Is Kingdom Hearts 1 Overshadowed by Kingdom Hearts 2?
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- Опубліковано 17 лип 2024
- In a world where a man has all 3 main KH games in his top ten games of all time, he boils the first two down to their core elements and nitpicks them in order to impress nobody and annoy everybody.
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0:00 - Intro
2:32 - Story & Pacing
10:29 - World Design & Exploration
20:08 - Atmosphere & Contextualization
26:14 - Combat
28:52 - Lightning Round
30:59 - Outro - Ігри
KH1 is my favorite of the series, it just feels so weird and abstract. I especially love Traverse Town it really feels like the end of the line and there's nowhere to go after it.
it's just ~mysterious~
Exactly I feel like the abstract stuff adds to the atmosphere so much
Really great video. I have no idea how this only has 25k views
Okay I'm glad someone else said it so I didn't have to.
Never thought I would see Drew Gooden in such a niche video
@@TyeTaylor considering his kingdom hearts-centric video it's not shocking in theory, but it is a very pleasant surprise
wow
42k when I'm watching it!
I never really stopped and realised just how much more KH1 makes an effort to actually make you feel like there's a lot riding on your journey. Thanks again for the excellent video!
Ya gotta love those apocalypse vibes. Thank you for the support!
Well in all honesty, whatever was there in kh1 that was just it! From kh2 onwards all the worlds are restored, even the ones from birth by sleep. You just don’t go to them. DDD is a completely different story.
I’ve always felt a little lonely in the “KH1 is my favorite game of the series” camp, so it’s refreshing to see someone defending its merits.
Same here.
Aye fam!
Not alone
I'm much the same, there where things I felt was missing from KH2 even though I enjoyed the world selection.
It always seems like I'm alone in that, so glad to find others who see it the same
5:04 Actually, it’s confirmed in the Manga that Xigbar writes Demyx’s cue cards.
Amazing. Not who I would've expected, but I'm glad everyone has enough down time to do that lmao
That explains
Oh
Wait really?
I prefer 1 over 2 also. 1 just has a charm to it that seems to be missing compared to 2. Maybe it's the mystery that 1 did so well. That feeling of never knowing who you'll run into next or what world would show up next.
I really feel like 2 dropped the ball when it came integrating the Kingdom Hearts overarching story within the Disney worlds, the Experiment in KH2 Halloween Town could have done more to highlight how a creature who doesn't have a heart is desperate to obtain one (just like the Organization) or how Barbosa and his crew are similar to the Nobodies because they too are cursed to feel nothing. I feel KH2 could have done more to highlight those comparisons instead of only vaguely alluding to it.
Am I also the only one who misses how Sora used to interact with the environment? By KH3 Sora can't even just chat with random people, he can't pick up and push boxes, he can't even climb up ladders (I know he can run up walls now) but I miss the world interaction and that's something that only the first game has.
So true! You saying this reminds me that I meant to bring up how KH1 presents new worlds as literal balls of mystery, whereas KH2 just shows them on the map screen unobscured. I guess KH1's tagline was "You never know who you'll run into next" for a reason!
@@RegularPat Yeah. I remember first playing KH1 and in Mickey's letter to Donald and Goofy he tells them to look for a man named Leon. How many people expected Squall Leonhart the protagonist of Final Fantasy 8 to show up being that Leon? Or your opponent in the ??? Platinum match being Sephiroth? I wish Kingdom Hearts still did surprises like that. The first one was full of surprise moments.
@@meteornome2556 at least they’re still doing foreshadowing lore bosses (and he’s NOT cheesable for once)
The magical Charm definitely is missing. But only because KH2 made its own vibe & it felt much more was at stake. Also idk, KH2 came out when I was in 6th grade...since Kh2 was more serious & the main cast in the game was growing up & maturing, it was synonymous with my life while growing up. KH2 was like a comfort blanket for me, it showed me growing up is okay & seeing how serious the game was at the time.. it definitely helped me mature.
& KH1 was honestly a comfort blanket to everyone. A 1of1 coming of age story, that lets us bask in the glory of our youth & gave that sense of adventure every kid searches for.
In short both games have amazing vibes 🤣
KH1 being a lot simpler and self contained I feel helps. Aside from one extra boss fight in Final Mix and the secret ending cutscene there wasn't some big confusing story about Xehanorts, Nobodies, Organization 13, previous Keyblade weilders etc. It was just Heartless and one guy who tried to control them for his own gain. Trying to follow KH lore even as a dedicated fan now with the story jumping so much between main games, prequels, simulations and side stories on multiple consoles/mobile is a headache.
How the hell are you such a small channel, that was a very very good video, even with jokes from time to time. Keep it up, I'll be waiting for another video.
Thank you, I really appreciate that! I probably need to say "like comment subscribe" more, maybe that's the trick lmao
@@RegularPat you content is easily worth multiple 100k subs right now, your channel will probably explode soon
@@silverhetch3383 That's flattering lol. I went from 900 to 9,000 in about a month so I already considered that as exploding
@@RegularPat believe me, the big bang will still come
@@RegularPat Damn that is wild
I feel like the villains Pete joins up with in KH2 are weird. Him giving Heartless to Shan Yu would fit given his lust for power, but Shan Yu just develops Heartless powers on his own... somehow. If anything, that would've fit better with Scar, who has everything he wants and wouldn't need Heartless to do his bidding, but his lingering feelings of hatred towards Mufasa could've summoned the Heartless to ruin the Pride Lands, much like how it's overhunted in the film.
And Barbossa using the Heartless is weird because his whole deal is wanting to go back to being a normal pirate rather than some demonic monstrosity. In KH3, he's even disgusted at the idea of using the Heartless!
I think they wanted to have a clayton-moment with shan yu, but it feels more like an excuse to replace the huns from the movie with heartless to have less violence for the agerating because they just kinda halfbaked the execution.
One of the biggest missed opportunities in KH2 is to draw parallels between Barbossa and Organization XIII all of whom just wishes to be normal humans again.
@@JTD95 I didnt think about that but that would have been an amazing parallel!
His lingering hatred for mufasa DID become a heartless. Did you not play the second visit?
@@insertnamehere2746 Yeah, but he's suggesting that this would have made more sense as a reason for the Heartless to show up to begin with rather than have Pete be involved at all, and vice versa with Pete making the devil's deal with Shan Yu on Maleficent's behalf rather than him just getting Heartless control on his own, making Scar the Clayton parallel rather than Shan Yu.
Never have I watched a Kingdom Hearts channel where the analysis and what is liked/could be improved are so akin to my own. That's not hubris, but enjoyment of the content and having a "you too?" moment. I hope your channel continues to grow
As someone who prefers KH1 over KH2 myself, this was so cathartic to watch. You really hit it on the head, especially with the world design. Another thing that I personally don't like is the grinding of Drive forms for platforming abilities instead of getting them through the story. (And also the fact that there's specific ways of leveling them, so it's harder to do casually.) But I never put as much time into Drive forms as everyone else seems to do, so that might just be me.
Anyways, love this, as well as your KH1 Facts videos. Looking forward to whatever you end up doing next! :)
Thanks so much! Honestly, it was cathartic to make lol. That's a great point on the Drive Forms and how they're leveled. With requirements like Drive Orbs leveling up Master Form, I'd think it would be difficult to organically level it up while progressing through the story.
Even when I used a drive form whenever it was available, I still had to grind them near the end of the game because of the level ceiling they have until you get final form. Even though I feel drive forms are a lot more fun to use than summons, it still is kind of ridiculous that you can’t max out high jump until the story’s almost done.
ok i have to still play KH2 through. but as far as i understand it shouldn't be that much of a problem? because there isn't that much platforming and such, the only thing i can see is in battles, but there i don't see most of the uses, except dodge roll.
@@jeffboy4231 it's for optional content
>But I never put as much time into Drive forms as everyone else seems to do, so that might just be me.
We can see that since it's very easy... In fact if you just USE the drive forms you will level up them up eventually.... Exceptions are: Wisdom which only evolves from killing Heartless and Final form that evolves by killing Nobodies. Valor and Master level up by just killing/hitting enemies. It's very, very easy.
