This video is a direct recording of my Sonofield Ear Trainer mobile app running in its "Pocket Mode", which enables hands-free training while you walk, commute, or relax. Sign-up here to be notified when SET releases for iOS and Android: www.sonic-sorcery.com/set
A progress report: I started listening to this video when it first came out in mid-September, approximately two months ago. The first time I played it, I could only hear the 1, 2, and 7 scale degrees. Since then I have played it for about 10 minutes a day (starting at a randomly chosen spot in the video), for 5 or 6 days out of each week. As of this week, I find that I can identify all seven scale degrees over 90% of the time. Also, I am 65 years old. Takeaways: (1) you don't need to be young or musically talented for your brain to learn to recognize scale degrees (I am neither). (2) It's a marathon, not a sprint. Think months, not weeks or days. (3) Consistency is important. Don't do it once a week, or five times in one day then stop for two weeks. Think of it like weight training.
This is the BEST exercise ever! Its been 4 days and my whole approach to music, playing my.acoustic.guitar, listening music or singing with Friends have changed subtly.....i Will stick to 20min a day during 6 months. Happy to share my experience. Dont doubt to launch a simple but effective version of the app!!
@izadjan7249 my friend, I am really impressed. I now identify about 80% of the key of the songs. Then for the 3 and 4 chords songs, i might even get them before the song is finished. Songs that i know by heart (not with my guitar before) come even easier to spot the chords. Its been almost 2 months which is nothing actually.....well impressed with my own capacity to recognise and feel music in a completed different way. I am doing just 10 to 15 min everyday of singing the major scale with a drone in the back and my guitar to reproduce the right Sound with my voice. And trust me: i have been the worst ear around. It can be educated with a fun exercise and very little time. I hope the app comes out soon!
Really useful thanks a lot! Ever since watching your video on feeling the major scale I've had a breakthrough in my ear training. Learning solfege and feeling the scale degrees rather than focusing on intervals alone is a far superior method.
Day 1: 15mins. Strong on 1,7,2. Weakest on 3,4,5. A few lucid moments where I just knew things were right but a lot of confusion. Conclusion: after 34 days doing this 30 mins a day all 7 degrees have a strong feeling. Progress was a bit non linear and can’t really be rushed. Consistency and just focusing on the feeling rather than attempting to resolve seems to be key. Thanks so much for this Max! Looking forward to tackling the minor scale next and really excited for the app!!
Day 2: 30 mins. Felt worse than yesterday. So much confusion around 3,5 which make me start messing up 1. 4 was much clearer to me today and I was probably close to 85% on it. 7 much clearer than 2.
Day 3: 30 mins. Better than yesterday. Lower pitches close to the drone feel easier. The higher ones get more lost and muddy. 4 and 6 come easy. 5 felt more familiar today but not consistently. 3 is the hardest. Having to fight to just feel and not try to slide the notes around in my head to get resolution.
Day 4: 30 mins. Getting more improvements and clarity. Still along way to go but probably around 65%. 5 has a much stronger feeling now that I can find fairly often. Found a little insight into 3 but still muddy.
Day 5: 30 mins. This feels like meditation now. Quite relaxing to do. 6 hits like a ton of bricks now. 0 doubt on it. Some confusion between 4 and 7. 3 remains a mystery but I’m learning to identify that I can’t place it feeling with 3.
Thank you Max. For really diving deep into the Ear training category. I doubt in you tube there is any content out there just like you. Thanking you for making me believe that I can do it. You changed my mind set towards ear training with one single line- " If you can feel chord changes you can train yourself" This boosted me a lot. With your lessons and through different other approaches I can feel the changes. I am not 100% accurate all the time. But from a guy who can't do any recognition to identifying 8/10 notes correctly is a proof that in future I can do more.. Apart from notes I can feel chord moods. The overall vibe of the song. And as a result my song listening experience got much better and my playing changed drastically. Thank u master❤❤❤
I just watched the entire video while combining it with my meditation, and it was great. I really felt improvement after that hour-long session. The number one problem with the ear training app is that you have to pick an answer, and many times it can be discouraging to see a low score. I believe it's going to be a great app, and I will definitely get it. I am really hoping to see a functionality that most of that app lacks of, and it is practice audiating, by giving an interval, letting me sing it (or imagine it ) and playing it after that.
