Thank you all. As a new psychology major and trauma survivor I appreciate people who share this information. Not only does it help me but helps me see how to help others
The sooner doctors are on board with personality disorders the better off this world will be. I find alot of doctors ignoring this is a problem. It is not an excuse for these people. They do have days when they sit and cry 'why am I such a monster'. If cluster b people could get help in their childhood years, and there are signs, this wouldn't be happening right now. Thank you Dr. Fox for the work you do. I just wish there were more doctors out there like you.
YES YES! I SECOND EVERYTHING YOU SAID! THANK YOU ,THANK YOU DR FOX!THANK YOU TO EVERYONE ON THE COMMENTS ALSO! DR FOX HAS SAVE MY LIFE! WORDS CAN NEVER EXPRESS MY GRATITUDE TO YOU DR FOX!MAY GOD CONTINUE TO BLESSED YOU ALWAYS!❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Thank you, so much for acknowledging the effects of Personality disorders on their victims. I grew up along side a paranoid schizophrenic brother who targeted me above everyone else in the family, I was not allowed to defend myself from his constant bullying, teasing, violence and other crazy behaviour s such as creeping up on me, hiding and throwing stones at me, stealing my clothes and photographs, name calling, smashing my things, spitting in my face and on and on. I was completely helpless and was blamed for trying to stand up to him. After 30 years of this high stress 'dangerous' environment I am finally free of him and the people who enabled him. I never want to hear the words six of one and half a dozen of the other again. When you are living with someone with a severe mental illness this is certainly not the case. This is the most insightful conversation I have heard about this subject. Thank you again.
Mr. Fox understands BPD and the patients and I hope he runs off on the Mental Health community. I never told an excuse I have bpd. I will say it is a true inability to regulate my emotions and while splitting I can lose all control and snap. It wasn’t until Dr. Fox and people like him that I started learning the error of my ways! Thank you very much Mr. Fox!
I struggle with BPD and Domestic Violence I think the "Split" actually I know it's what causes me to snap and toss all the DBT skills out of the window. It took my stepson moving out to realize I have a problem. DBT and CBT are helping but it's a daily struggle I'm slowly getting better and encourage people to hang in there. Not in a violent relationship but as a partner with someone who has BPD
36:28 - I did have an extreme reaction to the abuse and I was labelled as the unstable one. Understanding what was happening and escaping that abuser was life changing. 2 years out and working on myself and my BPD and PTSD has changed my life for the better. Learning and growing in understanding and emotional regulation; This channel has taught me so much; thank you form the bottom of my heart
As a two year partner of a man with BPD..domestic violence is nothing to joke about . When he has an episode, he will threaten to call police crying that he is being hit and abused if l try to leave him. This gives you a police record. It destroys your relationship at the same time. I have also been trapped in room for hours by partner with BPD and had to leave my own house to escape being trapped by these emotional episodes that have scared my child. The manipulation rage and then pleading for you not to leave a second later is terrifying. My partner has been in CBT and on a waitlist for DBT over a year…l am waiting with him and keeping distance now.
i love how you put reason and excuse in clear context ...... one can have a reason doesn't mean they use it as an excuse ..... one thing a lot of people forget about situational violence as a actually reality for people with BPD and narsasitic personaty disorder where its not about control or dommanance its about reaction ...... and no matter what should always be held accountable as a male with BPD who has been a perpetrator of violence in a romantic relationship and family dynamics it only happens when lacking self regulation .... my partner never backed down on holding me accountable for my actions and i thank him soo much for doing so and getting removed form the home etc help set me on the right track agen ...... i say this to my parents who work in my g ma domestic violence clinic also ..... not everytime violence in romantic relationships is it about someone being majorly abusive ... a lot of times its about lack on self disaplin and radical acceptance when it comes to people who have class b personality disorders ... and never cuz they want to abuse or need to control ..... the chance of a situational violence in a relationship can become higher and for some more deadly but allways hold us accountable ... reasons arent excuses and even if someone doisent have control or remember doesn't mean they shoudoent be held accountable for there actions .... and don't have to be labeled as abusive just to make the point of being held accountable .......I'm glad my partner listen to me about my BPD and ptsd playing a role for when i hit him repetivly during a brake down screaming i just want you to love me right ....... i have a reason i broke ... but doesn't mean i didn't have to continually own it was my obligation to try harder and work harder at my mental health ..... because he has stayed strong we have gotten to the strongest our relationship has been .... it included not being allowed home or near him before we got back ..... personality disorders aren't excuses so no matter what if someone feels unsafe they should remove themselves or the other till things can be proven to be safe agen ..... i get so upset when domestic violance workers really cant accept the reality of situational violance and make sure when things like this happen everyone knows and accept one is a vicetm and one is an abuser completely removing the reality of situational violance and how people with high emotnal states have a higher chance of sintuational violance or aggresstion really awesome video to be apart of dr fox my fam has been working ing the DV fuild for a long time i never thought id be the one being violent in a romantic relationship shows how much i dient truly see mymetnal health
I can see how BDP suffers get caught in abusive relationships. They do almost no vetting before getting way too deep in relationships. I've seen them go from meeting someone to one month later living with them and being totally financially dependent on them. No person living in reality would do that and not expect bad things to happen eventually.
Also I have noticed that so many who have overlapping relationships and new relationships immediately after ending current relationships. These people seem that they can’t be able to be alone.
Has anyone been falsely accused/convicted of domestic violence (NPD projection)? This happened to me in 2005 divorce. The "experts" had no idea the level of abuse (e.g. flying monkeys) used against me. It's one thing for a mentally ill person to abuse you, it's another to have law enforcement, the courts, employers, or any other person that has power over you to use your victimhood against you.
I have seen it much more commonly, that the victim of domestic violence and abuse, and the coercive control that always precedes and accompanies a violent episode, and prevails after it, are overwhelmingly revictimized by law enforcement, psychiatric, social services, the justice system and even society in general, when the dynamics of domestic abuse reaches a level of intensity that draws the attention and action of these other groups that normally are unaware of the ongoing interpersonal violence being committed behind closed doors
Yes. I have seen this many times, and listened to many stories from people who have been falsely accused of things by the abuser. In fact, I myself have been through this. There is even a concept I came up with, that I call "legal abuse". But, I have recently discovered guess what? There is, now, a term that some professionals who work with victims of dv use, called "legal abuse". So, that's interesting. It's a newer concept. But I suspect that people will start talking about it more in the future.
