Bungie, Here's The Truth.
Вставка
- Опубліковано 30 вер 2024
- As a long time fan and creator for Destiny 2, this was a hard one to make. Let's talk about everything one last time.
PATREON: / ascendantnomad
TWITCH: / ascendantnomad
TWITTER: / ascendantnomad
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The key to me is the core playlists. The campaign is always a one (or three) and done experience for me. Having reasons to go into the playlists (loot), and compelling experiences while playing is where it's at.
exactly. When D1 had slow periods, people grinded strikes and PVP for the specific loot each provided. When D2 has had slow periods, none of these activities (god forbid we mention Gambit) got any love to make them truly replayable and grindable like they were in D1.
Stripe specific loot neeeeds to come back. Maybe the same as d1 with skeleton keys? Idk, just want them back. I WANT to enjoy running strikes again
This. I used to play D2 for a fair bit, but I ultimately decided to dip when the core playlist burned me out (this was between Season of Dawn and Beyond Light). Tried returning twice around Season of the Chosen and the free Witch Queen period, but no dice - I basically only engage in D2 from the lore standpoint because I find it interesting, and also Byf packages it very nicely.
A change to core activities is really the only major thing that would convince me, personally, because good gunfeel and ability spam aren't enough for me anymore. And I have since moved on to some other live services that have a core loop/experience that I'm not as burned out on (granted, they have their own issues and accusations of being monetarily predatory...)
yes! i hate this seasonal model because they have to be spewing content constantly wich do to the fact that they have little time and upper-management decices that they rather have low quality and high cuantity content wich gets deleted in a year top and in the meantime it all just fells so bland and they cant even focus on the things that dont get deleated like core playlist
@@ready1player31I think there’s some real rose colored glasses on D1. The loot wasn’t that great that it’s better than the amount available now. The grind for an item was extremely monotonous at be times. How many times do I gotta run this for an Imago loop to drop. Finally! Fuck, shit roll. Strikes were harder relying more on movement cover and weapons and less on abilities. Now go into a strike run a few get your engrams go reroll them at Zavala run enough strikes get multiperk weapons from rolls. Hopefully somewhere along the way an exotic engram drops. Part of what made D1 good was the rarity of those things. But even the hardcore player base that’s been around since D1 alpha and beta probably wouldn’t be happy with that very long grind for hopes of something and shear luck in getting an exotic armor piece. Hell most complain now about drop rates or armor stats being shit. I love D1 and still play it from time to time but it’s a far cry from being in a better place overall.
For me it's the "always on" mentality of Destiny. There's no end point to it and no matter how good something is, once you've played it for thousands of hours it gets stale. You can't game design your way around that, it's just how people function. I honestly wish Bungie would drop seasonal/episodic content entirely. It will never happen since that's how they make most of their money. But for both the health of the developers and the community, I would rather have a single banger expansion every year and maybe a mid season QoL update. Destiny is obsessed with manipulating players into playing it, but eventually you just reach your breaking point and get off the FOMO treadmill once and for all.
Genuinely I don’t think anything will. It’s been too long with too much of our feedback being neglected and ignored that there’s a huge chunk of players that have felt nothing but apathy for years at this point and it’s going to take nothing short of a miracle to change that. The game can and hopefully will be made objectively good, I hope for those that want to play the game that the studio can and will treat its players right, but that memory will linger.
I quit after Lightfall honestly and watching nothing really but negativity crop up around the game in this final stretch of D2's life just shows how badly it's going. Even with the "Miracle Savior that is Destiny 3" people talk about, Bungie has fumbled the state of the game and its upkeep too long to win the same love people had for it for years.
The fact is that it's taken THIS LONG to switch from Seasonal to Epsiodes after so much feedback and complaining about the Seasonal Model is absolutely nuts to me.
And ignoring the feedback of their own devs..
This right here is the answer. Not to mention that apathy and resentment of not being genuinely heard would only increase substantially if they made a Destiny 3 and hit the reset button on 7 years of loot and progress. I think a fresh start would only make things worse.
I stopped playing with Beyond Light. The core gameplay felt barely above average. I know Witch Queen was considered good (but not Taken King good nor Forsaken good) but Elden Ring and other amazing games happened and I forgot about Destiny. I will play it again ONLY if Final Shape is nothing but stellar AND all the other expansions are included and everything (dungeons, exotics, whatever) is included/unlocked.
Otherwise GG
@@Frogemoth For me, Witch Queen was up there with Forsaken in terms of story, raid, and campaign. Its not as big but quality wise it was Forsaken level.
Expectations? After all this? I just want to see it end. That's it. I want to see the conclusion. No matter if it's bad or good.
End the Suffering
I think the game ultimately suffers from the fact that it is the only IP making money while the Bungie execs have pie in the sky ambitions to start 4-5 new IPs. That and a misunderstanding with regard to the engagement-to-monetization equation. I think execs at Bungie have for too long confused playtime as being directly tied to amount of money spent per hour or whatever it is without consideration for retention, because engagement and retention are not the same thing. The game has been built to maximize engagement with decreasing thought regarding retention, and absolutely no thought regarding player population growth beyond assuming a new expansion automatically means new players *who will stick around*. The game has done a very bad job bringing new players in and convincing all but the most dedicated players to stay.
This community has been here before... too many times. Burned and begging/waiting for better.
We are so predictable that it's become a business strategy for bungie. If bungie says, "we hear you, our next expansion will be better," every other expansion, we shouldn't support them. Fool me once....
It's so funny when hearing their GDC conference about how their plan for player engagement, is by gaining players trust, and then slowly throwing it away to a nice lukewarm feeling where people expect nothing from bungie, but they'll also throw away all their money. I have to give Bungie props for scamming every d2 player. Each and every person that kept throwing money at bungie and were surprised why they've gotten worse and worse only have themselves to thank
the big problem here is that it takes soooooo loooong for them to fix things that it feels like a live game for 2 weeks (when new season / mid season launches) and a dead game for the rest of the season. If it's so hard to fix things on the tiger engine that it takes 3 months to nerf a barricade, them don't treat your game like a live service. They need to either go full on live service, farm some money and kill the game, or go back to big DLCs and no seasons. That's my opinion
It doesn't get more "full on live service" than Destiny right now. It's not really a Bungie issue, and more a game development in its entirety issue. Playert expectations increase over time. A single seasonal activity with a handful of weapons isn't cutting it anymore. We just got two of the best seasonal activities we ever had, along with the imbau engine which in its entirety is around the level of an exotic mission, complete with new loot, armor sets, exotics, exotic mission rotator, exotic armors, new abilities in the form of aspects, a slew of other system and balance changes and oh yeah, a free raid. Seasons nowadays are packed by comparison and people still want more. Now, i'm not blaming players for wanting a good game, nor am I saying that Bungie does everything perfectly (by god no), but so does every other company or person or other institution on earth. Nothing and nobody is perfect. But the fact that player expectations keep increasing over time, means that at some point, they will significantly outgrow what can realistically be developed in the given time (given monetary constraints of course), regardless of how good the developers are. Whether this happens after 1-6 months (which is what happens to most live service games), after a year, or two or 10 it will happen sooner or later and there is nothing anyone can do about that.
