Hey Misha, thanks for your analysis. Maybe we can help a little here. That the fast lap was driven in automatic mode was the recommendation of the Corvette development engineers. The radio was also placed on the dashboard by the Corvette engineers. There is nothing special behind it. Even though the tires were preheated with heating blankets before the fast lap, they were not quite at the perfect working temperature in the first part of the Nordschleife lap, as you could see when braking in Hatzenbach. The lap was driven on September 17, 2024, when the Nordschleife also did not have perfect grip. But that's part of the Supertest, that we can't set lap times countless times like a manufacturer. We only get one day for the fast lap and have to live with the external conditions. And as already mentioned: The internal lap time of the Corvette developers, which was shown to us during our test, was also 7.10 minutes.
Thank you for the additional clarification. A lot of people like to claim that sport auto doesn't know wtf they're doing. Misha obviously has to keep in the back of his mind that most of his viewers are from the US. So obviously, glaze the corvette and smell some conspiracy by sport auto.
And oh how very convenient it is that both times you have scheduled this car, it has been in sub optimal temperatures by tens of degrees. Just a coincidence I’m sure, not a part of any institutional bias towards Porsche , whose tests you always manage to conduct when temperatures are ideal. In fact you waited a full year after running the cold test at Hockenheim, until temperatures were cold again, to run the super test on the Z06!! Do it right or don’t do it at all.
The decision to reuse the Stingray’s gear ratios, paired with a different final drive, seems driven purely by cost-saving measures. However, applying the same ratios to two cars with vastly different power curves (LT2 vs. LT6) and RPM limits (6,500 vs. 8,500) is far from ideal. Increasing the final drive to compensate and shorten 4th and 5th gears significantly impacts the first two gears, making them overly short and impractical. The Z06 deserves a bespoke gear set tailored to its unique characteristics. Optimized gearing would not only enhance driver confidence which was lacking in the test but also unlock the car’s full potential, likely achieving a Nürburgring lap time under 7:05-matching at least the GT3 in Sport Auto’s Super Test.
The gear ratios are already a problem on the base stingray, so applying them to a car with a much higher redline and *less* torque results in these gearing struggles. I do agree cost-savings played a big role, many parts are re-used from the stingray to the ZR1 for that reason, but also emissions testing and mileage testing that goes throughout a range of gears also played a part. It's unfortunate that a car with a lightning-quick 8 speed DCT only really has 4 useable gears for performance, and a 5th gear for a top speed number. Hopefully the ZR1's power band suits the gearing a lot better.
it's actually 3 performance and 5 economy. Acceleration drops HARD when you're shifting from 3 to 4 on any Corvette made in the last few decades. They've been doing that stupid crap since C5 corvette, due to local regulations and lack of will to find a way around it. 4th is just not that bad as 5th, but still drop in acceleration is extreme.
@@maximborodyuk3773 the C5 Z06 in particular is diabolical. To get a good 0-60 time it has a 2nd gear so low it feels like you have shifted back into 1st, then after a decently placed 3rd, 4th gear kills the car for good.
@@oliverwood3404 I had C7 GS up until recently. A lot of positives, but gearing...On mountain roads, when you're on high elevation, it barely pulls on 4th our of 7 (manual). LIke you could go flatout for dozen seconds or even more without running of gear, barely accelerating. Top speed supposedly on 5th, but it would take forever to reach it, and not on high altitude. And 1st is extremely short, 2nd is barely usable too (except really twisty stuff), which leaves you with exactly 1 good gear, Lol. Such a shame. Having car now that has top speed on 7th out of 7 gear feels a bit weird.
Savagegeese same day/same driver/same track comparison of Z06 vs GT3. Corvette and GT3 manufacturer teams on hand making sure both vehicles’ setups were optimal: Times: Z06: 1’27”240 GT3: 1’27”329 Tight, short track. Pro driver said GT3 would definitely lose advantage on longer tracks and Z06’s lead would grow on them. This is an excellent, very well put together comparison video which goes into great detail explaining the strengths and weaknesses of both cars. Highly recommended.
To be fair lap times between tracks and drivers are not really comparable. Just bc 1 car is fastest at Track A doesn't necessarily translate to B. What a car CAN do and what a car gives the driver confidence to do are also a major differentiator. Sport Auto has been testing 911's for decades and they change iteratively each generation. The Z06 is completely new. There's just no way their driver felt as comfortable as he does when testing a car like a 911. Just as an example go look at the C6ZR1 lap vs other cars like GT3 with the same times. Very similar times, but the ZR1 looks like it's about to lose control constantly and it's scary just watching the video much less being the driver.
@@westcoastfrisco The LT6 is a high revving, 12.5:1 CR, FPC V8, where peak power comes in at 8400rpm, and peak torque is made at around 6400rpm. It’s… Supposed to stay up high; that’s where the meat of its power is made. The engine is happiest when it’s revved out. It may be “American”, but it’s very much an exotic engine, ripped right out of the C8.R GT3 race car.
I'm going to say gearing like others have, but also the driver is a big reason why too. I'm not saying I can do this, I sure as shit can't. But that guy made a shitload of mistakes on this lap. Including a oversteer on entry at 1:52. He misses the curbing after that. Completely misses the apex at 5:30. Over brakes at 6:17 and again at 7:26. He's hitting the gas BEFORE the apex. The transmission shifting like shit and he's not using manual mode to fix it. There are tenths left all over the place because he doesn't feel confident in the car. If we can visually see the fuckups from gopro footage, I'm sure there are far far more. People make mistakes, but like, it is a pro drivers job to get a perfect, inhuman lap. No mistakes.
People refuse to hear sport auto didnt do the car justice, it was a far from perfect run and the car has proven plenty capable otherwise.5th gear is definitely long but people want to crutch on it like it destroys the car
@@skylerhickman3646Yep. The 5th gear is a little long, but not to the point where it’s suddenly killing the car and tarnishing an entire lap. The Norschleife is a different beast, and much, MUCH longer, yes, but on every other track that the Z06 has been tested on, it’s either been one of the top fastest production cars ever, or THE fastest, even setting two lap records. Something is definitely off here.
This car beat the 992 GT3 RS at Magny Cours by over half a second. Something is WAY off here. Imagine if suddenly the 992 GT3 RS had a time from American testers that was seconds slower than the Z06. People would rightfully be skeprical.
Also when you drove the Z06, going up to Flugplatz you reached 232 kph and you weren't going for an all out lap. This guy did 226 kph going up to Flugplatz. Also the minimum speed through Flugplatz on this lap was 173 kph, while the C7 Z06 did 174 kph with front engine less downforce, less sticky tires. C8 Z06 should be doing 177-181 kph bare minimum through there since that's what the AMG GT Black Series and 991 GT2 RS are doing.
Indeed. And, Misha was pulling 1.5Gs in a non-Z07 equipped (it only had the aero, not the cup tires, stiffer springs etc), OPF Euro-spec Z06, consistently. A properly set up, US-spec Z07 should absolutely run through the ring with no issue, longer 5th gear aside. Christian wasn’t flogging the car at all, and the mistakes he made throughout the lap were clear. He’s a fantastic driver and knows the ring, but his run here was *far* from optimal.
@@jedispartancoolman Likely because they had limited time for Christian to learn the car. At Ron Fellow’s Corvette driving school, they recommend to use the paddles. They help to keep the car in its optimal powerband, and prevent oddities like what happened during the lap from happening. It’s a smart and incredibly fast DCT, but you’d obviously want to be shifting yourself to maximize the car’s potential.
My conspiracy theory is that Chevy purposefully left the Z06 somewhat unoptimized for track use to leave more room for improvement for the ZR1. Putting 670hp to the ground with only 2 driven wheels is hard enough, putting down 400 hp more seems impossible.
Tinfoil hat wearer here, I am with you on this. I think the traction control is nerfing the power delivery sooo much, the forward progress has been hampered. Or possibly, the suspension is not factory set well for that track. Cheers
Tend to agree with these takes. This looks like an early lap and not maximum attack. The driver surely must've noticed that the automatic shifting wasn't working out, but if it's possibly even the first lap it isn't likely something you'd adjust in the middle of the lap in an unfamiliar car. Even with somewhat shitty gearing it's hard to believe that it's only 2-3s faster than the C7 Z06 on less sticky tires was with the same driver seven years ago.
Yes, it’s just coincidental I’m sure, but both times they have tested this vehicle they have chosen to do so in very cold, sub optimal temperatures for the Cup2Rs. Not like their objective is to make it look slower than it actually is to satisfy Porsche or anything, oh no no no no no no.
@@senadhasanbasic260 no other magazine in the world has such a contorversial results with any car on any track regarding where it came from. GT3RS is supposed to be faster on most tracks than c8 z06. 3x the downforce...
@ the point is, they were faster by *under a second*., 0.7 Which indicates they would, if the car were correctly driven under same conditions, be closer at this track.
I am someone who loves the Z06 but has no racing experience and knows little but from this video you explain it very well and I understand everything you're talking about and they're definitely not giving it all or they're hiding something
The Viper ACR ran a 7.1 in wet conditions with a crowdfunded team and a manual gearbox. Man that's wild! Surprised it isn't on the list for comparison.
Thank you for confirming my suspicion that there is definitely several seconds lost on that lap. I would bet that early slide lost at least a half second itself.
Misha - Hello from the states. As you critique: the driver has the transmission in Auto. I've done both with my Z07 on my local race track. The auto shifting is... well let's call it dubious. It's unsettling. It'll do very well for a bit as long as you're driving 8-10/10ths. But breathe off the throttle a bit, and it gets a bit confused (it's changing modes when you do that) and then shifts in some of the weirdest spots. I recorded my laps and you can clearly hear me say, "oof!" when it decided to shift at a weird spot, unsettling the car. GM's keen on folks using the car in Auto, but I'm not quite sure the shifting algorithm is ready for track time. Use the paddles!
Keen on using Auto I understand, but I also guarantee that the transmission calibration engineers didn't set up that auto shift algorithm for a 10/10 Nurburgring lap.
It’s super strange, Maybe the alignment was completely off, the car has massive down force and one of the widest cup 2r tires front and rear in the industry. I can agree with the gearing, ok, but it should fly through the corners at massive speeds, but the corners where it was slow, it doesn’t make any sense. And on the other tracks it was flying. That sport auto vibe felt bad for me either. Seems like the driver was not pushing at all or was afraid of it.
Nothing strange dont make exuses, if its 07:00 capable car then GM would have released lap time after doing 2 years in a row attempts, but instead kept quiet.
@ there are no excuses, just mere facts and curiosity why this exact car couldn’t show the speed and lateral G in the corners that it showed on other race tracks dozens of times. Any car with bad alignment or improper setup will drive terrible. When Misha drove the EU spec car, he said he was completely amazed with its cornering capabilities and that car was on worse tires
@@coolguy_2997 Who is Misha? F1 driver champion or something? It's not like he is perfect, btw GM just now stated the lap time is what they expected themselves
@@TRX25EX Misha drove more supercars and track cars than any F1 driver (and the F1 cars behave the opposite way of ‘normal’ cars anyway) so he has relevant track experience (especially on the NR) to have a well grounded opinion on these cars. And he said among rivals - he prefers only the 992 gt3 rs to this Vette. I’m not a fan here but I really wanted to see a hard push with the well setup car but I saw a safe side driving with a lot of mistakes with the car behaving very strange.
@@coolguy_2997 Show me one Track Attempt video without mistake I'm waiting , even AMG One had countless of mistakes which is normal, look at Su7 video that car even turned off and lost power lol. Don't act as driver need to be perfect if Misha perfect let him go and do it than talk nonsense, the guy who did lap attempt is the most popular in top 50 lap times list so definitely he is more proven than Misha is by far. I drove Lamborghini Ferrari Porsche Lotus McLaren Audi and at least 10 other makers even Morgan on a track does that make me good enough to do these lap attempts?
The Viper is a legend. Absolutely insane car. The US folk really swung for the hills AND they hit right on the spot. I would have a Viper over a Porsche
Firstly, the tall 5th gear is not a huge problem. Yes an extra gear would have helped aid that top end acceleration, BUT in caranddrivers instrumented test the Z07 C8 was 3.1 seconds faster 0-170mph than a 992.1 GT3 RS. Secondly the driver in the video was not pushing it to the absolute limit. Its not a GM driver so he doesnt know the car thoroughly AND he has to get it back in one piece. On the other hand when Porsche tests its car they can afford to write the car off for a laptime. Rumors are GM also tested the Z06 and got around 7:10 but thats only rumors I believe. In the real world numerous youtube track comparisons and tests done by magazines have consistently shown the Z07 C8 to be in between a GT3 and GT3 RS when it comes to track times. This Z07 Z06 is definitely capable of a sub 7 with the right driver and right conditons Edit: in caranddrivers instrumented tests, the Z07 C8 and GT3 RS 992.1 both produced 1.16g on a 300ft skidpad. So the C8 definitely has the cornering and too speed too.