I've been playing this video in the background while doing something else, at least once every day in the past week, and am amazed how much my hearing improved! Im starting to recognise unintentionaly melodies of pop songs as their scale notes. I wish there was a listening practice like this video for sound design skills. Like syntorial but something you can play in the background and guess while listening a single parameter from a small set of possible values. Or sound design of drums.
wow, I've never thought about the extra opportunities to practice you get when you don't need to use your hands. I am very excited about the release as I've never tried drone ear training and I have offput practicing minor scale degrees as no other functional ear training apps I've found really offer that. I usually practice ear training pretty intensely, where i do a 90 minute session every morning trying to get as many repititions done as possible in the time frame. I therefore wonder if the sonofield app would have features that allow for fast excercises as that would be optimal for me. But I also understand if the point of the app is to help a deeper feel and stronger memory for the sensations of the different scale degree, which would be helpfull for me in its own way.
Yes, you can up the speed of this mode as well as remove the confirmation repeat tone if you like. It then moves quite quickly! There are also other modes which I will show soon..
Fantastic tool! I've been recommending to a few of my students. A minor and chromatic version would be awesome as well, as some have mentioned. Thank you so much!!
Thank you for these! I've got these on repeat in my car when I'm driving in to work. Some of the notes are actually starting to take on their colors now in my mind. When I told my wife "6 now feels very red-violet to me, in my mind", she just looked at me like I was crazy though, lol!
I just dicovered something - I actually CAN feel and name "hard" degrees (3, 4, 5, 6) but not instantly and I really really need to concentrate. If my mind starts to wander even just a little, I don't feel anything except the most obvious degrees (1, 2, 7). I wonder if with time these "hard" degrees will become as obvious as the "easy" ones.
More of this on the app. Cant wait! Happy to pay for it! Quick question please: i am beginner and hace been two days practicing with Mynoise in the back and my guitar and of course producing with my voice the note.....so far only doing 1, 5 and 4. Alternating and creating and repeating melodies....I will introduce soon the 3, 6, 2 and 7 like in your other video. Or shall i start with @ll of then in no particular order?
That's great to hear! The app is coming together very nicely, I think you will really enjoy it. It's a good idea to introduce degrees one a time and compare them to the ones you're already familiar with. There are various orders that you could use to become familiar with their own reasoning, but it's not a huge deal. You can go with the order you've got there for sure.
How does this relate to finding chord progressions? Chords built on relative scale degree give similar sensation? or its only useful for finding melody notes
It's not designed for chord progressions but it does help in one important way - bass notes. The bass note of a chord will have the feeling state of the degree as you learn them here. This means you can tell which note in the key is the current bass note and then you can use other aural skills, or theory, to deduce the chord
This is great for recognizing the scale degrees of a key. But for chords other than the one chord, I hear them as the scale degrees of the key itself rather than the scale degrees relative to that chord's root. Making it less useful in constructing chords. I suppose I could change the way I think about chords and play the minor 2 chord as the 2 4 6 1, for example.
The way you do it, hearing them from the key rather than the chords, is preferable in my opinion. Constructing chords, hearing chord tones and extensions is related, of course, but different for me. Many people have a hard time hearing melody notes in relation to the key.
Can someone explain to me why the "3" at 34:30 sounds a bit sharp to me? I realise it is impossible given it is digital. It sounded off when I first heard it and then I compared it to the C# on my digital piano it still sounds a little higher. Or alternatively the interval from the drone to 3 sounds a little greater than a major third. Either one, can't tell. 🤨🤔
Here's my guess: All major third intervals in our tuning system (equal temperament) are sharp by 14 cents compared to just intonation (perfect tuning). When the third is played in a low octave (compared to the drone), it becomes particularly noticeable because it is both out of tune and out of sequence compared to the harmonic series.
Would you recommend focusing on this first before moving to minor version or is it good to do both at the same time? Well not at the same time but you know what I mean 🙂
just because it’s the second one doesn’t mean it’s easy, this takes a little time to get used to start with 7 then find others that stand out more to you then work on more subtle ones
Agreed! This supplements those things. It doesn't replace them. The app will have singing features that require you to produce the degrees internally and then vocalize them accurately. Hopefully we can get the instrument side involved down the road...
Thank you for this great opportunity to train my ears. However I think that the circle of fifths is not quite the best way to arrange the notes. The 3 (as the 5th harmonic) is much closer to the fundamental (1st harmonic) than the 2 (aka 9th harmonic), so 3/1 sounds more pleasant than 2/1. And so is b6 closer to the 1 than b7. Will there be a video with the flats/sharps?
