I really wish they were a bit more balanced though. 4 planeswalkers is significantly easier than any of the other challenges. But I love the Special Ops idea!
TheVanilla gamer yeah me too. Thats why i stopped to watch their Edh games regurlarly and if I click on a video I only skip through it most of the time to get some ideas for decks.
For anyone reading later; Rings of Brighthearth does not affect the number of counters put onto or taken off of a Planeswalker. The change in loyalty is a cost, the rings only affect the effect of the ability.
najomage how the phases work is you have to declare blocks first before priority is passed back and forth. The very first thing you do is declare blocks and THEN priority is passed. So yes, it was a legal mirror match. Also, if you read mirror match it says that the tokens enter blocking meaning it bypasses the declaration of blockers.
I'm not sure how long it takes to film these, but how difficult would it be for SCG to just have a judge for these videos because honestly there have been so many actual game-shaping incorrect-rules calls in this series.
This was one of my favorite episodes. Really enjoyed the goals and the general power level of the decks. Very much a goldilocks situation for me, not too strong, not to weak, just right! Thanks!
The combat phase is the third phase in a turn, and has five steps in this order: Beginning of Combat Step Declare Attackers Step Declare Blockers Step Combat Damage Step End of Combat Step So Mirror Match was legal play, please play by rules
nathones players gain priority in turn order once the active player passes priority. Every player gets priority each phase of combat after the effects of the step itself are finished i.e. Damage in the combat damage step.
magic.wizards.com/en/game-info/gameplay/rules-and-formats/rules -- not native English speaker so official source would be better, look 116. Timing and Priority and 509. Declare Blockers Step also 5. Turn Structure in general is a good read
Mirror Mockery declares the creature as a blocker. Since it has to be cast during the Declare Blockers step, there is literally no other way to cast it. The very first thing that happens in Declare Blockers is the declaration of Blockers before any player gets priority. If you wanted to cast a spell before blocks are declared, you would have to do it in Declare Attackers which Mirror Match clearly forbids. Justin cast the spell legally and Jon was wrong. Also, Jon searched for a legendary creature with Woodland Bellower. Jon may be illiterate.
Corey Castelli Missing one word doesn't make you illiterate. and pretty sure the the chaos warp happened after blockers were declared, so too late to cast mirror match. No one disputed that.
What comes after declare blockers is combat damage step. In that case, Justin would still have both of his blockers absorbing the 16 power. The only way Chaos Warp can stop a blocker is before combat damage, i.e. the declare blocker step. As it is still the declare blockers step, Justin can then cast his spell.
VBane it's not possible to cast the mirror match during combat damage step before damage but The stack continues at the declaration of the end of the declare blockers step.
In case no one mentioned it yet, The Chain Veil also effects planeswalkers that come into play AFTER you activate it. So he could have activated Ajani a second time around 59:20
I really liked the hidden roles mechanic, it was an interesting and welcome twist to the game play with players getting points in unusual ways and something that I would like to see more of. The video compilation where the roles from last week revealed in a short time was also well done rather than showing the actual video footage in real time as you sometimes do, this allowed me to be able to watch the video straight through rather than trying to skip and potentially miss commenting, etc.
Jeremy, I hate the negative comments you receive. It used to be Suarez and I guess now its your turn. Its ridiculous. I enjoy what you all bring to the table and all the commentators act like they never make mistakes. Jesus, I've played for 15 years and I still tap the wrong mana for things. Keep your head up man, and may I be one of hopefully many who congratulate y'all on the fun games and the sweet plays. #teamsuarez #teamgreen #noelway #teamparnell May the cards fall ever in your favor
I cheer on Jeremy too, but seriously, I do not understand at all why he was so determined to kill the player that was no threat and leave the guy with 80 life alone. Those choices were not playing to win; they were choices made out of poor strategic thinking.
there was nothing strategic about it, really. first, they play for points which changes the conventions of commander. where you and i may identify a large threat and think "We need to deal with this guy before we die", he could have simply conceded to the fact that he couldn't deal with stephen and decided to get a kill point in the literal sense of the word. and second, jeremy and justin have a funny rivalry that goes back through the games, much deeper than just this game (like any other meta). he more or less just wanted to see if justin had answers (which he did, jon was able to convince justin he made an illegal play with mirror match, when it was legal), and wanted a kill point.
hey fair enough, it could have been his strategy. the way i see it, he wanted to see if justin had yet another answer lol, and the bonus being if he didn't, he'd get a kill point. i don't necessarily see that as being a good strategy, but it was a funny one.
Shouldn't that work with Mirror Match? Jeremy cast chaos warp during the declare blockers step it resolved and Justin has priority again. If Jeremy cast chaos warp at any later step damage would already have been dealt. Don't think it affected the outcome particularly.
