When Did Warcraft Become Boring?
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- Опубліковано 11 тра 2024
- "WOW as it is right now is the worst it's ever been and on a sad path. This is entirely due to the laziness of the the people in charge." - anonymous commenter, 2014
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/ catdanyru - Ігри
They turned Warcraft into Feelingscraft. The old lore did not treat their players like children, there was brutality, blood, guts, racism, torture etc. REAL SHIT... Now its just a bunch of cartoon fairy bullshit.
There are also furries.
This is so true... It's sad how this badass game became so gay
Tumblr game devs have poisoned the well.
What happens when you force calipedo american modern ideologies into warcraft:
@@wisp6826 There have always been furries, furries can just as much enjoy blood, guts and all that other shit.
That "family" cutscene is CRAZY. That's the kind of Paw Patrol crap that Asmon thought FFXIV was before he played it. Man I miss the vibe of Frozen Throne so much.
How is it paw patrol-esc? The Blue Dragonflight is finally having a proper future for the first time in lord knows how long. That goes with the Dragons in general. Let them have their happy ending.
Besides, the Frozen Throne was during the rise of the Lich King. Dragonflight is like...3 years post Jailer 😭
@@preds43You're so cooked I can smell the smoke.
@@TheBaconShaman Ofc the mf named "Bacon Shaman" is talking about cooking L:MAOOOO
@@preds43🍿🍿🍿🍿
XIV still has this problem, and an even worse part of it is the "great community" which are literally paw patrol pansies. Game content aside, you still can't escape this modern softness.
It's really quite sad that the MMO genre has devolved into attracting these kind of people.
Remember when Saurfang told Garrosh he can't go to the pig farms outside Org because the squealing reminded him of Draenei children being butchered? When he talked about "honor" it wasn't just a platitude, he knew the cost of doing dishonorable stuff. Imagine a line of dialogue like that ever popping up in Dragonflight.
I remember how people complained about Alexstrasza and took it as a rape fantasy or something like that when you got the quest in Dragonflight and people took it as of bad taste. To me it was, bad people (orcs) got the hang out of a female dragon and they use her to get an army of dragons because that was what they wanted for their army and pursue of power. It's ok for her character to feel bad about that in the current expansion? Obviously, but it's a reason to change and retcon the lore? Na, but that's what a past event is in Dragonflight.
The amount of atrocities that ocurred in the story that are a part of war in the universe of warcraft is a lot, and it sucks that the game isn't like that anymore trying to be soft and correct in every corner.
@@Kanamon22 my only issue with it was that i had 0 faith in blizz to actually tell that part well considering thier uh....track record. also the ' lets not tell alextraza about this' trying to play it off as a hah hah thing wasn't great.
@@Kanamon22 That came to my mind when I saw her vomit life magic in the cinematic Asmong played.
I remembered that she was once chained down by the Horde and used to spawn dragons for war. Dragons that spewed flame and torched green landscapes, not turn arid terrain green.
Now you mention it, I suppose that means they forced her to mate. Don't know that I ever thought about that. I've no idea how this comes up in Dragonflight.
@@Kanamon22 the only mention is on the quest of Duroz Scaletaker “ they’re making me medicine and they don’t know”. W about Alextrasza? If you’re not going to kill the orcs outright give them a debuff or setback their reputation to Hated or something
@@saphojuiced6243 tbh i don’t see an issue with her turning arid terrain green considering she’s the aspect of life. I do however have an issue with her having been enslaved by nekros being retconned
Old wow lore was deep. What he means is it used to be good, now its not good.
A loved prince, fallen to corruption, then destoys everything he tried to protect.
Thrall, a slave, trying to find a home for his dying people.
Mal and illidan, two brothers trying to do right, each one misunderstanding the other. Both in love with the same elf.
Jaina, forced to choose between whats right and her father.
The stories were extremely deep, thats why they were good. The big diffrnece is the stories felt real, the struggles were brtually honest and played as a mirror to real stories from history. They were basically good stories. Its not just about big men hitting each other, there was that, but there was something more and thats what drove the games success.
The last "deep lore" expansion was MoP, after that it was just recycled surface level bs. WoD could've been the best xpack, but they messed it up, then Legion was absolute trash until .3, which people really really forget how shit Legion was until the very last patch.
Also “of blood and honor” which is the story that Asmongold was referencing. Literally Fording telling the Silver Hand to fk off because they wanted to execute Eitrigg w/o trial. We lorefags remember
The old stories were simply told but had substance.
The new stuff lacks substance.
I probably learned more lore reading that than I did playing wow for a long, long time. Think I had over a year online on my tank in TBC alone
And not to mention they were relatable on some level. Everyone can relate to some sort of love triangle or a disagreement with parents or not getting along with a sibling despite trying. You might not agree with what Arthas did but you could understand him and his reasoning on some level. All this shit now is so far gone that I can’t relate at all and because I can’t relate I don’t care about them or their stories.
Wow lore used to play like an arcane history book. Now it plays like a daytime soap opera
An exploration sandbox mmorpg that got turned into Disney Land sadly
I wonder why that could be??? 🤔🤔🤔
Honestly WoW has always been kinda boring, what made it fun a decade ago, was the communities you built around raiding or PVP.
Now it just doesn't have the same energy.
That's not fair.... Daytime soap operas have better writers who are paid better.
@@joe77andino its always been disneyland, you just see the fiberglass now.
People really need to give up on WoW and Blizzard.
It will never be the way it used to be.
blizzard died when it was bought by activision, then sold to microsoft.
@@bloodred255 thats crazy because they just set a record for sales
@@mahatmasloth6543 Pretty sure McDonald's is also doing fine yet i doubt it beats mom's cooking does it?
@@mahatmasloth6543 Imagine thinking a mega corporation making money is a sign of quality.
Yo breath smells like 🥾
@@mahatmasloth6543 I think he means the soul of it died, not that it has 0 players now.
"World of Warcraft: Friendship is Magic"
Ironic thing is MLP _did_ have its fair share of dark moments.
@@LuznoLindo true true
Even MLP takes less its public like childrens.
@@LuznoLindo also the ponies were not afraid of throw hooves when was needed
I know fuckall about WarCraft. Don't know, don't care. But seeing the difference between an orc warlord receiving a vision quest to unite the Horde, doing so, and invading Azeroth vs "we needed to come together as family" is... Last Jedi levels of fucking insulting. Holy shit.
