I believe the reduction in tickets available on LNER has increased the prices. You used to be able to get tickets a lot cheaper than that (although I'm a railcard user so there's that...)
I'm liking this Rebecca, great idea to do comparisons like this. Nicer sitting on your bum rather than walking ten leagues a video like Paul. Lovely to have Rebecca's Nest back.
I did similar last year, London-Edinburgh up on LNER and back on Lumo! There's a lot to like about Lumo (you mentioned the headrest). However I was doing both journeys with an 18 month old one my lap in both directions and with a baby pram, lots of baby stuff etc... on LNER the staff members brought out a colouring book which helped keep him amused and it was nice to be able to walk him to the buffet car as well to settle him/change scenery. Lumo also charges you extra for baggage which we hadn't clocked when booking, and there's seemingly less space to stow big luggage... we managed to escape the charge (no one mentioned it) but it did add to the stress on the journey a bit. On that basis I'd prefer LNER, though it's good to have options and obviously not everyone has the same needs!
Lumo for me too.. We live in Newcastle upon Tyne and have on occasions, used Lumo one way and LNER the other whilst visiting our son in London. Really enjoying these vlogs Rebecca, please keep them coming 👍🏻😊
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Nice review Rebecca. One correction: You intimated that if you haven't ordered your food, you can buy some on the train. In fact Lumo do not do food on the train, the trolley just does drinks and snacks. You have to preorder your food as you did, or bring your own. LNER have a good range of food on the train, hot & cold. If you're over 6ft tall then unfortunately Lumo don't welcome tall people on their train!- the fold down table hits your knees before it is level, so your coffee goes on to the floor! You have to sit with your legs to one side in order to lay the table flat. LNER do faster trains than your LNER one, and in my experience their ticket prices are very similar to Lumo. In my experience, overall they are very similar, its the small things that make the difference on the day.
Useful comparison. One aspect that I don't think was mentioned was the difference in seat comfort. The LNER Azumas are, as with so many newer trains, fitted out with 'ironing board' seats, which are hard and uncomfortable over longer distances. Lumo seats on the other hand have significantly more padding and are much more comfortable.
Very well made video, really interesting to watch these comparisons. I wish You Tube was around during British Rail! Made this journey several times onboard HSTs in the 1980’s, both 1st and 2nd Class were a level above these trains. The catering too was superb then, at your seat silver service dining and the trains just as fast. Walk-on tickets at decent prices, where did it all go wrong Mr Major?
Once again I’m so jealous of the train service in Europe. Americans are so set on automobiles that we neglected to build a decent rail system. I would much prefer trains to planes and automobiles. Thanks for the video, Rebecca 😊
The new Amtrak Venture rolling stock is as good as anything in Europe (it is quite literally an American version of the new Austrian RailJet rolling stock), as is Brightline as they use the same Siemens rolling stock (and your Brightline train is lucky enough to not smash into a vehicle in a grade crossing). Though that new rolling stock hasn't found its way into the Northeast corridor yet, the only part of the US where rail service approaches European levels.
I really found this useful - was in the UK in 2016 and bought a britrail pass for 3 first class trips. I did London to Portsmouth, Portsmouth to Liverpool and then Liverpool to Edinburgh. I chose rail travel so I could see as much as possible along the way. Am planning on spending around 3 months wandering around the UK on my next trip and expect to use rail travel extensively to get around. Will be following your adventures from now on.
the chargers on the Azumas cut out whenever the train goes through a neutral section. these are sections in the overhead lines where there's no power provided; this is to divide up the electric provision into sections. the train coasts through. whilst the lighting stays on by battery, the sockets all turn off for 15 seconds then come back on again. if you are in coach A or M, this is associated with a massive banging noise as the overhead pantograph descends and reascends
As somebody that directly contributed to the design changes that turned the Azuma trains into Lumo trains, I’m glad you enjoyed it! I’m impressed you picked up on a lot of the key differences, even subtle ones just by riding each once.
Hello from Australia ... Great video Rebecca, I just saw your personal update about ramping up this channel a couple of days back. I was "initially" thinking on your return LNER journey that your rocky situation could be to do with your seat placement compared to the prior journey. HOWEVER ... You did then comment on passengers walking up the aisle bracing themselves. So that shot me out the water. ... So then ... In many train VLOGS the presenter never tells you where their seat is placed inside the saloon. A seat in the centre will always be more comfortable a ride than the seats at the end. In the centre you are away from the key stress points of sitting over the bogies (the wheel structure) and away from the coupling between carriages. Even more true in a sleeper cabin. It would be great if a VLOGGER one day points this out. Either way probably more comfortable than trekking a Roman road in inclement weather. :)
I think there may be a reason why the charger kept cutting out. When their is over head electric wires like on the line you travelled on every so often there will be what are called neutral sections which are section of the overhead wire which arent electrified, this allows the signaller to isolate different section of the overhead wires in an emergency instead having to shut down the entire line between Newcastle and Edinburgh for example. So everytime the power cuts out the train has passed through one of these neutral section and the trains looses power for abit. Lumos trains may have a battery back up that keeps the chargers on but im not 100% sure
Love the video. Trains + UK always good. Your presentation style is great. Voice, details and use of English is very endearing. Also looking cute and abfab as always.
Just he aware that if Lumo cancel a service or cancel on route (not uncommon) you will have to go on an LNER train on the unreserved seating section. If not seats you will be standing! But it's worth taking a chance with much cheaper tickets than LNER. You can also book way further in advance than LNER (which is 3 months). Worth looking at also getting a rail card as.you could make the money back on this return journey alone
Very interesting Rebecca, thank you. Mainly travelling on very tired Avanti West Coast trains (with dire wifi), the refurb programme is slow and like most train operators - are NOT installing USB-C sockets (mandatory by law for new devices any time now !!). I hope you had a day or two in Scotland before returning south !