I think kh1s focus on exploration is more fun for a first playthrough, but for any subsequent playthroughs, kh2s combat is more appealing
Sums my thoughts up perfectly
KH2 falters because it went full Nomura. Nobody can save the plot after that.
Wow I think you nailed exactly how I feel. This video is really great and made me appreciate 1 a lot more, but I don't see myself enjoying the exploration past my 3rd playthrough at this point. 2's combat alone brings me back to it 2 to 3 times a year.
I disagree, it's just what you prefer most in a game, in KH1 each experience can be different because there are so many details that you discover in different times that you play
Unh....... reverse what you said and it's correct.
I agree with you when you say kh1 has more immersive worlds than Kh2, and I'd even say better than kh3. I say that because the details in the worlds kh1 are generally very specific. They're the types of worlds where you can play for hours until you're physically tired of staring at your screen but still continue playing because of the enjoyment. I especially liked wonderland in that respect. I realized it's world is built very much like something out of a theater, which fits wonderland very well
That's a great point on Wonderland! I wish I had considered that for my world rankings. But yeah, the boxy approach to some of the rooms really lends to a sort of theatric appearance.
KH1 definitely has more charm than 2 imo, it feels like the worlds were more planned out. It also has my favorite box art on PS2, I remember being mesmerized by it as a kid
100%
KH1 feels like a Disney movie to me, just made for kids and made into a video game. I have so many good memories playing this at my Grandma's!
That box art is iconic!
I'm so glad I finally found someone who cares about level exploration and platforming in KH
It's funny. As a kid, I vastly preferred KH2 to 1, and retroactively looking back on it, it's because I was just glad to not get lost lol. But in recent years after playing these games numerous times, 1 just feels like a far fuller game than what 2 offers. You pretty much go into all of my reasons as to why, but when it comes down to it, I just find playing KH2 to be a bit of a chore. The combat is fun, but that's all replays have going for it. The worlds feel inorganic and lifeless as harsh as that sounds. I have been somewhat ridiculed for thinking that way by some hardcore KH2 fans, but I just don't find good combat to be enough when there's all these other elements that feel drastically underutilized. It just feels like almost every other part of the game was sacrificed or neutered for overcorrections.
I do prefer playing KH2 over BBS and DDD, but honestly speaking, even those games have more going for them with their worlds and exploration. It might not seem like much to people, and as you said, it comes down to what people prioritize, but KH2's worlds are the only ones where it felt like I was on a rollercoaster with no side turns. None of the other games are as non hand-holdy as KH1, but there's always brief slices of creativity the game rewards you for exploring.
Also, while I do prefer 2's combat, I do prefer 1's magic and how it's utilized. The spells in 1 have their own specific utilities in combat of course, but beyond that, most of them interact with the environment in their own ways, and that just does so much more for me. Anyway, really great video, there's been a resurgence of KH1 recently, but nice to see this was happening even back in 2019.
The words "inorganic" and "lifeless" are the sort of words I wanted to use but was too cowardly to do in this video lmao. They really are though. Absolutely charmless when held up against KH1. In terms of world design, for me, it's 1>3>>BBS>>>DDD>KH2
hey a random kh fan. I got a question. Is it worth it playing kh if i dont like disney stuff ? ;v; Its a little cringey to me and OH GOD I DONT WANT ANYONE TO SEE ME PLAY IT. But i adore that combat! Because after i finish yakuza series, i want yo try kh :v
@@paweave9562 It's hard to say. Disney is an integral part of the franchise so if you find it to be a significant turn off, it might not be for you. There are several other elements that are great like combat, music, etc, but Disney has always been a mainstay
@@seemangalbj i mean , a little ducky fucky and goofy wont hurt right? I just hope there is not disney worlds with princesses and stuff ;-;
@@paweave9562 ...I hate to break it to you, man...
The atmosphere is what wins me over in KH1. It really feels like having an adventure with clear objectives: find your friends and the keyholes. The ladder, together with the lore which is inserted in them (even though sometimes there is no explanation in how some Disney characters know about it, like Triton), actually helps in giving Disney worlds a much less filler connotation.
I really liked how you talked about how we should develop a more friendly atmosphere in the fandom and how debates on matter of tastes should be respectful. Toxicity is the main reason I stay an arm's length away from most of the fans, so that the series won't lose its charm for me. So I was very happy to find this channel that has a more positive outlook and discusses different opinions without insulting anyone or disparaging the series. Thanks for making this video!
I really admired KH1's pacing, KH1 felt like a children's Disney movie in video game format.
Replaying KH1 for the first time since I was a kid really put it into perspective. It has some highly underrated strengths that I just never thought about when I was young.
I’ve never seen that item in Hundred Acre Wood by breaking the log. I feel like I learn something new about KH1 all the time and that’s why I love it so much.
The big differences between 1 and 2 weren't something I noticed until I was getting my partner into the series. They immediately loved Kingdom Hearts 1, with its quiet puzzles, having to figure out how something worked with not much more than environmental storytelling (see: "Use thunder on the wires in District 3 to unlock a puzzle in Gizmo shop to get postcards to turn in for prizes"), and platforming elements - they literally found new ways to access things that I typically reserved for a return visit after getting high jump or glide, after playing this series for 15+ years. To see them jump into KH2 and try to use those same skills, searching out puzzles and pushing at the confines of worlds made me realize that, while many consider KH2 to be the holy grail of the series, it is dishearteningly limiting, especially when compared to later games which, while remaining Action RPG combat focused, still managed to bring back in some of the KH1 charm, especially starting in Birth By Sleep where you had things like the Rec Room Pinball puzzle, and figuring out platforming challenges to get to stickers - where AGAIN they've managed to "break sequence" for stickers and chests that I always took for granted necessitated a return trip.
By the time they finished KH2 I'd come to a startling realization that it might be my least favorite game in the series, in terms of gameplay? And that the first one is literally just, such a Safe and familiar game to me it's perfect in my eyes, so It's really interesting to see someone else who prefers 1 over 2.
Regarding combat, I think KH2 has better and more exciting combat, but there's one thing I miss from KH1: Tech Points. Being able to hit someone's attack back at them, stun them, and get EXP for it was exciting. Or getting tech points for using someone's elemental weakness. Or some other similar thing. It's like the game was rewarding you for experimenting.
In KH2, that would just be a Reaction Command you hit five times in a battle that would look cool but ultimately require little thought or engagement on your part. The game just figures out how to do the cool thing for you and takes away the sense of achievement in the process.
F for techpoints. I can remember when it was in a KH3 betabuild but then they thought:"nah, let's do the KH2"
So, I just dropped by to say: I absolutely agree with everything. I still prefer 2 over 1, but your toughts on exploration and pacing are definitely things that I never got the chance to properly organize in my head and you summed up perfectly. I recall doing many more post-game content of 1 over 2 back in the days.
I would add that the combat in KH1 is much more focused on parrying enemy' attacks. I think this kind of gameplay is far more interesting than KH2's reaction system, as it's not inherently obvious what you can and can't parry. I guess that also goes along with the whole "exploration" thing in KH1.
I will say I'm glad to see someone else shares my opinion of KH1 v KH2. I recently played through both games back-to-back, and KH1 holds up much better. At one point, completing KH2 felt like a chore. That never happened in the original game.
One of my favorite moments of kh1 was the sealing of Olympus collusium’s keyhole, which requires the last trinity to use. It’s a neat bookend to have sdg all work together to move the stone to reveal the keyhole where sora alone couldn’t budge it when you first arrive there. Really fits the whole my friends are my power theme.
7:10 I will defend Maleficent here. If you take time to think about it her plan to turn “Sandy Claws” into a heartless is one of the most twitsted and brilliant schemes in existence.
It’s established Santa can travel to other worlds he’s not restricted to his own. And we know from basic folklore he does it all in one night and has entry to any person’s home. If Malificent had succeeded in turned Santa into a heartless that would basically be an automatic victory.