I mean is it really a rumor when it's from the official company itself ? GM confirmed they are seeing the same lap times “While making the deal to borrow the car with Aaron Link (GMV manager) Gebhardt asks Link if he drove the C8 Z06 at the Nurburing and Link showed him a video of his last visit showing a 7:10 during development testing." Seems like it's pretty consistent.
@@leofhr2966Jim Mero lapped the Nurburgring in a C7 Z06 in 7:10 seconds. The previous gen car thats around 2-5 seconds slower on every single race track. GM tests it's cars using a 100 octane tune to be compatible with race fuel offered by various race courses around the world. The C8 Z06 was confirmed to be using it as well.
@@saltyfloridaman7163 then wheres GM lap time? they did attempts for 2 years in a row, why its not out? Misha claimed it can beat it and on that video I said it cant
@@leofhr2966where did they THEMSELVES state that? I’ve seen nothing but Sport Auto giving an unsubstantiated rumor about some random engineer giving them a time.
@philb9117 Random ? Also where is your claim that it isn't true ? Why would they lie and what's the point ? GM could easily claim it untrue but they themselves haven't, and why wouldn't they if it's false information that could ruin their reputation ? Why wouldn't they themselves post a time for the car to show how capable it truly is ? I get the car can do better, and I get the skepticism, but to claim that they are lying without anything to back it up is just being a hypocrite considering you have no way to prove them wrong when they have video evidence of the car performing on the track and are an established organization even recognized by Misha himself.
Crazy that I didn't realize that the car was in full auto until you mentioned it. I do wonder if only being given limited laps due to noise limits might be the reason like you said. The US spec Z06 is really loud from factory so I wouldn't be surprised. Sounds really good in person though.
@@einautofan6685 I don't get why people move towards race tracks and complain about noise, but its best thing tracks can do to stay open as long as possible in a ever stricter world filled with more innate karenism
@@Ottobon Nobody moved close to a race track. They were there before. The nur is also a public road... Read a little before you open your mouth next time.
Am I the only one who feels like the driver was hesitant and a bit erratic. He kept fiddling with his helmet. He seemed to be doing a lot of unnecessary small steering adjustments. What do I know. I'm not a race driver but other drivers look smoother, more focused and faster.
Misha’s lap was far more impressive. @MishaCharoudin, you should get that orange Z06 you drove out there again on a track day and give it a full-blown lap !
@@markw9512 ok tell misha to come and do 6 lap times attempts on Z06 in a booked session, if he does under 07:10 we will pay for all expenses, if he doesnt he pay for it all
What "sounded off" was that the Corvette wasnt best? Because why would it be. There is no reason why it would be. So if we just keep thinking something is "strange" every time its not best, well then you can always wait for next time. And next time, and next time.
Really enjoyed your commentary. I always learn things when I watch you drive and learned a lot from listening to your review of this. Yes - keep the revs up in the power band! I notice you always do this when you're driving and it's really helped me on track.
5th gear is long because Chevy’s build to price approach uses the same gear ratios across 3 different engines and purposes in the Stingray, Z06 and ZR1. A little active aero would make a big difference too.
Despite its long 5th gear it still outaccelerates the GT3 RS to 150mph by 2 seconds. I own a 658whp 2004 Mustang Mach 1. It weighs 3600lbs and makes 50whp more than the C8 Z06 and I've raced one before. I have a T56 transmission and during a roll race event, the C8 Z06 still gave me trouble all the way to 165mph, i trapped 3mph faster at the end and we did a half mile roll. That extra long 5th gear isn't really the issue everyone thinks it is, it still beats Hellcat Redeyes in roll racing, my built Mustang had to reel it in and barely edged a win, and it was consistently among the best of the 600-700hp groups. At the crank I make about 740hp. Nothing about this video makes sense
@@saltyfloridaman7163now if the gears was shorter the car would be giving u wayyy more problems. It makes peak power towards 8500 and if it upshoft and now at 6500 on a hill, that’s abt a 50-100hp loss jus cause the shift
It also has a slower overall time than the C7 Z06 on Cup 2 non-r tires with GM's 100 octane calibration. Jim Mero ran a 7:10 in 2015 with the 100 octane calibration.
The Cup2Rs make up 2.5 seconds on a 2.4 mile track. Even the V.I.R time for the C8 Z06 is 6 seconds over the C7 z06. This is nonsense on a 12.9 mile track like nordschlife
I've watched Best Motoring all my life, that great car show from Japan. It was like that there, whenever they tested Japanese cars against European ones, the Japanese ones were always better. whether it was Honda NSX or Nissan GTR against the rest, it was just as strange as now. I have the feeling from the video that it's the same, only the other way around. I think if a really good racer were driving there and getting everything out of it, it would 100% be 10-15 seconds faster
That's simply because a factory pro driver will have loads of practice laps. The engineers will also have time to fine tune the suspension. It's normal that a hot lap with little preparation time will be 10+ seconds slower than a proper lap record by a manufacturer. But even if you subtract that time, it'll be difficult to get sub 7 on the full 20.8km.
Always with the sandbagging… Just like they tested it on Hockenheim when it was very cold outside, well below the optimal range of the cup2rs, costing it multiple seconds. My understanding is they promised to redo it in warmer temperatures, but of course they never did. Follow the advertising money and you’ll see why.
Nonsense, people just don't understand Sport Auto laps and how they come about. They did a VERY slow lap in a Porsche GT4 RS MR recently but the internet didn't notice that I suppose. Even when Misha drove a different one, the C8 seemed extremely slow on the straights for a 650+ HP car. It literally accelerates like a 500HP GT3.
@ not nearly as slow as it was in this video. And fast enough to where Misha, who knows a thing or two about lapping at the Ring, felt very confident that it was fully capable of a sub seven minute time. Maybe you should watch this video all the way through instead of just commenting here.
@markw9512 Let's not compare youtubers with professionals who have been doing this for a lot longer. GM was apparently present at this test and assisted Sport Auto and from what is reported they didn't expect much different. I saw Misha's lap as well and it did not look sub-7 there either. It accelerated like a 500hp GT3 but down in the cornering speeds. Let's not forget that even a GT3 RS is barely sub-7 in Sport Auto terms.
Yeah that Camara test at 3*C was also the first thing that came to my mind. And Sport Auto did shit like that 10 years ago, thats why we stopped reading their print media it was so obvious.
It’s also 5 seconds slower than a gt3 rs from 2019 with 520 horsepower what’s your point? Also 4 seconds slower than an amg gtr pro on worse tires and is front engine
Why is everybody so upset? It makes total sense. The Corvette Z06 is not built to be a dedicated track car like RS series Porsches are, nor is it a Nurburgring special like the RSs. The Z06 is extremely track capable, but ultimately street biased. A 7:10 lap time is not exactly slow in that regard. Sport Auto already pointed out the gear ratio issue, which is not ideal in this case but completely in line with the intended purpose of the car.
I don't know if upset is the right word, it's just a bit strange is all. With Cup 2 R:s it should definitely be more than 2-3s faster than the C7 lap from 7 years ago on normal Cup 2:s. It was almost 5s faster around the much shorter VIR in the C&R's Lightning Lap for example. That combined with the strange choice to leave it in full auto, which is clearly costing time, makes it look like this isn't the full potential.
@@osenmosen That C7 lap was factory and on a 200m longer track. The C8 is faster than the C7. Sport Auto doesnt do perfect laps or try to showcase the perfect lap. They dont have the means for that.
C7 zr1 did a 6:57 the track pack c8 zr1 should easily do sub 6:50 seconds the c8 zr1 and c7 zr1 or z06 are both capable of beating the Porsche gt3rs they do all the time in imsa series. The c8 zr1 will be sub 7 minutes easy if done right and with track pack. The new mustang gtd will probably beat the gt3rs time watch... but c8 zr1 and c7 zr1 both capable of sub 6:55 c8 zr1 should be able to match gt3rs. Viper acr idk what its best time for the ring was another good track car.
I agree with Misha that whether intentionally or unintentionally the RPMs and gear position are not visible. Same for throttle. A fast lap video with an alleged 5th gear problem without the viusalization of RPMs, throttle and gears is weird indeed.
I think more important was the fact that, just as they did last year with the same car at Hockenheim, they purposefully tested the car in late fall and very low track temperatures which are well below optimal for these tires. I don’t believe this was a simple “scheduling error”, I believe it was done deliberately to sandbag it. Too much for coincidence.
so you mean the Dodge Viper ACR that has a manual transmission and an extremely limited top speed due to its aerodynamics is 10 seconds faster? lol and not to forget, during the official lap record, the driver miss shifted a few times. The Viper ACR is for sure a sub 7 minute car.
Everyone can speculate all they want but GM confirmed they are seeing the same lap times >>> “While making the deal to borrow the car with Aaron Link (GMV manager) Gebhardt asks Link he he drove the C8 Z06 at the Nurburing and Link showed him a video of his last visit showing a 7:10 during development testing. ” Also, Michelin warmed the tires and GM setup the electronics mode for Christian. Basically he was driving in engineer mode, and mode not available to the public. For those blaming the bean counters on the transmission flub, GM blew their R&D budget on the pointless Ferrari clone LT6, yet another engine GM will abandon. A revised 600 HP LS7 would have been amazing along with a focus on removing 500 lbs.
@@TranceFurbeing quicker is all speculation until GM applies to formally run a Nurburgring certified record lap. They never will because they know they cant. They’ve had plenty of time. GM radically changed the platform and can only match C7 times. Insanity. The 4000+ lb ZR1 will be quick but I’m betting it won’t beat the GT2 that has less horsepower.
@@WindyCity1992 being quicker is all speculation until GM applies to formally run a Nurburgring certified record lap. They never will because they know they cant. They’ve had plenty of time. GM radically changed the platform and can only match C7 times. Insanity. The 4000+ lb ZR1 will be quick but I’m betting it won’t beat the GT2 that has less horsepower.
@@anonymous..-Everybody skips it's a 4,000 pound car.Thats heavy for a mid engine car.If gm went under 7 minutes they would of been showing off that number.
Amazing that some of these facts from Sport Auto only came out after Misha called them out. Not to mention we still don't have any basic telemetry data to see (not even RPMs), nor the PDR data. If they want to be taken seriously as "journalists", they need to be 100% transparent upfront (not after being called out) and provide the telemetry source data from the car's built-in PDR footage. Some insightful comments in the video point out the many mistakes during the lap and how the guy is slower than Misha in certain sections of the track (and don't forget that Misha had the slower Euro version of the car): "But that guy made a ton of mistakes on this lap. Including a oversteer on entry at 1:52. He misses the curbing after that. Completely misses the apex at 5:30. Over brakes at 6:17 and again at 7:26. He's hitting the gas BEFORE the apex. The transmission shifting like crap and he's not using manual mode to fix it." The fact that GM did a 7:10 with their engineers (not a pro driver) and in traffic during industry pool, tells you everything you need to know about this garbage Sport Auto lap.
The information was in the magazine all along, nobody is reading the article before commenting. It happens every time Sport Auto releases a video. People comment but don't read the article. For instance, Misha is questioning auto mode, but the article explains this was the request of GM for the best time.
