As a Lombard this is totally my dream hearing a foreigner talking of Gian Galeazzo is insane or one that uses a perfect map for the foreign domination of Italy great video!
As an italian that studies history, this was very accurate, I'm surprised somebody that isn't from Italy could grasp, link and understand all the factors you've mentioned; amazing job so far, I'm curious about the part 2 (which I would argue, will be more difficult to handle)!
Really really great video. Why don't you make this video or another more than a single oneshot video? You could make a series, maybe using some suggestions fron the commet section (or maybe without this suggestions). You cuold tell this story inventing the specific details, like the names of the future succecors of gian galeazzo, but maintening the story plausible. I think ot would be really passionating.
As always, a great video. Here's a suggestion for another one: What if the Sassanids had managed to stop the Arabs at the Zagros Mountains or even earlier during the conquest of Mesopotamia?
The fourth crusade was the fault of the treacherous pretender to the Byzantine throne. Don’t make promises of payment that you will not keep friends, or you may lose everything.
The king is back haha! Truly, your videos have always been great and I’m happy about how you’ve been getting increasingly better in terms of quality, realism and style! Personally, I always looked more towards a Machiavellian republic and on top of that a federal system to address and respect the rich regional and cultural differences that manifested themselves after the fall of the western Roman Empire, ofc that would be more of an idealistic scenario, and your capability to address that by manifesting the political reality of the time is indeed a different idea than usual, everyone usually goes for Florence. Also, this video came at the perfect time, everyone is always talking about a united Latin Rome after the fall, but lately I’ve found myself obsessed with the Italian republics and their renaissance form the ashes of Rome (no pun intended) and their beautiful history and culture. Florence, Venetia, Naples under the Hauteville’s, Genoa. Can’t wait for part 2, man 😉🔥🔥 P.S: the passing yet beautiful mention of the 4th crusade has become a staple for this channel 😂. I’m with you, man. Curse the day that Christians fought against each other in such a horrible act, it will remain as one of the biggest tragedies ever to be seen in history.
The one who stood the greatest chance at unifying italy(and was on the path to do so) was Cesare Borgia, son of Alexander VI. Unfortunately the premature death of his father had him lose support and led to his demise.
I've been waiting for something like this to be tackled. Great premise and a more than solid base for a continuation, I'm glad you didn't just go over military successes and explained the economic reasons why and how Milan could have centralised power and favoured prosperity. I do think the Rome should be maintained with the Pope rather than having it become the capital of Italy, considering Gian Galeazzo's plan for an Italian kingdom was to have it centered around Pavia - his personal capital and the capital of the past kingdom of Italy, where Gian built the Certosa of Pavia and where he expected to be crowned.
16:16 OTL Sforza Milan installed the son of the doge of genoa in Corsica in the 1460s-1480s that was declared a vassal to the Duke of Milan (who got the title "count of corsica", a title that the sforza tried to press earlier). Then the governor decided to ally with some local corsican lords. The new Doge of Genoa wasn't as willing to keep a family member on Corsica so they kicked him out and sold it back to the Bank. This period of Milanese domination would continue ITTL. Early Italian colonies could occur in this form, Genoese colonies being supplanted by Pro-Milanese governors. it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominazione_milanese_in_Corsica 20:11 They will try to obtain the title of king of italy, perhaps under a ruler like Charles the Bold in Burgundy, but likely would fail. I think it's more likely they get a grand ducal title, a Prince title or maybe a "King in Prussia" situation (except none of their territory except rome are really out of the HRE, but King in Italy could still work). 20:19 Rome might not be a good spot to make the capital with all the secular and ecclesiastical quarreling and plots and intrigue.