Though admittedly her giving up because Oogie annoyed her too much is bad form. I feel instead of making that joke just have Sora and Co save Santa in time
Pretty much. If oogie would not have bumped into her at the right correct time, she would have won. And that is not an engaging way for the good guys to win.
just an all around good video. I credit you partially for making me realize I enjoy going back to kh1 more than the rest of the games in the series to play through casually.
and i credit you for knowing how to beat Unknown so now we're even
I've always been of the same mind. For me, the word best used to summarize the first game is "dread". There is always something darker and scarier around the next corner. I still remember reading the Ansem reports and coming to understand that this arrogant man tapped into something he could never have hoped to understand or control and was corrupted entirely. The Heartless are portrayed as a relentless teeming eldritch force which can't be stopped. The best you can hope to do is lock them on the other side of a big door and undo the damage they've caused. You always get the sense that no matter how strong Sora gets, he is out of his depth. And if he ever approached the point where he wasn't, he'd end up like Ansem. No other game has made me feel the way KH1 does and that's why it's my favorite.
There was kind of a foil aspect to Ansem, Riku and Sora. All three of them wanted to see what was outside their tiny worlds, but Riku and Ansem lost themselves to blind ambition and gave into their darkness.
Kh1 will always be a standalone masterpiece to me. Everything makes more sense in the context of the story compared to 2.
Nobodies have always confused me because I was always under the impression (through in-game lore and that friging cutscene of the guy straight up dying in front of you) that you become a heartless when your heart is forcibly removed. But 2 threw that out the window, and now I don't know what believe.
Kh1 is a better story, but Kh2 (late game) has better gameplay.
Yeah? You become a heartless when your heart is removed, then the body transforms in a nobody
Your heart becomes lost in darkness and becomes a heartless. Your body becomes a nobody, a being with no identity
I see heartless as the empty space where a person used to be.
I believe he is "confused" by the KH1 transformation where Sora's body becomes a heartless and returns to normal when his heart is returned. When and where did Roxas form then? From what husk?
@@Mqstodon According to the Secret Ansem Report, when your body gets disintegrated into sparkling bits of light, they teleport into a completely different and unrelated world where they reintegrate into a Nobody, a thing that doesn't exist despite existing. How can you say "Yeah?" as if it makes complete and obvious sense. Just no.
I prefer KH1's Atlantica over KH2's Atlantica.
Same
I at least have fun with Atlantica when I finally learned how to properly use magic.
100%
To be honest, even though I think the gameplay peaked in KH2. I don't think anyone will ever try to argue KH2 Atlantica is better than the KH1 version (or even good for that matter)
Not to kink shame, but...
Discovered you a few days ago and I gotta say you've been a blast to listen too! Keep it up!
Great video. I really like the ‘non-linear’ aspect of kh1. More reminiscent of how Jrpg used to be and it felt so rewarding to progress through the game. Not much was given to us for free. Even the oblivion keyblade is easy to miss first play through
I still prefer 2, but I agree with just about everything you said (except for the it about opening chests; not being able to open chests doesn't make the game more intimidating, just irritating).
You've highlighted a lot of things about 2 (my personal favourite) that I never really thought about but realise now did effect how good it could've been.
I get what you mean about the world building (as in the literal construction and world design) being much better in 1. In fact that along with the message and theming of 1's story are the things I prefer the most about 1. (I differentiate overall story and message/themes here, as I personally prefer the story in 2 but 1 had what I felt were more predominant themes of friendship and as corny as "My friends are my power" is that shit makes me tear up every time, alongside Sora wordlessly with a smile on his face giving up his heart to save Kairi).
I think a good example of what could've been is the cavern of remembrance in 2. I'm surprised you didn't bring it up, I don't know maybe you disagree but the cavern of remembrance in 2 is like if instead of ditching the world design/exploration and platforming of 1 they continued on it and expanded it like they did the combat. That area is awesome, and my favourite area out of 1 and 2. It's a shame like you said the rest of the worlds in 2 are less fun to explore and pretty much vessels for different combat arenas.
I liked that eventually you could bypass old areas with the growth abilities, you mentioned you preferred in one that going from a to b is an adventure, and I agree but I don't think it's the growth abilities fault, it's the world's fault for not adjusting for the abilities. The feeling of mastery the growth abilities provide to me is awesome, breezing through areas that were once long and arduous with ease feels like a step up, but the problem is with your new found mastery the levels don't have anything to challenge/interest you, getting from a to b could easily still be an adventure with growth abilities if they made you have to take different paths to advance as you revisited worlds, how cool would it be if there was a place high up and far away in twilight town that you needed to go to for the story (or even just to explore) that once you got growth abilities was made possible, stuff like that can only be done with the growth abilities (and there are a few situations in 1 where you can come back and use glide, which is like a smaller scale version of what I'm describing).
Kind of a pointless point to make lol but the movement in 2 is amazing, it's just never capitalized on it (outside of the cavern of remembrance, which is awesome and exactly what I'm describing.)
The disney worlds in 1 are far better, and although I don't really find the parts after the middle point to be filler, everything after Hollow Bastion 1 and before Hollow Bastion 2 isn't so much boring as it is quite reminiscent of Clank sections in Ratchet and Clank. They don't suck, and it's not like you aren't having fun you just can't help but think about how much more fun you could be having as Ratchet, or in KH's case when what you're doing is relevant to the game's plot.
Combat in 2, loses points because imo it's not really amazing unless you take the bachelor's in how to maximize fun in KH2, but once you do, KH2 combat is amazing. I've 100% 1 and 2, and I've beaten 2 on level 1 and if you understand summons, limits, etc the tools available to you and what revenge value is + play on Critical mode as it's the only difficulty that challenges you (except for certain fights that are pretty hard in general) then it is so satisfying and fun and although it's not the only thing I like about 2 it is one of the best parts about it.
Overall even though I prefer two and let's be honest despite facts and preferences it probably just comes down to us preferring the "feel" of each game. I was a little bit older when I played 2, and briefly lost access to KH1 but still had two and despite what I can say about my preferences about each game it honestly probably comes down to me just having more nostalgia for 2 than 1, although I have a lot for both.
As a final note, I think other games do most elements of 1 and 2 just as good, even if I still prefer 1 and 2, but 2's combat is better than dark souls and most any other popular example for the pinnacle of action combat game play in my opinion. And I say that without nostalgia goggles because my understanding of the combat was never good enough as a child for me have nostalgia for summons/limits/etc, which I just never used. Playing on level 1, it's like Dark Souls but better for me, with the added addition of everything else that makes it such a great game. And while I don't think I particularly prioritize game play or anything for that matter, 2's outstanding combat alongside my slightly more nostalgia for it make it better than 1 for me, even though honestly as a full package I think 1 is probably the better experience.
I have no idea what the point of this comment overall is, but that's my take lol, I haven't played KH3 yet (lack of funds and I want to wait for it to reach it's final state before I play it) but you putting it above 2 interests me since I don't necessarily disagree with any of your takes in this video. Sorry for the wall of text haha, I just lack any friends who are even remotely interested in Kingdom Hearts and it's like my favourite gaming series of all time and 1 and 2 especially are like perfect games in my heart, and I don't talk about it much. Could you imagine how hype I felt when I beat KH2 on level 1 (no items too btw, humble brag) and had nobody to tell?
No apology necessary! I love talkin about this stuff. You're totally right on the Cavern, I honestly realized after recording my script that I probably should've talked about it at some point; it's definitely way more in line with what I like in KH worlds. I think it slipped my mind because I really only went through it two or three times since I had never been able to experience it until the PS3 Remix. As for the growth abilities, you're right, I think it's not solely the fault of the growth abilities, but also the world designs. Your Twilight Town example is exactly the kind of stuff I would've loved to see the growth abilities be used for.
Your point on the combat is something I wish I could've articulated better. I feel like to the layman, aka a person who's just playing through on Standard and maybe never plays it again, KH2's combat isn't all that amazing in my eyes (I never thought it was the crown jewel that everyone talks about it as until recently) but yeah, once you impose more challenges on yourself and take a bit of a deep dive (!) into the minutiae of the mechanics, it becomes more apparent how well put together it is.
