Space Marines vs Death Guard, 10th edition Warhammer 40k battle report
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- Опубліковано 5 вер 2024
- The glorious 13th make their first foray into 10th edition and facing them - a tournament Death Guard list. Big shout out to Death Guard Andy and Heretic Dave from @HereticDave40k UA-cam channel for helping make this one happen.
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Respect to a Death Guard purist trying to make it work. I agree with many here the list didn't work this time, but what a Chad for trying. And a nice person too. Also appreciate Winters keeping Death Guard struggles visible so more likely to be noticed by GW and fixed.
Its crazy how flippy floppy GW makes the faction rules. Last Edition the space dwarves, Death Guard, and Admech were super powerful and now they are at the bottom of the ladder. They really want to milk those very competitive tournament power gamers as much as they can.
Hello Winters! Just wanted to say how much your videos really inspired me to take a casual interest in the Warhammer universe and turn it into a full blown tabletop obsession. My goal is to own a chaos army for each of the four gods, plus Black Legion + daemons + chaos knights + Dark Mechanicum (hopefully someday soon). I stream my painting sessions on Twitch and I hope to do some battle reports in the cozy style you do, where it's just two friends having a casual game at home, no epic music or fancy animations. Love the channel and love that you've taken your hobby and made it into your career!
The 6 up save on that bike for 5 VPs was hilarious, :D poor DG
Thanks for the game winters, ❤
Next time ill bring a even more disgusting and resilient list!! 🎉
You have just gained a sub from me gents! Good game I love the DG list!
Listen I'm telling you jam in as many nurglings as the points allows that is they key!!!
Great game Andy.
How to fix death Guard without annoying everyone else on earth - give all their infantry +1 wound. It functions very similar to -1 damage, but it isn’t anywhere near as infuriating to deal with or to balance around.
Boom, sorted, life is good.
yeah just make them a hp sponge it fitting and cool 22dmg weopons matter it would be a great fix
That match more with Khorne or Blood Angels. Death Guards need survability or toughtness.
@@winflips That's what I meant, give their infantry an additional wound. Bring their Plague Marines to W3, Terminators W4. Make them bulky. The extra wound is almost like having -1 Damage, but I think it would be less annoying for your opponent and easier to balance around.
@@wargamesontoast Sorry I tought you mean +1 TO wound.
God bless you for using only Firstborn marines! It's so hard to find Battle Report with no Primaris nowadays.
I'm only about 25:33 in and when Winters summarized the amount of casualties, I had a sinking feeling. Just an absolute "oh no" moment.
EDIT: Ok, going further into it, saw two things. While DG simply ARE NOT as durable as they used to be there is something there. The unit in the center took fire from dreads, preds, centurions, bikers, and more and STILL had 3 figures left when the shooting stopped. In that same vein, the DG termis were fed in largely piecemeal and that didn't help
The big heavy death star units are also very vulnerable to oath of moment.
I think the speed hurt more than anything else, what with the divided DG forces.
In short: yeah, DG need some help AND it isn't as simple as "DG Suxors thus die." Weak, but playable.
I think the pain point comes from seeing other armies get that durability boost and coming from the very dominant earlier modes.
Meanwhile, SM, Eldar, GS, and Thousand Sons are having a bit of a different swing about. :D
After seeing the DG list this couldn't have gone any other way. I also play DG and I am replacing all my poxwalkers for cultists since they are performing a lot better since they have the scout rule and can shoot a little bit. Also Blightlords aren't what they use to be so taking 30 of the slowest terminator with the weakest melee and shooting weapons they don't perform well against anything.
This list actually did really well in his last battle report on Heretic Dave's channel.
Great Battle Report. I would say taking so few units against Oath of Moment was only going to end one way.
Now this is an interesting space marine list that is fun to watch. Its great seeing the 13th play every time!
DG never had a chance with that board. Looked like a bit of a shooting gallery.
Every time I see a 10th edition Death Guard battle report I die a little inside. I've got around 4,000 points that are just going to be collecting dust on my shelf cause they're borderline unplayable. Ah well, at least Tyranids are still fun.
Not really, but giving your opponent all your threats one a turn while the marines can use their army rule that works best against one big scary unit really is kind of your own fault. The deep striking is a trap with blightlords I feel. Also rapid ingress would have been a way better use of the command points spent in rerolls this game since then they would have made a charge and I bet the game would have been different
@@rubengerritsen6868 So your opinion is that Death Guard is fine?
