Unleashing the Power of the Force | A Critique of Star Wars: Force Unleashed 1 & 2
Вставка
- Опубліковано 27 січ 2020
- Playing Star Wars Jedi Fallen Order made me wish we got Force Unleashed 3 instead. I went back to play Force Unleashed 1 & 2 and re-discovered the magic of games where force powers were embraced and not held back.
Patreon: / cdavis_games
Discord: discordapp.com/invite/67tDGrr
Twitter: / cdavis_games
Ko-Fi: ko-fi.com/chrisdavis
Paypal: www.paypal.me/cdavisgames
Thumbnail by / leavedavidalone
#StarWars #ForceUnleashed #LucasArts #Disney #JediFallenOrder - Ігри
So, what Star Wars stories do you recommend people read, play, or watch?
I think it depends slightly on what your favorite era of Star Wars is. If you’re a prequel guy, then you should read some of the excellent James Luceno books such as Darth Plagueis, The Rise of Darth Vader, and Labyrinth of Evil (all Legends stories). If you’re a Clone Wars fan, then I highly recommend Dark Disciple (canon). For the original trilogy, you really should check out the Thrawn trilogy and the Jedi Academy trilogy that follow Luke and co after the main trilogy (Legends), but I also recommend new books like Tarkin (canon).
If you liked Knight of the Old Republic, then check out The Old Republic books starting with Revan (written by Drew Karpyshyn, the guy behind Mass Effect). Many of the comics are great and they are available on Marvel Unlimited (a subscription service). I think the service is quite good value anyway, but even if you don’t maintain a subscription, you can dive in quite cheap for one month and read hundreds of new canon Star Wars stories. The main Star Wars comic is good, as is Darth Vader and Doctor Aphra, so maybe start with those.
Alright, what have I missed?
I found Jedi Academy trilogy is very weak (by far, the worst books I read i SWEU). Tbh, "I, Jedi" by Michael Stackpole was quite a surprise since it showed one of the storylines in Jedi Academy and did it better. Speaking of Stackpole, I can't recommend X-Wing's Rogue Squadron series and Ghost Squadron series highly enough
I too very much enjoyed dark disciple. Another favorite was the Darth Bane series.
Darth Bane trilogy, best books besides thrawn
Star Wars Legacy is a pretty good yarn. The Dark Horse Clone Wars comics are pretty darn good. Also, the Heir to the Empire trilogy is still great; I don't think a lack of direct conflict between the protagonists and antagonists means that it's not a good story. "Traitor" and "I, Jedi" are really good. Vector Prime is good, and there's a bunch of individual books in different story arcs. "Starfighters of Aduma" is a good one.
I am NOT a fan Doctor Aphra, and I find it hilarious that the continuity and quality of Star Wars faltered under Disney/Lucasfilm storytelling within 5 years that the old continuity didn't fall to in over 30 years.
The Revan book is trash.
Matthew stover’s revenge of the Sith novel is one of the best SW novels though
I love fallen order and force unleashed both for different reasons
Fallen order is a game that makes me feel like a Jedi padawan reconnecting with the force. It tells a decent enough story and let’s be real here 40% of people bought the game so they could build there own lightsaber
Force unleashed is a game that makes me feel like everyone is my bitch
Just some guy With Primus apotheosis you can’t even see your lightsaber in JFO
Yeah, two very different games. You aren't supposed to be super powerful in Fallen Order (though by the end you get to that point).
@@jayomega2717 yeah, but it still fun to custom it. I know it stupid but, yeah, I had fun.
Yeah tbh I don’t like when people compare TFU to Fallen Order/Survivor, one was a clear clone of PS2 GoW, while one was a clear clone of Seikro. I for one prefer Survivor if I want to feel like a force wielder in a video game. Cal isn’t supposed to be pushing 50 stormtroopers off mountains, or shooting Sith lightning… he’s a padawan that BARELY escaped Order 66.
Force unleashed critique starts 12:35
force unleashed 2 critique 55:01
Thanks, I got tired of his uneducated EU hate. It's so generic to say "mOsT oF tHe EU wAs BaD" or that they contradict each other. Which is factually incorrect.
@@maverickay5807 Eeeh...
@LN2233 But yeah, thanks for that. It's always nice to have timestamps, and as such your posting them here is much obliged. :)
I'm curious, what type of education do I need to discuss the EU? I've read most of the books/comics. Isn't that enough? I love a lot of the EU, but some of it is definitely bad. And they do contradict each other. That is factually correct. It's why there's a hierarchy of canon.
@@maverickay5807 "He doesent like what I like therefore he is uneducated"
"And the return of Palpatine if you could believe such a ridiculous notion." Taking pot shots at RoS are ya? good.
Palpies did that already even Darth Kryath
Wookie Warrior: "Aight I'm boutta head out" 21:32
That was bloody brilliant!
Force Unleashed 3 would’ve been great, because let’s all be fair playing as Starkiller you faced almost no challenges in 1 and 2(Unless you played on harder difficulties like _Unleashed)._
Biggest issue with FU1 was how clunky and unresponsive it could be. The issue with FU2 was that it’s campaign was far too short, and it’s gameplay was Repetitive, and as mentioned in the video lacks fun replay-ability.
Force unleashed 3 could’ve been something great and improved on both aspects, and in the Streams(Which are on UA-cam) where Sam Witwer and David Collins were playing Force unleashed, they talked about various things behind the scenes and even featured creators behind it with their final episode being with the Writer Hayden Blackman. And even at one point they hesitated when discussing Galen marek and the potential that he could’ve _survived_ FU1 and was in fact the main character you played in TFU2.