"Not cutting it anymore" is a consumer issue. Do we really think a developer is capable of producing infinite content? Content pieces like this feed into the idea that Destiny is supposed to provide the player base with unending enjoyment. It's not realistic and now people are starting to understand.
@@DreadedLad88Bingo. On top of that while Bungie may be bad when it comes to monetization, the people who think they should get unending content for an entire year for $60 are in the wrong too. It’s takes money to develop this stuff and in my mind, both parties are at fault in their own respective ways.
I agree
@@DreadedLad88 You are right, but it's also a Bungie problem. If it wasn't, they wouldn't be in the spot they are in.
There are a lot of components that bring people together to play a game, but I will try to focus on 2, those are hype and good content. Bungie nails both, but the timing is pretty bad. They give us this false sense of live service spacing big content drops (not even talking about DLCs, think about raid reprises or even dungeons) that have the sense of new for a few weeks, but, really quickly, become more of a chore. They also are proven to no be able to produce content that feels fresh for long, so why do they choose to keep trying to make destiny retain players over long periods of time, instead of making REALLY big releases? Because they want you to spend money and believe that game is alive. The community is wrong in believing that Bungie is capable of delivering what THEY offer us. it's the strategy that they use to grab money, and it's going terrible
for me, this whole situation screams bad management
A HUGE thing for me is I started playing Destiny 2 halfway through its life cycle and ended up missing huge amounts of content. I got addicted to it regardless, but a huge part of me would love to be able to experience the game from its initial point through its life cycle. Destiny 3 sounds like a grand idea for people like me who either started late or are just wanting to start now.
Then destiny 3 follows the same seasonal thing and you'll miss huge amounts of content again over time and be saying the same comment again but with a 3 instead of a 2
Wanted to highlight your point on LFG getting harder as players drop off. By the time Bungie is done with Fireteam Finder, there won't be enough players left to use it. A feature we've waited literally forever for will be DOA due to Bungies negligence, which is the most Bungie thing.
I think Datto put it best. We need New Destiny, not More Destiny
The fomo of the game killed it for me.
So many weapons that are in the game but not IN the game.
The never ending stories that go away the battle passes.
I laster until the last season of the witch queen and I'm so glad I didn't got light fall.
I simply don’t believe that they can deliver us an experience that will get us back on the same train we’ve been riding for a decade.
Destiny will just end and bungie will move onto a new game. There’s no point in salvaging this game when the executives and management don’t care about the player base. They’ll just burn it all down and start again.
After years and years of playing both destiny from day one. I’ve actually given up with Destiny 2. I’ve just found a new clan on destiny, one with a bunch of awesome people. And we are having fun.
I’m not even sure what happened to destiny 2… I found the game back in warmind and I absolutely loved it. The unique destinations, the excellent gunplay, fun activities, etc. but all that’s just… stale now. It looks like destiny. It sounds like destiny, it feels like destiny, but it just… isn’t. I can’t explain it but something about destiny 2 has felt really off for a few years if you ask me. Going back to destiny 1 the feeling I used to love about this game is still there, and I HATED destiny 1 the first time I played it in 2019
@@rockl79 The difference is that destiny 2 is a game that demands your wallet and your time every single day and week, and it never makes you feel fulfilled. All the content in the game never gives you anything cool to use, or gives you a good enough challenge to grow. It's a soulless husk withy money drained into it.
Destiny 1 despite being very scummy with content held back in it's release date and being resold to you for full price again. At least now it's finished, there's a sense of finale when u play the game, a sense of accomplishment and reward. Challenges faced, and those same challenges rewarding you with something brand new and shiny for accomplishing it. You feel like you're growing within the world and rising to the peak, instead of seeing the world grow and leave you behind unless you keep spending money.
There's so many other factors too, such as the members of people within those communities. How depressed everyone in d2 has become, and a bunch of corporate shills. D1 has oldheads, and people willing to help others learn or enjoy the same content with no need to rush it.
People will always say D2 is better than d1 because it has more quantity and quality of life changes blah blah blah. What they fail to realize though, is that all people want is a video game to have fun in with their friends once in a while and not deprive their life savings into it. That's why d1 as it stands will always be the better game. ( Nostalgia also holds a good part of it for someone like me though ;) )
All you need is a good cat. With or without Destiny, goodest cat will still be there. I think many of us are gonna see this through to the Final Shape, but after the final curtain call on the Witness's doorstep, I doubt many of us will go any further. It's a shame that this is how it ends for so many people, as this could have been a timeless franchise much like that of Final Fantasy, but corporate greed once again rotted a once great name right up the trunk.
It doesn't speak highly of Bungie that after a decade of building up this franchise, 85% of players at the end share the sentiments of "Thank the Traveler we're free at last! Goodbye forever 👋".
It wouldn’t be financially viable for them to shut down to make a D3.. They need to give us a Taken King Forsaken with a sprinkle of season of opulence rolled into one.
Why not??? Every Sony studio goes dark for 3-5 years to make new games.
The big problem with destiny is how divided the player base is. There’s people who play the game as a hobby or for fun, and there’s the people who get hooked on the gameplay and can’t stop because it’s formed an addiction. The game is built to form an addiction and bungie has psychologists dedicated to that. If they shut down for a few years, the addicted portion of the player base (which for all we know could be half the players) would leave and have no reason to come back
i don’t think you know anything about finance or business
@@randomuser40454Because Bungie burns money fast.
@@randomuser40454 Bungie’s sole source of income and revenue is from Destiny. How do you expect them to live pay their employees rework the game and also work on marathon all while having no money coming in. It’s improbable
I was hanging out in the cosmodrome the other day, just doing my bounties, and genuinely enjoying myself and i stopped to think "wouldnt it be cool if this was actually rewarding?"
I'm curious, what happened after you thought this? Did you stop on the spot? Me undergoing that very same realization was what ultimately caused me to quit a week or so later.
I was doing stuff in the Dreaming city earlier and was thinking somewhat similar, then I realised I was occasionally getting seasonal engrams from it, which is a lil hopeful I think.