I have experience similar scenario around same time 2005 with my ex-wife and part of her agenda was to win the custody over our mutual child. Sickening. Stressful and worse experience in my life. Hard learned lesson.
@@inpersonaDKI experienced the exact same with my husband. He moved into my house, he became extremely violent, I filled for divorce and asked nothing from him but he tried to flip everything onto me. He destroyed our two children. It is the most insane horrific thing I have ever experienced.
Oh man, couples therapy. Nope. Nope. Nope. That was harmful for me. The best thing I did for our marriage was went to my own therapy sessions alone, dropped all marriage books, learned how to grey rock. He hated it and applied a ton of pressure to get things back to the way they were. It was intense. But! Instead of the discard he actually began to change!! For the better.
Loved that you mentioned having to reprogram your patterns in relationships. I got out of an abusive relationship and then dated terrible people who didn’t treat me right. I have worked hard to learn that “excitement” and “ chaos” isn’t what love actually is. I have turned down men who I thought were boring, just like your client did. It has taken me a long time to realize my worth and to figure out who I am, so I won’t keep repeating the same thing again. I would love to hear more about the upper 3% of BPD that can get violent, because I believe my ex was one. I don’t believe he had npd or aspd. He had remorse and split a lot, also suffers form substance abuse and sexual/online addiction.
Wow. Thank you, all of you. I know you've never met me Dr Fox but trust me when I say you've been one of my best friends for about a year now. Turn up years ago I got involved with my partner who I didn't realize at the time was a severe drug addict. Severe as in over 20 years in and out of jail and prison and really will do anything she needs to do to get high. Being a severe fixer codependent, my instincts kicked into gear and I subconsciously tried to save her. I let way too many things go because quite frankly she intrigued me in the beginning. I always told her there was one day early on I looked at her and there was a very sad very scared little girl looking back at me for a minute. I knew then that something had happened to her and that's something had to be extremely relevant to her behavior. And again as a codependent this wasn't my first rodeo with an addict. But never ever have I ever met someone with this magnitude of those behaviors. in the beginning I thought I know she was lying but it doesn't make sense as to why. So I would work on figuring out why but meanwhile I let a really stupid lie go which only told her, I'll believe anything. And with daily gas lighting before I do it, before I even knew what hit me I kind of almost was believing anything. So many things I'm like I don't think that's true, but I don't know that it's not. It was a roller coaster from hell, and to this day as I'm reading this I love that girl more than anything. My struggle now is after all this time. I finally had found BPD about a year ago and my entire life all of a sudden made sense. Every behavior, she's got 9 out of 9 I could tell you multiple stories that correlate with every behavior. Even the favorite person. However her favorite person is not me and never was. As I said she spent most of her adult life in and out of incarceration, was unable to raise her children, and one toxic relationship after another mostly superficial. From what I've been able to ascertain only that favorite person was somewhat real at least in her mind. I honestly don't believe it was real in theirs. and now I struggle with am I real or am I just another trick because I'm the one that stuck around and I'm the one that takes care of her when she's in jail and I'm the one that answers the phone. She was like this the day I met her and I didn't know, and now I do know and she still like this and I don't know what to believe anymore. She finally told me that she gave up on the favorite person and I said I hope so cuz I have no way of knowing that while you're in jail. If your contacting then I don't know what to do. Swore up and down she wasn't, I even said I worry that when I run out of money and can't give you commissary you're going to go behind my back to other people you shouldn't be talking to and she swore she wouldn't do that. She's going to humble herself. When she went from jail to prison, being discharged from jail gives an inmate access to their jail mail for 60 days online. I found some more evidence in her phone that was a problem and when I confronted her with that I told her I wanted her login information and she was forced to give it to me because if she didn't she would look guilty. And sure enough there was a letter from that person only a month before, three letters in total all during the time. She swore she wasn't talking to them. So now I don't know what to do. I don't know how to navigate this journey. I said I would leave alone for now anything that happened before the date she agreed that she had a mental illness and needed help and would really get therapy in. I said all that deception can wait till you get into treatment and handle it. But any lies after that date are fair game.. and this is almost a year after that date. I struggle sometimes like is it MPD and she doesn't care about what she does or is it BPD and she doesn't know how to express. Because either way I don't see it. Everything I know from her is what I've been told by her. She's never once had her actions lined up to her words. I only know some things that are true from corroboration from her family and the main thing is the childhood trauma that would explain everything both from the step parent that abused her in the worst possible for a little girl and the mother who turned her head and punished her when tried to tell. I've also been accused of toxic compassion. But then things here and there that she says and does wind up being very clear to me that that's a BPD thing. Or that's her having no value for herself at all, that's her taking a trauma and trying to downplay it by using a different word to describe it. I brought this up to her because it seems relevant to me and I'm actually wondering if you wouldn't mind commenting on this thought I had. As an adult she did work as a prostitute to get her drugs and was beaten and raped many times. When she speaks of that to me, she will use the word rape. But when she speaks of her childhood abuse, which is the same exact action that happened to her, she uses the word molest. Shell say she was molested. I pointed it out to her once and we had talked about it and she kind of understood what I was saying but I also noticed that she immediately went back to using the two separate words. So I'm thinking that she's downplaying it in her mind somehow so her mother isn't to blame. I have watched her so closely and paid such attention over the last two and a half years that I don't think I would have been able to put this all together had I not. So I'm honestly not regretting that time despite the fact that I lost everything that I own as well as and pretty much an emotional shell of who I once was. Because for the first Time in 43 years somebody paid attention to her. Instead of just looking at what she did somebody wanted to know why? What makes you want to do that? So at this point in time where we are is she's in prison waiting to go through the whole process to start therapy and recovery. So right now she is still a completely undiagnosed and untreated borderline. So from day one until the last time I spoke to her she is lying. It's a compulsion. She won't admit to it completely even when caught dead to rights with evidence. I think that comes from childhood where ying equaled survival and Truth equal pain. I just don't know where that leaves me because despite understanding why doesn't change the fact that these things happen, that I was lied to, cheated on, used, gas lit, emotionally physically and psychologically abused, emotionally raped, my reputation got chipped away anytime she was mad at me she would lie about me. And she cannot give up this favorite person. So how do I protect myself without being just another one in the long line of people that abandon the borderline. I hate to give up this close to the end. I went through so much to get here and I don't want to fall down 10 ft from the finish line. I know I need therapy too I wish I could I just can't afford it right now. But I don't know how you take an untreated borderline and survived the beginning of that journey to where they start to truly acknowledge what they've done. I feel like she's self-aware enough to at least have her dysregulation cycle and then call me later and apologize. To figure out what it feels like when she's cycling and know that she's cycling. And that at the end of that cycle is going to be a body. Most likely mine. Is there any way that they blow through like a hurricane but at least stop every few feet look over their shoulders and survey the damage? I'm so sorry I just got so long. As I mentioned I don't have anyone to talk to and I need a therapist lol. This is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. Cuz it really feels like what she needs and what I need are at two opposite ends of the spectrum.
