufacturing. Since then, the Chinese have not only entered the market, but have out done & out priced the others, to the extent that 99% of market is manufactured in China now. Whether we like it or not, the world has given their manufacturing to China & China have been rubbing their hands in joy, because of it. What we must know about Chinese manufacturing is, they improve constantly, they seek for improvements & in a very quick way. In my opinion China will take over the entire motorbike market by 2035. A better product & better value. SIMPLE.
Thanks again being the owner of a VoGE DS525X I might be slightly biased , but you need to know something which you brought up in the video conserning the HONDA CB500X , ITS NOT MADE in JAPAN but TIAWAN , the capital letters were done on purpose .
We cut our cloth to the feel of the economy. When it comes to bikes, for most folks its the experience that counts not cc, bhp, heavy lbs or heavy gpb spent. Modern mid-weight fit the times and due to lower weight offer a better experience 95% of the time. Why stress the finances which in the end diminishes the experience?
@@thebingleywheeler💯 Should be gbp not gpb, but dyslexia a bit like picking the wrong bike! Focus on your true needs for a while rather than let the testicles do the thinking 😂
I come from an industry were upto 10years ago was dominated by Japanese, Taiwanese & European manufacturing. Since then, the Chinese have not only entered the market, but have out done & out priced the others, to the extent that 99% of market is manufactured in China now. Whether we like it or not, the world has given their manufacturing to China & China have been rubbing their hands in joy, because of it. What we must know about Chinese manufacturing is, they improve constantly, they seek for improvements & in a very quick way. In my opinion China will take over the entire motorbike market by 2035. A better product & better value. SIMPLE.
On the value for money thing. What do you think these bikes, with all the bells and whistles of technology, will stand the test of time and British winters. What state will they be in ten years time. I have had Chinese phones for years now but in reality they need replacing after a couple of years. Has anyone got a quote from the likes of we buy any bike on a two year old one? Cheers for your thoughts Dave
Well. It would appear that the Chinese are upping their game in a similar way that the Indians did at Royal Enfield. In the end it is the consumer who benefits with more choices and more competitive pricing. I paid a premium for my W800 over similar bikes from certain other manufactures. Not because I don't trust other manufacturers but because the W800 has certain attributes not present in other bikes and those particular attributes were important to me and I could afford to pay a premium for those attributes. I can certainly see how economic conditions would prevent a large portion of the population from making the same decision I did and buy based primarily on price. As bad as inflation and cost of living is here in Canada I suspect the economic situation in the UK is a little worse right now. Hopefully political reason and common sense will prevail and conditions will improve. BJ
China have copied the BMW Mini & vastly improved upon it. A better product & a much better price. All consumers want the best product at the best price & so China will take over the entire motorbike market by 2035.
Why do steam trains in the distance make you go blurry eyed 😂. But seriously, people that have been into bikes for many years remember how quickly the Chinese bikes used to go bad mechanically and cosmetically. Are the new breed any different? I ask because i was thinking of swapping my t100 for one of these.
Chinese bikes are built to a price. You might buy one and have no issues for 5 or 10,000 miles but at some point after this the problems will almost certainly start creeping in with premature wear and tear. Japanese bikes are the most reliable bikes on the planet , if you are thinking about buying a new Chinese motorcycle you are better off spending the same amount of money buying a used Japanese motorcycle with a full service history. If looked after and serviced it will probably last forever and you should also have no problems getting spare parts for many years to come. As with most things in life , you get what you pay for at the end of the day.
@rufuscapsti,said you spent a fortune on your Harley, and still ended up with an average motorcycle...spent a fortune on my Harley,,haven't even reached average!...Harley's are a breed apart 👍🤣🤣
Weather you like dislike about these bikes they are here to stay. All this was said about Japanese bikes way back What as to be said is Japanese and European bikes have got bigger and more expensive. You take your choice
I have no problem with China…they’re providing a service doing trade…that’s trade, and not to be confused with America and its vassals exporting war and regime change worldwide. If that’s controversial folks then do a bit of research
America : 160 military bases on foreign soil projecting power and war. China: 2 (Ethiopia and Vietnam) Russia: 3. (Georgia, Armenia and Kazakhstan). Yet people always say China is an evil empire bent on world domination 😂😂
I have to agree, its great that they don't have the environmental and health and safety regulations that hamper western industries, not to mention the wages they pay their workers. I do worry a little about the quality of the steel they use, but then I read they have to comply with certain ISO standards, just like they did with anchor chains for ships that allegedly broke, however ships breaking loose from moorings is no concern to us. I think we should support the Chinese industry as they are a struggling democratic country and need every advantage we can give them. We don't need such industry here, we got a thriving service economy, the hotel trade is doing particularly well at the moment, and the building trade will boom very soon. Who needs to make things to sell abroad to earn foreign currency, certainly not us.
@@alanbarsteward7630nicely put! Who needs values when you spend your pension on imported slave labour products? You can leave difficult questions like how to earn a living to you children.
Anything with a tablet on the dash has no future with me, I don't mind a small LCD display beside analogue clocks but tablets on the dash look cheap and nasty and age fast, analogue dials are timeless and look much better, the Triumph Bonneville T100/120 for example. I just think too many bikes have these TFT displays now and they got too much information and many even have android auto and car play, this is ridiculous on a bike tempting riders to look down a lot more than they should. Honda are a prime example of no more analogue displays except on the cub and shadow, the Shadow isnot even available in Europe anymore but I would never buy a modern Honda because all their bikes now look the same with just minor differences, for example the NT1100 is supposed to be the Successor to the Deauville, it's just a slightly different looking African Twin that sits lower down, hideous looking yoke with a big tablet on the dash. Honda offered no replacement for the Deauville or Pan European two well loved bikes and very sought after 2nd hand, if Honda made a real Deauville replacement people would buy it. Anyway just my opinion.
Of course they are cheaper, the Chinese don’t have the R&D costs, though their Engineers do have diplomas in reverse and badge engineering. Ironically though it looks like CFmoto's rep might take a battering due to their association with KTM! When the Chinese design their own engines and chassis then they will be of interest.