USB-A to USB-C cables are common enough, USB-C to USB-A/mini-USB/Lightning cables not so much. USB-A outlets will still be more useful for more people.
The 390s almost certainly still ride better than any IET, and I've heard all the 11 car sets have been refurbed already. The IETs will increase trip times on the WCML as they're 15mph slower on the WCML than the 390s or 221s as they lack tilting technology (110mph vs 125mph at max line speed). Will be much more efficient for the routes it will be replacing the 221s on though, as they're dual mode so can run on the wire until they reach diesel territory and only run the diesels as needed.
In their day the Pendolino units (originally ordered by Virgin Trains) were state-of-the-art. They are capable of 140 mph but that speed cannot be realised without upgrading the signalling system.
I sort of expected that. Lumo, being a smaller independent company with fewer services, were bound to pull out all the stops to make it a more enjoyable experience. Good for them :D
I'm a lanky six foot so I always try to find a table seat or use the Wheelchair space if there isn't a wheelchair or cyclist using it . I often have a trolley or suitcase with me so that space is useful if the other generous leg space options aren't available.
I travelled Lumo only once and once only! I'm 6ft 3in tall and found that the fold down table hits your knees before it is level, so your coffee goes on to the floor! You have to sit with your legs to one side in order to lay the table flat. So uncomfortable. So stick with the table seats. I won't use them again. The tables on the LNER don't have that problem.
Thank you for this comparison, we are planning to go to Edinburgh from London on our trip this month and saw there are 2 trains to get us to Edinburgh and Lumo much cheaper one. We will be using the Lumo train then. Thanks!
😊Yeah Thanks a lot for share this interesting video...I'm Japanese and I remember got to ride in a LNER and Great Western Class 800 from London to Primouse,Wigan,Glasgow,Ediburgh and York in this early summer!! It was so comfortable with so nice views🥰 But I must not forgot...Many of British person took lot of kind for me and I felt so glad! Thanks!
Now if I'd known in advance that you were planning this trip Rebecca I would have come to my local ECML station (New Barnet) & waved as you whooshed past me ! 😎
I'm guessing Hitachi has made some improvements to the suspension on the newer IET variants, I would expect the upcoming Avanti 805s and EMR 810s to have the same upgrades. In Avanti's case those 805s are replacing the generally good riding 221s, and will end up being compared to the 390s which are supposed to be the smoothest riding trains in the UK.
What a lovely positive style of review, I enjoyed that thanks. I find loads of train sockets are dodgy, they’re the same as sockets in the home, ie. made of sprung copper inside which is soft but they are getting plugs rammed into them many times a day unlike your home sockets. It’s a great facility to have but I guess train companies have made a rod for their own back, it stands to reason that they’re going to wear out pretty quickly and think how many there are to keep on top of maintaining them.
I'm thinking of having a long weekend in Edinburgh, not sure if I'm going to fly from Gatwick or take a train from King's Cross. I'm not used to public transport tbh, watching this video has given me an idea what to expect. Thank you
The train is the better option, as it takes you from city centre to city centre with no airport security checks. The train works out much quicker, is more comfortable and is often cheaper.
The Lumo train is definitely a good option for this journey. By the time you gave factored airport security and check in times plus getting to and from the airport the train is marginally faster too (although not by much)
Hi Rebecca, The two trains you travelled on are both from the same family of trains. LNER uses the class 801, while Lumo uses the class 803. The class 801's are a bit older than the class 803's now. Maybe that could explain the bumpy ride on the way back?
I live in the South West so rarely have cause to use either Lumo or LNER, but on the odd occasion I do, I find both of them a massive upgrade on GWR. Bigger comfier seats in standard class, smoother journey, friendlier service, etc.
Great comparison. In Dec'22 / Jan'23 I took a Grand Central train (Adelante Class 180) from Kings Cross to York standard class, then returned on LNER (Azuma) 1st class. I too found the LNER a much bumpier ride. It also seemed easier to get food and drink on the Grand Central, than it did on the LNER. I also found it less personal (less welcomed) on the LNER, but they did seem a bit short staffed.
Aside from the comfy seats, another benefit is the Lumo train I usually get (Thursday around 9:30pm Newcastle to Stevenage) is always almost empty. It's like having a private 125mph taxi home.
An excellent comparison of passenger experience. Also consider the 'volumes' of passengers accommodated. On a typical weekday, Lumo sends 2,010 seats from Kings Cross to Edinburgh, and LNER sends 15,886 seats (almost 8 times more). I have always found with anything (not just railways), the greater number of customers handled, the more robotic and less 'personal' the service becomes. This might be a necessity in order to handle the numbers?
When we moved up here (just south of Edinburgh) we had a few gigs to attend in the O2. So (treating ourselves) we took the LNER first class. They serve you dinner at your seat although the choice is a bit limited (and if critical staff dont turn up or there is a kitchen failure your back to sandwiches exactly like you had). The seats are probably a tad more comfortable with a headrest that can be adjusted (in theory), The charge ports were no more relaible though. I was barely able to keep my phone charged alternating between my charger or using the USB port. If I was using my phone to scroll through facebook it was using it faster than I was putting it n. NB. If you dont want to stop so much you need to pick the right service. The on-the-half hour LNER services only stop at about 5 stops (or less) and takes more or less the same time as the Lumo. The advatage of eating on the train is that you dont have to look for somewhere to eat when you get into London or hope that the hotel's restaurant is still open. That said, if you only end up with sandwiches then you lose any advantage. The airline like service on the Lumo, cheaper price and on average less stops is very attractive.
