A few notes: (1) at 5:43, it should be noted there’s only support for AV1 decoding-not encoding. This was in the script but I experienced a Freudian slip. (2) several take issue with my usage of “stupid” when referring to the average customer so let me rephrase: the average consumer is *ill-informed*-and the prior 13” MBP was mediocre hardware (sorry, it was) that served to prey on the lesser-informed that figured Pro > Air without really considering the differences.
Just plain wrong, 13" Macbook Pro M1/M2 has several advantages, for one, its battery life won't be ever reached by any Macbook. Design is also better looking, dimensions/weight are better than 14" model. I would prefer 13" Macbook pro M3. Now to get 16GB ram M3 you need 50% more money, than with M1/M2.
@@jutjub22Battery life is 2 hours less on the 13" vs 14" now and everything else you mentioned is subjective vs 14". The 13" was not a good VALUE upgrade over the Air
@@ABowlofWeetabix no, opposite, 14" has 15h wireless web, and 13" has 17h. I think the biggest issue price and RAM, now you need to pay almost 2000$ to get cheapest M3 with more than 8GB ram. M1/M2 you could get with 16GB ram for low as 1100-1300 (air/pro upgrades)
The base tier pro’s have almost always been “manager laptops” if you want to look pro but really don’t need one (and would be better of with an upgraded non-pro)
even 256 GB SSD is pretty sad for pro macbook at baseline. A Mac is not an iPhone, 256 is still ridiculously overkill for a phone but I see 1TB as a baseline for me on a mac. But I guess that means I must shell out an extra 100,000,000,000,000,000,000 to get the upgraded storage
@@voidmayonnaise Which is why I upgraded to 64GB Ram (sorry, 'unified memory') on my Mac Studio M1 Max... cuz I knew that anything less would make the machine feel really slow 5 years from now.
@@James-wn9qc that’s totally fine for you! I’ve been a tech enthusiast all my life, but more in the usage of technology rather than the production side of things, so this was a super awesome dive into the ‘why’s of the production chain that I like to see!
I’m not the demographic for this video. I heard words that sounded like English talking about products that I love telling to know something about them so that I don’t get duped. I’m going to get duped unless I rewatch this a few times.
10/10 explaining the TSMC chip processes. So many outlets get the N3** series mixed up. $1600 for 8GB ram and one external display support in a "Pro" machine is laughable though. One of your best videos yet!
Yeah the chip node explanation was perfectly executed, haven't seen ANYONE else talk about it - that's why Snazzy Labs is levels above other youtubers imho
The only thing I'm disappointed about is that they didn't raise the RAM for the base M3 MacBook Pro to 12GB or 16GB. $1599 is a great price reduction for the 14" form factor, but it turns into $1799 as soon as you upgrade the RAM to a more reasonable spec.
So I’ve been using the m1 ultra since dday for dev work. And I recently got a baseline air. My biggest worry was that MongoDB would kill my ram because on the Ultra it literally uses about 12 to 14 gb based on log size. I loaded it up on the m1. I was very pleasantly surprised. Yes the page file is there but in terms of performance barely felt the difference. I’m running at any one time 3 to 4 large vscode instances, Xcode and chrome and safari simultaneously as well as numerous db servers and node processes. Yes it eventually slows down when I run the iOS simulator but all in all for an 8gb machine in 90% of cases it runs just as well as the m1 ultra.
That's a great dig down on those new MacBooks! What I find the most disappointing is that the new $1600 14" M3 MacBook Pro comes with 8GB of RAM. A Pro device in 2023.
But this year they moved the base processor to “pro” laptops. For m2 pro with 16gb you can pay only 200 dollars more. I wonder what air will change. Or will it even exist
How can you say this?????? It's U. N. I. F. I. E. D. memory! It works so much better, like magic!!!!!! I am so excited to try my new M3 macbook pro arriving tomorrow at my house. Shame on Bill Gates and Linus Torvalds! Mac is just a million times better at everything than Lie-nux and Dwinde-dows. Jobs and Cook FTW!
The chip yield thing is very interesting! It seems like we’re squarely in the iterative regime of changes, where no one year is worth upgrading from last year, but the cascading changes are worth it if you’re a few generations back.
Honestly, it's been like that for the last decade already with the only real leap being the initial switch to Apple Silicon. Prior to that every iteration (PC or Mac) was small enough that it just generally wasn't worth upgrading any more often than once every 4 years or longer. Hell, I kept my mid 2012 classic MBP right up until January this year when the M2 16" MBP launched. I probably could have waited until this M3 launch to upgrade still, but I figured 10 years was good enough for a machine. Hoping my M2 Max 16" MBP can hold on just as long too!
@@HVDynamo My MBP is still a 2013 13" MBP, and with the M3, I think now I'm finally ready to upgrade. I will state that my MBP ISN'T my primary computer.
TSMC finally hit the wall hard just as their competitors have before them. One of Apple's biggest advantages was outspending everyone else to get on the best process ASAP (M1 was on 5nm 2 years ahead of AMD/Nvidia). They're still probably a year or two ahead, but the advantage is so small (maybe half a process) that it's less relevant than ever. Unfortunately this means the gains for most of the industry will be more boring than ever, until we hit an unexpected development somewhere...
Great video. One correction around the 5:45 mark. The new chips only do AV1 decode. No mention (presumably because it’s not there) of AV1 encode capability.
Yeah. And even then it’ll be a while before it’s actually utilized as things have to be updated. The UA-cam app still doesn’t stream video in AV1 on the 15 Pro/Pro Max.
I caught this as well, but are there any/many end use cases that do encode jobs in AV1 on device? I assumed that youtube does that processing for you when you upload.
@@MaslinMonty Livestreaming to UA-cam, but that’s about it rn. Twitch has yet to introduce AV1 support at all despite Amazon being a founding member of the consortium that developed AV1.
