I was shocked by how cool the concept it was, especially after I had such a strong dislike of the Wizard Slayer for such a long time. I think this is a winning combo for anti-caster combat, I hope you rock it!
@@Redjoy123 I was playing a Wizard Slayer/Thief and during the fight with Irenicus my entire team stood by and watched as Irenicus got every single spell wrong. Fighting him was fun, I could do anything I wanted to him, the rest of us stood by and watched because it wouldn't be fair for anyone else to slap him when he himself was doing no better than a stressed out schoolboy before a test.
@@jacekgadysz184 I love that stuff! I can't imagine that it was easy to go through but I love the fact that you worked through this and came out with a character who was a BEAST against mages! Nicely done!
Ranger dual classed to Cleric is a very nive Demon Slayer With Demonic/fell as your racial ennemies. You also have great two weapons profiencies slots. Swashbuckler dual classed to fighter is one of my favorite builds as well as Swashbuckler dual classes to mage. I also really like the simple Wizard lvl 2 dual classed to fighter. Gives your fighter the ability to read scrolls and use wizard wans as well a few first levels spells like find familiar abd Protection against evil. Gives you access to amuley of power and staff of the magi wich is pretty cool.
These are all interesting choices! For me, I usually stay away from dual-classing into a Fighter just because the HLAs and later abilities aren't so great, but I can see the synergy between Swashbuckler (which I'm not a big fan of by itself) and Fighter. I also get the Mage to Fighter at a low level, but I feel like getting a casting of Mirror Image or Web could be useful for a Fighter (dual-classing to Level 3 vs. Level 2). The Demon Slayer is interesting and I like the idea of a Cleric with more proficiency points for the weapons they can use. What level would you make that switch to Cleric?
Well, I would make the swap at 7th level at least to get the extra half attack per round. As the Ranger isn’t allowed Grand Mastery. But another good combo is the Archer, Wich I would wait about to level 9. Specialize in Slings and gets +3 to hit and Missile damage bonus at level 9, and you get Cleric Spells like DUHM that gives you Strenght l. Slings do get Strenght damage adj. So it mixes well. Plus you can equip a Shield and switch to dual wielding Maces or hammers if rushed into melee.
Good Question, personally, I think that Dual-Classing a Fighter to Cleric is stronger than a Fighter-Cleric Multiclass. The character who Dual-Classes gets the full HP of a Fighter for as many levels as they are a Fighter while the Multiclass character has to split that HP. The Dual-Class character gets to focus on one class at a time before switching, which means that they will be a stronger character faster than having to split the XP like a multiclass character. Dual-Classing allows character to take advantage of particular kits while Multi-classing does not. Finally, the weakness of Dual-Classing is that the character loses higher-level abilities from their first class, but of the four main classes the Fighter has the strongest early game and the "weakest" later game while Clerics and Mages are the opposite. But with that said, you can certainly have a great time playing a multi-class Fighter Cleric, I just prefer Dual-classing.
Thank you! That's what I will go with. I made a Berserker/Mage Dual and I'll make a berserker/cleric dual to go with him. Two fighter caster duals to take through the whole trilogy!!
Yeah! I feel like Fighters and Divine Casters go really well together, a Fighter/Druid is a beefed up Ranger. Sure, there are things they can't specifically do that Paladins and Rangers can do (like use bows, swords, or... Tracking! LOL), but they prove to be more tanky and devastating with their spells (like Ironskins).
Hahaha! Yeah, even though it’s just an example, I am sorry for triggering you and all of the viewers of this video. An amazing blade as such shouldn’t be ignored.
Kenzai / thief is really powerfull, i made a thief have all the skills of all thief kits. And then i played kenzai to 13, and dual classed in bg2. Grandmastery katana + item upgrade mod + hammer/axe vs undead. I play on legacy or bhaal solo, super fun. Thief is a really fun class. Currently i play fighter/druid multi class on lob difficulty, and its in bg1ee and that things litterally speedwalk true the outdoor areas xD i dont need the fighter stuff yet, but will come handy later with hla and shapechange hla’s. I also altered insect plague and creeping doom to have damage progression on certain levels. And one druid casted it on me in bgee, and that thing gotta have inzane level. Because his insect plague did 4 damage each time, which was double in lob. So i basicly took 8 damage each tic lol. So i just tricked him outside to my 2 fire elementals + 3 nymphs and flooded him with Lightning :p
Kensai thief gets a kai + backstab + grandmastery in quarter staff combo. I've used that with staff or ram +12 to one shot a fire giant in Yagashura's lair.