@@anonymous..- Yeah, because the guy wasn't going to bother spending any time learning the car. That's exactly the advice I would give someone jumping in the car and doing just one or two hot laps on super-long track. And all my other points still stand too.
a) Track condition RED b) Cold tires c) Visibly conservative driving (early braking, not pushing the car near its mechanical grip limits on corners, leaving it in Auto mode with weirdly visible downshift and upshift events). Misha pointed all these out in his analysis video, this is a guy that is not only very experienced with hot lapping on the Ring, but also had seat time in this very car. d) ZERO data/evidence transparency from Sport Auto: Not just refusing to share the car's PDR footage with telemetry data, but not even placing a camera so the instrument cluster RPMs, G-meter, and speedometer could be visible. I don't care where "GM staff placed the radio"...its on them as journalists to adjust the camera to make the dash data visible, or add an extra camera. Even better to just release the PDR footage which is even easier for them to do, yet they refuse to do it. e) Not enough warm-up to at least get basic familiarity with the car's dynamics so that it could be pushed properly. f) The fact that they did not disclose some basic facts until Misha rightly called them out publicly, hurts this media org's credibility. Given all the above factors, that is way more than enough to throw away the credibility of this garbage lap. On a side note, I'm a firm believer that cars should be developed at the Ring given all the valuable data and variety of parameters that it provides. But this Ring hero lap nonsense is all a non-real world game, and is purely a function of the Ring's ownership/management gatekeeping with all the preferences given to their domestic manufacturers with track access, not to mention expense and hoops they make you jump through, but also logistically needing to camp out for 1 month+ to wait for the right weather conditions. For car lap comparisons, it's much more realistic to use lap times at a variety of tracks around the world where the track ownership/management gives better access for hot lap time setting rather than the lack of access at the Ring.
GM confirmed they are seeing the same lap times “While making the deal to borrow the car with Aaron Link (GMV manager) Gebhardt asks Link if he drove the C8 Z06 at the Nurburing and Link showed him a video of his last visit showing a 7:10 during development testing."
That's on a different track I believe, and every track has a different characteristic that benefits one type of car or more but usually based on that characteristic be it downforce, lightweight, high hp and so on. GM already has a time as they also claimed 7:10 time when asked by this same driver and group.
U know nothing about racing. Please never speak again. Imagine acting like all tracks net the same result. 😂😂😂 holy hell dude. Do u even think before u type
@@leofhr2966 I specified it's Car & driver's lightning lap which is not on the ring. But all the cars are tested on the same track. It's very obvious this lap is not near full potential.
If they get in a proper lap in good track conditions, I think it'll do it in well under 7 minutes. With equal or better aero than the Z06 (which should've done a faster lap than 7:10) and roughly double the power of a GT3 RS, which did it under 7, the ZR1 pretty much has to be sub 7.
It’s like they handed him the car with cold tires, road-sport gearbox tuning and told him to just drive. Sad to see it being compared to cars that left nothing on the track.
I have no problem letting the car shift itself because now no one can claim driver error. It is what it is, the gear box shifting is not optimal…at least for this track.
Probably purposely held back in order to artificially inflate the gap between the C8 ZR1 and the C8 Z06, which otherwise, might not have been large enough to justify the inevitable MSRP price gap there.
In sport auto they say tires were pre heated at 85 degree and the engineers recommended not to use the paddle shifts as the gearbox in automatic mode would be as perfect as Porsches PDK. They also say that the ratio of the 5th gear cost the car a sub 7 lap.
It’s also possible that the way he was driving it led to the downshifts, he may have been too late on the throttle and the car downshifted because it knew it could go faster through those corners. It almost looks like he did one and only one lap, which is rather odd… Normally you would run some familiarization laps before attempt.
Sport Auto used the AMG GTR 7 years ago and achieved the exact same lap time. You should compare the AMG GTR video with the C8 Z06. Both cars have the same weight, but the tires differ - one uses Cup 2, the other Cup 2R. There’s a 100 horsepower difference, and the aero should be at a similar level, though the C8 might generate more downforce.
Lets be real, AMG GTR supposed to have 585hp, but in reality it's more like 650hp. Like all modern turbo engines it's more powerful than claimed. 7:10 is absolutely legit. Maybe 5 seconds improvement possible, but that's it. Gt3 rs is still a lot faster
A lot of people here blaming the driver, I want to point out that he didn’t have any issues with 99% of the cars he was given, and he didn’t feel the need to sandbag the c7 zo6 time as well. If there’s any problem with the lap time, I think it’s more likely with the car
I wish there was a Manual version of this car for Street Driving. For those of us that care a bit less about Lap Times and just want to grunt around like an Orc.
5th gear ain't the problem. it out accelerated the 6:49 gt3rs in 5th gear 223 kph to 287 kph by 0.88s. problem is gt3rs exit onto the longest straight 20 kph faster vs c8z!.
I think with the wacky auto he definitely lacked confidence given the gearshifts were haphazard, gearing sucks big time but I think if he had full manual control he would be significantly faster here.
GM already confirmed they also got 7:10 on the dot. Sport auto has VERY GOOD drivers. They have many times that actualy beat the official brands time. Z06 5th gear is too long and cant keep up that simple.
One long gear isn’t going to completely tarnish a lap, it’s not that cut and dry. If you simply watch the video and know what to look for, you’ll spot multiple errors that the driver made throughout the lap, errors that most definitely cost him several tenths.
Where does gm confirm this? Very good driver not using paddle shift?, and going slower speeds through many corners than what Misha was doing on his laps? No.
honestly based on the video the gears do look slightly off but not that big of a deal the driver made a few mistakes and frankly strange that they posted this lap because it could certainly be faster
For the price of the car 7:11 is a very strong performance. There is no faster video of the vette on youtube - that tells you quite a bit. It may do a 7:06, mabye 7:05 in perfect conditions, but never sub 7. It is what is.
Idk, The Viper fully manual did a 7.01 in worse conditions and circumstances. Maybe he was sandbagging, we'll never know. But there are slower cars that have run faster. I mean the ACR is much slower than the Z06
GM Performance Product director said they got the same time and showed Sport Auto the video. There's no conspiracy. GM has been there with this car for years and hasn't released a time. The whole thing is obvious. Great car, just not a match for this track.
GM's lap time has been in the industry pool during testing and with traffic though. According to my knowledge there has been no lap time because the actual lap time-timeslot couldn't be used due to weather.
Hopefully they repeat this test: At least there is something wrong with: A: Tyres (regular Cup 2 would be as fast or even more fast) B: Driver at that day
It's a $100k car that does a 7:10 with an unoptimized setup. I don't have a problem with it at all. 7:12.13 Dodge Viper ACR (2010) Dominik Farnbacher 2011-09-14 7:08.34 McLaren 720S Christian Gebhardt 2018-06-28 7:13.00 Porsche 918 Spyder Horst von Saurma 2014-06 Time seems decent to me 🤷♀
Reminds me of the Porsche Cayman where DeMan came out with a shorter gearing. In the case of the Corvette, possibly a cost saving measure, however, most are here in the USA where many tracks have long straights. Also, the tall “highway” gearing helps allows the car to sneak by and pass the emission and fuel consumption in the standard government tests here.
This lap is the pure display of playing it safe, which isn't a bad thing. Prolly not the most comfortable and reassuring ride for the driver, that said, this Generation of Z06 is just there to be there. Maybe next year there'll be another attempt, with a bit more optimized version of the Z06.
Honestly, looking at that list it looks massively skewed against American cars, either the driver wasn't top of his game or he intentionally went too slow to put the upstart American car in its place.... seeing the amount of extremely easy-going driving on display+the constant mis-shifting was so bizarre for a supposed lap-record-attempt.
It's a conspiracy. Let's conveniently ignore the 7:10 set by GM. They just happen to be as untalented as that biased, sandbagging german loser from sport auto.
@@DickeJunge_vonderSchaukelIs that why the Z06 matched it at Big Willow, beat it by 1.6 seconds at Magny Cours, and then beat it once more at Throttle House’s home track, with the Vette being in HTC form for that one?
another clownshow from ScamAuto, thanks for reviewing it honestly and pinpointing all the stuff. Even just a gearbox in auto mode should tell you all you need to know about how hard he's going. No proper driver would go 10/10 with the risk of a gearbox randomly shifting at the inappropriate moment, as you said it yourself as well.
The long 5th is almost definitely meant to meet US fuel efficiency requirements. Those get tougher every year which might explain why some 7yo cars were able to do better.
Should have been in manual/paddle mode to set a fast time imo. The procharger supercharged Z06 has nearly 200hp extra, would be a beast with the extra hp.
You could see the Wallkie Talkie was not completely covering the big D on the dashboard. H was in AUTOMATIC for the WHOLE Lap. This is gonna go deep... I can feel it lol
Sounds to me the sport auto reasoning of the tall fifth gear make sense. When the car takes 12 seconds instead of 6 seconds to go from 200-250. That’s a whole chunk of time lost. That said, GM should be able to fix this easily.
It is annoying that they did this. In the US it really doesn’t make much difference on most tracks here as the tracks just aren’t this fast up top, and I suppose they’re rationale was they weren’t going to sell too many cars in Europe… But they would sell more if they’d have nailed this lap for sure, so to me this was a marketing miss by being overruled by bean counters. Having said that, I do think he left a fair amount of time on the table here in the time should’ve been closer to the 705 range even with him at the wheel have been going full tilt in better conditions. And conditions made a difference. It is suspicious that both times they tested this vehicle, last year at Hockenheim and this year atthe Ring, they chose sub optimal conditions under which to do so. Cup2Rs do not like cold tarmac, and they doubtlessly know this. I’m sure that the large amount of advertising dollars, boondoggles, car loaners, etc. they receive from Porsche had nothing to do with this decision.
@@markw9512Its not like Chevy pays reviewers to not put a 911 Turbo S in a drag race against the C8 Z06 as well, because we know how that ends. 7 billion dollar investment in the C8, and probably the same amount of money in marketing lol.
@ because Chevrolet themselves has said that the competition for it is the GT3. It’s a twin turbo versus a naturally aspirated motor with the turbo S. Let’s see how the twin turbo Porsche does against the twin turbo ZR1. 😘 But that is straight line speed. On track, the Z06 has turned lap times several seconds faster than the 992 turbo S has, anywhere including the ring.
@ again: the GT3 is **400 pounds lighter** than the Corvette. You the cars have to have equivalent horsepower when the GT3 is 400 pounds lighter? Plus Porsche underrates their horsepower GT3s produce 470 hp on the Dyno, indicating a true 560 HP crank. Combine that with 400 fewer pounds and the horsepower to weight ratio of these vehicles is basically identical.
They sand bagged the Z06. Since when do you drive the car with a DCT in auto mode on a hot lap and its because they dont want people seeing the Z06 be 2-3 seconds faster a car from America that cost ALOT less then the 911 GT3 and 2-3s faster on track is a clear lead but i guess we will never know the truth because no way that was a legit attempt i watched this dude do other hot laps doesnt drive auto mode letting the cars shift but this one he does, Misha is faster then him in CheatCode:Z06 also not in auto, WE NEED A GO FUND ME/GIVE SEND GO TO RAISE MONEY TO SET IT ALL UP WITH U.S.A. SPEC Z06, FRESH CUP 2R, CLEAR TRACK, MISHA DRIVER, I BET IT DOES A 6:59 OR BETTER NO SWEAT!🇺🇸👍🏻🦅
this is a very vibes based analysis, but i felt like watching someone just messing around and having fun driving around the nurburgring, not someone going fast. i mean the car is moving fast sure, but i felt like the car had potential for way more. Both because of the driving but also because of how the car behaved
Hey Misha, thanks for your analysis. Maybe we can help a little here. That the fast lap was driven in automatic mode was the recommendation of the Corvette development engineers. The radio was also placed on the dashboard by the Corvette engineers. There is nothing special behind it. Even though the tires were preheated with heating blankets before the fast lap, they were not quite at the perfect working temperature in the first part of the Nordschleife lap, as you could see when braking in Hatzenbach. The lap was driven on September 17, 2024, when the Nordschleife also did not have perfect grip. But that's part of the Supertest, that we can't set lap times countless times like a manufacturer. We only get one day for the fast lap and have to live with the external conditions. And as already mentioned: The internal lap time of the Corvette developers, which was shown to us during our test, was also 7.10 minutes.
Thank you for the additional clarification. A lot of people like to claim that sport auto doesn't know wtf they're doing.
Misha obviously has to keep in the back of his mind that most of his viewers are from the US. So obviously, glaze the corvette and smell some conspiracy by sport auto.
@@customurlgoeshereGreat observation, especially the 2nd part. You nailed it.
And oh how very convenient it is that both times you have scheduled this car, it has been in sub optimal temperatures by tens of degrees. Just a coincidence I’m sure, not a part of any institutional bias towards Porsche , whose tests you always manage to conduct when temperatures are ideal. In fact you waited a full year after running the cold test at Hockenheim, until temperatures were cold again, to run the super test on the Z06!! Do it right or don’t do it at all.
@@customurlgoeshereexactly that. His C8 Video had tons of views.
@@markw9512Amg did its record run in damp conditions as well. You guys cant beat the 911s, stop being mad.