The first thing that happens during the "declare blockers step" is declaring blockers. After that players still get priority. Mirror Match just puts a token into play that blocks, the same way that after declaring attackers a card like Kari Zev puts a token into play that is tapped and attacking. You don't have to have the token before that step to declare it as blocking. It is assigned as blocking as part of the effect that creates it. Justin was cheated out of surviving there, unintentionally but still.
Define cheating. Seriously, how can we say for sure what is cheating and what is a misunderstanding or a misreading of a card? I also think they should start reading their own freaking cards, but to take away points makes no sense. By the rules, every player should know what is happening in the table, and not just belive what the opponent says. It sucks that suares was wrong about the declare blockers fase, but there were 3 other players in game (plus the director) that could have corrected him. It's not only his fault and it's not fair to penalise him for it. I do think tha Choi did a better work at correcting this type of play, and that should be one of the roles the director plays.
One of the reasons why I enjoy SCG Commander videos more than other channels is rarely do you guys do obnoxious things and infinite combo off by turn 4, or chain mindslaver people (besides Justin showcasing Emrakul). It always delivers a quality game of commander that you'd see at a LGS between 4 competent players. For me personally, I've only been playing the game since Shadows over Innistrad. Seeing what different cards do over the history of magic that I wasn't around for is very interesting. This week was entertaining and had some good laughs as usual, but the continuous attacking of Justin while he was basically dead on board really made it seem like I was watching a different channel, which completely shut his deck off and made it very uninteresting to even consider picking up and playing since he had to play defensive from very early stages of the game. Maybe it was just the decks chosen and the bonus point theme that took away from this weeks video. Johnathon attacking for 90 million a turn very early, Jeremy not wanting to attack a deathtouch creature on Steven's side of the table to achieve his 40 power eventually, and Steven hitting the right tax cards early to deter everyone from pointing their stuff at him sort of resulted in a "Nombo" of a game this week. Love what you guys do, hopefully you can view this as simple constructive feedback from someone who appreciates your work, and possibly find ways to improve and potentially avoid these types of one-sided games in the future.
(Jeremy) Thanks for your feedback. I think you hit the point home more than most that the hidden roles, while interesting, led to a game where attacks and politics were quite different than they normally would have been.
Yeah, sure Jeremy, I think what REALLY happened is you were so blinded by making sure Justin lost so that he would drop out of first, that you let Steven build up an absurd field that you did nothing about when you had multiple opportunities and threw the game away. Rather disappointing game, try to learn some threat assessment for future games.
Star City Games My experience with running a Warhammer 40k narrative campaign was that secret objectives needed to be things you didn't get in the course of winning, but potentially took work away from winning or could be accomplished if someone thought the game was unwinnable. The alternatives were to effectively use it as a deckbuilding restriction, so getting it would be trivial if you built a list tailored to do so but would be difficult to impossible if you didn't, or just make them really generic, which is uninteresting. Otherwise it risks becoming a method to reward whoever is winning anyway. It's tough to balance, in general, but worth continuing to explore.
Justin should not have died after he cast mirror match. He indeed no longer had an option to declare blockers, but mirror match puts the creatures into play blocking, meaning that the creatures still get blocked by the creatures that mirror match makes. beg combat, jeremy applies trigger to his creature, makes it a 16/16 attackers declared on Justin priority is passed declare blockers, Justin assigns 2 blockers priority is passed Jeremy casts his spell priority is passed Justin recieves an island as Chaos Warp resolves Priority is passed Justin casts Mirror Match putting in an additional 8/8 blocking the attacking creature it copies. priority is passed Jeremy's 16/16 bounces off the 8/8 token from before + the 8/8 created and put into play blocking created by Mirror Match. I don't know how you guys came to some conclusion that Justin still dies. If Mirror Match simply put creatures into play it would be too late, but it doesn't, it puts them into play blocking the attacking creature that they copied. Simple case of RTFC...
RaiTsuka Um, might be misunderstanding you, but the problem wasn't that it was too late to block with the creature, it's that it was too late to legally play the card at all.
VBane It was absolutely still a legal time, they were still in the declare blockers step. Once every player passes priority, then they move to the damage step.
correct. Priority is passed at the end of the declare blockers step, at which time they are currently still in the declare blockers step. the only way to leave the declare blockers step, is for every player to pass priority in turn. Jeremy cast Chaos Warp, priority passes in turn until everyone has passed, and the spell resolves. Then Jeremy gains priority again as the active player. Priority passes all the way around to Justin, who then uses that priority to cast Mirror Match. Priority would pass all the way around until everyone has passed and the spell resolves. then priority goes back to Jeremy and passes to each person. once everyone has passed priority with nothing on the stack, the game will progress to the next part of the phase, the Combat Damage step.
you don't gain priority in the combat damage step until after combat damage has been dealt. so even if this is the case, Justin would still have lived, as all of the damage would have already been dealt to the double blocking tokens Justin had prior to the Chaos Warp.