"VanCleef story is better than Dragonflight." And the slow pace of the environment around it made the whole thing. It wasnt just a lore dump cutscene. It was the slow build up right from lvl 2 when you face a handful of no-name bandits in Northshire Abbey, thinking its just random NPCs. And slowly you get into the depths of it over many levels, all the way up to 20 when you do Deadmines. Such a cool way to tell a story, and it's completely optional. It doesn't force it down your throat like a themepark of cutscenes.
and then it continues with the unsent letter chain revealing the stormwind conspiracy which ends near level 30!!
I mean let's not pretend like that was the height of torytelling -- it was just leagues better than the horseshit we get now
> It doesn't force it down your throat like a themepark of cutscenes.
I see you're familiar with ff14 xD
No man, it ends at max level, killing Onyxia/clearing Blackwing Lair. All this ruckus was connected with noble corruption which was caused also by Katrina Prestor (Onyxia in disguise). She made it so Stonemasons didn't get paid, interrupted some Westfall reinforcements, supported rebels from the side. She was connected to Marshal Windsor's abduction and so on. We didn't stop at Deadmines, there was more to Stormwind's corruption.
@@dudda5000 and then the conspiracy and "incompetence" lead to katrana prestor aka onyxia, shit was cool
Parasites took over the main host of Blizzard and now wear it's skin acting like it did all the things we loved. Old Blizzard will always be fondly remembered, but it is long dead and gone.
That's the story of the U.S, not just of this company.
I think this is true of nearly every long lived company in gaming now. They all get bought out and/or infiltrated, and then the new team exploits the positive name recognition earned by the old guard to scam us with trash games for as long they can get away with.
I know everyone eats their ass and I'm not saying anything original here, but From Software are genuinely the only company I can think of off the top of my head who've been around for a long time that haven't compromised themselves yet. There are probably more, but none that I can think of easily.
The skinwalkers are amongst us and now they're rotting through
@@kyslippy AMONG US?! SUS
Thats why we must abandon them. And join our own efforts. Private servers
Blizzard have unironically ended an expansion with “Maybe, the real WarCraft is friends we made along the way”
"And so we did." who wrote that crap. There is 15 year old edge lords that can write better than this.
The story of Blackmoore and Thralls relationship was brutal.
Cutting off you daughters head, just to try and gain control of your greatest gladiator, with Thralls grief and anger was really powerful to read about.
To be correct, she was his concubine and not his daughter. But yes, Warcraft now misses moments like this, its all soft in tone, touchy feelings, no character has an ounce of testosterone left.
The issue isn’t faction peace or character soap opera. It’s tone. It’s always been tone. The tone used to be good. Now it’s not.
True
100%
Warcraft three had character soap interaction. It had likeable and dislikable characters with flaws. You're 100% right. It's just tone.
It’s also super gay now
So true, legion had faction unity, with the underlying tension and conflicts under the grand scheme of things, with class hall quests peppering the conflicts via NPC interactions. It's balanced.
Replacing paintings of women with pictures of fruits tells me all I need to know about the state of this game and what to expect in the future.
This, with this on the side and this on top.
This.
@warmasterofchaossometimes yes and sometimes not. They changed some and my guess is they missed some.
Well the dev team is nothing but fruitcakes now so it makes sense.
“We will never be slaves” cinematic is like peak warcraft for me. I didn’t even fucking play WoD but that little movie had it all. Music, brutality, action, great dialogue. And at the end you felt something.
Thrall asked "How is Anduinn" when he should have asked, "Why is Anduinn".
You will own no items and be happy.
So..........even Azeroth is being taken over the W.E.F.?!
but unfortunately we arent
@@KingMickeyMouseOoOthey have penetrated the cabinets
The goblins are putting chemicals in wellspring lake to turn the long jaw mud snappers gay
2024 updates: You will own no items and will not be happy.
It's not like you can't tell a story about family etc, it's just the way it's being told. It's like the writers think we're 10 years old.
They made the game family friendly as soon as they removed Garrosh calling Sylvanas a bitch after some dude complained about his son playing the game and hearing it
@skidaddleskidoodle1103 meanwhile in FFXIV they won't hesitate to use the word.
If only they'd have Vin Diesel saying it, it'd have meaning. Oh, and he could say "we live life a quarter of a mile at a time...."
@@MegaDarkness5000 wut u talking about, ff14 story was all about the power of friendship 😂 shadowbringer was peak, hopefully the dip in story quality in endwalker is temporary and the new expac is better
have you seen the classic wow players? they play like they're 6
I started playing WoW in Classic and loved that there was no overarching story. There were just a bunch of quests and some history of the world, but you just played. You went into dungeon because gear, not because of a story. You went into a raid because of gear, not a story. I just want to be a dude in the world doing stuff to make gold and live the life of an adventurer.
I think they went wrong when they did WoW instead of Warcraft 4.
I miss night elves from W3 when they were savages that scared even the orcs. They turned them into lame hippies.
Old night elves: the vietkong
New night elves: hippies and vegans
Likewise. That was the whole attraction for me originally. They weren't just wood elves. It was like a wood elf/dark elf mix, and it worked.
Not only that but they couldn't even give them vengeance. It all became about "renewal" and "Don't look back in anger at the near genocide." ... wait that sounds too much like what they say about real tragedies these days "don't look back in anger."
Malfuruion showed peace of old nelves in his BFA cutscene.... Scary, deadly and absolutely badass.
They were hippies even in W3. Well the druids were. The rest were just dumb.
And to lose to orcs and humans despite being 5,000 years old, shameful.
Bro we went from Gothic horror with diablo and There is only War in WARcraft to, slice of life anime where everyone is having a personal drama going on and life is hard but they can overcome all hardships so long as everyone and the school bully works together.
It is sad when you compare the depth of the scenes to the... anime that WoW is right now. BfA had some great cinematics, and they weren't anime. They need to go back to using WoD, Legion, and BfA style or just darken the entire tone of their cinematics. The War Within looks good. I would like to see how they flesh that out. It would be *perfect* to kill off Anduin. Not that I dislike Anduin, but our main characters literally never die. They just run circles around one another.