Lumo emulates a budget airline. It offers something different for the usual UK rail product. That is why the regulator allowed Lumo to compete with incumbent LNER. Yes Lumo has fewer stops but, again, it must not be seen to compete too much with the incumbent otherwise it wouldn't have been granted the licence to compete. Some people wish Lumo would call at Peterborough and/or Doncaster to tap the markets in East Anglia and S Yorkshire.
A well thought-out comparison, telling you what you need to know to plan a rail trip to Scotland. Travel time and comfort is important on such a long journey, but it would also be nice to know the price differential - though I suspect LUMO was cheaper.
I live near Inverness and it’s an 8-hour schlep down to London on LNER. To be honest, I only do it if 1st class is affordable, otherwise I fly. BUT I tried a new idea this week. Bus down to Edinburgh (which, being of a “certain age”, I get for free), plus Lumo from Edinburgh to London. Overall travel time is the same more or less, but you have the advantage of a civilised lunch stop and leg stretch in Edinburgh and, like you, I found the Lumo experience overall to be more pleasant. (Also, the train arrived into London on time, to the SECOND!)
I got Lumo once and the train was packed. It failed at Newcastle and we were told we could get on one and only one LNER train to get to Edinburgh and it was standing room only. I'm a regular traveler on the ECML and its LNER for me every time
Interesting comparison . Next time I travel that way, I will need to look carefully which one to select, although being based in Derby , options will be different
Done both Lumo and LNER on several occasions and interesting to see how your journey was. I find both can be good but my first Lumo trip was on a packed train from London and upon boarding there was a big issue with people having so much luggage that it was hard to find spaces, I had only a backpack and a bag so one on the overheard and one under my seat but other with multiple cases and stuff. Also had an LNER trip that became so full at one stage that a number passengers either stood or sat by the doors even with seat reservations and was a nightmare, I do find Lumo more comfortable and believe the wifi worked better so for the cheaper price I would always go with that where possible (Only 4/5 trains so not great choice of times)
Thanks Rebecca, for another enjoyable and informative video! I’ve yet to experience Lumo, although after watching this video and subsequently downloading their app, I’m definitely going to give them a go….especially as their prices - with a railcard discount - are very favourable for a four plus hour journey Can’t wait for your next offering!!
Interesting to watch, in 2022 I travelled Aberdeen - London with LNER, I recognise your comments about unsettled ride. What is strange is that the Lumo & these LNER trains are basically the same train just set up differently, I use the earlier but very similar "Javelin" trains on a regular basis and do find that at times the ride is not as comfortable as the older trains that serve Victoria / Charing Cross etc. (Javelin, St Pancras to Kent, part of the way using HS1). As for tracking the journey, I find the Network Rail app to be excellent, it also gives an indicaiton of late running and revised arrival times.
Indeed they are. These Hitachi units are a standard design for UK mainline rail. Other operators using them include GWR, TPE, Hull Trains and by 2025 (EMR, whose units are currently being tested).
brilliant review of Lumo & LNER i did a journey with LUMO from London to Newcastle in 2022 & my exprerience wasnt the best to start with as i did feel really unconfortable on the train while travelling up but had a better journey back but im travelling with LUMO again in may when i travel up to Edingburgh im hopinh my experience will be better than in 2022 but in LNER ive only done short journeys with them like from Newcastle to Durham & Leeds to Doncaster brilliant vlog
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These comparisons are great! If I want to come to the UK for a trip through, as an adventurer this will help me travel more comfortable also moneywise. ❤
Did both Lumo and LNER at the end of 2023. Had booked Lumo for both ways. The onboard service and quality of carriages are very good on Lumo. Seats are comfy and staff are really friendly. The main downside to Lumo is they are really exposed if they cancel services. You are then at the mercy of using LNER in unreserved section. Also, when busy or full on Lumo, there is limited luggage storage. They had to use on.ofntbe toilets for luggage just to fit it all onboard.
We just got the lumo from London Kingscross to Edinburgh. We got a good price for the return journey for a family of 4. . LNER way more expensive. Train dirty on the outside . Inside ok. Train busy lots of luggage with people bringing cases that are to big. Toilet needed a clean . Train was on time. Total journey 4 hours 26 minutes. Was expecting the LNER to have four chairs facing a table . Clearly no option. The lumo very much like a plane layout. Bit of a cattle truck. Your journey depends on the people around you . We had pleasant and considerate people . A pleasant trip so far . The return Journey in a few days time. . I think it’s a case of we tried it once , probably not again . Quicker than a car but the train is restrictive on what you can bring. The car has more space… May try the aeroplane next. Have to see .
Travelled with LNER to Scotland and was reasonably happy there was good WiFi on board plus they have also have two trains an hour to Edinburgh, one ‘stopper’ as shown in the vlog and a faster train with less stops - about 3 I think also LNER run north of Edinburgh to Aberdeen in Diesel mode so I was able to return to London from Dundee direct without changing
Nice video! In regards to your charger cutting out, I know that the plugs on some trains briefly lose power when going through a neutral section on the overhead lines, so it could be caused by that (although I would have expected this to happen on Lumo as well).
The bumpy ride is probably due to the age of the trains. LNER and Lumo both operate the same type of train (the IET), but LNER’s are a few years older, and the IETs have a habit of roughening up after a bit of time in service. Sadly, I reckon the Lumo trains will go the same way in some time.
Great video, thanks! Omw to vacation to Edinburgh from central EU and was thinking to visit London as well. One thing struck me tho - the price? Airplane ticket is 30% of the price from Edinburgh to London. That is absolutely insane (and that is when Im counting the cheapest lumo ticket for around £50. I did hear it's bad, but this is something I did not expect.
