"There is no sacrifice in taking care of your kids"...exactly. If they say that they sacrificed something, they are saying that what they gave up was more valuable than having you. That is a very cruel thing to say to a child and also very stupid. Didn't they choose to have kids? Why would the child have to bear the blame for them not having what the parents actually confess to have wanted? Good video. 👍
true... but something inside me just doesn't want to hurt anyone even if at the cost of me getting completely destroyed. Can't sleep at night if i hurt someone.
😢😢😢, as an Asian guy with high I.Q. it's really not easy for me and this video has helped me a lot, i've been cursed as a failure ever since i stood up for what i considered right in my perspective since i was young and every time i would try to do something in my view important, they would ruin it and if i fought back they would just humiliate me infront of other people and their friends making me out as a bad person etc...and when those other adults say "i was worse than you when i was your age" what comes to my mind is... "Ya i already know that you idiot" and "why am i being compared to dumb idiots such as this guy", it makes me frustrated angry and sad at the same time.
Sometimes the most loving thing to do in a relationship is to see the toxic pattern, and then break it by simply refusing to play by the pattern's rules. It's the mature thing to do.
You might be interested in my book "Setting free the intellectually gifted" amzn.to/1TXD8OK, I described in quite some detail my relationship (or, in a certain sense, the lack of one) with my parents, might resonate with your experience...
I am african american woman, in a lower economic class and on the ASD spectrum. As you spoke I couldn't help but think about the "ism brothers" of society (racism, sexism and classism) and how the child-toxic parent dynamic you described exist on a larger scale in society... I often feel that I'm expected to be greatful when "allowed" basic human rights or when in the workplace (I'm often the one actually running the organization/program) I'm expected to be grateful for the opportunity to have my ideas pilfered and my energy squandered because I'm poor, black and female..... thank you for this video, it's given me insight on how to interact safely in society.
I have felt less lonely since I discovered your channel. It seems like you can understand me, that’s what i keep thinking after watching your previous videos...
I agree with this 100%. I think that you have summarised the issue many of us face in a very concise and poignant manner. I'd add two points: 1. You can go further and impose the condition that you will only visit them if they agree to re-evaluate their own toxicity, through therapy or serious introspection. 2. If you have to detach from the toxic game by enstranging yourself from your parents, perhaps it's still good to be close to them and support them before they are about to pass, to lessen your guilt and facilitate your mourning process and because it would be cruel not to.
I recently had this problem with mine because I asked them to think of me as a person before of a son because their idea of obedient grateful good son was not mine to fulfill, I even think there is a deeper love in letting ourselves know each other as people than as an idea
My parents found out they had a gifted son at a time my father was in the final stages of terminal cancer. The last thing they needed was to organize the extra intellectual stimulation the psychologist said I needed. One would think surrounded by phenomenally bright and cultured family would be a blessing. It wasn’t. My step father arrived on the scene. He was a boba fide genius and a titan of mid / late 20th century intelligentsia. He bullied me in seven languages while artfully enjoining the rest of my family to follow suit. It was dreadfully frustrating, figuring out situations faster than the adults. On finding a solution or the answer to a complex knot of problems I’d be patronized and ignored. A while later my ideas or insights were agreed as the correct ones by the adults. My family lied to me about me fathers illness. By ten I figured out he had Hodgkins Disease. Back then oncologists considers there to be 28 sub types of this cancer, 4 of which are incredibly rare. At 10 1/2 I had narrowed down the subtype my father had. At a family social function I addressed my entire family after lunch. I read my essay on The Nature of Father’s Malady. 3,000words long, I was to find. When admitted later, after my fathers death, that I the dozen or do deductions so made to wrangle my argument into a conclusion this side of writing a book, were all 100%; even the ultra rare subtype my father acquired. How? By paying attention or as Abel puts it ‘ bring concerned.’ After my essay concluded my entire family outbid each other with patronizing comments and approbation prior to lying to me, keeping up the lie saying my fathers illness was a mystery and he’ll probably get better soon. I stormed off. This is called ‘ creating a scene ‘ in my family although my consternation involved pursed lips and a quick march out of the sitting room up to the nursery. This is one example of many and being the smartest person on the room aged 10 isn’t a recipe for happiness: The worst part of my life was a 3 year period between 22 and 25 when I was ‘boxed in’ with no good choices to be had. It was 3 years of expedient means. The worst part of it was being aware how stuck I was and how there were no easy ways ….. there was not one way out of the situation. Trying to explain this to my Granny with I was close, or indeed all my friends at the time bar one who got it, was a Sisyphean task. Three years at that age is an eternity and the drought of opportunity did a 180 quickly and my life and career took off like a bullet. If you are a young person having read this far, who is gifted i.e. IQ 132 + and you need assistance, hit me up on Facebook. All conversations are held within a compact of strict confidence. Only if a high crime is revealed would I break such an oath. Sure I write this with a certain levity but I do not truck with chaos. Finally, I note that gifted and socially well equipped people are seldom discussed ( even here on Abels channel ) yet we are the statistically dominant archetype over the + 132 IQ threshold, I.e. three or four standard deviations above the norm. Be great to hear from you. Laters P de H
I always felt this way as a kid. Just did not have the intellectual capacity to put this in words and give it meaning. As kid I rejected the game, but as adult I begrudgingly accepted it again, as I saw no way out. I am much older now, and I reject the game again. It is bullshit, and it gets you nowhere no matter what you do.