Quality, in-depth stuff. Appreciate it. Most of the typical YT reviews are merely repeating info I already knew, mostly from simply browsing the Apple online store. But not you, you dig out stuff I had no idea about. Excellent.
This is exactly why I love these videos. All the other videos go into the hype. Snazzy goes into the details that I want to know about. I was very happy to see a Snazzy video this morning. Keep up the good work!
@@Tonellacamyeah i still use intel too! Can’t wait to see m3 14” release because m1 14” is bloody expensive here. How come the price just fall not more than $300 since i added it to my cart even BEFORE m2 14” releases is beyond me 😂
The M1/2/3 base and Pro levels are already far more power and and battery life, with much less heat and fan noise, than any Intel Mac ever made. I “only” upgraded from Intel to an M1 Pro, but that improvement is still working so well that I don’t need to upgrade to M3 yet, and I don’t need a Max. The people who need the Max chip are those whose software genuinely needs more CPU and GPU cores or a very high amount of Unified Memory, because those are the improvements. The single core score of a Max or Ultra is not really higher than a base or Pro, so do not upgrade thinking the machine is always faster. The Max and Ultra are only faster if you do a high amount of parallel processing (e.g., 3D and video editing) that can be distributed across more cores.
Interesting info about the 3nm process node roadmap. The 256GB remaining in the iMac for base AND mid tier really hurts. The specs per dollar does seem like the worst value in the entire M3 range. Which is sad because my 2011 iMac is nearing retirement.
I'll be replacing a late 2015 i7/16GB/2TB. M3 is $2500, and $400 of that is the 2TB vs 1TB SSD, which I'll pay, but most people probably wouldn't. The 2015 was at least that much, 2.5" smaller screen, fusion vs SSD, and I'll be happy to not have the fan. Given the inflation over the last 6-7 years, seems like a pretty OK value to me. I could build a PC for about 2/3 the price, but then I'd have to deal with Windows, and the M3's GPU is probably enough for WoW.
I am about to buy my first macbook. Will the battery of the M3 Pro last longer than the M3 Max during normal usage like browsing with 15-20 tabs, while listening to music?
This is high quality content. I’ve watched 2 videos prior to this about the new M3 chips, but they were really just repeating what we saw on the keynote.
Thank goodness he mentioned the memory fiasco. I felt like the only one. It’s the reason I’m waiting because the Pro version doesn’t offer the 32GB I was about to buy just a week ago when I decided to wait.
I was really bummed when I saw that it didn't support AV1 encoding. Decode is nice, and if Final Cut Pro gets updated to support playback and editing of AV1 files, it might be a nice-to-have. BUT, it's not enough for me to upgrade from M2 Max just yet.
@@definingslawek4731 hahaha that’s fair reasoning 😂 I got my current MacBook “open box” from a retailer for a pretty good price, and it’s been great so far. AV1 was the only thing that I wanted to upgrade for, as I don’t want more CPU or GPU power, and with my workload, I won’t NEED either of those for a long while. But AV1 support would’ve reduced file sizes just that little bit more over HEVC. But you’re right! I’m fine waiting for M4 I guess 😂
This upgrade appears to only be for those that work in the realm of video production or want to experiment in gaming on the Mac. For the rest of us "normies", the best value proposition will be a certified refurbished M2 Macbook Pro in just a couple of months. Based on all of the great information from the TSMC process, I think I can I would wait until the M4 chips if I needed to live life closer to the bleeding edge and already had an M2 based Mac.
Putting the base M3 in a 14" chassis feels like overkill. All that weight and thickness for a chip that can be passively cooled in the MBA doesn't seem like a good buy unless you have to have a 120hz screen.
The screen is better in more ways than that. Also, it has a better array of ports and much better battery life (although these days all the MacBooks have great battery life). The M3 is PLENTY fast enough for almost everyone. There's is no logical reason why you couldn't value all the benefits without needing more than M3 power.
@@jacobrichter I can understand needing the ports, But $1600 for a laptop with 8gb of RAM and a chip that will be in the $1100 MBA is still a hard pill to swallow.
@@nathanross4036 That's certainly true. I'm mostly saying that it makes a lot more sense than the 13" MBP, that basically only had the advantage of more battery life compared to the MBA.
But it cannot be passively cooled in the MBA. 1st of all, there is no M3 MBA yet, but 2ndly, MBAs DO reach the max temperatures and slow down. Sure, they could have gone with a smaller chassis and just one fan, but it probably was not worth machine setup/engineering/validation to create a whole new SKU.
As excited as I was when the M1 Macs arrived, I decided to hold off upgrading from my older MacBook, knowing that they'd only get better after the 1st generation Apple silicone. With the introduction of the 3nm processors, I was finally convinced to flip-the-switch and upgrade! That is until you pointed out the "B" and "E" differences. I'll now wait with anticipation for your verdict. Hope it doesn't break your bank! Show less
seriously you always have the most interesting and comprehensive take when it comes to new releases, everything i need to know and almost nothing that should be blatantly obvious. Thanks!
I actually bought an M2 Max Macbook Pro back in March... I was originally going to wait until Xmas before buying, and I wish I did now LOL... Anyway thanks Snazzy Labs for the in-depth video especially talking about the specific chip yield they are using for M3, I haven't seen any others talk about this! Now not as bothered about getting my M2 Max MBP earlier this year :)
Love it! - Wow, you got this one out fast! Thanks for a down to earth explanation of what Apple's new line up means, without the Apple marketing spin. I'm guessing they never sent you some snacks...
Massive kudos to going into the TSMC story here. Most UA-camrs stick to "3nm is better than 4" and are utterly surprised by the implications of the node. You really do your homework.