That Staff +12 is pretty cool but the limited charges really turned me off, especially if I miss most of those hits (which a Kensai Thief who is good with Staves shouldn't have too many issues with, but everybody rolls 1s). Nicely done with that Fire Giant! One shotting one of those isn't easy!
So I’m not the biggest fan of Dual-Classing into Fighter but I get the appeal both from the perspective of getting Iron Skins AND the Warewolf forms/tokens. I don’t see this as the craziest combo in the world but you’ll have to deal with being a Fighter who trades a bit of HP and weapon access for some pretty powerful spells and pretty much being immune to normal weapons.
Can you dual class into a sub class? For example I’m thinking of an evil play through and thought a Blackguard/Assassin would be fitting for a true son of Bhaal.
Unfortunately no. I believe that in 2.5 Ed. of D&D (used in Baldur's Gate EE), you aren't able to multiclass Paladins or Paladin subclasses (like the Blackguard). There might be a way to do it with editors, but even with EEKeeper, I'm not sure if the game will let you make this combo. Plus, you can't really dual-class into a kit outside of the main class (i.e. dual-class into an Assassin), only from the kits (dual-class from an Assassin). This would be an awesome idea for a character though! Sneaking around and getting a massive backstab followed by using the Blackguard spells and abilities to stick around in the front line. It's a bummer that you can't really make that specific thing happen in the base game.
So, what I would do is level up to Level 13 for Wizard Slayer (though Level 9 can work as well, you've passed that point so best to go further). Once you get to Level 13 for Fighter, then Dual class to Thief and focus on ranged weapons (I think Crossbows are a good choice for Firetooth but you could also go Shortbows and be happy as well). The nice thing with that is that the point when you regain your Wizard Slayer levels, you'll be able to get UAI only a few levels more. For specific abilities, it really depends on what area of the game you're in. If you're very early on in Athkatla then you could go Lock Picking/Find Traps, then do the training at the Thieves' Guild. That's actually a pretty good bet to aim for early on for VERY easy experience. I hope that this helps!
@@Redjoy123 13th level seems pretty reasonable, but it's BGT and I'm not sure if I have miscast ability working with ranged weapons, I suppose without fix it's not working.
@@Redjoy123 I have checked, I have BGT by darktech ant it includes BGFix with ranged miscast for WS, so I'll be fine, but actually I started like with 4 stars in katana and double handed profficiency, so I must try to stick to this plan for more fun :)
This is rough, just because I would love everyone to experience everything right away, I would say try out each of the classes for a little bit to see their playstyle before preparing a Dual Classed character. I wouldn't even say to go through all of BG1 with each class, unless you REALLY want to do so, getting up to Level 5 or 6 should be good enough to get a good feel for each class you want to try. I would say that you'll probably want to know how Mages play in Baldur's Gates 1 and 2 (different from other modern D&D games) before creating a Fighter Dual to Mage. If you want to try it out right away, I would create a Fighter with Dexterity of 18 (which you should be doing anyway) then, if you like them and want to try something unique, have them Dual to a Thief (ideally at Level 9 but if you're just testing, then Level 7 can work as well). Thieves can be good for newbies to play to use certain mechanics and with the Fighter's HP, they can do pretty well.
I actually favor Bounty Hunter over Swashbuckler. Maybe for a Mage, a Swashbuckler isn't so bad, but I'm not very impressed with the kit compared to the other Thief kits.
btw even EE ruins the game I think, not only mods. I don't like anything this Edition brought to the game, except for cosmetic changes. For example, being able to hide in front of enemies is against traditional DnD rules, and you can easily avoid any enemy spells without using invisibility... cheesy.
I assume that you're talking about the Shadowdancer? And that you're not a fan? Okay, I respectfully disagree, but I get how it seems very cheesy to be able to pop in and out of shadows in the middle of combat. I would say that, if we were talking about traditional D&D, Elves and Dwarves were their own classes, not a race/species. Paladins, Druids, Bards, and Rangers weren't a thing. Clerics had super specific rules to their role playing that needed to be carried out otherwise they lose their divine casting. I don't disagree that EE added some elements that led to powercreep (why take a normal unkitted Thief when you could get the one who can hide in plain sight?) but traditional D&D would be a very different game from what I would want to play.