I love Dr Fox's videos, he really helps me cope better with life and I'm an older woman with mental health problems. Thank you for this video with the two ladies
Just wanted to mention this because I hear it so very often and had said it my self so many times in the past. A lot of us say “ if they had hit me I would have left” but most do not leave when that does eventually happen and the truth is if you look at what we put up with psychologically for years a hit would seem like a drop in the hat to that damage as well
Also, I am impressed that he mentioned this issue that ocurrs with people who have been abused, like developing issues as a result of the abuse, and even drug use, being diagnosed with various disorders. Thats the first time I have heard someone even mention anything about that.
thing i learned form this is low frustration tollorance ........ this is actually really what has ben the biggest issue for my petulance and even anytime I've had aggressive relations ...... even in the domestic the reason it got so bad was we would go in circles about disagrements to the point id snap ....... sometimes at a super low tolerance sometimes cuz the lack of ability to separate before the frustration tolerance got to low ........ you really put it in the best terms .......anyone with aggressive issues needs to become mindful of there frustration tollorance and how to monuver around them .... as that's what saved me ..... that's the radical acceptance i made to prevent myself from falling back to aggressive behavior ..... awesome video
I’m grateful for the education. An aging narcissist gets worse; and alcohol emphasizes the bad qualities of a psychopathic malignant covert narcissist. And yet because of the constant smearing I am the one who is crazy. And the joke is if a person is crazy then they are disposable. If he looked in the mirror he would see a drunken three year old. The reveal was shocking.
I have dealt with a lot of dv. Intimate partner dv (mostly heterosexual relationships), and something interesting I have noticed is that often times, if it's male on female dv, where the man is the abuser, it's usually due to misogynistic attitudes and beliefs regarding women and womens roles. A smaller percentage of the time, it's a personality disorder that's involved. And I also believe that this may help explain why we see more male on female dv in intimate relationships when it comes to dv. However, when it is female on male dv, in intimate relationships, the abuser shows signs of a cluster b personality. Just something that I have observed. I am not trying to pathologize women. But tbh, this is what I have seen in every single case where the female is the abuser.
When enduring the DV that comes after leaving some relationships it’s crucial to securely block that person as well as their friends, family, acquaintances who will spy on you and report it to them. Even completely harmless things can be used by a malevolent ex to harass and persecute you. And NEVER go on their social media either because doubtless there will be things there specifically aimed at hurting, scaring or manipulating you.
I went to two sessions of couples therapy with my now ex husband. He had been abusing me, but everything was always my fault. The therapist asked during the first session why we were in therapy. My ex husband went on to talk the entire session and blamed me, saying I couldn’t put phone chargers back and that was causing a major strain on our marriage. The therapist asked me, do you think you could buy some extra charges? I remember leaving thinking, “maybe I am the problem”. Fortunately, in the next session, she told my ex she wanted to hear from me. I started to cry and opened my mouth to speak - he started yelling at the therapist. He told her it was her fault for making me cry and he stormed out of the session. I went back the next time and told her everything. She gave me some good tips on boundaries moving forward, told me what was happening shouldn’t have happened. She put names to things I didn’t want to name - rape, assault, threatening suicide by means of controlling me, etc. it was really helpful. I don’t think it’s beneficial to go to therapy with a narcissist. They just silence and blame, and then they have ammunition “granted” to them by the therapist.
Do you think you could buy extra chargers. Geese. Also be wary of a therapist or doctor who tries to make your partner your point of support of your therapy before they find out if the partner is part of the problem. Or things like what you described will happen. Individual therapy is best in situations like this.
My ex bpd gf was addicted to dating and sexting sites. Because of the trauma I experienced due to her cell phone addiction I would never consider meeting someone on a dating site. In the end I had her choose her online life or me. She chose her phone. In the end she became violent.
When the partner is gathering flying monkeys, how can we trust that the therapist won't become one of them? Therapists' ability to recognize disorders at play in a couples' dynamic is one part subjective, and one part dependent on solid information. Many dishonest or depressed individuals tell fanciful stories about themselves; especially if they are trying to portray someone they abuse as an abuser. In couple's therapy and even in individual therapy, how does a therapist avoid making things worse by reinforcing an unhealthy dynamic due to misunderstanding what is going on? Of course they don't say "make my relationship worse", but the abuser wants something out of the relationship, and will certainly lie to get it. For people suffering with dissociation, what they may seek from a therapist is validation, and if you simply make them feel justified in their abuse, they will ratchet it up.
The ICD - the system used in most countries outside the USA - has abolished all the old personality disorders and replaced them with a dimensional, spectrum type model that records traits, rather than trying to shoehorn them into arbitrary and often reductive boxes like the DSM does.
@T H I've been studying evolutionary behavior for a while. And I cannot wrap my head around how the d s m make sense. I have always found the ICD more accurate.