My parents adopted me when I was 5 years old. When I was around 35 I learned about narcissistic personality disorder and realized both my parents are highly narcissistic. I tried grey rock method on my father and he started ghosting me. After that I went no contact with them both. Neither of them wanted to see me have any success in life.
This pretty much nails the relationship I have with my father. Hes never been able to see things through my eyes or relate to me on any level whatsoever. Im supposed to listen to all his stories and advice but any time I talk about anything I love to do or plans i have he just literally ignores me. And whenever Ive had the courage go tell him how i feel he breaks down in tears and makes me feel so guilty for bringing it up. So im stuck is this rigged game where I just have to be his little dog and not share any of my own goals or opinions OR be a bad boy and get belittled or ignored when i do. Im 42 and make my own child and feel I would absolutely never act the way he does to me with my own. Its really a shame how you once look up to your parents and then in the future realize how toxic they actually are. Took me about 10 years to get over this but ive accepted it and simply dont play the game anymore
My father and step mother are both narcissists (overt cerebral and invert compensatory) I cut ties with them years ago. It was the only way to regain my sanity.
I'm confused as I had a great therapist who convinced me my mum was a narcissist, but since then I've realized I'm Autistic and I can see traits in her too. My dad is a sociopathic narcissist so I don't speak to him at all. My mum though is a conundrum as I'm not quite sure how to classify her in my mind, and how to tell how toxic she is. I hardly see or commiunicate with her as I find her very self absorbed and difficult. My family certainly act in a passive aggressive low key abusive tribal way, but I do wonder if there is neurodiversity.. A therapist I really respect on youtube said that some people aren't born with Autistic brains, but develop them through severe abuse, this is certainly possible for me.. I don't know what to think. Do you think sometimes Autistic individuals act tribally like neurotypicals? It seems unlikely huh
i so agree- i never could accept that "sacrifice" argument- my parents are educated enough to know how to not conceive a child. (so what's with the emotional black mail?:)) sometimes, i also think part of it all, is that they don't understand their child. They don't understand why their child says what they say and why their child does what they do. I'm very angry at times, that they won't make the effort (or maybe aren't capable) of reevaluating (although i think at least one of them has the brain for it). in the end, either way, i firmly believe that the solution you present is the one that will work. Sometimes i just feel sorry, that it has to be this way, that i have to pull myself out of the game, because they get scared and think i don't love them or something just because i'm not willing to play the part they planned out for me. What i find also weird is the occasional role-switch. When i stand my ground, and stay true to myself, sometimes they subordinate themselves and suddenly i feel like the parent (which is definitely not what i'm aiming for...) have you had any experience with this kind of role-switch yourself?
O yes, I've been my parents' parent many times. Even as a child... I described some of that, and a lot more on my relationship with my parents (or, more often, the lack of one), in my book "Setting free the intellectually gifted" amzn.to/1TXD8OK ...
This reminds me of Eric Berne Transactional Analysis, Adult to Adult communication. Also Alan Watts talks about how we need to explain to children that the whole damn show is just a game, that there are rules, and later they can change the rules.
The parent - child relationship starts and continues for a very long time with them in the superior (adult) and you in the subordinate/ inferior (child) position. After decades of interacting in this configuration it gets ingrained in their brains so hard that it is impossible for them to see and treat the former child as an equal, even when the child is already an adult for decades. The parents very ofter remain for the rest of their lives incapable of treating you as an equal, and treat you forever as a subordinate/ inferior. And if you try to interact with them as an equal, they get upset and cannot tolerate it. They can only interact with you in that configuration, they as the superior adult and you as the inferior child, anything else won’t be tolerated.