@@corbin_4738 yea and make Turalyon usurp the throne to wage war against the horde in the name of the light (Garrosh 2.0)
@@YA-kr4fr But that doesn't make sense. And it didn't make sense in BfA because by that point both sides had come together against a common enemy too often and didn't have anything to fight each other over anymore. The problem started when they added the Blood Elves to the Horde even though the Blood Elves would also want to kill the orcs and trolls because they are foreign invaders who don't belong on Azeroth. The moment they stopped acknowledging this is the moment they lost any reason for the Horde and Alliance to want to fight each other.
A great way to sum up a lot of the differences is that it changed from being "badass" to being "nice", from a scaling down of the scope and intensity in favor of broader safety. When a large part of the appeal came from the grandiose/intense spectacles they created, making the spectacles smaller and softer and safer pushed away people who liked what they had before, while not guaranteeing people would like what they have now . People often remember forms of entertainment in two ways at the same time: its overall feel, and memorable pieces of it (the cool parts). For example, in this vid asmon remembered D2 / WC3 cinematics as being awesome, and then he showed us the cool parts, which there were many of. Right now, for more and more people, WoW has an unimpressive, underwhelming and bland overall feel, and cool parts that you think about later and proudly want to share with others are scarce and brief. They need to figure out how to at least be cool again, and then maybe eventually they can be badass again.
They are trying to make same thing happen to WH40k lore. And WH40k is arguably the last masculine franchise right now.
If it hasn't fallen it's on the brink with the female custodes shit.
@@MightOfChrist that's the unfortunate reality and best advice I can give is just don't get too attached to any media because at some point it will get corrupted by you-know-whos.
Oh no, women in gaming 😮
@@newguyiswinning noone had any problem with adepta sororitas, what's your point?
@@MatjeBalovichman doesn’t know the nuns with guns is loved by the entire community n we still starving for lore that could’ve went to them instead of the custodes
Dragonflight is the worst cinematic they've ever done, may as well be unicorns, ponies and rainbows with the power of friendship and family. RIP
Hired to many Bronies or adults who watch Bluey by themself
Because it's all leftist activists. They have no creativity. Only trying to force their worldview down people's throats in every medium they can.
Honestly, the opening cinematic is to date the worst WoW cinematic I have ever seen.
You know their storytelling is cooked when “Hmmm that thing Raszageth is making an awful amount of sense”
"Tell them only that the Lich King is dead! And that World of Warcraft died with him!"
SOOOOO TRUUUUE!
You forgot the most important part: "NOW GO, LEAVE THIS GAME, AND NEVER RETURN!"
lich king is the most overhyped lore in warcraft . try reading it. it sucks :p
@@skatarin1690 well thats the point asmon was making we ddinte carre about the lore but the little we knew it about made it sooooooooo hype the lich king cinematique mannnnnnnnnnnnn
@@skatarin1690It's badass as fuck though. Why would I read it anyway, it's a fucking game
This is why I still play Classic Era. The gameplay is fun and the story is "Fuck you, kill dragons".
More like, "here you go, some simplified skills mechanics, the class teaching is gone, and the combat is boring, have fun with the cosmetics filth".
@@hachijospaniard5643Totally right, but the simplicity of combat/the world/basically anything in this game is what makes it beautiful. Ever chopped wood with an axe IRL? It's so simple, yet rewarding.
To be honest they milked the cow dry long time ago, Warcraft 4 RTS should have been released already preparing the platform for WOW2 .
They turned the frogs gay
So *that's* what Sylvanas' blight was doing...
Considering there is actually 2 gay frogs in Dragonflight... yeah
Did they? I thought it was the Titan's that turned the dragons AND frogs gay? If you look into the aqueducts you will find the frogs. Alex was right!
@@arlisongbird9386 considering they put an entire playable race into DF that revolves around fINdIng youR OwN idENtity ... jeah x2
They unironically took Warcraft and Hello Kitty Island Adventure and put them in a blender and made modern WoW.
Yup it’s the blue hair liberals they decided to hire
The latter of which is actually a game now.
Butters was a visionary
Funny, I remember very clearly, that when Bfa was going on, the forums were filled with posts about how the conflict between horde and alliance is boring and old and no one wants to see or hear any of that shit anymore. Blizzard listened to their community and changed it. And now everyone is crying to revert back.
The community is the reason why the game goes into the gutters.
I wasn't reading the WoW forums, but the consensus I got from people I was playing with while playing BfA was - before BfA dropped - people were hyped to get back to Alliance vs Horde(though we should probably do something about that sword Sargeras stabbed into Azeroth first...), but the presentation was horribly disconnected, it was massively driven by the most insane, least logical version of Sylvanas we'd ever seen(a character that had already been insane and illogical since she was first raised as a banshee, more or less), there were 25 different stories going on at the same time, and then we got the kicker at the end that it was a bait and switch; the Battle for Azeroth was never between the Alliance and the Horde, but two years of garbage to retcon the entirety of Warcraft lore into Zovaal's story in Shadowlands - even going so far as advertising Shadowlands as the "final chapter" of WC3... then the expansion turning out so bad that the majority of the events that happened in it are completely ignored and wiped from memory, just like WoD.
@@Unregistered.HyperCam.2 Ok I do agree with this, but on the other hand you said it yourself. Sylvanas has been illogical and irrational since the very beginning of her introduction as a forgotten. So her continuing being irrational makes kind of .....sense?
Doesn't mean that I think it's a good premise and everything and honestly, I wish they'd have never included Shadowlands the way they did. Because now we will get bs like the "short-term" revival of Ysera to fill the plot....
WoW Dragonflight looks like a bootleg mmo based on "How To Train Your Dragon", and even then HTTYD, which is a "childrens" movie went into deeper and darker themes...
Exactly.
"We're vikings. It's an occupational hazard."
I feel like there was always drama between characters, Jaina and Thrall, her father losing his shit, her protecting a friend. It's just that the drama is now "we all need to love each other" and not well crafted conflict.
Why does fantasy have to represent the modern world, or our reality at all? It just doesn't make sense, it's all a nonsense.