The "feel" is massively important and also the most difficult to put into words; there's all sorts of factors that go into that, and you and I and I'm sure everyone else has their own personal reason as to why 1 or 2 is their preferred experience. Thanks for your thoughts, I appreciate the dialogue!
I actually think you make some really good points.
I disagree but that's likely because (as you said at the beginning) we all have our own subjective preferences and things we're looking for in a game. For me I don't see the Disney worlds as filler, I love being in them for the experience of living out movies I've always loved and interacting with those environments. Being able to jump off Pride Rock, travel between Halloween town and Christmas Town and walk around the world of Steamboat Willie etc is magic that (for me) never wears off. I enjoy the Disney worlds as little escapes and self-contained sanctuaries away from the main plot where I can simply go and immerse myself into that world and its characters and not need any references to what's going on beyond. The combat is SO much fun, I love Org 13 and their boss fights (even though they caused me so much rage as a child haha) and the beginning, middle and end of the game are phenomenal, as you said. I especially hold a special place in my heart for the menu screen music (Dearly Beloved), as well as Twilight Town and the extended prologue. As for level design I found KH1 tedious at times as I kept getting lost and had to continuously loop around and backtrack trying to find where I was supposed to go. It took me out of the story. I prefer KH2's streamlined story-driven approach. Ultimately I consider both Kingdom Hearts 1 and 2 to be masterpieces but KH2 will always be my favourite game of all time.
Cringe
Ain’t reading allat
I 100% agree with everything you said re: KH1. I also this from start to finish it has the better atmosphere and a more cohesive story (I do think KHII has a great conclusion and sometimes wish it had just ended there to be honest). That every spell has a field effect makes the magic feel particularly useful. I know in later games besides Cure, I sometimes never use my magic.
One aspect that I think isn't touched on is Hayley Joel Osment was like the biggest star in 2002, all the VOs of the OG characters were peak early 00s fame. Those voices really captures a particular zeitgeist and a mainstream appeal later games just don't capture. Disney wasn't also just a jugganaut as KHIII or in pure dire straits like 2006 but in just the right spot.
I'm glad to find others who agree that while there's no denying KHII is mechanically probably better and more accessible, a lot of the atmosphere, fun exploration and cultural zeitgeist is absent.
Been loving your videos.
The doors. On Big Ben. Open?!
I was all ready to go "the puzzle pieces though!!" as someone who played final mix first and was felt very satisfied when you mentioned it. I did really enjoy leveling up the forms just to try and get the pieces I had seen earlier. I think this is one of your earlier videos but i really enjoyed it!
KH 1 actually does interest me more.
and I think 358/2 days needs more recognition, it feels like the actual middle point between KH1 and KH2 everything wise, unlike Chain of Memories where it goes and just does its own thing
Days and com are two sides of the same coin narrativewise. The thing that actually drags down the com-experience in relation to KH2 is that you can't win. If you don't know com, then you are automatically confused. When you do know com, it becomes obvious how little it actually means to the plot. Orgmembers die and Sora went to sleep. Those are the only two facts that are somewhat relevant about the entire game and that is almost recoded-tier importance. KH3 almost gave com a solid by bringing back a plotpoint into the maingames, but that did not end up mattering at all.
@@lpfan4491 you can ignore COM play days instead and go to 2.
they kinda bring up the castle oblivion plot and sora stuff there.
Always found it funny how KH2 might have the snappiest, and overall best, movement controls I've experienced in any game, yet there's nowhere to utilize it (except for Cavern of Rememberance in 2FM)
KH1 almost feels like it came from an entirely different franchise compared to the rest of the series. It has a darker and more urgent tone, it's more mysterious, the storytelling is straightforward, it combines scrappy and snappy combat with platforming and exploration, and Sora is a humble, relatable, down-to-earth kid instead of Generic Shounen Protagonist #3465.5a. Honestly, I wish the series stayed this way. Then again, it sort of makes sense. KH1 was made by Squaresoft (maker of legendary RPGs) while the rest of the series was made by Square Enix (pretentious hack company).
Oh, man, it absolutely does feel like a different franchise. It almost feels like a different GENRE, really. I loved all the various RPG elements that were in KH1, and the lack of them from then on was always a little depressing.
@@Nyzer_ the reason kh1 is so great is because it has veteran Final fantasy writers and Keiko Nobimoto working on it. After thr first game Nomura took more control and we have the cringe fest that is 2 with all the stupid retcons
@@Schizobateman Even 2 isn't THAT bad. It's very different, to be sure, but I think it's got the most similarities to 1's story structure out of all the other games in the series. (Specifically the structure, not the actual plot points, since the multiple different recap/rehash games are basically cheating there.)
The Disney villains are actually doing things across multiple worlds (not much, mind you, but SOMETHING), we get some Disney worlds that are actually linked to the main plot (not much, mind you, but SOME), Riku and Kairi actually play a part (not a big one, mind you, but SOMETHING - noticing a trend yet?), etc.
Sure, the story was worse. No question. But it's got enough elements of KH1 that it was very possible for it to walk off that stumble, especially since that stumble came with the perfect ten point flip trick that was KH2's incredible combat system. (Difficulty was definitely too low, but that was a number balancing issue, not so much the gameplay's fault.)
But yeah, compared to KH1 and even (especially) CoM, it was clear that a lot of the folks who'd contributed to the great writing of those games weren't around anymore.
Then by the time of DDD, it was clear that even a lot of the folks responsible for the great MOMENTS of KH2 onward were also gone.
@@Nyzer_ In KH1 every Disney world you visited had its own plot that tied into the main plot, and nearly each one ended with a message that added to the themes that Kingdom Hearts was so good at conveying, until it dove into generic shounen JRPG that it has unfortunately become, which frankly started with KH2 and hit its peak with DDD.
Good stories build up and grow with each new chapter as the reader/viewer/player experiences the world. Not every revelation is big, some can be subtle or small, but still very much important to the universe. KH1 did that masterfully. But this isn't a KH1 vs KH2 debate topic, so I'll stop there.
From my experiences people hate KH2 because the plot is exactly as described, heading into more JRPG shounen territory, whereas KH1 felt like a Disney fairy tale. The other thing is that the gameplay is too button mashy, but quite frankly KH1's combat is clunky and not very intuitive or fluid. KH2 failed to balance Sora's ease of use, utility, arsenal of abilities, and fluidity in his movements with the enemies and so the game is very easy. I mean people still think that magic is useless, despite being objectively false. KH2FM manages to balance everything out perfectly.
The biggest thing that KH2FM adds that had no excuse of being omitted in vanilla is the fight with Roxas. It's a no brainer that it should have been a boss fight. At the time I first played 2 I didn't know there was a FM of the game, and I still pondered why there wasn't a fight. However, other than the Roxas fight none of the side content in FM struck me as neccesary to have been in vanilla. The Org13 refights are cool, but not needed really. Lingering Sentiment is definitely not needed. Palette swapped heartless? Yuck. A christmas outfit for the NBC world? A cool novelty, but nothing else. Puzzle pieces? Hooray, more collection quests... Yeah, I don't even think dodge roll was needed, I merely thought quick dash replaced it since mobility is the name of the KH2 Sora game, and never thought of it again.
As much as I like KH2, I do have to admit that combat got absurd compared to the first game. Sora doesn't simply get better at combat compared to the first game, he's turned into some crazy Super Saiyan Time Warping Ninja. There's points where he literally teleports around for attacks.
KH1 was quite grounded by comparison, and the inclusion of Tech Points made less straightforward combat approaches more rewarding as well as highlighting when you exploited weaknesses. The core combat idea has stuck with the series, but the removal of the Tech Point system I imagine leads quite a few players to not realize that certain attacks can be reflected to damage enemies, including various bosses.
@Memes Within Memes Awaits You I don't consider any games after kh1 to be Canon. It's just some poorly told nomura fanfics with his lame anime OCs
KH1's movement vs KH2 is akin to classic Resident Evil to RE6 and above where you can melee zombies to move around.