Teeming with comments and questions watching this. Great video. Was on the edge of my seat almost but you came around. Id like to think there's a certain similarity in the duality of high/low prenatal testosterone levels (which is the 2nd and previous video of yours that i watched) and this rigged game/fair game parenting strategy. To me, being also the open and divergent type intellectually (though only so far i think egoistically attracted to the idea of being *highly intellectual*) the emotional aspects here register as being balanced evolutionarily, between those two extremes, which i could explain futher as either: eternal struggle for the mother's love. For the feed of the parent. Tendency towards relentless or scavenging behaviour extrovertedly, contrary to having maternal care as an almost certainty, having bonds and then preying on the introverted aspects of life. This is so multifaceted and integral to me, that its very very tricky not to diverge significantly, as im sure you notice. Stoked to find this channel. Always been a heady bloke and while im not so sure im 130+ IQ (tested at 112 multiple times online) im surely relating to your struggle, and im most certainly sure, that ive also always felt different. Furthermore that ive been beat and brainwashed so thoroughly by the rigged game you describe here, that much of what i used to notice in my mental/psychich constitution has vanished, faded or submerged itself. Very interesting ❤️
Yup, this is my predicament exactly. As a mom myself, all I'm trying to do now is "earn" my complete freedom and never get involved with my mother's games/antics again. Because that's all this is. There is no understanding, there's only ownership as in "Look at ALL the stuff I did/do for you. You OWE me!" "You're unthankful, ungrateful, good for nothing...etc.". Yet she lives with me, all of the housework is done by me, my daughter and I physically helped her move here...etc. I work and pay my own bills, her part of the bills are the only thing she needs to contribute with here (because she can $). Whatever I do for her out of my own kindness, it's "expected" and should be increased to HER satisfaction, the stakes seem to get higher and higher and how dare I not agree to how she treats me and her granddaughter. I have only one child, but it constantly feels like I'm raising two. Continuing on the heels of what you elequently described, I could write an entire book on this (my own experience) but for the sake of other comment readers (no one comes here to read a novel📖), I'll keep this short and can attest to the fact that it's a game you will NEVER win...unless perhaps...there are other (older) family members who will be honest enough to FINALLY confront your parents about their behavior.🤷♀️ Edited for grammar.
Exactly, you cannot win it, in any way possible, which is why I call it "rigged". Very important to acknowledge that fact. But you *can* refuse to play it. Which is also very important to realize...
it's so weird finding your channel. I just learned about my high q late in life and it's so funny how this video explains the same issues i had. my folks were never there and never listened and now that I'm older i don't even know what to do because we don't get along. when I was sick i was very pleasant with them until something really bad happened to me and I realized they were never there. then I realized the only times in my life they said I was pleasant were also when I was sick. then I figured out how to cure myself, which i planned to figure out, and they completely reject my recovery. and I started thinking, why am i so trying to impress these people? and now I've done all this achievement and realized they never once asked me in my whole life what I've been up to. they all me the same "how are things" but then follow up by saying "I don't like to hear that you're unwell". so I can never tell them I'm unwell and they wouldn't listen anyway. i was raised by teenage women because they worked all the time and my mum told my woman this bs about how "you make all these sacrifices for your kids" and I thought, what sacrifices? what I wanted was attention and affection? instead I got ramblings. and now I'm a rambler and I fear having kids! thanks so much
This happened to me too. I loved my father very much but I do not know if it was reciprocated. Maybe for a while? My father decided that it was a good idea to begin to lie to me and I did not approve. He then decided to drink himself to death and blame me for his miserable existence. I decided that it was a good idea to strive for excellence. Out of love I offered him everything that I was and had attained, he said "yes" and proceeded with his own self-destruction. This was very puzzling to me. Surely it is better to aim up than down? Choose health & sanity before mental deterioration & self-pity? It was all good as long as I played along with his game and with society. He didn't handle it well that I was able to think outside the box or not go along with game rules that set me up to fail. He never even suspected there was anything outside of his own view of things, he could only see things in relation to himself and his own mind. I tried to get him to sort things through with his own father and was met with the answer he already had. He gaslighted so much, he even gaslighted himself in the process!
You do not have accept their zero sum game behavior. I like to think of families as a play or story where people are expected to follow certain roles and follow a script. The script is people's understanding of what a family should be and often who they are. Most people cannot step away and redefine their roles, hence disfunction can persist over generations. Bravo
My experience as the child of my parents was nothing like the zero sum game that you describe. My parents loved me and I them. The idea that my mother and father were in league with one another for the purpose of foisting upon me a prepackaged identity inimical to my authentic self occupied no part of my thinking. If high I.Q. is being linked causally to a propensity for rejection of parental values, then I am doubly exceptional since I belong to the Triple Nine Society and I have multiple distinct memories going back to the age of one. I was not and am not in the parlance of this channel a “neurotypical.”
Poignant analysis. This is something I had to learn from a young age. Parents have little incentive to change the rules of a game that is rigged in their favor. By staying in the game you only confirm to them that it is okay to use manipulative tactics in order to get you to benefit them. Expressions of gratitude and generosity should come from within, not forced out of you by somebody who is simply fulfilling a role that the generational cycles before them have created.
I'm 35 and I think my parents are toxic. It's really too bad but we just don't get along. They don't really give a fuck about me. They say "of course I love you" but I can't come by, am not welcome, accepted, et. Cetera. Bunch of manipulative bullshit. Lol you describe it perfectly.
I feel powerful watching these two videos talking about parents. I’ll act this out in my life and hopefully share some positive feedback with you within the next few months. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and creating all these contents! I hope you’re doing great. Maybe you can also share some thoughts on questions that you’re yet to finalize a good answers to your audiences to solve.
Hello Gabry, that's fabulous that you feel empowered, that's the whole idea of the videos (and my books)! You'll get some interesting results and profound and meaningful changes in your life if you start to tackle the parent issue (that most of us have, but only a few do something with or about it). Definitely very much worth it. Thanks for the suggestion also, I'll keep it in mind!
