23mm on 25mm RIM, using the 105% rule
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2021
- #25mmtire #ZIPP #widertirerims
Troll, negative or abusive comments will be removed.
Jerseys
Purple/Black with Waynos Fotos emblem as displayed in the video.
My size is 2XL and I am 85kg and 185cm tall for an idea of sizing.
Pricing $75.00 USD + shipping(to you) just need to confirm shipping costs to you to get a final TOTAL pricing. Let me know in the comments if interested or DM me on INSTAGRAM: @Waynos_fotos_cycling
Sizing in inches;
3XS: 27-29, length front: 17, Length arm: 10 (back order only)
2XS: 30-32, length front: 18, Length arm: 10 (back order only)
XS: 32-34, length front: 18, Length arm: 10 (back order only)
SMALL: chest 34-36, length front: 19, Length arm: 10
MEDIUM: chest 36-38, length front: 20, Length arm: 11
LARGE: chest 38-40, length front: 21, Length arm: 11
Xtra LARGE: chest 40-42, length front: 22, Length arm: 12
2x Xtra LARGE: chest 42-44, length front: 22, Length arm: 12
3x Xtra LARGE: chest 44-46, length front: 22, Length arm: 13 (back order only)
4x Xtra LARGE: chest 46-48, length front: 22, Length arm: 13 (back order only)
5x Xtra LARGE: chest 48-50, length front: 22, Length arm: (back order only)
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The 105 rule says that upgrading your groupset beyond 105 has diminishing returns when compared to upgrading to 105.
Yes I run 25 mm on my 27 mm ext Elite rims. A wider rim recaptures the turbulent airflow off the tire edge and returns it to laminar airflow, reducing drag. Hambini has a good UA-cam video explaining it.
For those that commented about comfort, try running 25mm up front and 28mm in the back. I know we're talking fairly small gains here but the "105 rule" is more improtant on the front end than the rear where the seat tube on the frame blocks much of the airflow before it hits the rear wheel and you get the higher volume tire under your butt for comfort.
True front is where matters
@@The86rick Hmmm, ok sure, if you live near the cobbled streets of Belgium I guess that’s true. In my personal case years of training by 12 ounce curls have gifted me with forearms and biceps of steel. So real men don’t suffer from arm pump. Not sure what the metric equivalent to a 12 ounce is…. A one pint lift? ;)
Never heard of it before, but I quite like the Shimano 105 on my Cx bike! 😂
CONTINENTAL GP5000 23mm on 25mm wide Winspace Hyper 65mm deep are very fast, over take people just by rolling...
"Aero" is everything. I just bought the newest "aero" tires, along with everything else on my "aero" bike which includes "aero" chain lube and my new "aero" rear LED light. I got my calculator out and added up ALL the "aero" advantages I have and I am now saving exactly 6.722368 HOURS per mile/4.1770863413 HOURS per kilometer. I am SO jacked! I sent away for some "aero" beard oil that will decrease my dander/filthy beard drag by 28.5221% I'll update you in the future on THAT!
Loln
My zipp 808 firecrest wheels said i needed 25mm tyres so thats what i got. But you’ve explained a lot. Yes i know what Hambini said.
Tyres vary a lot that why I'm using 23c clincher tyres on a rim designed for 25c. There is no bulbing at all.
I run 25 mm tires on my old Raleigh. Put some wider hybrid type rims on. Seems to ride a lot better than on the skinnier rims.
The human powering the bike is the real "edge". The rest is happy talk about 3-watt increments and whatever. 👍
Spec is the greatest company in the history of cycling.
I don't subscribe to any rules like that when I match tires to my rims. I pretty much have a tire brand and size that match the OD width of the rim. Some brands tires end up wider than their spec when mounted to particular rims and this also makes it hard to find proper tires but I use the R3 which usually is more narrow than its spec and therefore when mounted on my wider rim gives an aero shape that Hambini would be proud of.
I am surprised you don't get neck ache doing the videos 😉
wow, never heard of that before, thank you.
The "wider tire is best" crowd love to cite the superior rolling resistance of 28mm+ tires despite the fact that rolling resistance on actual roads is almost impossible to measure accurately, and totally discount the aero advantage of the 105 rule that is, at very least, a metric that is possible to measure.
I have done videos on this,
As a performance metric, rolling resistance is a complete myth, when applied to the real world.