"Did you just assume his creature type?" "That's....that's not a cool joke man" Both the joke, and the response given, in the manner that it was given. Made me chuckle....cringe a little, but chuckle.
commander goals (in case montage is too fast) Justin Parnell: control 1 non-creature permanent from each opponent at the same time. Jeremy Noell: Attack with a 40 power creature. Stephen Green: Have 4 Planeswalkers in play at the same time. Jonathan Suarez: Draw 20 cards in a single turn.
"I'm going to play an extra land... I'm going to play Akroma's Vengeance." I laughed so hard at 21:50 lol I always love resolving Akroma's Vengeance :D
But the Mirror match was cast during "Declare blockers" step. It is still "Declare blockers" until everybody passed priority, and only then it goes to the damage step, when no one receives priority before damage is dealt.
fun idea could be that you all have secret alt win cons, similar to the hidden agendas, and maybe you receive double points if you win the game with your alt win con... ex: Near-Death Experience, Coalition Victory, Celestial Convergence, Dark-steel Reactor, etc OR maybe the commanders ARE the alt win cards... but that might be a bit over the top
i really enjoyed this episode and would love to see hidden roles again. Maybe do a hidden role in the hat where each of you make two roles and choose one at random.
Hidden roles and point system are great, i going to try it out at my LGS for weekly play! Great content! EDH is complicated and supposed to be casual and fun, disregard all the negative comments. Atraxa looks like a blast to play.
at around 34:00 when jon is building his board massive, he could have untapped devoted druid 10 times (because it's a 9/11 from overrun pumps) then pumped twice more and killed probably two people.
I scrolled down a little ways and I haven't seen anyone comment that at 21:30 Justin should have taken 10 damage from trample. Since the damage is being prevented similarly to protection, it should roll over
I really enjoyed this one, perhaps in future the roles could have different difficulties that are worth more points - say you can pick from a 1, 3 or 5 point role and maybe give one of your opponents one of the other roles.
Like silly role like having 5 cards into play with a horse on the picture or things like that that people doesn't really want to do but that would make a funny video or just hard things like meld something. Good idea man !
in addition to the Ezuri target... Pretty sure that the Teferi that Justin put in his graveyard was Stephen's planeswalker... but highly entertaining video!
Quick question; what is the command zone mat? Is it just a laminated piece of paper? I am looking at the starcity page and the vs 4 player mats are there, I was just curious what the command zone is. Thanks
Watching these older videos and it's obvious that Kyle doesn't care about his job anymore. He used to put in little images to go with the references mentioned, and now he just does nothing.
Everyone has noticed the "cheats" and misunderstandings that happened this game, but I can't focus on those knowing that just before the 1hour mark, Stephen decided to sacrifice his flying/vigilance/deathtouch/lifelink/proliferate commander instead of a 3/3 beast just to draw one more card. That's the sort of game decision that really grinds my gears.
1:23:57 swiftfoot boots stays on stonehoof chieftain because it was not removed from battlefield. Justin took control of creature when equipments equip is on stack and attaches to stonehoof chieftain but jeremy still has control of the equipment.
That mirror match scenario was super bad. I'm really impressed with Justin's ability to have survived as the archenemy for so long even though going after him was unjustified when Stephen constantly needed to be weakened. Also good work on staying calm and enjoying the game, Justin. I know a lot of people who would have gotten salty in that situation.
I associate my play style with Jeremy more than anything. When I look at the line up I see which one I would play and sure enough he's playing it. It helps that he's playing my favorite deck to.
In a new season, I'd like to see everyone play the same commander but with different takes on the general. I think Kynaios and Tiro or Phelddagrif are generally the best for this.
Enjoyed that, particularly Jon's deck, instead of doing something like Azami he really went out the park on that one. As a variant could you do something like a hidden goal PLUS hidden prohibition? So something that's limiting you achieving the goal deliberately?
35:00 You could have done 11 more damage if you untapped the devoted druid for mana to fuel two more overrun (it costs you the druid but would have killed Justin).
Hey guys! Great game! Just reminding you of my little idea I had for the season finale generals! Justin: Meren Jeremy: Damia Jon: Breya Stephen: Omnath, locus of rage Thanks guys! Love the series!
Will there be any future series where you guys take decklists from the community if so I have 2 lists on Tapped out for Kaalia and Animar (2 decks that havent been in Commander Vs since the very beginning YEARS ago) I would love to share :)
Made a mistake, When Justin Cackling Counterpart the second time, his token would have been a 16/16 not 8/8. Since the target was boosted by Xenagos before it was copied
I really liked the secret goal and would really enjoy seeing more of those, because then it becomes about doing the thing your deck wants to do, instead of always politicking your way to the end. I think this episode really emphasized the flaws in this points system. Everyone knew that Justin had to die first for them to stay in the points race, so regardless of how weak he was, it was correct for players to attack him mercilessly. I think if anything I would like for there to be less points given out for placement. I seriously think the points system should be replaced somehow, be it everyone having their own goal, or forgoing a points system entirely. Some of the points seem arbitrary (first blood, casting commander 4 times) and encourage thing players should not have to care about in deck making.