Restrictive movement isn't always a flaw, but makes each choice and action more decisive if not hold more weight. KH2 take a mid-air combo Sora twirling vs KH1 Sora grounded then keyblade swinging with a flashy sphere. That's oomph I enjoy.
KH1 had a darker more fantasy feel to it. SquareEnix was still Squaresoft when they made KH1 and during that era for Square they were on a roll of consecutive great RPGs especially the Final Fantasy games. KH1 feels more like Final Fantasy. It’s that darker and fantasy feel that I was talking about.
My personal point that KH1 has over KH2 is the combat potential of your allies, most obviously Donald and Goofy.
In 1, you could give them a couple of mid-to-high tier accessories and weapon choices and they'd turn into nigh-unstoppable gods against common fights.
Crank up Goofy's strength, and even without abilities, he'd shred hordes if you put his "Defensive Actions" behavior to max, which would make him prioritize his own version of Captain America's Charging Star move, running into crowds shield up and landing hits at an amazing pace. Then you go and give him combat abilities, and even bosses start sweating once he revs up the Tornado...
Donald meanwhile has the benefit of how magic scales in 1, making him equal to Sora's own spells in almost every way if their MP totals were equal, and if you kit him up to have even higher MP, ohh boi, the Duck goes into warhead territories of screen clearing nukes, courtesy of Thundaga and Blizzaga. Hell, even if you wanted him to be a bit more frugal about his casting habits, the customizations features provide gloriously. Best part of it all is that he has access to ALL of Sora's spell kit as it gets learned and upgraded, with one-world allies getting upgrades for their respective copies, too.
In 2, more often than not, it feels like all the damage comes from Sora, the player, which turns a case of making you feel like a badass in combat, sure, but at a cost. Namely, if you don't instigate your allies to do damage under your control (i.e. Limits) they kind of hit like wet tissue paper when left to their own devices, even if you revisit an area say, 3 worlds back, where you should be breezing through by virtue of your allies getting way more potent at their job, such a thing doesn't happen.
Instead, allies have been tailored to "set up" scenarios for Sora, the player, to hit the enemies with the cool stuff we know Sora can do, but they also end there. Goofy and Beast come to mind where they each have an ability to tear across the battlefield in spectacular fashion, but the actual effect is paltry damage and actively launching the opponent in the air, at Sora's direction, allowing for the one-two. And then Donald or others with a healing ability got really shafted in their feeling of usefulness in the fact that Cure and similar abilities take ALL MP remaining. A balance change I understand from the player's perspective, but of course Donald's not gonna heal ya, he just spent all his MP casting his other stuff for paltry damage and now he has to wait on the recharge because most players are absolute misers when it comes to their Ethers.
And finally, this is all in context of regular encounters, with run-of-the-mill Heartless and Nobodies as the opponents in mind. Against bosses?
KH1 you can choose to take an active part in combat, or, if you're a bit overleveled and geared up your allies nicely, hang out in the backrow and watch Donald and Goofy steamroll their healthbars a substantial chunk before you have to take over.
KH2 makes bosses all about Sora vs the boss, and the allies only really participate if you use the limit. Leave them on their own devices? They get mauled, even with top gear, and the damage doesn't even make a dent in the health bars. And of course, Sora has to be at the forefront of the fight at all times regardless to make use out of any and all Reaction Commands that pop up, to allow for actual damage to happen (not saying I don't like RCs, of course, they're cool as heck). But if the beefy glacier from 1, Goofy, can't even stand in front of Shan Yu's sword swings and slow him down... why is he even there?
This all even comes to a grand design idea in Drive Forms, where, to make Sora that much more powerful, he has to bench Donald, Goofy or both so he can step up and deal the real damage. Summons do this in both games, but there was still risk involved with them because you took away your allies. Genie's not gonna toss a potion in 1 if you're getting slapped, and in 2, the emergency heal that some summons have can be a case of "too little, too late" more often than not, but it's okay, Summons have Limits too in 2, so there's a panic button to compensate.
In summary, KH2's combat is still great, because it makes YOU, the player in control of Sora feel like you're the massive badass that we know he is, ever growing as the game goes on, with more and more abilities. But it comes as a cost of your allies feeling less like allies and more like additional commands for Sora to utilize that just so happen to have a health bar that can deplete.
Whereas in KH1, Donald and Goofy start off woefully underwhelming, but as they level and get geared up, they can clear enemies faster than Sora sometimes, and deal considerable boss damage in the right cases.
Apologies for this paragraph of text, but I had more examples to visualize this point in my mind than I first thought.
Also, fun fact: In KH2, there's I believe 60 AP Ups in the game, assuming you only Synth one. If you were to split this 20/20/20 for Sora, Donald and Goofy, the latter two would have enough natural AP to equip practically all of their abilities without aid from Accessories, allowing for better customization. A nice little thing if you were to have the three split such rewards evenly down the line, made it feel like it was "intended", though one can hardly argue for that. Unfortunatly, I'd wager nobody ever gave any of their allies stat ups in that game due to their performance.
Also, for the record, I can think of plenty more examples of this with other party members, but I will not do so unless somebody asks me to. I typed this out a bit too late in the night, but it is not something I'll just drop and walk away from.
i grew up with kingdom hearts 2, and i adore it as a game and it will always be special to me
that being said
one thing i appreciate about kh1 wayy more than kh2, is the way the worlds adapt and change to fit how you play them; it’s a lot more conscious of how you play it and adds or removes little details when needed, even if it would be super unconventional for players to do so
three big examples i can think of is
-completing deep jungle before wonderland
-doing olympus coleseum after 1st hollow bastion visit
-doing monstro after 1st hollow bastion visit
the first thing is kinda simple but i like it, instead of alice getting kidnapped it’s snow white!
in the second case, hades would usually go on an angry rant about Hercules before maleficent interrupts him: if you wait til you kill her though, she of course doesn’t show up.
the third situation i find the coolest, since it changes not just one scene, but pretty much the entire narrative of the world: riku being possessed by ansem and sora chasing him not because riku is teasing him, but because riku SHOULD NOT be there and sora is a lot more hostile to him, ‘riku’ spares few words through the entire world.
these aren’t like, INSANE things, but there’s nothing like it in KH2 or.. any of the other kingdom hearts games, i’m pretty sure! there’s no moment where you can skip over olympus to kill demyx in hollow bastion only to have the story change in olympus on who stole the stone or anything even vaguely like it!
it seems to me in general KH1 had a lot of thought out into it, i like kh2 and kh3 and all the other games, but it feels more like they were putting as much into it as they could; the worlds aren’t huge like kh3, but tiny little details like that make it feel a lot less linear and samey, you know?
The thing that always gets me about everyone saying the plot is convoluted and nonsensical is:
Yeah. Hearing it summarized or recapped in one sitting, it *is* a kind of a lot. But if you consume it the way it was meant to be consumed- by actually playing the games with minimal spoilers, and taking your time to play unrelated games between them, then a ot of the weirdness you kind of just.. absorb by osmosis.
You aren't wrong... I actually played all the games and understand the story perfectly...its explaining it with all the terminologies like heartless and nobodies that make it hard.
Yeah, I've played Kingdom Hearts since the first game when I originally played at it's release when I was 8. Played it for the following 17 years and fully enjoyed the roller coaster story ^^
Even though Nomura makes me want to rip my hair by making a mobile game and rythm game canon XD
@@cameronfield7313 ok i knew the mobile game is canon BUT THE RYTHM GaME?
@@jeffboy4231 Yeh. If you're ok with Spoilers, I'll tell ya.
@@cameronfield7313 lay it on me
KHIII is my favorite game of all time, so, Unpopular Opinion Team, unite!
ah, a powerful ally
@@RegularPat Muhahaha.
"Piece of bread that's in the middle for some reason"
*Shows video of Xemnas grinning*
I see what you did there.
Damn dude, you pretty much summarized my feelings about KH1 and KH2. Nice video!
overall I think KH2 is the better game but I love KH1 I go back and forth which one is my fav
Great video! Keep doing some KH videos
The pacing in kh3 would have felt a lot better if there were at least SOME org fights sprinkled in throughout the Disney worlds. They're already causing trouble in the worlds but actually fighting them would feel much more exciting than just another heartless fight.