The ability of the tyre to control road imperfections is a much bigger variable, why wider tyres are better on rough surfaces and skinny tyres are better on smooth surfaces.
And something people have forgotten is soft sidewalls control road imperfections better, why high TPI cotton tyres are still the best, size vs road for road imperfections speed trade off.
“Rolling resistance is a myth”
Lol I’d throw you a Maxxis minion 2.6 dhf tyre to your front wheel and I’ll see if you still sing the same tube.
You ca measure and compare RR in a lab setting. That difference can than be extrapolated to a real life scenario. To always argue “urgh but that’s not in a real life use case”, is simply being pedantic and silly.
@@87togabito RR measured in a lab is usually done on smooth drums and despite elaborate steps taken to make it more applicable to outdoor riding, nobody has ever sufficiently demonstrated that their lab RR tests reflect outcomes on actual roads, despite you saying it can be extrapolated.
The main issue is the different rim and tire hook designs. I have 25mm clincher tires that are 26 mm wide on one set and 24 mm on another rim set. So you have to play around a bit to get an exact 105%. However tubular tires don't have that issue and are fairly accurate on width.
Just a thought. Watch Alaphilippe as he broke away and mashed his way to victory. All the aero gains made by his equipment were irrelevant cos he rode on the hoods in a non-aero hip-snaking position with face fuzz. Why? Cos he was comfortable and could breath properly so put power down. Aero is often overrated, as he just demonstrated
Comfort = more power > aero for uphill attacks obviously.
However in this case, the tyre does nothing to affect your posture.
The aero gains here are have no cost, outside a financial sense.
And imo, money is literally the easiest upgrade a cyclist can get. You have to train for fitness; buying an aero bike or frame only costs money.
I think more watts are lost worrying about it.
Mavic used to offer a tire/rim combination that were matched and took advantage of the 105 rule. Interesting that many professional teams were using this for years. It should come back into use as a wider rim might be stronger as well.
I was just thinking of the same thing. Too bad Mavic tires were not as good as the Conti.
From my perspective, losing 1 lb. of body weight will give you more advantage than switching to a '105' set-up. So is it worth it to put up with far more road shock?
I think not.
I think that having your tire larger creates a slightly larger aero tear drop that puts your tire/rim and rim/spoke transitions in the 'vacuum' area in your aero tear drop. Thus minimizing the aero distortion caused by the irregular profile of those transitions. The slight increase in the aero tear drop is far less friction than the distortion caused by a too close tire profile.
I think difference in comfort is unnoticeable if you use comparable tire pressures. Difference becomes noticeable if you use fatter tires with very low pressure, but then you have additional penalty in the form of increased rolling resistance.
I actually run lower pressures with a 23c on a 25mm od rim than I did running a 25c on older slimmer rims. The reason being that the sidewalls of the 23c are straighter on the 25mm od rim. With greater curvature of the sidewalls you have to run higher pressures. The 23c/25mm OD rim/75psi combo has made a super rigid frame so much nicer to ride on especially when the days get long.
19 - 21 mm tyres are best choice on good quality surface.
Running 23mm micheline tires on ICAN 25mm (outside) rims. This is not in line with their recommendations. They advise minimal 24mm tires, but they are as rare as hen's teeth. The 25mm conti's I normally use don't fit my bike with these wheels..bummer. The current setup rides nicely, maybe a bit less demping.
I thought I was down with the kids when I got my new rims and schwalbe pro one 28mm tyres which should have given me the optimum 105 percent . They did make me
Slightly faster but when measured with a vernier caliper were 30mm. I got used to the comfort of bigger tyres and now have stuck to 30mm as my ' go to 'tyre.
I run 28mm tires on a 20mm Internal/ 25mm external width and it’s great
hey, could you please tell me how wide that tire is on that 20mm internal rim? I want to buy new wheels and I had 28mm Conties on 17mm internal rims that measure almost 29.5mm, now im worried about fork clearance if the tires is gonna be too big
@@ThePsychonaut yeah, sure thing. On my current wheelset the 28mm tires measure more around 29 to 29.5mm
@@astrayagrarian its the same, I found some rim with the same dimensions, actually 21mm internal 28 outer and tried the tired and its 29.5 almost 30mm, thanks!