My friend has a Dimir deck under Lazav that is similar to Justin's theme. He calls it "I don't like my deck, let me play yours." Lots of searching opponents' library for stuff and clone effects.
Really loved the hidden roles. Maybe some sort of hidden traps for another time. When a player does something he loses a point but doesn't know it himself.
Twas a great idea, loved it.... FYI The Chain Veils second ability (4tap you may activate loyalty bla bla), can be used on planeswalkers not only you control after resolution, but ones you put on board after resolution too, e.g. the ajani the one turn. Cheers!
I have an idea for an episode, and it would be amazing if you would try it. What it is, is to take the strongest of the box deck out of 4 of the commander sets and play them against each other To see which is the strongest..
it could be cool, but I watch too many edh shows to enjoy another 2 hour video that ends with everyone getting ground out by precon2016 Breya again lol
![Commander VS S7E6: Gideon Jura vs Garruk vs Arlinn Kord vs Venser [MTG]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tS08fSSt-RE/mqdefault.jpg)
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
![Commander VS S4E3: Emrakul vs Gisa and Geralf vs Ishkanah vs Ulrich [MtG: Multiplayer]](/img/n.gif)
I really like the "Secret Role" or "Special Ops" type of extra roles.
Brings extra fun, and it is good inspiration for our own group's rules.
I really wish they were a bit more balanced though. 4 planeswalkers is significantly easier than any of the other challenges. But I love the Special Ops idea!
"wizards has been deploying the gatewatch for the last three blocks" lmao
ded
jim bobby truttthhh
Oml thank you : D
illegal target at 1:31:22 because Ezuri is legendary.
I feel like the table doesn't check Suarez enough because they assume he knows what he's doing.
Olive R they don't read the cards and it pisses me off sometimes
Hahahah cheaaaaterrrr
Suarez just tends to cheat a lot and somehow gets away with it every time.
TheVanilla gamer yeah me too. Thats why i stopped to watch their Edh games regurlarly and if I click on a video I only skip through it most of the time to get some ideas for decks.
For anyone reading later; Rings of Brighthearth does not affect the number of counters put onto or taken off of a Planeswalker. The change in loyalty is a cost, the rings only affect the effect of the ability.
1:31:15 Can't get legendaries with Woodland Bellower.
Thank goodness
Jon has an illegal search for Ezuri and then convinces Justin to concede after making a legal mirror match play. #wisemove
Don Atherton not a legal mirror move, he cast it after he declared blockers
Which is totally legal, because he's playing it at the END of the declare blockers step, which is the ONLY time you can cast it.
najomage how the phases work is you have to declare blocks first before priority is passed back and forth. The very first thing you do is declare blocks and THEN priority is passed.
So yes, it was a legal mirror match.
Also, if you read mirror match it says that the tokens enter blocking meaning it bypasses the declaration of blockers.
You can only play spells in the declare blockers step after blockers are declared.
I'm not sure how long it takes to film these, but how difficult would it be for SCG to just have a judge for these videos because honestly there have been so many actual game-shaping incorrect-rules calls in this series.
This was one of my favorite episodes. Really enjoyed the goals and the general power level of the decks. Very much a goldilocks situation for me, not too strong, not to weak, just right! Thanks!
ob nixilis first ability is a +2 not +1 poor ob nixilis so powerfull that you nerf him
Stephen: "Never gonna get my Sol Ring!"
Justin: "Acquire."
The combat phase is the third phase in a turn, and has five steps in this order:
Beginning of Combat Step
Declare Attackers Step
Declare Blockers Step
Combat Damage Step
End of Combat Step
So Mirror Match was legal play, please play by rules
Which of these phases do players get priority? I have trouble understanding this phase more than any other for some reason.
nathones players gain priority in turn order once the active player passes priority. Every player gets priority each phase of combat after the effects of the step itself are finished i.e. Damage in the combat damage step.
magic.wizards.com/en/game-info/gameplay/rules-and-formats/rules -- not native English speaker so official source would be better, look 116. Timing and Priority and 509. Declare Blockers Step also 5. Turn Structure in general is a good read
Just to be "that guy" you forgot the "First Strike Combat Damage Step" :^)
Sorry but there is no "First Strike Combat Damage Step", go read 510.4
Mirror Mockery declares the creature as a blocker. Since it has to be cast during the Declare Blockers step, there is literally no other way to cast it. The very first thing that happens in Declare Blockers is the declaration of Blockers before any player gets priority. If you wanted to cast a spell before blocks are declared, you would have to do it in Declare Attackers which Mirror Match clearly forbids.
Justin cast the spell legally and Jon was wrong. Also, Jon searched for a legendary creature with Woodland Bellower. Jon may be illiterate.
Corey Castelli Missing one word doesn't make you illiterate. and pretty sure the the chaos warp happened after blockers were declared, so too late to cast mirror match. No one disputed that.