Child abuse here, but it was classified as domestic when it continued past the age of 18. And BPD. I caught myself yesterday having a problem and an emotional sort of beeak down where that BPD brain was in full control and i was needling my partner. It was so humiliating that i was making a problem when there wasnt one and making my partner's struggle with depreasion all about me. When i snapped out of it i immediately apologized. But i am so lucky to have a partner who remained calm and collected while i was in a spiral.
I don’t know if I should post this or not… I am personally diagnosed ADHD and GAD (ocd primary) and have been under long-term care from a psychiatrist. I am currently struggling with domestic abuse that is escalating from my partner who is diagnosed bipolar but undiagnosed bpd and an alcoholic. I hope this video helps me understand. I am trying to be patient but the physical violence has progressed with the alcohol and I am beginning to fear for my life.
I lived that same scenario for 20 years! Please get away! There is no hope that they will change. Your therapy is useless, while you are still in the abuse. I’m so sorry. ❤
In my opinion the movie: Girl Interrupted is a good example of the spectrum (with violence or not) related to Borderline Personality Disorder. Susanna K. Lisa. Just a thought possibly having the same disorder)?
In my experience, a smart narcissist or psychopath will cause psychological harm, but cannot be held to account because they know better than to create physical violence. But they can be scary, always hiding behind veiled threats. Borderlines, and their affective instability are prone to angry outbursts that often lead to physical outbursts that per the legal definition, engage in what we traditionally consider domestic violence including striking a partner or trying to destroy their personal property.
It's important to recognize the different ways that individuals can cause harm and the impact it can have on those involved. It's crucial to prioritize safety and seek support when needed.
@@DrDanielFox absolutely. But when dealing with psychological abuse, it's often hard to demonstrate, and those who are being abused aren't believed- especially if there is a smear campaign. My ex manipulated even my own family into believing completely false scenarios, fabricated mental conditions that I supposedly had, etc I was isolated and not believed. These include being bi-polar, a narcissist, several "mental breakdowns," suicide attempts, drug problems and several overdoses. All of them 100% false. I don't drink or do drugs! The only thing I have been diagnosed with is CPTSD because of my experience. Even almost 7 or 8 years later, my family still does not believe me, and the false narratives implanted in the brains of my neighbors and other people who I continue to have to deal with believe these falsehoods. I have since had a child with another man, and there have been a number of attempts to have my daughter removed from my custody because of what these people continue to believe as well as gossip about. My daughter is lively, sweet, kind, and other kids generally live her. But due to all the false mythology, parents refuse to let their children even around my daughter- even when she has never once shown any sign of aggression towards anyone. These smear campaigns ruin lives, families, etc and can persist for years. As long as there are flying monkeys with schadenfreude, they will perpetuate the abuse. And there is nothing criminal about what they are doing- even though it's now affecting my completely innocent daughter who has nothing to do with the man who began this campaign. It's sickening. It started as "domestic violence" 8 or 9 years ago. And even though I have cut off all ties with my ex, he and some of his proxies have taken the abuse way outside of the home. And there is nothing I can do about it.
It can be really challenging to navigate these kinds of situations. It's important to trust your instincts and seek professional help if needed. Remember, you deserve to be in a healthy and supportive environment.
Idk, I myself can hardly stay around people who support some nasty things like war, who say disgusting things about other nations, or when they watch their favorite pandits, leaders, tv-shows. It's not just about tolerating other opinions - they will never stop thinking it's ok to watch around me things I don't like, and I will never start tolerating some things
Can you make my personality worse? I'm done being nice. And now after a year of trauma therapy I'm learning emotional regulation...... but these b's are gonna drive me crazy
the police have put me on a list of vulnerable people because of the behaviour of a BPD neighbour. She follows me to and from my jobs, steals my post, kicks on walls in the night. Personally I do not see the point of being put on a list, because this situation will not end well and I know it. She is relentless, and has to the backing of other people on my road. one good thing I am glad about, she bragged about her neighbourly alliances to the authorities, causing her and them to be monitored. The police and my housing provider have given her a warning about her behaviour, but it just makes things worse. I put on a body cam and have cctv all over my home and facing onto the road as the altercations happen on the road, I have made things worse because it has driven her to more sneaky ways. Ignoring such people is like pouring oil on fire. I will probably get kickback for posting what I have posted, but this is REALLY tiring, repetitive and tedious to observe. I dont mind not being liked, but this behaviour has dragged on since she moved here in 2012. Going to work is therapy and relief!! I hang on to that for my sanity! I can see things getting physical, as I had already been mugged in 2018 and she found the situation very amusing, she laughed actually. This is not going to end well at all
At 18:00 she calls it passion but you understand women can’t stand nice men who just lay over for women. She tested him and he failed. The abusing bf at least resisted. Unfortunately got into violence which is not good, but you should at least bring up female nature in that their innate desire to test men allows them to see who can stand up n be real
We can see and expirence very intesne things that exist and u cannot unsee also i have been online bullied. And friends around me said u know its your fault. Tfw those people are no longer part of my life.
Thank you all. As a new psychology major and trauma survivor I appreciate people who share this information. Not only does it help me but helps me see how to help others
This perspective shows that you’re going to be wonderful in your selected field. Best wishes!
The sooner doctors are on board with personality disorders the better off this world will be. I find alot of doctors ignoring this is a problem. It is not an excuse for these people. They do have days when they sit and cry 'why am I such a monster'. If cluster b people could get help in their childhood years, and there are signs, this wouldn't be happening right now. Thank you Dr. Fox for the work you do. I just wish there were more doctors out there like you.
YES YES! I SECOND EVERYTHING YOU SAID! THANK YOU ,THANK YOU DR FOX!THANK YOU TO EVERYONE ON THE COMMENTS ALSO! DR FOX HAS SAVE MY LIFE! WORDS CAN NEVER EXPRESS MY GRATITUDE TO YOU DR FOX!MAY GOD CONTINUE TO BLESSED YOU ALWAYS!❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
@@Christine-jg3hf 🙏❤
Thank you, so much for acknowledging the effects of Personality disorders on their victims. I grew up along side a paranoid schizophrenic brother who targeted me above everyone else in the family, I was not allowed to defend myself from his constant bullying, teasing, violence and other crazy behaviour s such as creeping up on me, hiding and throwing stones at me, stealing my clothes and photographs, name calling, smashing my things, spitting in my face and on and on. I was completely helpless and was blamed for trying to stand up to him. After 30 years of this high stress 'dangerous' environment I am finally free of him and the people who enabled him. I never want to hear the words six of one and half a dozen of the other again. When you are living with someone with a severe mental illness this is certainly not the case. This is the most insightful conversation I have heard about this subject. Thank you again.