Even some of the stuff I had sitting around as ideas back then years ago were miles better than what's out for Warcraft right now, at least for pre-WoW (or even set during WoW but with Wc3 game mechanics). Heck, one of them even involved a Burning Legion Agent (one of Tichondrius' to be exact) doing work to set up the Invasion of Kalimdor and Felwood's corruption (and getting into conflict with a fellow agent; don't you love when bad guys get into scuffles with each other?).
Because frankly, the setting is called WAR-Craft, and not LOVE-Craft.
Daelin Proudmoor was right all along.
@@jamespadgett8660 Kind of funny that Daelin and Garithos were proven completely right by Wow's story while the writers wanted them to be completely wrong.
Daelin Proudmoore did not lose his shit . He saw his eldest son burned to a crisp by dragon riding orcs . Vengeance for the sake of a loved one is not madness
The cut scene where Arthas returns home and says "Succeeding you." is permanently etched into my mind and -- I S -- Warcraft.
Gives me chills every time I watch it that and the Wotlk reveal cinematic
"Times change!"
- Garrosh Hellscream
The problem in todays society is that the Orc are supposed to hold a parade flag instead of a sword.
I havent played retail wow since the launch of BFA. I recently came back, logged into my goblin rogue in Org. It was like rainbows and butterflies and i immediately just logged back out.
"You changed" said the person that finally got what he wanted.
Worst psyop phrase used in modern history.
Actual gaslighting
@@gonefishing9781truth
Funny seeing the people defending the modern WoW story using the same "modern audience" arguments that has been proven time and time again to be non-existant.
In 2009 when WotLK introduced Dungeon Finder so people wouldn't have to talk with each other anymore and also multiple difficulties for the raid so people didn't have to git gud anymore. WoW became bad when it became mainstream, just like the entire gaming scene.
What most people don't know is that the "people on the top" are not even in Blizz or Microsoft. They are in Blackrock....
That's why everyone pissed about the Warhammer 40K retcon. We know, this is the first slip on the slippery-slope. We know it, they know it, everyone knows it. There is no stop on the lame train.
its a retcon of a retcone tho, half of 40k lore is a retcon at this point lol
@@wapniak666the problem isn't that there is a retcon, it's why they're doing it and how
@@BoredMarcus why is because money, it's GW afterall
How, it's as bad as always
Good thing about warhammer is that is soo full of shitty lore than you can ignore stuff that you don't like
@@wapniak666i would believe that but companies have stayed losing millions for going woke. So what exactly are they doing it for? Esg ratings have destroyed modern media aka 🇮🇱
Oh no, women in 40k!! 😮
Pretty much most of WoW's modern lore must be retconned, erased and forgotten.
Shadowlands.
a Warcraft 3 purist WoW would be nice with 4 starting factions
Alliance: Stormwindian Human, Gnome, Bronzebeard Dwarf, High Elf
Horde: Orc, Darkspear Troll, Tauren, Ogre
Forsaken: Undead Human, Undead Elf, Alteraci Human, Blood Elf
Sentinels: Night Elf, Furbolg, Cenarius' Children, Dark Troll
@@DavidGlendaleArdenaso Gnomes are tr**, bro, so no.
Just a dream, we got punshed by garrosh for helping anduin in a quest, waking up now.. totaly war like Cata/Mop.
@@DavidGlendaleArdenasoAgreed. They shouldn't all be crammed into 2 factions. Like whose idea was to put the undead (forsaken) in the horde? The horde must be made up of orcs, trolls and tauren tops, no fucking blood elves and undead. It makes no fucking sense. I am saying this as an alliance player.
What pisses me off is that there are always people defending downgrading, and not only in gaming. Every form of critique is met with "just shut the fuck up and stop whining you hater, if you don't like it just don't play/watch this". If i don't like something it is my right to express it, I don't need you to tell me whether or not my "hating" is justified or not. People defending shitty work are part of the problem because when anything goes to shit you just have to watch and god forbid you say you don't like the change because you're immediately ostracized.
The D2 Mt.Arreat(act 5) cinnematic was amazing too.
The story had set stakes in Wacraft 3 that made it clear what failure meant in the end. The world tree was the last bastion for both Horde and Alliance and the Night Elves.
Failure meant extinction for all but nowadays even in dragonflight's story we don't even know the consequences of losing a world tree in a different dimension like wtf. Also end of the world stories can absolutely be reused again, remember Legion? People felt something when Tirion died, when Varian went out like a G and when the Horde roared in Vol'jin's funeral.
Was it mature? Fuck no but it was so much better than the glorified therapy sessions we have in the modern story.
Right, we were never told what would happen if Fyrakk was able to claim Amirdrassil as his own. Oh but wait, we were. He would've used it to destroy the world, just like Archimonde planned to do with Hyjal. I don't think anyone here actually plays WoW anymore, you just lurk in your basements and whine about how "WoW is woke now" just because the faction war's gone, and the lore dares to try to be a smidge more inclusive.
There are still factional tensions, it's just not about the Alliance and Horde directly anymore. Because that concept was sucked dry by the end of Wrath, it made no sense that we were competing with the opposite faction to kill Arthas first. Imagine if Lord of the Rings ended with each of the Free Peoples separately competing to be the ones to destroy the Ring and kill Sauron. He would've wiped them all out. And that's how stupid the faction war has looked ever since we faced extinction at the hands of an enemy that could convert every slain soldier into his forces, regardless of how they died.
@@Mister_Vyar how many world ending threats end up being hollow and empty because a group of 10/25 rag tag heroes just show up and slap the bad guy down, then are forgotten so Varian/Thrall/Jaina/etc can take the credit.
"The Light-AAAAARGHHHH"
-The Ashbringer
It's because if you lose, you get participation medal too, so they stopped the storytelling that values victory at all costs, they want to include all races and genders so we can all have fun together and nobody gets hurts, it's no longer warcraft, it's communitycraft.
@@Mister_Vyar You a funny guy tbh. I never put forth anything related to politics and you put words in my mouth to attack a point that doesn't exist.
Point 1: At what point did I say anything about faction conflict? Never said anything remotely close about reigniting the faction war.
Point 2: At what point did I say anything about WoW being woke? I said glorified therapy sessions so I dunno if you misconstrued that with being left leaning which would be hilarious if that's the case.