What comes after declare blockers is combat damage step. In that case, Justin would still have both of his blockers absorbing the 16 power. The only way Chaos Warp can stop a blocker is before combat damage, i.e. the declare blocker step. As it is still the declare blockers step, Justin can then cast his spell.
VBane it's not possible to cast the mirror match during combat damage step before damage but The stack continues at the declaration of the end of the declare blockers step.
In case no one mentioned it yet, The Chain Veil also effects planeswalkers that come into play AFTER you activate it. So he could have activated Ajani a second time around 59:20
I really liked the hidden roles mechanic, it was an interesting and welcome twist to the game play with players getting points in unusual ways and something that I would like to see more of. The video compilation where the roles from last week revealed in a short time was also well done rather than showing the actual video footage in real time as you sometimes do, this allowed me to be able to watch the video straight through rather than trying to skip and potentially miss commenting, etc.
Jeremy, I hate the negative comments you receive. It used to be Suarez and I guess now its your turn. Its ridiculous. I enjoy what you all bring to the table and all the commentators act like they never make mistakes. Jesus, I've played for 15 years and I still tap the wrong mana for things. Keep your head up man, and may I be one of hopefully many who congratulate y'all on the fun games and the sweet plays. #teamsuarez #teamgreen #noelway #teamparnell May the cards fall ever in your favor
I cheer on Jeremy too, but seriously, I do not understand at all why he was so determined to kill the player that was no threat and leave the guy with 80 life alone. Those choices were not playing to win; they were choices made out of poor strategic thinking.
there was nothing strategic about it, really.
first, they play for points which changes the conventions of commander. where you and i may identify a large threat and think "We need to deal with this guy before we die", he could have simply conceded to the fact that he couldn't deal with stephen and decided to get a kill point in the literal sense of the word. and second, jeremy and justin have a funny rivalry that goes back through the games, much deeper than just this game (like any other meta).
he more or less just wanted to see if justin had answers (which he did, jon was able to convince justin he made an illegal play with mirror match, when it was legal), and wanted a kill point.
Not to really argue with you, but playing for points (or playing to prevent others from points) is a strategy.
hey fair enough, it could have been his strategy. the way i see it, he wanted to see if justin had yet another answer lol, and the bonus being if he didn't, he'd get a kill point.
i don't necessarily see that as being a good strategy, but it was a funny one.
Wasn't Parnell in first before this game started? That's really the only explanation for it. The point system they do complicate things.
Shouldn't that work with Mirror Match? Jeremy cast chaos warp during the declare blockers step it resolved and Justin has priority again. If Jeremy cast chaos warp at any later step damage would already have been dealt. Don't think it affected the outcome particularly.
Yes this correct. While it probably wouldn't have changed the outcome, denying Justin another saving himself moment was cruel.
Yea, priority after declaring blockers is still in the "declare blockers" step.
Was surprised when they turned it around.
Mirror Match can only be cast during declaring blockers, blockers had already been declared so he could not cast it.
He cast it at the END of the declare blockers step, which is the ONLY legal time to cast it.
The first thing that happens during the "declare blockers step" is declaring blockers. After that players still get priority. Mirror Match just puts a token into play that blocks, the same way that after declaring attackers a card like Kari Zev puts a token into play that is tapped and attacking. You don't have to have the token before that step to declare it as blocking. It
is assigned as blocking as part of the effect that creates it.
Justin was cheated out of surviving there, unintentionally but still.
I love how Stephen always went +1 on Ob Nixilis, while his ability is a +2
;)
One of my favorite episodes so far! Was so confused when half way through with Justin at one life the video still had one hour left to watch ha
Hidden Rolls is awesome. I would LOVE to see more of it.
Can we get a RTFC rule that makes people lose half a point every time they cheat?
Carter Please make this happen. At least for the blatant, game-changing cheating.
If only this wasnt almost logistically impossible.
Define cheating. Seriously, how can we say for sure what is cheating and what is a misunderstanding or a misreading of a card?
I also think they should start reading their own freaking cards, but to take away points makes no sense.
By the rules, every player should know what is happening in the table, and not just belive what the opponent says.
It sucks that suares was wrong about the declare blockers fase, but there were 3 other players in game (plus the director) that could have corrected him. It's not only his fault and it's not fair to penalise him for it.
I do think tha Choi did a better work at correcting this type of play, and that should be one of the roles the director plays.
Change this to non-minor rules infraction. Cheating implies intent which is impossible to prove. Rules mistakes are cut and dry.
One of the reasons why I enjoy SCG Commander videos more than other channels is rarely do you guys do obnoxious things and infinite combo off by turn 4, or chain mindslaver people (besides Justin showcasing Emrakul). It always delivers a quality game of commander that you'd see at a LGS between 4 competent players.
For me personally, I've only been playing the game since Shadows over Innistrad. Seeing what different cards do over the history of magic that I wasn't around for is very interesting.