Meanwhile, back in the real world... China has more annual STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Maths) graduates than US, UK, EU and Japan combined. While our roads deteriorate into cart tracks China is building roads, railways, airports and seaports. Wake up!
@@mickgarbutt3553 I know they are making great strides in ev cars and hifi etc. but their bikes are still just copies, albeit well made ones now. Hence of no interest to me.
Thought that steam train was a perfect metaphor. If we buy Chinese bikes en masse then the choice in the brands we currently enjoy will go, they will stop making them or importing them. Simple as. I will not buy one. We have lost so many things in this Country over recent decades, it’s a race to the bottom. Chinese everything at the bottom.
@@martyndunn1905 no doubt Martyn. Doesn’t mean I like it or approve of the way everything is being moved overseas and being built down to a price. Don’t blame China I blame our pathetic politicians. My father in law did 42years on the plate mill at Scunthorpe Steel and in its heyday employed something like 40,000 men. Now it’s under 3000 and on its knees. Like Port Talbot. Why? Because we are importing cheapo steel, coal, wood hip, goodness knows what else from all over when we could make it here. The whole green thing is a scam, a con. You buy your Chinese bike if you want. I would rather walk.
Do you ride a Japanese or German bike? Motorcycles used to be "working class transport" , now they're (mainstream brands) just fashion accessories and toys for the wealthy.
I disagree. Not because of the reasons you give though but because of the thing that will be the beginning of the end for all motorcycling. The Eu and uk mandade for the exclusion of combustion vehicles draws ever closer, and there is no electric future for motorcycling outside of limited range city riding. The future of motorcycle manufacturing lies not in hands of the consumer but rests in the hands of politicians unless thing change dramatically in the near future. The posturing over chinese versus the current crop of manufacturers is wasted energy. If we are to continue enjoying what little freedoms remain via riding motocycles then we all need to wake up to what lies ahead.
Sorry, can't fully agree. The future of motorcycles, irrespective where are made, or how they are powered, will be light weight small capacity motorcycles.The average age of riders in the Western world will guarantee this. It is already the case in Asia.
The well established motorcycle manufacturers have become greedy and complacent. They haven't really had anybody else giving them pause for thought, until now. At the very least once these Chinese bikes come onto the used market they will provide a much cheaper entry cost to motorcycling than we've seen for a long time, not counting cost of insurance. I do try to avoid Chinese products when I can but it's not easy. I'm sure plenty of my money still makes its way to China and hence helps to prop up the CCP regime. I don't think any worse of people that do choose to buy Chinese. As with all things it's complicated, at least for people who think further than the end of their nose.
Mate, I just have one thing to add to your already brilliant case, if Chinese motorcycles were a reason not to buy them, we would see a lot of Harleys on road sadly we see more of the Chinese made or Chinese parts laden bikes on road than American Made Freedom and Democracy Loaded so called reliable and ethical motorcycles... People who have these opinions rarely put there money where their mouth is!
You said this bike is around £6000 and is £3000 cheaper than the Honda nx500 actually it is only £800 cheaper !!!!!! And you should not be telling people what to think regarding chinese motorcycles it's not a police state yet. Your chanel is so much better when you review motorcycles than it is lecturing us on our morals.
So as I said in the video the “equivalent” Honda would be up to 3k more….so have a look at the cost of the NX500 and add on all the things which come as standard on the Voge….so Spot Lights, Crash Bars, Full 3 piece hard luggage etc…..there’s your 3k 😂👍🏻
I've seen ( and sat on) the Vote 900 yesterday in Slaidburn. The gentleman riding it was "running it in" prior to its handover to the press. It has everything included, steering damper, aluminium panniers/topbox, tyre pressure sensors, tubeless etc, etc. It was well finished, appears to be good quality, in truth it was a very nice bike. Furthermore, when l sat on it l got both feet flat on the ground, which at my age 68 and waning strength was confidence inspiring. The O.T.R. price was said to be around £ 9000 he said. As you said, Chinese bikes are here to stay, however, the problem that l see is the aging motorcycle buyers/riders. There are very few newcomers to the motorcycling world. It's grey hair or no hair.
Love beautiful Slaidburn and the surrounding roads are to die for.
Took delivery of mine on August 1st and have done about 1000 miles so far and I've got to say I think it's great . The only thing I've done to change it is put a non reflective screen protect on it . All the important parts as far as I'm concerned are good recognised brands tyres, suspension and ignition . The biggest surprise was the handling paired with the comfort makes it an absolute joy for all day trips.
In my opinion it made too much sense to ignore , I'm not bothered in the least how much it'll be worth in 12 , 24 months time the fun factor here and now is what I'm interested in after all I once lost £2000 on a triumph street triple .
It now sits alongside my yamaha fazer 1000 and ducati monster and it's not out of place and to be honest it currently the steed of choice 😂.
Badge snobbery and loyalty are now proving to be expensive traits.
@@derekskinner8682 Could you tell me if the screen protector has eliminated reflections on the screen much please?
@RichardS-qh8mi yes it's made the world of difference. 👍
@@derekskinner8682 Thank you - would you have the link please, as the ones I’ve looked at seemed mixed reviews and a bit ropey to be honest!
Recently sold my beloved BMW 1200 RT so we could keep a roof over our heads. Rode all my life and just turned 60, I think a lot of families are in a similar situation, my bike was a luxury/ hobby that I miss very much. Hopefully things will improve and I’ll get back on one in the future that being the case I’m certainly going to look at this machine 👍
Sad for your situation. At 67 I have downsized to a Meteor, Hunter and a Honda Grom. Believe it or the Grom is my #1 choice for local rides. Costs very little and nothing to run. 200 miles on 6 litres.
Just keep riding.
Good luck.
Oh that’s sad mate having to sell your bike ! It’s therapeutic riding as well 👍 don’t worry starmer will be looking after us 👍🤦♂️
Interesting discussion about the ethics of buying Chinese. I’m one who wouldn’t want to buy a Chinese machine and I’m not sure that it is the simple binary decision you make out. The problem is that there are virtually no complex manufactured products which don’t contain Chinese components. So long as people are aware or are discussing the fact that China is a repressive dictatorship and its suppression of workers rights is a necessary condition to the low cost of production….. then that’s good. People need to make the intellectual link between their consumer choices and the ‘shot to bits’ UK economy.