I believe that Galen marek wasn’t a Clone and was in fact the real Starkiller. What helps confirm this is the secret clips you can unlock from completing TFU2’s challenges. What I’m saying is that Starkiller was indeed _alive,_ but was part of a trial Vader’s successful Clone “the Dark Apprentice” would face. And I don’t know about you but Battling a clone of yourself that Vader himself has even stated in the Secret clips saying he was far stronger than The original Starkiller. That would’ve been an epic boss for the Force Unleashed 3, a clone of yourself that knows all the moves your going to make and unlike you does not _hesitate_ to go for the most violent solution. It would’ve been great considering you had no chance of ever beating him.
If you don’t know who the dark apprentice was, basically if you choose the dark side ending he impales you from behind before you kill Vader. This was part of Vader’s plan, and he instructed that the Dark apprentice should only engage if Vader’s life was threatened. That’s why In the light side ending the dark apprentice doesn’t attack, because Vader _was in control of the situation._
I suggest you watch Sam Witwers Force unleashed Stream because they go into a lot more detail about the making of The force unleashed and even delved into the potential story the Force unleashed 3 could’ve had.
The 360/PS3 FU1 felt somewhat clunky, but the PS2 version felt so much smoother.
@@derrinerrow4369 PS2/Wii had a different story structure in general, and I agree that the gameplay in it was far less clunky.
I member when Plasma saber's were able to slice and dismember organic meat bags
Galen is put into a coma
I agree with the theory that Starkiller didn’t actually die at the end of FU1, and is the playable character in FU2. In FU2, I believe that clones of him existing at all is evidence that Starkiller is still alive. They make it very clear in Clone Wars that dead flesh cannot be duplicated, so they need a living donor. That tells me Galen survived.
So I actually played the Wii version of TFU and from what I remember (I was probably 8 or 9 at the time) the controls were actually amazingly good and responsive. I remember comparing other games to it saying "Yeah, these are responsive, but it's nowhere near as good as TFU". This was a decade ago, so my memory may be lying to me. If I can find the copy of the game I'll update this comment.
Actually the Ps2 and Wii versions of the game have been developed by a different studio, more competent in my opinion, and yes, the actual fighting feels better in these versions than the "next gen" ps3 and xbox360 ones.
Believe it or not, but the Wii/PS2/PSP version of TFU1 is widely considered the superior version in all aspects except graphics of course. The base gameplay is much better, and the boss fights are entirely reworked to be actually really good, and the Wii controls were actually quite good and impressive for it’s pre-Motion+ era.
Nah, I don't care about what is "widely considered the superior version". I grew up with the PS2 version and yet recently playing the Ultimate Sith Edition made me unable to go back to play the PS2 version, it's just a superior experience for me in term of challenging difficulty, there're more cooler force combos that weren't in the PS2/WIi version like you can actually execute your enemies the "God of War style", and the destruction physics and enemies AI actually struggling around and grabbing stuff are obviously superior all around.
I played the wii version as a kid and it really feels weird how the Bespin/ Cloud City mission isn’t in the other versions of the game. It’s not very important but fighting Mandalorians in my favorite location from the original trilogy was so awesome. The lack of HD on the Wii was tough to stand even then tho
The Wii version is especially terrible. The controls just holds the game back with how terrible they are.
The Force Unleashed 2 is one of the most enjoyable games I’ve ever played. It was just so shockingly short :( I wish we got more of both games to be honest
Bruh the game was horrible you were just constantly fighting the same fights with another skin slapped onto it + the Story was just stupid
It had great potential but it failed horribly due to the greed of the developers giving them only 9(!!!) Month to finish the game
Loved the analysis of The Force Unleashed, I think you were a bit unfair on Fallen Order though. For one thing, the developers have gone on record as saying that they pushed for the main character to be a jedi, against Lucasfilm who actually wanted them to make a game about a non-force wielder.
I got the sense that you really wanted Fallen Order to be an action-centric game, where your character has a big impact on the movies. It makes sense that Fallen Order isn't the game for you: but for myself and millions of other fans, there was a lot that made the game memorable. Personally, I like that the main character is totally weak: it makes sense since he was a traumatized kid after Order 66. The game is a lot more about exploring and discovery as a result, and I like that at the end there's no magical mcguffin that sets things right. That twist feels like the kind of realization that a jedi should come to.
Also, for me frankly the story was much more memorable, because it was less outlandish. You can see this in comparing the game's final encounter to TFU 1 or 2's final battles: you're not just spamming force powers against a helpless emperor or vader with clone backups. You feel genuinely like Darth Vader is as threatening as in the OT, and that you stand no chance.
Still though, I agree that it would be nice to get a new action game with a powerful character in the Star Wars universe. Great video, thanks for reading!
This guy is an idiot. He states this is the best saber combat ever. He clearly never played Jedi Knight Outcast and Academy. Plus he said PS2 game was inferior because of the physics engine. Which is also bullocks
@@SuperHns I played Jedi Knight Outcast yesterday. OMG it has aged horrible. It's not a shooter and the gameplay on PC is just horrible. Nar Shadaa is a nightmare with all the snipers.
Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy will be next. But oh boy, there are some sound glitches, really unfair gameplay & dumb mechanics. I don't felt like a Jedi ... just like a guy how is able to jump really high. I never used the lightsaber yet.
Well, see you after Yavin 4 i guess. 🤦😕
Yeah, honestly the Force Unleashed series has some of the most boring combat out of any Star Wars game. The Fallen Order is miles ahead on my opinion.
@@999999SkyGuy what version did you play? I remember getting those games to set up on PC was an absolute nightmare, but jedi outcast and academy were really fun with the realistic lightsabers cheat on
I prefer TFU 1&2 final bosses than JFO escape sequence.
The escape sequence of JFO was just another repetitive set piece.(And they made an escape sequence instead of a bossfight because the developers didn't dare to anger Vader fanboys/fangirls)
Your mistake with Fallen Order was posing it to be the spiritual successor to The Force Unleashed. Jedi, at least in popular Star Wars media, aren’t god-tier beings- there’s a reason they all died in Order 66...