I think most people will figure it out, but you can get fast trains with LNER between the two, with much fewer stops for a quicker journey. They usually mean the trolley can get around more (they can't have that in the aisle while people are trying to get on or off). I live in London but family is in north Scotland so usually get LNER the whole way to Inverness as Lumo doesn't go that far sadly, and swopping at Edinburgh is no fun (its an extremely draughty and chilly station at any time of year). Though these days I tend to get the Sleeper up there, because I take my dog and she'd never relax for nine hours, and it means I don't waste most of a day on each leg.
LNER have been going for some time so when new everything was nice and pristine. Standards have slipped quite a lot, including the amenities. It's functional for what it needs to do and that's about it. Lumo whilst relatively new, I feel will suffer the same fate and standards will gradually erode away. 2 sockets for the aisle seat under the one in front and then 2 sockets below the window nearer floor level much better as a design layout but everything is about cost so take a trusted adapter for the extra socket. It was very good of you to do the comparisons so very much appreciated. Perhaps a west coast journey next, to Glasgow so we can see how that side of the country compares with its counterpart on the East.
Not a fan of the luggage store at the end of the carriage having had a case disappear on a trip into London, I now carry a bike lock should I have to use them.
Got the LNER down today and will get the Lumo back up next Saturday (at 5:48!). I have used both before and tbh I like them equally, not that much difference in quality.
Just got Trian Sim 4 and it has made me strangely more invested in this vid than a regular Whitewick vid... which is usually already heavily invested ♥🚄
The main difference is Lumo is ano frills train service with no first class, trolley service rather than the modern version of a buffet car, and can charge less as its trains are more basic and run less frequently than LNER. I wish we could have an alternative to Avanti on the WCML as they've been a poor replacement for Virgin and are too expensive.
I prefer Avanti because they lean into the corners....and because I live near Manchester so don't have the same choice ☺️ I did have an Ooh & Aah at an LNER Class 803 at Edinburgh and was wondering about going via Leeds on my next trip though just to try them (or Lumo) out. Nice video!
You could try out 3 flavors of IET in one trip haha. TPE runs the class 802s on the Manchester to Leeds line, and of course you have Lumo and LNER on the ECML.
I travel this route regularly and am a total Lumo convert. I won't travel LNER now if there is a Lumo ticket available. The main reason is comfort. I don't know what body shape the LNER seats were designed for but it's not mine! The seats are more like park benches and I find them cripplingly uncomfortable. Also the fully electric version of the Azuma rolling stock which Lumo uses (as opposed to the diesel-electric 'hybrid' Azumas used by LNER) just seem smoother and quieter. Fun fact, LNER needs to use the hybrid trains because its route extends north to Aberdeen. The line between Edinburgh and Aberdeen is not electrified.
The only downside to Lumo as far as I can see is the relatively infrequent services. My last trip on LNER was very bumpy, the train suspension getting worn out, maybe. I'll certainly be trying LUMO for my next trip. Thank you for the review, Rebecca!
Traveled lumo from Newcastle to London today Have to say it was rather nice Seat got a little firm and a lack of legroom was a pain as there was a stranger next to me (I’m 6’5 so need to stretch out a bit) but overall a solid journey
A couple of extra additions of info…
LUMO:
Morning travel
£46.90
LNER:
Afternoon Travel
£87
I believe the reduction in tickets available on LNER has increased the prices. You used to be able to get tickets a lot cheaper than that (although I'm a railcard user so there's that...)
Thank u Rebecca ❤️❤️❤️
What sort of tickets? Booked in advance? How far in advance?
I'm liking this Rebecca, great idea to do comparisons like this. Nicer sitting on your bum rather than walking ten leagues a video like Paul. Lovely to have Rebecca's Nest back.
Having a commentary is so much better than some of the dumb UA-cam train trips, well written and spoken too. It was also a good length. Excellent.
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The worst ones are those with nonstop ludicrous lounge music! 😣
Thanks
I did similar last year, London-Edinburgh up on LNER and back on Lumo! There's a lot to like about Lumo (you mentioned the headrest). However I was doing both journeys with an 18 month old one my lap in both directions and with a baby pram, lots of baby stuff etc... on LNER the staff members brought out a colouring book which helped keep him amused and it was nice to be able to walk him to the buffet car as well to settle him/change scenery. Lumo also charges you extra for baggage which we hadn't clocked when booking, and there's seemingly less space to stow big luggage... we managed to escape the charge (no one mentioned it) but it did add to the stress on the journey a bit. On that basis I'd prefer LNER, though it's good to have options and obviously not everyone has the same needs!
Lumo for me too.. We live in Newcastle upon Tyne and have on occasions, used Lumo one way and LNER the other whilst visiting our son in London. Really enjoying these vlogs Rebecca, please keep them coming 👍🏻😊
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Nice review Rebecca. One correction: You intimated that if you haven't ordered your food, you can buy some on the train. In fact Lumo do not do food on the train, the trolley just does drinks and snacks. You have to preorder your food as you did, or bring your own. LNER have a good range of food on the train, hot & cold.
If you're over 6ft tall then unfortunately Lumo don't welcome tall people on their train!- the fold down table hits your knees before it is level, so your coffee goes on to the floor! You have to sit with your legs to one side in order to lay the table flat.
LNER do faster trains than your LNER one, and in my experience their ticket prices are very similar to Lumo.
In my experience, overall they are very similar, its the small things that make the difference on the day.