The decision to reuse the Stingray’s gear ratios, paired with a different final drive, seems driven purely by cost-saving measures. However, applying the same ratios to two cars with vastly different power curves (LT2 vs. LT6) and RPM limits (6,500 vs. 8,500) is far from ideal. Increasing the final drive to compensate and shorten 4th and 5th gears significantly impacts the first two gears, making them overly short and impractical. The Z06 deserves a bespoke gear set tailored to its unique characteristics. Optimized gearing would not only enhance driver confidence which was lacking in the test but also unlock the car’s full potential, likely achieving a Nürburgring lap time under 7:05-matching at least the GT3 in Sport Auto’s Super Test.
@@saeed5853 This Gear Ratio is a real shame! This car could be as fast as a GT3 RS!!!😜🤷♂️
The Viper ACR went faster without factory support
@@einautofan6685 Slow down there tiger, GT3 RS is a bit of an exaggeration.
The gear ratios are already a problem on the base stingray, so applying them to a car with a much higher redline and *less* torque results in these gearing struggles. I do agree cost-savings played a big role, many parts are re-used from the stingray to the ZR1 for that reason, but also emissions testing and mileage testing that goes throughout a range of gears also played a part. It's unfortunate that a car with a lightning-quick 8 speed DCT only really has 4 useable gears for performance, and a 5th gear for a top speed number. Hopefully the ZR1's power band suits the gearing a lot better.
This car has no chance vs the 992 gt3rs. Maybe the 2019 one.
Odd that GM chose 4 performance gear ratios + 4 economy gear ratios, should have been 6+2
it's actually 3 performance and 5 economy. Acceleration drops HARD when you're shifting from 3 to 4 on any Corvette made in the last few decades.
They've been doing that stupid crap since C5 corvette, due to local regulations and lack of will to find a way around it. 4th is just not that bad as 5th, but still drop in acceleration is extreme.
@@maximborodyuk3773 the C5 Z06 in particular is diabolical. To get a good 0-60 time it has a 2nd gear so low it feels like you have shifted back into 1st, then after a decently placed 3rd, 4th gear kills the car for good.
@@maximborodyuk3773 Even the C4 got nobbled with the 4+3 Doug Nash gear box. AFAIK Corvette never made a 5 speed manual.
3 performance gear ratios and the rest for economy. Surprised it has done as well as it has
@@oliverwood3404 I had C7 GS up until recently. A lot of positives, but gearing...On mountain roads, when you're on high elevation, it barely pulls on 4th our of 7 (manual). LIke you could go flatout for dozen seconds or even more without running of gear, barely accelerating. Top speed supposedly on 5th, but it would take forever to reach it, and not on high altitude.
And 1st is extremely short, 2nd is barely usable too (except really twisty stuff), which leaves you with exactly 1 good gear, Lol.
Such a shame.
Having car now that has top speed on 7th out of 7 gear feels a bit weird.
Savagegeese same day/same driver/same track comparison of Z06 vs GT3. Corvette and GT3 manufacturer teams on hand making sure both vehicles’ setups were optimal:
Times:
Z06: 1’27”240
GT3: 1’27”329
Tight, short track. Pro driver said GT3 would definitely lose advantage on longer tracks and Z06’s lead would grow on them. This is an excellent, very well put together comparison video which goes into great detail explaining the strengths and weaknesses of both cars. Highly recommended.
It is very bizarre the z06 was only 3 seconds faster than the c7 z06. To me that was the biggest tell that this test was sandbagged.
That was vs a GT3. Not an rs which is why I think everyone is mad. Also makes me mad
@ForzaDriftMan ThrottleHouse tested it faster than a GT3RS, as did Car and Driver, and as did Motorsport Magazine.
@@IndependenceCityMotoring Yeah people really can't handle that a corvette is that fast.
To be fair lap times between tracks and drivers are not really comparable. Just bc 1 car is fastest at Track A doesn't necessarily translate to B. What a car CAN do and what a car gives the driver confidence to do are also a major differentiator. Sport Auto has been testing 911's for decades and they change iteratively each generation. The Z06 is completely new. There's just no way their driver felt as comfortable as he does when testing a car like a 911. Just as an example go look at the C6ZR1 lap vs other cars like GT3 with the same times. Very similar times, but the ZR1 looks like it's about to lose control constantly and it's scary just watching the video much less being the driver.
When Misha drove the Z06 he really kept the revs high up.
He keeps up high on everything he drives, too high sometimes
@@westcoastfrisco Please explain how that's wrong?
@@EvoraGT430 not all cars make peak power at or near redline. He drives an American V8 like a GT3. Completely different motors and power curves.
@@westcoastfrisco The LT6 is a high revving, 12.5:1 CR, FPC V8, where peak power comes in at 8400rpm, and peak torque is made at around 6400rpm. It’s… Supposed to stay up high; that’s where the meat of its power is made. The engine is happiest when it’s revved out. It may be “American”, but it’s very much an exotic engine, ripped right out of the C8.R GT3 race car.
@@danieldickerson4838he’s talking about American V8s in general, not the Z06.
I'm going to say gearing like others have, but also the driver is a big reason why too. I'm not saying I can do this, I sure as shit can't. But that guy made a shitload of mistakes on this lap. Including a oversteer on entry at 1:52. He misses the curbing after that. Completely misses the apex at 5:30. Over brakes at 6:17 and again at 7:26. He's hitting the gas BEFORE the apex. The transmission shifting like shit and he's not using manual mode to fix it. There are tenths left all over the place because he doesn't feel confident in the car. If we can visually see the fuckups from gopro footage, I'm sure there are far far more. People make mistakes, but like, it is a pro drivers job to get a perfect, inhuman lap. No mistakes.
I can’t do this either but you make a valid point.
People refuse to hear sport auto didnt do the car justice, it was a far from perfect run and the car has proven plenty capable otherwise.5th gear is definitely long but people want to crutch on it like it destroys the car
@@skylerhickman3646Yep. The 5th gear is a little long, but not to the point where it’s suddenly killing the car and tarnishing an entire lap. The Norschleife is a different beast, and much, MUCH longer, yes, but on every other track that the Z06 has been tested on, it’s either been one of the top fastest production cars ever, or THE fastest, even setting two lap records. Something is definitely off here.
@@danieldickerson4838 Not to mention the Z06 STILL accelerates quicker than the gt3rs at the top end in 5th gear. Misha kinda nailed it on the head
@@MarcusSteigerexactly, the car is being unpredictable for him and he has probably tested more cars there than anyone
This car beat the 992 GT3 RS at Magny Cours by over half a second.
Something is WAY off here.
Imagine if suddenly the 992 GT3 RS had a time from American testers that was seconds slower than the Z06. People would rightfully be skeprical.
Different tracks will always net different results; however, I agree on this lap attempt not being the best it could be.
This car beat the 992 GT3 RS by more than 1 second on Val De Vienne and even went sub 2:40 on there. Only other car to do the is Ferrari 296 GTB.
Driver definitely wasn't fully pushing it.
Wrong. "The zo6 has long 5th gear which makes it perform very bad in the straights"
@@elijahprasad7884and the gt3 rs beat the c8 z06 on the laguna seca, vir, willow springs, etc so what’s your point?
Never before I thought that Gran Turismo 4's auto transmission logics could be realistic at least for one car
Also when you drove the Z06, going up to Flugplatz you reached 232 kph and you weren't going for an all out lap. This guy did 226 kph going up to Flugplatz. Also the minimum speed through Flugplatz on this lap was 173 kph, while the C7 Z06 did 174 kph with front engine less downforce, less sticky tires. C8 Z06 should be doing 177-181 kph bare minimum through there since that's what the AMG GT Black Series and 991 GT2 RS are doing.
Indeed. And, Misha was pulling 1.5Gs in a non-Z07 equipped (it only had the aero, not the cup tires, stiffer springs etc), OPF Euro-spec Z06, consistently. A properly set up, US-spec Z07 should absolutely run through the ring with no issue, longer 5th gear aside. Christian wasn’t flogging the car at all, and the mistakes he made throughout the lap were clear. He’s a fantastic driver and knows the ring, but his run here was *far* from optimal.
@@danieldickerson4838 not a mistakes. It's deliberate.
@maximborodyuk3773 the C8 Z06 did a 7:12 in heavy traffic during testing in 2021 btw. Only dropping 2 seconds is proof he threw the lap on purpose
@@maximborodyuk3773So, GM themselves managing around 7:10 themselves is also deliberate?
@@Bug4life GM was just testing the car and tuning/developing it. They didn't do an all out run for an official time.
The guy was sawing on the steering wheel and not paddle shifting Misha could bust that guys lap. Go for it!
It is supposed to be on automatic.
@@permanentlybored195 Is it? Kinda cringe not using paddles.
@@MiGujack3 idk the gt3 rs lap was automatic aswell.
@@MiGujack3yes, the manufacturer recommended the automatic mode
@@jedispartancoolman Likely because they had limited time for Christian to learn the car. At Ron Fellow’s Corvette driving school, they recommend to use the paddles. They help to keep the car in its optimal powerband, and prevent oddities like what happened during the lap from happening. It’s a smart and incredibly fast DCT, but you’d obviously want to be shifting yourself to maximize the car’s potential.
My conspiracy theory is that Chevy purposefully left the Z06 somewhat unoptimized for track use to leave more room for improvement for the ZR1. Putting 670hp to the ground with only 2 driven wheels is hard enough, putting down 400 hp more seems impossible.
Tinfoil hat wearer here, I am with you on this.
I think the traction control is nerfing the power delivery sooo much, the forward progress has been hampered. Or possibly, the suspension is not factory set well for that track.
Cheers
Not that difficult with a high rpm powerband and mid engine.
More likely the gearing was for EPA regulations in the US to get to target fuel average
honestly you are probably correct
@@petera4476 I owned two older Vettes ,(C6 and C7),and for track use it's easy to SHUT OFF traction control but not ABS.
Tend to agree with these takes. This looks like an early lap and not maximum attack. The driver surely must've noticed that the automatic shifting wasn't working out, but if it's possibly even the first lap it isn't likely something you'd adjust in the middle of the lap in an unfamiliar car. Even with somewhat shitty gearing it's hard to believe that it's only 2-3s faster than the C7 Z06 on less sticky tires was with the same driver seven years ago.
Driver takes his hands off the wheel! Show me one maximum effort lap where that happens anywhere else.
Didn’t the 2019zr1 do 7.19
2:40 that is wild the tires have to be cold and he has to be babying it. 120mph over the crest is stock miata territory...
Yes, it’s just coincidental I’m sure, but both times they have tested this vehicle they have chosen to do so in very cold, sub optimal temperatures for the Cup2Rs. Not like their objective is to make it look slower than it actually is to satisfy Porsche or anything, oh no no no no no no.
@@markw9512So the Americans paid the Gt3 Rs to be faster at Laguna Seca then the C8 Z06.
@@senadhasanbasic260 no other magazine in the world has such a contorversial results with any car on any track regarding where it came from. GT3RS is supposed to be faster on most tracks than c8 z06. 3x the downforce...
@ the point is, they were faster by *under a second*., 0.7 Which indicates they would, if the car were correctly driven under same conditions, be closer at this track.
@@senadhasanbasic260Looks like the Italians paid Sportauto to do a sub 7 as well....lol.
It just tells me he doesn't know the car; isn't comfortable with it to be able to really push it.
According to Sport Auto, they equaled the time set by GM's development driver. Arguably, the person who should be the most familiar with the car.
@@mtnman1984Sounds like bs though…
@@stickvortex if it was, GM would have already refuted it. The car was provided by GM at the track with factory support.
@@stickvortexLol if Chevy would be faster they woulda publish their time
@@stickvortex the Corvette developers also got 7:10
Give us the PDR video. He hasn’t even said what PTM mode was used, we don’t even know if TC was on. He just said it was in “my mode”.
If it was in "My Mode", then the traction control system was full on or full off. You can't enable PTM in "My Mode". Good catch.
I am someone who loves the Z06 but has no racing experience and knows little but from this video you explain it very well and I understand everything you're talking about and they're definitely not giving it all or they're hiding something
The Viper ACR ran a 7.1 in wet conditions with a crowdfunded team and a manual gearbox. Man that's wild! Surprised it isn't on the list for comparison.
Thank you for confirming my suspicion that there is definitely several seconds lost on that lap. I would bet that early slide lost at least a half second itself.