@@Redjoy123 Yes, I was referring to the Shadowdancer. Apart from the childish writing of the new NPCs in the Enhanced Editions, some aspects are completely overpowered and, frankly, ruin the experience. When I say "traditional D&D," I'm referring to the original Baldur's Gate II game. That game was created through extensive teamwork, testing, and balancing (just look at the credits). These new additions like the Enhanced Edition, mods, and tweaks are often developed unofficially by only a few people, sometimes even a single individual. Logically, the quality is bound to be lower compared to the original-and I can clearly see the difference. In other words, it’s like saying, "Hey, I’ve seen a movie with a werewolf, and it was amazing. The damage should be slashing and better"-something I often read on many BG websites. So, let's change this, let's change that… but in reality, it just results in a mess of "new" or "revised" spells and abilities that don’t make any sense and definitely don’t improve gameplay. I think the game is best as it is. I only play the Enhanced Edition due to cosmetic changes, avoiding most add-ons (e.g., Hexxat summoning an army of shades, each firing millions of lightning bolts and fireballs; Dorn the half-orc being gay [ahem]; Neera being an annoying, childish, soulless character; etc.). I also avoid items like the Robe of Vecna-anything included later that makes the game a cakewalk.
Hahahahahaha! Find a GM who says that your character has a 12 Str., a 13 Dex., a 14 Con.,... Then find a new GM who will actually let you build a good character. Thank you for the comment, you superior dice roller, you!
Wizard slayer thief sounds like what I will try next time
I was shocked by how cool the concept it was, especially after I had such a strong dislike of the Wizard Slayer for such a long time. I think this is a winning combo for anti-caster combat, I hope you rock it!
If you can hit a mage it’s going to die in two freaking seconds. I am not sure it makes as much sense irl than it does on paper.
I tried it, it wasn't worth it. WS is still crap
@@Redjoy123 I was playing a Wizard Slayer/Thief and during the fight with Irenicus my entire team stood by and watched as Irenicus got every single spell wrong. Fighting him was fun, I could do anything I wanted to him, the rest of us stood by and watched because it wouldn't be fair for anyone else to slap him when he himself was doing no better than a stressed out schoolboy before a test.
@@jacekgadysz184 I love that stuff! I can't imagine that it was easy to go through but I love the fact that you worked through this and came out with a character who was a BEAST against mages! Nicely done!
Ranger dual classed to Cleric is a very nive Demon Slayer With Demonic/fell as your racial ennemies. You also have great two weapons profiencies slots. Swashbuckler dual classed to fighter is one of my favorite builds as well as Swashbuckler dual classes to mage. I also really like the simple Wizard lvl 2 dual classed to fighter. Gives your fighter the ability to read scrolls and use wizard wans as well a few first levels spells like find familiar abd Protection against evil. Gives you access to amuley of power and staff of the magi wich is pretty cool.
These are all interesting choices! For me, I usually stay away from dual-classing into a Fighter just because the HLAs and later abilities aren't so great, but I can see the synergy between Swashbuckler (which I'm not a big fan of by itself) and Fighter. I also get the Mage to Fighter at a low level, but I feel like getting a casting of Mirror Image or Web could be useful for a Fighter (dual-classing to Level 3 vs. Level 2).
The Demon Slayer is interesting and I like the idea of a Cleric with more proficiency points for the weapons they can use. What level would you make that switch to Cleric?
Well, I would make the swap at 7th level at least to get the extra half attack per round. As the Ranger isn’t allowed Grand Mastery. But another good combo is the Archer, Wich I would wait about to level 9. Specialize in Slings and gets +3 to hit and Missile damage bonus at level 9, and you get Cleric Spells like DUHM that gives you Strenght l. Slings do get Strenght damage adj. So it mixes well. Plus you can equip a Shield and switch to dual wielding Maces or hammers if rushed into melee.
Great video king 👑
Thank you! I'm here to rock and play old games.
Question please: would you say a fighter dual cleric is more powerful than a fighter/cleric multiclass?
Good Question, personally, I think that Dual-Classing a Fighter to Cleric is stronger than a Fighter-Cleric Multiclass.
The character who Dual-Classes gets the full HP of a Fighter for as many levels as they are a Fighter while the Multiclass character has to split that HP.
The Dual-Class character gets to focus on one class at a time before switching, which means that they will be a stronger character faster than having to split the XP like a multiclass character.
Dual-Classing allows character to take advantage of particular kits while Multi-classing does not.
Finally, the weakness of Dual-Classing is that the character loses higher-level abilities from their first class, but of the four main classes the Fighter has the strongest early game and the "weakest" later game while Clerics and Mages are the opposite.