One of my main asks honestly, is to just allow eververse items to dismantle for bright dust again =\ The removal of that was asinine af if you ask me, and was only done out of greed (Same goes for hiding the API for eververse during holiday events. Not to mention, the armor pieces weren't available to buy piece-meal and haven't been for a while. It's the whole set or nothing now).
I get that they want people buying shit from eververse to turn a profit, but they're already asking us to shell out $100+ a year just to keep up, let alone how much it costs, and how confusing it has gotten to even get into it in the first place as a blueberry. (I'm a D1 Veteran btw)
I love this franchise so much... but all the recent news regarding upper management, and the current state of the game, resulted in the dissolution of the clan I created back in Forsaken, right after Last Wish's release... (My first World's First attempt). No one was playing anymore, no one was active in the discord, nothing... It felt like a ghost town, so I just dusted my hands of it and gave the reigns to someone else... Probably one of the hardest decisions I've had to make tbh.
My other big ask is to BRING BACK SRL (And Sparrow Horns!). I could and did play that mode for hours on end in D1. Probably one of my favorite racing experiences in gaming.
Beyond that, the wholesale disregard for the PVP community up till recently has not and will never be acceptable to me, as I'm sure a lot of us would agree. And I'm not even that great in the crucible. I'm mid at best last I checked.
Checkmate is a step in the right direction, but I don't think it's enough. We still have maps in this game that WERE NOT MADE WITH 6v6 IN MIND, and it shows. They can go back and rework spawns and sight-lines all they want, but when you have maps that are small enough where some of our current abilities allow you to cross it at the speeds we can currently, it won't matter.
On a similar note, BRING BACK COMBINED ARMS! Or give us some actually large scale maps where combat is not as "common", or hell, double down and make a 12v12 "War" mode with a massive one-off map or something... I understand a lot of folks wanna just get in and get out of a match and not have to run to every engagement, but to me, larger spaces (I don't mean wide open spaces with no cover) allow for better strategizing, instead of the current "Run and Gun, Meth Monkey" mentality we're currently fostering.
That being said though, as much as I don't want to admit it, I can feel the apathy setting in, and it breaks my heart... I can feel myself losing interest in the story and characters I love, that have meant so much to me over the last decade... All because of corpo greed...
For me to come back they need to un-vault all vaulted content. I wont pay for games and content that has an expiration date.
But why comeback to stuff you have played? I 100% get the moral justification to not support a game that removes content, but would giving it back really make you wanna play the game again?
@@bragekv9937 i go back to old games often, and i cant take my boys through the story. Im the kind of person who never sells games. I would comeback and buy more content if i knew it wouldn’t be taken away.
Saving D2 will be the biggest Hail Mary in gaming history
In an alternate dimension, the team was split to start developing Destiny 3. Sadly, we don't live in that dimension.
We had that dimension and it caused a massive rift in sentiment when D2 launched. We had banger content and incredibly positive sentiment and none of the stuff folk liked about RoI and the age of triumph update carried through to D2 vanilla, that split is the was the issue. Going dark as nomad says, we're looking at 4 to 6 years for a new *game* from scratch. Marathon started in 2018~2019 and won't release til 2025 if the articles are correct, if the focus is after final shape / anniversary content / episodes? we're looking at 2027/2028 at a minimum.
Seasons are not good season of witch soo boring
Totally with you on the Destiny 3 part. It cannot comprehend how that’s not on the plan already as a way to clean things up and bring people in again, regardless of what the content actually is!
For me , its the asking price VS what you get in return.
Light fall was 50$ by default and for this price it offer campaign , one new open are , one raid , some new weapons and armor.
50$ is almost a price of entire game and you get something like 1/6 of entire game.
So many destiny players don't understand this simple example as to why the pricing is so dogshit, it actually blows my mind that these people even have money in their lives
People also don't seem to remember, that Bungie had an insane price increase in lots of countries.
They increased the price 2x, 4x the original pricing for certain countries. These people literally just gave up on the game as it is, what did Bungie think this will do? NOT affect their bottom line?
And those that made this change are still in the company, I bet.
See here's the thing, after I unsubscribed from Aztecross, I realized that I'm tired of thinking in terms of will Destiny continue. If Destiny is on it's death knel then let it be. I love this game, I've enjoyed the game, I have my other problems. I'm going to get my rank 11 I'm going to enjoy the final shape and I'll do my best to move my community as well as we drift apart. I'm going to have fun with other games, I'll enjoy the stuff I've done, I'll cherish my fond memories.
Enjoy Destiny, enjoy your life, your cat, your world. See ya starside.
If they can make certain key changes to the game, Destiny 2 could be all they need. My thoughts:
1. If we can't have everything in the game at one time, give us the option of what we want to download. This meaning campaigns, raids, gear sets, weapon sets, entire DLCs, etc. We need access to what we've had and what some missed out on entirely.
2. I think we need to bring back more frequent level increases, but don't increase the base starting level for those that come back. This gives people something to work towards, and for new players a longer incentive to keep playing. BUT we can't have arbitrary enforcement of level while we have effective power capped. Many have said that no new level to chase made them want to play less and less.
3. We need full access to Seasons/Episodes upon release. Drip-fed content is part of the problem and it always has been. It's absolutely fucking NUT that Bungie hasn't changed things after so many complaints about it for so long, almost as if there's some ego-backed player control issue in the heads of the company.
4. The players themselves need access to controls for difficulty. The behind-the-scenes controls for difficulty isn't cutting it and at this point it's been made clear that they don't want to make content strictly for those that want harder content. Next best thing? Give the players the dials/knobs themselves. Enemy health, player health regens, amount of revives, if it's a full darkness zone, no exotics allowed, PVE version of checkmate, etc. Let US decide what difficulty we want.
5. Make a proper fucking onboarding system for new players. Holy shit this has been an issue since Destiny 1 AND THEY STILL PUSH THAT RESPONSIBILITY OFF ONTO THE COMMUNITY. This is ass backwards and NOT how you should be running a game.
6. Put more of the cosmetics into a farmable fashion. Be it rewards for high-end activities or just more items in the brightdust store. Either would work, and I know for a fact that many people play this game just for how it looks and for the cosmetics.
I know this is a lot, but holy fuck would it answer a lot of issues and give a lot of things we've been asking for since day 1.
Nomad...its over, I love Destiny 2 I still play, but unless they turn left hard as in; Destiny 3, dedicated servers, an actual pvp team, sand box innovation, new player onboarding, and reasonable monetization then maybe. Oh yeah, equally important, rehire those composers and fire all members of upper management with 3 months severance. Then we can talk and that might now be enough.