Thanks for the feedback! Part of the premise is that degrees which are a fifth apart are most harmonically similar, meaning similar in feeling/sound. A tonnetz arrangement better shows harmonic ratio relationships, but it is also more confusing for most people to look at. Here, degrees which sound similar, and may be confused for one another, are near each other while degrees which feel maximally different are opposed. It certainly isn't perfect and I agree with the issues you raise. Are you asking if there will be a video that uses note names instead of scale degrees? Probably not, but that will be a feature in the app.
@@uwose 4 is a special case since it is the "mother" of 1, meaning 4 generates 1 very quickly in it's series but 1 never generates 4. For many people this means that the feeling of 4 is almost like a key change, like becoming the generator of the tonic itself.
@@maxkonyiYes, 1 is created by the 3rd harmonic of 4. So 1 is contained in its mother 4. And 4 is not really contained in 1. But if you have a series of intermediate dominants, then V goes back to I, and I goes back to IV, and so on. Btw, 1 creates 5 and 3 (and nature's 7), so every natural tone already contains a major chord.
Is there anything I should be taking away from the visual? I’m aware of circle of fifths, but in name only. Is there something about the circle of fifths that helps with thinking about the sounds/the feel?
Degrees which are close together on the circle sound/feel most similar to each other. Degrees which are diametrically opposed sound most different. It also breaks your normal linear view of melodies so you can better focus on the feeling states of each degree.
Is this a new app? I just bought your course and bought the 2 apps you recommended from there. Seems similar, is this one different? Other than prettier of course. Lol
Yes! This is a new app I've been developing for some time. It is different than FET and CET in that it is drone based and focused on learning the feeling of scale degrees.
I just did a 40-minute session while I was out for a walk, and now I have a question: I get about 85% of the notes right. But with the exception of 1 and 7, I literally always quickly “sing” the solfege in my mind to the nearest 1, and count the steps in my mind. I’m worried that my approach is somehow defeating the purpose of feeling the actual states. Should I focus more on the feelings, and deliberately NOT sing solfege to the nearest tonic? Thank you so much!
you can always do a scaffolding approach, where you start out by doing what is the easiest and then slowly remove the crutches. with enough trial and error you will generate pattern recognition and start to recognize some notes instantly and the ones you don't recognize instantly you can by process of elimination get to quite quickly. What I personally suggest is picking 2 or 3 notes you think share a similiar nuance or element for example 1 3 5 are all relatively warm sounding while 2 4 7 have a tense striving quality. pick these 2-3 notes and practice them deliberatly in some app with the focus of learning to differentiate the notes until you get a feel. Another helpful tip is to find a song which starts its chorus or verse in a specific scale degree. for example "hey jude" which starts on the 5th on "hey" and goes to the 3rd on "jude". for the 7th the song that comes to mind is "pure imagination" where one the word "world" is the 7th followed by the 1st in "of"
IMO you should be focusing on individual feeling states. Don't resolve anything or use references. In real situations it's normal to just use everything together, but when training scale degree perception, it's best to not muddy the waters with other approaches.
@@maxkonyi Thank you, Max, I appreciate it. I’ll go for another walk and ear training session tomorrow, and try to focus exclusively on the feeling states. I’m also really really looking forward to your app, absolutely can’t wait.
I find it really hard to feel anything here. I think it would be helpful for beginners like me to limit the possibilities to just two notes, that are easiest to tell apart first like (I guess) 1 and 7. Would this be possible in the app?
Absolutely! In fact, there is a whole progression path which you leads you through learning each degree, one at a time. You can also create custom games with the exact degrees and settings you want.
@@maxkonyi that's great, can't wait till release. Love the way you teach, I'm currently going through your Warp Drive course and really like that you explain the logic behind all concepts.
I tend to want to sing the path to the tonic (for example, if it's 5 I will sing 5 6 7 1, so there are four notes, so I know it's 5). How to give up this habit?
I have ZERO clue whats going on here. All I am hearing is a drone, with notes that go with the drone or against it.. I can already in my head hear what notes I need to play on piano in whichever scale like you would with a lead guitar listening to a backing track and going solo. So the question is how will this help me if i can do that.?
That's great. Ear training is often something people begin working on because they realize they can't quickly understand what's going on in the music they listen to or in the music they imagine. Learning to recognize notes by their scale degree number means you always know what the notes of a melody are, regardless of key.