Try doing Fallen Order on Max difficultly and you’ll see the force as an essential tide turner than a tacked on half thought
Force Unleashed is a great game too. But it’s silly to compare the two, it’s like comparing Dynasty Warriors to Dark Souls
one can say that Starkiller was trained to get stronger and kill, no Jedi teachings to slow him down
The thing with Fallen Order is that none of the things within it are as good as the previous games under the same name. It isn't even as good as Lego Star Wars... The combat was done better in Jedi Knight series, the Force powers better in any other game, some not even related to Star Wars. The story is just the worst possible thing in existence. The gameplay loop is bad because it makes no sense what so ever. I.E. why the fuck are the stormtroopers in the same exact place once we "die"? The characters would make calling them dogshit an insult to dogs. The most alien thing being the bugeyed lady AND she is as useless as a potato farm in a salt lake. And finally the whole "cutting off from the Force" that the movies and this game say they do is akin to pinning themselves with a prick and calling it seppuku, then constantly about the pain of doing such a horrible action, and surviving.
For those who haven't been born in the shitstorm that is the 2010+, the act of cutting yourself out from the force is akin to gauging out your eyes, cutting off your ears, flailing off your skin and ripping out your tongue, all at the same time. As the Force is simply latched onto anything seen and unseen, ripping it away is just like ripping away a meter long leech from your body. Painful and sometimes deadly.
The only piece of information that i am aware of, of such a case, is from KotOR II. Where said MC ripped herself away from the force when she activated a planet crusher, a device that increased the gravity of a planet to such an extent that it simply collapsed in on itself. Said planet was occupied with people she fought alongside for a good while, and to who she was Force Bound. For ease of understanding they were those twins that could feel each others suffering.
She crushed those people to death, and upon seeing the tidal wave of pain, chaos, and carnage that was surging through the Force to her, she severed the connection.
THAT. IS. WHAT. IT. TAKES.
That's the choice. To either rush into the wall of smoke that is engulfing your surroundings, or wait for the hot magma to fall on you from the erupting volcano that YOU triggered.
Call me salty, call me a fanboy, but i believe I've written a better story in these short paragraphs than the whole fucking team of "writers" (read drug addled meth-heads) that had any hand in the sloppy warty handjob that is Jedi Fallen Order story.
The X-wing books and I, Jedi are probably my favorite “Legacy” books. They’re mostly about rouge squadron pilots and don’t really have too many appearances by the main star wars players which makes them pretty good.
Sounds good, i hate the "good" guys, they are just too "black and White"
I still need to read the X Wing books. I've always been a little reluctant to dive in to those because I've found a lot of authors do a terrible job describing the space combat in Star Wars. Even some of my favorite books have had bad space fights in them. Mind you, the X Wing books obviously specialize in that, so you'd hope they do it a lot better!
Jedi Fallen Order was a learning process that reminded me of the first time I played Dark Souls and Sekiro (Sekiro I'm yet to finish), what suckes about Fallen Order is a second playthrough which feels useless and pointless, just when you start to feel really awesome at the game. I hope for Fallen Order DLCs soon, it would fit the game. Unleashed was more of a DMC, Darksiders and you feel op pretty early on. A Jedi game for me is skills and reflexes that the player who plays must react to. I remember Jedi Academy and Jedi Outcast well and this game was really a 2.0 of that if not 3.0 (:
I agree with you on a lot, the Star Wars Lore being a bit louse and whats Canon and Legend is still in the air.
Good Video!
Nothing is touching jedi academy
I largely disagree with your view of Fallen Order, but I can see why you say that. That being said, this was an interesting video on The Force Unleashed. I also remember it being really fun, and BOY was I disappointed in the second game.
I agree.
when you brought up the star destroyer QTE in the 1st game i instantly remembered how annoying and tedious that part was. I still remember feeling so relieved when i finally did it. i was like 9 years old btw lmao
Same
Alittle late on this one but when I was younger, that sequence nearly made me quit playing altogether. It just didn't click. Lol
@@damienkendrick1664 I first played the PS2 version of Force Unleashed and don't recall having any trouble with the star destroyer. Then years later I played the PS3 version and struggled with it it quite a bit.
Lmao same
Well it is a star destroyer not a tie fighter.
This is honestly the best critique of these games I've ever seen. Seriously, keep up the good work, mate.
aTem I saw it in my recommendations and immediately watched it because these games were the first ever games I played on the Xbox
Nice I wasn't expecting this.
I'll say I agree with your first assessment of force unleashed and Jedi fallen order. Jedi fallen order has good parts but isn't that special and just felt far too safe. The force unleashed games are just good fun.
I think the thing that makes people connect so much with Fallen order is it a functional, non-broken single player driven game in star wars, published by EA. It brings a New Hope, so to speak, to the idea that things can be better.
@@noyes250 , non broken? I noticed bugs and glitches but okay. The story was bland and lame like the content provider mentioned. To many elements from other games instead of carving out a new niche.
I understand people liked the game but like Fallout 4 , I found it wanting , like most titles in the previous gaming generation which makes me leery about the next generation of gaming.
@DoubleOne7 Eh, for me it's the opposite. Back when I was younger I was tired of being OP, hacking drones left and right playing episode III's ps2 game, and loved the Battlefront games when they came out as I got to enjoy a star wars game where I wasn't OP. The force unleashed games were fun, but you were pretty OP for my taste. Later, Demon Souls came out, and loved the genre, where you are not some crazy OP hero. Playing Fallen Order on GM difficulty, it's perfect. Be careless and even a group of scout troopers can be a threat, specially early in the game. And fights are tense, or at least without mindless button mashing so far. I guess it boils down to the fact that I never enjoyed spectacle fighter games where you hack and slash through waves of enemies.