This week was entertaining and had some good laughs as usual, but the continuous attacking of Justin while he was basically dead on board really made it seem like I was watching a different channel, which completely shut his deck off and made it very uninteresting to even consider picking up and playing since he had to play defensive from very early stages of the game. Maybe it was just the decks chosen and the bonus point theme that took away from this weeks video. Johnathon attacking for 90 million a turn very early, Jeremy not wanting to attack a deathtouch creature on Steven's side of the table to achieve his 40 power eventually, and Steven hitting the right tax cards early to deter everyone from pointing their stuff at him sort of resulted in a "Nombo" of a game this week.
Love what you guys do, hopefully you can view this as simple constructive feedback from someone who appreciates your work, and possibly find ways to improve and potentially avoid these types of one-sided games in the future.
(Jeremy) Thanks for your feedback. I think you hit the point home more than most that the hidden roles, while interesting, led to a game where attacks and politics were quite different than they normally would have been.
I think it would've helped if everyone knew everyone knew else's objective that way everyone had some idea of what they need to play around.
Yeah, sure Jeremy, I think what REALLY happened is you were so blinded by making sure Justin lost so that he would drop out of first, that you let Steven build up an absurd field that you did nothing about when you had multiple opportunities and threw the game away.
Rather disappointing game, try to learn some threat assessment for future games.
Star City Games My experience with running a Warhammer 40k narrative campaign was that secret objectives needed to be things you didn't get in the course of winning, but potentially took work away from winning or could be accomplished if someone thought the game was unwinnable. The alternatives were to effectively use it as a deckbuilding restriction, so getting it would be trivial if you built a list tailored to do so but would be difficult to impossible if you didn't, or just make them really generic, which is uninteresting. Otherwise it risks becoming a method to reward whoever is winning anyway. It's tough to balance, in general, but worth continuing to explore.
I would love to see the hidden roles again. It's a very fun idea, and it's entertaining to see you guys trying to figure the role(s) out.
That was a really awesome game and it was a really cool theme. Probably one of my favorites of the season! Great vid guys
Justin should not have died after he cast mirror match. He indeed no longer had an option to declare blockers, but mirror match puts the creatures into play blocking, meaning that the creatures still get blocked by the creatures that mirror match makes.
beg combat, jeremy applies trigger to his creature, makes it a 16/16
attackers declared on Justin
priority is passed
declare blockers, Justin assigns 2 blockers
priority is passed
Jeremy casts his spell
priority is passed
Justin recieves an island as Chaos Warp resolves
Priority is passed
Justin casts Mirror Match putting in an additional 8/8 blocking the attacking creature it copies.
priority is passed
Jeremy's 16/16 bounces off the 8/8 token from before + the 8/8 created and put into play blocking created by Mirror Match.
I don't know how you guys came to some conclusion that Justin still dies. If Mirror Match simply put creatures into play it would be too late, but it doesn't, it puts them into play blocking the attacking creature that they copied.
Simple case of RTFC...
RaiTsuka Um, might be misunderstanding you, but the problem wasn't that it was too late to block with the creature, it's that it was too late to legally play the card at all.
VBane It was absolutely still a legal time, they were still in the declare blockers step. Once every player passes priority, then they move to the damage step.
correct. Priority is passed at the end of the declare blockers step, at which time they are currently still in the declare blockers step. the only way to leave the declare blockers step, is for every player to pass priority in turn. Jeremy cast Chaos Warp, priority passes in turn until everyone has passed, and the spell resolves. Then Jeremy gains priority again as the active player. Priority passes all the way around to Justin, who then uses that priority to cast Mirror Match. Priority would pass all the way around until everyone has passed and the spell resolves. then priority goes back to Jeremy and passes to each person. once everyone has passed priority with nothing on the stack, the game will progress to the next part of the phase, the Combat Damage step.
The problem was he could only cast the spell during the Blocker Step and the Step was over.
you don't gain priority in the combat damage step until after combat damage has been dealt. so even if this is the case, Justin would still have lived, as all of the damage would have already been dealt to the double blocking tokens Justin had prior to the Chaos Warp.
This was a great theme. It just pushes deck design in interesting ways for fun interactions between decks.
The amount of defensive cards Justin had in his deck is absolutely astounding XD
"Did you just assume his creature type?"
"That's....that's not a cool joke man"
Both the joke, and the response given, in the manner that it was given. Made me chuckle....cringe a little, but chuckle.
followed by an awkward silence ...
commander goals (in case montage is too fast)
Justin Parnell: control 1 non-creature permanent from each opponent at the same time.
Jeremy Noell: Attack with a 40 power creature.
Stephen Green: Have 4 Planeswalkers in play at the same time.
Jonathan Suarez: Draw 20 cards in a single turn.