I'm sorry, but I'd like to understand. Why are the degrees arranged by fourth/fifth? What does it do? Sciencomancy? It would be more convenient and logical to arrange them in order, as they are numbered -1 2 3 4 5 6 7, and how they're arranged on the keyboard.
Lots you can do. Firstly, can you sing "do re me fa so" (the first 5 notes of a major scale) without your instrument? If not just hum along to a bunch of basic vocal warm up videos. Overtime this conditions your ear to hearing and producing these tones. If there, then Play a single drone on your instrument. Say C. Just start humming and singing C, and then a D. Just go back and forth between "do re do. Do do re re do". And just hover in that space for a while. Over time you'll notice the difference between C and D is striking. The sensation and feeling of being at home on the C/1 vs the D/2 will become obvious and unmistakable. Start small. Don't start with all 7 of you're having issues.
I hear you. A few points: 1). The actual app has control over tempo, so it can be set to go much slower than this. 2). I set the tempo here to be a median point for people seeing as it's a fixed video. 3). As a beginner, just relax and listen without stressing over feeling anything correctly. Listen to the first tone openly, hear the answer, then keep the answer in my mind as the repeat tone plays. The feeling is immediate, even if that isn't clear at first.
This is great! I just have one recommendation: to not let it do the same scale degree twice in a row. Each time that happens it feels like "I just heard that note, so I know it's the same degree." Thank you for this!
That's actually by design! It won't play the same degree in the same octave in a row, but it will play it in different octaves since many people have trouble with this and it is one of the main points this method is trying to convey. I know for people who find it easy, it can be annoying though!
@@maxkonyiplaying same degree in different octave has actually been the most helpful. Can really “feel” the note without focusing so much on the sound.
This video is a direct recording of my Sonofield Ear Trainer mobile app running in its "Pocket Mode", which enables hands-free training while you walk, commute, or relax. Sign-up here to be notified when SET releases for iOS and Android: www.sonic-sorcery.com/set
Eta on app?
@@km47190 Before the new year!
I can’t find it in iPhone’s App Store.
It's not on the Play Store
@@andrea-mj9ce Not yet!
A progress report: I started listening to this video when it first came out in mid-September, approximately two months ago. The first time I played it, I could only hear the 1, 2, and 7 scale degrees. Since then I have played it for about 10 minutes a day (starting at a randomly chosen spot in the video), for 5 or 6 days out of each week. As of this week, I find that I can identify all seven scale degrees over 90% of the time. Also, I am 65 years old. Takeaways: (1) you don't need to be young or musically talented for your brain to learn to recognize scale degrees (I am neither). (2) It's a marathon, not a sprint. Think months, not weeks or days. (3) Consistency is important. Don't do it once a week, or five times in one day then stop for two weeks. Think of it like weight training.
Wow that's awesome. Thank you for commenting! Great to hear.
This is the BEST exercise ever! Its been 4 days and my whole approach to music, playing my.acoustic.guitar, listening music or singing with Friends have changed subtly.....i Will stick to 20min a day during 6 months. Happy to share my experience. Dont doubt to launch a simple but effective version of the app!!
how is it going so far?
@izadjan7249 my friend, I am really impressed. I now identify about 80% of the key of the songs. Then for the 3 and 4 chords songs, i might even get them before the song is finished. Songs that i know by heart (not with my guitar before) come even easier to spot the chords. Its been almost 2 months which is nothing actually.....well impressed with my own capacity to recognise and feel music in a completed different way. I am doing just 10 to 15 min everyday of singing the major scale with a drone in the back and my guitar to reproduce the right Sound with my voice. And trust me: i have been the worst ear around. It can be educated with a fun exercise and very little time. I hope the app comes out soon!
I just wanna say Max your attitude as an instructor is like... THE best. Please stay that way even as you get big.
Much appreciated! Will do 🙏
Very useful! Its funny how calming it seems each time you say 1 after all these degrees away from home.
Really useful thanks a lot! Ever since watching your video on feeling the major scale I've had a breakthrough in my ear training. Learning solfege and feeling the scale degrees rather than focusing on intervals alone is a far superior method.
That's great to hear 🌞
Im floored by this approach. Take my money with thé app!
Day 1: 15mins. Strong on 1,7,2. Weakest on 3,4,5. A few lucid moments where I just knew things were right but a lot of confusion.
Conclusion: after 34 days doing this 30 mins a day all 7 degrees have a strong feeling. Progress was a bit non linear and can’t really be rushed. Consistency and just focusing on the feeling rather than attempting to resolve seems to be key. Thanks so much for this Max! Looking forward to tackling the minor scale next and really excited for the app!!