Different strokes for different folks.
@@FaustSketcher I can absolutely see where you are coming from. I can't say that fallen order is bad I can see why people would like it significantly more than force unleashed. I kinda got tired of the whole souls like thing recently so the more deliberate combat while good felt kinda stale to me after playing so many similar games.
I'm glad you liked it and if they do make another I'll keep my eye out for it because at the end of the day I'm still glad that game exist.
@@afroarchitect2446 Well ye if you are not feeling the soulsborne subgenre atm it's perfectly understandable haha ^^; I myself had last played Dks3 almost 3 years ago, and have been waiting to play sekiro until I finished some more games after 2019 (gonna play it after Fallen order actually), so I was all ready for more soulsborne games. And I love metroidvania stuff so ye It's a perfect mix for me. I definitely hope there's more coming, maybe next time something more like Jedi Academy where you create your own padawan and stuff instead of having a premade character. But as long as it's like this, I'll be happy to play anything :D!
Abeloth. Such a cool concept.
She should be the True Sequels antagonist.
This video is a perfect reminder why i subscribed to you in the first place Chris.
I can confirm that lightsaver combat on TFU Wii is just waggling it about but the force powers genuinely work surprisingly well. It feels great to grab someone and do a force choke motion to break their neck.
I’d definitely recommend the Star Wars comics “Dark Empire” and “Dark Empire II” for some good old EU lore-building. There’s also “Crimson Empire” that deals with the Emperor’s Red Guards from Return of the Jedi and of course check out “Shadows of the Empire” the book of you haven’t already as it’s a great side story set inbetween Empire and Jedi.
The story of Jacen Solo will for ever be my favorite storyline of legends. Bar none.
Why's that? I'm genuinely curious. I've never read a real Star Wars book before...
It's super touching cause of his inner conflict. Probably name my first son Jacen
@@saintallison Jacen Solo is a Jedi that has to grapple with trying to maintain order during a civil war while always trying to push for the best outcome no matter the cost to himself. It causes him a lot of trouble and inner conflict as he makes hard decisions in scenarios that don't necessarily have "correct" solutions.
@@GhostOfBilly Oh wow, that sounds right up my alley, I'll definitely check it out! Thank you very much for the reply :D
@@saintallison I recommend them wholeheartedly it's the series called Legacy of the Force
2:30 Source for the following statements: www.usgamer.net/articles/lucasfilm-was-hesitant-to-let-respawn-make-a-jedi-focused-star-wars-game
Was respawn tasked with making a star wars game? Maybe.
But they CHOSE to do a Jedi. They CHOSE to do a force wielder. Disney/LucasArts wanted them to do a bounty hunter because they hold "force Wielder's close". Respawn had to gain a good amount of trust that they would do a Jedi justice to be granted the opportunity to actually have a force user.
I have to disagree with his take on Jedi: Fallen Order I think it's one of the greatest Star Wars games ever made and easily beats out The Force Unleashed in both story and game play. I like how the the development team stayed consistent with how the force was portrayed in the movies where the Jedi weren't all powerful superheroes but used the Force sparingly and in very controlled ways. It just feels more apart of the universe (obviously the fact that Fallen Order is canon and TFU isn't helps too) Unleashed just feels like fan fiction, really good fan fiction but still none the less not an official story.
What movies are you talking about? Because if you are talking about Disney Universe then you are forgetting how the Force is portrayed in Disney trilogy.
As someone who has only played the Wii version of the first game, I think the controls are above average for Wii standards. Generic waggling is part of the game for the most basic parts of combat, but most of the force powers have unique movements. Here's a list of some of my favorites (from what I can remember, haven't played this game in like 7 years).
Holding someone in the air and then force choking them requires you to hold Z and hold the nunchuk upside down with the Z button facing you (which apparently you can't do in the other versions so honestly I feel sad for you). From this position you can also swing the nunchuk straight down to slam them into the ground.
Holding the Wii remote sideways with the buttons facing you while holding the A button blocks (so it's like how you'd actually hold the lightsaber when blocking), and from this position if you swing forward/outward you can throw the lightsaber.
The big whirlwind explosion attack where you sort of vacuum enemies towards yourself and then blast them all away makes you hold down four buttons at once (to charge up) and then release by swinging your arms down really hard (no joke it doesn't work unless you break your forearms, but the effort matches the strength of the move so it's cool).
Force pushes and all their variations make you stab the nunchuk forward.
One of my favorite combos was to grab someone with the force, choke them, then while doing that throw the lightsaber into their chest, and either slam them into the ground or force push them into some other enemies and send a force lightning shockwave after them.
Maybe I have my own nostalgia glasses on but honestly this stuff was awesome when I was a kid and made me really feel like bat--I mean star man--killer.
All of these pale into insignificance alongside Jedi Outcast and Academy.
Lmao no
Well yes but actually no but still yes. Unique in each their own ways
Meh
Those are some good ass games!
@@maverickay5807 Graphics aside they are infinitely superior.
I think Force Unleashed has difficulty-select syndrome; playing on a cranked difficulty like Sith Master feels like a wholly different game, possibly because of making the game actually challenging, making more obscure abilities more necessary like rolling, grapples, leaping slash etc. to minimize the damage you take, as you'll die from a few laser shots, as opposed to say 20-40 in the regular game. The lock-on system is understated as it gives you a fairly generous side-roll that may give short invincibility, & the leaping slash move letting you travel between distant targets very quick. I basically never used Lightning Shield until Sith Master difficulty, which makes any lower difficulty seem redundant as the game just needed that slight challenge to make use of the abundant combos/powers.