Useful comparison. One aspect that I don't think was mentioned was the difference in seat comfort. The LNER Azumas are, as with so many newer trains, fitted out with 'ironing board' seats, which are hard and uncomfortable over longer distances. Lumo seats on the other hand have significantly more padding and are much more comfortable.
hello again Rebecca, what an interesting Review, my choice would be Lumo too , well done and thank you 😊😍
I will always prefer the 225 sets and the HST sets, standard class always felt like first and the crew were absolutely lovely 👍
Very well made video, really interesting to watch these comparisons. I wish You Tube was around during British Rail! Made this journey several times onboard HSTs in the 1980’s, both 1st and 2nd Class were a level above these trains. The catering too was superb then, at your seat silver service dining and the trains just as fast. Walk-on tickets at decent prices, where did it all go wrong Mr Major?
Once again I’m so jealous of the train service in Europe. Americans are so set on automobiles that we neglected to build a decent rail system. I would much prefer trains to planes and automobiles.
Thanks for the video, Rebecca 😊
The new Amtrak Venture rolling stock is as good as anything in Europe (it is quite literally an American version of the new Austrian RailJet rolling stock), as is Brightline as they use the same Siemens rolling stock (and your Brightline train is lucky enough to not smash into a vehicle in a grade crossing). Though that new rolling stock hasn't found its way into the Northeast corridor yet, the only part of the US where rail service approaches European levels.
Good to see you, again, Ms Whitacre. Always loved your facial expressions.
This person is definitely the most exciting person ever! She is so energetic and happy!! I absolutely love this video!
Think I’d choose Lumo too. What a great vlog. Thank you Rebecca. So enjoyable to watch.
I really found this useful - was in the UK in 2016 and bought a britrail pass for 3 first class trips. I did London to Portsmouth, Portsmouth to Liverpool and then Liverpool to Edinburgh. I chose rail travel so I could see as much as possible along the way.
Am planning on spending around 3 months wandering around the UK on my next trip and expect to use rail travel extensively to get around. Will be following your adventures from now on.
the chargers on the Azumas cut out whenever the train goes through a neutral section. these are sections in the overhead lines where there's no power provided; this is to divide up the electric provision into sections. the train coasts through. whilst the lighting stays on by battery, the sockets all turn off for 15 seconds then come back on again. if you are in coach A or M, this is associated with a massive banging noise as the overhead pantograph descends and reascends
Thank you for sharing your experiences with us Rebecca looking forward to seeing more videos from you ❤
As somebody that directly contributed to the design changes that turned the Azuma trains into Lumo trains, I’m glad you enjoyed it! I’m impressed you picked up on a lot of the key differences, even subtle ones just by riding each once.
Hello from Australia ... Great video Rebecca, I just saw your personal update about ramping up this channel a couple of days back. I was "initially" thinking on your return LNER journey that your rocky situation could be to do with your seat placement compared to the prior journey. HOWEVER ... You did then comment on passengers walking up the aisle bracing themselves. So that shot me out the water. ... So then ... In many train VLOGS the presenter never tells you where their seat is placed inside the saloon. A seat in the centre will always be more comfortable a ride than the seats at the end. In the centre you are away from the key stress points of sitting over the bogies (the wheel structure) and away from the coupling between carriages. Even more true in a sleeper cabin. It would be great if a VLOGGER one day points this out. Either way probably more comfortable than trekking a Roman road in inclement weather. :)
Epic trip. 🎉
I think there may be a reason why the charger kept cutting out. When their is over head electric wires like on the line you travelled on every so often there will be what are called neutral sections which are section of the overhead wire which arent electrified, this allows the signaller to isolate different section of the overhead wires in an emergency instead having to shut down the entire line between Newcastle and Edinburgh for example. So everytime the power cuts out the train has passed through one of these neutral section and the trains looses power for abit. Lumos trains may have a battery back up that keeps the chargers on but im not 100% sure
Love the video. Trains + UK always good. Your presentation style is great. Voice, details and use of English is very endearing. Also looking cute and abfab as always.
Perfect timing, I will be in the UK later in the year and need to make that trip, so your advice is great.
Just he aware that if Lumo cancel a service or cancel on route (not uncommon) you will have to go on an LNER train on the unreserved seating section. If not seats you will be standing! But it's worth taking a chance with much cheaper tickets than LNER. You can also book way further in advance than LNER (which is 3 months).
Worth looking at also getting a rail card as.you could make the money back on this return journey alone
Very interesting Rebecca, thank you. Mainly travelling on very tired Avanti West Coast trains (with dire wifi), the refurb programme is slow and like most train operators - are NOT installing USB-C sockets (mandatory by law for new devices any time now !!).
I hope you had a day or two in Scotland before returning south !
USB-A to USB-C cables are common enough, USB-C to USB-A/mini-USB/Lightning cables not so much. USB-A outlets will still be more useful for more people.
The 390s almost certainly still ride better than any IET, and I've heard all the 11 car sets have been refurbed already. The IETs will increase trip times on the WCML as they're 15mph slower on the WCML than the 390s or 221s as they lack tilting technology (110mph vs 125mph at max line speed). Will be much more efficient for the routes it will be replacing the 221s on though, as they're dual mode so can run on the wire until they reach diesel territory and only run the diesels as needed.
In their day the Pendolino units (originally ordered by Virgin Trains) were state-of-the-art. They are capable of 140 mph but that speed cannot be realised without upgrading the signalling system.
Very good video, Thanks for posting!
I sort of expected that.
Lumo, being a smaller independent company with fewer services, were bound to pull out all the stops to make it a more enjoyable experience.
Good for them :D
Lumo isn't independent. It's owned by WorstBus AKA First
Not sure about being a smaller Independent company given its part of First group
@@ianburnley6873 I agree
@@ianburnley6873 smaller than HMG...