Day 2: 30 mins. Felt worse than yesterday. So much confusion around 3,5 which make me start messing up 1. 4 was much clearer to me today and I was probably close to 85% on it. 7 much clearer than 2.
@@Robertlavigne1Good job being consistent! I’ll start too!
Day 3: 30 mins. Better than yesterday. Lower pitches close to the drone feel easier. The higher ones get more lost and muddy. 4 and 6 come easy. 5 felt more familiar today but not consistently. 3 is the hardest. Having to fight to just feel and not try to slide the notes around in my head to get resolution.
Day 4: 30 mins. Getting more improvements and clarity. Still along way to go but probably around 65%. 5 has a much stronger feeling now that I can find fairly often. Found a little insight into 3 but still muddy.
Day 5: 30 mins. This feels like meditation now. Quite relaxing to do. 6 hits like a ton of bricks now. 0 doubt on it. Some confusion between 4 and 7. 3 remains a mystery but I’m learning to identify that I can’t place it feeling with 3.
Thanks! I find this really helpful
Ah thank you so much 🙏Glad it's helpful!
Thank you Max. For really diving deep into the Ear training category. I doubt in you tube there is any content out there just like you.
Thanking you for making me believe that I can do it. You changed my mind set towards ear training with one single line-
" If you can feel chord changes you can train yourself"
This boosted me a lot. With your lessons and through different other approaches I can feel the changes. I am not 100% accurate all the time. But from a guy who can't do any recognition to identifying 8/10 notes correctly is a proof that in future I can do more..
Apart from notes I can feel chord moods. The overall vibe of the song.
And as a result my song listening experience got much better and my playing changed drastically.
Thank u master❤❤❤
So glad to hear that! Thanks for letting me know 🌞
I just watched the entire video while combining it with my meditation, and it was great. I really felt improvement after that hour-long session. The number one problem with the ear training app is that you have to pick an answer, and many times it can be discouraging to see a low score. I believe it's going to be a great app, and I will definitely get it.
I am really hoping to see a functionality that most of that app lacks of, and it is practice audiating, by giving an interval, letting me sing it (or imagine it ) and playing it after that.
Yes, that type of singing exercise will be in the app!
This was invaluable. Please do a chromatic episode. I'm moving on to the minor after 2 or 3 more times on the major. Thanks so much.
Glad it's been helpful! Chromatic coming soon
I've been playing this video in the background while doing something else, at least once every day in the past week, and am amazed how much my hearing improved! Im starting to recognise unintentionaly melodies of pop songs as their scale notes. I wish there was a listening practice like this video for sound design skills. Like syntorial but something you can play in the background and guess while listening a single parameter from a small set of possible values. Or sound design of drums.
Interesting ideas! I will consider...
Thank you so much! That’s I incredibly helpful as a beginner who wants to truly understand music, intuitively!
I’ve been wanting something like this for a long time! Can’t wait for the app!
Excited for the app!
You just saved my life 😢❤ Love you!
Thanks max, youve improved my life !
Can't wait for the app, do you know if you will release it soon?
Thanks for your amazing lessons and ear training videos! You're the best! 💪
Much appreciated 🙏 Yes! It will be releasing before the new year. Stay tuned...
wow, I've never thought about the extra opportunities to practice you get when you don't need to use your hands. I am very excited about the release as I've never tried drone ear training and I have offput practicing minor scale degrees as no other functional ear training apps I've found really offer that. I usually practice ear training pretty intensely, where i do a 90 minute session every morning trying to get as many repititions done as possible in the time frame. I therefore wonder if the sonofield app would have features that allow for fast excercises as that would be optimal for me. But I also understand if the point of the app is to help a deeper feel and stronger memory for the sensations of the different scale degree, which would be helpfull for me in its own way.
Yes, you can up the speed of this mode as well as remove the confirmation repeat tone if you like. It then moves quite quickly! There are also other modes which I will show soon..
Doesn't "functional ear trainer" app have a minor scale? I mean, what "other functional ear trainer apps" are you talking about?
It's the best way to practice this Skil. Thanks. You are awesome
I am so grateful for this 🙏🙏🙏
THANK YOU SO MUCH BROTHER
Awesome! Great! Looking forward to app 😊 doing it at least 30 min a day😊
A minor scale version would be great ! Thanks a ton !
Coming soon...maybe today...
