Matt G armbar can be much easier to get against big opponents sometimes too though. And it’s less fatiguing if you go for it and fail. Desperately trying for a triangle and failing will leave you completely gassed and defenceless
prandz420 I don’t know this really is a tough debate... I mean a helicopter sub is already just risky overall so like Rener said just getting the opponent up in the air is the toughest part, so I think once the opponent is in the air it’s a 50/50 either way you’ve got a successful sub unless the opponent has good enough instincts to stop either submission by standing for arm bar or getting the arm in like Ryron showed. So I just say go with the choke over the arm bar because it’s the more threatening. And honestly in a street scenario i’m going arm bar over triangle all day since it’s so much easier to release while a triangle is just asking to be slammed Matt Hughes Vs. Carlos Newton style
I like the armbar because my intro was Pedro Sauer Path To Black Belt and he always liked to say "and into the armbar." Many people feel that is one of the most effective joint locks. Love, Mike.
Both options are valid and have different applications. Triangle: heavier opponents because it requires less finesse; Arm Bar: more inexperienced or lighter opponents because its unexpected.
love both, but the armbar i did to a tough brownbelt training partner of mine whos like 50 pounds heavier and in the process my body-side foot got stuck in the gi and nearly broke as i spun him into the lock... After that i started doing the triangle more and its been clutch in competition! great vid thanks!
How absolutely cool would it be to have Ryron or Rener as your very own private/personal BJJ coach/mestre? Mannnnn that would be glorious haha. One can dream! Love both of these guys.
Arm-bar: 1. I find it harder to set up and lock the triangle. 2. In my experience, more people can get out of an imperfect triangle than an imperfect arm-bar. I don't want to need perfection. 3. You're more exposed to strikes with a triangle than with an arm-bar. 4. The arm-bar is more reliable than the triangle in no-gi. When setting up a triangle, it's hard to keep good control of the elbow on a sweaty arm.
Actually statistics of fights show that the triangle is the only technique that increases in success rate after getting your leg over. Always fight for your triangle, even though it's bad.
Triangle can put u unconscious and without irreparable damage. And i believe u never get out of a tight triangle. also some strong dudes can fight through the pain even if their arm is broken they can come at u and attack if somehow get out. With triangle, u cant fight through cuz u just have no air. Cant fight that. Feel me?
This is the most fantastic videos. I love the knowledge, and the brother dynamic reminds me of my own brothers. Keep up the amazing vids, mad respect for you both and of course the Gracie family!
Life and jiu jitsu are like surfing. You can plan on what you want to do. But you have to wait and see what the wave is going to do in order to flow & surf the wave. So be ready and learn to flow.
Without doubt the triangle choke for the reasons Rener stated. Under adrenaline or drugs a broken arm isn’t necessarily going to stop someone in a fight. However you can’t fight if you are unconscious.
Up kick 3 times to triangle. I also love doing standing arm bar and a standing guillotine!!!! 4 years down and I cannot stop training! Can’t wait to get my two boys in there 🤙🏽
I'm on team Ryron on that one! I absolutely do NOT have the credentials to have a valid opinion on this, but I pulled a beautiful helicopter armbar once, and it felt like a million bucks. XD
Wow.. they both look sweet as hell! lol. I agree with Rener though. Flexibility is an issue with the helicopter armbar and submission resistance is more likely. The helicopter triangle does have a flaw as well but recovery seems easier and submission resistance is minimal (and it looks more awesome). lol.
Blue belt from Manchester, Nh (Gracie university, Manchester Gracie) It depends on how the opponent is parachuting. I prefer the arm bar as it can transition to the triangle. However the triangle also has it's benefits. Nutshell answer: Both have their pros and cons. Use them accordingly to the opponent.
Rener: "We don't agree on a lot of things."
Ryron: "That's not true."
😂😂😂😂😂
Thumbs up if you want more debate videos.
I'm sharing this!
GracieBreakdown yes please!!
I would rather call it a triangle lift instead of helicopter because he doesn't spin
GracieBreakdown love your guys videos need more !!!
GracieBreakdown love you guys
I’m team helicopter into another helicopter - I get my opponent spinning so fast that he passes out from centrifugal force -
I'm more into helicopter Into reverse helicopter. I make my opponent spin me then I slam into his face with my forehead
@@dogman5791the helicopter crash
Or just flies away from the helicopter motion
Helicopter Upkick for the win! ;)
Ouch.... that is simple... but effective
Helikopter head kick more effective
truly street minded
Hahaha Ryron doesn’t agree with Rener about not agreeing 🤣love it...fun vid.