Point 3: At what point in the cinematics was it made EXPLICITLY clear that Fyrakk would use the world tree the exact same way Archimonde did? Was it hidden behind the wall of texts that 90% of people don't actually read? Was it on a throwaway dialogue mentioned once or twice? Please do tell me.
Point 4: It's funny how you'll resort to ad hominems and label people criticizing the game as whiny basement dwellers(kinda ends up looking like you're projecting) when in reality their criticisms regarding the story are well founded when you compare the popularity of the story in modern WoW to the popularity of the story of WoW in the past.
Point 5: You're right actually I don't play WoW anymore. I quit after SL and when I found the systems and story telling in other MMOs much more appealing me and thousands of others realized just how much WoW was missing the whole damn time.
Point 6: If you are defending the story of Dragonflight something tells me you're part of the audience that modern blizzard appeals to nowadays that will eat whatever shit content they're fed and say thank you while getting fed garbage.
I keep laughing whenever I hear someone says that alliance and horde NEED to team up again
it was badass the first time but making it a habit is a little too much
This was cool.... but as an echo of what "could have been" if Azeroth hadn't fallen to war and genocide for generations. It was a very unique situation in legion and it was creative, at the time... I remember my friends and I all gasping and going ARE WE GOING TO ALL FIGHT THIS TOGETHER?!.... Now the dividing line of Horde and Alliance has become so thin that they might as well just make it non-faction based and you can play who you want, with whoever you want.
It's just so far gone now.
Those are INHERENTLY different groups with different world views, them teaming up should've been only happening during legion. Kind of like the Allies teamed up with USSR to take down Germany
@@SleepingForestGaming It was only "cool" because it was meant to be a 1 time thing, never again. Now they do that bullshit ever expansion. It completely undermines the role of Thrall and Jaina as skilled diplomats.
I don't mind them teaming up for a common cause, but them ACTUALLY teaming up Is just like..wtf?? Like nah there's no way they'd actually be allies like that 😂😂😂
I also heard guilds will be able to be cross faction now both alliance and horde. Just such a dumb ass thing. I was considering coming back to WoW last year but I'm good now LOL
"seek me out" gave me chills hearing that again...
09:40 this scene was a poster on everyones wall, a desktop wallpaper and is printed on shirts to this day.
The video game landscape has never been more fertile for someone to come in and make the most hardcore, brutal, masculine, sexy, and no fucks given approach to a game than right now. We are begging for it.
Good luck finding any non-ESG funding.
@@lorecow88 I'm probably stupid but what the hell is esg? I goggled it and games, and it just looks like some company that made a lot of pretty generic mobile looking games. So I"m confused.
I can't remember what the exact acronym stands for, but it's essentially your anti white and anti heterosexual score. The less of those two things your product is, the more funding you get. If that's sounds rarded, it's because it is.
@@jamespadgett8660 Huh guess maybe they funded forspoken then. Can't think of any other games, as I've played a lot of the more 'controversial' games in recent memory and none seemed like a game they would of funded
@@luxnoriaEnvironmental, Social, and Government Score. It's a score for investors to determine a company's commitment to these three standards, to determine its sustainability by way of ethical perception.
Or, in layman's terms: Instead of making a good product and making bank off selling a product to a customer, a company will kowtow to what is currently perceived as popular in those three sectors(environment, society, government) - all of which vary from region to region, and can change at the drop of a dime - to attract investors and get kickbacks.
The Warcraft intro cinematic is the sole reason I got the 7th legion plate set from warfronts. I was finally able to be the Alliance soldier on that rock signaling the charge.
God, that original Footman drip was unmatched.....
when i was a kid my fav units in wc3 was the footman. they just looked badass and the voice actor for them in the german version sounded cool too, just a badass knight going up against orcs and the undead. and yes,, the warfront set is badass.
FFXIV seems to have more of a harsh world than WoW. And it has Lalafells.
Thrall deserved better than getting turned into a god damn my little pony character.
Those playable Dragons look like Hasbro toys.
_Hasbro_ toys?
Ouch...
Current Hasbro toys at that.
It doesn’t help that all of the spoken dialogue in the game now is slow where the speaker pauses every couple words to sigh or pause for emotional effect.
After watching the cinematic of the dragons right after the Warcraft 3 cinematic, it feels like I'm watching a GTA roleplay, but one of the worst RP sessions.
The difference between storytellers and writers. Storytellers want to tell a good story while writers want to write a good story. Between the two, writers are more likely to get self-indulgent and try their hand at waxing poetically, while a storyteller is more likely to show not tell. You need to be both a writer and storyteller to tell a good story, but I'll take a good storyteller over a good writer any day, and the same goes for a bad storyteller and a bad writer.
Food for thought; perhaps oldschool warcraft was traditionally masculine while current retail is the emasculation.
It was made for the audiance wich was 99% males, now they trying to make it 50/50 but the divice is no more than 80/20 probably.
This reminds me of the words from the yakuza game director, Masayoshi Yokoyama. About how the yakuza game series's target audience is Japanese males and how over the years it has gained an audience of westerners as well, because they are attracted to the japanese aspects of the game. Trying to cater to the new western audience will only alienate the current western audience who likes the game series because of its japanese aspects.
Honestly it's just a trend for everything. They want to emasculate males as females are much better consumers. Any guy you see chasing status beyond money and power is just a on that train.
@@torum6448 This is such a great point
Definitely plays a role in it. That, and the desire to not offend anyone at any cost.
Another issue is that Blizzard couldn't manage to keep WoW's faction war going, they kept thinking that these conflicts had to be something they had to eventually resolve instead of continually use as a narrative device for other things like classic did. The writers are too obsessed with the idea that there has to be a happy ending or all the problems in WoW have to be solved by the end of an expansion.
I don't think it needs a happy ending necessarily, but I do think it needs an end. We have had so many expansions of back and forth war (of usually the same groups) or "fight the current big bad guy". If the story is always Horde vs. Alliance back and forth forever, then why care who is winning or even fighting? The problem is also that people don't care for the "peaceful" alterative either. That is just boring for an MMO.
They just need to bring the story to a close, but make it inherently cool and fun along the way. Or come up with something that isn't Horde vs. Alliance or another big bad guy, and especially not a bunch of passive characters.