When discussing prices, I think we should all consider 16GB of memory and 512 of storage as the effective base model. Yes the lower spec models perform well for most things, but they page memory aggressively and with such a small SSD it will wear out quickly. It wouldn’t be terrible, but a soldered SSD means it bricks the whole system.
realistically 1 terabyte is the minimum viable storage, especially when this is the one laptop where you will never ever be able to have more. The OS itself and various non user files take up roughly 150-200gb (Windows laptops have replacable drives and often even second slots so you could for the price of 256 - 512 get 2tb extra in your laptop) Re: bricking the system from worn out ssd. This is even worse than it seems cause a repair shop could actually replace that ssd and resolder it but the BIOS is held on ssd now instead of on a seperate bios chip meaning you can't for example run the computer from an external drive, nor replace the internal drive.
@@definingslawek4731 IMO, 512 is plenty for most users. I've had my MBP for just over a year and I am using 235 GB of storage. I don't use it heavily, I have a desktop for that, but I do use it a lot. I suppose if you plan on running creative or professional software on it (other than office), 1TB makes a lot of sense. But despite Apple's target demographic, that isn't most people buying these things.
As I order my new M3 Mac, I struggle with this question: Do I need a powerful Mac (high-end chip, plenty of RAM) so that I can harness the strength of AI…or is it the opposite in that AI will be cloud-based and I actually need less “horsepower” beneath my wrists? Thank you
Exactly what I’m thinking. I would love to use stable diffusion locally to feed it to learn specific things and imagery I need for our brand. And, budget for hosted server time is zero. Adobe Firefly is neat, but no way to train it at all. I wonder…
I don't feel that disappointed getting my M2 Pro 16" a few months ago, plus I genuinely prefer the Space Grey colour - and it seems like compared to the M3 Pro there's going to be a very small bump in CPU Performance which is more what I need for my workflow than GPU. The M3 Max looks quite promising, but at that price point I'm gonna wait 3 years or so before upgrading.
I will probably never buy a MacBook again, I refuse to get punk'ed by Apple's RAM & Storage prices. My M1 Max 16" spec equivalent is now 4250€, from 3680€ in 2021.
They don't want you to buy the M3 series if you don't need to, or won't get scammed into buying a base model M3 with 8GB of RAM. The M1 Pro/16GB are great options, as well as the M2 Pro/16GB! No need to buy the M3.
@@gs7828 Don't worry I wasn't even tempted as soon as I realised AV1 encode is *still* not a thing with the M3, also Thunderbolt 5 is going to be a thing very soon.
5:00 the configurator did the same thing last year. If you clicked on an increase in RAM or processor, it would also change the other but only tell the price increase of the first.
Exactly. Tim Cook’s Apple always seems to disappoint. Long release times on rehashed products. It will take literally another 10 years if a 27 inch iMac ever happens.
I love hearing these US prices, knowing that when the product arrives in Europe, it will be at least 30% more expensive. It cost $2000 to buy a 256GB/16GB M2 13" Air when it launched... Instead of about $1300
Well most of the 30% is our VAT that by custom is already shown in EU and not shown in US. Noone in US paid 1300$ for that MBA as well, they just do not present it outwards.
@@khoanguyen0001 cool, no VAT, sales tax varies over states, which is probably the reason why it is a custom to show these prices without tax. Although I am surprised to see that some states have none at all. But truth of the matter is that the price difference dictated by Apple is not that big as it seems, simply because the VAT in EU is somewhere around 20%. We have 21.
For EU the base model will be around 2069 € and 16GB will be 2299 €. Wanted to see like 1700 for base model with 16gb. It's approx 2200 usd for base and 2400 for 16gb
@@christeder Well, I bought my 16/256 because I don't need much space, aside from enough memory for compiling a few apps on Apple Silicon for MacOS. And I think the exact price when I bought it was about $1950...? I'm not 100% certain due to fluctuations of currencies and their exchange rates, so it varies across different countries that haven't adopted Euro as their currency.
This continues to blow my mind on how little i understand about business. How many aspects there are to making chips, marketing and pricing. Thank you for showing how or why things are the way they are while still sharing great information about new technology
JIT compilers and methods have been around since the 90's in the amiga days. Its pretty much what coders used to make cool 3d effects that basically was never planned to be possible.
Err, No. The shaders are still compiled beforehand in exactly the same way as all other GPU's. It's just that the memory allocation is done on a what's needed basis via hardware vs a software worst case scenario. Essentially at the deepest level any shader programs memory requirement defined by the compiler in software at compile time are ignored and the hardware decides instead. That's why no changes are required to any programs to run. In summary JIT hardware memory allocation is a completely different animal to JIT compiled software.
Thanks for the content quinn! Clear and concise, critical without being rude, and contextualizing parts of the industry and how they work together. Truly a great video.
Does the M3 supports now more than 1 external monitor? And what about daisy- chaining monitors over USB-C ? This absence of daisy chaining support prevents me from setting up dual monitor universal workspaces for our users using macs, linux and windows laptops: the mac users only can use a single monitor as no daisy chaining is supported.
I appreciate the fact that you are a fan of Apple, but are still able to point out things they do that are irksome/uncool. Some Apple tech UA-camrs can't do that; it is all sunshine and roses all the time, every time.
5:25 they pulled an iPhone 15 Pro Max on us this year with the MacBook Pro. Eliminated the 512gb base storage model leaving only the 1tb model at its full price, rather than keeping the same price and bumping base storage.
It really depends on what you're upgrading from when looking at this device to purchase. To answer your other question, it's probably safe to say that the N3E version will be around a 20% increase from the M3 lineup since Apple sorta nerfed it.
@AlfaMedtech I'm not 100% certain. I heard someone's theory about N3E coming out for the M3 MBA devices since they have no fans to cool them, but we'd have to see if that truly happens or not. If it did happen, then probably spring of 2024, but if not, then, I'd say, around this time next year in 2024 for the M4.