For me is for them to bring back the vaulted content that people had paid for so we can have some form of content consistency
For seasonal content that will more or less have been vaulted, you can have 3 to 4 of them as a choice for people to go and do in a weekly rotation to get the seasonal loot that was once tied to said seasonal content in question:
Want to get a perfect paradox shotgun? go select in the destination section and select the sundial
Want to get a gnawing hunger auto rifle? go do the reckoning
Want to get the BAD NEWS XF4354 hand cannon? go do a forge activity
and again players can keep playing these seasonal activities (those that aren't a battleground/strikes already) until the weekly reset when there will be a reset and thus a brand new selection of past seasonal activities can be formed.
It is already a cardinal sin for a looter shooter like destiny 2 to remove content from the game thus loot that people have held to dear in the first place, so before they even remotely think of doing a D3, i think bringing stuff back that was once part of the main d2 experience that are now in the DCV and give them some breath of fresh air to help meld with the modern sandbox is a start.
If they bring back the old expansions, i feel they would have to do some fine tuning to make them pace similar to the witch queen/lightfall campaign missions where they can be actually re-playable.
And also working upon the playlist with for strikes, bringing back vaulted strikes and bring back strike specific loot will do wonders to make each strike feel unique as well as gives players more of a reason to go and do the strikes directly instead of going into the playlist to do so. Was also told that there used to be a dynamic strike system in d1 where you may fight different enemy factions even if you are running it again, and i feel it adds in the uniqueness to each of the strikes so maybe bring that back into d2.
For pvp, just bring back the vaulted maps that were once in D2, either they were good or bad, it honestly doesn't matter, they were once part of the game and it should have remained in the first place
For gambit, bringing back the tangled shore map (as we already know the dreaming city map is making a return) and obviously new maps for gambit would help it quite a bit. we know they will be adding in newer factions such as the shadow legion into the mix for enemies we should expect to fight, maybe some modifier to keep gambit from becoming stale then it already is
This to me as i see it currently would help breath new life as well as repair for the content that we had once had and cherished.
I’d absolutely love for everything to come back, and I despised the content vault and still do, however I can’t help but feel that even if everything comes back, the game is so drastically different now than it was in 2019 that it just wouldn’t be the same. Even if we ignore the atrocious lighting changes beyond light brought, the changes to the sandbox, darkness subclasses, engrams, leveling, weapon crafting, etc… It’s just not the same game and I really don’t know how well all the older stuff would fit. Personally I’d rather them take all the older content and put it into a destiny 2 “legacy” version with the old engine, sandbox, etc. Basically an exact copy of d2 how it was during forsaken
Personally, I think the way they can retain people is by nailing the main expansion and using seasons/episodes as a way to enhance the core gameplay loop while simultaneously supplementing the endgame content. Adding new strikes/maps while also having something new and challenging to work towards would be awesome. I think they need more things like Prison of Elders or something new that's dungeon adjacent. I know there are a lot of people who say they're leaving after final shape no matter what, but I feel like a lot of those people would continue playing even after final shape if they felt like their time playing was worthwhile instead of monotonous like it currently is.
I agree that at some point in the long term future, the best move for Destiny would be to make a Destiny 3. Something that wipes away the technical debt and allows Bungie to start from a clean slate with all the knowledge and experience from Destiny 1 and 2. But I feel there are still potential issues that make that prospect risky.
For one, community sentiment and goodwill. Destiny 2 came out in 2017. A short while after Destiny 1's high points in Taken King and Rise of Iron. Even though Destiny 2 was a step back in many ways (its launch was a disaster arguably), Destiny the franchise was still "new" enough that it was able to weather than and get back on track a year later with Forsaken.
The situation is different however now. Now, Destiny the franchise has been ongoing for nearly 9-10 years. If Bungie started working on a Destiny 3 today, it would be in development for at least 4-7 years to ensure it launches properly. Leaving Destiny 2 in essentially maintenance mode during all that time.
You have Final Shape coming that's going to be a launching off point for many people. Often because they are done with Destiny after 10 years. And you have people that remember Destiny 2's faults in content droughts and missteps. For a Destiny veteran that stepped off after Final Shape and maybe occasionally comes back to play D2 in its maintence mode, would they be excited to give Bungie another chance for a Destiny 3 when they barely ran Destiny 2 well? Essentially repeating the past 10 years? Especially when a Destiny 3 would reset players' inventories like how D2 did. I can imagine a situation where if Destiny 3 launches and isn't immediately amazing and full of more content than Destiny 2, many players may just go back and play D2 until D3 catches up, really stalling D3's progression. Maybe new players would be curious if D3 had a decent onboarding system so it would be more approachable than D2 at least. But still.
The second major issue is, well, Bungie's vision. Destiny 1's development was rough. The game was rebooted at the 11th hour, resulting in vanilla D1 becoming a laughing stock. It recovered with Taken King andRise of Iron, but lost that progress with Vanilla D2 which also was rebooted at the 11th hour. Destiny had to re-trace its steps with Forsaken. And then Beyond Light and Lightfall walked back progress again in many ways.
How do we know Destiny 3 won't be a repeat of all this? What if Bungie is indecisive and end up resulting in another vanilla D1 and D2 situation? Or what if they do stuff like remove or downplay gambit and PVP?
The thing that surprised me is how much l warmed up to the idea of a Destiny 3 after Lightfall. There was a time when I would have dreaded loosing all my stuff. But outside PvP-gear, where high stats/ perfect rolls/ adept-mods actually matter, there is just so little left to chase. Maybe 3-4 guns per season that are better than our existing arsenal, while new players are still stuck playing an impossible game of catch-up.
Destiny 2 still has a lot of strong points, I hope they'd be able to keep that going for a new game without tying to reinvent the wheel. But of course all that is just wishful thinking. I won't see a D3 until I turn 30, who knows what will have happened until then...
'Kill Destiny so that Destiny might live'
Same. I loved the idea of D2 being 'Destiny Infinity' at first, but it's clear that they can't really fix core issues with this game in 'real time'. The uncomfortable fact is that if the franchise can survive a 2-3 year break where they can take their time and build a game designed from the ground up to be what Destiny has become, rather than stay the kind of 'hack' that Destiny is a big pile of, the game would be much better off.