"I'm going to play an extra land... I'm going to play Akroma's Vengeance." I laughed so hard at 21:50 lol I always love resolving Akroma's Vengeance :D
I really liked this game, it was especially fun watching Stephen try to get out and protect his planeswalkers.
This was awesome ! Great vid as always guys :)
But the Mirror match was cast during "Declare blockers" step. It is still "Declare blockers" until everybody passed priority, and only then it goes to the damage step, when no one receives priority before damage is dealt.
I think this is the first time you guys have ever ultimated a planeswalker. Thats dope as hell!
I for one definitely want to see the hidden goals again, and I really want to see Thada Adel again
fun idea could be that you all have secret alt win cons, similar to the hidden agendas, and maybe you receive double points if you win the game with your alt win con... ex: Near-Death Experience, Coalition Victory, Celestial Convergence, Dark-steel Reactor, etc
OR maybe the commanders ARE the alt win cards...
but that might be a bit over the top
I would like to see the hidden roles again. I would also like to see the random EDHREC commanders again. That was very fun to watch.
Do this again. Way fun. Keep up the good work. Props to the funny editing.
i really enjoyed this episode and would love to see hidden roles again. Maybe do a hidden role in the hat where each of you make two roles and choose one at random.
59:14 The Chain Vail counts for all P.W before and after the ability
I recommended Seton at one point! I hope Jon enjoys it, because its a really fun deck!
Did no one else see the devoted Druid's counters getting removed throughout the game?
1:39:40
All was right, That's exactly haw Mirror Match works. That scoop made me cry.
Jon needs to play a custom version of Breya! I loved how he played the precon, I want to see his own spin on it.
Great theme! Definitely do this one again!
Jeremy for your pettiness may you never win and always go out first. Great job at identifying threats.
Forget the haters. You guys put out consistent and enjoyable content. Keep on doing your thing!
Hidden roles and point system are great, i going to try it out at my LGS for weekly play! Great content! EDH is complicated and supposed to be casual and fun, disregard all the negative comments. Atraxa looks like a blast to play.
at around 34:00 when jon is building his board massive, he could have untapped devoted druid 10 times (because it's a 9/11 from overrun pumps) then pumped twice more and killed probably two people.
This theme was awesome. I would love to see it again :D
you guys are amazing!! you encourage me to keep playing magic!! Fight on!
I scrolled down a little ways and I haven't seen anyone comment that at 21:30 Justin should have taken 10 damage from trample. Since the damage is being prevented similarly to protection, it should roll over
@stephengreen your deck list shows 98/100 cards. 1 would be Atraxa obviously but what would the missing card be?
I really enjoyed this one, perhaps in future the roles could have different difficulties that are worth more points - say you can pick from a 1, 3 or 5 point role and maybe give one of your opponents one of the other roles.
Like silly role like having 5 cards into play with a horse on the picture or things like that that people doesn't really want to do but that would make a funny video or just hard things like meld something. Good idea man !
Did Stephen remove a mining counter from gemstone mine to fog with spike weaver?
22:00 Stephen did not draw the card for Kioras -1
He also ticked up Ob Nixilis for +1 instead of +2 the whole game. Read the Planeswalkers mr. Green...
He also didn't lose the 2 life from The Chain Veil qhen his planeswalkers were killed by Jeremy.
He also played Rings of Brighthearth wrong...
Well Stevie, in the end of the day, we still like you. Read your cards though. rsrsrs
#TeamGreen
how he doubled the activation cost of the planeswalker instead of just the ability.
Ezuri is my favourite non-legendary to get with woodland bellower and Quirion Ranger is my favourite druid.
At 22:04 the trample damage still carried over. The only damage prevented is the toughness of the creature but the trample damage still goes through.
TheBlackdragon936 It doesn't have trample unless it has 10 or more +1/+1 counters.
Did it have trample, though? Xenagos does not grant trample.
in addition to the Ezuri target... Pretty sure that the Teferi that Justin put in his graveyard was Stephen's planeswalker... but highly entertaining video!
Can someone help me find the video where (I think Justin) plays the Bruna from Eldritch moon (the meld one) please?
Quick question; what is the command zone mat? Is it just a laminated piece of paper? I am looking at the starcity page and the vs 4 player mats are there, I was just curious what the command zone is. Thanks
(Jeremy) Yeah, it's just a laminated print out.
Watching these older videos and it's obvious that Kyle doesn't care about his job anymore. He used to put in little images to go with the references mentioned, and now he just does nothing.
guys come on this was..... hilarious I loved that Stephen got to have all the fun I want to see this again
Chain Veil works for Planeswalkers that enter after it is activated too. Stephen missed an extra GW ajani and W ajani activations at least
I liked the theme!!! Great job guys! Thank you!
That was a lot of fun, I'd love to see hidden roles return in future seasons! #teamsuarez
Everyone has noticed the "cheats" and misunderstandings that happened this game, but I can't focus on those knowing that just before the 1hour mark, Stephen decided to sacrifice his flying/vigilance/deathtouch/lifelink/proliferate commander instead of a 3/3 beast just to draw one more card. That's the sort of game decision that really grinds my gears.
this was a very enjoyable video to watch, keep it up!