@@56Model30 You know nothing about China ... nowadays they have more rights nd better standard of life that us here in UK and most of Europe
Sold my Honda Blackbird to pay off my credit cards. It took me Ten years to get back into biking seven years ago. I lost my enthusiasm and confidence as I have now reached seventy years of age. Moral of the story is don’t leave it too long. Best wishes.
Enjoy your down to earth and clear approach to the reviews and the effortless/natural way you introduce them, none of this 'welcome to my youtube channel' cheesy nonsense. Keep up the good work!
Thank you Simon 😊
I have just sold a 2004 multistrada 1000 and a Triumph 900 scrambler and bought a CFMOTO 800mt for £6799 and its fantastic, most comfortable bike ive ever owned and the fit and finish is as good as anything i have ever owned in 50yrs of riding, dont knock them until you have tried them. VFM speaks for its self!
I think the only thing preventing some riders, taking a punt on a Chinese brand bike, is uncertainty about continued dealer back up & part availability . One of my bikes was manufactured in China , but the difference is, it is Japanese branded , which gives me more confidence regards long term backup, plus parts availability . I have no doubts about the Chinese manufacturers ability to produce motorcycles to a good standard , they have all the latest tech & precision machinery to achieve it , as they are now proving it . They just need to back it up , like the Japanese brands did , with proper franchised dealers & sustained parts availability ,to increase the buyers confidence in the brand . Also at the moment ,the short term reviews are all we have to go on. Reviewers who actually take a punt on the budget Chinese bikes , tend to be the type of rider , that change their bikes almost as often as their underwear & get rid after a year or two of ownership , before they get lumbered with any potential issues. Next they have a new bike reveal , it certainly won’t be a budget Chinese bike , it’s more likely to be a well established brand like BMW , Triumph .an Italian jobby or Japanese . So subscribers never get to see how ,the Chinese bikes really shape up , long term all weather high mileage use after 5 to 10 years of ownership . What we need is a UA-camr , to get rid of all their bikes , & just own & ride one Chinese manufactured bike at least 5 days a week in all weather for 5 years & 50 ,000 miles at least , to get a proper test & evaluation of a bike .
So , do you think Chinese bikes are, how to put it, disposable in the medium term?
@@stevet599 Owners will have no choice but to dispose of Chinese bikes in the medium term , unless the bikes have sustainable and consistent manufacturer / dealer & parts back up equal to the established popular brands .
Agreed
Nice one Dave, yes Chinese built MC's are here to stay the build quality has improved, they cost less and you get a lot of extras for your money. For example, with the CF Moto Adventure 700, that I test rode recently, (what a suprise that was), you get fully adjustable KYB suspension front and rear, Bosch ignition, Pirelli tyres, Juan brakes and a Kawasaki designed bored out engine, also a 4 year warranty. Yes the twin engine is an old design with a 180 degree crank, but it's bullet proof and has been thoroughly tested.
Exactly so Stephen
Morning Dave.
One word, "accessibility". Somewhat overused - but in the case of bikes like the Voge DS525X entirely appropriate. I've never owned a 1200GS, but I've had a couple of RT's. I'm not a very big fella, and these bikes were always at the limit of what I could manage due to their size and weight. Whilst a slightly different use case (tourer) I was always confident enough whilst on the go, but it definitely caused me a subconscious mental block with regards to where I'd take them. But, I reckon even bigger fellas feel this too if they're being completely honest? My Classic 350 changed everything for me as the ideal adventure tool and consequently I've put more miles on that little bike in 18 months than any other bike I've owned in recent times. But it has it's limits of course. For true adventures, further afield you might need something with a little more capability. Bikes like the DS525X might be the perfect solution. Light, capable, well-equipped and such good value - they might just be the ideal bike for exploring, solo or two-up.
Spot on analysis there Philip 👍🏻
Absolutely right. It's a mixture of brand snobbery and prejudice. We probably all own products either made in China or containing Chinese components, so people just need to get over themselves and celebrate the fact these bikes make motorcycling more accessible.
But, for many it's a very bitter pill to swallow, myself included! I guess it's more political than anything.
I own a Guzzi and a CFMoto. Happy with both bikes. They are different but they both have their quirks. I've been waiting 10 months for a body panel for the Guzzi (2022) not good for a company that's been around for over 100 years. The CF could do with better fueling. This is common across their models. 2 software updates later and it's still not perfect, but at least you don't have to go into the dealer for the updates.We don't get all the Chinese brands here in Australia but I would be happy to try any of them. Thanks for your video. It's true and honest. The bikes are built well at a great price. The top brands need to get with the program or lose sales, it's already happening with KTM.
Got one a few months ago, to accompany my BMW tourer in the garage, and impressed so far. Easy to ride from day 1, nice light clutch (as arthritis sets in), almost too low seat height as I’m 6ft, it’s capable and economical, good features, good fairing, handling, tyres, brakes, instrumentation…..all good. Fuel economy amazing. The lighting is brilliant too. Try one!
Great video and awesome little bike. Haven't seen this brand in my neck of the woods but i have noticed its hard to find any product these days that wasn't at least in part produced in China. I remember talking to my mates about this coming to fruition about 20 years ago.
Good Morning Dave , i agree with you 100% , back in 1973 i bought a brand new suzuki 250 because i couldn't buy a british 250 , now in the present day i won't think twice about buying a chinese bike they offer great value for your money & are full spec'd up , whats not to like , as always take care & ride safe
Bang on Steve 👍🏻
Not had a problem with my Chinese Zontes in 4 years. I have a Honda and a Harley but I use the Zontes the most.
The rear shocks on the Zontes are crap, they had crazy hard compression, my wife found it back breaking as a passenger, so I changed them for €60.
I hate to think what's been spent on my Harley to still end up with an average motorcycle, whereas the Zontes has been great, straight out of the box.