This is one of the few games I’ve ever played that has so many changes in terms of story across its many ports and versions
Excellent content as usual, Chris. Makes me more excited for that Witcher 3 retrospective *wink wink*. Hopefully.
It's coming...
The novelisation of revenge of the sith by matthew stover is a fantastic read. Not EU/ legends, but well worth a read
Great critique, not only on the games but on Star Wars in general. Subscribed
The PSP version was my absolute favourite game when I was 8 years old so I was quite surprised when I could barely recognize any of the footage you showed in the beginning.
Well, I guess I now have a good excuse to somehow play the other versions and see what I missed out on!
Honestly, I loved the story of Fallen Order. And the characters. The gameplay is okay, but replayable.
Once again, thank you for your videos.
You're very welcome!
I don't think anyone expected the Thrawn trilogy to be made directly from page to screen. It would be adapted. Like how all books are when they move to the screen.
I would rather have jedi academy 2 than force unleashed 3 without hesitation.
That another single player kotor would be the best
Dont think disney would allow it
Who doesn’t love Fallen Order??? That game is awesome
People with taste
Just got my TFU Shaak Ti action figure in the mail today! I'm off work today, I've got weed, and I've got time to chill and watch this with my new Shaak Ti! Hell yeah ✌
Okay, it really seems like you don't fully understand the difference between 'Expanded Universe' and 'canon' as far as the old dynamic operated. Expanded Universe impeded nothing in terms of the films - that's the entire point of the Expanded Universe in the first place. You can contradict it with official canon but still keep the more profitable or popular stories and characters in circulation - regardless of canonicity or conflicts therein.
The EU allowed tertiary creators the freedom to mess around with the Star Wars IP without feeling constricted by the need to adhere to a strict canon or stifling oversight, while providing new and inventive content that can then retroactively be made canon if it proves popular/profitable or catches the eye of Ole' Gorge himself - keeping the entire IP fresh in the process. It's the kind of dynamic that allowed the Star Wars IP to be both deep as an ocean and wide as one to boot - the EU stifled NOTHING from the new films because the films are ALWAYS canon and canon is inherently allowed to contradict things in the EU - it was having your cake and also getting to eat the fucking cake. So I believe the only way you can see why Disney would throw out the EU because it could 'stifle new content' is if you don't understand how the EU worked in the first place in regards to canon. You aren't BEHOLDEN to adapting the books when it comes to the films - they had and could have been two totally separate things. It's not difficult to suss the two out, most people would not have been confused, since most would never read the fucking books anyway and those that would read them would be fans invested enough to understand the difference between the films and the books - since it wouldn't be their first rodeo when it comes to EU/canon discrepancies - your argument for this is really lame, even if you're trying to play devil's advocate.
They could've kept both the old 'sequel' stuff and still made their own for the films - it was never a dichotomy, rather EU and canon had a symbiotic thing going on that worked wonders for literally the entire existence of said dynamic. Would people REALLY have been alienated any more than WHEN THEY THREW OUT THE ENTIRE BABY WITH THE BATH WATER AND DECIDED TO START FRESH. YES, THAT DECISION WAS TRULY THE LESSER EVIL WHEN IT COMES TO ALIENATING PEOPLE. The fandom has experienced no schism as a result. Everything's fine, how are you?
What you've said makes no sense. You're basically saying the EU wasn't canon anyway, in which case, what's your problem with Disney not treating it as canon? You say they could have kept the old stuff and made new stuff, but you can't have two completely contradictory stories. You say they can be two separate things, but that's what they are now. Why was it okay to contradict EU stuff with the movies before but not now? What about if Disney never said anything official about the old EU and just did its own thing? Would that somehow be okay with you? You're getting way too hung up on the "Legends" label because from what you've said, you don't actually have a problem with the movies contradicting the stories.
I wanted a critique on the Force Unleashed, instead I got a critique on Fallen Order...
Just found your channel, love it, and holy shit you've done my favorite Star Wars game!
block button? What block button.. xD
Great Critique as always! Your content is great and I've been listening through a lot of them. Keep it up!
Missed you CD
Fun fact: Dark Disciple was supposed to be a part of canceled clone wars episodes, same story just animated
Tales of the Bounty Hunters (legends) and almost all of the Clone Commando stories
Are the Clone Commando stories the ones that are novelizations of Clone Wars episodes? I don't think I've read those ones.
@@ChrisDavis_Games I dove into my closet to find one and its actually the Republic Commando series. 3 books Hard Contact, Triple Zero, and True Colors by Karen Traviss
@@Cody27 Traviss wrote some novels for Gears of War that I thoroughly enjoyed! Thanks for the recommendation :D
Starkiller: raised by Vader from infancy, trained in the dark side ways daily until he was an adult.
Cal Kestis: padawn whose training was never finished, and was in hiding for almost 10 years with no training at all by the start of his game.
Yeah, totally reasonable to expect both characters to have the same powerset at the start of the game. God, are you gonna give any reasons that you like Force Unleashed more besides "muh flashy force powers" ? Because that's all I hear you saying. And btw idk how in the fuck you could play FU2, that game runs so fucking abysmally bad, idk how anyone could finish it.
Well, I think he is coming from a place where the gameplay is above narrative. Fallen Order is a story heavy game where the gameplay reflects the story (Cal is untrained and gets better).
What he's saying is: if they made the game with a different gameplay that was more "fun" (i.e. more Force powers that were less limited) and then "tack" the story onto that it would be a better game.
FU is still a clunky mess tho.
You know, Respawn didn't have to create a player character who was a padawan whose training was never finished. They made that decision themselves and the consequence was a boring game. Maybe it shouldn't have picked a dull premise.