This was an AWESOME Commander Versus Video. Whoever suggested it gets more praise than the spoiled cards from MM17.
1:23:57 swiftfoot boots stays on stonehoof chieftain because it was not removed from battlefield. Justin took control of creature when equipments equip is on stack and attaches to stonehoof chieftain but jeremy still has control of the equipment.
Aaron. Who else got that one?:)
I like these mystery theme decks. Can you do more of these?
That mirror match scenario was super bad. I'm really impressed with Justin's ability to have survived as the archenemy for so long even though going after him was unjustified when Stephen constantly needed to be weakened. Also good work on staying calm and enjoying the game, Justin. I know a lot of people who would have gotten salty in that situation.
where do we get those corgi sleeves? i have a mighty need
I associate my play style with Jeremy more than anything. When I look at the line up I see which one I would play and sure enough he's playing it. It helps that he's playing my favorite deck to.
Liked the video. Wanted to see Suarez accomplish it. Fun concept
Easily my favorite video of the season!!! :)
In a new season, I'd like to see everyone play the same commander but with different takes on the general. I think Kynaios and Tiro or Phelddagrif are generally the best for this.
so didn't jon kill the minds to save justin ...? @ 1:05:09
Enjoyed that, particularly Jon's deck, instead of doing something like Azami he really went out the park on that one. As a variant could you do something like a hidden goal PLUS hidden prohibition? So something that's limiting you achieving the goal deliberately?
35:00 You could have done 11 more damage if you untapped the devoted druid for mana to fuel two more overrun (it costs you the druid but would have killed Justin).
This challenge was a cool concept. Please fit this in again.
Hey guys! Great game! Just reminding you of my little idea I had for the season finale generals!
Justin: Meren
Jeremy: Damia
Jon: Breya
Stephen: Omnath, locus of rage
Thanks guys! Love the series!
The thing that Trophy Mage is holding is a pata, a kind of indian sword that was held sort of like a katar.
Will there be any future series where you guys take decklists from the community if so I have 2 lists on Tapped out for Kaalia and Animar (2 decks that havent been in Commander Vs since the very beginning YEARS ago) I would love to share :)
Made a mistake, When Justin Cackling Counterpart the second time, his token would have been a 16/16 not 8/8. Since the target was boosted by Xenagos before it was copied
Please do this secret goal thingy again. I personally looooove building decks with a goal in mind so it's awesome to see you guys do so too. ^.^
wasn't the minds dialation supposed to die when the ajani was cast
Please tell me Stephen had Deepglow skate in his planeswalker deck.
1:12:12 Forgot to draw off Soul trigger
Is the Commander VS Movie going to be a 4-way Oloro match, best of 5?
I really liked the secret goal and would really enjoy seeing more of those, because then it becomes about doing the thing your deck wants to do, instead of always politicking your way to the end. I think this episode really emphasized the flaws in this points system. Everyone knew that Justin had to die first for them to stay in the points race, so regardless of how weak he was, it was correct for players to attack him mercilessly. I think if anything I would like for there to be less points given out for placement. I seriously think the points system should be replaced somehow, be it everyone having their own goal, or forgoing a points system entirely. Some of the points seem arbitrary (first blood, casting commander 4 times) and encourage thing players should not have to care about in deck making.
john you can't search azuri with woodland behemoth since its a legendary creature.......
That was a ton of fun! Please do again.
This was the perfect opportunity for Justin to play a proper Marchesa or Nicol Bolas deck
My friend has a Dimir deck under Lazav that is similar to Justin's theme. He calls it "I don't like my deck, let me play yours." Lots of searching opponents' library for stuff and clone effects.
1:31:00
"nonlegendary". is that so hard to read?
Really loved the hidden roles. Maybe some sort of hidden traps for another time. When a player does something he loses a point but doesn't know it himself.
I love this theme. Please do this again!
Didn’t the second etherize take the zenagod
Off the battlefield? Or did I miss something
Twas a great idea, loved it....
FYI The Chain Veils second ability (4tap you may activate loyalty bla bla), can be used on planeswalkers not only you control after resolution, but ones you put on board after resolution too, e.g. the ajani the one turn.
Cheers!
I have an idea for an episode, and it would be amazing if you would try it. What it is, is to take the strongest of the box deck out of 4 of the commander sets and play them against each other To see which is the strongest..
personal preference mostly, and probably the ones who got their commanders banned from edh
+Happy The Cat so currently none of them? I don't believe there are any out of the box commanders that are banned
Oloro, Marath, and Derevi are banned from being commanders as of right now.
Happy The Cat are you talking about 1v1 commander... because that's a different rule set.
it could be cool, but I watch too many edh shows to enjoy another 2 hour video that ends with everyone getting ground out by precon2016 Breya again lol