Xaldin didn't do much for the story in kh2, but fighting him at the end of Beast's Castle was super exciting.
I've been watching your backlog of KH videos, almost feeling as if I'd seen them before. I was shocked when I realized your channel is younger than KHIII. It has such an OG feel. That first game was legit.
I agree with all points! Kh1 is absolutely my favorite one.... I sort of think of 1, COM, and 2 as the “first arc” of the series: I enjoy the later games a lot! But nothing compares to that first arc ☺️
Fantasic video, I watched a lot of your vids on KH and when you mentioned this one I had to watch it, I'm currently playing KH2 again and after 1 I do see it in somewhat of a different light, it doesn't have that end of world feel and I agree with you on the Disney villains not feeling as important but with Maleficent essentially not as important I don't know how they would have fixed it, I do really love that you re visit every world for new story content.
Oh and I also disliked the keyhole system in 2, I know we don't have to lock keyholes for the world's but they always felt very personalised for the world's where as in 2 sure an item sets it off but it's the same repeat screen to open a new gateway
Watching your videos has made me realize that I like the original Kingdom Hearts as well more than 2. I think for a while the overwhelming love for the second game always made me assume it was better, but yet whenever I boot up the collection I'm always gravitated back to the first game.
Keep up the good work and I wish you nothing but success on your UA-cam channel and Twitch streams. I try to catch them whenever I can! ♥️
I love both for very big reasons :D Childhood into my teen years and very great memories. I grew up with not that many games so what i had was what i got and limited game time too :)
Love your content btw Pat!!
Watching this is interesting coming back from a hiatus of KH3 and recently playing through KH2 because... damn, this all pretty on point. Granted, I've always held a special place in my heart, no pun intended, for KH1. I could talk a lot about everything gone into here but, to bring up combat, I feel like KH2 legitimately made me appreciate KH1's a lot more. KH1 Sora has to self-teach at a really fast pace and that reflects in his slower, clunkier hits and lingering finishers, and KH2 Sora felt like a natural evolution of that, so I find it fun to go back to KH1 and really work with the limitations of him just getting the hang of his weapon.
I also agree that KH3 has the best pacing. There's a good amount of build-up, the Disney worlds don't overstay their welcome, we get good snippets of an overarching plot in each Disney world to keep you going (which isn't really as consistent in the other games), and the climax is... appropriately like 3 or 4 climaxes that do a great job of building into each other. I dunno, I just really like the way the game is paced. It's not without its issues, ofc, but it feels pretty smooth.
I actually watched KH 2 in its entirety before even realizing there was a game before it. And I still think KH2 is in the top three for the storyline
Yes, yes it is. I felt like the stakes in KH1 were higher and more thrilling. First video game to make me cry, the ending just touched me that much and for that reason and many others, the very first game in the series will always be my favorite one in the franchise :)
The beginning of Regular Pat’s crusade against KH2
The simplest way to put my feelings on the games are that KH1 has an absolute ton of charm, but KH2 is more fun to actually play. KH1 imo is just too stiff and despite having better exploration by a mile, that stiffness kind of hampers some of that enjoyment. The combat is also simple and a bit stiff. KH2 though is just fun to run around and fight in. Its an absolute joy to just move and its really a damn shame that the world wasn't designed to take advantage of that. The Cavern of Rememberance shows how well exploration could have worked if the entire game was designed with even just a little verticality and didn't want to hold your hand so much.
The stiff combat makes me not like KH1 that much. Admitted, i grew up with KH2 vanilla and just last year I got my hands on the "Story so far" Collection. It was a hard journey.
Played KH2 first, then KH3 after 12 years of wait. I wasn't able to get the other games, but looked them up on YT.
After KH3 Re:Mind I got my hands on the collection and started on Proud. At first it was a mistake, cuz I had to look up way to beat the bosses (not all of them). But I chose proud mode to make the game longer for myself.
Once I finish DDD, 0.2 and watch the movie, I can replay for the full experience and not just the "finish the story" experience.
I'd generally have to agree there, even though there are many aspects of KH1's gameplay and design that I prefer. KH2's core gameplay is just inherently more fun on its own - the only reason I prefer KH1's overall gameplay is because of how well it does a bit of everything, whereas KH2 is very, very clearly carried by the sheer fucking polish of its core gameplay, which is a godsend for it because all of the supporting elements are... underwhelming.
My issue with kh1 these days is that so much of that games plot and esssence is no more. Games that came after just keep retconning it.
Became a fan of the Channel a couple weeks ago, and I gotta say, I'm a big fan.
As someone who also has KH1 as his favorite game of all time (along with personal disparagement woth the more action heavy direction of 2), i found this video to be cathartic, KH1 is brilliant in many ways.
I don't hate the later games, but there's nothing else that quite scratches the itch like KH1.
I think KH1 is subtly the best game from the series. In the context of what was possible for them to do they accomplished everything you could hope for with KH1. KH1 really nailed power progression down for Sora and you never feel like you're plowing through the levels, maybe if you're overleveled. Whereas with KH2 you do kinda plow through the levels because of their layout and limited enemy encounters. KH3 gives you just lots of big battles but enemy numbers are moot because you're so strong at every point in the game. Movement of KH1 is antiquated, obviously, but it doesn't limit you from exploring worlds and keeps you in the fight. Whereas in KH2 and KH3, you could easily avoid battles entirely without Glide and often not enjoy the aesthetics of a world because of how fast even your run speed is.
Also think it's important to include the Final Mix versions of the game now that they're readily available and maybe 1000 people in the world are playing KH1+2 on a PS2. As the Final Mix of KH1 did improve the combat a lot, even if it made it easier.
I also don't think it's debatable that KH1 is the best game in the series. History matters and KH1 is one the best games of it's generation because of the precedents it set and it being the foundation of entire series. The worlds in KH3 look great but that's nothing special in modern video games, and the combat isn't that interesting. Give me the button smashing, zoomed in, bad camera angles of KH1 to replay over both of them any day. How I'd rank the games is: KH1 > KH2 > BBS > KH3.
What lets KH1 down for me is that guard just randomly didn't work when I played it and enemies feel too OP compared to sora in a way that wasn't very fun to play. Otherwise, I very much agree with the sentiment. I rather have an engagingly designed game than a sterile one.
I'm currently playing through all the kh games with my boyfriend who has never played them. I was always in the KH2 camp, crazy action and power with a more complex less disney story. I liked that the disney worlds were more worlds that sora just had to help, he picks up where he left off even after a battle with a guy whos every joke punchline is "darkness."
I was a boy then and after a year of supplimental hormones I'm a grown woman. The first kh definitely feels different now and I've come to appreciate just how many secrets there are mostly. We'll go to re:com next then 2 which I'm sure will still be my favorite. But it feels nice to love the game it started with more.
Thank you I feel vindicated! My favorite parts of KH games are the Disney worlds, which feel really woven into the story in KH1, but can feel really awkward in KH2's first world visits when Disney characters keep falling in and out of performances of the original movie, when you'd think dark monsters and anime guys and talking ducks and dogs would throw the movie to the wind. I will say KH2 has this cool feeling often where Sora visits all his old Disney friends and they ask him how he's been. Very wholesome, and it only happens a couple times in KH3, and sadly can't exist in KH1.
One thing I also want to add comparing KH1 and KH2 is Donald and Goofy . In KH1, they feel like their own characters with their own motives. In KH2, they really just want what Sora wants, only adding sassy and cautionary comments as they follow Sora around, and they never really create any ripples in the franchise after. Imagine any other RPG series starring a trio where two of them barely factor into the story. Nobody likes when Donald and Goofy abandon Sora in Hollow Bastion, but it gave them an opportunity to show their agency as parts of the story. The closest KH2 comes to that is when Goofy "dies" and Donald runs off on his own for a few minutes. Giving them their own goals and aspirations could have been a fun addition.
I feel like the KH fandom now is less unhealthy than it was when KH2 came out. No shortage of people in 2007 calling Kairi a slut for the wacky tube dress she wears in KH2 hahaha.