@@keithbassett007i dont think they need to bring the story to a close. I think they just need to end it. What would be a better way for the world of WARcraft to end than the bad guy winning, destroying the entire alliance and horde factions; and the servers going offline. I cant eemember his name but i think the big swirly demon guy from BC would be perfect to bring back and he actually wins. What if it turns out he was "mind controlling" alld the players and we were really working for HIM the entire time?
Id rather it be some epic battle and cliffhanger than a closure and a succint ending. Just like the ultimate end to a war, i think the only true way to end it is for all the PC's to "die" canonically and no more expansions after that.
@@keithbassett007they could use the warhammer treatment. If there are more races like main big races u can have WARS with then u can keep ur WARS and fun characters. But its just child ish alliances vs horde. Breaking up the alliances won’t really work cause their now way to connect and established. Some may go alone but yea to forced. I don’t see humans, dwarfs and gnomes break their to well connected. Horde was always bit fragile except maybe orc and tauren maybe goblins but their more mercenary type of people i think. Whatever this ip suffers from staying alive to long making it bloated u run out of space gods to kill. Idc about any big bad god or light, dark whatever color is the hype. Reason i now like warhammer fantasy so much more now yes yes.
Disney Syndrome.
@@whenimmanicimgodly4228 Honestly the idea of the bad guy winning and shutting down the servers is cool. I would be cool with that. I just think the theme of Alliance vs Horde or "big bad guy" is stale at this point in this game. Either revamp it or end it.
Current writers are trying to lull people into passivity so that they don't realize that the stories of good and evil in all these games are just parallels to the real world
everyone likes to say classic is too easy but in retail you legit pull 50 mobs and never die till end game because leveling doesn't matter in retail questing is so dam boring its awful
retail is about end game, after 20 years no one wants to have challenging leveling content, people done it dozens of time and just want to play their alt on max lvl
@@wapniak666 Sorry just raiding is boring some ppl dont like to wipe on the same boss for 3 hours
@@haishish4967 ok so maybe mmos are not for you? how many times can you play classic leveling experience and not get bored?
especially as classic class desing is sooo bland
i would rather play retail leveling than classic simply because at least something is happening and im not stuck using frostbolt for 50 levels
@@wapniak666 braw trying to say mmo are not for me just cuz i dont want to spend 3 hours on a boss lmao go look at ff players its nowhere as long fights. At least classic has a good story and the world feels alive retail is dogwater story
@@haishish4967 classic has no story
FF is completely different game
If you want easy raid then you have LFR on retail, a bit harder than classic raids
Yeah like in the lore of totalwarhammer/warhammer fantasy lore right now, its awesome because its just a slew of guys and gals fighting to survive in a world filled with war while at the same time uncovering all the mysterious chaos shenanigans.
Ever since they made the focus on making your toon into the "chosen one" everything in lore is just basically you tea bagging things left and right and the protag characters having an internal crisis on the side.
I mostly dislike chosen one plots in normal RPGs, but they make even less sense to me in an MMO where you're playing with thousands of other people all doing the same things. I'm not an MMO player, but I think if I was my ideal scenario there would be playing a character who just fits in as a normal part of the world. Like obviously you're always gonna be stronger than the NPCs, but at least try to pass it off like the players are a normal part of the world.
Or if you're gonna do the chosen one thing, do it like Morrowind or Divinity Original Sin 2. In those games the player is potentially the "chosen one", but there are actually an untold number of other "chosen ones" who could equally complete the task. So you're special compared to most NPCs, but you're far from the only one.
"Chosen one" isn't wrong as there many successful games with chosen one theme however... the way Blizzard developed their character and existing faction is just not it.. they fail at something that is crucial to make "chosen one" plot work well.
Somehow Warcraft "Champion" are drifting between chosen one and bring random elite NPC while the real main characters are somehow got hurt by the "chosen one" player part of the lore make them less important and not interesting as it should be.
Original WoW have player nerd out loud when they see their favorite character from W3 and now Blizzard destroyed half of that characters
I fucking love Warhammer fantasy lore.
@@mickbotcast i miss it, when we were just one of the many random heroes supporting a faction.
Imagine a modern World of Warcraft without cartoony Pixar trash. It would be glorious.
But no, the game has to appeal to as many people as possible.
The cartoony look was always my biggest turn off to the game. I know style is an opinion, so I get the people who loved/love WOW. It's also why I never got into Champions online. Certain cartoony animation is just not my thing.
And it ends up appealing to no one.
@@bl8388 I understand your preferences, because it's the same reason I could never get into asian MMOs, but even if WoW has always had a cartoony look, it used to be a lot darker and grittier than what we have now. Now everyone is smooth, round, and overly emoted. Back in the day, it was a heavy metal cartoon kind of.
Man that dragon player model is so incredibly deviant art lame. Doesn’t even look like it would fit in Azeroth, looks nothing like any other Dragonkin. Looks like something a fetish art teenager would make. So glad I don’t play anymore jeeeez
they got rid of the best jokes in the game. Make it safe for us. Yet the company can't make it a safe workplace.
OMG when you watch those two cinematics back to back it makes you want to puke at what WoW has become…
Wow's lore and in game story has become boring because writers got replaced with a bunch of RP'ing furries that "learned to write" by writing fan fiction and now are just writing the BIOs for their OCs over and over.
wows story was always boring, from day one. it was hyper generic fantasy, the lore was good, but the storytelling wasnt. Lore and Story are not the same thing. You might have tasty carrots and potatoes but if you dont know how to cook, they will never become a stew.
Yea. They used to hire acrual like legit AUTHORS to comr and write lore for them. Now they dont, and you can tell.
@@Shiirowi fundamentally disagree. If you actually paid attention snd read the quests and saw what you were doing in vanilla throufh MoP it was very good lore, good story telling- but was never the full story just a segment of one. The books gave the rest of the context.
@@Shiirow it was only boring if you didn't pay attention to it, read stuff, and actually care. The WoW lore is some of the most interesting lore in any gaming franchise IMO but they ruined it when MoP and BCpt2 finished
As a furry myself I disagree with this statement, if these people were use to Rping at all the stories would of been better. These people are just the writing version of that "game journalist" that played cup head or the other that played doom. They are people who's talent is 'probably' else where hired on for a writing role to most likely save money. Hell they probably just called in the janitor one day and asked them to write the story dragonflight.