Mr. Fox understands BPD and the patients and I hope he runs off on the Mental Health community. I never told an excuse I have bpd. I will say it is a true inability to regulate my emotions and while splitting I can lose all control and snap. It wasn’t until Dr. Fox and people like him that I started learning the error of my ways! Thank you very much Mr. Fox!
I struggle with BPD and Domestic Violence I think the "Split" actually I know it's what causes me to snap and toss all the DBT skills out of the window. It took my stepson moving out to realize I have a problem. DBT and CBT are helping but it's a daily struggle I'm slowly getting better and encourage people to hang in there. Not in a violent relationship but as a partner with someone who has BPD
Thank YOU Doctor Fox for Destigmatizing BPD!! You are So Appreciated
36:28 - I did have an extreme reaction to the abuse and I was labelled as the unstable one. Understanding what was happening and escaping that abuser was life changing. 2 years out and working on myself and my BPD and PTSD has changed my life for the better. Learning and growing in understanding and emotional regulation; This channel has taught me so much; thank you form the bottom of my heart
A relief to listen to this. Love the empathy of Dr Fox
Thank you
Well said I agree Doctor Daniel YOU are So Appreciated on so many levels ❤
As a two year partner of a man with BPD..domestic violence is nothing to joke about . When he has an episode, he will threaten to call police crying that he is being hit and abused if l try to leave him. This gives you a police record. It destroys your relationship at the same time. I have also been trapped in room for hours by partner with BPD and had to leave my own house to escape being trapped by these emotional episodes that have scared my child. The manipulation rage and then pleading for you not to leave a second later is terrifying. My partner has been in CBT and on a waitlist for DBT over a year…l am waiting with him and keeping distance now.
i love how you put reason and excuse in clear context ...... one can have a reason doesn't mean they use it as an excuse ..... one thing a lot of people forget about situational violence as a actually reality for people with BPD and narsasitic personaty disorder where its not about control or dommanance its about reaction ...... and no matter what should always be held accountable as a male with BPD who has been a perpetrator of violence in a romantic relationship and family dynamics it only happens when lacking self regulation .... my partner never backed down on holding me accountable for my actions and i thank him soo much for doing so and getting removed form the home etc help set me on the right track agen ...... i say this to my parents who work in my g ma domestic violence clinic also ..... not everytime violence in romantic relationships is it about someone being majorly abusive ... a lot of times its about lack on self disaplin and radical acceptance when it comes to people who have class b personality disorders ... and never cuz they want to abuse or need to control ..... the chance of a situational violence in a relationship can become higher and for some more deadly but allways hold us accountable ... reasons arent excuses and even if someone doisent have control or remember doesn't mean they shoudoent be held accountable for there actions .... and don't have to be labeled as abusive just to make the point of being held accountable .......I'm glad my partner listen to me about my BPD and ptsd playing a role for when i hit him repetivly during a brake down screaming i just want you to love me right ....... i have a reason i broke ... but doesn't mean i didn't have to continually own it was my obligation to try harder and work harder at my mental health ..... because he has stayed strong we have gotten to the strongest our relationship has been .... it included not being allowed home or near him before we got back ..... personality disorders aren't excuses so no matter what if someone feels unsafe they should remove themselves or the other till things can be proven to be safe agen ..... i get so upset when domestic violance workers really cant accept the reality of situational violance and make sure when things like this happen everyone knows and accept one is a vicetm and one is an abuser completely removing the reality of situational violance and how people with high emotnal states have a higher chance of sintuational violance or aggresstion really awesome video to be apart of dr fox my fam has been working ing the DV fuild for a long time
i never thought id be the one being violent in a romantic relationship shows how much i dient truly see mymetnal health
Thanks
I can see how BDP suffers get caught in abusive relationships. They do almost no vetting before getting way too deep in relationships. I've seen them go from meeting someone to one month later living with them and being totally financially dependent on them. No person living in reality would do that and not expect bad things to happen eventually.
Also I have noticed that so many who have overlapping relationships and new relationships immediately after ending current relationships. These people seem that they can’t be able to be alone.
Has anyone been falsely accused/convicted of domestic violence (NPD projection)? This happened to me in 2005 divorce. The "experts" had no idea the level of abuse (e.g. flying monkeys) used against me. It's one thing for a mentally ill person to abuse you, it's another to have law enforcement, the courts, employers, or any other person that has power over you to use your victimhood against you.
I have seen it much more commonly, that the victim of domestic violence and abuse, and the coercive control that always precedes and accompanies a violent episode, and prevails after it, are overwhelmingly revictimized by law enforcement, psychiatric, social services, the justice system and even society in general, when the dynamics of domestic abuse reaches a level of intensity that draws the attention and action of these other groups that normally are unaware of the ongoing interpersonal violence being committed behind closed doors
Yes. I have seen this many times, and listened to many stories from people who have been falsely accused of things by the abuser. In fact, I myself have been through this. There is even a concept I came up with, that I call "legal abuse". But, I have recently discovered guess what? There is, now, a term that some professionals who work with victims of dv use, called "legal abuse". So, that's interesting. It's a newer concept. But I suspect that people will start talking about it more in the future.
I have experience similar scenario around same time 2005 with my ex-wife and part of her agenda was to win the custody over our mutual child. Sickening. Stressful and worse experience in my life. Hard learned lesson.
Happened to me. I wasn’t convicted but the experience cost me my home, belongings, friends, business and lots of money before she dropped it.
@@inpersonaDKI experienced the exact same with my husband. He moved into my house, he became extremely violent, I filled for divorce and asked nothing from him but he tried to flip everything onto me. He destroyed our two children. It is the most insane horrific thing I have ever experienced.