Helicopter triangle 🔥
That was hilarious when Ryron forced himself into the armbar :'D "armbar!", "nooo!", "armbar!! look"
4:18 "like a baby orangutan grabbing it's mother" this is why I come here.... Classic.
These two are why I fell in love with Jiu-Jitsu, thank you! 🙏❤️
I choose unconscious opponent over an opponent with broken bones
Matt G armbar can be much easier to get against big opponents sometimes too though. And it’s less fatiguing if you go for it and fail. Desperately trying for a triangle and failing will leave you completely gassed and defenceless
prandz420 I don’t know this really is a tough debate... I mean a helicopter sub is already just risky overall so like Rener said just getting the opponent up in the air is the toughest part, so I think once the opponent is in the air it’s a 50/50 either way you’ve got a successful sub unless the opponent has good enough instincts to stop either submission by standing for arm bar or getting the arm in like Ryron showed.
So I just say go with the choke over the arm bar because it’s the more threatening. And honestly in a street scenario i’m going arm bar over triangle all day since it’s so much easier to release while a triangle is just asking to be slammed Matt Hughes Vs. Carlos Newton style
Choke them out, then break their arm. That’s what coach teaches us always
Stop at Chicago or direct flight?
Hahaha, anyone else feel me?😏👍🏼
Love these guys👊🏼
Only the dedicated fans/subscribers will know the reference to "stop in chicago" :-D
@@IronChad_
ua-cam.com/video/DtpgC2g6LiE/v-deo.html
3:09 “calm down” 😂😂😂
Helicopter Triangle squad for life!
I wish I could train with you guys
Helicopter Arm•bar or Helicopter Triangle....?
Answer: Yes
When Ryron forced himself into the arm bar 😂😂😂😂
Ikr I love it 😂
I love these guys!!! Making Jiu-Jitsu fun since...forever!
Love it! Brothers dynamics is contagious!
I like the armbar because my intro was Pedro Sauer Path To Black Belt and he always liked to say "and into the armbar." Many people feel that is one of the most effective joint locks. Love, Mike.
Old Blue belt here. Love, love, love these videos; your enthusiasm is contagious now I just want to roll.
The passion you guys have is so beautiful 💯
That was great. I liked the Triangle arm bar.
BEAUTIFUL TECHNIQUE as always
Both options are valid and have different applications. Triangle: heavier opponents because it requires less finesse; Arm Bar: more inexperienced or lighter opponents because its unexpected.
I love their relationship 😅 It's a privilege to be able to learn from them in Torrance.
Helicopter sweep, position before submission 😎
You guys are hilarious. The energy with you two is awesome.
-- The answer is like Yin and Yang, it's both...
Hilarious banter ... but a hellofalotta great information as well ! Super stoked you two are out there giving as this great information!
You guys are so awesome. I have no idea which one. Either one would kick my butt.
25% off store wide on Gracie and Quikflip. Get to www.GracieLifestyle.com or www.QuikflipApparel.com com before the goodies are gone!
love both, but the armbar i did to a tough brownbelt training partner of mine whos like 50 pounds heavier and in the process my body-side foot got stuck in the gi and nearly broke as i spun him into the lock...
After that i started doing the triangle more and its been clutch in competition!
great vid thanks!
How absolutely cool would it be to have Ryron or Rener as your very own private/personal BJJ coach/mestre? Mannnnn that would be glorious haha. One can dream! Love both of these guys.
U can ! Join Gracy university in Torrance both brothers teach all levels of classes its amazing!
Arm-bar:
1. I find it harder to set up and lock the triangle.
2. In my experience, more people can get out of an imperfect triangle than an imperfect arm-bar. I don't want to need perfection.
3. You're more exposed to strikes with a triangle than with an arm-bar.
4. The arm-bar is more reliable than the triangle in no-gi. When setting up a triangle, it's hard to keep good control of the elbow on a sweaty arm.
I find triangles to be better , but triangles are my best technique , I've practiced them the most .
Actually statistics of fights show that the triangle is the only technique that increases in success rate after getting your leg over. Always fight for your triangle, even though it's bad.
@Vali Zeth: Do you have a link to that info? I'd be interested in looking into that.
Triangle can put u unconscious and without irreparable damage. And i believe u never get out of a tight triangle. also some strong dudes can fight through the pain even if their arm is broken they can come at u and attack if somehow get out. With triangle, u cant fight through cuz u just have no air. Cant fight that. Feel me?
@yonathan L: Totally valid points and I completely agree, but my triangle set-up just isn't that reliable... yet.
Haha, the debate mid drill is always hilarious and awesome.
Love the debate style teaching method. The material sticks better.