I am a red-blooded patriotic American and I own a jawa and an oral that's made in Russia. I started with Japanese bikes and rode Japanese motorcycles for 20 years before I bought my first English motorcycle and now I have nine English motorcycles one jawa the URL and my Harley-Davidson Sportster as well as my genuine Vespa scooter. I don't care where it's built as long as it has quality built in. What cost $2 an hour to make in China cost $100 an hour to fix in the Western country
Totally agree with your conclusions. The fact is that most if not all mainstream manufacturers make either all or some part of their products in the developing world whether that be Thailand, Malaysia, China or elsewhere.
Exactly Colin 👍🏻
I do you like your style! I have ridden two voges, a 300 rally which vibrated my nuts off and a ac525x. Which i liked. However i found them unrefined. Yes, i want affordability as i also have a family, a house, a car, like you said. So, I have bought a used honda deauville 700. It has all the useability I need, it looks lovely in red and it still costs less than the two chinese bikes! Go figure!!!
I approached my criteria as what will cause me the least amount of financial stress.
Well done Dave you really know how to sell a motorcycle, I hope that Appleyards look after you as well as you promote them.
Andy
Cheers Andy well if they don’t…..watch out for the video! 😂
Heyho Dave! Motorcycles used to be working class transport, nowadays it seems that "big brands" are only interested in catering to the wealthy who perceive bikes as toys or fashion accessories. If (🙄) there's another major economic "correction" many of the old brands may disappear because we'll all be riding the chinese equivalent of the Honda CT90.
I recall owners getting financially hurt by Chinese bike manufacturers, it's fresh in my memory. But everything changes, l spend a lot of time in Spain and Chinese bikes are everywhere now, these are commuting tools, not leisure bikes like in the UK, so the reliabity must be there for them to be succeeding, great. Still, they don't have anything l want to buy yet in the UK market (retro/cruiser) so l am happy for other brave buyers to do the long term test riding. It's about market share, they are not doing Joe public a favour with these prices, and when that share grows so will their prices.
Brand snobbery? I am happy to admit to that, it's nothing to be ashamed of either, buying into something with a proven past & future worth is sensible and that market place positioning can only be achieved over a very long period. So right now l open my garage door & get a thrill out of owning a Moto Guzzi, a Chinese bike (even one better) isn't going to give me that, nothing wrong with being aspirational & wanting a product. I could wear a Casio but l wear an Ollech & Wajs, they both tell the time adequately.....
Another top point of view of these fantastic bikes 👍
Most manufacturers use Chinese parts or indeed the majority of parts are Chinese in origin including some premium brands .the current Chinese manufacturers have really upped their game and offer very competent motorcycles at a price point that is hard to ignore. The people that have the moral affectation do as you say only do so until it becomes to difficult to apply to real everyday life ,much the same with the stop oil protests all stud there in their man made clothing having driven there ect ect ,any way rant over .Great video and some very relevant points well made Dave 👍
I was in the Voge dealer in Jerez in Spain and he told me he had 67 sold orders for the 900.
Because in main land Europe we aren`t such snobs like british are sorry to say but it is true how many morons with money have BMW`S 10 years old but only 2 or 3000 miles cos just ride a few times to some event to show off, many Voge 900 and CFmotos 800MTS in Europe have over 20000 miles not kilometers in less than 2 years
Japanese bikes of the 1970’s - the ones that finished off the British bike industry - had multiple faults. They were expensive - remember the days of Hire Purchase? - the chrome rusted at the first sign of rain, the tyres were made of plastic, the spark plug caps earthed out and disintegrated in the wet, the disc brakes didn’t work, they had abysmal handling until the shocks were changed out, your exhaust blew its innards out and rusted through on a regular basis, etc, etc. We’ve forgotten how much better all bikes are compared to years ago.
The Honda nx 500 is not £3000 more can be had for £6895.00 and I suspect if you bought both bikes new today the Honda will be worth a lot more in two years time. If Chinese bikes proof to be good this will only become apparent over the next 5 years or so. I personally know where I would put my money at the moment. Great vid as always though showcasing our beautiful Yorkshire.
With a engine a seat and not much more , now had all the stuff fitted in a CFMOTO 450 mt or VOGE 525 dsx and see how much that Honda will cost you ?
@@luisvalentim99Good comment.
@graemetaylor629 how much does it cost once you’ve fitted crash bars, panniers, top box etc?
@@thebingleywheeler it goes up to nearly £10000 and still some stuff not even available has option .
I took a test ride on the nx, and if you put the adventure pack and everything from voge on it the price you pay would reach at least £3000, I chose to pocket the difference and I sold my triumph tiger 660 for voge , and just remember all bike are made in china and then assembled in county of origin
"Second star to the right and straight on 'till morning"...Indeed, my friend. Well said and so true. A good looking mount that leaves enough in your pocket for the necessities of life.
SS in commiefornia, USA.
Great post Dave, Great Bike, made in the same country as my apple I-phone, the only issue I have noticed watching many reviews of these Chinese bikes is parts availability
I totally agree Dave these chinese bikes are here to stay.
I test rode the 525 great looking bike great value for money.
Decided to get the benelli 702X needed that bit extra power as i do a lot of 2 up riding with the wife on the back.
I found the gearbox a lot smoother on the benelli with the extra get up and go.
Ive absolutly no regrets at all.
real value for money without breaking the bank
Couldn’t agree more with any of your comments - as a lifelong motorcyclist of 45+ years the overriding factor for me is comfort and value for money. To start rubbishing Chinese bikes is utter hypocrisy when nobody, no one, is immune from a multitude of Chinese products being used daily. If someone’s morals are so high they’d have to chuck out half their house on that basis alone, starting with their TVs, apple and android products!
Absolutely! 👍🏻
"A Jack of all trades, a master of several "
Late watching this one, we are on the same page and you have nailed the current customer's wish and need with regards to the style of bike with relation to required end use and expectations. In these current times when any distractions from the mundane requires us to spend pennies few of us have, the Chinese through a ruthless need to survive in a global motorcycle market have provided bikes at a price that we can just about rise too. As you say, a few privileged few can afford a Ducati desert storm or a new GS. But to the average motorcyclist, there is a light in the dim reality of current financial restrictions that gives us that exit door from the rabbit hole of life. These bikes will redefine current markets hopefully.