GM is sandbagging to make the ZR1 look out of this world fast. This driver looks like he’s out for a Sunday drive.
with your impressions this looked more like a test run
Misha - Hello from the states. As you critique: the driver has the transmission in Auto. I've done both with my Z07 on my local race track. The auto shifting is... well let's call it dubious. It's unsettling. It'll do very well for a bit as long as you're driving 8-10/10ths. But breathe off the throttle a bit, and it gets a bit confused (it's changing modes when you do that) and then shifts in some of the weirdest spots. I recorded my laps and you can clearly hear me say, "oof!" when it decided to shift at a weird spot, unsettling the car.
GM's keen on folks using the car in Auto, but I'm not quite sure the shifting algorithm is ready for track time. Use the paddles!
Keen on using Auto I understand, but I also guarantee that the transmission calibration engineers didn't set up that auto shift algorithm for a 10/10 Nurburgring lap.
It’s super strange, Maybe the alignment was completely off, the car has massive down force and one of the widest cup 2r tires front and rear in the industry. I can agree with the gearing, ok, but it should fly through the corners at massive speeds, but the corners where it was slow, it doesn’t make any sense. And on the other tracks it was flying. That sport auto vibe felt bad for me either. Seems like the driver was not pushing at all or was afraid of it.
Nothing strange dont make exuses, if its 07:00 capable car then GM would have released lap time after doing 2 years in a row attempts, but instead kept quiet.
@ there are no excuses, just mere facts and curiosity why this exact car couldn’t show the speed and lateral G in the corners that it showed on other race tracks dozens of times. Any car with bad alignment or improper setup will drive terrible. When Misha drove the EU spec car, he said he was completely amazed with its cornering capabilities and that car was on worse tires
@@coolguy_2997 Who is Misha? F1 driver champion or something? It's not like he is perfect, btw GM just now stated the lap time is what they expected themselves
@@TRX25EX Misha drove more supercars and track cars than any F1 driver (and the F1 cars behave the opposite way of ‘normal’ cars anyway) so he has relevant track experience (especially on the NR) to have a well grounded opinion on these cars. And he said among rivals - he prefers only the 992 gt3 rs to this Vette. I’m not a fan here but I really wanted to see a hard push with the well setup car but I saw a safe side driving with a lot of mistakes with the car behaving very strange.
@@coolguy_2997 Show me one Track Attempt video without mistake I'm waiting , even AMG One had countless of mistakes which is normal, look at Su7 video that car even turned off and lost power lol.
Don't act as driver need to be perfect if Misha perfect let him go and do it than talk nonsense, the guy who did lap attempt is the most popular in top 50 lap times list so definitely he is more proven than Misha is by far.
I drove Lamborghini Ferrari Porsche Lotus McLaren Audi and at least 10 other makers even Morgan on a track does that make me good enough to do these lap attempts?
The Z06 sounds amazing
Viper ACR is still the American King of the Ring and its manual to boot!
Imagine an automatic acr with slightly more power, it would eat the gt3s.
The Viper is a legend. Absolutely insane car. The US folk really swung for the hills AND they hit right on the spot. I would have a Viper over a Porsche
@@rudySTi I do own a viper over a Porsche. So I get that!
@hprracingchannel That’s amazing man! Just saw your lap at the COTA too. Living the dream! Good stuff
That was my first thought. The Viper was way faster.
Firstly, the tall 5th gear is not a huge problem. Yes an extra gear would have helped aid that top end acceleration, BUT in caranddrivers instrumented test the Z07 C8 was 3.1 seconds faster 0-170mph than a 992.1 GT3 RS.
Secondly the driver in the video was not pushing it to the absolute limit. Its not a GM driver so he doesnt know the car thoroughly AND he has to get it back in one piece. On the other hand when Porsche tests its car they can afford to write the car off for a laptime.
Rumors are GM also tested the Z06 and got around 7:10 but thats only rumors I believe.
In the real world numerous youtube track comparisons and tests done by magazines have consistently shown the Z07 C8 to be in between a GT3 and GT3 RS when it comes to track times. This Z07 Z06 is definitely capable of a sub 7 with the right driver and right conditons
Edit: in caranddrivers instrumented tests, the Z07 C8 and GT3 RS 992.1 both produced 1.16g on a 300ft skidpad. So the C8 definitely has the cornering and too speed too.
I mean is it really a rumor when it's from the official company itself ? GM confirmed they are seeing the same lap times “While making the deal to borrow the car with Aaron Link (GMV manager) Gebhardt asks Link if he drove the C8 Z06 at the Nurburing and Link showed him a video of his last visit showing a 7:10 during development testing." Seems like it's pretty consistent.
@@leofhr2966Jim Mero lapped the Nurburgring in a C7 Z06 in 7:10 seconds. The previous gen car thats around 2-5 seconds slower on every single race track. GM tests it's cars using a 100 octane tune to be compatible with race fuel offered by various race courses around the world. The C8 Z06 was confirmed to be using it as well.
@@saltyfloridaman7163 then wheres GM lap time? they did attempts for 2 years in a row, why its not out? Misha claimed it can beat it and on that video I said it cant
@@leofhr2966where did they THEMSELVES state that? I’ve seen nothing but Sport Auto giving an unsubstantiated rumor about some random engineer giving them a time.
@philb9117 Random ? Also where is your claim that it isn't true ? Why would they lie and what's the point ? GM could easily claim it untrue but they themselves haven't, and why wouldn't they if it's false information that could ruin their reputation ? Why wouldn't they themselves post a time for the car to show how capable it truly is ? I get the car can do better, and I get the skepticism, but to claim that they are lying without anything to back it up is just being a hypocrite considering you have no way to prove them wrong when they have video evidence of the car performing on the track and are an established organization even recognized by Misha himself.
Crazy that I didn't realize that the car was in full auto until you mentioned it. I do wonder if only being given limited laps due to noise limits might be the reason like you said. The US spec Z06 is really loud from factory so I wouldn't be surprised. Sounds really good in person though.
@@KentPhillips I don't get the noise barrier at the Nürburgring! Sorry, after all this was still a production car at a race track!😜😏
@@einautofan6685 The ring is near a residential area. Probably noise complaints.
@@einautofan6685 I don't get why people move towards race tracks and complain about noise, but its best thing tracks can do to stay open as long as possible in a ever stricter world filled with more innate karenism
@@OttobonYeah. Someone sued to get Laguna Seca racetrack in the US shut down so I’m not surprised by anything anymore.
@@Ottobon Nobody moved close to a race track. They were there before. The nur is also a public road... Read a little before you open your mouth next time.
Am I the only one who feels like the driver was hesitant and a bit erratic. He kept fiddling with his helmet. He seemed to be doing a lot of unnecessary small steering adjustments. What do I know. I'm not a race driver but other drivers look smoother, more focused and faster.
Misha’s lap was far more impressive. @MishaCharoudin, you should get that orange Z06 you drove out there again on a track day and give it a full-blown lap !
At one point he let go of the steering wheel completely. Who would do that?
@@guysteelWhy not?
@@markw9512 ok tell misha to come and do 6 lap times attempts on Z06 in a booked session, if he does under 07:10 we will pay for all expenses, if he doesnt he pay for it all
@@TRX25EX who is “we “?
C8 Z08 Nürburgring GT Cruise Lap
Love your commentary and analysis on this video. Something sounded off to me about the 7:10 time for a C8 Z06, too.
What "sounded off" was that the Corvette wasnt best? Because why would it be. There is no reason why it would be. So if we just keep thinking something is "strange" every time its not best, well then you can always wait for next time. And next time, and next time.
Really enjoyed your commentary. I always learn things when I watch you drive and learned a lot from listening to your review of this. Yes - keep the revs up in the power band! I notice you always do this when you're driving and it's really helped me on track.
We call it sandbagging in the US. Driver wasn't interested in driving the car to it's full potential.
Nah z06 is just over hyped my guy. It's just another GM
@@uncleben6959fax.
I personally think it’s so when GM posts a 6:50 with the ZR1 it’ll make it seem out of this world fast.
@@hpkntnw my thought too
@@uncleben6959yea just another gm that beats the gt3 rs on most tracks.
Nearly 75% of the track was in shadow and the sun looked very low. I wonder what the ambient temperatures was? - Paul Yunker
"air temp: 18°C, track surface temp: 27°C"
@@dr80008 should be at least a bit warmer I assume.
@@dr80008 Did you consult the euro weather data for that date and approximate time? If so, good find!
5th gear is long because Chevy’s build to price approach uses the same gear ratios across 3 different engines and purposes in the Stingray, Z06 and ZR1. A little active aero would make a big difference too.
Despite its long 5th gear it still outaccelerates the GT3 RS to 150mph by 2 seconds. I own a 658whp 2004 Mustang Mach 1. It weighs 3600lbs and makes 50whp more than the C8 Z06 and I've raced one before. I have a T56 transmission and during a roll race event, the C8 Z06 still gave me trouble all the way to 165mph, i trapped 3mph faster at the end and we did a half mile roll. That extra long 5th gear isn't really the issue everyone thinks it is, it still beats Hellcat Redeyes in roll racing, my built Mustang had to reel it in and barely edged a win, and it was consistently among the best of the 600-700hp groups. At the crank I make about 740hp. Nothing about this video makes sense
@@saltyfloridaman7163 name checks out lmao
@@saltyfloridaman7163now if the gears was shorter the car would be giving u wayyy more problems. It makes peak power towards 8500 and if it upshoft and now at 6500 on a hill, that’s abt a 50-100hp loss jus cause the shift
With cup2R, it's 3 sec faster than the C7 Z06 on Cup2 non-r. So basically, it is slower than the C7 Z06.
Oy
It also has a slower overall time than the C7 Z06 on Cup 2 non-r tires with GM's 100 octane calibration. Jim Mero ran a 7:10 in 2015 with the 100 octane calibration.
The Cup2Rs make up 2.5 seconds on a 2.4 mile track. Even the V.I.R time for the C8 Z06 is 6 seconds over the C7 z06. This is nonsense on a 12.9 mile track like nordschlife
@@WindyCity1992aww poor guy and what’s your excuse for the regular c8 at 7:30? 😂
@@Bimmer_Billpoor guy? Cringey comment dude.
I've watched Best Motoring all my life, that great car show from Japan. It was like that there, whenever they tested Japanese cars against European ones, the Japanese ones were always better. whether it was Honda NSX or Nissan GTR against the rest, it was just as strange as now. I have the feeling from the video that it's the same, only the other way around. I think if a really good racer were driving there and getting everything out of it, it would 100% be 10-15 seconds faster
That's simply because a factory pro driver will have loads of practice laps. The engineers will also have time to fine tune the suspension.
It's normal that a hot lap with little preparation time will be 10+ seconds slower than a proper lap record by a manufacturer.
But even if you subtract that time, it'll be difficult to get sub 7 on the full 20.8km.
Always with the sandbagging… Just like they tested it on Hockenheim when it was very cold outside, well below the optimal range of the cup2rs, costing it multiple seconds. My understanding is they promised to redo it in warmer temperatures, but of course they never did. Follow the advertising money and you’ll see why.
Nonsense, people just don't understand Sport Auto laps and how they come about. They did a VERY slow lap in a Porsche GT4 RS MR recently but the internet didn't notice that I suppose. Even when Misha drove a different one, the C8 seemed extremely slow on the straights for a 650+ HP car. It literally accelerates like a 500HP GT3.
@ not nearly as slow as it was in this video. And fast enough to where Misha, who knows a thing or two about lapping at the Ring, felt very confident that it was fully capable of a sub seven minute time. Maybe you should watch this video all the way through instead of just commenting here.
@markw9512 Let's not compare youtubers with professionals who have been doing this for a lot longer. GM was apparently present at this test and assisted Sport Auto and from what is reported they didn't expect much different. I saw Misha's lap as well and it did not look sub-7 there either. It accelerated like a 500hp GT3 but down in the cornering speeds. Let's not forget that even a GT3 RS is barely sub-7 in Sport Auto terms.
@ let’s compare track numbers.
#### Base C8 lap times ####
EVO Magazine’s C8 hot lap at Anglissy, Steve Sutcliff’s hot lap.