I'm a lanky six foot so I always try to find a table seat or use the Wheelchair space if there isn't a wheelchair or cyclist using it . I often have a trolley or suitcase with me so that space is useful if the other generous leg space options aren't available.
I travelled Lumo only once and once only! I'm 6ft 3in tall and found that the fold down table hits your knees before it is level, so your coffee goes on to the floor! You have to sit with your legs to one side in order to lay the table flat. So uncomfortable. So stick with the table seats. I won't use them again. The tables on the LNER don't have that problem.
Thank you for this comparison, we are planning to go to Edinburgh from London on our trip this month and saw there are 2 trains to get us to Edinburgh and Lumo much cheaper one. We will be using the Lumo train then. Thanks!
😊Yeah Thanks a lot for share this interesting video...I'm Japanese and I remember got to ride in a LNER and Great Western Class 800 from London to Primouse,Wigan,Glasgow,Ediburgh and York in this early summer!!
It was so comfortable with so nice views🥰
But I must not forgot...Many of British person took lot of kind for me and I felt so glad!
Thanks!
Now if I'd known in advance that you were planning this trip Rebecca I would have come to my local ECML station (New Barnet) & waved as you whooshed past me ! 😎
Great video Rebecca. I love trains. Nice top by the way, suits you 😊
Great comparison and great to see you out and about. 👍
I have been reading that the LUMO train seats and ride are the best of all of the different 800-class trains
I'm guessing Hitachi has made some improvements to the suspension on the newer IET variants, I would expect the upcoming Avanti 805s and EMR 810s to have the same upgrades. In Avanti's case those 805s are replacing the generally good riding 221s, and will end up being compared to the 390s which are supposed to be the smoothest riding trains in the UK.
Thank you so much for this video! Very helpful! I’m traveling to London for the first time next month and doing this same journey by train
What a lovely positive style of review, I enjoyed that thanks. I find loads of train sockets are dodgy, they’re the same as sockets in the home, ie. made of sprung copper inside which is soft but they are getting plugs rammed into them many times a day unlike your home sockets. It’s a great facility to have but I guess train companies have made a rod for their own back, it stands to reason that they’re going to wear out pretty quickly and think how many there are to keep on top of maintaining them.
I'm thinking of having a long weekend in Edinburgh, not sure if I'm going to fly from Gatwick or take a train from King's Cross.
I'm not used to public transport tbh, watching this video has given me an idea what to expect.
Thank you
The train is the better option, as it takes you from city centre to city centre with no airport security checks. The train works out much quicker, is more comfortable and is often cheaper.
@@richardb3363OK thanks. I will have to weigh up the pros and cons and decide what I'm going to do.
The Lumo train is definitely a good option for this journey. By the time you gave factored airport security and check in times plus getting to and from the airport the train is marginally faster too (although not by much)
Hi Rebecca, The two trains you travelled on are both from the same family of trains. LNER uses the class 801, while Lumo uses the class 803. The class 801's are a bit older than the class 803's now. Maybe that could explain the bumpy ride on the way back?
Lovely video and informative. Thank you. My question is, is there no other faster train service between the two cities with less stops perhaps?
Loved this video and would liked to have known what price the tickets were for each company and if any railcard discount was used😀
My first time on your channel and it’s fantastic! Thanks for the great and well-balanced information :-) 🎉
I live in the South West so rarely have cause to use either Lumo or LNER, but on the odd occasion I do, I find both of them a massive upgrade on GWR. Bigger comfier seats in standard class, smoother journey, friendlier service, etc.
What a beautiful video I absolutely loved it I must do more train journeys in the future myself my I say u looked stunning as always Rebecca ❤❤❤🥰🥰🥰
Love Kings Cross! Great comparison. Thanks!
Much thanks for sharing all this information. You answered more in your video then I could find by using their websites.
Oh, you're really good at this. Light, charming, informative, efficient and fun. Top points. 😊
That was a great review full of facts to prepare the traveller. Much better than flying? I think so. Well done!!
I take a four way socket extension on the train with me. A solid one so it fits in a bag more easily
Great comparison. In Dec'22 / Jan'23 I took a Grand Central train (Adelante Class 180) from Kings Cross to York standard class, then returned on LNER (Azuma) 1st class. I too found the LNER a much bumpier ride. It also seemed easier to get food and drink on the Grand Central, than it did on the LNER. I also found it less personal (less welcomed) on the LNER, but they did seem a bit short staffed.
Aside from the comfy seats, another benefit is the Lumo train I usually get (Thursday around 9:30pm Newcastle to Stevenage) is always almost empty. It's like having a private 125mph taxi home.
Love your video. I'm going to london in a few weeks via lumo then lner so very much appreciated your comparisons
An excellent comparison of passenger experience. Also consider the 'volumes' of passengers accommodated. On a typical weekday, Lumo sends 2,010 seats from Kings Cross to Edinburgh, and LNER sends 15,886 seats (almost 8 times more). I have always found with anything (not just railways), the greater number of customers handled, the more robotic and less 'personal' the service becomes. This might be a necessity in order to handle the numbers?
When we moved up here (just south of Edinburgh) we had a few gigs to attend in the O2. So (treating ourselves) we took the LNER first class. They serve you dinner at your seat although the choice is a bit limited (and if critical staff dont turn up or there is a kitchen failure your back to sandwiches exactly like you had). The seats are probably a tad more comfortable with a headrest that can be adjusted (in theory), The charge ports were no more relaible though. I was barely able to keep my phone charged alternating between my charger or using the USB port. If I was using my phone to scroll through facebook it was using it faster than I was putting it n.
NB. If you dont want to stop so much you need to pick the right service. The on-the-half hour LNER services only stop at about 5 stops (or less) and takes more or less the same time as the Lumo.