So much fun learning from this two😍
I like both of them cause armbar and choke are very successful you guys are awesome!!!!
"We don't agree on a lot of things but we work em out"
"That's not true"
i still remember the first time i saw a helicopter armbar, i still consider it the prettiest move in JJ.
You guys have so much fun!
Damn guys you must make more videos,, you give us good vibes
This is the most fantastic videos. I love the knowledge, and the brother dynamic reminds me of my own brothers. Keep up the amazing vids, mad respect for you both and of course the Gracie family!
Life and jiu jitsu are like surfing. You can plan on what you want to do. But you have to wait and see what the wave is going to do in order to flow & surf the wave. So be ready and learn to flow.
I love this style of video!!
Without doubt the triangle choke for the reasons Rener stated. Under adrenaline or drugs a broken arm isn’t necessarily going to stop someone in a fight. However you can’t fight if you are unconscious.
“I only talk about street fights”🤣🤣 luv it
helicopter triangle all the way!
If you going for the triangle, what’s to stop the top guy from simply pulling his left arm back and stopping the whole move?
For sure bro 💯
Awesome and fun to watch 👍
They remind me of two baby lions play-fighting
Gotta go with the armbar just because the spin looks so dope ;-)
Helicopter arm bar for life plus looks more fancy 👌😎
I love you guys great 2 learn more from u both. Gratefull 4 life!!
Just in time for the holidays! Helicopter armbar! Be the soul of the party!
“I use you as a swiiiingset...”
Now there are 51 Shades Of Gray! You guys are the best!!
I really love this interaction
That was super entertaining... Gonna go with....ahhhhh... Can't decide.
Do more of these! Great video.
You two are hilarious lol and the arm bar is style points
Could you imagine what a family cookout was like? Kids a family rolling all over the place
I literally watched this episode like 5-6 times already :)
2:27 Rener only talks about street fights then demonstrates the importance of grips on a gi lmaooo
Great breakdown love it thank you guys
Up kick 3 times to triangle. I also love doing standing arm bar and a standing guillotine!!!! 4 years down and I cannot stop training! Can’t wait to get my two boys in there 🤙🏽
The nIce thing about BJJ is that for every nice move there is a nice counter and a counter to that.
I choose both :D
Love it, fun one to practice on your kids 😂
I'm on team Ryron on that one! I absolutely do NOT have the credentials to have a valid opinion on this, but I pulled a beautiful helicopter armbar once, and it felt like a million bucks. XD
My legs are too short to catch most people in triangle effectively, so I'm Team Armbar all the way.
I suggest you watch John Danahers video on the triangle. You just need more angle than someone with long legs
@@GKang93 Thanks for the tip! Great video with lots of useful information.
I love these guys
Love these guys
Awesome as always guys
Triangle for sure it is very smooth, fast and you can't defense it in any way.. you have no chance but sleep
Let’s get these guys to 1million before 2020
These guys have me wanting to buy every shirt and hoodie
Armbar for life
You guys are amazing 🤘
I’m team you guys are the best teachers for life
Nice gear guys!!
👍🏼✊🏼😉😃
so bascically this is video should be titled "we were arguing on which helicopter submission someone be the judge of this"
They make those look so easy
This is hilarious and amazing
The only advertisment i like to watch because of the little jokes, si funny xd
Helicopter Triangle! ♻️
Going with Ryron on this one!
Wow.. they both look sweet as hell! lol. I agree with Rener though. Flexibility is an issue with the helicopter armbar and submission resistance is more likely. The helicopter triangle does have a flaw as well but recovery seems easier and submission resistance is minimal (and it looks more awesome). lol.
This was a great video! I’m team arm bar all the way.
This was such a fun video
I freaking love you guys
Helicopter triangle because it works from the standard guard pull and yoko tomoe nage 🔥
This was an awesome technique video
Helicopter armbar , but both are effective. Thanks Gracie bros
You guys are awesome ❤️
Blue belt from Manchester, Nh (Gracie university, Manchester Gracie)
It depends on how the opponent is parachuting. I prefer the arm bar as it can transition to the triangle. However the triangle also has it's benefits.
Nutshell answer: Both have their pros and cons. Use them accordingly to the opponent.
Both are cool but I love the armbar
You guys are the best
Armbar FTW! Helicopter Triangle puts the attacker's head close enough to one's lower abs that the attacker could potentially bite that area.
I love both 👍👍👍👍
Such great videos
Helicopter arm bar seems easier to apply, both are effective moves!
I'll go with arm bar because my legs are not long enough to secure a triangle unless I need more attention to training when practicing the triangle.
Great video, thanks!!!
Brotherly love 👍