The other problem is we have heard many many times from bungie that destiny can’t grow forever. Whether it’s the engine or restrictions on the storefront, destiny has a finite file size it can grow to before it physically cannot grow anymore. If you ask me the end of destiny 2 is inevitable at this point, but if that’s the game itself crashing and burning with the community holding pitchforks at bungie’s throat or a super hyped refresh to the series, nobody knows. Personally I’d like to see all the old content put into a destiny 2 “legacy” game with the old engine and forsaken power level, and then have the current destiny 2 just cease along with destiny 3 being released. But from the reports I’ve heard, it sounds like zero work has gone into making a third game so far
''just kidding you have other issues'' you have no idea how right you are nomad lol thanks for the chuckle
I think more love and updates to the core playlists would be great but overall, after Final Shape and the 3 episodes, I will probably be done and be able to look back fondly at my time in a game that means so much to me still.
Just the Final Shape for me. If I say "The Final Shape and the 3 episodes", it'll turn into "might as well get the next expansion too"
That’s true. But I’ve already pre ordered and I’m still excited for the ending.
hey ascendant nomad. you told me a couple FOTL’s ago to get the mech titan set whenever i asked you and i haven’t taken it off since. i’ve never forgot that. thank you
D2's biggest problem imo is it's spread very thin by an identity crisis, it's trying to do too many things. It wants to be open world, an mmo that's both casual and hardcore, an arcade and competitive PvP shooter, a loot based game, an episodic story game, all at the same time. It's just not possible. Focus in on what brings back your dedicated playerbase - strikes, crucible gambit, give us a story that has a satisfying conclusion, and give us more things to chase instead of just putting everything in eververse.
If every season released a well made raid, i'd probably have 0 complaints for d2 lol
When remnant 2 is releasing dlc at 10 dollars a pack is imo the final nail in destiny’s coffin
Lose the whole "we can't" attitude that defined the state of the game - We know we promised, but we just can't produce 3 ritual armor sets (unless they're $20 Eververse pieces) was the perfect distillation of current D2.
Yup, doesn't matter about if bungie wants to make a new destiny game, or the amount of complaints and ideas people have. As long as Bungie's motive is to never "Overdeliver" i'm surely never touching the franchise again. Not like i'm playing it anymore anyways. I've been burned by too many game companies for far too long.
I feel it’s a thing that is happening to all popular franchises in the industry 😢 goodbye fun
i disagree 100 percent. a sequel in the mmo world is horrible. its is often the best opportunity to jump too a different mmo and get into it.
I don't know why there's so much confidence that a Destiny 3 would change anything. D1 was horrible at launch and D2 took nothing from D1's lessons on release. And Lightfall is a clear indicator that Bungie still does not learn from their wins. I have zero confidence that a new game will do anything more than give Bungie a fresh chance to sell us old weapons and locations AGAIN.
Stop being so greedy, but I don't know they can. Microsoft wasn't the problem, Activision wasn't the problem. Bungie is the problem.
I've seen quite a few people who have left this game long before it got to this point. I being one of them.
I'm playing games like SSBU
I'm replaying KH final mix and all the KH remix/dlc games
I have a ton of games on back catalog which aren't even including what is *still* coming out this year and next year, not to mention what I've already played.
Honestly, as far as looter shooter with a sci-fi twist, Remnant 2 looks really nice, I plan on getting it.
Destiny 2 TFS would literally have to be the 2nd coming of RNGeezus. And honestly, I probably still wouldn't come back.
MyNameisByf put it best. The *culture* needs to change. You can't get good fruit from a rotten tree. And Bungie has been rotting for over a decade now. And history has shown us that isn't going to change. And say that it does, we would them be forced to wait for a Destiny 3 while they rebuild from a huge shift.
I just have this sinking feeling that Bungie's gonna throw once more.
P.S. CONGRATS ON 100K
Bungie: "OVERDELIVERY!" *Joe Blackburn doing the z-snap complete with the neck shake*
Not going to lie. I know what I've signed up for with Bungie at this point. I'm here for final shape when it lands and I'm sure it will at least be a decent expansion, however there is literally NOTHING they can do to keep me on board post that. It's a perfect exit point for me akin to Avengers: Endgame so being upset and hoping for major changes to the future of destiny as a whole is not something I'm subscribing to with them anymore. I'm just here for the last ride.
Also I do agree with what you said about expansions needing to affect the overall game. The reason why the taken King and forsaken were amazing expansions is because they changed the entire game
Patrols were different every single destination was affected in some way. Core playlists were updated.
I don't mind that we get one or two new trials or PVP weapons every season, but for expansions they need to release like six brand new weapons when expansions come out
Loot tables need to be updated and core playlists need to be refreshed so that when people get done with the seasonal content they still have fresh things to do after that point
Sorry but, they need to entirely remove the management that sounds quite literally like they're bogging down devs that want to address core problems. I don't see that happening, and its sad. They became worse after splitting from Activision, and have become the very thing most of us hate about Activision itself. They're not reinvesting into Destiny, they're funding these other projects while they scoop out to us a Minimal Viable Product. The Bungie that some of us knew from the Halo days is dead, it's now just an animated corpse of our previous hopes and dreams for what could've made Destiny the most unique game in the live service market. It's too late.
On another note, I recently reread the State of the Game from August and it paints a pretty clear picture of why people should no longer support Bungie. I recommend people read that again and come to their own conclusion about how Bungie as a corporation now act to its increasling dwindling dedicated playerbase.
The stuff that people have been asking for they haven’t bothered to listen. From strike specific loot, crucible, SRL(me) and strikes.
Everything you said is true, but i think there’s a bigger issue. Start a new account and play it through. It’s an awful confusing mess. The cost of entry is also ridiculous. Nobody in their right mind will enjoy it, or being willing to pay a stupidly high price for it. Conclusion, no new players means a slow death as existing guardians leave. It doesn’t matter how good the final shape is or how much they revamp the system
I don’t care anymore. I just want the final expansion to come out, I’ll play it and leave. After the final shape their goodwill from me is gone. Years of asking things knowing it was blocked by the executives have soured my opinion of the game severely.
The biggest issue is they haven’t given us anything to look forward to after TFS. They’ve constantly touted it as “the end of the light and darkness saga,” and hasn’t helped them in this regard. It’s almost obsessively mentioned as the end by the devs and player base, of course people are treating it as the end. A sequel announcement would do that the easiest in terms of giving us something to look forward to on the horizon. Showing how episodic content is new and transformative could also work but is a hard sell (it’s literally just longer seasons at this point and if Season of the Lost was any example - long seasons don’t work well without in-between content). But what they’re doing currently with marketing TFS as the end of the chapter has only hurt them and I don’t they realize that.
Letting the developers actually do the things they've been disallowed from doing would be a nice start. Unionizing the entire industry would be an even better one but that's not a Bungie-specific problem.