Times:
Porsche Turbo 991.2 : 1’15”2
Corvette C8: 1’15”6
Porsche 992 Carrera S: 1’16”0
Nurburgring Lap Times:
Base Corvette C8: 7’29”9
Porsche Carrera S: 7’30”41
Porsche GT4: 7’32”0
Auto Bild Supertest, acceleration and hot lap, 2020 C8 Stingray, Sept 2020:
Lap times:
Corvette C8: 1’32”31
Porsche 992 911 Carrera S: 1’32”36
Lamborghini Huracan LP 610-4: 1’32”84
Car & Driver Lightning Lap, 2020:
Corvette C8: 2’49”0
Porsche GT4: 2’50”3
Road & Track, Grattan:
Base Corvette C8: 1’26”4
Porsche GT4: 1’26”5
Note that GT4s are ~425 lbs (193kg) lighter than C8s *and* have *much* grippier tires, Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2rs specifically.
#### Z06 vs Porsche GT3 and others ####
Car & Driver Lightning Lap 2023:
Corvette Z06: 2’38”6
Porsche GT4RS: 2’40”5
Lamborghini Huracan Tecnica: 2’43”9
From past few Lightning Laps, same track:
2022 Porsche GT3: 2’40”6
2019 Porsche GT3RS: 2’41”6
2021 Porsche Turbo S: 2’42”5
The fastest cars from all of Car & Driver’s Lightning Lap comparisons:
1. 2019 McLaren Senna: 2’34”9
2. 2021 Mercedes AMG-GT BS: 2’37”0
3. 2023 Porsche 911 GT3 RS: 2’37”2
4. 2018 Porsche GT2RS Weissach: 2’37”8
5. 2021 McLaren 765LT: 2’38”4
6. 2023 Corvette Z06: 2’38”6
7. 2019 Corvette ZR1: 2’39”5
8. 2018 McClaren 720S: 2’39”7
9. 2023 Porsche 911 GT3 MR: 2’39”8
10. 2022 Porsche Cayman GT4RS: 2’40”5
11. 2022 Porsche GT3: 2’40’6
12. 2019 Porsche GT3RS: 2’41”6
13. 2021 Porsche Carrera Turbo S: 2’42”5
14. 2020 McLaren 600LT Spider: 2’42”6
15. 2017 Ford GT: 2’43”0
16. 2015 Porsche 918 Spyder: 2’43”1
17. 2018 Mercedes AMG GT R: 2’43’4
18. 2023 Lambo Huracan Tecnica: 2’43”9
19. 2018 Lambo Huracan Perform.: 2’44”0
20. 2016 Dodge Viper ACR: 2’44”2
21. 2024 Lucid Air Sapphire 2’44”3
22. 2020 Ford Mstg Shelby GT500: 2’44”6
23. 2015 Corvette Z06: 2’44”6
24. 2020 Lamborghini Huracan Evo 2’45”0
25. 2019 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 LE 2’45”0
26. 2016 Ferrari 488GTB 2’45”1
27. 2017 Ford GT 2’45”5
28. 2018 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 LE 2’45”7
29. 2015 McClaren 650S Spider 2’45”8
And:
41. 2021 Corvette Stingray 2:49”0
46. 2012 Ferrari 458 Italia 2’49”9
Road & Track Performance Car of the Year, 2023:
Lamborghini Huracan Tecnica: 1’23”1
Porsche GT4RS: 1’22”7
Lamborghini Huracan STO (2022): 1’21”9
Corvette Z06: 1’20”6
Autobild Sportscars Supertest
Lausitzring lap times:
AMG GT Black Series: 1’25”23
ABT XGT 1’25”76
Ferrari 296 GTB: 1’25”88
Porsche 911 GT2 RS (991): 1’25”91
Corvette Corvette Z06/Z07: 1’27”41
Lamborghini Huracan STO: 1’27”94
Lamborghini Aventador SVJ: 1’28”05
AMG GT R Pro 1’28”39
Lamborghini Huracan Evo 1’28”82
Lamborghini Huracan Tecnica 1’28”96
Ferrari F8 Tributo 1’29”06
Porsche 911 Turbo S (992): 1’29”95
Porsche 911 GT3 RS (991): 1’30”60
Quattroruote magazine Vairano Pro track
1. Pagani Huayra BC Roadster 1’20”71
2. AMG GT Black Series 1’20”93
3. Ferrari 296 GTB 1’20”93
4. Ferrari SF90 Stradale 1’21”72
5. Porsche 911 GT3 (992) 1’22”79
6. Corvette Z06 Z07 Package 1’23”73
7. Lamborghini Huracán STO 1’23”82
8. Lamborghini Revuelto 1’24”39
9. Maserati MC20 1’26”55
10. BMW M4 Competition Coupe 1’28”61
11. Maserati GranTurismo Trofeo 1’31”75
Savagegeese same day/same driver/same track comparison of Z06 w/Z07 vs GT3. Corvette and GT3 manufacturer teams on hand making sure both vehicles’ setups were optimal:
Times:
Z06: 1’27”240
GT3: 1’27”329
Tight, short track. Pro driver said GT3 would definitely lose advantage on longer tracks and Z06’s lead would grow on them. This is an excellent, very well put together comparison video which goes into great detail explaining the strengths and weaknesses of both cars. Highly recommended.
From fastest laps site:
Sport Auto Fr. Val de Vienne lap times
Rank Vehicle Time
1 Ferrari 296 GTS 1’37”70
2 C8 Z06 (Z07) 1’39”30
3 992 GT3 RS 1’41”60
4 992 GT3 1’42”80
5 M4 CSL 1’43”28
6 GT4 RS 1’44”65
Motorsport Magazine (chart at end of vid shown w/times):
McLaren Senna 1'14"93 (TrofeoR)
C8 Z06 (Z07) 1'15"23 (Cup 2R)
991.2 GT2 RS 1'15"91 (Cup 2R)
992 GT3 RS 1'15"96 (Cup 2R)
Ferrari 488 Pista 1'16"06 (Cup 2R)
Montecello Motor Club North Course Fastest laps:
AMG GT Black Series: 1’19”42
C8 Z06 (Z07): 1’20”55
911 GT3 (992): 1’21”69
Huracan STO: 1’21”9
718 Cayman GT4 RS: 1’22”70
Huracan Tecnica: 1’23”10
M4 CSL: 1’24”20
Sport Auto Mendig AFB Circuit:
Lamborghini Huracan STO: 1’45”57
C8 Z06 (Z07): 1’45”91
McClaren 650 S Spider: 1’45”35
911 GT3 (992): 1‘47”16
GT4 RS: 1’48”16
C8 Z06 set production car record
at Canada's Canadian Tire Motorsport Park, 2023.
Throttle House Track Test:
1. C8 Z06: 1’06”56
2. 992 GT3 RS: 1’06”67
3. BAC Mono: 1’07”52
4. Viper ACR: 1’07”55
5. 992 GT3: 1’07”77
Hagerty test of Z06 vs 992 GT3 RS & M3 CSL, Jason Camissa with Randy Pobst driving. Willow Springs, high speed track with 992 GT3 RS’s active aero winning the day here, near freezing track temps.
Times:
GT3 RS: 1’24”3
Z06: 1’24”9
Yeah that Camara test at 3*C was also the first thing that came to my mind. And Sport Auto did shit like that 10 years ago, thats why we stopped reading their print media it was so obvious.
You can tell he's not on the limit, letting go of the wheel, adjusting, one-handed driving, relaxed, automatic shifting, etc.
You've never seen F1 drivers drive with their knees.
7:10 is 2 seconds slower than a mclaren 720s. That is lighter and more powerful. Dont matter how you cut it. 7:10 is pretty darn good
It’s also 5 seconds slower than a gt3 rs from 2019 with 520 horsepower what’s your point? Also 4 seconds slower than an amg gtr pro on worse tires and is front engine
Copium
@@ericship8383 it's also 9 seconds slower than a Viper ACR without factory support. 😂😂😂😂
@@Turshin Viper ACR laptime is 7:01.3
This is massive cope 😂😂 yall were saying it would be the gt3rs 992
Why is everybody so upset? It makes total sense. The Corvette Z06 is not built to be a dedicated track car like RS series Porsches are, nor is it a Nurburgring special like the RSs. The Z06 is extremely track capable, but ultimately street biased. A 7:10 lap time is not exactly slow in that regard. Sport Auto already pointed out the gear ratio issue, which is not ideal in this case but completely in line with the intended purpose of the car.
Common sense here?
I don't know if upset is the right word, it's just a bit strange is all. With Cup 2 R:s it should definitely be more than 2-3s faster than the C7 lap from 7 years ago on normal Cup 2:s. It was almost 5s faster around the much shorter VIR in the C&R's Lightning Lap for example. That combined with the strange choice to leave it in full auto, which is clearly costing time, makes it look like this isn't the full potential.
@@osenmosen That C7 lap was factory and on a 200m longer track. The C8 is faster than the C7. Sport Auto doesnt do perfect laps or try to showcase the perfect lap. They dont have the means for that.
What people are upset about is that GM invested 7 billion into a new chassis for a 3 second gain, which is still 15 seconds slower than the gt3.
C7 zr1 did a 6:57 the track pack c8 zr1 should easily do sub 6:50 seconds the c8 zr1 and c7 zr1 or z06 are both capable of beating the Porsche gt3rs they do all the time in imsa series. The c8 zr1 will be sub 7 minutes easy if done right and with track pack. The new mustang gtd will probably beat the gt3rs time watch... but c8 zr1 and c7 zr1 both capable of sub 6:55 c8 zr1 should be able to match gt3rs. Viper acr idk what its best time for the ring was another good track car.
Underwhelming indeed, many things seem wrong with that car. Hopefully they will get things sorted and try again next year.
I agree with Misha that whether intentionally or unintentionally the RPMs and gear position are not visible. Same for throttle. A fast lap video with an alleged 5th gear problem without the viusalization of RPMs, throttle and gears is weird indeed.
I think more important was the fact that, just as they did last year with the same car at Hockenheim, they purposefully tested the car in late fall and very low track temperatures which are well below optimal for these tires. I don’t believe this was a simple “scheduling error”, I believe it was done deliberately to sandbag it. Too much for coincidence.
@@markw9512 Agree. The test at the Hockenheim ring was downright useless. CUP2Rs and track literally frozen @2Cs.
so you mean the Dodge Viper ACR that has a manual transmission and an extremely limited top speed due to its aerodynamics is 10 seconds faster? lol and not to forget, during the official lap record, the driver miss shifted a few times. The Viper ACR is for sure a sub 7 minute car.
Viper was and is the most capable car america has ever made.
I like that Viper used a race car driver for its run.
And also older technology tyres and poorer choice(?): Kumho were on the Viper
@@ionutbagmuianu884 v720 ACRs are still banned in many 200TW racing classes almost 10 years later. different compound from normal kumho v720s
@@thepetrolman4879Not it's not. Stop glazing.
Everyone can speculate all they want but GM confirmed they are seeing the same lap times >>> “While making the deal to borrow the car with Aaron Link (GMV manager) Gebhardt asks Link he he drove the C8 Z06 at the Nurburing and Link showed him a video of his last visit showing a 7:10 during development testing.
” Also, Michelin warmed the tires and GM setup the electronics mode for Christian. Basically he was driving in engineer mode, and mode not available to the public.
For those blaming the bean counters on the transmission flub, GM blew their R&D budget on the pointless Ferrari clone LT6, yet another engine GM will abandon. A revised 600 HP LS7 would have been amazing along with a focus on removing 500 lbs.
It’s not that complicated. They just need a more experienced and/or skilled driver.
The GM Engineer who ran 7:10 isnt a seasoned nurburgring driver , the
Guys at sport auto lap the ring for a living
@@TranceFurbeing quicker is all speculation until GM applies to formally run a Nurburgring certified record lap. They never will because they know they cant. They’ve had plenty of time. GM radically changed the platform and can only match C7 times. Insanity. The 4000+ lb ZR1 will be quick but I’m betting it won’t beat the GT2 that has less horsepower.
@@WindyCity1992 being quicker is all speculation until GM applies to formally run a Nurburgring certified record lap. They never will because they know they cant. They’ve had plenty of time. GM radically changed the platform and can only match C7 times. Insanity. The 4000+ lb ZR1 will be quick but I’m betting it won’t beat the GT2 that has less horsepower.
@@anonymous..-Everybody skips it's a 4,000 pound car.Thats heavy for a mid engine car.If gm went under 7 minutes they would of been showing off that number.
Christian is driving slowly.
Nurburgring lap times don’t mean too much to me personally. I adore my C8 Z06 and will continue to love it even if it is a bit “slow.”