I guess we just have to wait for real benchmarks. Since a lot of the “improvements “ sounds like a downgrade in certain models. Unless you go for the best of the best, compare to the M2 chip
I suspect you're misunderstanding Dynamic Caching. Given what they said about "local memory" or "on-chip memory" and it being allocated at compile-time, I suspect it has nothing with VRAM/Unified Memory to do, but rather with the on-GPU, per-execution-unit memory, or the same thing that nVidia calls "shared memory" and AMD calls "local data store". VRAM is usually *not* allocated at compile-time, but local memory demands is usually stated by the compiled shaders. That would also make more sense given that they speak of Dynamic Caching improving GPU utilization. Allocating VRAM in one way or another wouldn't be expected to affect utilization, but being able to dynamically allocate local memory would, since that could squeeze more threads into the same execution unit.
so is the usb c version on the imac worse then the mbp? If so how much? Thought that would be a higher thunderbolt version? Also did the other models let you choose higher speed nic?
About these monitor limitations, does it mean a M3Pro Macbook can't support three 1080p displays or are the listed limitations just another way of explaining bandwidth?
Hardware Limitations unfortunately. M(x) = 1 internal, one external M(x) Pro = 2 M chips slapped together, so 1x internal, 2x external M(x) Max = 2 M Pro chips slapped together, so 1x internal, 4x external.
So should we wait if we can for the N3P/X? I'm still on an Intel MBP but it's still chugging along. I could wait another year if the gains will be massive
I also have an Intel MBP laptop and I'm waiting for the M4 lineup now personally. It will at least have the N3E node in it at the least but possibly the N3P node if we're lucky. The N3P is supposed to be in production in the second half of 2024.
A few notes: (1) at 5:43, it should be noted there’s only support for AV1 decoding-not encoding. This was in the script but I experienced a Freudian slip. (2) several take issue with my usage of “stupid” when referring to the average customer so let me rephrase: the average consumer is *ill-informed*-and the prior 13” MBP was mediocre hardware (sorry, it was) that served to prey on the lesser-informed that figured Pro > Air without really considering the differences.
Just plain wrong, 13" Macbook Pro M1/M2 has several advantages, for one, its battery life won't be ever reached by any Macbook. Design is also better looking, dimensions/weight are better than 14" model. I would prefer 13" Macbook pro M3. Now to get 16GB ram M3 you need 50% more money, than with M1/M2.
@@jutjub22Battery life is 2 hours less on the 13" vs 14" now and everything else you mentioned is subjective vs 14". The 13" was not a good VALUE upgrade over the Air
@@ABowlofWeetabix no, opposite, 14" has 15h wireless web, and 13" has 17h. I think the biggest issue price and RAM, now you need to pay almost 2000$ to get cheapest M3 with more than 8GB ram. M1/M2 you could get with 16GB ram for low as 1100-1300 (air/pro upgrades)
Nah, that was quite correct - no need to redact it. The 'average consumer' is pretty stupid.
The base tier pro’s have almost always been “manager laptops” if you want to look pro but really don’t need one (and would be better of with an upgraded non-pro)
8GB as lowest RAM Tier in an "Pro" notebook - that has to end!
When I bought my first MBP, the lowest tier was 8GB/128GB. 8 years later, only SSD doubled up. It's embarrassing given the RAM price right now.
You can get a $109 phone with 8gb of RAM, it's ridiculous!
Yes, and to get cheapest 16GB M3 you need almost 2000$, M1/M2 with 16GB ram was possible to get from 1100-1200$ or so.
even 256 GB SSD is pretty sad for pro macbook at baseline. A Mac is not an iPhone, 256 is still ridiculously overkill for a phone but I see 1TB as a baseline for me on a mac. But I guess that means I must shell out an extra 100,000,000,000,000,000,000 to get the upgraded storage
@@voidmayonnaise Which is why I upgraded to 64GB Ram (sorry, 'unified memory') on my Mac Studio M1 Max... cuz I knew that anything less would make the machine feel really slow 5 years from now.
This is the kind of in-depth but not TOO technically explained type of content that we're looking for! Great job Quinn & crew!
i know gamers nexus has a habit of going SUUPER deep
Gonna be honest he lost me 80 seconds in
@@James-wn9qc that’s totally fine for you! I’ve been a tech enthusiast all my life, but more in the usage of technology rather than the production side of things, so this was a super awesome dive into the ‘why’s of the production chain that I like to see!
I agree! This is some of what Quinn does best.
I’m not the demographic for this video. I heard words that sounded like English talking about products that I love telling to know something about them so that I don’t get duped. I’m going to get duped unless I rewatch this a few times.
10/10 explaining the TSMC chip processes. So many outlets get the N3** series mixed up.
$1600 for 8GB ram and one external display support in a "Pro" machine is laughable though.
One of your best videos yet!
Yeah the chip node explanation was perfectly executed, haven't seen ANYONE else talk about it - that's why Snazzy Labs is levels above other youtubers imho
Computers at Walmart have more ram at that price tag.
@@hereweare9011 at half price with nvidia gpus...
Great breakdown of all the extras
The only thing I'm disappointed about is that they didn't raise the RAM for the base M3 MacBook Pro to 12GB or 16GB. $1599 is a great price reduction for the 14" form factor, but it turns into $1799 as soon as you upgrade the RAM to a more reasonable spec.
Now add tax and you're approaching $2,000
So I’ve been using the m1 ultra since dday for dev work. And I recently got a baseline air. My biggest worry was that MongoDB would kill my ram because on the Ultra it literally uses about 12 to 14 gb based on log size. I loaded it up on the m1. I was very pleasantly surprised. Yes the page file is there but in terms of performance barely felt the difference. I’m running at any one time 3 to 4 large vscode instances, Xcode and chrome and safari simultaneously as well as numerous db servers and node processes. Yes it eventually slows down when I run the iOS simulator but all in all for an 8gb machine in 90% of cases it runs just as well as the m1 ultra.