Wow first here nice
Nice
There is absolutely no entry point to this game. And you’re correct, I’m not a game developer, but I don’t know how they can create one without a hard reset. Because of things like the DCV
just give me a destiny 3, unpopular decision, but who cares when so many people have quit this game. You need a new game to invite new players and bring back older veterans in the game. People will whine about not having their weapons and armor carry over, but who cares when you have no friends to play it with lol.
A lot of people remember only the bad that we got from how d2 launched, but before we got it, nearly everyone was saying it was a good thing. It allowed them to do so much more with the game, it cleared things up and allowed it to feel new again. The problem is that didn't happen and bungie failed. I have no reason to beleive they won't fail again. I have been burned too many times by this game and company. I simply don't beleive anymore, and that's sad isn't it?
Video was fine. It’s good to bring up complaints and better when you include the production complications that create those complaints (as you did) but too many videos like this where people do not suggest solutions to the problems would be not good I think?
They could just not have us start from scratch again if they make d3, just let us port over our d2 character. A lot of multi games where it’s a continued story tends to do that but that’s my opinion
Smart people to stop wasting money on re-skins and shit product:….. welp, 45% are smart
Destiny 2 days are over. Game was at bottom at Lightfall. After that it was worse & worse.
I always played destiny to use the guns I grind for against other people in pvp. Pvp isn’t even really guns anymore it’s just an ability game so I play other shit now.
It honestly makes me sad to see how the games ended up the nostalgia from d1 makes me wanna enjoy d2 and play it but there’s nothing going on and so many problems the game just feels repetitive and I haven’t played for over a yr now also I can’t lie d3 don’t make sense for me just more of the same+even more of my money for 2 missions and a raid
More vault space would be a start 👍
400 is far more than necesary, you just need to clean your vault.
@@Baguette18 How long is it since you played the game mate? Hours and hours of collecting god rolls and you aren't allowed to keep them? favourite sunset guns, you aren't allowed to keep them. Curios from the past, you aren't allowed to keep them. You are completely out of your depth.
FYI Vault Space is now 600.
My vault has consistently never hit 600. Clean it.
However i still agree more vault space would be great. And glimmer cap increase. And search function in inventory and vault.
Even with multiple godrolls of good weapons, there are some weapons that you just won't use. Why collect God rolls of them?
Also, with armor, I had five suits of armor with two exotic pieces for each slot, so I could swap pieces around as needed.
As someone was strived to be very efficient with everything, I failed to see the need for more than 200 slots of vault space.
@@Aetherial_Blaze and why keep certain god rolls anyway lol just craft stuff and use that. Most crafted weapons are better than any god rolls you can get of non-craftables
God roll fantasy is dead
Edit: beloved and defiance of yasmin are perfect examples. You dont need any other pvp sniper. Just those 2. Trash literally everything else
The views to likes here are why youtube needs to overhaul how content creators get paid. Sorry Nomad😕
Servers are a must the connection is ass. Balancing is so far gone its not funny. Bows and fusions broken oppressive as fuck, grenade launchers still annoying. The ability spam is just disgusting.
I have zero faith in the game anymore. Might play final shape if I hear good things after it comes out. Probably when it goes on sale
If Destiny 3 just means I'm doing another exotic quest to earn thorn I think I'm good without it.
Get new players, that means bring back the old stuff, the new player experience is trash
Bungie didnt "produce" Witchqueen, AXIS STUDIOS did and they produced Foresaken expansion. Bungie performed maintenance and "updates"..
Bungie has been incompetent since the release of D2. Well.... not incompetent, more like purposely lazy scumbags who refuse to overdeliver on their Triple A game priced DLC's. It's funny seeing people had any hope in them since the release of beyond light after they took away all our content.... Are you sure they were responsible for maintenance and updates? seems like they can't do that either
I just feel like the pipeline for improvements and changes in Destiny 2 is so long. I realize it is hard to compare one game with another as changes in one game can be as simple as changing a few numbers in a table while another game has much more going on "under the hood". We lived through months and months of Mountaintop and Recluse basically running the Crucible, we have had Exotics be partially or completely broken functionally for months or even years (Nothing Manacles to name one).
Like others have said here, I just don't think the game engine is suited to work with the type of content Bungie has been developing and NEEDS to be developing for it. There have been strides made recently to adress stuff like old unused Exotics, but honestly, these changes come way too late in the lifetime of the game. There is also the issue of an old game becoming "figured out". Besides the odd exotic mission and new raid encounters, there are few things that surprises a Destiny 2 player anymore since the formula is pretty much the same from year to year.
destiny is dead in the water after the final shape and i really do think they might go out of business and sony might just consolidate their assets whenever its all over
I'm not going to lie I have no hope in a Destiny 3 if the people that caused the issues in Destiny 2 are still around 😢
For pve, if they stopped using fake difficulty (real term, means stuff like modifiers, bullet sponges, and getting one shot by everything) and started making more enemies spawn that are more aggressive the higher the difficulty goes with slightly higher damage but not higher health, like how doom and ultrakill do difficulty, I would care about pve. Also if they stopped making as many wall bosses in raids I would play raids.
For pvp, if they made it so you can make your own playlist of gamemodes to matchmake for like you can in titanfall 2, it would be less boring because of the variety and you could exclude gamemodes you don’t like.
A gamemode I would love is control or tdm with no heavy ammo or supers. Supers and heavy ammo ruin my experience in D2 pvp and feel like a cheap way for bad players to win that drags down the rest of the match because it feels like BS when you get solo super we or rocketed.
For weapons, make more unique archetypes and make unique exotics again. There is no reason for me to care about a new pulse rifle that has slightly different stats than the other 500 pulses in the game that are the same archetype. Titanfall 2 feels like it has more weapon variety than destiny even though it just has about 30 weapons, about 6 of which are heavy weapons that aren’t effective on players and are only effective on mechs unless you really wanna troll someone.
PVE is the biggest shame for Destiny 2 right now. Even when you do beat those "Difficult" activities, what do you get? The same weapons u can get from a random red bar enemy in a normal strike. only difference is that it gives u a slight increase in useless stats that change nothing. Oh wellllll. At least I can slowly watch this game rot away from within due to bungie deciding to never overdeliver. Hope it bites them in the ass
I definitely agree with you on Destiny 3.
Also you have to keep in mind that Destiny 2 was built to run on 10-year-old hardware like the PS4.
Originally bungee wanted Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 to be open world where if you could see it you could go there.
Destiny doesn't have the exploration aspect because you're in these tiny bubbles and you can see the world around you but you just can't go to it.