Amazing that some of these facts from Sport Auto only came out after Misha called them out. Not to mention we still don't have any basic telemetry data to see (not even RPMs), nor the PDR data. If they want to be taken seriously as "journalists", they need to be 100% transparent upfront (not after being called out) and provide the telemetry source data from the car's built-in PDR footage.
Some insightful comments in the video point out the many mistakes during the lap and how the guy is slower than Misha in certain sections of the track (and don't forget that Misha had the slower Euro version of the car):
"But that guy made a ton of mistakes on this lap. Including a oversteer on entry at 1:52. He misses the curbing after that. Completely misses the apex at 5:30. Over brakes at 6:17 and again at 7:26. He's hitting the gas BEFORE the apex. The transmission shifting like crap and he's not using manual mode to fix it."
The fact that GM did a 7:10 with their engineers (not a pro driver) and in traffic during industry pool, tells you everything you need to know about this garbage Sport Auto lap.
The information was in the magazine all along, nobody is reading the article before commenting. It happens every time Sport Auto releases a video. People comment but don't read the article. For instance, Misha is questioning auto mode, but the article explains this was the request of GM for the best time.
@@anonymous..- Yeah, because the guy wasn't going to bother spending any time learning the car. That's exactly the advice I would give someone jumping in the car and doing just one or two hot laps on super-long track.
And all my other points still stand too.
@@IndependenceCityMotoring Some of Porsches record laps are in pure auto and I believe Jim Mero drove his record C7 Z06 lap in pure auto.
Misha didnt even do a full lap, stop the excuses. You Yanks are such copiumsniffers lmfao
Looks like the magazine favored its bread and butter and fans (Porsche and europeans) which is disappointing but not a surprise..
We all know that Misha can beat that time!
a) Track condition RED
b) Cold tires
c) Visibly conservative driving (early braking, not pushing the car near its mechanical grip limits on corners, leaving it in Auto mode with weirdly visible downshift and upshift events). Misha pointed all these out in his analysis video, this is a guy that is not only very experienced with hot lapping on the Ring, but also had seat time in this very car.
d) ZERO data/evidence transparency from Sport Auto: Not just refusing to share the car's PDR footage with telemetry data, but not even placing a camera so the instrument cluster RPMs, G-meter, and speedometer could be visible. I don't care where "GM staff placed the radio"...its on them as journalists to adjust the camera to make the dash data visible, or add an extra camera. Even better to just release the PDR footage which is even easier for them to do, yet they refuse to do it.
e) Not enough warm-up to at least get basic familiarity with the car's dynamics so that it could be pushed properly.
f) The fact that they did not disclose some basic facts until Misha rightly called them out publicly, hurts this media org's credibility.
Given all the above factors, that is way more than enough to throw away the credibility of this garbage lap.
On a side note, I'm a firm believer that cars should be developed at the Ring given all the valuable data and variety of parameters that it provides. But this Ring hero lap nonsense is all a non-real world game, and is purely a function of the Ring's ownership/management gatekeeping with all the preferences given to their domestic manufacturers with track access, not to mention expense and hoops they make you jump through, but also logistically needing to camp out for 1 month+ to wait for the right weather conditions.
For car lap comparisons, it's much more realistic to use lap times at a variety of tracks around the world where the track ownership/management gives better access for hot lap time setting rather than the lack of access at the Ring.
Its not from the manufacturer so I dont know if thats the best it can get
GM confirmed they are seeing the same lap times “While making the deal to borrow the car with Aaron Link (GMV manager) Gebhardt asks Link if he drove the C8 Z06 at the Nurburing and Link showed him a video of his last visit showing a 7:10 during development testing."
@leofhr2966 well its a heavy car but with experienced driver Im sure it get under 7.6
@calvinallan2208 Maybe, but it's a bit weird how desperate people are about this not getting a sub 7 min lap.
@@leofhr2966because countless cars with similar numbers have gone way faster
@@leofhr2966 it looked so fast when misha drove plus many called it a gt3 killer thats why
Awesome job Misha as usual. Thank your for such a professional and unbiased detailing of the BS lap.
The driver matters the most
Z06 starts at $113K USD. It has supercar performance for moderately-wealthy buyers.
It should go a lot faster. We need an official GM time. Car & driver's lightning lap has the C8 Z06 at only 1.4s off the 992 GT3rs
That's on a different track I believe, and every track has a different characteristic that benefits one type of car or more but usually based on that characteristic be it downforce, lightweight, high hp and so on. GM already has a time as they also claimed 7:10 time when asked by this same driver and group.
U know nothing about racing. Please never speak again. Imagine acting like all tracks net the same result. 😂😂😂 holy hell dude. Do u even think before u type
@@leofhr2966 I specified it's Car & driver's lightning lap which is not on the ring. But all the cars are tested on the same track. It's very obvious this lap is not near full potential.
@leofhr2966 GM's time was probably done by engineers so if anything it is concerning that a pro driver could only match it.
GM already said the time is 100% legit. Check out Sportauto Video.
Get over it, gt3 rs is just a lot faster on the Ring
My hypothesis is they are keeping the base c8 “slow” so the new one can be wildly fast comparatively
This can’t be a flat out time. Looks slower than a video game
Lmao the excuses!
Appreciate the insight......we'll see if the time gets updated in the future with another attempt.
I'm waiting to see what the new 2025 Corvette ZR1 does, in terms Nürburgring of lap times!?
Probably will beat the 296 but not by a lot
It will definitely be faster!😉😎👍
If they get in a proper lap in good track conditions, I think it'll do it in well under 7 minutes. With equal or better aero than the Z06 (which should've done a faster lap than 7:10) and roughly double the power of a GT3 RS, which did it under 7, the ZR1 pretty much has to be sub 7.
@@titaniummechanism3214 I'm expecting a sub 6:50 from the ZR1 tbh!
Then there is the Zora to follow the ZR1. 😮
It’s like they handed him the car with cold tires, road-sport gearbox tuning and told him to just drive. Sad to see it being compared to cars that left nothing on the track.
I have no problem letting the car shift itself because now no one can claim driver error.
It is what it is, the gear box shifting is not optimal…at least for this track.
Finally common sense here. You better stop it tho because you'll get hate
Probably purposely held back in order to artificially inflate the gap between the C8 ZR1 and the C8 Z06, which otherwise, might not have been large enough to justify the inevitable MSRP price gap there.
German magazine, american car cannot be faster than german cars
Lmao GM's unpublished lap is about the same.
@@Bug4lifeI’d love to see it mentioned anywhere by GM.
Jim Mero ran a 7:10 in 2015 with the older C7 Z06 on worse tires.
@@philb9117 Refer pinned comment in the lap video from sport auto.
@@philb9117Where is Chevys official time then?
In sport auto they say tires were pre heated at 85 degree and the engineers recommended not to use the paddle shifts as the gearbox in automatic mode would be as perfect as Porsches PDK. They also say that the ratio of the 5th gear cost the car a sub 7 lap.
It’s also possible that the way he was driving it led to the downshifts, he may have been too late on the throttle and the car downshifted because it knew it could go faster through those corners. It almost looks like he did one and only one lap, which is rather odd… Normally you would run some familiarization laps before attempt.
It’s the driver, l mean proper drivers wear racing gloves, right ?
Sport Auto used the AMG GTR 7 years ago and achieved the exact same lap time. You should compare the AMG GTR video with the C8 Z06. Both cars have the same weight, but the tires differ - one uses Cup 2, the other Cup 2R. There’s a 100 horsepower difference, and the aero should be at a similar level, though the C8 might generate more downforce.
Lets be real, AMG GTR supposed to have 585hp, but in reality it's more like 650hp.
Like all modern turbo engines it's more powerful than claimed.
7:10 is absolutely legit.
Maybe 5 seconds improvement possible, but that's it.
Gt3 rs is still a lot faster
A lot of people here blaming the driver, I want to point out that he didn’t have any issues with 99% of the cars he was given, and he didn’t feel the need to sandbag the c7 zo6 time as well. If there’s any problem with the lap time, I think it’s more likely with the car
It looks like this person just needs more seat time in that car. Great driver of course, but he doesn't seem familiar with this vette.
I wish there was a Manual version of this car for Street Driving. For those of us that care a bit less about Lap Times and just want to grunt around like an Orc.
5th gear ain't the problem. it out accelerated the 6:49 gt3rs in 5th gear 223 kph to 287 kph by 0.88s. problem is gt3rs exit onto the longest straight 20 kph faster vs c8z!.
MF was sand bagging 🤷🤦
I think with the wacky auto he definitely lacked confidence given the gearshifts were haphazard, gearing sucks big time but I think if he had full manual control he would be significantly faster here.
GM already confirmed they also got 7:10 on the dot. Sport auto has VERY GOOD drivers. They have many times that actualy beat the official brands time. Z06 5th gear is too long and cant keep up that simple.
One long gear isn’t going to completely tarnish a lap, it’s not that cut and dry. If you simply watch the video and know what to look for, you’ll spot multiple errors that the driver made throughout the lap, errors that most definitely cost him several tenths.
Where does gm confirm this? Very good driver not using paddle shift?, and going slower speeds through many corners than what Misha was doing on his laps? No.
it just isn't that simple. The car has many seconds left in it. Driver is driving slower than misha has done on tourist lap.
honestly based on the video the gears do look slightly off but not that big of a deal the driver made a few mistakes and frankly strange that they posted this lap because it could certainly be faster
For the price of the car 7:11 is a very strong performance. There is no faster video of the vette on youtube - that tells you quite a bit. It may do a 7:06, mabye 7:05 in perfect conditions, but never sub 7. It is what is.
Americans wont accept that, if an american driver wouldnt do sub 7, he is paid by the germans, and so on.
Idk, The Viper fully manual did a 7.01 in worse conditions and circumstances. Maybe he was sandbagging, we'll never know. But there are slower cars that have run faster. I mean the ACR is much slower than the Z06
Not really since the C7 Z06 was only 3 secs slower with much worse tire technology and costing significantly less. This time is not good.
Independent Z06 wind tunnel testing had the Z06 also making very little downforce. About a tenth of what GM quoted.
Please post the reference material.
@anonymous..- Ask AMT Motorsport. They did the test
Needs another lap with Randy Pobst behind the wheel.
If they used the dct and didn't slip at any point in time while on the track, I reckon a 7:00 could be possible.
GM Performance Product director said they got the same time and showed Sport Auto the video. There's no conspiracy. GM has been there with this car for years and hasn't released a time. The whole thing is obvious. Great car, just not a match for this track.
GM's lap time has been in the industry pool during testing and with traffic though. According to my knowledge there has been no lap time because the actual lap time-timeslot couldn't be used due to weather.
So no one is going to mention the 2017 Viper ACR that did it in 7:01? With a manual transmission! Cmon 👎🏾👎🏾
The Gear Ratio ruins everything here!!!😱😜🤷♂️
That's sad! The car has potential for soo much more...
Everyone is comparing this to a GT3RS which is $150k more.
Hopefully they repeat this test:
At least there is something wrong with:
A: Tyres (regular Cup 2 would be as fast or even more fast)
B: Driver at that day
Easy Porsche win, sorry corvette owners, try again 😊.
It's a $100k car that does a 7:10 with an unoptimized setup. I don't have a problem with it at all.
7:12.13 Dodge Viper ACR (2010) Dominik Farnbacher 2011-09-14
7:08.34 McLaren 720S Christian Gebhardt 2018-06-28
7:13.00 Porsche 918 Spyder Horst von Saurma 2014-06
Time seems decent to me 🤷♀
Reminds me of the Porsche Cayman where DeMan came out with a shorter gearing. In the case of the Corvette, possibly a cost saving measure, however, most are here in the USA where many tracks have long straights. Also, the tall “highway” gearing helps allows the car to sneak by and pass the emission and fuel consumption in the standard government tests here.
Petition to have Misha set a new record for the Z06 !!!
This lap is the pure display of playing it safe, which isn't a bad thing. Prolly not the most comfortable and reassuring ride for the driver, that said, this Generation of Z06 is just there to be there. Maybe next year there'll be another attempt, with a bit more optimized version of the Z06.
#### Base C8 lap times ####
EVO Magazine’s C8 hot lap at Anglissy, Steve Sutcliff’s hot lap.