Oh man, couples therapy. Nope. Nope. Nope. That was harmful for me. The best thing I did for our marriage was went to my own therapy sessions alone, dropped all marriage books, learned how to grey rock. He hated it and applied a ton of pressure to get things back to the way they were. It was intense. But! Instead of the discard he actually began to change!! For the better.
Silence Not Violence?
Wow! But how did you cope with lying & gaslighting etc I'm sure nothing is really going to change that
What changed?
Loved that you mentioned having to reprogram your patterns in relationships. I got out of an abusive relationship and then dated terrible people who didn’t treat me right. I have worked hard to learn that “excitement” and “ chaos” isn’t what love actually is. I have turned down men who I thought were boring, just like your client did. It has taken me a long time to realize my worth and to figure out who I am, so I won’t keep repeating the same thing again.
I would love to hear more about the upper 3% of BPD that can get violent, because I believe my ex was one. I don’t believe he had npd or aspd. He had remorse and split a lot, also suffers form substance abuse and sexual/online addiction.
This was great! Thank you women and Doctor Daniel Fox
I really enjoy these longer format collaborations. They’re very informative.
I agree with you, this was an excellent interview and discussion.
Wow. Thank you, all of you. I know you've never met me Dr Fox but trust me when I say you've been one of my best friends for about a year now. Turn up years ago I got involved with my partner who I didn't realize at the time was a severe drug addict. Severe as in over 20 years in and out of jail and prison and really will do anything she needs to do to get high. Being a severe fixer codependent, my instincts kicked into gear and I subconsciously tried to save her. I let way too many things go because quite frankly she intrigued me in the beginning. I always told her there was one day early on I looked at her and there was a very sad very scared little girl looking back at me for a minute. I knew then that something had happened to her and that's something had to be extremely relevant to her behavior. And again as a codependent this wasn't my first rodeo with an addict. But never ever have I ever met someone with this magnitude of those behaviors. in the beginning I thought I know she was lying but it doesn't make sense as to why. So I would work on figuring out why but meanwhile I let a really stupid lie go which only told her, I'll believe anything. And with daily gas lighting before I do it, before I even knew what hit me I kind of almost was believing anything. So many things I'm like I don't think that's true, but I don't know that it's not. It was a roller coaster from hell, and to this day as I'm reading this I love that girl more than anything. My struggle now is after all this time. I finally had found BPD about a year ago and my entire life all of a sudden made sense. Every behavior, she's got 9 out of 9 I could tell you multiple stories that correlate with every behavior. Even the favorite person. However her favorite person is not me and never was. As I said she spent most of her adult life in and out of incarceration, was unable to raise her children, and one toxic relationship after another mostly superficial. From what I've been able to ascertain only that favorite person was somewhat real at least in her mind. I honestly don't believe it was real in theirs. and now I struggle with am I real or am I just another trick because I'm the one that stuck around and I'm the one that takes care of her when she's in jail and I'm the one that answers the phone. She was like this the day I met her and I didn't know, and now I do know and she still like this and I don't know what to believe anymore. She finally told me that she gave up on the favorite person and I said I hope so cuz I have no way of knowing that while you're in jail. If your contacting then I don't know what to do. Swore up and down she wasn't, I even said I worry that when I run out of money and can't give you commissary you're going to go behind my back to other people you shouldn't be talking to and she swore she wouldn't do that. She's going to humble herself. When she went from jail to prison, being discharged from jail gives an inmate access to their jail mail for 60 days online. I found some more evidence in her phone that was a problem and when I confronted her with that I told her I wanted her login information and she was forced to give it to me because if she didn't she would look guilty. And sure enough there was a letter from that person only a month before, three letters in total all during the time. She swore she wasn't talking to them. So now I don't know what to do. I don't know how to navigate this journey. I said I would leave alone for now anything that happened before the date she agreed that she had a mental illness and needed help and would really get therapy in. I said all that deception can wait till you get into treatment and handle it. But any lies after that date are fair game.. and this is almost a year after that date. I struggle sometimes like is it MPD and she doesn't care about what she does or is it BPD and she doesn't know how to express. Because either way I don't see it. Everything I know from her is what I've been told by her. She's never once had her actions lined up to her words. I only know some things that are true from corroboration from her family and the main thing is the childhood trauma that would explain everything both from the step parent that abused her in the worst possible for a little girl and the mother who turned her head and punished her when tried to tell. I've also been accused of toxic compassion. But then things here and there that she says and does wind up being very clear to me that that's a BPD thing. Or that's her having no value for herself at all, that's her taking a trauma and trying to downplay it by using a different word to describe it. I brought this up to her because it seems relevant to me and I'm actually wondering if you wouldn't mind commenting on this thought I had. As an adult she did work as a prostitute to get her drugs and was beaten and raped many times. When she speaks of that to me, she will use the word rape. But when she speaks of her childhood abuse, which is the same exact action that happened to her, she uses the word molest. Shell say she was molested. I pointed it out to her once and we had talked about it and she kind of understood what I was saying but I also noticed that she immediately went back to using the two separate words. So I'm thinking that she's downplaying it in her mind somehow so her mother isn't to blame. I have watched her so closely and paid such attention over the last two and a half years that I don't think I would have been able to put this all together had I not. So I'm honestly not regretting that time despite the fact that I lost everything that I own as well as and pretty much an emotional shell of who I once was. Because for the first Time in 43 years somebody paid attention to her. Instead of just looking at what she did somebody wanted to know why? What makes you want to do that? So at this point in time where we are is she's in prison waiting to go through the whole process to start therapy and recovery. So right now she is still a completely undiagnosed and untreated borderline. So from day one until the last time I spoke to her she is lying. It's a compulsion. She won't admit to it completely even when caught dead to rights with evidence. I think that comes from childhood where ying equaled survival and Truth equal pain. I just don't know where that leaves me because despite understanding why doesn't change the fact that these things happen, that I was lied to, cheated on, used, gas lit, emotionally physically and psychologically abused, emotionally raped, my reputation got chipped away anytime she was mad at me she would lie about me. And she cannot give up this favorite person. So how do I protect myself without being just another one in the long line of people that abandon the borderline. I hate to give up this close to the end. I went through so much to get here and I don't want to fall down 10 ft from the finish line. I know I need therapy too I wish I could I just can't afford it right now. But I don't know how you take an untreated borderline and survived the beginning of that journey to where they start to truly acknowledge what they've done. I feel like she's self-aware enough to at least have her dysregulation cycle and then call me later and apologize. To figure out what it feels like when she's cycling and know that she's cycling. And that at the end of that cycle is going to be a body. Most likely mine. Is there any way that they blow through like a hurricane but at least stop every few feet look over their shoulders and survey the damage? I'm so sorry I just got so long. As I mentioned I don't have anyone to talk to and I need a therapist lol. This is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. Cuz it really feels like what she needs and what I need are at two opposite ends of the spectrum.