Destiny 3 could fix that because they could make Destiny 3 built from the ground up on current gen consoles and or next-gen consoles that come out in 5 years
They could have it so they could implement fixes faster than they do now, etc etc
So yes I definitely think at some point if they want to continue with the franchise they need to make a new game that is truly next-gen and a step above Destiny 1 and 2
I’ve been saying this for like 5 years lmao
For it to be a forsaken level it would literally have to include:
- the best Campaign so far
- multiple destinations
- a new or completely revolutionary playlist activity
- multiple Maps
- 4 strikes
- a shit ton of exotics
- a completely new type of activity like dungeons
- literally weeks and month's of continuing, evolving and expanding gameplay like the dreaming city curse
- the greatest raid the franchise has ever seen
Its not going to happen.
Can't have half of those things with good ole UNDERDELIVER Bungie. 4 strikes? Do you not think about the starving indie devs in their little cubicles at Bungie HQ?
Bungie & Destiny must get new players to join.
Only my opinion… or wish…
For those 4 months delay, they should bring back all the campaigns since The Red War as a one continuous campaign- for free!!!
No need for all the open world planets, just the missions, with drops of rephrased old weapons and all of the seasonal weapons.
Exotic missions, old crucible maps (maybe even as a part of a pvp required quest part) and even good season activities or missions also.
That way new players will be able to experience all the great story and connect to the game.
There will be a ton of new players that will stick around and buy the final shape, otherwise, it will be just us veterans… closing an era and say goodbye.
While this is nice for new players it would do nothing for the current playerbase thats bleeding. This would also take too much dev time if the delay was to improve final shape thats what they will be doing.
@@bragekv9937yeah u right. Took it only as a way to attract new players, it’s hard to convince anyone to play the game cause it’s so complicated and expensive to start.
I tried Destiny 2 after playing only a few hours of destiny 1. When I first tried it it was in the third or fourth season and I couldn’t get into it, i did a few strikes in a row and got bored. I tried playing again in season of the hunt and got hooked immediately. I have played over 12 hundred hours since then and am still hooked. I hope it gets better because I have put so much “work” into this game let alone about a thousand dollars in silver and expansions etc.
i would love to find a better game , if so i would leave, not that i hate Destiny, but Destiny 1 was amazing and they didn't give us that. 2 was better in many ways, but they have to give us Destiny 1 content in order to keep it going. Any options ? i would love to switch.
"have we all outgrown this franchise".........geez man you said it out loud
We didn't outgrow the franchise. The franchise stopped growing with us.
Just replace gambit with the entire campaign line
Destiny's viability in my life lies only in watching videos of content creators critique and shit on it. Not ever playing it. This is the saddest and funniest of truths 😭😂
That's probably the greatest outcome for you tbh. You get to laugh at all the little pay piggies cry and realize that their game has always been shit lol ( It fucking hurts to have played this game since D1)
What fills the void after The Final Shape?
so what i'm hearing is that destiny is doomed lmao
Bungie needs to pull a Nomura and introduce a black box that has something mysterious we don’t know about or could know about
D3 should be a prequel
Let’s see some evil guardians
Let’s see some lore that’s been untouched
Let’s see more of earth than just Russia
Bro id love to see drifters storyline. Imo hes the most interesting character so far.
Ascendant kitty!!!!!
I don’t know who’s more out of touch, Bungie or the fan base.
at this point both all three parties, upper managment doesnt seem to get that yes anger is passion but anger quickly turns to apathy if unresolved, The dev's not resisting managments decisions and adding things on their own accord nor standing up for the players, and the players asking for the same things basically on repeat because they dont know where the game SHOULD innovate and end up asking for the same game.. just with new guns and maps.. like damn the players have no creativity but i digress that all three aret at fault and sony has been made a fool of for making the deal in the first place
If they ditch D2 to make a D3, a lot of people will just walk, myself included.
I'm not paying $60-70 for an update.
I think that anyone asking for a D3 is to be frank, cutting their nose off to spite their face. D2 may not be in a good place now, but do you think D3 would be better over the long term? It'd run into the same issues that D2 has.
I think for me, it comes down to the core game play loop.
I don't need new loot, new content, etc, I just need to be able to have fun with what I have and often it's struggle.
On the PVP side of things, Midrange game feels good, when you ADS and start shooting people with your handcannon, it's Destiny. But when you have to fight someone up close, honestly the game just feels really damn clunky.
I cannot understand why the hipfire in this game is not more consistent and reliable, there's just no excuse for not being able to reliably kill someone with hipfire, who's outside of shotgun and melee range but not far enough to justify zooming and making taking up a huge chunk of your screen.
And it's not just that either, compared to other games the fov is limited, the HUD could use some tweaks or at least allow us to customize it how we want. Maps generally suck are not built or tailored for specific modes, matchmaking is horrendous, I can go on and on.
But it's not just that side of things, PVE needs some love as well. The most fun I had with PVE, was ironically speedrunning lost sectors in Season 20. That gameplay loop of trying to beat it, optimize my time and score, constantly going back to the drawing board and trying something different to get a faster and faster time was so much fun.
I do not understand why they don't lean in more to things like scoreboards, who has the fastest time? who got the highest score? who get the best score while killing every single enemy, and getting all the things to completion? Imagine if it wasn't just Lost Sectors but Strikes, Dungeons, and Raids as well? The weekly stuff, whoever did the best would get some kind of particle effect or limited time ornament to show off their achievement.
I think if I had to name it, I think Destiny's biggest issue for me is I don't log in to play the game for fun, I log in to do chores and get the rewards. I'm not itching to play Crucible, or anything else.
When I think of games I just can't put down and I could play for hours and hours on end without stopping. I think of stuff like Team Fortress 2, Left 4 Dead, Borderlands, Witchfire, Doom Eternal, Elder Scrolls.
Destiny just isn't in the conversation, it's mid at best, and parasitic to your life at it's worst.
I hate to say this but, I don't think D2 can attract new players at this point, not as it has been going for the last few years anyways. The player onboarding experience is one of the worst I have ever experienced, bar none; the numerous glitches and bugs that just havent been alowed to be adressed are dragging the gameplay down; the price of all of the DLC and Dungeons drives a lot of potential players away; and the limitations with the old hardware that have to be considered when updating the game severly limit it's potential. None of what I have said even includes all of the lore, or even story of the game that has been sunset that might be crucial for new players, and with the potential threat of sunsetting in the future as the game continues to grow larger and larger, it's just not feasable to keep piling on more story onto an already bloated game.
Maybe after TFS and Marathon is released, Bungie can work on a D3 while a skelaton crew works on the "episodes" for a few years. However I wouldn't expect a D3 to even be announced until 2026 at the earliest more likely closer to 2027.