The advatage of eating on the train is that you dont have to look for somewhere to eat when you get into London or hope that the hotel's restaurant is still open. That said, if you only end up with sandwiches then you lose any advantage.
The airline like service on the Lumo, cheaper price and on average less stops is very attractive.
Lumo emulates a budget airline. It offers something different for the usual UK rail product. That is why the regulator allowed Lumo to compete with incumbent LNER. Yes Lumo has fewer stops but, again, it must not be seen to compete too much with the incumbent otherwise it wouldn't have been granted the licence to compete. Some people wish Lumo would call at Peterborough and/or Doncaster to tap the markets in East Anglia and S Yorkshire.
The camera work on this is very good, something that often lets other vloggers down
A well thought-out comparison, telling you what you need to know to plan a rail trip to Scotland. Travel time and comfort is important on such a long journey, but it would also be nice to know the price differential - though I suspect LUMO was cheaper.
I live near Inverness and it’s an 8-hour schlep down to London on LNER. To be honest, I only do it if 1st class is affordable, otherwise I fly. BUT I tried a new idea this week. Bus down to Edinburgh (which, being of a “certain age”, I get for free), plus Lumo from Edinburgh to London. Overall travel time is the same more or less, but you have the advantage of a civilised lunch stop and leg stretch in Edinburgh and, like you, I found the Lumo experience overall to be more pleasant. (Also, the train arrived into London on time, to the SECOND!)
I got Lumo once and the train was packed. It failed at Newcastle and we were told we could get on one and only one LNER train to get to Edinburgh and it was standing room only. I'm a regular traveler on the ECML and its LNER for me every time
Interesting comparison . Next time I travel that way, I will need to look carefully which one to select, although being based in Derby , options will be different
Done both Lumo and LNER on several occasions and interesting to see how your journey was.
I find both can be good but my first Lumo trip was on a packed train from London and upon boarding there was a big issue with people having so much luggage that it was hard to find spaces, I had only a backpack and a bag so one on the overheard and one under my seat but other with multiple cases and stuff.
Also had an LNER trip that became so full at one stage that a number passengers either stood or sat by the doors even with seat reservations and was a nightmare,
I do find Lumo more comfortable and believe the wifi worked better so for the cheaper price I would always go with that where possible (Only 4/5 trains so not great choice of times)
Lovely to have the 'nest' back Rebecca - great review of the two services!
Thanks Rebecca, for another enjoyable and informative video! I’ve yet to experience Lumo, although after watching this video and subsequently downloading their app, I’m definitely going to give them a go….especially as their prices - with a railcard discount - are very favourable for a four plus hour journey
Can’t wait for your next offering!!
Very good. Enough real information to make your mind up
Interesting to watch, in 2022 I travelled Aberdeen - London with LNER, I recognise your comments about unsettled ride. What is strange is that the Lumo & these LNER trains are basically the same train just set up differently, I use the earlier but very similar "Javelin" trains on a regular basis and do find that at times the ride is not as comfortable as the older trains that serve Victoria / Charing Cross etc. (Javelin, St Pancras to Kent, part of the way using HS1). As for tracking the journey, I find the Network Rail app to be excellent, it also gives an indicaiton of late running and revised arrival times.
Indeed they are. These Hitachi units are a standard design for UK mainline rail. Other operators using them include GWR, TPE, Hull Trains and by 2025 (EMR, whose units are currently being tested).
I thought the Lumos didn't have diesel engines but the LNER ones did? DOes that not make a difference?@@alexmcwhirter6611
Did LNER yesterday 1st class up to Grantham - the staff were lovely but I have to agree about the temperature... it was absolutely roasting!
brilliant review of Lumo & LNER i did a journey with LUMO from London to Newcastle in 2022 & my exprerience wasnt the best to start with as i did feel really unconfortable on the train while travelling up but had a better journey back but im travelling with LUMO again in may when i travel up to Edingburgh im hopinh my experience will be better than in 2022 but in LNER ive only done short journeys with them like from Newcastle to Durham & Leeds to Doncaster brilliant vlog
This was interesting. I work for SWR based at Exeter St Davids and it good to see comparisons. Enjoying the channel.
Exeter St Davids is a lovely station. I like that it has two lines leaving in opposite directions that both end up in London
We had the electrical come and go on the Caledonian Sleeper as well. Thank you for an interesting comparison video.
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These comparisons are great! If I want to come to the UK for a trip through, as an adventurer this will help me travel more comfortable also moneywise. ❤
Thanks for the video Rebecca, definitely LUMO for me!!🙂🚆🚆🚆🚆🇬🇧💚
Did both Lumo and LNER at the end of 2023. Had booked Lumo for both ways. The onboard service and quality of carriages are very good on Lumo. Seats are comfy and staff are really friendly.
The main downside to Lumo is they are really exposed if they cancel services. You are then at the mercy of using LNER in unreserved section. Also, when busy or full on Lumo, there is limited luggage storage. They had to use on.ofntbe toilets for luggage just to fit it all onboard.
We just got the lumo from London Kingscross to Edinburgh. We got a good price for the return journey for a family of 4. . LNER way more expensive. Train dirty on the outside . Inside ok. Train busy lots of luggage with people bringing cases that are to big. Toilet needed a clean . Train was on time. Total journey 4 hours 26 minutes. Was expecting the LNER to have four chairs facing a table . Clearly no option. The lumo very much like a plane layout. Bit of a cattle truck. Your journey depends on the people around you . We had pleasant and considerate people . A pleasant trip so far . The return Journey in a few days time. . I think it’s a case of we tried it once , probably not again . Quicker than a car but the train is restrictive on what you can bring. The car has more space… May try the aeroplane next. Have to see .