@@effindave6909 They are very not fine but you can win with them if you play better than your opponent, you can not win with gimmicks like Oath of moment and other trickery cause DG get none.
@@effindave6909no they are weak for sure, but they are totally playable, I’m not sure what would be the most fun way to run them but I don’t think they are as unplayable as people say
@@rubengerritsen6868Honestly, I'd say the best way to use them is to use as many blight drones/haulers as you can. Those things are oddly resiliant with a decent bit of shooting power. Then fill the list with OC units and maybe some termis to have a deepstrike threat. The only problem is just that everything beyond those blight vehicles are just wimpy and wilt under either anti-infantry or anti-elite fire cause they can't maneuver around sightlines with their current speed
Absolute respect to Andy for trying to make a pure DG termy list work, but unfortunately SM are just designed to counter exactly this kind of death star list with OoM - having few units on the board plays right into the SM army dogpiling and deleting one unit at a time with overlapping buffs. Weirdly having multiple 5 man plague marine units running around *might* have been more resilient simply by reducing the efficiency of OoM. Really sucks how rough a spot DG are in, whoever looked at their army rules and said 'this is fine' when also looking at SM, CSM, Knights, Eldar... was drunk.
Honestly the fact that Winters forgot in turn 1 that heavy bolters get sustained hits 1 built in, and his lascannons are strength 12, so wound terminators on 2+, doesn’t even matter, this was just a slaughter
A little over an hour, this game will be brutal
Andy was a good sport.
That DG army list is a chef’s kiss. Kugath would be proud.
While I do think dice played a massive role in the game, I think the decision to come in piece-meal was another major factor. Of course, he has a point about staying off board because of how slow his army is. Deploying a giant terminator brick where the entire army can basically shoot it was probably not a good idea, but I come from the school of thought were saturation of targets tends to be better in making the enemy make mistakes - of course, that may not have happened anyway.
Still good game, I can see how 60 pox walkers could be difficult for some armies to shift, but as hardcore as Oath of the Moment is against this DG army, could you imagine how nightmarish it would be for him if he had to fight a Tyranid army with Barbgaunts?
I would have maybe used the rapid ingress strat to bring them in during Winters Turn. I half expected it
@@simonberndt2015 Second that, Rapid Ingress, at least in my mind as a filthy casual, is a very high priority "CP to spend" when I'm fielding terminators, they hit like a brick but they are slow and this gives them a move + charge next turn with their high T and saves allowing to probably survive the shooting in the turn you ingress them, especially if placed well
@@simonberndt2015 if memory serves though, winters pretty adeptly screened out the area's for deep strike, and there was a chance he could have deep striked even more into the open given where the objectives were. But its a good idea.
@@ProxyResearch One of my go to and favourite Strats in 10th.
@@OniFeez Even if he dropped them in or behind cover it would have created another threat for Winters to consider that could move and charge in his own turn.
Hey, it’s Andy! This guy is great. HD40K has some of the coolest BR’s around. So glad to see him here. The first BR I ever watched was right here. Thank you so much Winters for the years of excellent content.
Hey buddy!! Thanks for the ❤ !! This was a great game with a great opponent who matches my charismatic personailty!!
Hope you are well!!
The 13th! Been waiting so long for their 10th debut ❤
Honestly for 10th you really need more LoS blocking terrain and to make use of it. Poor Death Guard, no matter where they dropped you could light them up. Army list wise Oath will virtually deal with 5 units per game, Andy had only 4 worth looking at. More mission play units required. You 13th although not optimized was just perfect for the job.
Sometimes you have to adjust your game plan depending on your enemy. If he had more on the field first turn and not in deep strike it might have changed the dynamic
@@davidring681 Maybe he should’ve started with more in the board, but it doesn’t matter when there’s no terrain.
Winters had all the tools and DG had no where to hide, stage, etc.
Like shooting ducks in a barrel. 4” moving ducks.
Always wonderful to see the 13th in full flow.
Winters acts all narrative this and that (with narrative terrain) - but is actually a shark on the table. Zoning out, saturated firepower and good target priority. Solid all round lists.
DG Andy is a solid player but this terrain did no favours. It really allowed Oath of Moment to shine. Then spending CP for an 11" charge reroll. You mad lad. 😂
Love Heretic Dave 40k and his batreps so keep up the good work mate. Don't be downtrodden, bounce back in a slow and sticky fashion.