@@maxkonyi Thanks ! Just listened to the whole thing, it's great !
Thanks! I'm going to listen to this on my commute in to work. It's time that would otherwise be wasted.
You should do the same thing but different order because I assume others like me might have this whole vid memorized mostly by now.
That's what the app is for! Releasing before the new year...
Gimme that sonofield right now!
Thanks for this.
really excited for this release!!
Fantastic tool! I've been recommending to a few of my students. A minor and chromatic version would be awesome as well, as some have mentioned. Thank you so much!!
Minor is out already. Chromatic soon!
Wow, thank you very much, Max! I appreciate that!
Thank you for these! I've got these on repeat in my car when I'm driving in to work. Some of the notes are actually starting to take on their colors now in my mind. When I told my wife "6 now feels very red-violet to me, in my mind", she just looked at me like I was crazy though, lol!
I've signed up to be notified when the app drops. Looking forward to it!
Ha! That's great. Glad they've been helpful!
Fastest email signup ever. Thank you SO MUCH.
Great works!
Love this
More of thisssss❤❤
I just dicovered something - I actually CAN feel and name "hard" degrees (3, 4, 5, 6) but not instantly and I really really need to concentrate. If my mind starts to wander even just a little, I don't feel anything except the most obvious degrees (1, 2, 7). I wonder if with time these "hard" degrees will become as obvious as the "easy" ones.
I just found out I can hum the first and whistle the note and ADJUST the feels!
Thank you 🙏
More of this on the app. Cant wait! Happy to pay for it! Quick question please: i am beginner and hace been two days practicing with Mynoise in the back and my guitar and of course producing with my voice the note.....so far only doing 1, 5 and 4. Alternating and creating and repeating melodies....I will introduce soon the 3, 6, 2 and 7 like in your other video. Or shall i start with @ll of then in no particular order?
Thanks for sharing and the Great work
That's great to hear! The app is coming together very nicely, I think you will really enjoy it.
It's a good idea to introduce degrees one a time and compare them to the ones you're already familiar with. There are various orders that you could use to become familiar with their own reasoning, but it's not a huge deal. You can go with the order you've got there for sure.
How does this relate to finding chord progressions? Chords built on relative scale degree give similar sensation? or its only useful for finding melody notes
It's not designed for chord progressions but it does help in one important way - bass notes. The bass note of a chord will have the feeling state of the degree as you learn them here. This means you can tell which note in the key is the current bass note and then you can use other aural skills, or theory, to deduce the chord
THANKS
hell yeah, this looks very useful
wow! Instantly joined the email list :)
Why
@@Bozzigmupp to be updated about when sonofeld releases
genial video me encanta sigue asi
This is great for recognizing the scale degrees of a key. But for chords other than the one chord, I hear them as the scale degrees of the key itself rather than the scale degrees relative to that chord's root. Making it less useful in constructing chords. I suppose I could change the way I think about chords and play the minor 2 chord as the 2 4 6 1, for example.
The way you do it, hearing them from the key rather than the chords, is preferable in my opinion. Constructing chords, hearing chord tones and extensions is related, of course, but different for me. Many people have a hard time hearing melody notes in relation to the key.
Can someone explain to me why the "3" at 34:30 sounds a bit sharp to me? I realise it is impossible given it is digital. It sounded off when I first heard it and then I compared it to the C# on my digital piano it still sounds a little higher. Or alternatively the interval from the drone to 3 sounds a little greater than a major third. Either one, can't tell. 🤨🤔
Here's my guess:
All major third intervals in our tuning system (equal temperament) are sharp by 14 cents compared to just intonation (perfect tuning). When the third is played in a low octave (compared to the drone), it becomes particularly noticeable because it is both out of tune and out of sequence compared to the harmonic series.
Would you recommend focusing on this first before moving to minor version or is it good to do both at the same time? Well not at the same time but you know what I mean 🙂
I would focus on this first until you're quite familiar with them
Wow, I have difficulty recognizing 2! Interesting...
just because it’s the second one doesn’t mean it’s easy, this takes a little time to get used to start with 7 then find others that stand out more to you then work on more subtle ones
cool thanks
Should I keep repeating this until I got it all right without error befiore moving to next one?
It is still better to try to sing these intervals yourself and play it with your instrument too.
Good work, hope it helps either
Agreed! This supplements those things. It doesn't replace them. The app will have singing features that require you to produce the degrees internally and then vocalize them accurately. Hopefully we can get the instrument side involved down the road...