Perfectly put and I’ve been watching your 900 DSX coverage with great interest a bike I’d be happy to own
Talking about size and weight, being in my seventies i thought I'd give a DCT a go, so last month i took a NC750X DCT out for a demo. First problem was just trying to get on it, I tried mounting it like a horse but my size and weight was a problem. The seat height was no problem but getting my leg over or off certainly was. I loved the DCT but unfortunately i bruised the inside of my right leg and pulled my hamstring, getting off the thing. The bike cost 9 grand and they offered me 2600 on my 18 month old GoldStar with 675 miles on the clock. Obviously no sale.
Stand on the pegs to get off and on..no need to raise you leg
I've heard the resale on the Goldstar is pretty poor but to offer that is an absolute joke
Love my voge ds525x better than a honda 500nx, and I'm so glad I sold my triumph tiger 660 and bought this bike , I don't care where bike comes from as long as quality is there and the voge has it and yes I'm at that special age and have spare cash to go on more adventure
You can only run this bike on E5 fuel . Something I don't think the manufacturers are making clear enough . What with the short service intervals and the higher cost of fuel this will soon mount up . But I that said I really like this bike 👍
Usability and affordability; these are the key issues now.
Your insight into the future sounds right to me.
I am starting to put behind me my inherent English aversion to all things economically Chinese, although even there, like us all, I am a hypocrite. I have a pair of Quad loudspeakers, designed in Britain and manufactured
In ROC! and they are fantastic.The BRITISH market, such as it was immediately post-war, was soundly thrashed by Japan and we deserved what we got largely, although it was a shame that so many jobs were lost.
China is fast taking over the world, not with guns and bombs but by the means of 'Economic colonialism' in Africa for example.
Japanese manufacturers and others, beware!
Anyway the bike looks great and I also think deliberate retailer under supply should help residual prices here.
Clever again on their part, and shows they are here for the longer. term.
Your review style is top notch for me🎉
Thank you Graeme and I concur fully with the points you make
For us as a nation who once dominated the world of manufacturing quality products to one that imports the scrapings from the bottom of the barrel,perfectly sums up the Britain of today quite admirably unfortunately.
Britain never produced high quality cars or motorcycles.
@seanobrieYes it did.n5520
@@michaeldeane6600 examples please ??
@@seanobrien5520 Rolls Royce, Vincent motorcycles,
@@michaeldeane6600 well beyond the normal guys pay grade,. British cars and motorcycles were built between strikes and tea breaks ,, pure shite
Oh boy, you opened the channel to all kinds of controversy now. Something in conflict with my perception of the channel that had lovely content like the in search of inner peace video on Norman. On this video, I respectfully could not disagree more! After 40+ years in sales to manufacturing in the USA, I have seen the damage done to average working class people thanks to unbridled capitalism and free market economics. When countries subsidize manufacturers to strategically undercut other countries manufacturers and run them out of business, people lose good paying jobs as well as posing national security risks. Corporate management was happy to go along with it because they increased profits and raised their own pay at the expense of the workers. The average US CEO makes over 300 times the average worker wage in their companies. That’s why so many people are barely scraping by today. Japan did it to us in 70’s and 80’s and now China has been for the past two decades. In addition, to sell in their country, you have to give them your technology. In the USA politicians are realistically talking about tariffs in the 60-100% range which would kill this market for the Chinese made products. So forget about parts support after that. I think your view is too simplistic and misguided. Not everything is as black and white as your 100% or nothing take on Chinese products. We here I think are learning our lesson from Covid that we need to bring manufacturing back to our country for the sake of our people and national security. On another topic, the background scenery in this video is beautiful and can’t help but bring peace into this otherwise crazy world!
Manufacturing in the UK was destroyed by the Thatcher government from 1979 favouring financial services which were quickly deregulated leading eventually to the 2008 crash. Had we not followed this corrosive ideology here we might have retained a competitive edge and at least stood a fighting chance in the new world. Thatcherism and Reaganomics saw to it that the profligate greed of hedge funds, venture capitalists, equity dealers and the rest ran riot and the working and middle classes are now poorer as a result…..so now we can only afford the Chinese stuff….we no longer have a real choice
Well I can’t disagree with anything you said there. Reagan started the downward spiral here for sure
@@thebingleywheeler And industry is continuing being destroyed by governments Conservative and Labour.Best wishes from a dying Port Talbot steelworks.
We need more examples like Lucas Aerosoace
Absolutely agree with you.
They are raving about the 900 in Spain. At last people are seeing through the Chinese prejudices. They will be pushing the main manufacturers hard very soon.
The Spanish know their bikes
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery 👍🏻
You're not wrong. For adventure biking in the UK a 450 cc may well be enough. However, for riders in say the home countires we have to ride for 200 miles before we can find any nice places to ride through. So we need a bike with a good bit of ooomph! to get us there. Big BMW, Triumphs KTMs etc are just a bit too much for riding the back roads and lanes. All in all the 450MT and the Voge you are on here are probably just right. Not forgetting the new Enfield 450 thing.
Just saw this in an article this morning: "The U.S. Commerce Department recently proposed rules that would ban vehicles with software and hardware links to China and Russia by model year 2027." So any vehicle that has connectivity to your phone or other device will be banned and we will not see the likes of bikes like this and CF Moto, etc. I wonder if this will effect KTM and BMW as well, knowing that some of their bikes have some Chinese parts that may fall into this category. So, I hope you enjoy them as we yanks soon can't.
Here in the USA, virtually everything we buy is made in China nowadays. So, why not motorcycles? For me, I think it's good for the overall motorcycle market that these Chinese brands have become available. They give us more choice, and keep the other manufacturers on their toes with respect to model offerings and price (though we are only starting to see that). I don't agree with Chinese politics, but let the politicians sort that out. We obviously have a very robust trade relationship with China that's good for both countries, depending on your point of view. Let our differences remain our differences while enjoying the trade relationship.