Goddamn the amount of salt in that comment
There's no law that says you have to like Fallen Order. I'd call it the best SW story in ages, with the possible exception of The Mandalorian. Perhaps you have to be some kind of outsider to appreciate it? Because when it comes to the old Star Wars cliche of "building a new family", there's simply none better
What's weird, considering Force Unleashed is sold as this over-the-top power trip, is that your lightsabre feels weaker there than in Fallen Order. In Fallen Order a skilled player can take out most basic enemies in a single hit, which is really how it should be. While I recall Force Unleashed having me perform flashy-looking multi-hit combos even on basic mooks.
That's your problem for using lightsaber most of the time instead of force powers.(TFU was more a ranged combat focused game)
Really didn't expect the Unleashed games to be the ones you'd do a video on but I'm pleasantly surprised - would've expected (and also enjoyed) a look back at KOTOR 1 and 2.
Those are coming!
Those are coming!
Rogue One telling a cool story?
Everyone is bland and dies in the end. Wow, what a great story.
Dom The Elegy TRUUUUUUUUUE
Cool premise, I suppose. That said, the first part of your observation is true - everyone dying at the end being somehow a negative thing is a little goofy, though. There are better criticisms of Rogue One out there - so, so many of them.
I liked them dying at the end , where tf did they come from anyway
I'll never understand how SW fans can praise Rogue One like that. It was a mediocre, badly paced film with transparent rewrites and studio meddling. I've heard someone say if you leave only the battle of Scariff it would work as a pretty good short film for Disney+ and I agree.
Dom The Elegy Yeah I’m not a huge fan of Rouge One either. Might sound weird but it’s my least favorite of the disney films
You missing the bridge multiple times in the scrapyard spoke to me on a deeper level loool remember getting so frustrated at that exact part when I was younger
thx for the vid and effort
The Republic Commando books are probably my favorite and would certainly recommend them, if you're into Clone Wars content it's perfect for you. Even if you're not into Clone Wars that much I think the Mandalorian culture/society explored in the books is just as enjoyable.
Did we played the same Fallen Order? Force is very useful in combat, you may not feel like a god of force but it certainly didn't feel like it'd been forced into the game (sorry for tautology). Although it seems like it was trying to be souls/sekiro type of game first and star wars second, with parrying animal hits with lightsaber looking especially wrong, but it's not related to force.
The Knights of the Old Republic comics by John Jackson Miller are in my top five Star Wars stories... movies included. And they even tie into the games, if you like those!
"Even the return of palpatine if you can imagine such a ridiculous notion." 😔 if only i couldn't
Thrawn will of course make his Live Action debut in Ahsoka! And maybe even his right hand man Gilad Pellion!
I played both the ps2 and PC versions. I played the ps2 one first, and the PC one disappointed me greatly (even with an fps unlocker to remove the 30fps cap).
The ps2 version is a better ps2 game than the ps3/360/PC version is a ps3/360/PC game, if that makes any sense. Also it's longer.
Nah. Ps2 version is vastly inferior.
In PS2 version you have a HP which is completely pointless since when you die the game just revives you without reviving any of the enemies.
And, the PS3/360/pc version with the DLCs were as long as the ps2 version.
Also, graphically the PS2 version was really bad. Felucia was a foggy mess in the ps2 version. Force grip was also hugely downgraded compared to PS3/360 versions.
Regardless of what anyone says. Revan is the most interesting and captivating character that isn’t from the films
Raven=The sith that just decides to be a Jedi because jedis managed to wipe his mind clean.
I'd love to see you do an in-depth critique of the KOTOR games!
You will!
For the reading list:
The "Legacy Of The Force" Books along with the "Fate of the Jedi" books are a wonderful way to see what the sequels should have been.
Hell yeah Chris! Perfect timing just got to the office to listen to this brick of a video
Is anyone here curious that if Vader knew he had a son before the events of New Hope would he still keep StarKiller?
I'll have to agree with Chris, and say Darth Bane Trilogy. It works very well as an explanation for how Sith survive with the Rule of Two and why it makes them so strong. It also sets up a brilliant theory with transferring souls between Sith master and apprentice, making it theoretically possible for Darth Bane's soul to actually carry on all the way up to Palpatine. Bane is also easy to root for as a character due to how much of an underdog he is at most times, and yet manages to do things he does, outsmarting and outdoing thousands of lesser Sith warriors. I love the guy.
The Force Unleashed was canon as F, but for the game interaction was buffed as F(_)ck!!! The novel or comics was more re likely be the more realistic version, cuse in on novel Vader was able to crush the lightsabers of Starkiller and also in one of both novels Starkiller said he was like a ragdoll toy with Vader as the puppeteer or the boy playing. And so on
I strongly consider The Force Unleashed to be the best Star Wars anthology series that almost was. The story of Starkiller in the first entry was engaging, and it plugged a gap in the continuity nicely. The then-canon ending even offered a great sense of closure. Everything that needed to be said was said and done: The Force Unleashed 2 could have been about anyone, at any point in then-canon. Force Unleashed 2 could have been about an obscure Jedi or Sith from Darth Bane's era, another survivor of Order 66, a friend of Jacen Solo, a rival or former love interest of Darth Talon...when I found out Force Unleashed 2 was a direct sequel though, that killed my interest in the series. When I found out it was predicated on the idea that a clone of Starkiller wanted to rekindle a romance between itself and Juno Eclipse, I raised an eyebrow and played Force Unleashed 1 again. The chemistry between Eclipse and Starkiller isn't bad, Hell they make more sense than Raylo, but they didn't have much in the way of romantic chemistry. The kiss at the end of Force Unleashed 1 came out of nowhere and like you said, it didn't feel earned. I don't see myself ever playing TFU2, it does look like an improvement, but the story kills it for me.
If Drew Karpyshyn authored it, I recommend it. I also recommend Death Troopers as a "so bad it's good" read. Imagine Dead Space but in the Star Wars universe.