Thank you for this great opportunity to train my ears. However I think that the circle of fifths is not quite the best way to arrange the notes. The 3 (as the 5th harmonic) is much closer to the fundamental (1st harmonic) than the 2 (aka 9th harmonic), so 3/1 sounds more pleasant than 2/1.
And so is b6 closer to the 1 than b7.
Will there be a video with the flats/sharps?
But usually I don't use the visualisation anyway. It's just a background task. I don't focus on it, then I feel it.
But sometimes I have to focus on it: why do I feel the 4 as my root?
Thanks for the feedback! Part of the premise is that degrees which are a fifth apart are most harmonically similar, meaning similar in feeling/sound. A tonnetz arrangement better shows harmonic ratio relationships, but it is also more confusing for most people to look at. Here, degrees which sound similar, and may be confused for one another, are near each other while degrees which feel maximally different are opposed. It certainly isn't perfect and I agree with the issues you raise.
Are you asking if there will be a video that uses note names instead of scale degrees? Probably not, but that will be a feature in the app.
@@uwose 4 is a special case since it is the "mother" of 1, meaning 4 generates 1 very quickly in it's series but 1 never generates 4. For many people this means that the feeling of 4 is almost like a key change, like becoming the generator of the tonic itself.
@@maxkonyiYes, 1 is created by the 3rd harmonic of 4. So 1 is contained in its mother 4. And 4 is not really contained in 1.
But if you have a series of intermediate dominants, then V goes back to I, and I goes back to IV, and so on.
Btw, 1 creates 5 and 3 (and nature's 7), so every natural tone already contains a major chord.
is it okay to count up in your head from the tonic note or is it more about hear the colour of each individual note?
The colour of each note (scale degree)!
Is there anything I should be taking away from the visual? I’m aware of circle of fifths, but in name only. Is there something about the circle of fifths that helps with thinking about the sounds/the feel?
Degrees which are close together on the circle sound/feel most similar to each other. Degrees which are diametrically opposed sound most different. It also breaks your normal linear view of melodies so you can better focus on the feeling states of each degree.
Oh my god this is hard. I can only more or less reliably identify 1 and 7, but the rest of the degrees…
It's just a matter of exposure and time. There will come a time that it's all very obvious to you
Is this a new app? I just bought your course and bought the 2 apps you recommended from there. Seems similar, is this one different? Other than prettier of course. Lol
Hi, what 2 apps did he recommend?
@@PalinaKalin functional ear trainer and complete ear trainer. They are very good, worth the cost. :)
@@brandonscott3012 thanks!
Yes! This is a new app I've been developing for some time. It is different than FET and CET in that it is drone based and focused on learning the feeling of scale degrees.
@@maxkonyi Well, I'll be sure to check it out when it's released then 😁
I just did a 40-minute session while I was out for a walk, and now I have a question:
I get about 85% of the notes right. But with the exception of 1 and 7, I literally always quickly “sing” the solfege in my mind to the nearest 1, and count the steps in my mind.
I’m worried that my approach is somehow defeating the purpose of feeling the actual states. Should I focus more on the feelings, and deliberately NOT sing solfege to the nearest tonic?
Thank you so much!
you can always do a scaffolding approach, where you start out by doing what is the easiest and then slowly remove the crutches. with enough trial and error you will generate pattern recognition and start to recognize some notes instantly and the ones you don't recognize instantly you can by process of elimination get to quite quickly. What I personally suggest is picking 2 or 3 notes you think share a similiar nuance or element for example 1 3 5 are all relatively warm sounding while 2 4 7 have a tense striving quality. pick these 2-3 notes and practice them deliberatly in some app with the focus of learning to differentiate the notes until you get a feel. Another helpful tip is to find a song which starts its chorus or verse in a specific scale degree. for example "hey jude" which starts on the 5th on "hey" and goes to the 3rd on "jude". for the 7th the song that comes to mind is "pure imagination" where one the word "world" is the 7th followed by the 1st in "of"
IMO you should be focusing on individual feeling states. Don't resolve anything or use references. In real situations it's normal to just use everything together, but when training scale degree perception, it's best to not muddy the waters with other approaches.
@@maxkonyi Thank you, Max, I appreciate it. I’ll go for another walk and ear training session tomorrow, and try to focus exclusively on the feeling states. I’m also really really looking forward to your app, absolutely can’t wait.
The drone noise in background is that the root for the intervals?
Yup. "Root" is used when talking about chords. "Tonic" is used when talking about keys, like in this case.