$600 to upgrade the base model iMac to 16GB RAM & 1TB storage. It's a joke.
The 14" M1 pro dropped to $1599 within like a month of launch with 16gb ram and 512gb ssd
@@Jst4vdeos there's nothing Pro about Xbox series S storage capacity
This is the content we love. Thanks for the TSMC breakdown. It all makes a lot of sense when you look at it from that lens.
That's a great dig down on those new MacBooks!
What I find the most disappointing is that the new $1600 14" M3 MacBook Pro comes with 8GB of RAM. A Pro device in 2023.
But this year they moved the base processor to “pro” laptops. For m2 pro with 16gb you can pay only 200 dollars more. I wonder what air will change. Or will it even exist
I think the air will still remain. People use it for light tasks and it is easier to carry.
How can you say this?????? It's U. N. I. F. I. E. D. memory! It works so much better, like magic!!!!!! I am so excited to try my new M3 macbook pro arriving tomorrow at my house. Shame on Bill Gates and Linus Torvalds! Mac is just a million times better at everything than Lie-nux and Dwinde-dows. Jobs and Cook FTW!
05:43 - Only AV1 decode, not encode, as far as I know.
The chip yield thing is very interesting! It seems like we’re squarely in the iterative regime of changes, where no one year is worth upgrading from last year, but the cascading changes are worth it if you’re a few generations back.
Honestly, it's been like that for the last decade already with the only real leap being the initial switch to Apple Silicon. Prior to that every iteration (PC or Mac) was small enough that it just generally wasn't worth upgrading any more often than once every 4 years or longer. Hell, I kept my mid 2012 classic MBP right up until January this year when the M2 16" MBP launched. I probably could have waited until this M3 launch to upgrade still, but I figured 10 years was good enough for a machine. Hoping my M2 Max 16" MBP can hold on just as long too!
@@HVDynamo My MBP is still a 2013 13" MBP, and with the M3, I think now I'm finally ready to upgrade. I will state that my MBP ISN'T my primary computer.
and also, it is like that with iphones for a decade too.. which is basically the same thing regarding the silicon and power improvements
TSMC finally hit the wall hard just as their competitors have before them. One of Apple's biggest advantages was outspending everyone else to get on the best process ASAP (M1 was on 5nm 2 years ahead of AMD/Nvidia). They're still probably a year or two ahead, but the advantage is so small (maybe half a process) that it's less relevant than ever. Unfortunately this means the gains for most of the industry will be more boring than ever, until we hit an unexpected development somewhere...
@@cordlc yeah sad...3nm or 2nm is here to stay for 6 yrs. no 1/4nm in 10 years...
Great video.
One correction around the 5:45 mark. The new chips only do AV1 decode. No mention (presumably because it’s not there) of AV1 encode capability.
Yeah. And even then it’ll be a while before it’s actually utilized as things have to be updated. The UA-cam app still doesn’t stream video in AV1 on the 15 Pro/Pro Max.
I caught this as well, but are there any/many end use cases that do encode jobs in AV1 on device? I assumed that youtube does that processing for you when you upload.
@@MaslinMonty You would probably want to upload in AV1 format?
@@MaslinMonty Livestreaming to UA-cam, but that’s about it rn. Twitch has yet to introduce AV1 support at all despite Amazon being a founding member of the consortium that developed AV1.
@@MysteryMii Apple is also a member of the consortium and they’re the last major hardware vendor to add support.
Quality, in-depth stuff. Appreciate it. Most of the typical YT reviews are merely repeating info I already knew, mostly from simply browsing the Apple online store. But not you, you dig out stuff I had no idea about. Excellent.
This is exactly why I love these videos. All the other videos go into the hype. Snazzy goes into the details that I want to know about. I was very happy to see a Snazzy video this morning. Keep up the good work!
I’m still stuck on an old intel chip. Would it be worth it to just upgrade to the M3 Max?
I went from intel to and M1 Max and it was a crazy difference so I imagine intel to m3 max would be a crazy life changing experience
@@Tonellacamyeah i still use intel too! Can’t wait to see m3 14” release because m1 14” is bloody expensive here. How come the price just fall not more than $300 since i added it to my cart even BEFORE m2 14” releases is beyond me 😂
@@nhs.14 I bought a refurbished M1 Max and got a great deal on it and honestly I would of never known it was a refurbished one !
The M1/2/3 base and Pro levels are already far more power and and battery life, with much less heat and fan noise, than any Intel Mac ever made. I “only” upgraded from Intel to an M1 Pro, but that improvement is still working so well that I don’t need to upgrade to M3 yet, and I don’t need a Max.
The people who need the Max chip are those whose software genuinely needs more CPU and GPU cores or a very high amount of Unified Memory, because those are the improvements. The single core score of a Max or Ultra is not really higher than a base or Pro, so do not upgrade thinking the machine is always faster. The Max and Ultra are only faster if you do a high amount of parallel processing (e.g., 3D and video editing) that can be distributed across more cores.
Interesting info about the 3nm process node roadmap. The 256GB remaining in the iMac for base AND mid tier really hurts. The specs per dollar does seem like the worst value in the entire M3 range. Which is sad because my 2011 iMac is nearing retirement.
Get a mini pc with 64GB and 1TB for a lot less lol
@@chromaticvisuelle this...and soooo faast stil..literally half price...