Thanks! It's actually sad that you have to agree, because it means you have had your bad experiences too. But well, it's still better to understand... Once you understand, you can start handling it...
@@Abel.Abelson im just glad more people like you are bringing this much-needed message out there because most parents ego, arrogance and therefore abuse is out of control. being a parent almost means you are akin to gods/godesses (especially mothers), and you cant criticize them, but arents are humans too and are not above it. happy holidays!
Didn't work ! I don't know the solution, but this hasn't worked and I have tried it for a long time. There's a debt and you cannot wish it away. You are right when you say that the care they provided you with, and the 'sacrifices' they made should have felt rewarding in itself iff they truly loved you, but if they are claiming repayment then it seems like you cannot wish away the debt. They clearly have raised you on expectations rather than love. There's a karmic debt here, that one needs to clear, there's no other way to peace I am quite sure that you dont have to be the 'good son' or 'good daughter' that they think they deserve ( You never can be good enough) but there are other ways of repaying the debt.
You may also be entangled (a term in psychology for a not really healthy family relationship) and/or have a salvation fantasy (unconsciously expecting them to be or do things they can't, and think that if you act in the right way, it will happen). But yes, of course it's hard, in any case there is a lot of grieving to do.
Hello, Abel! I saw your last videos and i like so much the things you are talking. Keep moving! This question that i'll write don't have too much connection with this video, but i believe here is more easy to you see it than if I write it in some other video with more correlation, but whatever (haha). I noticed that you are a jiu-jitsu practitioner. Can you tell me and the others, in some next video, or here, what is like to be an intellectually gifted person in terms of getting better in some hability like in jiu-jitsu? Is it like you are going to learn more fast... or... how it works? Is it like your brain make the process of growing axon more fast than others?
Yes, I could do that, I'll note the subject of jiu-jitsu. In my case, it was very confronting to *not* be able to simply glance over it and "get it". I was confronted with the (relative) slowness of motricity learning. It's like learning to ride a bike. You can understand the bike and even your own body structure and functioning, but that doesn't mean you can ride it. Matter comes in, slow matter, muscular memory etc, as opposed to snappy mental understanding. Interesting experience. Whether my muscular learning is faster than others is very hard to tell, but I wouldn't think the difference to be significant. Apart from that, there are tons of studies about the correlation between exercising and mental capabilities, but that's more a question of general health and applies to everyone equally.
@@Abel.Abelson, thank you very much for responding. If I am not going to bother you, could you answer this other question? I would like to know if there have been many times in your life when people realized that you were intellectually gifted. Could you give an example that occurred to you? I don't know ... like ...for example being in a market and someone asked something, and you answer, and your answer makes someone realize that you are smart. 🤯
@@gabrielvalezeelisbaodonasc6410 Half of the time they think I "overcomplicate" or "think too much" (which I translate as them not thinking enough), so in that case no, they don't think I'm smart. Then let's say 25% of the time they don't really get the point and just do what's socially expected, or follow up with something beside the point. So then they don't think I'm smart either. And then there's 25% of the time they do think I'm saying something smart, but only in a minority of these cases will they admit this, and certainly not in public (because they're too concerned with their own status). So in general it's not at all like if they regularly go "oh how smart of you", definitely not. Makes one end up with a Cassandra complex, actually.
If you fix your relationship with your parents you wouldnt be as miserable, 100%, thats a fact no I'm not saying there isn't going to be any compromises but that's the point you gotta compromise and show some humility for the people who raised you so that God gives you some happiness if you believe in God
You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and letting me know. Have a look at the books too, they serve the same purpose, but better, in my opinion... amzn.to/3paQsmz
"There is no sacrifice in taking care of your kids"...exactly. If they say that they sacrificed something, they are saying that what they gave up was more valuable than having you. That is a very cruel thing to say to a child and also very stupid. Didn't they choose to have kids? Why would the child have to bear the blame for them not having what the parents actually confess to have wanted? Good video. 👍
true... but something inside me just doesn't want to hurt anyone even if at the cost of me getting completely destroyed. Can't sleep at night if i hurt someone.
😢😢😢, as an Asian guy with high I.Q. it's really not easy for me and this video has helped me a lot, i've been cursed as a failure ever since i stood up for what i considered right in my perspective since i was young and every time i would try to do something in my view important, they would ruin it and if i fought back they would just humiliate me infront of other people and their friends making me out as a bad person etc...and when those other adults say "i was worse than you when i was your age" what comes to my mind is... "Ya i already know that you idiot" and "why am i being compared to dumb idiots such as this guy", it makes me frustrated angry and sad at the same time.
I am sorry for what you are going through. I was and still am in similar situation although I am being 23 this summer.
I respect you for standing up for your truth.
Sometimes the most loving thing to do in a relationship is to see the toxic pattern, and then break it by simply refusing to play by the pattern's rules. It's the mature thing to do.
Yes, exactly. Authenticity.
You echoed descriptively 100% my parent's toxic patterns. Very objective and concise analysis.