Finally somebody who agrees with me. Literally everyone I've talked to looks at me like i'm crazy whenever I say I prefer KH1 > KH2. I never played these games as a kid either so I had no nostalgia blinding me. KH1's world exploration and pacing was just much better to me. Nothing will ever top KH1 Hollow Bastion. KH2's Disney worlds were not all that fun to play through. The heartless in KH1 look way cooler too haha, I love the Invisibles.
I 100% agree with you pat! Well done
I've generally been a KH2 truther, but 1 & 2 are just so close. Whenever I go back and play them, I never play one without the other. I think the points you've made about 1 are pretty valid. Specifically the exploration and olympus tournaments are so much better in 1. 2 just feels better in a few others ways that are more relavent to me. Drive forms were the coolest things to me as a kid and I think a pretty interesting resource management (before I learned how to abuse it). Sora also just handles better in 2. Like, Deep Jungle was super frustrating for me as a kid because trying to hop across those dang Hippos was a pain and a half. Also, not having the ablitiy to skip cutscenes was a big deal for me. I got really stuck on the second Riku fight my first time (at like 14-ish years old, I didn't know what guard, summon, magic, or anything besides the X button did) and I can't tell you how many times over like a month I had to watch Riku bitchslap Donald out of the room. I know they fixed this in the Final Mix, but I didn't get that luxury until a few years ago.
Generally agree about the Disney villians not really being threatening/relavent in 2, but I do feel somewhat of a threat from Malificent up until Timeless River. After that, yeah, she feels like a non-threat. I don't think we'll ever get the "villians team-up" like we did in the first game, which sucks.
3 felt like a pretty big step back honestly. It's not bad, but it doesn't have the same place in my heart as the first two numbered games. It feels like the plot barely moves between Olympus and rescuing Aqua. That really makes the last couple disney worlds drag on a lot for me. I really think they could have moved the Aqua rescue up a couple of worlds, have her like pass out and be like "oh she needs to rest. Go knock out the last two worlds and when you're done, she'll wake up and we'll go resuce Ventus." And I know KH2 isn't great in this regard, but at least the mid-game stuff moves the plot along pretty well.
And maybe this is because I'm an adult now and I was a dumb kid back then, but I never really felt threatened by any of the "common" enemies. Like, the "end of the world" heartless and "world that never was" nobodies could kill me from time to time. I never felt threatened in KH3 except by the final boss rush. I'm not a hardcore player (Always have played at proud difficulty), but I didn't feel much of a challenge in this one. Maybe I should try Critical if I ever play KH3 again.
Who makes this posts and thinks “yeah people are going to read this”
Hey Pat, I rambled a bunch in that other comment, but I'm wondering what your take is on the new magic system in KH2 vs the one in KH1.
Hey sorry I missed that earlier! Honestly, I have no true preference, and maybe my indifference there is a hot take itself. I think the "brokenness" of Cure in KH1 is a bit overblown, but I also don't think KH2 is all that much of a harder game than 1 even with it's "Cure=All MP" system, so, I dunno! I will say I tend to use magic a lot more in KH1, I always felt like there more uses for it, and maybe that's blasphemous. But I never found myself using Magnet or Reflect too often in my plain ol' KH2 playthroughs, whereas all of the spells in 1 usually see a fair amount of use from me.
“The series is Floundering” And now I’m subscribing.
This was honestly a really good take than when i read the title and clicked on the video. Ive played way more kh2 than kh1 but all of the point you made were great.
KH1 is my overall favorite too.
The one defence I give the the first act filler in kh2 is that the visits are almost meant to be self contained as it's been a year since Sora saw any of the characters in those worlds. They felt more like reunions followed by a local matter to deal with, even though the gang is there to search for Riku and Mickey. As a kid, I really appreciated the fanfare of seeing Aladdin, Beast and Mushu again. I think everything else hits the mark, though. The second visits were a missed opportunity to really connect the worlds to the broader narrative, and the results were very unsatisfying in hindsight.
The plot and pacing is also why I like KH1 the most on later playthroughs, even though I ADORED KH2 as a kid.
Completely agree with you when defend KH3 pacing. I thought it was one of the better paced games honestly. After each world there was some exposition. The whole game is really about uniting the seven lights and the thirteen darknesses and their final battle, and that’s exactly the story that was told.
During each world you’re introduced to one of the thirteen darknesses, and they all kind of play with the theme of the world.
Ansem and Xemnas at Twilight Town, the two former baddies of KH1 and KH2
Young Xehanort at Toy Box, the most youthful Darkness appearing in a world themed about toys and kids. He tests the group with themes of isolation and separateness (feelings YX likely felt on Destiny Islands)
Marluxia appears in Kingdom of Corona. He allies himself with Mother Gothel and tries to keep Rapunzel locked away for safekeeping on the top floor of a tower, similarly with how he kept Namine hostage on the top floor of castle oblivion so he could manipulate her powers.
Vanitas, a being born of negative emotions, sets his unversed to collect the screams of children in Monstropolis.
Even if they don’t directly relate to the world they still provide some sort of exposition through the context of that world, like when Dark Riku was explaining hearts and vessels and using Baymax as an example. He created a data chip born of conflict and violence and used that to represent a heart overcome with darkness, and placed it inside baymax.
Either way. Sorry for the rambling comment. I just truly believe KH3 to be one of the most well paced games from a story perspective. I agree it’s missing it’s gameplay middle point, but it’s such a non issue when compared to how great the other parts are.
Larxene was Mary’s secret booty call and she shows up in Tangled’s spin-off
I just felt that kh3 had way too many cutscenes THATS sometimes ruined the pace of the game it felt like every 10 steps a cutscene would end up playing
It's just exposition too late I think maybe all this evil stuff the organization is doing could've and probably should've been done in days where the focus was on them
I think I can justify that bit on Dark Riku - he's an artificial lifeform (a replica) just like Baymax. Also like Baymax, he's had his heart rewired at some point.
KH3 also lacked a beginning game and Twilight Town was cheeks
Valid
tis the reason i'm only showing KH1 to my (hopefully never) kids, a simple and clean beginning, middle and end
has a few similarities to Bloodborne even, it's not as perfect, but for a kids game, this might be the best and the one that has the most "sauce" out of all in the franchise and that for me is enough. Both games end on a bitter sweet way even, except you don't become an eldtrich god in KH1 but i like to think the story ended there anyway. Sora and Kairi are forever separated, Riku is lost, the worlds are restored, the princesses are saved, the apocalypse now ended, but these 3 friends, will never see each other again
Kingdom Hearts II and Kingdom Hearts III do the same thing with progression; here's some story, and now play a bunch of Disney Worlds where SOME of the main antagonists MIGHT show up. But I think II is vastly superior simply because I didn't care for III worlds. I is in the opposite boat, as I liked I's worlds, (except Neverland) but what makes I so "bad" to most people I've met is the gameplay.
Cringe
It is 2021 and I just found out you can freeze those bubbles... I tried to get that chest for weeks and weeks. And every playthrough it would just be staring at me. Damn.
I have to say, watching your content has made me like kingdom hearts 1 alot more. this has led to kingdom hearts 1 and 2 becoming a joint favourite video game for me.
I watched every second of this video, and you know what. I don't regret it
a bit late but I'm so glad to have found a KH youtuber who has my same view on the exploration side of KH being discarded after KH1
KH2 has been my favorite in the series since it’s release. And while it still is, your video definitely put a lot in perspective for me. They were definitely things that factored into why I fell in love with the series in the first place, but it’s easy to forget about all that 20 years later. Thanks for the vid!
I don’t think there’s been a game since ‘02 that’s totally mesmerized me the way Kingdom Hearts did. It was an insane creative concept that worked out in the most amazing way possible.
I hate how the original gets overshadowed. It’s my favorite in the series and the story and world design is so much better than KH2. And it has Billy Zane Ansem!