As for speculation, I think this might allow for either A) A Milano-Burgundian Alliance that pressures Frederick III to raise their titles to King of/in Lotharingia and Italy, along with Charles' VERY bold demands, such as Charles becoming regent of the child duke of savoy (likely a joint regency with whoever the Duke of Milan is) and his ally, the Rhenish Palatine be recognized as such (he usurped his nephew). If the Duke of Milan at the time is similar in personality to Charles the Bold, that means he'd have some demands too. Maybe his son or ally (fregoso family??) made Count/Lord of Genoa, or condemnation over some annoying vassal like Mantua or Romagnan lords. THIS IS ASSUMING CHARLES THE BOLD OR A DUKE WITH A SIMILAR PERSONALITY DUE TO SIMILAR UPBRINGING HAPPENS (since most likely some marriages with the dukes of milan will occur) B) one of the two wannabe kingdoms sides with the emperor in order to get their demands instead and either collapse due to it
The only positive scenario would have been an alliance between Milano and Venezia. Both depended on each other and could integrate what the other was lacking, but the hubris of the leaders and the pope doomed Italy to lose power, wealth and independence, failing to see that the world around was changing. Nice summary, it's hard to teach this period and if someone is a fan of Game of Thrones's politics, I guarantee this period would be a great discovery!
13:40 personally i dont think personally hed live too much longer due to the fact that none of his relatives lived past the age of 51 so i dont really see whys hed live longer, especially if he was to have a larger domain which would take up more time and energy for him. And i theres really no reason for him to marry anyone else in the region apart from his cousin as id see all his neighbours being hostile to him due to his rapid expansion & and he cant marry a lowborn as thatd ruin all the legitimacy he just gained, personally i the downfall of the visconti was almost innevitible.
I see what you mean. With this video I was trying to construct a timeline, as opposed to making a change then seeing what would have happened afterwards. So points like you've mentioned mean there was no guarantee for what I've set up
A curious and rather interesting idea, but now you got me wondering about other things as well. What if Russia (at least as we know it) never united?What if the New World was discovered much later, or sooner? Hell, what if Mahdist Sudan actually won? So many interesting, yet often overlooked or fleeting ideas and stories to tell.
Very interesting, I like how you took into consideration some important details such as the outrage that the invasion of the Papal States in the 15th century would have caused
Eh tbh if anything the Visconti claiming the Italian Crown would be a huge overreach. A more realistic title would be something like Grand Duke or even Prince-Elector (who had the dignity and style of Kings). It would be more realistic that the Pope be ruling out of Latium as the Pope can call upon Aragon, the French or the Emperor to drive out the Visconti from Rome.
I was thinking about it in relation to the Kingdom of Bohemia, but I see what you mean. It'd be interesting to see the dynamic they have with their neighbours as you've mentioned.
@@HistorysInfluence Bohemia wasn't at title the Emperor held. Italy however is a crown that comes with the position of being Emperor. That's part of the sacred duty given to the Holy ROMAN Emperor. The Empire is supposed to continue the legacy of Charlemagne of trying to recreate the legacy of a universal Christian Emperor. Of course the Emperor here is more the head of a collective set of Catholic nations (the Res public Christiania) as its premier sovereigns. That's why no one dared call themselves Emperors until Napoleon came along. Even in the case of Russia, as Czars its monarchs formally acknowledged the title of Holy Roman Emperor as having a higher Imperial dignity than their own. Of course when Henry VIII broke away from Rome, he declared himself fully sovereign by also proclaiming "England as an Empire" thereby equating it in rank to the level of the Emperor. The Kings of France were doing this too to a degree, but they were a special case as that sovereignty only extended to within the administration of their Kingdom rather than repudiating the theoretical power of the Emperor.
VENICE INDEPENDENT💪🏻💪🏻🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁🛑🛑🛑 VIVA IL DOGE! Lunga vita alla repubblica🤛🏻🤛🏻🤛🏻 Dal Carso all'Adda viva la Serneissima Granda🦁 fuck feudalism and poverty
Really really great video. Why don't you make this video or another more than a single oneshot video? You could make a series, maybe using some suggestions fron the commet section (or maybe without this suggestions). You cuold tell this story inventing the specific details, like the names of the future succecors of gian galeazzo, but maintening the story plausible. I think ot would be really passionating.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
This is probably the most unique and interesting alternate history idea I’ve ever seen! And I’ve watched well over a hundred of these types of videos.