Thanks! Glad it was meaningful for you! And thanks for letting me know :)
You might be interested in my book "Setting free the intellectually gifted" amzn.to/1TXD8OK, I described in quite some detail my relationship (or, in a certain sense, the lack of one) with my parents, might resonate with your experience...
I am african american woman, in a lower economic class and on the ASD spectrum. As you spoke I couldn't help but think about the "ism brothers" of society (racism, sexism and classism) and how the child-toxic parent dynamic you described exist on a larger scale in society... I often feel that I'm expected to be greatful when "allowed" basic human rights or when in the workplace (I'm often the one actually running the organization/program) I'm expected to be grateful for the opportunity to have my ideas pilfered and my energy squandered because I'm poor, black and female..... thank you for this video, it's given me insight on how to interact safely in society.
You're very welcome, thanks for commenting!
I have felt less lonely since I discovered your channel. It seems like you can understand me, that’s what i keep thinking after watching your previous videos...
Glad to hear that! It's my essential reason for making them and writing my books...
I agree with this 100%. I think that you have summarised the issue many of us face in a very concise and poignant manner. I'd add two points: 1. You can go further and impose the condition that you will only visit them if they agree to re-evaluate their own toxicity, through therapy or serious introspection. 2. If you have to detach from the toxic game by enstranging yourself from your parents, perhaps it's still good to be close to them and support them before they are about to pass, to lessen your guilt and facilitate your mourning process and because it would be cruel not to.
I recently had this problem with mine because I asked them to think of me as a person before of a son because their idea of obedient grateful good son was not mine to fulfill, I even think there is a deeper love in letting ourselves know each other as people than as an idea
Yes, totally. My parents were not flexible or authentic enough to do anything with the same question, how did yours do?
My parents found out they had a gifted son at a time my father was in the final stages of terminal cancer. The last thing they needed was to organize the extra intellectual stimulation the psychologist said I needed. One would think surrounded by phenomenally bright and cultured family would be a blessing. It wasn’t. My step father arrived on the scene. He was a boba fide genius and a titan of mid / late 20th century intelligentsia. He bullied me in seven languages while artfully enjoining the rest of my family to follow suit. It was dreadfully frustrating, figuring out situations faster than the adults. On finding a solution or the answer to a complex knot of problems I’d be patronized and ignored. A while later my ideas or insights were agreed as the correct ones by the adults. My family lied to me about me fathers illness. By ten I figured out he had Hodgkins Disease. Back then oncologists considers there to be 28 sub types of this cancer, 4 of which are incredibly rare. At 10 1/2 I had narrowed down the subtype my father had. At a family social function I addressed my entire family after lunch. I read my essay on The Nature of Father’s Malady. 3,000words long, I was to find. When admitted later, after my fathers death, that I the dozen or do deductions so made to wrangle my argument into a conclusion this side of writing a book, were all 100%; even the ultra rare subtype my father acquired. How? By paying attention or as Abel puts it ‘ bring concerned.’ After my essay concluded my entire family outbid each other with patronizing comments and approbation prior to lying to me, keeping up the lie saying my fathers illness was a mystery and he’ll probably get better soon. I stormed off. This is called ‘ creating a scene ‘ in my family although my consternation involved pursed lips and a quick march out of the sitting room up to the nursery. This is one example of many and being the smartest person on the room aged 10 isn’t a recipe for happiness: The worst part of my life was a 3 year period between 22 and 25 when I was ‘boxed in’ with no good choices to be had. It was 3 years of expedient means. The worst part of it was being aware how stuck I was and how there were no easy ways ….. there was not one way out of the situation. Trying to explain this to my Granny with I was close, or indeed all my friends at the time bar one who got it, was a Sisyphean task. Three years at that age is an eternity and the drought of opportunity did a 180 quickly and my life and career took off like a bullet. If you are a young person having read this far, who is gifted i.e. IQ 132 + and you need assistance, hit me up on Facebook. All conversations are held within a compact of strict confidence. Only if a high crime is revealed would I break such an oath. Sure I write this with a certain levity but I do not truck with chaos. Finally, I note that gifted and socially well equipped people are seldom discussed ( even here on Abels channel ) yet we are the statistically dominant archetype over the + 132 IQ threshold, I.e. three or four standard deviations above the norm. Be great to hear from you. Laters P de H
Idk my iq but def a little but above avg for the very least or am just being delusional with low iq
My parents did nothing compared to yours Am the one being over sensitive ig :(
I always felt this way as a kid. Just did not have the intellectual capacity to put this in words and give it meaning. As kid I rejected the game, but as adult I begrudgingly accepted it again, as I saw no way out. I am much older now, and I reject the game again. It is bullshit, and it gets you nowhere no matter what you do.
My parents adopted me when I was 5 years old. When I was around 35 I learned about narcissistic personality disorder and realized both my parents are highly narcissistic. I tried grey rock method on my father and he started ghosting me. After that I went no contact with them both. Neither of them wanted to see me have any success in life.
My parents are narcissitic. Ruined my life.