Well said sir 👍🏻
Britain is going full commo and will be walking soon anyway.
Starmer just speeded up the globalist tyranny…at least some of the brighter plebs are noticing now…not enough though, we are in deep, deep trouble
I took that very bike out yesterday & did 120 miles on it. In many ways I was shocked as to how good it was - the ergonomics suited me perfectly (5'9" / 31" inseam), it was comfortable, with compliant suspension & light, easy handling. Good brakes, good tyres out of the box (Metzler Tourance) , good protection from the screen/fairing/hand guards so that even at 6 / 7 degrees I didn't get cold, flexible motor with enough grunt without having to flog it & enough performance for me (same A2 compatible power output as my Interceptor) . It seemed well finished as well as well specified. And all at a very compelling price point
But as it stands, I wouldn't buy one.
While the ever-present vibrations didn't cause me numb fingers at the time while riding, this morning my hands are "tingling" from the experience nearly 24 hours later.
The gearchange action is really out of place with the rest of the bike - while all the other controls are light & work smoothly and easily, the gearchange is stiff, rather "mushy" in feel and the lever travel overly long. It spoiled an otherwise very enjoyable ride. The first thing I noticed on getting back on my Himalayan was the light, positive short travel gearchange.
And it is too loud at 98 dba according to the VIN plate, which isn't compliant with Austrian noise limits in the Tirol (95 dba). My Himalayan was noticably quieter on my return journey home & my 5 1/2 year old Interceptor is also under 95 dba. May not be an issue for some (many ? ) but motorcycle noise is something of an issue on the Continent ATM & I would not want to have a bike that I was limited in where I could use it because it was too loud for local noise limits.
These points may well have been addressed already, as there was a "595" shown at EICMA recently. If (or, more likely, when) those issues get sorted, it would be difficult for me to argue against one of these and, even so, it is probably the nearest bike I have ridden for decades that comes out of the showroom "ready to tour" without having to raid the accessories catalogue or aftermarket. suppliers.
Interesting…..I didn’t find any issues with vibrations or the gear change myself
the CF 450 could have sold 10x more - the reason they are sold out is because they supplied so few - the supply for next spring is pathetic as well, very small numbers coming into the country, thousands should be landing but we will be lucky to see a couple of hundred in 2025.
I've heard that as well from 2 local dealers, one of the dealers said he wouldn't touch CFMOTO because KTM are the distributors and he didn't want to deal with them.The other couldn't get the bikes in the number he wanted, the MT range being the more desirable bikes.
l guess time will tell...l remember when if you bought a Nikon, Canon, Yashica, Minolta with the little gold sticker on the pentaprism it was made in Japan...and very good they were to. Same went for their Bikes ....they were put together like a Sewing Machine compared to most Brit Bikes......perhaps the Chinese will travel the same route.....
Bit late to this one but been to the Motorcycle 2024 show today to look for my first bike after gaining my full licence . I’m at a dilemma. I’m down to 2 bikes I really like, the DS525X and the Honda NX500. I really really like the Voge but I have some reservations. 1. What’s the resale value or trade in value gonna be in say 2 years, or will even a dealer take it in part ex? 2. Parts availability in the future for these bikes. The Voge really ticks all my boxes particularly with all the kit it has. It makes the Honda look really basic. But in 2 or 3 years time if both of these are for sale, which one is gonna sell the easiest? My heart says buy the Voge but my gut says the Honda
Great vid and sums up the status quo. I have my reservations about the Ccp but I honestly do not see me or many others making a difference to the future regarding Chinese products.
Like you said there are folk who will state they would never buy one because of their strong feelings about the Chinese culture and their wrong doings but then they will support a Saudi owned football team and drive a German or Japanese car despite their tainted history.
I think those that puff out their chests and shoulders are really only appealing to themselves as people will buy them as the prices are good and it looks like they are tackling the dodgy reliability reputation of previous years.
And let's face it what isn't made in China now?
I bought some Japanese snacks the other day only to find they were yes you guessed it, made in China!
The big players in the motorcycle world will have to take a serious look at this as it is a big concern to them.
However I think the road ahead for us isn't necessarily about where a bike is made and the politics behind it but whether we will be able to ride our roads or afford to with Draconian ideas floating around by governments hell bent of stopping us from travelling.
We should be more focussed on that and enjoy what we have now.
I tend to agree that the mid range affordable bikes are indeed the future. Another factor that may influence this is the "average" (if there is such a thing ) motorcyclist is becoming older and the bemoth adventure bikes and tourers are just getting too much. Im fortunate enough to own a 1250 GSA and an RE Himalayan. If i didnt tour two up i wouldnt have such a big bike in my garage. In fact, my himalayan comes out more than my GSA and it never fails to put a smile on my face. This week i rode with a friend whos just bought the 450 Himalayan. It well screwed together, has a 3 year warranty and cost under 6k. Solo for sure, its all the bike id really need.
Just about anything you buy now is probably made in China , so it would be very inconvenient if you stopped buying from there on principle . Everything Ive ever bought from there has been brilliant , perhaps I have just been lucky. What really gets my goat is why we cant get our manufacturing base back so that we can make the stuff instead of paying China to do it . Madness that we make bugger all any more. Sorry for the rant, lovely video again !.
Our economy is now only 20% manufacturing….this unforgivable decline began in 1979 on the back of an insane political ideology
@@thebingleywheeler The country is an absolute shambles and will definitely get worse !. Glad Im old...
BTW Dave you have a good relationship with Appleyards so could you ask for a change of their policy of not allowing a passenger on test rides please.
I prefer to take my good lady on the back whenever possible, so my choice of bike always depends on how comfortable and secure she feels on that there back seat. Thank you in advance.
I’ll ask….im guessing it’s a Moto GB policy based on third party insurance liabilities and therefore cost….