You know how the curse for the Dreaming City, where it's repeating the same cycle over and over? That's Bungie. Only there is no 15th Wish for them. I'd love to see Bungie actually adapt, grow, improve. But without senior management changes, it's not going to happen, because there is no desire for it to happen. The people who care, who build this game, cannot control it's destiny. And many are now gone.
TFS has to deliver something of a miracle to retain. Effectively D3 would be the only route to gain new players. Given the downsizing, really no, D3 is off the table.
Final Shape could be amazing, but it won't be. Real Bungie said, "Sayonara," a long time ago. I don't think I could get my friends back to the game - even if it was to play "Destiny 3."
destiny and bungie have lost there way , thieve forgotten that they are alive service looter shooter, and apply most of there effort too making cool skins for the ever verse store for you to purchase with real money , if all the loot is stale and most of the guns are meh , there's nothing to loot. so this isn't a looter shooter anymore , that's why destiny 2 is on life support , at this stage in destiny 2's life cycle we should be playing to unlock and craft 3-5 brand new weapons a fortnight , not just reskinned average weapons from old dungeons and raids , for a live service game the loot sucks , same guns in rotation , which becomes repetitive once you have a decent roll, bungie seems too think every player is going to grind for that 5 outa 5 weapon for weeks months years , when most just grab the weapon with a decent roll and move on . nobody really cares about god rolls , we want new cool looking weapons { and amour sets } with interesting perks and synergy , I'm not really a fan of sunsetting , but I think to save/freshen the game bungie need to sunset all raid and dungeon weapons/ armour from first dungeon / raid to the last , every 3 months and put new and improved weapons/amour in there place , then bring the old stuff back for a month then maybe put a decent roll in store seen as though they need our money ...rinse and repeat GIVE US SOMETHING [NEW] TO LOOT AND GRIND FOR, if not forget about it .. I'm going back to warframe .. until the finals/ grantheft auto 6 hits seen as though the final shape [which i pre ordered day 1] is up in the air.
I don't even know if Destiny 3 can really be Destiny 3: once you lose developer seniority, be it to other projects or layoffs, you lose what makes that game. Current way things are, I may have some 5 or 6 thousand collective hours but I'm out, not unless TFS goes on an 80% off sale or gets GOTY levels of praise, I'm done. I can't look at another strike or go for legend again, no matter what loot. The actual gameplay that you're supposed to run and run has been the same for so long. I love the dungeons but I don't play the game to do anything more than solo flawless them and leave. I used to love raiding and sherpa-ing but all my friends just stopped playing since we already go to college and work and destiny just feels like unpaid labor at times.
It’s amazing people can’t see beyond Final Shape the Light Dark Saga is a pretty good storyline. What’s stopping the writer having another storying equally and good or better?
I won’t play Destiny 3 if it means leaving all my gear behind and I have to grind for it all again. If you can’t port your gear then probably.
Destiny 3 will be
worst thing for the game IMHO they should drop the number and call the whole thing Destiny
And bring back the volted content so new and old players can replay the story line again maybe with a legend or master difficulty levels.
The lay offs etc came from Sony but badly handled by Bungie but how do you lay off staff in a good way. Salvtori going had one bonus. If he stayed more people would probably been played off and his job is complete as the music has reportedly been done for Final Shape. Also Sony music has some very talented composers on their books that would be much cheaper. I wil miss his music after final same tho.
the only thing i actually want is a proper acknowledgement of everything thats transpired recently, like even just a simple "we messed up and we're sorry" would probably go a long way into repairing some of the damage and even still just a overall better first look towards new content would be nice, like finding out stuff about the season literally like 2 days? before its supposed to go live just feels a bit confusing in a day and age where people arent as willing to just fork out $12 for a season because of the name of the game it would be nice to have a change in the way they give us info for the new seasons given theyre made so far in advance.
The mystery need to come back. We need a other dreaming city, my favorite times in destiny where I had a cool area full of unknown stuff to discover and explore, and I was rewarded for that exploration. (Dreadnought, dreaming city) and the raid and campaign need to be absolute bangers.
To me, theres one thing that makes a DLC feel like im playing a new game, and thats QOL changes. Reticle customization, leaderboard for comp (solos and clans), speed change for the console cursor, interface editor etc etc etc… They wont do this unfortunately
Your rant is completely pointless. Bungie hasn't gotten their stuff together since the release of Destiny 1 (actually since the reboot of Destiny 1). From the perspective of an SW dev and project manager with several decades of professional experience, I can tell you that pretty much everything has been going wrong at Bungie starting with the implementation of Destiny 1. They had technical problems, they had problems with the company culture, they had problems with different factions in the Bungie dev team, they had problems with developing a stringent, working game economy, they could never build a technical platform that was robust and flexible enough to add new content, game modes and game mechanics easily, and and and. Bungie has been overestimating themselves grossly from the beginning. They also have a culture of lying to their customers. It was worse in Destiny 1 and got better after a couple of years with Destiny 2, but to me it appears that dishonesty is in their genes, and I am inclined to think that this is their core problem: They lie to themselves about their capabilities and the goals they can achieve, and to their customers, too. Your quality argument is also very true. Bungie could have made way more money in the end, have an almost indestructible reputation and a franchise they could sell for many years to come if they had spent more money on making Destiny a truly outstanding game, and not one were weaknesses and strengths balance each other into an average one that is constantly plagued with problems. Don't get me wrong: I am not bitter or angry, I am not venting. It's just a game after all. I have kept playing Destiny because despite all of its shortcomings I found it to be entertaining during all the years. However, I have observed how the game developed, how Bungie handled it and how they handled their customers. If Bungie was a car maker, they'd have been dust on the ground years ago.
No
I think we're all just tired of destiny at this point. We're like crack addicts that have built up a tolerance to crack. We're sick of it, but we are addicted. The game is in shambles and barely makes sense anymore and who can even keep up with all the weird storylines, currencies, weapon perks, mods, games menus and submenus and titles and objectives and season passes... it's all just too much, too fragmented, it's nonsensical. I've become only an extremely casual free to play pvp only player at this point. Just addicted to the gun play and that's it.
If episodes are considered maintenance mode for the franchise do y’all really think they’ll bring Forsaken level changes lol. It’s gonna be a close out campaign with a killer raid and that’s about it. Sorry boys that’s my expectation anyway. It’s so obvious to me .
I feel like we're in an echo chamber now.
If they listened to us, they'd speak on the issues we present...but they haven't....and we're going on week 2 post lay offs. Like at some point we gotta just give it a rest because it's a waste of effort if nothing is going to happen