I'll be replacing a late 2015 i7/16GB/2TB. M3 is $2500, and $400 of that is the 2TB vs 1TB SSD, which I'll pay, but most people probably wouldn't. The 2015 was at least that much, 2.5" smaller screen, fusion vs SSD, and I'll be happy to not have the fan. Given the inflation over the last 6-7 years, seems like a pretty OK value to me. I could build a PC for about 2/3 the price, but then I'd have to deal with Windows, and the M3's GPU is probably enough for WoW.
I am about to buy my first macbook. Will the battery of the M3 Pro last longer than the M3 Max during normal usage like browsing with 15-20 tabs, while listening to music?
Lol did you tell an A.I. to turn Tim Cook into Frankenstein? 😂
This is high quality content. I’ve watched 2 videos prior to this about the new M3 chips, but they were really just repeating what we saw on the keynote.
Thank goodness he mentioned the memory fiasco. I felt like the only one. It’s the reason I’m waiting because the Pro version doesn’t offer the 32GB I was about to buy just a week ago when I decided to wait.
I was really bummed when I saw that it didn't support AV1 encoding. Decode is nice, and if Final Cut Pro gets updated to support playback and editing of AV1 files, it might be a nice-to-have. BUT, it's not enough for me to upgrade from M2 Max just yet.
You're bummed out you don't have a reason to drop another 4 thousand dollars within a year? I'd be pretty happy :p
@@definingslawek4731 hahaha that’s fair reasoning 😂 I got my current MacBook “open box” from a retailer for a pretty good price, and it’s been great so far. AV1 was the only thing that I wanted to upgrade for, as I don’t want more CPU or GPU power, and with my workload, I won’t NEED either of those for a long while. But AV1 support would’ve reduced file sizes just that little bit more over HEVC. But you’re right! I’m fine waiting for M4 I guess 😂
As always, the most informative recap
Much appreciated!
This is the first snazzy labs video in a while that actually showed up on my recommended. I watch them all regardless.
Love the amount of detail you put in your videos! Thank you for always being so thorough
Finally someone properly explaining the TSMC backstory. No other reviewer does the homework, they just parrot whatever Mark Gurman tweets that day.
This upgrade appears to only be for those that work in the realm of video production or want to experiment in gaming on the Mac. For the rest of us "normies", the best value proposition will be a certified refurbished M2 Macbook Pro in just a couple of months. Based on all of the great information from the TSMC process, I think I can I would wait until the M4 chips if I needed to live life closer to the bleeding edge and already had an M2 based Mac.
I was waiting for this video. Snazzy loves Apple so much, he's willing to be critical.
The fact that the entire event was filmed on iPhone 15 Pro Max is mind blowing! 🔥
Is the M3 Max review coming?
Putting the base M3 in a 14" chassis feels like overkill. All that weight and thickness for a chip that can be passively cooled in the MBA doesn't seem like a good buy unless you have to have a 120hz screen.
The screen is better in more ways than that. Also, it has a better array of ports and much better battery life (although these days all the MacBooks have great battery life).
The M3 is PLENTY fast enough for almost everyone. There's is no logical reason why you couldn't value all the benefits without needing more than M3 power.
@@jacobrichter I can understand needing the ports, But $1600 for a laptop with 8gb of RAM and a chip that will be in the $1100 MBA is still a hard pill to swallow.
@@nathanross4036 That's certainly true. I'm mostly saying that it makes a lot more sense than the 13" MBP, that basically only had the advantage of more battery life compared to the MBA.
But it cannot be passively cooled in the MBA. 1st of all, there is no M3 MBA yet, but 2ndly, MBAs DO reach the max temperatures and slow down.
Sure, they could have gone with a smaller chassis and just one fan, but it probably was not worth machine setup/engineering/validation to create a whole new SKU.
But, but, but we have to render our 8K Canon Raw footage on that M3 and not melt down the chassis! ;)
How did I not know about this channel? Love the extra level of detail and unique insights here.
Cheers, and welcome!
As excited as I was when the M1 Macs arrived, I decided to hold off upgrading from my older MacBook, knowing that they'd only get better after the 1st generation Apple silicone. With the introduction of the 3nm processors, I was finally convinced to flip-the-switch and upgrade! That is until you pointed out the "B" and "E" differences. I'll now wait with anticipation for your verdict. Hope it doesn't break your bank!
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You do know that it will never be the case that there isn’t something better coming in just a few months
seriously you always have the most interesting and comprehensive take when it comes to new releases, everything i need to know and almost nothing that should be blatantly obvious. Thanks!
I actually bought an M2 Max Macbook Pro back in March... I was originally going to wait until Xmas before buying, and I wish I did now LOL... Anyway thanks Snazzy Labs for the in-depth video especially talking about the specific chip yield they are using for M3, I haven't seen any others talk about this! Now not as bothered about getting my M2 Max MBP earlier this year :)
Trust me our m2 max’s our still pretty freaking good !!
I really love the Quality and Look of your Videos. Do you mind sharing what camera and lens you use?
Love it! - Wow, you got this one out fast! Thanks for a down to earth explanation of what Apple's new line up means, without the Apple marketing spin. I'm guessing they never sent you some snacks...
Massive kudos to going into the TSMC story here. Most UA-camrs stick to "3nm is better than 4" and are utterly surprised by the implications of the node. You really do your homework.
how can you keep consistent a gem of a channel for more than 10 years snazzy, im perplexed
Aw thanks man
Really enjoyed your little dive into process nodes and their implication. Straight to the point, factually correct and easy to understand. 👍
When discussing prices, I think we should all consider 16GB of memory and 512 of storage as the effective base model. Yes the lower spec models perform well for most things, but they page memory aggressively and with such a small SSD it will wear out quickly. It wouldn’t be terrible, but a soldered SSD means it bricks the whole system.
realistically 1 terabyte is the minimum viable storage, especially when this is the one laptop where you will never ever be able to have more. The OS itself and various non user files take up roughly 150-200gb (Windows laptops have replacable drives and often even second slots so you could for the price of 256 - 512 get 2tb extra in your laptop)
Re: bricking the system from worn out ssd. This is even worse than it seems cause a repair shop could actually replace that ssd and resolder it but the BIOS is held on ssd now instead of on a seperate bios chip meaning you can't for example run the computer from an external drive, nor replace the internal drive.