@@thebingleywheeler thank you
Love mine to bits done a Scotland tour and a Wales tour so far, great bike after coming from a Kawasaki versus 650 don't get me wrong some of the quality is questionable compared to the Kawasaki but more than happy with the Voge 👍
Do you think MotoGB will be around long enough to provide a lasting back up service for the machines they import? It has been rumoured that the current owner is more interested in the property market and not motorcycles.
Not got a Chinese bike.. But I can remember when I started biking many years ago.. Some bikers would not by German or Japanese due to the war...
Had a Voge for 3 years a 550ds.... excellent value and no problems
I haven’t seen a single Chinese bike that makes me want to switch from my Honda.
Ur Honda is probably built in china , most bikes are
ua-cam.com/video/z0oSZK3Gd9g/v-deo.html
Not even this? :P
I come from an industry were upto 10years ago was dominated by Japanese, Taiwanese & European manufacturing.
Since then, the Chinese have not only entered the market, but have out done & out priced the others, to the extent that 99% of market is manufactured in China now.
Whether we like it or not, the world has given their manufacturing to China & China have been rubbing their hands in joy, because of it.
What we must know about Chinese manufacturing is, they improve constantly, they seek for improvements & in a very quick way.
In my opinion China will take over the entire motorbike market by 2035.
A better product & better value. SIMPLE.
@@PhoenixCreationsKaTyJs Yes, l believe you are correct. Although I'm bound to say my 2014 FVR 800 did have Made in Japan on the ID plate...
@@PhoenixCreationsKaTyJs No. it’s not 😁
Thanks again being the owner of a VoGE DS525X I might be slightly biased , but you need to know something which you brought up in the video conserning the HONDA CB500X , ITS NOT MADE in JAPAN but TIAWAN , the capital letters were done on purpose .
Taiwan or Thailand?
Yes Taiwan is technically China
what weight will it carry? very important for a bike of this type.
Is this good for 2 up with luggage in the Swiss/Italian alps? Looking at the new 900, but if this would do and easier to get, I'm in....
Definitely
We cut our cloth to the feel of the economy. When it comes to bikes, for most folks its the experience that counts not cc, bhp, heavy lbs or heavy gpb spent. Modern mid-weight fit the times and due to lower weight offer a better experience 95% of the time. Why stress the finances which in the end diminishes the experience?
Absolutely pal if it works for you then most other considerations are secondary 👍🏻
@@thebingleywheeler💯 Should be gbp not gpb, but dyslexia a bit like picking the wrong bike! Focus on your true needs for a while rather than let the testicles do the thinking 😂
I come from an industry were upto 10years ago was dominated by Japanese, Taiwanese & European manufacturing.
Since then, the Chinese have not only entered the market, but have out done & out priced the others, to the extent that 99% of market is manufactured in China now.
Whether we like it or not, the world has given their manufacturing to China & China have been rubbing their hands in joy, because of it.
What we must know about Chinese manufacturing is, they improve constantly, they seek for improvements & in a very quick way.
In my opinion China will take over the entire motorbike market by 2035.
A better product & better value. SIMPLE.
On the value for money thing. What do you think these bikes, with all the bells and whistles of technology, will stand the test of time and British winters. What state will they be in ten years time.
I have had Chinese phones for years now but in reality they need replacing after a couple of years.
Has anyone got a quote from the likes of we buy any bike on a two year old one?
Cheers for your thoughts Dave
Well. It would appear that the Chinese are upping their game in a similar way that the Indians did at Royal Enfield. In the end it is the consumer who benefits with more choices and more competitive pricing. I paid a premium for my W800 over similar bikes from certain other manufactures. Not because I don't trust other manufacturers but because the W800 has certain attributes not present in other bikes and those particular attributes were important to me and I could afford to pay a premium for those attributes.
I can certainly see how economic conditions would prevent a large portion of the population from making the same decision I did and buy based primarily on price. As bad as inflation and cost of living is here in Canada I suspect the economic situation in the UK is a little worse right now. Hopefully political reason and common sense will prevail and conditions will improve.
BJ
Have they got any stock Dave? Or is it next year for delivery. I’m in a bit of a dilemma, a new voge or cf moto or a year old v Strom 650.
Voge 525 available now I’m told
China have copied the BMW Mini & vastly improved upon it. A better product & a much better price.
All consumers want the best product at the best price & so China will take over the entire motorbike market by 2035.
Voge 900 for me👊
dealer network is sparse ,, but - voge are very good looking and good value ,
Why do steam trains in the distance make you go blurry eyed 😂. But seriously, people that have been into bikes for many years remember how quickly the Chinese bikes used to go bad mechanically and cosmetically. Are the new breed any different? I ask because i was thinking of swapping my t100 for one of these.
The new ones are very different
Chinese bikes are built to a price. You might buy one and have no issues for 5 or 10,000 miles but at some point after this the problems will almost certainly start creeping in with premature wear and tear. Japanese bikes are the most reliable bikes on the planet , if you are thinking about buying a new Chinese motorcycle you are better off spending the same amount of money buying a used Japanese motorcycle with a full service history. If looked after and serviced it will probably last forever and you should also have no problems getting spare parts for many years to come. As with most things in life , you get what you pay for at the end of the day.
Yes...sure🤣
@rufuscapsti,said you spent a fortune on your Harley, and still ended up with an average motorcycle...spent a fortune on my Harley,,haven't even reached average!...Harley's are a breed apart 👍🤣🤣
Longevity/parts supply/dealer warranty network...??...unless you're a PCP 'user' then it 'doesn't matter
Plenty dealerships here
Weather you like dislike about these bikes they are here to stay. All this was said about Japanese bikes way back
What as to be said is Japanese and European bikes have got bigger and more expensive. You take your choice
I have no problem with China…they’re providing a service doing trade…that’s trade, and not to be confused with America and its vassals exporting war and regime change worldwide. If that’s controversial folks then do a bit of research
America : 160 military bases on foreign soil projecting power and war. China: 2 (Ethiopia and Vietnam) Russia: 3. (Georgia, Armenia and Kazakhstan). Yet people always say China is an evil empire bent on world domination 😂😂
I have to agree, its great that they don't have the environmental and health and safety regulations that hamper western industries, not to mention the wages they pay their workers. I do worry a little about the quality of the steel they use, but then I read they have to comply with certain ISO standards, just like they did with anchor chains for ships that allegedly broke, however ships breaking loose from moorings is no concern to us. I think we should support the Chinese industry as they are a struggling democratic country and need every advantage we can give them. We don't need such industry here, we got a thriving service economy, the hotel trade is doing particularly well at the moment, and the building trade will boom very soon. Who needs to make things to sell abroad to earn foreign currency, certainly not us.