I'm so glad this video was helpful for you. I wish you well.
I love Dr Fox's videos, he really helps me cope better with life and I'm an older woman with mental health problems. Thank you for this video with the two ladies
I'm so glad this video was helpful for you. I wish you well.
great video! and discussion about the relationship between BPD and DV and what the people around someone with BPD might experience!
Just wanted to mention this because I hear it so very often and had said it my self so many times in the past. A lot of us say “ if they had hit me I would have left” but most do not leave when that does eventually happen and the truth is if you look at what we put up with psychologically for years a hit would seem like a drop in the hat to that damage as well
Also, I am impressed that he mentioned this issue that ocurrs with people who have been abused, like developing issues as a result of the abuse, and even drug use, being diagnosed with various disorders. Thats the first time I have heard someone even mention anything about that.
thing i learned form this is low frustration tollorance ........ this is actually really what has ben the biggest issue for my petulance and even anytime I've had aggressive relations ...... even in the domestic the reason it got so bad was we would go in circles about disagrements to the point id snap ....... sometimes at a super low tolerance sometimes cuz the lack of ability to separate before the frustration tolerance got to low ........ you really put it in the best terms .......anyone with aggressive issues needs to become mindful of there frustration tollorance and how to monuver around them .... as that's what saved me ..... that's the radical acceptance i made to prevent myself from falling back to aggressive behavior ..... awesome video
Great Video. Thanku ☀️🍃
I’m grateful for the education. An aging narcissist gets worse; and alcohol emphasizes the bad qualities of a psychopathic malignant covert narcissist. And yet because of the constant smearing I am the one who is crazy. And the joke is if a person is crazy then they are disposable. If he looked in the mirror he would see a drunken three year old. The reveal was shocking.
I have dealt with a lot of dv. Intimate partner dv (mostly heterosexual relationships), and something interesting I have noticed is that often times, if it's male on female dv, where the man is the abuser, it's usually due to misogynistic attitudes and beliefs regarding women and womens roles. A smaller percentage of the time, it's a personality disorder that's involved. And I also believe that this may help explain why we see more male on female dv in intimate relationships when it comes to dv. However, when it is female on male dv, in intimate relationships, the abuser shows signs of a cluster b personality. Just something that I have observed. I am not trying to pathologize women. But tbh, this is what I have seen in every single case where the female is the abuser.
When enduring the DV that comes after leaving some relationships it’s crucial to securely block that person as well as their friends, family, acquaintances who will spy on you and report it to them. Even completely harmless things can be used by a malevolent ex to harass and persecute you. And NEVER go on their social media either because doubtless there will be things there specifically aimed at hurting, scaring or manipulating you.
I'm so glad this video was helpful for you. I wish you well.
Thx interesting topic.
Thank you
I went to two sessions of couples therapy with my now ex husband. He had been abusing me, but everything was always my fault. The therapist asked during the first session why we were in therapy. My ex husband went on to talk the entire session and blamed me, saying I couldn’t put phone chargers back and that was causing a major strain on our marriage. The therapist asked me, do you think you could buy some extra charges? I remember leaving thinking, “maybe I am the problem”. Fortunately, in the next session, she told my ex she wanted to hear from me. I started to cry and opened my mouth to speak - he started yelling at the therapist. He told her it was her fault for making me cry and he stormed out of the session. I went back the next time and told her everything. She gave me some good tips on boundaries moving forward, told me what was happening shouldn’t have happened. She put names to things I didn’t want to name - rape, assault, threatening suicide by means of controlling me, etc. it was really helpful. I don’t think it’s beneficial to go to therapy with a narcissist. They just silence and blame, and then they have ammunition “granted” to them by the therapist.
Do you think you could buy extra chargers. Geese. Also be wary of a therapist or doctor who tries to make your partner your point of support of your therapy before they find out if the partner is part of the problem.
Or things like what you described will happen. Individual therapy is best in situations like this.
My ex bpd gf was addicted to dating and sexting sites. Because of the trauma I experienced due to her cell phone addiction I would never consider meeting someone on a dating site.
In the end I had her choose her online life or me. She chose her phone. In the end she became violent.
Hard decision for sure. I hope you're ok.
When the partner is gathering flying monkeys, how can we trust that the therapist won't become one of them? Therapists' ability to recognize disorders at play in a couples' dynamic is one part subjective, and one part dependent on solid information. Many dishonest or depressed individuals tell fanciful stories about themselves; especially if they are trying to portray someone they abuse as an abuser. In couple's therapy and even in individual therapy, how does a therapist avoid making things worse by reinforcing an unhealthy dynamic due to misunderstanding what is going on?
Of course they don't say "make my relationship worse", but the abuser wants something out of the relationship, and will certainly lie to get it. For people suffering with dissociation, what they may seek from a therapist is validation, and if you simply make them feel justified in their abuse, they will ratchet it up.
Thanks!
It'd be interesting to also find out where ADHD and its cousins Oppositional Defiant Disorder and Conduct Disorder fit in with domestic violence.
Yes yes yes.... step out of the DSM!!!!!
The ICD - the system used in most countries outside the USA - has abolished all the old personality disorders and replaced them with a dimensional, spectrum type model that records traits, rather than trying to shoehorn them into arbitrary and often reductive boxes like the DSM does.
@T H I've been studying evolutionary behavior for a while. And I cannot wrap my head around how the d s m make sense. I have always found the ICD more accurate.