@@definingslawek4731 IMO, 512 is plenty for most users. I've had my MBP for just over a year and I am using 235 GB of storage. I don't use it heavily, I have a desktop for that, but I do use it a lot.
I suppose if you plan on running creative or professional software on it (other than office), 1TB makes a lot of sense. But despite Apple's target demographic, that isn't most people buying these things.
6:51 Wait, that's not the listed price at Apple for a 128GB RAM M3 Max 14 Pro....it is $4699 USD. How did you swing that pricing?
Best recap as always, Well done Quinn 👍
As I order my new M3 Mac, I struggle with this question: Do I need a powerful Mac (high-end chip, plenty of RAM) so that I can harness the strength of AI…or is it the opposite in that AI will be cloud-based and I actually need less “horsepower” beneath my wrists? Thank you
Exactly what I’m thinking. I would love to use stable diffusion locally to feed it to learn specific things and imagery I need for our brand. And, budget for hosted server time is zero. Adobe Firefly is neat, but no way to train it at all. I wonder…
I don't feel that disappointed getting my M2 Pro 16" a few months ago, plus I genuinely prefer the Space Grey colour - and it seems like compared to the M3 Pro there's going to be a very small bump in CPU Performance which is more what I need for my workflow than GPU. The M3 Max looks quite promising, but at that price point I'm gonna wait 3 years or so before upgrading.
Hi. Which one is more powerful and faster, the MacBook Pro M3 Max or the Mac Studio M2 Ultra?
I will probably never buy a MacBook again, I refuse to get punk'ed by Apple's RAM & Storage prices. My M1 Max 16" spec equivalent is now 4250€, from 3680€ in 2021.
They don't want you to buy the M3 series if you don't need to, or won't get scammed into buying a base model M3 with 8GB of RAM. The M1 Pro/16GB are great options, as well as the M2 Pro/16GB! No need to buy the M3.
@@gs7828 Don't worry I wasn't even tempted as soon as I realised AV1 encode is *still* not a thing with the M3, also Thunderbolt 5 is going to be a thing very soon.
5:45 Small correction - they only support AV1 DEcoding, not encoding (even says so on the slide you are showing)
I currently have a 2016 MacBook Pro and its about time i upgraded. I am currently unsure if i should go for an M3 or an older model. Any thoughts?
it's a crime to sell a 8GB RAM on $1600 laptop especially in 2023-2024😂
Especially one that had 16gb base last year and is marketed as a pro laptop
The Apple Store lists the m3 max as “up to 400gbps” memory, compared to the flat “400gbps” on the m2 max. Can you say why the “up to”?
Frankenstein's monster*
Bet you are fun at parties
5:00 the configurator did the same thing last year. If you clicked on an increase in RAM or processor, it would also change the other but only tell the price increase of the first.
I only ask for one thing: Give me a god damn 27" Imac.
I have a 27 inch studio display and love it ! I connect my m2 max to it and chef kiss !!
Exactly. Tim Cook’s Apple always seems to disappoint. Long release times on rehashed products. It will take literally another 10 years if a 27 inch iMac ever happens.
Are we going to get MBA 15” with m3 chip? When?
Guess as soon as N3E process (and apple) is ready - guess until summer 2024.
I love hearing these US prices, knowing that when the product arrives in Europe, it will be at least 30% more expensive.
It cost $2000 to buy a 256GB/16GB M2 13" Air when it launched... Instead of about $1300
Well most of the 30% is our VAT that by custom is already shown in EU and not shown in US. Noone in US paid 1300$ for that MBA as well, they just do not present it outwards.
@@Alwarin1
There are 5 U.S. states that don’t have a sales tax, including Oregon. There’s no VAT in the U.S.
@@khoanguyen0001 cool, no VAT, sales tax varies over states, which is probably the reason why it is a custom to show these prices without tax. Although I am surprised to see that some states have none at all.
But truth of the matter is that the price difference dictated by Apple is not that big as it seems, simply because the VAT in EU is somewhere around 20%. We have 21.
For EU the base model will be around 2069 € and 16GB will be 2299 €. Wanted to see like 1700 for base model with 16gb. It's approx 2200 usd for base and 2400 for 16gb
@@christeder Well, I bought my 16/256 because I don't need much space, aside from enough memory for compiling a few apps on Apple Silicon for MacOS.
And I think the exact price when I bought it was about $1950...? I'm not 100% certain due to fluctuations of currencies and their exchange rates, so it varies across different countries that haven't adopted Euro as their currency.
This continues to blow my mind on how little i understand about business. How many aspects there are to making chips, marketing and pricing. Thank you for showing how or why things are the way they are while still sharing great information about new technology
8 gb is unacceptable and non upgradable ssd overshadows carbon neutrality lmfao 2tb Samsung ssd is 100 usd
Agree
Thank you for the look into TSMC current and upcoming nodes, that was very interesting
JIT compilers and methods have been around since the 90's in the amiga days. Its pretty much what coders used to make cool 3d effects that basically was never planned to be possible.
Err, No. The shaders are still compiled beforehand in exactly the same way as all other GPU's. It's just that the memory allocation is done on a what's needed basis via hardware vs a software worst case scenario. Essentially at the deepest level any shader programs memory requirement defined by the compiler in software at compile time are ignored and the hardware decides instead. That's why no changes are required to any programs to run. In summary JIT hardware memory allocation is a completely different animal to JIT compiled software.
Actually, JIT was being used even before then by the Japanese.