I love this!!
Thankyou! I'm just placed high in a local tournament and DG were playing for the Top spot.
Couldn't best the eldar though!!
Thanks for your feedback!!
DG Andy!
@@Chaos40K no one can *strokes his Fate D.... ice* 😂
@@FarseerB1rdy😂😂
Thanks!
@@HereticDave40k you definitely don't look how you sound though... 😁 Caught me off guard!
New drinking game. Take a shot each time winters says "oath of moment!" 🎉😂
Great to see the firstborn lead so well. What a glorious battle. For the 13th!!! 💪
Great to see the 13th back on the table. The classic space marine force.
I'm wondering what the tournament scene is like in the UK for sportsmanship. I recently went to the Tacoma Open GT as part of GW's US Open Series and had 6 lovely games against 6 lovely opponents, including the best game of 40K I've ever played (dropped the last day for travel, thus why I didn't have 8 amazing games). I bring this up because I've heard my experience echoed constantly from numerous sources. We hear nightmare stories once in awhile, but with many events all over the world every weekend, that accounts for a miniscule portion of things. I haven't attended small events so maybe that's where the nastier rep comp play gets comes from. Attend the local RTT as a first-timer and get trounced by the local sharks. Anyway, I'd imagine the Warhammer World events would be similarly excellent, if not many others besides.
I love how Winters can, in the nicest, friendliest, most cuddly way possible, talk some serious smack.
Ha ha he even brings a Hellbrute. Thats awsome just because its such a sic looking model. Mine is happy to serve in his shell regardless what the lore says lol.
I don't think it would have changed the outcome but damn that run of bad luck on the 4+s at the start really cost Dave a lot of terminators. Should be a 50/50 but he was rolling 20/80 at least.
It wasn't dave, it was me, DeathGuard Andy - I just support dave on his channel Heretic Dave 40K
@@Chaos40K Sorry. Had a 50/50 chance and rolled bad.
I hope you had fun even with the dice conspiring against you.
Great battle rep and more of you two hopefully
The 13th at 5:24 am.. who needs sleep anyway.
13th?
I love oom exactly for this :P, it is a hard counter to spammy big blob armies, you cannt make a wrong choice if your opponent gives you only one possibility
Winters and Heretic Dave, my favorite wargammers, I need a batrep, another good one Winters. Death Guard Andy, the invuls weren’t invuling very well lol
Thanks!
Oath is strong, but it worked so well because DG funneled into the Marines. Oath really only had one target a turn, but if it had more targets, it would have been a different due to threats still on the board and close.
Great game Winters - tactically smarter today I think PLUS I think you getting first turn, pushing forward hard with bikes and the mobility of your bikes and multi-meltas was one of the key differences in your list vs other opponents perhaps. Plus you maximised use of Oath of Moment with plenty of shooting options bro g able to leverage it!
I don't mind 10th edition rules much, I still play 9th edition since we haven't been bothered learning the new things based on unbalanced indexes. We also don't like the character changes. Auras were more interesting. It really made you feel there was a presence of a character inspiring the units and troops. I also don't like the OC values, for the reasons you mentioned and also because I like the old troop concept that you needed 3 troops to make an army lega. Once the codexes arrive we're moving to 10th. We 're a small group of three who collect warhammer in my area and we're all more or less on the same page. If anyone wants to play 10th, we do i. But so far when discussing what to play, 9th edition 40k or 7th edition whfb is what it comes down to from what GW has to offer (or had). Also, my main SM army will become legacy as I don't invest in the bigger marines, I still use tactical era models. To be honest, the old terminators would not fit inside a land raider... Now they are even chonkier. Why make things bigger? To sell models... No thank you.
It's like the turd that is Age of Shitmar, we're still playing 7th edition whfb. 8th edition was too focused on magic and big chonky blocks of horde units. AoS is just an abomination that killed off a legacy of awesome.
I guess the gist of things for us is that we play what we like. If there's something we don't like, we don't play it.
It is understandable that some people find it frustrating when a group wants to play in tournaments and that kind of forces your hand a bit into playing what is relevant for the tournament scene, even if you as an individual would more enjoy other editions or games. But what are you gonna do if there's noone sharing your opinions. We want to roll them dice, so you adapt and accept even if you don't like it. Guess I'm lucky with my small group, even if it would be nice to play against a bigger group sometimes.