This might be hot take but ive never seen Taurens as furrys. Always thought of them as some badass Minotaur's.
Man I remember rolling a Gnome and the game just hits you with "Your leader messed up and killed most of your people, your one of the last survivors in a war torn world, good luck" or the pure vile evil nature of the Forsaken being one of the best representations of undead monsters in fiction being like a literal faction of deadites from Evil Dead but with magic and shit. The Gnomes were especially cool to me because despite their comedic relief tone, the fact they just bounce back from their whole people being wiped out was inspiring more so than any "Family" carebear route they were going as those little guys looked at literal mass death of their people and said "nah we'll win" and started working to rebuild like nothing happened those guys are giga chads and an example of don't judge a book by it's cover. Back to the undead they were also amazing because they came during a time when being evil and doing experiments on humans and stuff was super frowned upon if you were the player character doing it, and Warcraft just was like "nah fam your an undead abomination this is what a Forsaken is" it's a by gone era I miss in fiction of both heroes and villians being what they were meant to be "Greater than Human" both physically and mentally.
old wow lore is making it to the second movie and being shocked and surprised that Darth Vader is Luke's father. Modern wow is "Some how, palpatine returned"
I was told before WoW even existed that Palpatine kept clones of himself so that he could transfer his essence into them. Apparently in one of the books or something a long time ago - I never read them. A friend told me, but that was ... maybe back when EQ was the primary MMO.
All comes down to the need of making fantasy games a reflection of contemporary real life politics. Who f*king asked for it?
EDIT: And yes, the lawsuits made Blizz virtue signal like crazy just to prove they don't have rotten apples in their midsts.
Well they also hired a bunch of people during shadowlands and cleared house... seems the hiring was of the rainbow type.
Body type 1 and body type 2
“When did Warcraft become boring?”
When you add-ons became mandatory to raid. There’s an add-on for basically anything in the game. You may as well consider it an idle mmo at this point. They need to ban all them shits.
I stopped playing WoW around dragonflight since I realized that the reason why I wasn't enjoying myself was that I was no longer the target audience. Mythic raiding alone is not enough to keep me engaged with the franchise.
Yea i dipped out a bit before that because i was tired of having to run fucking RAIDS for Wpvp gear. Was rediculous. I want to play pvp not pve all pvp gear should come from pvp 😂😂
respect that you could hold that long. I stopped in Cata. Tried 2 times later with other expansions but just for a month
@@whenimmanicimgodly4228 what pvp gear came from a raid? lol
@@whenimmanicimgodly4228 doing pve to get gear for pvp was always a thing
@jointser1008 bruh, no it wasnt 😂😂😂 I literally remember the patch it was added and we had full guilf discussions and training going on before it went into effect because of it. Bffr man
Maybe the real treasure was the friends we slaughter along the way
- Arthas
probably
The way they ended Arthas's story was very symbolic of how the writers of WoW wanted to move towards their new themes.
Just compare Warcraft 3 cinematic: Arthas kills his King Father(ARTHAS' BETRAYAL) with this 12:53
When they decided Paladins shouldn't be Heavy Metal avengers that burned the undead from the inside out, but instead gave them pink armour. That's when things really started going downhill, in TBC somewhere.
This is why everyone is so upset about 40k getting changed with FSM and stuff. I can feel the tone shift coming
It's really funny to me. As a huge warcraft 3 fan back in the day, this exactly encapsulates how I felt about og wow, and especially later on when they completely changed the draenei to look like Kil'jaeden or Archimonde, when originally they were super fucking ugly and looked nothing like that at all in wc3.
i knew it all went to shit when i found out muradin wasn't actually dead but instead had amnesia,
less of an impact when arthas threw away his advice
I enjoyed the OG WoW trilogy a lot, but what they did to the Night Elves bothered me something fierce. I rolled Horde as my first characters and they were all fairly faithful to W3 (especially the Forsaken being unapolagetic evil bastards) but the NElves were watered down so much from the fierce almost barbaric people they were in W3.
@@Staz Oh, yeah every damn dead character, that had a big role in wc3 and died, coming back so you can turn them into a bossfight annoyed me too.
Basically invalidated a lot of the drama wc3 had.
100,000% agree, that footman is what I want, it's all I ever wanted. A cool dude in armor defending his land and people. We don't need to slander the orcs, but we know we're the heroes and somewhere, that stopped being the story.
I think part of the problem for me is that WoW team is pre-occupied with things being "Beautiful" rather than "Cool"
Old Warcraft wasn't particularly deep. It didn't concern itself with being deep, but with being "Cool"
And now WoW has been consumed by the drama of their main characters. The "World" of Warcraft is not a place where we inhabit our characters and go on adventures, it is a setting for the character drama of Anduin, Thrall, Jaina, and the other main characters of WoW.
the "you grew up and you changed" thing doesnt apply to everyone. I'm 24 and never played wow back in the day. First time i got into it was when WoD released and then i played in dragonflight. But after trying classic and tbc i have to say, i liked the game more how it was back then.
exactly, i started game at Mists of Pandaria xpack and whenever i see Lich king zones or even Cata zones i never been before it gives such feeling this feeling "oh wow this is Warcraft!".
But the majority of people are just nostalgic boomers
@@katanaswing3082 they are definitely not majority anymore, most of "nostalgic boomers" quit the game meanwhile subscription numbers shows how many new furries/disney millenial joined to community. My point is you don't need nostalgia to enjoy/realise game in totally diffrent tone, which sucks.
10:28 Thrall in Warcraft 3 was younger than Anduin was in Battle for Azeroth btw
"i am not this person anymore" dude you never were you were mind controlled....forcing emotions
The simple answer to “why” is that none of the people who made the art you love don’t work for blizzard anymore.
silvanas breaks the helmet, absorbs its power and becomes a raid boss. you beat her and she runs to the jailer, which to that point is still an unknown and unheard of entity, and asks for power. he endorses her and you have to beat her in a second fight and then the jailer himself punishes her by destroying her soul after you killed her, to show his power. then he steps into the ring and you beat him in the next fight. after you do the world starts breaking apart because he has a plan that you yet don't understand and you get a second cataclysm.
the ancients of the then old world can be the same soft and emotionally damage people as now, living in regret and trying to fix what is lost, but the change is irreversible and factions arise that try to just survive, oppose the regression or welcome the new, or are new with this world altogether.
now go out and find, conquer and kill whatever mystery, uncharted land and monster exists in this new world. the ancients then plot to revive the jailer to try return to the old ways and almost destroy the world, which was his mentioned plan all along and you have to stop him, again, but this time for real.