It's funny, because Fallen Order's devs WERE forced into making the game. Originally, they wanted to make more of a blaster-focused game, but someone, I don't know who, forced them to make it about Jedi.
Jack Clock i love that you and the guy that commented before you completely contradict each other xD I wonder whos right...(although i dont care enough to do the research myself)
That’s not true Disney really wanted them to make the protagonist a non-Force user while Respawn pushed for them to make the MC a Force user for their vision so you can stop spreading false info
The Force Unleashed was so jank that it almost felt traditional. As someone who's first Jedi game was Episode I: Jedi Power Battles, I'm just predisposed to playing as a force character with all the grace and movement of a haunted blender.
I'd honestly like to see a return of Dash Rendar...
In my mind, this game is canon. Oh? Disney says that it is not? Well, I don't care.
I like your review. It's very fair. I agree with you 95% The Star Destroyer take down is about timing you have to do it fast, or you'll be put in limbo where looks like you were. Can't be done. You have to restart you have to take it down Within. like 5 minutes oh, got to hit that sweet spot within like 4 minutes It took me a ton of tries to get that star destroyer down when that game came out.
21:33 bruh
I was never a fan of how these games overemphasized the force abilities over lightsaber combat and Starkiller is kind of boring. I haven’t played them, but from what I heard the Jedi Knight and Academy games tend to strike a good balance.
I love almost everything about Jedi Fallen Order and I don’t really mind how it tries to stay relatively consistent with the OT. The old EU and games did go overboard several times.
1 is awesome, 2 is atrociously abysmal.
years ago I read the novels and played all the games on all the consoles for force unleashed. it still is today my favorite star wars content and Galen is my favorite star wars character. to this day I'm angered they left his story open ended with the sequel that has yet to receive any follow up.
And is the 3rd one like the second one or first one because I'm confused a bit
My work is going to see an uptick in productivity for Tuesday now.
Quick question, I just want your opinion. Some people say that Finn in the Last Jedi was only fighting to save Rey but in the Last Jedi learns to fight for the resistance and that's what makes his arc different. What do you think bro? Cool video.
My favorite Disney Canon Book is the fart fetish one.
Saying that you can't understand people who enjoy the Last Jedi is the perfect encapsulation of my problem with some people who dislike the film. Personally, I absolutely despise The Rise of Skywalker, but that doesn't mean I don't get why some enjoy it. The fan service I hate so much, some are going to love, and the pacing that makes me wanna puke, are going to make others jump for joy.
I find this lack of "understanding" particurly odd considering just how subjective The Last Jedi is. Let's take Luke for example, depending on who you ask, he is either the best or the worst part of the story. I find Luke's journey to be a beautiful tale about learning from your mistakes and picking yourself up from deppression. While I love that he's still just as flawed as before, others wanted payoff for his arc in the OT. What they wanted was Luke Skywalker, Jedi Master, instead they got a deppressed hermit, (until the end of the movie at least) who caused the main villain's turn to the dark.
Now, I'm definitely taking this to seriously. It just bothered me so, so much, particularly since it came from the mouth of my favorite video game reviewer. Point is, please don't dismiss people who like something you hate, it makes you seem petty and rather immature.
Everything is subjective but you can still back up your arguments with facts. The problem with Luke in the Last Jedi is that Luke suffer from inconsistent characterization. The Luke in the Last Jedi was an completely different character to the point it felt like an character rewrite. Just because an character is flawed doesn't mean their good, I don't mind Luke becoming an hermit but it was poorly done.
@@SonicBadass while i agree that luke is very different in presentation between the two trilogies, i don't mind that at all because theres 30 years between the two. if luke was the exact same i would've been very disappointed because otherwise what would've been the point. luke being different shows that those 30 years were very unkind to h and made his character arc resonate so much more with me.
@@lilteddiursa But the audience needs to see those 30 years in order for his change to be believable. When an character changes with have to see that progression otherwise their change will feel like an character rewrite. That's simply good character development, bad character development is simply done with an time skip with the audience not seeing how the character changed.
@@SonicBadass but we do see that change, through character dialogue and flashbacks we see that he hates the legend that hes become, his fear of the dark side rising, his guilt at almost commiting violence against ben like how he almost killed his father, and kylo then killing the jedi he was training and starting the knights of ren. the movie absolutely justifies his change in personality. the force awakens sets luke up as what the resistance needs to beat kylo and snoke, and when rey finally meets him she, like the audience, is shocked to see him change, and the entire training sessions with luke explain why hes different.
as for it being bad story telling to see a character acting very differently after a time skip, all i can say is that i disagree. the whole draw of time skips is to see how things have changed and to work backwards from that. also with how long there was between the original trilogy and the sequel trilogy there was no other way they could've told that story if he was the same as in the originals or not, you would have to work backwards to see how his character progressed or, in this case, regressed.
@@lilteddiursa An few lines of dialogue isn't an organic character change that's simply telling us with have to see how he changed. Otherwise it's telling and not showing.
The problem with Luke considering killing Kylo is that it was out of character to begin with thus it doesn't make sense.
Furthermore, Luke being an legend wasn't handled properly. It's not reflected in the world. In the TFA people don't even believe he existed des the events of the OG being 30 years ago, we don't see museums, statues or art in his name or to praise him and his lightsaber was at an bar. The movie tries to tell me his an legend but I don't see it.
And how did he become tried of being an legend? Did people put to much expectations of him? Did people put pressure on him. And how could have they have done it if they never believed he existed? We don't see how being an legend slowly change Luke for the worse.
Time skips are an lazy way to add character changes to characters. Even bad writers could do it. It takes skill to show us the character slowly change. Even if your gonna have an time skip explain how the character changed.
May not be a "Reading" Recommendation but hear me out... The Dark Forces series of games are fantastic and Kyle Katarn's story should have been canon
Chris Davis, we meet again !