But with that said, you can certainly have a great time playing a multi-class Fighter Cleric, I just prefer Dual-classing.
Thank you! That's what I will go with. I made a Berserker/Mage Dual and I'll make a berserker/cleric dual to go with him. Two fighter caster duals to take through the whole trilogy!!
@@gringoguapo Berserkers really don't lose much at all as Fighters and make their dualed-class much tougher. A great class to start with!
@@gringoguapoWhoa. Slow down. you will overload your game with that much power in one group.
@@gringoguapoI’m playing a dual class berserker/cleric right now. Dual wielding FoA and Defender of Easthaven. He wrecks shop.
Fighter Druid dual is my fave
Yeah! I feel like Fighters and Divine Casters go really well together, a Fighter/Druid is a beefed up Ranger. Sure, there are things they can't specifically do that Paladins and Rangers can do (like use bows, swords, or... Tracking! LOL), but they prove to be more tanky and devastating with their spells (like Ironskins).
@@Redjoy123 yeah, a fighter dueled at level 7 to druid is an absolute beast
Confronting Suna Seni and leaving Arbane's Sword of Agility behind in loot triggered me :)
Hahaha! Yeah, even though it’s just an example, I am sorry for triggering you and all of the viewers of this video. An amazing blade as such shouldn’t be ignored.
Kenzai / thief is really powerfull, i made a thief have all the skills of all thief kits. And then i played kenzai to 13, and dual classed in bg2.
Grandmastery katana + item upgrade mod + hammer/axe vs undead.
I play on legacy or bhaal solo, super fun.
Thief is a really fun class.
Currently i play fighter/druid multi class on lob difficulty, and its in bg1ee and that things litterally speedwalk true the outdoor areas xD i dont need the fighter stuff yet, but will come handy later with hla and shapechange hla’s.
I also altered insect plague and creeping doom to have damage progression on certain levels. And one druid casted it on me in bgee, and that thing gotta have inzane level. Because his insect plague did 4 damage each time, which was double in lob. So i basicly took 8 damage each tic lol. So i just tricked him outside to my 2 fire elementals + 3 nymphs and flooded him with Lightning :p
Kensai Mage is one oof the all time classics.
Kensai thief gets a kai + backstab + grandmastery in quarter staff combo. I've used that with staff or ram +12 to one shot a fire giant in Yagashura's lair.
That Staff +12 is pretty cool but the limited charges really turned me off, especially if I miss most of those hits (which a Kensai Thief who is good with Staves shouldn't have too many issues with, but everybody rolls 1s). Nicely done with that Fire Giant! One shotting one of those isn't easy!
An odd question I'm sure but what do you think about dual classing a shapeshifting druid into Fighter?
So I’m not the biggest fan of Dual-Classing into Fighter but I get the appeal both from the perspective of getting Iron Skins AND the Warewolf forms/tokens. I don’t see this as the craziest combo in the world but you’ll have to deal with being a Fighter who trades a bit of HP and weapon access for some pretty powerful spells and pretty much being immune to normal weapons.
Can you dual class into a sub class?
For example I’m thinking of an evil play through and thought a Blackguard/Assassin would be fitting for a true son of Bhaal.
Unfortunately no. I believe that in 2.5 Ed. of D&D (used in Baldur's Gate EE), you aren't able to multiclass Paladins or Paladin subclasses (like the Blackguard). There might be a way to do it with editors, but even with EEKeeper, I'm not sure if the game will let you make this combo. Plus, you can't really dual-class into a kit outside of the main class (i.e. dual-class into an Assassin), only from the kits (dual-class from an Assassin).
This would be an awesome idea for a character though! Sneaking around and getting a massive backstab followed by using the Blackguard spells and abilities to stick around in the front line. It's a bummer that you can't really make that specific thing happen in the base game.
can you describe thoroughly more precise wizard slayer thief dual classing? Im now 10 level of wizard slayer in bg2, what should I do?
So, what I would do is level up to Level 13 for Wizard Slayer (though Level 9 can work as well, you've passed that point so best to go further). Once you get to Level 13 for Fighter, then Dual class to Thief and focus on ranged weapons (I think Crossbows are a good choice for Firetooth but you could also go Shortbows and be happy as well).
The nice thing with that is that the point when you regain your Wizard Slayer levels, you'll be able to get UAI only a few levels more.
For specific abilities, it really depends on what area of the game you're in. If you're very early on in Athkatla then you could go Lock Picking/Find Traps, then do the training at the Thieves' Guild. That's actually a pretty good bet to aim for early on for VERY easy experience.