I have never played wow and know next to nothing of the story, but from all the complaining I've heard, something like this sounds much better than what is actually in the game and would go a long way to preempt a lot of the "we're all family" writing that seems very misplaced in a world created with conflict and advertised as literal "world of WARcraft".
but this is just the opinion of someone who obsessively loves writing and world building.
When they started to hire far left extremists instead of og developers.
Pretty much, World of Warcraft into World of Dragon Tales (1999 TV Show)
Those og developers were the ones sexually harassing women bro.
@@blacksunshine9995 Yup, incels make great games lol
@@blacksunshine9995 but what is a woman, "bro"?
It all started when universities started offering game development courses and the barrier to entry became much lower with engines like Unity and GameMaker Studio. In my experience, chads go into computer sci, engineering or other STEM subjects and the weirdos go into video games since they're not good at anything else. This has led to the gaming industry becoming dominated by weak, stupid people, whereas, for the first 20 years of the industry, gaming was dominated by genius mathematicians and computer engineers since they were the only people talented enough to make games.
I know nothing about WOW but I like baldy getting mad at it
The only thing you need to know is that it went from Metal AF to Disney play house happy unicorn melody time.
@@soulextracter But only recently tbh. even shadowlands wasn't like that
So much for those Warcraft Story ideas I had sitting around for years.
They were going to be part of a semi-anthology known as the Infinite Chronicles and followed a number of original characters as they went through their own stories, basically being able to be their own thing within the setting. And still being, you know, WarCraft rather than "mah fee-fees" central.
Oh well. At least I can make use of them in my own stuff sometime in the future.
If they would bring back the brutal fantasy that warcraft used to represent then I would at least consider to return.
Everyones trying to be game of thrones, and id rather have the Illiad,
That's actually being a general phenomenon.
If you compare Warhammer artistical old style with it's new ones, you will find this cartoonization as well.
But Warhammer is so grimmdark and brutal in it's original form, that even after that phenomenon he's still into a extreme-middle grimdark degree. Something that made me like Warhammer more than Warcraft in this recent times. And it's not even about adding women charachters and such (don't care about that). It's really about making adult franchises into non-adult to sell more. Making them full Fantasy instead of dealing with the reality of our own world, that is fullfilled with hatred and violence that these games intent to satirize/criticize.
(I personally love the cartoonization more) That's not to say I don't want dark games, and stuff like that and I think it can work regardless of the artstyle as long as they commit to it and the writing is good. But the super detailed, or super gritty style just never appeals to me cause it's so ugly to look at.
I'm 39 this year, I'm older than asmongold, I remember all this shit. But I don't think it's about how great all the old stuff was. It's just this american culture war bullshit. You see what you want to see, when you go looking for the thing you hate, you see it everywhere, it's the same for peeps on both sides of the fence.
true i was around on that time and wow was just an other game for nerds, nobody cares.
Warcraft 2000: "KILL, BLOOD, MURDER, STRENGTH, WAR."
Warcraft 2020: "wE sTaY toGeRther. We bRInG peAcE anD LoVE."
The masculine urge to fight in glorious melee combat against savages
Something happened around TBC, when they realized the concept of 'dailies' could be used to bring in people consistently. They kicked it up a notch in WotLK, making dailies and weeklies a larger part of the game, buying the weekly loot egg, doing the weekly Wintergrasp raid, weekly arena matches, do your daily profession transmute for free money. Every expac thereafter followed this formula, demanding a certain number of hours every day and week.
Lore is secondary, you don't get people beating the same dungeons 20 weeks in a row because of *lore*, they sign up because they think they have to or else they'll fall behind.
i mean tbc and especially classic had basically no lore
@@wapniak666 They had a ton of lore if you read the quests. But the devs lacked the ability to do anything more with their game given the inexperience, system restraints (WoW had to work on the potato pcs of the time), and inexperience with the tools of the engine.
@@GeorgeMonet >They had a ton of lore if you read the quests
i mean sure individual quests had some lore/story tied to them
but almost nothing was connected or made sense as a whole
some quests were longer and had a bit more going on but these stories never went anywhere
pretty much everything exist in a vacuum
Tbc was a bit better with that as we had an overarching story for entire expansion
Remeber when people thought MoP was too peaceful because Horde and Alliance were trying to bridge that gap? It's not that no one listened, Asmon. Been said for a decade. xD
So much feelings , lost musculinity ..this Game used to be good for mental relax.. now there is so much emotional stuff that I rathed kill somewhere else
Devs nowadays have zero creativity, they just rehash other shows/scenes into one turd blob of a game.
My brother in Christ, most developers nowadays are literally like brick layers, they just write the code for whatever shit their superiors want.
Long are the days past when devs were a crucial part of the minds behind the game's plot, gameplay and world building.
"To the East, always to the East." so awesome
But that cutscene wasn't represented anywhere in the actual game. The actual game was just running out killing some bugs or some stupid pygmies and constantly having to return to town to buy more potions to constantly chug. So boring and such asinine gameplay.
@@GeorgeMonet The game basically starts you off as being one step behind, and keeps it going. From the intro to the final cutscene of D2 (w/o LoD), you are racing to catch up to Marius and the Dark Wanderer, always missing what happened in the cutscenes by mere hours. There are multiple allusions to this in the game; NPCs referring to the Dark Wanderer party having just come through (you can even see him just out of reach at the beginning of Act 3). The narrative is a mixture of retrospection in the cutscenes and current events in the gameplay. I quite like the tension this setup provides.
As for the gameplay, I guess that's a matter of preference. D2's got the ARPG formula down pat; some would argue it perfected it at the time. It's certainly - and naturally - very different from today's offerings in the genre.
Gay centaur marriage in game as a quest. 🤡🤖
The thing that pisses me off the most about this is that he says the games don’t have it anymore… neither do the movies.