Great video, I would recommend the Darth Maul son of Dathomir comic and tales of the bounty hunters novel for reading
Good video even if I disagree with many of your points about JFO. TFU was something special and is fun to visit every now and then.
I'm really looking forward to your next entry in the isometric RPG series. Will you be covering Tyranny?
You watch a JJ film, you get what you deserve.
In terms of book recommendations, I'd throw the Republic/Imperial Commando books.
They're part of the Legends canon now, and the storyline is sadly unfinished, with the last book being (as far as I know) Imperial Commando: 501st, set in the months following Order 66.
If any of you have the opportunity to get a complete set of the books, I highly recommend you do so. They offer an interesting look at the Clone Wars and how it affected the Republic, Jedi and troopers, but also fleshes out and humanises the Clones themselves.
I loved playing the force inleashing on the wii when I was a little kid, good memories :')
I cant believe you said that the ps2 version is a clearly inferior version because of lack of tech. You immediately made it obvious that the only thing you know about the ps2 version is that the graphics are worse. In my personal opinion, the ps2 version is the superior version of the game.
For one, the graphics being a downgrade is I think the one time it has worked for a game. I think the more basic graphics look much nicer in cut scenes than the weird rubber people ones in the xb360/ps3 version. Also, the cutscenes arent pre rendered in the ps2 version which means that the lightsaber color and costume you choose will actually show up in the cutscene.
The story is also more spread out with the jedi temple missions, which show both starkiller's growing disdain for Vader, and how Vader still uses his jedi training to train his sith apprentice. There's also an escalation of security each time starkiller shows up and they become more aggressive in the opening cutscene until the last one when no one says anything and it's just on sight when you show up AGAIN.
The gameplay is also mostly the same apart from a few different moves, and lighting being a held thing and not a button tap. It also didn't slow you down when used. Some of the boss fights are also different, like with kazadan not having a fixed camera, and the arena having giant columns for him to hide behind and surprise attack you and disorient you.
You also are put in his ship in between each mission to customize, upgrade, look at lore, and pick your next mission(I think they were originally going to let you replay missions at the table, because it always shows what planet you're going to but doesnt let you do anything but pick the one it chose.)
I think that because the ps2 team had much simpler tech to work with, they could fit in more that the main team wanted to, but didn't have time, and made the ps2 version closer to the intended version.
The Nintendo ds version is the absolute worst though, hands down.
In ps2 version death is completely meaningless and you have far worse QTEs.
Those reasons alingside lots of other reasons such as poor facial animations, far inferior force grip , no ability to push charge whenever that you want, worse upgrade system , invisible walls , far more repetitive level design makes that version inferior than PS360 versions.
Luke Skywalker and the Shadows of Mindor is a great EU/Legends one-off story set after ROTJ - totally nails the feel of the original trilogy, and feels really great to see the original characters in a new context.
One of my favorites is Old Republic: Deceived - A Malgus based story with Zeerid and Aryn based story!
The Virgin Cal Kestis vs The Chad Starkilker
So, tldr:
The Chad Force Unleashed Vs the Virgin Fallen Order
Also my favourite thing to have come out of TFU was the Lego set of Starkiller's ship that I got when I was younger
It's weird that you would say that Unleashed is more than Rogue One and Fallen Order is more like the new movies. From what I remember, the main criticism of fans towards Unleashed, way before Disney and the new movie series came along was that Starkiller is way too overpowered and that while crazy force powers are fun, it doesn't really feel like the main message of Star Wars. Because in Star Wars the force is more akin to this martial arts thing you have to train for, that you have to earn and that has this whole moral component. Which in turn reminds me a lot of the complaints against Rise of the Skywalker with people saying that Rey is just way too overpowered in there and doesn't really have to work for it.
While Rogue one by comparison is the story that is a lot more pulled back and, like Fallen Order, tries really hard to fit into the cracks left by canon without upsetting anything.
To me Unleashed (even if it had the blessing of George) always felt like this self indulgent self insert fanfic that very clearly did not fit into actual canon, just based on "if Starkiller was that important, how come nobody mentions him in the movies". (compared to Revan where it makes a lot more sense since his story took place a long time ago)
Now none of this has any bearing on whether it's a fun game to play. But since you took this entire detour on what is the better was to extend Star Wars, I thought I should mention it.
How different is the ps2 version of TFU1 from the next Gen console versions.
This seems much different from my experience.
In my youth, I only had the wii version. I do remember them fondly
im going to play jedi outcast, force unleashed and fallen order back to back. I think its going to be a pretty fun way to experience them
if you want Recommendations for books, The Thrawn Ascendancy Trilogy & New Thrawn Trilogy (Thrawn, Alliance & Treason) are great and reset not only Thrawn but also The Chiss & Wild Space. A Surprising one I was reluctant at first to read but is very well written is Light of the Jedi High Republic book, but my personal fav is the OG Thrawn Trilogy, Force unleashed books and The Bane Trilogy (Which I think does deserve a new story with the new canon look from clone wars season 6
I do strongly suggest the old thrawn trilogy aswell but since it came up a couple of times I instead suggest something different? Death Troopers is the most weird mix of Star Wars and Zombies, used to be Canon and is much better than you would think. Especially as book on audible it comes with music and sounds and it's a real, proper star wars story with Han Solo fighting undead stormtroopers. It's actually very good. Newest SW book I red was Ahsoka and closes a bit of s gap between Clone Wars and Rebels
I listen to a lot of the Star Wars books on Audible. Those sound effects and the music really improve the experience.
Shadows of the Empire is technically considered G-canon (thanks to an Outrider Easter egg in ANH), if there is someone here that hasn't read it, I would recommend it. It bridges the gap between Ep 5 and 6.