Any chance to have a similar video with all the missing degrees? b5 b3 etc
Already on my channel!
@@maxkonyi just saw it, thanks for your efforts! i find it really helpful
The next great idea would be to make separate videos for all the modes imho
@@nikigba That's what the app is for! These are already in there and you can also create custom games with any degree set you want.
@@maxkonyi sounds great! but I couldn't see it on Google Play for some reason
I find it really hard to feel anything here. I think it would be helpful for beginners like me to limit the possibilities to just two notes, that are easiest to tell apart first like (I guess) 1 and 7. Would this be possible in the app?
Absolutely! In fact, there is a whole progression path which you leads you through learning each degree, one at a time. You can also create custom games with the exact degrees and settings you want.
@@maxkonyi that's great, can't wait till release. Love the way you teach, I'm currently going through your Warp Drive course and really like that you explain the logic behind all concepts.
I tend to want to sing the path to the tonic (for example, if it's 5 I will sing 5 6 7 1, so there are four notes, so I know it's 5). How to give up this habit?
I have ZERO clue whats going on here. All I am hearing is a drone, with notes that go with the drone or against it.. I can already in my head hear what notes I need to play on piano in whichever scale like you would with a lead guitar listening to a backing track and going solo. So the question is how will this help me if i can do that.?
That's great. Ear training is often something people begin working on because they realize they can't quickly understand what's going on in the music they listen to or in the music they imagine. Learning to recognize notes by their scale degree number means you always know what the notes of a melody are, regardless of key.
Thx so much for this I do it while I crochet lol
4 is my favorite...
Lol. Mine is 3. On my guitar I just laugh and play 3 repeatedly. It just sounds so good!
I’ve literally gotten none right. lol day 1 tho. How long per day would be recommended to actually make progress at this?
Have you seen my 90min stream on Feeling the Major Scale? I talk much more about this stuff there
@@maxkonyi I haven’t. I’ll check it out now. 🙏🏼
I'm sorry, but I'd like to understand. Why are the degrees arranged by fourth/fifth? What does it do? Sciencomancy?
It would be more convenient and logical to arrange them in order, as they are numbered -1 2 3 4 5 6 7, and how they're arranged on the keyboard.
Why the same background note . . . For every note?
Because being able to identify all the notes of a key against the tonic is more important than knowing the interval between two random pitches.
I can feel degree but i cant even recognise 1st degree can anyone help me with this problem
Check out my other video "Feeling the Major Scale" for some tips on getting started with all of this and how to practice.
Lots you can do. Firstly, can you sing "do re me fa so" (the first 5 notes of a major scale) without your instrument? If not just hum along to a bunch of basic vocal warm up videos. Overtime this conditions your ear to hearing and producing these tones.
If there, then Play a single drone on your instrument. Say C. Just start humming and singing C, and then a D. Just go back and forth between "do re do. Do do re re do". And just hover in that space for a while. Over time you'll notice the difference between C and D is striking. The sensation and feeling of being at home on the C/1 vs the D/2 will become obvious and unmistakable.
Start small. Don't start with all 7 of you're having issues.
OH MY
just completed the whole video
I feel like this goes too fast because I don't have enough time to let the feeling sink in, especially as a beginner.
I hear you. A few points:
1). The actual app has control over tempo, so it can be set to go much slower than this.
2). I set the tempo here to be a median point for people seeing as it's a fixed video.
3). As a beginner, just relax and listen without stressing over feeling anything correctly. Listen to the first tone openly, hear the answer, then keep the answer in my mind as the repeat tone plays. The feeling is immediate, even if that isn't clear at first.
@@maxkonyi Thanks a lot. You're doing fantastic work.
@@BlueEagle-yk6dg Much appreciated!
You can also adjust the playback speed of the video!
sis anyone resolve that at the end 👀
This is great! I just have one recommendation: to not let it do the same scale degree twice in a row. Each time that happens it feels like "I just heard that note, so I know it's the same degree." Thank you for this!
That's actually by design! It won't play the same degree in the same octave in a row, but it will play it in different octaves since many people have trouble with this and it is one of the main points this method is trying to convey. I know for people who find it easy, it can be annoying though!
Gotcha. Thanks!
@@maxkonyiplaying same degree in different octave has actually been the most helpful. Can really “feel” the note without focusing so much on the sound.
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D7: 21/30 24/30 24/30
Kind of messed up that you wouldn't end it on a 1 😂
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