Thanks, I really appreciate that. I've had this idea in my head for around 4 years so was good to make it.
As a Lombard this is totally my dream hearing a foreigner talking of Gian Galeazzo is insane or one that uses a perfect map for the foreign domination of Italy great video!
Thank you :)
Finally, my EU4 larp was made into a video.
😂
@@HistorysInfluence i was gonna use this to larp an eu4 campaign
As an italian that studies history, this was very accurate, I'm surprised somebody that isn't from Italy could grasp, link and understand all the factors you've mentioned; amazing job so far, I'm curious about the part 2 (which I would argue, will be more difficult to handle)!
I really appreciate that, having Italians (and some Lombards in particular) appreciate the video means a lot to me.
Criminally underrated channel.
Likewise legend
I agree
6:39 These geographical barriers also resulted in the creation of different Italian dialects.
4:09 Considering the time period that is impressive.
I've never seen your channel before, but this made me subscribe for part 2.
Thank you, that means a lot
Viva Italia 🇮🇹
This is amazing. You made this alternate timeline feel very organic and plausible. Well done. You’ve earned my sub
Thank you very much
I dont understand why your channel is so underrated but trust if you keep up with these quality videos youll get up there man, keep up the great work!
I seriously don't know how you don't have more subs, your content is amazing and I always look forward to a new upload by you
Thanks mate, that really means a lot. Although truthfully, I think it's my lack of uploads
LOVE YOUR CONTENT! THANKS FOR THIS! CAN'T WAIT FOR PART 2!
Just earned a sub, really well made, both entertaining and realistic, well done 👍🏻
Love from 🇮🇹
As an Italian and a Lombard this video deserves a follow
16:47 I 100% agree. The fourth crusade against Constantinople should have never happened.
Really really great video. Why don't you make this video or another more than a single oneshot video? You could make a series, maybe using some suggestions fron the commet section (or maybe without this suggestions). You cuold tell this story inventing the specific details, like the names of the future succecors of gian galeazzo, but maintening the story plausible. I think ot would be really passionating.
I really enjoy the depth that this channel goes into. It makes the scenarios so much more interesting.
As always, a great video. Here's a suggestion for another one: What if the Sassanids had managed to stop the Arabs at the Zagros Mountains or even earlier during the conquest of Mesopotamia?
The fourth crusade was the fault of the treacherous pretender to the Byzantine throne. Don’t make promises of payment that you will not keep friends, or you may lose everything.
The king is back haha! Truly, your videos have always been great and I’m happy about how you’ve been getting increasingly better in terms of quality, realism and style! Personally, I always looked more towards a Machiavellian republic and on top of that a federal system to address and respect the rich regional and cultural differences that manifested themselves after the fall of the western Roman Empire, ofc that would be more of an idealistic scenario, and your capability to address that by manifesting the political reality of the time is indeed a different idea than usual, everyone usually goes for Florence. Also, this video came at the perfect time, everyone is always talking about a united Latin Rome after the fall, but lately I’ve found myself obsessed with the Italian republics and their renaissance form the ashes of Rome (no pun intended) and their beautiful history and culture. Florence, Venetia, Naples under the Hauteville’s, Genoa. Can’t wait for part 2, man 😉🔥🔥
P.S: the passing yet beautiful mention of the 4th crusade has become a staple for this channel 😂. I’m with you, man. Curse the day that Christians fought against each other in such a horrible act, it will remain as one of the biggest tragedies ever to be seen in history.
Thanks for the detailed and appreciative comment mate. And lol regarding the 4th crusade stuff
Perhaps you should do variations of this premise, where other Italian states manage to unify Italy in this period: Savoy, Florence, Venice etc
Interesting idea
Great video man keep it up!
The one who stood the greatest chance at unifying italy(and was on the path to do so) was Cesare Borgia, son of Alexander VI. Unfortunately the premature death of his father had him lose support and led to his demise.