That first turn was painful to watch.
Also, so many ones on the invul saves.
13th showing us how it's done!🔥
I really like your guests!
Better check out their stuff after watching this.
Great game! Always such a pleasure to watch these videos!! And always such an amazing job of showcasing this hobby being the best it can be!! Beautiful painted armies, great terrain, cool themes, and good folks having fun together, sharing this awesome experience we all love!!
GW: "Hey ChatGPT, write 10th edition rules for Death Guard."
ChatGPT: "Sure, here is your disgustingly resilient army!"
GW: "ChatGPT, write 10th edition rules for Death Guard without disgustingly resilient."
ChatGPT: "Fine, here is your cannon fodder NPC faction. May god have mercy on your soul."
I'd be mad, but... Blake's peace be upon you.
The charge at 56:22, all of those termies should have based the DG termies. If you can base then you must base and with a 9" charge roll, there would have been room to base. It wouldnt have changed what could fight but does affect positioning post combat etc.
Good batrep again Winters. I really like the attention to decent terrain and layour as well. Good stuff
Oath of moment is fucking overpowered💀
I love to see my stinky boys take the field so hats off for that!
But its real sad to see hur we are underperforming..
Cool terrain, I wish GW would bring back the bastion stuff. So much better than the shoebox crap they sell now.
I bet the Halo universe would be a fun setting for a Mini Wargame.
Who would have thought that constant re-rolls for both hits and wounds would be overpowered.
Every channel batrep with death guard only lasts an hour lol.
Aw no, I remember this guy is a good dude and he was so excited for his list.. And then.. :( Winters you heartless man lol.
Some more terrain would've been a step towards some balance. The new terrain layouts from GW have almost no board spanning open corridors and I've found it really cuts down on the point and delete gunline marine lists.
I recommend a Lord of Virulence if you are going to do so many Blightlord Terminators to re-roll the wound rolls, or keep them close to Mortarion to re-roll wounds of 1.
I believe that's only for blast weapons?
No, it is all weapons, but I just noticed it is for ranged attack only which doesn’t make it as good as I thought.
Wow, a 45 minute bat rep is bad news for any army.
Centurions!❤️❤️❤️
I want some so badly but I can't justify their price.😩
Great game lads. 🎉
I'm telling you all the secret now jam as many nurglings as you can into your list to make DG op again.
Great battle report as always Winters! I think people are hating on Oath Of Moment a little too much though. It took two dreads, devastators, predator, landraider, centurions, attacks bikes worth of shooting, and two dreads worth of melee with reroll everything to kill ten blightlords. I think they blight lords could use a feel no pain of some sort but they proved without a doubt they are still tough.
The best sign off
FWIW, I only watch batreps of Space Marine armies that are exclusively Firstborn, so thanks for keeping the dream alive! 😂
that ending was a complete surprise for me, never heard of that trophy
give Death Guard +1 wound and +1 toughness across the army, I remember an older edition where they had this plus all their weapons could move and shoot without negative effects...
This table is so much better in a visual sense than the usual MDF ruins in L-shape you see everywhere nowadays...
In the grim darkness of the far future, there are only re rolls.
O God! Death guard Andy!😅😅😅... hide any plastic dinosaurs
Hahaha. Not for this one
Ah DG when ever i watch a DG battle rep on 10th check the lists skip to last turn, nearly always the same result, havent seen a single BR that was close in 10th for DG
I've been struggling with DG in 10th, especially when facing certain armies. They just can't reliably kill anything or survive, and they have almost no mobility.
Well done champion. Hopefully you can defend your title if the no retreat tourney ever comes back in style.
Good morning, better get the kettle on!
Great game guys! Enjoyed it! Very cool terrain.
Heretic Dave is awesome
Thanks!
Come on mister tally man Tally me banana.
I have been infected with a catchy song.
Love seeing centurions :D Im really upset about GW discontinuing the bikes through. Screw them.
You know it's a 10th edition DG batrep when it's only an hour long.
Nice to see someone running Centurions and I've been considering getting a Predator so great help to see them both put through their paces.
Also, just a side note, those purple dice are really confusing to watch on mobile. The 6s look like 4s, really confused me for a while.
Ouch that was really painful to watch.
Brining big death star units against space marines is a reaaaly bad idea.