This pretty much nails the relationship I have with my father. Hes never been able to see things through my eyes or relate to me on any level whatsoever. Im supposed to listen to all his stories and advice but any time I talk about anything I love to do or plans i have he just literally ignores me. And whenever Ive had the courage go tell him how i feel he breaks down in tears and makes me feel so guilty for bringing it up. So im stuck is this rigged game where I just have to be his little dog and not share any of my own goals or opinions OR be a bad boy and get belittled or ignored when i do. Im 42 and make my own child and feel I would absolutely never act the way he does to me with my own. Its really a shame how you once look up to your parents and then in the future realize how toxic they actually are. Took me about 10 years to get over this but ive accepted it and simply dont play the game anymore
look up narcissism here on UA-cam (your dad is one)
My parents gaslight/ guilt trip me. I hate them.
My father and step mother are both narcissists (overt cerebral and invert compensatory) I cut ties with them years ago. It was the only way to regain my sanity.
I'm confused as I had a great therapist who convinced me my mum was a narcissist, but since then I've realized I'm Autistic and I can see traits in her too. My dad is a sociopathic narcissist so I don't speak to him at all. My mum though is a conundrum as I'm not quite sure how to classify her in my mind, and how to tell how toxic she is. I hardly see or commiunicate with her as I find her very self absorbed and difficult. My family certainly act in a passive aggressive low key abusive tribal way, but I do wonder if there is neurodiversity.. A therapist I really respect on youtube said that some people aren't born with Autistic brains, but develop them through severe abuse, this is certainly possible for me.. I don't know what to think. Do you think sometimes Autistic individuals act tribally like neurotypicals? It seems unlikely huh
listening to this made quite a few emotions surface within me. I needed to hear this, thank you.
Thanks for sharing... Yes, parents, it's quite a theme in one's life...
i so agree- i never could accept that "sacrifice" argument- my parents are educated enough to know how to not conceive a child. (so what's with the emotional black mail?:)) sometimes, i also think part of it all, is that they don't understand their child. They don't understand why their child says what they say and why their child does what they do. I'm very angry at times, that they won't make the effort (or maybe aren't capable) of reevaluating (although i think at least one of them has the brain for it). in the end, either way, i firmly believe that the solution you present is the one that will work. Sometimes i just feel sorry, that it has to be this way, that i have to pull myself out of the game, because they get scared and think i don't love them or something just because i'm not willing to play the part they planned out for me. What i find also weird is the occasional role-switch. When i stand my ground, and stay true to myself, sometimes they subordinate themselves and suddenly i feel like the parent (which is definitely not what i'm aiming for...) have you had any experience with this kind of role-switch yourself?
O yes, I've been my parents' parent many times. Even as a child... I described some of that, and a lot more on my relationship with my parents (or, more often, the lack of one), in my book "Setting free the intellectually gifted" amzn.to/1TXD8OK ...
This reminds me of Eric Berne Transactional Analysis, Adult to Adult communication. Also Alan Watts talks about how we need to explain to children that the whole damn show is just a game, that there are rules, and later they can change the rules.
Because of me, he had to leave office at five.
And was not able to have the same success in the office.
He told me when I was a child
The parent - child relationship starts and continues for a very long time with them in the superior (adult) and you in the subordinate/ inferior (child) position. After decades of interacting in this configuration it gets ingrained in their brains so hard that it is impossible for them to see and treat the former child as an equal, even when the child is already an adult for decades. The parents very ofter remain for the rest of their lives incapable of treating you as an equal, and treat you forever as a subordinate/ inferior. And if you try to interact with them as an equal, they get upset and cannot tolerate it. They can only interact with you in that configuration, they as the superior adult and you as the inferior child, anything else won’t be tolerated.
Teeming with comments and questions watching this. Great video. Was on the edge of my seat almost but you came around.
Id like to think there's a certain similarity in the duality of high/low prenatal testosterone levels (which is the 2nd and previous video of yours that i watched) and this rigged game/fair game parenting strategy. To me, being also the open and divergent type intellectually (though only so far i think egoistically attracted to the idea of being *highly intellectual*) the emotional aspects here register as being balanced evolutionarily, between those two extremes, which i could explain futher as either: eternal struggle for the mother's love. For the feed of the parent. Tendency towards relentless or scavenging behaviour extrovertedly, contrary to having maternal care as an almost certainty, having bonds and then preying on the introverted aspects of life. This is so multifaceted and integral to me, that its very very tricky not to diverge significantly, as im sure you notice.
Stoked to find this channel. Always been a heady bloke and while im not so sure im 130+ IQ (tested at 112 multiple times online) im surely relating to your struggle, and im most certainly sure, that ive also always felt different. Furthermore that ive been beat and brainwashed so thoroughly by the rigged game you describe here, that much of what i used to notice in my mental/psychich constitution has vanished, faded or submerged itself. Very interesting ❤️
I love your channel. I opted out of the game too when I realized I couldn’t win. The freedom of feeling indifferent to their judgements is sweet.
I love the way you explained this. Thanks!