Yes. Yes it is. The combat and drive forms are just that fun. I much prefer the KH1 world building with plot relevant stuff happening often and in each of the worlds. I prefer the KH2 map layouts but would even more prefer a compromise between the two. I really like Twilight Town because of how simple but big and open it is. I would (and still do really) get lost in Monstro, or in Neverland, and my sister's boyfriend dropped it entirely after getting lost in Wonderland. KH1 consistently has more engaging moments in the plot for me, but it never reaches the peaks of excitement 2 does. I cant think of a part in KH1 that made me smile as wide as scenes where Michael Mouse throws off the cloak and tries to be badass, or when soon after you fight 1,000 heartless. Those moments of cool are far more scattered, but the snappy controls and drive forms keep me engaged anyway. I love the attention put into limit form too. He even blocks in a similar (but more experienced) way. In KH1 the clunkier movement led me to die a lot (especially in more infamous fights like dark Riku.) A skip cutscene button would have made that more bearable. Luckily 1.5 came through for me there. I preferred the KH relevant plot in 2. I just really like Roxas' story and the shenanigans with the Organization. That's all just me though. KH1 is really underrated though. I really do like it. (Except when I get lost, but my sense of direction is abysmal anyway. That's more just me than the game)
Damn man, you're the first person online I've seen that feels the same about KH1 vs KH2 for me. I also like KH3 more than 2 as well, lol. I agree with all of your points and have felt all of them before too, and felt crazy that no one else did too. *ESPECIALLY* the room transitions!! I thought I was the only one!!
I like the convoluted CoM -and-beyond story too but I do personally prefer the more self-contained story and lore of KH1 and the integration of its Disney worlds. I also liked Sora as a fresh newbie, exploring worlds like he always wanted, absolutely fuggn slinging that Keyblade around with reckless abandon like he did his wooden sword before he becomes an action hero in 2 (though the signs of that show toward the end of 1 as well).
2 is great, but I much prefer 1.
Great video. You’ve been able to articulate a lot of my opinions as to why I prefer 1 over 2. Tbh, 2 shows a major shift with how Square approaches games and it lines up with when the merger between Enix and Soft happened. To me, Square is no longer the rpg powerhouse they used to be and all they do is make money off of nostalgia or mid tier games. Then again, a lot of companies from the past have fallen from grace and it’s only us old ass veteran gamers who have lived to see the major decline in gaming quality.
I dont actually know what you gonna talk once i didnt saw the video yet ( just the first 1 minute and 30) but i always feel sad that kingdom hearts 2 remove a lot of details like "use blizzard to extinguish the fire" "you can climb stairs!" and .. a lot of little interesting puzzles, which the game not necessarily make it obviously
Edt: Okay, after watch , i think maybe nomura should listen to this video. To be fair, maleficent looks like a real threat in UX, since she even won against Lauriam. (or maybe not.. hard to tell).
Edit2: even if KH3 have a "better pacing" than 2... its yet more pointless where Sora is clearly the strongest character at same time being prevented from going straight to the plot for reasons that later prove to be even more imbecile than you would think. While in KH2 you dont care so much to be delayed cause you dont even have a clear objective until later, different from 3, where you know things like "i must save Aqua, Terra and Ventus and Fight Xehanorts"
*sees the pupper follow Sora* wholesome
I find it interesting that the first heartless designs thought of in 2 are all from timeless river, probably because the designs there are the most unique.
I couldn’t ever find the right words to describe why I like KH1 so much more than the other installments but one of your last points was exactly it: The stakes feel higher. KH1 always had this weird, suspenseful, almost dark kind of atmosphere to it that none of the other games have matched. Your world is literally vanished at the very start of the game. There’s so much mystery. Riku working with Maleficent feels devastating and scary. It feels so pressing to get through the worlds to find him. The fights are a lot more ominous too because you’re right - you’re the underdog and the game doesn’t let you forget that all the way through. I feel like Sora (despite being the youngest he ever is in 1) feels older somehow - especially compared to him in 3. The characters were so much more fleshed out than in 2 or 3 and the pacing was definitely better. I felt 0 urgency in 3 and I also felt like the worlds didn’t really foreshadow like they should’ve. 1 will always be the standard for me no matter how much time passes. I really loved this video for highlighting how great of a game it truly is.
Oogies manor was so dope and atmospheric yo
I’ve always preferred KH1 over all the others and is my personal favorite game of all time, but I don’t think I fully understood why. I always just said the nostalgia factor overrides everything else, but the defense you give for it in this video further cemented why I love it so much.
I will say it really took until my second KH2 playthrough a few years after it came out for me to really enjoy the game. I just got through the story as I had to. KHI though, my first playthrough on Expert I clocked the in-game clock and got it to start from 0.
You really nailed it with this vid. I had similar feelings of
disappointment during my first playthrough of KH2. It just couldn't manage to meet the astronomically high expectations that I had after
KH1 and even CoM.
My main gripe with KH2 has always been how poorly integrated the
overarching story was with the disney worlds. The way you called it a 'chore' is very accurate. I missed seeing all the thoughtfully placed plot cutscenes like Maleficent conversing with Jafar in the streets of Aggrabah when you first enter that world - Or even the scene towards the end of that world where Sora finally encounters Maleficent for a brief moment. The game was so good at teasing/hyping the player up with little moments like that.
And yeah, KH2 definitely didn't have the feeling of urgency that KH1 had.
The 'threat' of the nobodies achieving their goal didn't really feel like it was of any consequence to the universe. The only reason Sora even went to their stronghold in the first place was to save Kairi (who was apparently kidnapped from Axel off screen??)
The worlds in KH2 were also a huge letdown. They were barren and
charmless compared to the worlds in KH1. I remember having a blast as a kid exploring wonderland for the first time and finding all its hidden secrets, out of reach treasures, obscure puzzles, and branching doorways/rooms. You don't get ANY of that in KH2. I know people hate on KH1s platforming, but I always thought it added a lot to the charm and exploration.
I agree on the combat too. I guess I found KH2's combat to be a
bit...obnoxious? I definitely prefer the more simpler combat that KH1 offers. I had more fun trying to take down ice titan and Sephiroth than I had against ANY boss in KH2 (With the exception of maybe Twilight Thorn and Axel)
Teenage sora was also a bit jarring to me since I had gotten so used to kid Sora. KH2 Sora just generally felt off to me. He didn't really develop much as a character, which really felt like a major missed opportunity (especially within the Disney worlds).
Also, I think Roxas should have remained the playable character throughout KH2. He had more incentive to take out all the org members as he traveled though the various disney worlds for the first time. We could have had flashbacks of his time in the organization throughout his journey along with visions of Sora (Similar to how Sora had visions of Kairi in KH1). Riku could have acted as a mysterious guide/adversary up until the final battle with Xemnas. Then at the end of the game, Roxas' inevitable return to sora would have been 100x more heart breaking since we've spent the whole game growing to love him. This would also be a perfect set up for future games like KH3 where we finally save Roxas from Sora's heart prison.
Also, Donald and Goofy could have totally been Roxas' companions like they'd been with Sora in KH1. Had namine had only put Sora to sleep at the end of CoM (which honestly would have made more sense), Donald and Goofy could have met up with Roxas in the first Disney world after he escaped from the Data world. They would have joined up with him in the moment they saw he had a keyblade (Or through the King/Riku's machinations) . Neither of them would realize that they were leading him up to his inevitable fusion back into Sora, which would have been a great heartbreaking twist at the end.
That sounds like a cool plotline... maybe there should have been a game like this?
I can't really compare them. KH1 felt classic and nostalgic even when it was a brand new game, I can't think of anything else like it. It's a very relaxing game to replay. KH2 just took a step further, making the story and gameplay more intricate as Sora ages.
It must be really challenging for the game developers to try to appeal to both older fans and newcomers to the series.
I think also, having actual conversations with characters in KH2 is a huge plus. And they brought in almost all the original Disney voice actors (it was the last role for Pat Morita and the actor who played Piglet before they passed away too).
And personally, I really prefer the colors and lighting in KH2, but that's a minor thing.
On the rewarding feeling of the dalmation collectibles: I kinda got that from the grubs in Hollow Knight too, since you were saying you were struggling to come up with any other game that has collectibles that feel as rewarding.