Is Winters doing cover wrong? I thought it was any part of a model in the unit obscured from any model in the unit. There were loads of times the DG should have been in cover by that reading. Please tell me if I'm wrong haha
The "Oooooof" ometer was cranked to 11 for that batrep.
That was a crap battle. Bad rolling and DG being in a terrible place made it a non starter. I don't want it to sound like I'm being negative about winters or Andy, just the state of these two armies stop it being too entertaining
Good on Andy trying something a bit different, but I'm not sure he'll be trying it again
Good afternoon, in the case of the terminators being blocked off the objective by the non charging bikes, the heroic intervention stratagem would've been a strong choice to swing that.
Unfortunately you can only use Heroic Intervention against an enemy unit that makes a Charge move
@@christianmaddex4363 darn! Just rechecked the wording and you're right. That was some movement shenanigans!
Good to see the 13th win.
Excellent Winters Batrep! The Death Guard even though they aren't the strongest army in 10th. Happy playing games with mine 😊 (Though I am getting together Emperors Children as well)
Can’t wait to see 10th edition Nids with the new Norn Emissary running round butchering elite infantry/characters 👾🌌😍
Me too I cant wait to give GW my money 😂
cant wait for norn emissary to turn 1 be shot off the board by oath of moment :/
Most over powered ability in 10th edition....... Oath of Moment.....
Poor guy it's never fun when you're betrayed by the dice 🎲 😔
Great batrep! But I'm curious, did you or did I get it wrong? You mix Fixed missions secondaries with Tactical missions secondaries. I read it as you play either of.. And also, did you take new missions even though you didn't clear the previous missions. You're not supposed to do that, are you?
I don't mean to be rude,I just want to get it right for tomorrow's games..
When you play Tactical you use the whole deck. You can discard secondary missions at the end of turn for CP's. All the rules for this mission type are in the Leviathan mission deck.
Back in the USSR the signals from the rulers were so unclear that the rest of the world had to evolve a 'Kremlinology' to interpret the signals. Sometimes I feel like that when I read the rules from GW.. Thanks for the clarification! Love your batreps, keep up the good work♥️!
great game but could you get yer titans out fer the ladz winters :)
Hello Winters great battle. I just realized that the gunner space marine on the attack bikes don't have (don't have room to wear) their power packs, just curious if their is an in lore reason why they don't and what happen if the need to dismount?
The return of the Glorious 13th!!!
For the algorithm! I mean, the emprah!
That DG list leans to heavily on slow melee units and suffers hard for it. Honestly DG should be played vehicle and shooty heavy.
Lord of contagion 115
Deadly pathogen
5 blight lord terminators 175
land raider 250
helbrute 155
twin lascannon, helbrute fist and combi-bolter
helbrute 155
twin lascannon, helbrute fist and combi-bolter
5 plauge marines 100
3 bubotic weapons, 2heavy plauge weapons
5 plauge marines 100
3 bubotic weapons, 2heavy plauge weapons
5 plauge marines 100
3 bubotic weapons, 2heavy plauge weapons
10 pox walkers 60
plaugueburst crawler 175
plaugueburst crawler 175
predator anhilator 130
Wardog huntsman 140
deamonbreath spear
Wardog huntsman 140
deamonbreath spear
This was not dice. Unless you count how many rerolls the Space Marines get compared to the Death Guard.
Sagan Meer is coming to play. The child from the Vengeance is getting to kill again.
Papa bless! 🪰🪰🪰
Brutal game. That Death guard list is too reliant on a 4+ dice roll. Plus,no shooting in it. Also, the 13th showed enough lascannons and multimeltas and Oath of the Moment will just decimate that list.Also, I heard an idea to fix DG where you give each infantry model an additional wound and their tanks a FNP save
I run something kinda similar.
Morty
loc
lov
typhus
1x10 blightlords
2x3 and 1x6 deathshroud
3x20 poxwalkers
Will GW ever address Oath of Moment though?
Sometimes the dice tell the story. This one was sad.
Even if he made more saves though I don't think he stood a chance. Deathguard has been nerfed to the turf. Not even fun to watch anymore sadly. Shame. I used to like the Deathguard batreps. Probably skip them until they get a balance put out. To be fair, the list Winters put together was wicked. All that D6 damage with Oath of Moment. Oof.
Oath of Moment FAQed. Now reads: 'Oath of Moment; I'm Sorry'.
I don't like being able to shoot behind other enemy units, doesn't make sense, unless it's a monster or vehicle.