Yup, this is my predicament exactly. As a mom myself, all I'm trying to do now is "earn" my complete freedom and never get involved with my mother's games/antics again. Because that's all this is. There is no understanding, there's only ownership as in "Look at ALL the stuff I did/do for you. You OWE me!" "You're unthankful, ungrateful, good for nothing...etc.".
Yet she lives with me, all of the housework is done by me, my daughter and I physically helped her move here...etc. I work and pay my own bills, her part of the bills are the only thing she needs to contribute with here (because she can $).
Whatever I do for her out of my own kindness, it's "expected" and should be increased to HER satisfaction, the stakes seem to get higher and higher and how dare I not agree to how she treats me and her granddaughter.
I have only one child, but it constantly feels like I'm raising two.
Continuing on the heels of what you elequently described, I could write an entire book on this (my own experience) but for the sake of other comment readers (no one comes here to read a novel📖), I'll keep this short and can attest to the fact that it's a game you will NEVER win...unless perhaps...there are other (older) family members who will be honest enough to FINALLY confront your parents about their behavior.🤷♀️
Edited for grammar.
Exactly, you cannot win it, in any way possible, which is why I call it "rigged". Very important to acknowledge that fact. But you *can* refuse to play it. Which is also very important to realize...
it's so weird finding your channel. I just learned about my high q late in life and it's so funny how this video explains the same issues i had. my folks were never there and never listened and now that I'm older i don't even know what to do because we don't get along. when I was sick i was very pleasant with them until something really bad happened to me and I realized they were never there. then I realized the only times in my life they said I was pleasant were also when I was sick. then I figured out how to cure myself, which i planned to figure out, and they completely reject my recovery. and I started thinking, why am i so trying to impress these people? and now I've done all this achievement and realized they never once asked me in my whole life what I've been up to. they all me the same "how are things" but then follow up by saying "I don't like to hear that you're unwell". so I can never tell them I'm unwell and they wouldn't listen anyway.
i was raised by teenage women because they worked all the time and my mum told my woman this bs about how "you make all these sacrifices for your kids" and I thought, what sacrifices? what I wanted was attention and affection? instead I got ramblings. and now I'm a rambler and I fear having kids!
thanks so much
I think you are reading my mind every time I se your vídeos. Thanks
This happened to me too. I loved my father very much but I do not know if it was reciprocated. Maybe for a while?
My father decided that it was a good idea to begin to lie to me and I did not approve. He then decided to drink himself to death and blame me for his miserable existence. I decided that it was a good idea to strive for excellence. Out of love I offered him everything that I was and had attained, he said "yes" and proceeded with his own self-destruction. This was very puzzling to me. Surely it is better to aim up than down? Choose health & sanity before mental deterioration & self-pity?
It was all good as long as I played along with his game and with society. He didn't handle it well that I was able to think outside the box or not go along with game rules that set me up to fail.
He never even suspected there was anything outside of his own view of things, he could only see things in relation to himself and his own mind. I tried to get him to sort things through with his own father and was met with the answer he already had. He gaslighted so much, he even gaslighted himself in the process!
You do not have accept their zero sum game behavior. I like to think of families as a play or story where people are expected to follow certain roles and follow a script. The script is people's understanding of what a family should be and often who they are. Most people cannot step away and redefine their roles, hence disfunction can persist over generations. Bravo
Exactly. Same goes for marriages and romantic relationships. Even for work relations, social functions ("civilian" vs "police officer") etc etc.
My experience as the child of my parents was nothing like the zero sum game that you describe. My parents loved me and I them. The idea that my mother and father were in league with one another for the purpose of foisting upon me a prepackaged identity inimical to my authentic self occupied no part of my thinking. If high I.Q. is being linked causally to a propensity for rejection of parental values, then I am doubly exceptional since I belong to the Triple Nine Society and I have multiple distinct memories going back to the age of one. I was not and am not in the parlance of this channel a “neurotypical.”
Poignant analysis. This is something I had to learn from a young age. Parents have little incentive to change the rules of a game that is rigged in their favor. By staying in the game you only confirm to them that it is okay to use manipulative tactics in order to get you to benefit them. Expressions of gratitude and generosity should come from within, not forced out of you by somebody who is simply fulfilling a role that the generational cycles before them have created.
Thank you! And very well put!
I'm 35 and I think my parents are toxic. It's really too bad but we just don't get along. They don't really give a fuck about me. They say "of course I love you" but I can't come by, am not welcome, accepted, et. Cetera. Bunch of manipulative bullshit. Lol you describe it perfectly.
Yes, a lot of them are actually. And there's a lot of ways of being toxic, also very "acceptable" and civilized ones...
4:42
Are your parents Italian? You made the precise gesticulation Italians make when giving advice.
No :) Local Flemish peasants since centuries, it seems.
I feel powerful watching these two videos talking about parents. I’ll act this out in my life and hopefully share some positive feedback with you within the next few months.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and creating all these contents! I hope you’re doing great. Maybe you can also share some thoughts on questions that you’re yet to finalize a good answers to your audiences to solve.
Hello Gabry, that's fabulous that you feel empowered, that's the whole idea of the videos (and my books)! You'll get some interesting results and profound and meaningful changes in your life if you start to tackle the parent issue (that most of us have, but only a few do something with or about it). Definitely very much worth it.