Child abuse here, but it was classified as domestic when it continued past the age of 18. And BPD. I caught myself yesterday having a problem and an emotional sort of beeak down where that BPD brain was in full control and i was needling my partner. It was so humiliating that i was making a problem when there wasnt one and making my partner's struggle with depreasion all about me.
When i snapped out of it i immediately apologized. But i am so lucky to have a partner who remained calm and collected while i was in a spiral.
You are definitely blessed ❤
Yea Dr Daniel Dimples ❤👍🇦🇺
thank you..
Spot on w narc relationship
I'm so glad this video was helpful for you. I wish you well.
I'm with the upper 3% BPD.... I'm completely traumatized....
I don’t know if I should post this or not… I am personally diagnosed ADHD and GAD (ocd primary) and have been under long-term care from a psychiatrist. I am currently struggling with domestic abuse that is escalating from my partner who is diagnosed bipolar but undiagnosed bpd and an alcoholic. I hope this video helps me understand. I am trying to be patient but the physical violence has progressed with the alcohol and I am beginning to fear for my life.
I lived that same scenario for 20 years! Please get away! There is no hope that they will change. Your therapy is useless, while you are still in the abuse. I’m so sorry. ❤
In my opinion the movie: Girl Interrupted is a good example of the spectrum (with violence or not) related to Borderline Personality Disorder. Susanna K. Lisa. Just a thought possibly having the same disorder)?
@DrDanielFox can you please help? I’m 41, I feel like a 12 year old, what can I do to help me feel like an adult?
In my experience, a smart narcissist or psychopath will cause psychological harm, but cannot be held to account because they know better than to create physical violence. But they can be scary, always hiding behind veiled threats. Borderlines, and their affective instability are prone to angry outbursts that often lead to physical outbursts that per the legal definition, engage in what we traditionally consider domestic violence including striking a partner or trying to destroy their personal property.
It's important to recognize the different ways that individuals can cause harm and the impact it can have on those involved. It's crucial to prioritize safety and seek support when needed.
@@DrDanielFox absolutely. But when dealing with psychological abuse, it's often hard to demonstrate, and those who are being abused aren't believed- especially if there is a smear campaign. My ex manipulated even my own family into believing completely false scenarios, fabricated mental conditions that I supposedly had, etc I was isolated and not believed. These include being bi-polar, a narcissist, several "mental breakdowns," suicide attempts, drug problems and several overdoses. All of them 100% false. I don't drink or do drugs! The only thing I have been diagnosed with is CPTSD because of my experience. Even almost 7 or 8 years later, my family still does not believe me, and the false narratives implanted in the brains of my neighbors and other people who I continue to have to deal with believe these falsehoods. I have since had a child with another man, and there have been a number of attempts to have my daughter removed from my custody because of what these people continue to believe as well as gossip about. My daughter is lively, sweet, kind, and other kids generally live her. But due to all the false mythology, parents refuse to let their children even around my daughter- even when she has never once shown any sign of aggression towards anyone. These smear campaigns ruin lives, families, etc and can persist for years. As long as there are flying monkeys with schadenfreude, they will perpetuate the abuse. And there is nothing criminal about what they are doing- even though it's now affecting my completely innocent daughter who has nothing to do with the man who began this campaign. It's sickening. It started as "domestic violence" 8 or 9 years ago. And even though I have cut off all ties with my ex, he and some of his proxies have taken the abuse way outside of the home. And there is nothing I can do about it.
I am trying to figure out if i am dealing with a malignant narcissist, BPD or a sociopath..
It can be really challenging to navigate these kinds of situations. It's important to trust your instincts and seek professional help if needed. Remember, you deserve to be in a healthy and supportive environment.
17:53 she loves the rollercoaster 🎢 not the carousel
How can one get the relationship they want, when your partner won't open up, or even divulge anything about their past or past relationships
Communication is key in any relationship. Have an open and honest conversation with your partner about the importance of sharing past experiences.
Have you read Dutton's The Abusive Personality?
Idk, I myself can hardly stay around people who support some nasty things like war, who say disgusting things about other nations, or when they watch their favorite pandits, leaders, tv-shows. It's not just about tolerating other opinions - they will never stop thinking it's ok to watch around me things I don't like, and I will never start tolerating some things
Can you make my personality worse? I'm done being nice. And now after a year of trauma therapy I'm learning emotional regulation...... but these b's are gonna drive me crazy
Wow! The narcissist is more likely to commit murder than the antisocial personality, that is something I didn’t know!!
It's surprising how different personality traits can influence behavior in such drastic ways!
Anyway if it’s causing someone to act up then they need help the most!
I like to call it social Mania not social media
I like that
domestic violence can be from behavioral disorders mental illness or a learned thing
the police have put me on a list of vulnerable people because of the behaviour of a BPD neighbour. She follows me to and from my jobs, steals my post, kicks on walls in the night. Personally I do not see the point of being put on a list, because this situation will not end well and I know it. She is relentless, and has to the backing of other people on my road. one good thing I am glad about, she bragged about her neighbourly alliances to the authorities, causing her and them to be monitored. The police and my housing provider have given her a warning about her behaviour, but it just makes things worse. I put on a body cam and have cctv all over my home and facing onto the road as the altercations happen on the road, I have made things worse because it has driven her to more sneaky ways. Ignoring such people is like pouring oil on fire. I will probably get kickback for posting what I have posted, but this is REALLY tiring, repetitive and tedious to observe. I dont mind not being liked, but this behaviour has dragged on since she moved here in 2012. Going to work is therapy and relief!! I hang on to that for my sanity! I can see things getting physical, as I had already been mugged in 2018 and she found the situation very amusing, she laughed actually. This is not going to end well at all
At 18:00 she calls it passion but you understand women can’t stand nice men who just lay over for women. She tested him and he failed. The abusing bf at least resisted. Unfortunately got into violence which is not good, but you should at least bring up female nature in that their innate desire to test men allows them to see who can stand up n be real
I'm exporting domestic violence abroad.
B S
I wanted ask if emotional abuse is domestic violance. I think so even tho society is not there yet
We can see and expirence very intesne things that exist and u cannot unsee also i have been online bullied. And friends around me said u know its your fault. Tfw those people are no longer part of my life.
On the internet thank you for speaking about internet culture or some loud people