@@alanbarsteward7630nicely put! Who needs values when you spend your pension on imported slave labour products? You can leave difficult questions like how to earn a living to you children.
@MindfulMotorcyclist Well said Sean I completely agree 👍🏻
You should be an ambassador for Chinese made motorcycles, well said 👍
Anything with a tablet on the dash has no future with me, I don't mind a small LCD display beside analogue clocks but tablets on the dash look cheap and nasty and age fast, analogue dials are timeless and look much better, the Triumph Bonneville T100/120 for example.
I just think too many bikes have these TFT displays now and they got too much information and many even have android auto and car play, this is ridiculous on a bike tempting riders to look down a lot more than they should.
Honda are a prime example of no more analogue displays except on the cub and shadow, the Shadow isnot even available in Europe anymore but I would never buy a modern Honda because all their bikes now look the same with just minor differences, for example the NT1100 is supposed to be the Successor to the Deauville, it's just a slightly different looking African Twin that sits lower down, hideous looking yoke with a big tablet on the dash. Honda offered no replacement for the Deauville or Pan European two well loved bikes and very sought after 2nd hand, if Honda made a real Deauville replacement people would buy it.
Anyway just my opinion.
Of course they are cheaper, the Chinese don’t have the R&D costs, though their Engineers do have diplomas in reverse and badge engineering.
Ironically though it looks like CFmoto's rep might take a battering due to their association with KTM!
When the Chinese design their own engines and chassis then they will be of interest.
Meanwhile, back in the real world... China has more annual STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Maths) graduates than US, UK, EU and Japan combined. While our roads deteriorate into cart tracks China is building roads, railways, airports and seaports. Wake up!
@@mickgarbutt3553 I know they are making great strides in ev cars and hifi etc. but their bikes are still just copies, albeit well made ones now. Hence of no interest to me.
"When the Chinese design their own engines and chassis, then they will be of interest." never going to happen...
Thought that steam train was a perfect metaphor. If we buy Chinese bikes en masse then the choice in the brands we currently enjoy will go, they will stop making them or importing them. Simple as. I will not buy one. We have lost so many things in this Country over recent decades, it’s a race to the bottom. Chinese everything at the bottom.
You probably have a house full of goods that are made abroad, don't be such a hypocrite.
I’m afraid the horse bolted long ago…but you shut the stable door if you like
@@martyndunn1905 no doubt Martyn. Doesn’t mean I like it or approve of the way everything is being moved overseas and being built down to a price. Don’t blame China I blame our pathetic politicians. My father in law did 42years on the plate mill at Scunthorpe Steel and in its heyday employed something like 40,000 men. Now it’s under 3000 and on its knees. Like Port Talbot. Why? Because we are importing cheapo steel, coal, wood hip, goodness knows what else from all over when we could make it here. The whole green thing is a scam, a con. You buy your Chinese bike if you want. I would rather walk.
@@Trev350 yes Trev. Exactly.
Do you ride a Japanese or German bike?
Motorcycles used to be "working class transport" , now they're (mainstream brands) just fashion accessories and toys for the wealthy.
I disagree.
Not because of the reasons you give though but because of the thing that will be the beginning of the end for all motorcycling.
The Eu and uk mandade for the exclusion of combustion vehicles draws ever closer, and there is no electric future for motorcycling outside of limited range city riding.
The future of motorcycle manufacturing lies not in hands of the consumer but rests in the hands of politicians unless thing change dramatically in the near future.
The posturing over chinese versus the current crop of manufacturers is wasted energy.
If we are to continue enjoying what little freedoms remain via riding motocycles then we all need to wake up to what lies ahead.
Sorry, can't fully agree. The future of motorcycles, irrespective where are made, or how they are powered, will be light weight small capacity motorcycles.The average age of riders in the Western world will guarantee this. It is already the case in Asia.
Agreed
The well established motorcycle manufacturers have become greedy and complacent. They haven't really had anybody else giving them pause for thought, until now. At the very least once these Chinese bikes come onto the used market they will provide a much cheaper entry cost to motorcycling than we've seen for a long time, not counting cost of insurance.
I do try to avoid Chinese products when I can but it's not easy. I'm sure plenty of my money still makes its way to China and hence helps to prop up the CCP regime. I don't think any worse of people that do choose to buy Chinese. As with all things it's complicated, at least for people who think further than the end of their nose.
Ooops! Canadian politics interrupted.... Get Trudeau Out!
Mate, I just have one thing to add to your already brilliant case, if Chinese motorcycles were a reason not to buy them, we would see a lot of Harleys on road sadly we see more of the Chinese made or Chinese parts laden bikes on road than American Made Freedom and Democracy Loaded so called reliable and ethical motorcycles... People who have these opinions rarely put there money where their mouth is!
hehehe..wait for the graphene technology of china..indestructible bikes, waterproof can swin, fireproof, etc
You said this bike is around £6000 and is £3000 cheaper than the Honda nx500 actually it is only £800 cheaper !!!!!!
And you should not be telling people what to think regarding chinese motorcycles it's not a police state yet.
Your chanel is so much better when you review motorcycles than it is lecturing us on our morals.
So as I said in the video the “equivalent” Honda would be up to 3k more….so have a look at the cost of the NX500 and add on all the things which come as standard on the Voge….so Spot Lights, Crash Bars, Full 3 piece hard luggage etc…..there’s your 3k 😂👍🏻
BIG QUESTION: Why can't we afford non-communist motorcycles... I guess that's a whole other "market & politics "
Just think twice??
Communist Chinese bikes? no thanks!
Most of the big brands of bikes are made in china