I have done this but I suspect that rolling resistance increases while using narrower tire. So I switched back to 25ves
That's about what Josh Portner of Silca Velo said. Might be true but recommended a wheel set costing double the value of my bike. He'll sell you secret sauce chain lube if you're interested. It's probably as good as the stuff GCN is being paid to promote now. Used transmission fluid works well too! 1/8" chains are inexpensive though. Cut it to length, use it up, get a new one when it gets dirty.
I actually watched his video, they did some research on this when he worked at Zipp. Unlike other claims in the industry this sounds legit!
@@waynosfotos I agree. The message is though that pro teams have had it all wrong forever. Average riders emulate the pros and are now expected to buy new kit. I am glad to benefit from new tech as it trickles down. I'll take my tech A' la carte!
Used transmission fluid. Why not new. Won't it attract junk ?
I put a sail on my bike and always ride downwind.......
While true, those small aero gains are not relevant for 99% of riders and pros of a slightly wider tire (comfort, safety) are greater imo :). 25mm clinchers on 17mm internal rims for winter, 25mm tubs on 24.2 outer-outer rims for summer.
can i put 23c on 28c rim?
I find in aliexpress Elite Wheelset Edge that is very light but they are 28c wide
40mm 1260g 50mm is 1320g
they also have 25c rim 38mm 1260g
Ride 23s on Pom roads there'll be no bulge in your chinos that's for sure as your bits will pot holed to pulp.
105 rule sounds great for race day, but slipping into a crack in the road could ruin your wheels.
My rims are 21mm internal and 28mm external and I'm running 25c tire in front for aero advantage (maybe) and 28c tire at the back for comfort (surely) 😉
hey, please i need some info, could you measure how wide is your rear 28mm tire on that 21mm internal rim? I want to upgrade to new wheels and im still not sure how is that gonna look because right now i run 28mm Conties on 17mm internal rims and they come up almost 29.5mm wide
@@ThePsychonaut depending on the model, tires of older construction becomes much wider than newest ones. My old non tubeless conties measures almost 32mm, than my Hutchinsons fusion5 11storm measures at about 31mm, than Pirelli cinturato TLR have about 30mm width and my Tufo comtura 4TR measures at about 28mm. My buddy have Pirelli Pzero TLR and they measures about 29mm. So, you can see, how big difference can be in between brands and models.
@@romanpramuka2703 Thanks man, I still need to research more, im in need of new wheels my rear Fulcrum hub broke on spoke, im considering some carbon rims that are 20mm internal and 27 outside, my frame is designed for 28mm tires but it gets kinda tight at front, it rubs on corners when i put all my weight on the drop bars but then when im on hoods it all runs fine
@@ThePsychonaut it looks like you need some stiffer wheels, maybe with deeper carbon rims. Keep in mind that with wider rims, tires becomes wider but not taller, it isn't same as wider tires on narrow rims.
@@romanpramuka2703 wider yes, thats what I'm afraid of lol, 35 or 38mm is the deepest I'd go with 24 spokes, hope it turns out well
Does Zipp's 105(%) rule say anything about getting your rims scratched because the tire fails to protect the sides of the rim against bits of gravel or the occasional kerb?
Pretty much sure it doesn't. And there's more to life than aero gains.
Yes that can be an issue
i have a fulcrum 600db/disk centerlock - 20mm internal width and i want a new wheelset to fit 19-23mm tyres to see on my own what happened . Any suggestions?
I had 23’s on my rims but my perception is that I was slightly slower because of rolling resistance so I switched back to 25s
That will happen in the snow.
Lol it is 1 watt of difference, that means maximum 2/300 watts = 1 /150 = 0,66% of difference of speed. You have a very good feeling to know exactly at what speed you should be considering the wind and the slope.
Isn't the 105 rule considering the external width rather than internal
Yes
What’s the best width of wheel to use with a 25mm clincher tyre? Thanks for the video Wayno
The answer is in the video. Remember the part about the 105 rule? Multiply 25 by 1.05 and that’s your answer.
great video waynos i want to test this as i just got a power meter my roval rim is 23 mm deep do you think that a 23mm in a 23mm rim will be faster than 25mm or 28 mm tires im gonna do 3 tests and then make a video about it. Could you give it a shoutout next vid?
For sure.
@@waynosfotos ok great im gonna make it next saturday
dumb question but if the rim says 14x622 can I put a 25mm tire on it?
Yes 👍, but check your internal and external diameter if you want to be consistent with the 105 rule.
1:27 Declan has a small …