Times:
Porsche Turbo 991.2 : 1’15”2
Corvette C8: 1’15”6
Porsche 992 Carrera S: 1’16”0
Nurburgring Lap Times:
Base Corvette C8: 7’29”9
Porsche Carrera S: 7’30”41
Porsche GT4: 7’32”0
Auto Bild Supertest, acceleration and hot lap, 2020 C8 Stingray, Sept 2020:
Lap times:
Corvette C8: 1’32”31
Porsche 992 911 Carrera S: 1’32”36
Lamborghini Huracan LP 610-4: 1’32”84
Car & Driver Lightning Lap, 2020:
Corvette C8: 2’49”0
Porsche GT4: 2’50”3
Road & Track, Grattan:
Base Corvette C8: 1’26”4
Porsche GT4: 1’26”5
Note that GT4s are ~425 lbs (193kg) lighter than C8s *and* have *much* grippier tires, Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2rs specifically.
#### Z06 vs Porsche GT3 and others ####
Car & Driver Lightning Lap 2023:
Corvette Z06: 2’38”6
Porsche GT4RS: 2’40”5
Lamborghini Huracan Tecnica: 2’43”9
From past few Lightning Laps, same track:
2022 Porsche GT3: 2’40”6
2019 Porsche GT3RS: 2’41”6
2021 Porsche Turbo S: 2’42”5
The fastest cars from all of Car & Driver’s Lightning Lap comparisons:
1. 2019 McLaren Senna: 2’34”9
2. 2021 Mercedes AMG-GT BS: 2’37”0
3. 2023 Porsche 911 GT3 RS: 2’37”2
4. 2018 Porsche GT2RS Weissach: 2’37”8
5. 2021 McLaren 765LT: 2’38”4
6. 2023 Corvette Z06: 2’38”6
7. 2019 Corvette ZR1: 2’39”5
8. 2018 McClaren 720S: 2’39”7
9. 2023 Porsche 911 GT3 MR: 2’39”8
10. 2022 Porsche Cayman GT4RS: 2’40”5
11. 2022 Porsche GT3: 2’40’6
12. 2019 Porsche GT3RS: 2’41”6
13. 2021 Porsche Carrera Turbo S: 2’42”5
14. 2020 McLaren 600LT Spider: 2’42”6
15. 2017 Ford GT: 2’43”0
16. 2015 Porsche 918 Spyder: 2’43”1
17. 2018 Mercedes AMG GT R: 2’43’4
18. 2023 Lambo Huracan Tecnica: 2’43”9
19. 2018 Lambo Huracan Perform.: 2’44”0
20. 2016 Dodge Viper ACR: 2’44”2
21. 2024 Lucid Air Sapphire 2’44”3
22. 2020 Ford Mstg Shelby GT500: 2’44”6
23. 2015 Corvette Z06: 2’44”6
24. 2020 Lamborghini Huracan Evo 2’45”0
25. 2019 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 LE 2’45”0
26. 2016 Ferrari 488GTB 2’45”1
27. 2017 Ford GT 2’45”5
28. 2018 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 LE 2’45”7
29. 2015 McClaren 650S Spider 2’45”8
And:
41. 2021 Corvette Stingray 2:49”0
46. 2012 Ferrari 458 Italia 2’49”9
Road & Track Performance Car of the Year, 2023:
Lamborghini Huracan Tecnica: 1’23”1
Porsche GT4RS: 1’22”7
Lamborghini Huracan STO (2022): 1’21”9
Corvette Z06: 1’20”6
Autobild Sportscars Supertest
Lausitzring lap times:
AMG GT Black Series: 1’25”23
ABT XGT 1’25”76
Ferrari 296 GTB: 1’25”88
Porsche 911 GT2 RS (991): 1’25”91
Corvette Corvette Z06/Z07: 1’27”41
Lamborghini Huracan STO: 1’27”94
Lamborghini Aventador SVJ: 1’28”05
AMG GT R Pro 1’28”39
Lamborghini Huracan Evo 1’28”82
Lamborghini Huracan Tecnica 1’28”96
Ferrari F8 Tributo 1’29”06
Porsche 911 Turbo S (992): 1’29”95
Porsche 911 GT3 RS (991): 1’30”60
Quattroruote magazine Vairano Pro track
1. Pagani Huayra BC Roadster 1’20”71
2. AMG GT Black Series 1’20”93
3. Ferrari 296 GTB 1’20”93
4. Ferrari SF90 Stradale 1’21”72
5. Porsche 911 GT3 (992) 1’22”79
6. Corvette Z06 Z07 Package 1’23”73
7. Lamborghini Huracán STO 1’23”82
8. Lamborghini Revuelto 1’24”39
9. Maserati MC20 1’26”55
10. BMW M4 Competition Coupe 1’28”61
11. Maserati GranTurismo Trofeo 1’31”75
Savagegeese same day/same driver/same track comparison of Z06 w/Z07 vs GT3. Corvette and GT3 manufacturer teams on hand making sure both vehicles’ setups were optimal:
Times:
Z06: 1’27”240
GT3: 1’27”329
Tight, short track. Pro driver said GT3 would definitely lose advantage on longer tracks and Z06’s lead would grow on them. This is an excellent, very well put together comparison video which goes into great detail explaining the strengths and weaknesses of both cars. Highly recommended.
From fastest laps site:
Sport Auto Fr. Val de Vienne lap times
Rank Vehicle Time
1 Ferrari 296 GTS 1’37”70
2 C8 Z06 (Z07) 1’39”30
3 992 GT3 RS 1’41”60
4 992 GT3 1’42”80
5 M4 CSL 1’43”28
6 GT4 RS 1’44”65
Motorsport Magazine (chart at end of vid shown w/times):
McLaren Senna 1'14"93 (TrofeoR)
C8 Z06 (Z07) 1'15"23 (Cup 2R)
991.2 GT2 RS 1'15"91 (Cup 2R)
992 GT3 RS 1'15"96 (Cup 2R)
Ferrari 488 Pista 1'16"06 (Cup 2R)
Montecello Motor Club North Course Fastest laps:
AMG GT Black Series: 1’19”42
C8 Z06 (Z07): 1’20”55
911 GT3 (992): 1’21”69
Huracan STO: 1’21”9
718 Cayman GT4 RS: 1’22”70
Huracan Tecnica: 1’23”10
M4 CSL: 1’24”20
Sport Auto Mendig AFB Circuit:
Lamborghini Huracan STO: 1’45”57
C8 Z06 (Z07): 1’45”91
McClaren 650 S Spider: 1’45”35
911 GT3 (992): 1‘47”16
GT4 RS: 1’48”16
C8 Z06 set production car record
at Canada's Canadian Tire Motorsport Park, 2023.
Throttle House Track Test:
1. C8 Z06: 1’06”56
2. 992 GT3 RS: 1’06”67
3. BAC Mono: 1’07”52
4. Viper ACR: 1’07”55
5. 992 GT3: 1’07”77
Hagerty test of Z06 vs 992 GT3 RS & M3 CSL, Jason Camissa with Randy Pobst driving. Willow Springs, high speed track with 992 GT3 RS’s active aero winning the day here, near freezing track temps.
Times:
GT3 RS: 1’24”3
Z06: 1’24”9
@@markw9512 stop it fanboy, youre not proving anything by pasting the same spamy comment everywhere.
@@AI-qd4vb facts are unpopular with some folks. Just as projection.
Side note, Mustang GTD also use TR-9080 like C8 Corvette, but hopefully a shorter ratio version.
Honestly, looking at that list it looks massively skewed against American cars, either the driver wasn't top of his game or he intentionally went too slow to put the upstart American car in its place.... seeing the amount of extremely easy-going driving on display+the constant mis-shifting was so bizarre for a supposed lap-record-attempt.
lol
It's a conspiracy. Let's conveniently ignore the 7:10 set by GM. They just happen to be as untalented as that biased, sandbagging german loser from sport auto.
We talk about 21 seconds slower than gt3 rs. Not 2-3 seconds.
Gt3 RS IS just the much better and faster sportscar😅
@@DickeJunge_vonderSchaukelIs that why the Z06 matched it at Big Willow, beat it by 1.6 seconds at Magny Cours, and then beat it once more at Throttle House’s home track, with the Vette being in HTC form for that one?
@@DickeJunge_vonderSchaukelnahh 21 second is way off, its like the gap between amg one and gt3rs ,i think corvette can do a lot better
Great job! Love your
scoreboard !
7/11 was a side job
7:10 on semis is good though. also consider that sport auto times are always slower than a factory driver could do.
another clownshow from ScamAuto, thanks for reviewing it honestly and pinpointing all the stuff. Even just a gearbox in auto mode should tell you all you need to know about how hard he's going. No proper driver would go 10/10 with the risk of a gearbox randomly shifting at the inappropriate moment, as you said it yourself as well.
The long 5th is almost definitely meant to meet US fuel efficiency requirements. Those get tougher every year which might explain why some 7yo cars were able to do better.
Should have been in manual/paddle mode to set a fast time imo.
The procharger supercharged Z06 has nearly 200hp extra, would be a beast with the extra hp.
GT3 RS was in automatic as well
Manufacturer said use auto not paddles
You could see the Wallkie Talkie was not completely covering the big D on the dashboard. H was in AUTOMATIC for the WHOLE Lap. This is gonna go deep... I can feel it lol
Lots of things wrong with this lap. Also I think the gearing thing is due to playing games with the EPA over fuel mileage ratings here in the states.
we know it's going to be slow because Christian does not let go of the steering wheel with both hands to roll up his sleeves
Guess we have to wait until Chevrolet does an official attempt. Until then, 7:10 counts. Stop the crying you little snowflakes.
Americans are soft af
Sounds to me the sport auto reasoning of the tall fifth gear make sense. When the car takes 12 seconds instead of 6 seconds to go from 200-250. That’s a whole chunk of time lost.
That said, GM should be able to fix this easily.
It is annoying that they did this. In the US it really doesn’t make much difference on most tracks here as the tracks just aren’t this fast up top, and I suppose they’re rationale was they weren’t going to sell too many cars in Europe… But they would sell more if they’d have nailed this lap for sure, so to me this was a marketing miss by being overruled by bean counters.
Having said that, I do think he left a fair amount of time on the table here in the time should’ve been closer to the 705 range even with him at the wheel have been going full tilt in better conditions. And conditions made a difference. It is suspicious that both times they tested this vehicle, last year at Hockenheim and this year atthe Ring, they chose sub optimal conditions under which to do so. Cup2Rs do not like cold tarmac, and they doubtlessly know this. I’m sure that the large amount of advertising dollars, boondoggles, car loaners, etc. they receive from Porsche had nothing to do with this decision.
@@markw9512Its not like Chevy pays reviewers to not put a 911 Turbo S in a drag race against the C8 Z06 as well, because we know how that ends. 7 billion dollar investment in the C8, and probably the same amount of money in marketing lol.
@ because Chevrolet themselves has said that the competition for it is the GT3. It’s a twin turbo versus a naturally aspirated motor with the turbo S. Let’s see how the twin turbo Porsche does against the twin turbo ZR1. 😘
But that is straight line speed. On track, the Z06 has turned lap times several seconds faster than the 992 turbo S has, anywhere including the ring.
@markw9512 'lets compare a 2025 1000hp Corvette to a 2020 650hp 911 to finally make it fair for the Americans'
😊
@ again: the GT3 is **400 pounds lighter** than the Corvette. You the cars have to have equivalent horsepower when the GT3 is 400 pounds lighter? Plus Porsche underrates their horsepower GT3s produce 470 hp on the Dyno, indicating a true 560 HP crank. Combine that with 400 fewer pounds and the horsepower to weight ratio of these vehicles is basically identical.
They sand bagged the Z06. Since when do you drive the car with a DCT in auto mode on a hot lap and its because they dont want people seeing the Z06 be 2-3 seconds faster a car from America that cost ALOT less then the 911 GT3 and 2-3s faster on track is a clear lead but i guess we will never know the truth because no way that was a legit attempt i watched this dude do other hot laps doesnt drive auto mode letting the cars shift but this one he does, Misha is faster then him in CheatCode:Z06 also not in auto, WE NEED A GO FUND ME/GIVE SEND GO TO RAISE MONEY TO SET IT ALL UP WITH U.S.A. SPEC Z06, FRESH CUP 2R, CLEAR TRACK, MISHA DRIVER, I BET IT DOES A 6:59 OR BETTER NO SWEAT!🇺🇸👍🏻🦅
this is a very vibes based analysis, but i felt like watching someone just messing around and having fun driving around the nurburgring, not someone going fast.
i mean the car is moving fast sure, but i felt like the car had potential for way more.
Both because of the driving but also because of how the car behaved