Hey! Dani here! Main accaount faulty atm! ❤❤❤❤
My fav alt history scenario
I've been waiting for something like this to be tackled. Great premise and a more than solid base for a continuation, I'm glad you didn't just go over military successes and explained the economic reasons why and how Milan could have centralised power and favoured prosperity. I do think the Rome should be maintained with the Pope rather than having it become the capital of Italy, considering Gian Galeazzo's plan for an Italian kingdom was to have it centered around Pavia - his personal capital and the capital of the past kingdom of Italy, where Gian built the Certosa of Pavia and where he expected to be crowned.
You're amazing and deserve more subscribers
underrated channel
A small alt history channel? Boy this is gonna be good
2 future Video Ideas.
What if Majorian had successful reconqured North africa?
What if byzantines had won the battle of Manzikrit?
I'll be doing Majorian and Manzikert timelines eventually, too good to pass up.
@@HistorysInfluence yeeepeeeeee.
Great video
Cool video
16:16 OTL Sforza Milan installed the son of the doge of genoa in Corsica in the 1460s-1480s that was declared a vassal to the Duke of Milan (who got the title "count of corsica", a title that the sforza tried to press earlier). Then the governor decided to ally with some local corsican lords. The new Doge of Genoa wasn't as willing to keep a family member on Corsica so they kicked him out and sold it back to the Bank. This period of Milanese domination would continue ITTL. Early Italian colonies could occur in this form, Genoese colonies being supplanted by Pro-Milanese governors.
it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominazione_milanese_in_Corsica
20:11 They will try to obtain the title of king of italy, perhaps under a ruler like Charles the Bold in Burgundy, but likely would fail. I think it's more likely they get a grand ducal title, a Prince title or maybe a "King in Prussia" situation (except none of their territory except rome are really out of the HRE, but King in Italy could still work).
20:19 Rome might not be a good spot to make the capital with all the secular and ecclesiastical quarreling and plots and intrigue.
Interesting notes and rebuttals
As for speculation, I think this might allow for either
A) A Milano-Burgundian Alliance that pressures Frederick III to raise their titles to King of/in Lotharingia and Italy, along with Charles' VERY bold demands, such as Charles becoming regent of the child duke of savoy (likely a joint regency with whoever the Duke of Milan is) and his ally, the Rhenish Palatine be recognized as such (he usurped his nephew). If the Duke of Milan at the time is similar in personality to Charles the Bold, that means he'd have some demands too. Maybe his son or ally (fregoso family??) made Count/Lord of Genoa, or condemnation over some annoying vassal like Mantua or Romagnan lords. THIS IS ASSUMING CHARLES THE BOLD OR A DUKE WITH A SIMILAR PERSONALITY DUE TO SIMILAR UPBRINGING HAPPENS (since most likely some marriages with the dukes of milan will occur)
B) one of the two wannabe kingdoms sides with the emperor in order to get their demands instead and either collapse due to it
Need part 2 rn
The only positive scenario would have been an alliance between Milano and Venezia. Both depended on each other and could integrate what the other was lacking, but the hubris of the leaders and the pope doomed Italy to lose power, wealth and independence, failing to see that the world around was changing.
Nice summary, it's hard to teach this period and if someone is a fan of Game of Thrones's politics, I guarantee this period would be a great discovery!
Suggestion: What if Miguel da paz survives?
We want part 2 before 2025. An excellent video once again.
What are the first two paintings you used in the video?
The Parca and the Angel of Death by Gustave Moreau
Burning City by Ludwig Meidner
13:40 personally i dont think personally hed live too much longer due to the fact that none of his relatives lived past the age of 51 so i dont really see whys hed live longer, especially if he was to have a larger domain which would take up more time and energy for him. And i theres really no reason for him to marry anyone else in the region apart from his cousin as id see all his neighbours being hostile to him due to his rapid expansion & and he cant marry a lowborn as thatd ruin all the legitimacy he just gained, personally i the downfall of the visconti was almost innevitible.