Thanks for the suggestion also, I'll keep it in mind!
Huge video. Clarifying, necessary, helpful. Great job. Thank you.
my gf noticed you are cosplaying your vase 😅 she's funny
Congratulations. I'm subscriber number 1000! Great job!
Thanks :) And congrats to you for being number 1000 :)
Discovered this now. Need this ✌
a great 'speak'...thankyou🙏🏼🕊💞
I agree 1000%!! Great vid
Thanks! It's actually sad that you have to agree, because it means you have had your bad experiences too. But well, it's still better to understand... Once you understand, you can start handling it...
@@Abel.Abelson im just glad more people like you are bringing this much-needed message out there because most parents ego, arrogance and therefore abuse is out of control. being a parent almost means you are akin to gods/godesses (especially mothers), and you cant criticize them, but arents are humans too and are not above it. happy holidays!
@@corsicanlulu Exactly! Thanks! And same to you 👍
Didn't work !
I don't know the solution, but this hasn't worked and I have tried it for a long time.
There's a debt and you cannot wish it away.
You are right when you say that the care they provided you with, and the 'sacrifices' they made should have felt rewarding in itself iff they truly loved you, but if they are claiming repayment then it seems like you cannot wish away the debt. They clearly have raised you on expectations rather than love.
There's a karmic debt here, that one needs to clear, there's no other way to peace
I am quite sure that you dont have to be the 'good son' or 'good daughter' that they think they deserve ( You never can be good enough) but there are other ways of repaying the debt.
Great video, once again!
Thank you :)
It’s still hard. I love them.
You may also be entangled (a term in psychology for a not really healthy family relationship) and/or have a salvation fantasy (unconsciously expecting them to be or do things they can't, and think that if you act in the right way, it will happen). But yes, of course it's hard, in any case there is a lot of grieving to do.
Brilliant approach, thanks a lot
You're welcome, thank you :)
Hello, Abel! I saw your last videos and i like so much the things you are talking. Keep moving!
This question that i'll write don't have too much connection with this video, but i believe here is more easy to you see it than if I write it in some other video with more correlation, but whatever (haha).
I noticed that you are a jiu-jitsu practitioner. Can you tell me and the others, in some next video, or here, what is like to be an intellectually gifted person in terms of getting better in some hability like in jiu-jitsu? Is it like you are going to learn more fast... or... how it works? Is it like your brain make the process of growing axon more fast than others?
Yes, I could do that, I'll note the subject of jiu-jitsu. In my case, it was very confronting to *not* be able to simply glance over it and "get it". I was confronted with the (relative) slowness of motricity learning. It's like learning to ride a bike. You can understand the bike and even your own body structure and functioning, but that doesn't mean you can ride it. Matter comes in, slow matter, muscular memory etc, as opposed to snappy mental understanding. Interesting experience. Whether my muscular learning is faster than others is very hard to tell, but I wouldn't think the difference to be significant.
Apart from that, there are tons of studies about the correlation between exercising and mental capabilities, but that's more a question of general health and applies to everyone equally.
@@Abel.Abelson, thank you very much for responding.
If I am not going to bother you, could you answer this other question?
I would like to know if there have been many times in your life when people realized that you were intellectually gifted. Could you give an example that occurred to you? I don't know ... like ...for example being in a market and someone asked something, and you answer, and your answer makes someone realize that you are smart. 🤯
@@gabrielvalezeelisbaodonasc6410 Half of the time they think I "overcomplicate" or "think too much" (which I translate as them not thinking enough), so in that case no, they don't think I'm smart. Then let's say 25% of the time they don't really get the point and just do what's socially expected, or follow up with something beside the point. So then they don't think I'm smart either. And then there's 25% of the time they do think I'm saying something smart, but only in a minority of these cases will they admit this, and certainly not in public (because they're too concerned with their own status). So in general it's not at all like if they regularly go "oh how smart of you", definitely not. Makes one end up with a Cassandra complex, actually.
Excellent video 💛 And the game is 100% rigged.
If you fix your relationship with your parents you wouldnt be as miserable, 100%, thats a fact no I'm not saying there isn't going to be any compromises but that's the point you gotta compromise and show some humility for the people who raised you so that God gives you some happiness if you believe in God
how do you reject the game? is it in your book?
Gosh .. thank you.
Thank you
I feel the same way. Thanx
You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and letting me know. Have a look at the books too, they serve the same purpose, but better, in my opinion... amzn.to/3paQsmz
Good day to you sir, are you from Sweden? Malmo?
Haha, no, not Sweden :)
Sounds similar to confirmation bias
Could you elaborate on that?
@@Abel.Abelson if you affirm your parents visions, they support you, if not, then you're not good enough, valid
@@arm4ix Yes, exactly. And they think this is "education" or "support" :)
Omg.
You're God's given Gift to people with High IQ. God Bless you with happy life and prosperity. :)
My anxiety and my plan to sleep on the railway track after discovering this channel: 📉📉