I hope that this helps!
@@Redjoy123 13th level seems pretty reasonable, but it's BGT and I'm not sure if I have miscast ability working with ranged weapons, I suppose without fix it's not working.
@@Redjoy123 I have checked, I have BGT by darktech ant it includes BGFix with ranged miscast for WS, so I'll be fine, but actually I started like with 4 stars in katana and double handed profficiency, so I must try to stick to this plan for more fun :)
Should a newbie stay away from dual classing? Or better to just jump in the deep end and learn as much as possible?
This is rough, just because I would love everyone to experience everything right away, I would say try out each of the classes for a little bit to see their playstyle before preparing a Dual Classed character.
I wouldn't even say to go through all of BG1 with each class, unless you REALLY want to do so, getting up to Level 5 or 6 should be good enough to get a good feel for each class you want to try. I would say that you'll probably want to know how Mages play in Baldur's Gates 1 and 2 (different from other modern D&D games) before creating a Fighter Dual to Mage.
If you want to try it out right away, I would create a Fighter with Dexterity of 18 (which you should be doing anyway) then, if you like them and want to try something unique, have them Dual to a Thief (ideally at Level 9 but if you're just testing, then Level 7 can work as well). Thieves can be good for newbies to play to use certain mechanics and with the Fighter's HP, they can do pretty well.
@@Redjoy123 that's really great advice. Thank you!
Staff of Magi makes Shadowdancer->Mage dual a little bit pointless. Both Assassin and Swashbuckler make for a better starting classes.
I actually favor Bounty Hunter over Swashbuckler. Maybe for a Mage, a Swashbuckler isn't so bad, but I'm not very impressed with the kit compared to the other Thief kits.
@@Redjoy123 Yes, duals starting with Thief are actually the only sensible use case for Bounty Hunter (as Thief HLAs make this speciality obsolete)
Beserker + anything works
Accurate. Berserker is such a great Fighter kit!
Pure class > Multi Class > Dual Class, strongest classes are Wild Mage, Sorc, Illusionist / Thief etc not a puny Dual berserker...
btw even EE ruins the game I think, not only mods. I don't like anything this Edition brought to the game, except for cosmetic changes. For example, being able to hide in front of enemies is against traditional DnD rules, and you can easily avoid any enemy spells without using invisibility... cheesy.
I assume that you're talking about the Shadowdancer? And that you're not a fan? Okay, I respectfully disagree, but I get how it seems very cheesy to be able to pop in and out of shadows in the middle of combat.
I would say that, if we were talking about traditional D&D, Elves and Dwarves were their own classes, not a race/species. Paladins, Druids, Bards, and Rangers weren't a thing. Clerics had super specific rules to their role playing that needed to be carried out otherwise they lose their divine casting.
I don't disagree that EE added some elements that led to powercreep (why take a normal unkitted Thief when you could get the one who can hide in plain sight?) but traditional D&D would be a very different game from what I would want to play.
@@Redjoy123 Yes, I was referring to the Shadowdancer. Apart from the childish writing of the new NPCs in the Enhanced Editions, some aspects are completely overpowered and, frankly, ruin the experience. When I say "traditional D&D," I'm referring to the original Baldur's Gate II game. That game was created through extensive teamwork, testing, and balancing (just look at the credits). These new additions like the Enhanced Edition, mods, and tweaks are often developed unofficially by only a few people, sometimes even a single individual. Logically, the quality is bound to be lower compared to the original-and I can clearly see the difference.
In other words, it’s like saying, "Hey, I’ve seen a movie with a werewolf, and it was amazing. The damage should be slashing and better"-something I often read on many BG websites. So, let's change this, let's change that… but in reality, it just results in a mess of "new" or "revised" spells and abilities that don’t make any sense and definitely don’t improve gameplay. I think the game is best as it is. I only play the Enhanced Edition due to cosmetic changes, avoiding most add-ons (e.g., Hexxat summoning an army of shades, each firing millions of lightning bolts and fireballs; Dorn the half-orc being gay [ahem]; Neera being an annoying, childish, soulless character; etc.). I also avoid items like the Robe of Vecna-anything included later that makes the game a cakewalk.
I rolled a 12,13,14,11,15,14 what should I do you stat cheater?
P.S. good vid.
Hahahahahaha! Find a GM who says that your character has a 12 Str., a 13 Dex., a 14 Con.,...
Then find a new GM who will actually let you build a good character.
Thank you for the comment, you superior dice roller, you!