11:45 could that also because of the low yields?
downvote for Frankenstein's monster.......
What’s the best value MacBook right now (M2 or M3) which can drive two external monitors?
10Gbps usb 3.1 is slow? When usb 2 is still being put on products? 🤔
This is such an intelligent video. Thank you for continuing to differentiate yourself with your exceptional takes on the industry.
Thanks for the content quinn! Clear and concise, critical without being rude, and contextualizing parts of the industry and how they work together. Truly a great video.
You’re like a happy, drunk, Irish Santa. Outstanding!
If the Mac Studio is updated to an M3 Max chip in 2024 will it be worth buying?
A14 was not a year old when M1 arrived, it was introduced 2 months earlier at the iPhone 12 event.
Only snazzy makes videos where we come to know what’s really important
I think the A14 and 5nm process were also brandnew when the m1 launched. Only the m2 was a bit delayed.
Commenting just for the algorithm! You've been putting out some really awesome stuff lately and I hope you start seeing the line go up!
Does the M3 supports now more than 1 external monitor?
And what about daisy- chaining monitors over USB-C ?
This absence of daisy chaining support prevents me from setting up dual monitor universal workspaces for our users using macs, linux and windows laptops: the mac users only can use a single monitor as no daisy chaining is supported.
Love the comments on process node likely affecting pricing and availability. Great work
Only AV1 decoding and no encoding? So you cant streaming from MacBook in AV1... SADGE
Appreciate your technical insight sir. Especially the relation between manufacturing, product and performance.
Just bought a 14" M2 pro in August, is the M3 pro worth upgrading?
As always, the best video I’ve seen on this topic. Keep it up SnazzyLabs team!
I really appreciate this nuanced and detailed explainer as to what's happening behind the scenes of the M3 upgrade
Best M3 video on UA-cam. Thanks
Excited to watch this one
Thanks Jacklyn! 🙏
Thanks for walking us through this.
Very cool deep dive containing details u need to know before going even more deeper. Thx a lot!
I purchased my first ever, Mac and M3 max excited to join the Apple family
Welcome! I joined with an M1 MBA 2y ago and it's still great. The thing I needed some time to get used to is the different keyboard layout.
I appreciate the fact that you are a fan of Apple, but are still able to point out things they do that are irksome/uncool. Some Apple tech UA-camrs can't do that; it is all sunshine and roses all the time, every time.
5:25 they pulled an iPhone 15 Pro Max on us this year with the MacBook Pro. Eliminated the 512gb base storage model leaving only the 1tb model at its full price, rather than keeping the same price and bumping base storage.
So is this a good upgrade or the performance on the 3e will be massive compared to the 3b and worth the wait ?
It really depends on what you're upgrading from when looking at this device to purchase. To answer your other question, it's probably safe to say that the N3E version will be around a 20% increase from the M3 lineup since Apple sorta nerfed it.
@@fitzman7 will that be expected in March of 2024 for the N3e or we are looking into October ?
@AlfaMedtech I'm not 100% certain. I heard someone's theory about N3E coming out for the M3 MBA devices since they have no fans to cool them, but we'd have to see if that truly happens or not. If it did happen, then probably spring of 2024, but if not, then, I'd say, around this time next year in 2024 for the M4.
I guess we just have to wait for real benchmarks.
Since a lot of the “improvements “ sounds like a downgrade in certain models. Unless you go for the best of the best, compare to the M2 chip
I suspect you're misunderstanding Dynamic Caching. Given what they said about "local memory" or "on-chip memory" and it being allocated at compile-time, I suspect it has nothing with VRAM/Unified Memory to do, but rather with the on-GPU, per-execution-unit memory, or the same thing that nVidia calls "shared memory" and AMD calls "local data store". VRAM is usually *not* allocated at compile-time, but local memory demands is usually stated by the compiled shaders.
That would also make more sense given that they speak of Dynamic Caching improving GPU utilization. Allocating VRAM in one way or another wouldn't be expected to affect utilization, but being able to dynamically allocate local memory would, since that could squeeze more threads into the same execution unit.
So in your opinion @snazzy could buying an m2 max now that the prices will drop be a better choice while waiting for the next chip? 🤔
06:56 - classic Snazzy "The silicon insults" 🤣
How many NAND chips in the base model 14” (512gb). Is it a single 512, or two 256’s ?
Any thoughts on the new MacBook Air M3 chip?
Very interesting insight into a topic that hardly anyone thinks about. I enjoyed it!
exactly content we need more videos like this on more products keep up that good work Quinn!
so is the usb c version on the imac worse then the mbp? If so how much? Thought that would be a higher thunderbolt version? Also did the other models let you choose higher speed nic?
Wait for the Mac Studio with M3 Super?
About these monitor limitations, does it mean a M3Pro Macbook can't support three 1080p displays or are the listed limitations just another way of explaining bandwidth?
Hardware Limitations unfortunately.
M(x) = 1 internal, one external
M(x) Pro = 2 M chips slapped together, so 1x internal, 2x external
M(x) Max = 2 M Pro chips slapped together, so 1x internal, 4x external.
Best video on the M3 I’ve seen. Thank you
so... tldr, what's the best set up, keeping price into consideration? 😅
Nice video but I have a question. what do you think can we expect a new macbook air 15 in 2024 q1 or q2 ?? with this chip?
Is it vetter to get 16" 32ram M1 Max 10-Core | 32-Core GPU or 14"m3 36gb for the same price?
So should we wait if we can for the N3P/X? I'm still on an Intel MBP but it's still chugging along. I could wait another year if the gains will be massive
I also have an Intel MBP laptop and I'm waiting for the M4 lineup now personally. It will at least have the N3E node in it at the least but possibly the N3P node if we're lucky. The N3P is supposed to be in production in the second half of 2024.