Travelled with LNER to Scotland and was reasonably happy there was good WiFi on board plus they have also have two trains an hour to Edinburgh, one ‘stopper’ as shown in the vlog and a faster train with less stops - about 3 I think also LNER run north of Edinburgh to Aberdeen in Diesel mode so I was able to return to London from Dundee direct without changing
Nice video! In regards to your charger cutting out, I know that the plugs on some trains briefly lose power when going through a neutral section on the overhead lines, so it could be caused by that (although I would have expected this to happen on Lumo as well).
Sockets, not plugs.
Plug socket? @@justinhamilton497
great vid rebecca
The bumpy ride is probably due to the age of the trains. LNER and Lumo both operate the same type of train (the IET), but LNER’s are a few years older, and the IETs have a habit of roughening up after a bit of time in service. Sadly, I reckon the Lumo trains will go the same way in some time.
Great video, thanks!
Omw to vacation to Edinburgh from central EU and was thinking to visit London as well. One thing struck me tho - the price? Airplane ticket is 30% of the price from Edinburgh to London. That is absolutely insane (and that is when Im counting the cheapest lumo ticket for around £50. I did hear it's bad, but this is something I did not expect.
I think most people will figure it out, but you can get fast trains with LNER between the two, with much fewer stops for a quicker journey. They usually mean the trolley can get around more (they can't have that in the aisle while people are trying to get on or off).
I live in London but family is in north Scotland so usually get LNER the whole way to Inverness as Lumo doesn't go that far sadly, and swopping at Edinburgh is no fun (its an extremely draughty and chilly station at any time of year). Though these days I tend to get the Sleeper up there, because I take my dog and she'd never relax for nine hours, and it means I don't waste most of a day on each leg.
LNER have been going for some time so when new everything was nice and pristine. Standards have slipped quite a lot, including the amenities. It's functional for what it needs to do and that's about it.
Lumo whilst relatively new, I feel will suffer the same fate and standards will gradually erode away.
2 sockets for the aisle seat under the one in front and then 2 sockets below the window nearer floor level much better as a design layout but everything is about cost so take a trusted adapter for the extra socket.
It was very good of you to do the comparisons so very much appreciated. Perhaps a west coast journey next, to Glasgow so we can see how that side of the country compares with its counterpart on the East.
This was lovely Rebecca! 😊
Not a fan of the luggage store at the end of the carriage having had a case disappear on a trip into London, I now carry a bike lock should I have to use them.
Ooooh that's a great idea. Thanks for the heads up. Sorry to hear you lost your case though.
Got the LNER down today and will get the Lumo back up next Saturday (at 5:48!). I have used both before and tbh I like them equally, not that much difference in quality.
I use LNER and use 1st class, the other aspect is to choose services with fewer stops when booking tickets.
Great video Rebecca. Lumo definitely seemed the better value for money journey, a good comparison :)
Just got Trian Sim 4 and it has made me strangely more invested in this vid than a regular Whitewick vid... which is usually already heavily invested ♥🚄
Nice video. Just asking does anyone know if Lumo accept the Britrail pass that we buy over in Oz for unlimited travel without any other costs? Thanks.
I thoroughly enjoyed watching this, keep it up.
Great review, simple, entertaining and honest!
btw, LNER use the class 801, LumO use 803. They're completely different but the same family.
The main difference is Lumo is ano frills train service with no first class, trolley service rather than the modern version of a buffet car, and can charge less as its trains are more basic and run less frequently than LNER. I wish we could have an alternative to Avanti on the WCML as they've been a poor replacement for Virgin and are too expensive.
Great video! Love your no-nonsense style!
Would be interested to see what you think of Avanti West Coast if you ever do a trip up to Glasgow 😅
I’ve only ever traveled by LNER. But, I tend to spend a bit extra to travel 1st Class. If you can get a decent price, it’s well worth it.
I prefer Avanti because they lean into the corners....and because I live near Manchester so don't have the same choice ☺️ I did have an Ooh & Aah at an LNER Class 803 at Edinburgh and was wondering about going via Leeds on my next trip though just to try them (or Lumo) out. Nice video!
You could try out 3 flavors of IET in one trip haha. TPE runs the class 802s on the Manchester to Leeds line, and of course you have Lumo and LNER on the ECML.
I travel this route regularly and am a total Lumo convert. I won't travel LNER now if there is a Lumo ticket available. The main reason is comfort. I don't know what body shape the LNER seats were designed for but it's not mine! The seats are more like park benches and I find them cripplingly uncomfortable. Also the fully electric version of the Azuma rolling stock which Lumo uses (as opposed to the diesel-electric 'hybrid' Azumas used by LNER) just seem smoother and quieter. Fun fact, LNER needs to use the hybrid trains because its route extends north to Aberdeen. The line between Edinburgh and Aberdeen is not electrified.
Really good review. Concise and to the point. Very useful.
Lots of LNER trains do journey in 4 hrs, 20 mins or so, stopping less.
Tried Lumo for first time myself recently. Also pleasantly surprised 🙂.
Well done and toot toot Rebecca!! ⭐️🌹👋👏
Another good one. Thankyou
The only downside to Lumo as far as I can see is the relatively infrequent services. My last trip on LNER was very bumpy, the train suspension getting worn out, maybe. I'll certainly be trying LUMO for my next trip. Thank you for the review, Rebecca!
Great comparison, Rebecca! Lumo's on my to-try list. Do they still avoid York completely northward...?
Traveled lumo from Newcastle to London today
Have to say it was rather nice
Seat got a little firm and a lack of legroom was a pain as there was a stranger next to me (I’m 6’5 so need to stretch out a bit) but overall a solid journey