I see what you mean. With this video I was trying to construct a timeline, as opposed to making a change then seeing what would have happened afterwards. So points like you've mentioned mean there was no guarantee for what I've set up
Amazing scenario
A curious and rather interesting idea, but now you got me wondering about other things as well. What if Russia (at least as we know it) never united?What if the New World was discovered much later, or sooner? Hell, what if Mahdist Sudan actually won? So many interesting, yet often overlooked or fleeting ideas and stories to tell.
7:18 maybe you meant “signoria”, signora (without the I) is the Italian formal word for “lady” or “miss”
Yup, kept getting that one mixed up in my head for whatever reason
@ no biggie, I just wanted to correct you so in the future your amazing videos won’t have this small mistake anymore
16:43 If Milan conquers Venice, that is the true end of the Roman Empire.
super interesting alternate history idea, one that i have never seen or thought of before
Peak scenario as Italian 🇮🇹🇮🇹
Very interesting, I like how you took into consideration some important details such as the outrage that the invasion of the Papal States in the 15th century would have caused
thanks mate
What if the Askumites survived
I'm wondering if Colombus would still exist, if so would there be an Italian American colonies?
Interesting point for pt. 2
@HistorysInfluence if Italy/Milan do get colonies it may be hard to keep them away from the Spanish because the Spanish hold Gibraltar.
Eh tbh if anything the Visconti claiming the Italian Crown would be a huge overreach. A more realistic title would be something like Grand Duke or even Prince-Elector (who had the dignity and style of Kings). It would be more realistic that the Pope be ruling out of Latium as the Pope can call upon Aragon, the French or the Emperor to drive out the Visconti from Rome.
I was thinking about it in relation to the Kingdom of Bohemia, but I see what you mean. It'd be interesting to see the dynamic they have with their neighbours as you've mentioned.
@@HistorysInfluence Bohemia wasn't at title the Emperor held. Italy however is a crown that comes with the position of being Emperor. That's part of the sacred duty given to the Holy ROMAN Emperor. The Empire is supposed to continue the legacy of Charlemagne of trying to recreate the legacy of a universal Christian Emperor. Of course the Emperor here is more the head of a collective set of Catholic nations (the Res public Christiania) as its premier sovereigns. That's why no one dared call themselves Emperors until Napoleon came along. Even in the case of Russia, as Czars its monarchs formally acknowledged the title of Holy Roman Emperor as having a higher Imperial dignity than their own. Of course when Henry VIII broke away from Rome, he declared himself fully sovereign by also proclaiming "England as an Empire" thereby equating it in rank to the level of the Emperor. The Kings of France were doing this too to a degree, but they were a special case as that sovereignty only extended to within the administration of their Kingdom rather than repudiating the theoretical power of the Emperor.
interesting
Cesare Borgia King of Italy!
HI, how are you doing?
Cola di Rienzo is not 9th century, but 14th century.
Good spot
🗣🗣🔥🔥
Machiavelli's dream
then italy's flag wouldnt be so simple😢
po the teletubbie
Probably a more capable empire to counter ottomans in europe
Is it just me or the pigeons between 7:38 And 7:44 look AI generated
They might be, copped them off a copyright free site
They are almost certainly AI
What if my grandmother has 3 weels
I'm from Veneto , the best of Italy 😂😂 not true ,the first is tuscay 😢
VENICE INDEPENDENT💪🏻💪🏻🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁🛑🛑🛑 VIVA IL DOGE! Lunga vita alla repubblica🤛🏻🤛🏻🤛🏻 Dal Carso all'Adda viva la Serneissima Granda🦁 fuck feudalism and poverty
Beautiful dream. Milan is the most important city in Italy. W Milano, W la Lombardia.
Really really great video. Why don't you make this video or another more than a single oneshot video? You could make a series, maybe using some suggestions fron the commet section (or maybe without this suggestions). You cuold tell this story inventing the specific details, like the names of the future succecors of gian galeazzo, but maintening the story plausible. I think ot would be really passionating.