Debunking TWO claimed 'accurate' Flat Earth models
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- Опубліковано 14 жов 2024
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PATREON: / davemckeegan
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#globe #science #flatearth #flatearthmodel #4D #4thdimension
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"I'm not sure what a political party from 90 years ago has to do with the sun..."
Nothing. The swastika is a sun symbol. You know, meaning changes depending on context. Like if I said right now that you're a smart, well read person, you'd obviously (and rightfully) detect the sarcasm. But if I just said that without the preceding sentences, or this latter sentence explaining something quite obvious, thus further insulting your intelligence, you'd think I praised you.
I mean, you don't have to be a genius to refute flattards, but come on...
If we consider the Earth as a FLAT plane and want to create a deceptive map that represents a globe, a commonly used technique is the azimuthal equidistant projection. This projection preserves accurate distances from a central point and projects the Earth's surface onto a flat plane. And it is100% possible.
-- To create a deceptive globe map using the azimuthal equidistant projection, follow these steps:
1. Select a central point: Determine the point on the Earth's surface that will be the center of your map. This could be a specific location or a point of interest.
2. Place the globe on the flat plane: Position the globe on the flat plane with the chosen central point aligned with the center of the flat map.
3. Draw concentric circles: Draw concentric circles around the central point on the flat plane. Each circle represents a specific distance from the center and can be used to represent latitude lines.
4. Divide the circles into sections: Divide the circles into equal sections to represent longitude lines. The number of sections will depend on the level of detail you want to include.
5. Project the points: Take points on the globe's surface and project them onto the corresponding positions on the flat map. This projection should maintain the correct distances and directions from the central point.
6. Connect the projected points: Connect the projected points with lines to represent coastlines, borders, or any other features you want to include.
So which version to believe now.. Flat or Globe? Or both are deceptive models! Hmmm!
@@vz7042it's a globe
@@vz7042Flat Earth maps *do not* preserve distances. Only globe does.
@@infernogaming4671 Never be so confident. Confidence is like believe or disbelieve without knowledge, not good.
I can provide you with an example that maintains accurate distances while still being visually deceptive. 😉
Here's an approach you can try:
1. Select a specific area: Choose a small region on the map that you want to represent deceptively.
2. Use an equal-area projection: Select an equal-area projection such as the Lambert Azimuthal Equal-Area Projection or the Eckert IV Projection. These projections preserve the relative sizes of areas accurately, minimizing size distortions.
3. Adjust the shapes: Manipulate the shapes of land masses within the chosen region to create a visually deceptive effect. For example, you can stretch or compress certain areas to create the desired visual impact.
4. Preserve distances: While adjusting the shapes, ensure that the distances within the chosen region remain accurate. This can be achieved by maintaining consistent distances between key landmarks or reference points.
Only flatearthers are able to present a "working" model that works even less than any non-woking models.
But the second one was relatively good. You just need to pinch it at the top and bottom... oh.
That's embarrassing 😂
@@SingularBingulareh, what? I seriously can't comprehend what are you trying to point?
@@SingularBingular??? Did you take your pills sir? You seem a bit agitated
@@SingularBingular I would, but I'm actually on the underside of the disc, our currency can't convert over parallel universes :/ apologies
That was my first reaction!
TEN Rules of flerfing :
1) Strawman the globe model in a desperate bid to manufacture a "gotcha".
2) NEVER, under any circumstances, talk about your positive claim that the earth is FLAT.
3) If pushed to do the above, pretend that you "claim nothing".
4) Learn to articulate the sounds “nu” and “huh” together in quick succession and use it whenever you need to deny reality (i.e, often).
5) Pre-emptively reject the answers to every question you ask.
6) Cherry pick parts of quotes that you think might help you, whilst pretending the rest never happened.
7) Perform a ‘flerf reset’ every morning, conveniently forgetting everything that was said to you the previous day.
8) Ignore the fact that, despite more than 10 years of social media flerfing, flat earth has advanced about as far as an asthmatic Ant with particularly heavy shopping.
9) Lie.
10) Lie more.
#GottaLieToFlerf
9) Say the earth is chasing the sun and the earth is spinning so fast at 1,000 mph chasing the sun at 66,666 mph rocketing through the galaxy at 500,000 mph while forgetting earth spins 15 degrees per hour and the earth orbits the sun less than 1 degree per day and the solar system takes 230 million+ years to orbit the milky way galaxy ONCE
Edit: yes i took the assuming part out cuz i felt it wasnt needed.
Edit 2:
There was this flerfer i debated on my channel(deleted comments now due to circular reasoning and getting nowhere) T B. When i said that stars rotate counterclockwise in the northern hemisphere and rotate clockwise in the Southern Hemisphere, he said i was begging the question by saying hemisphere. And he thinks i think stars rotate west to east in the southern hemisphere. That guy is so lost…
11) Garnish with copyright free music
12) Change the topic when disproven
@@dreamybullx1
12) Change the topic when disproven, while never acknoleding that the topic has been disproven. And when confronted with previous claim: see 3
Flerfs: "the ball model is impossible to explain!"
Flerfs: Shows us a videogame-like infinite scrolling square map that warps when you reach the edges
My immediate thought was that Daz Nez was playing Tales of Symphonia and had a false Eureka! moment during the rheard-flying segments.
@@NeutralDrowi didn't expect to see a ToS comment here❤
@@NeutralDrow So many games use the concept. I'm pretty sure Final Fantasy (the original) did it almost 20 years earlier than ToS. Or Tales of Phantasia even.
But I applaud your choice. ToS is a great game.
The world works like Minecraft, that's why world governments keep people from the edge so that they don't make the map bigger and lag the server.
It's always hilarious when flerfs accuse us of "strawmaning" their 'model'. You cannot strawman fiction. Fiction is whatever the individual wants it to be.
@@vz7042 The flat map doesn't preserve distances. Look up flight times(and distances) between australia and south africa, or between south america and south africa. They are much smaller on a globe than in your wrong flat plane. This is assuming the central point is the North Pole, but it is true for any considered point.
The earth is round...A lot easier to describe than the waffle you have just wrote down.
@@vz7042 "5. Project the points: Take points on the globe's surface and project them onto the corresponding positions on the flat map. This projection should maintain the correct distances and directions from the central point"
This is where the AE map fails, and globe continues to flawlessly work.
"Flat or Globe? Or both are deceptive models!"
Globe: It. Just. Works!
Guys, it’s clearly a ovaloid (3d oval)
This is a joke
@@carldawes4156 AE projection preserves azimuth and distance _from the centre._
If you choose the right spot in Spain as the centre, you can get North Island, New Zealand, wrapped all the way around the outside. I have that map, with a caption that "New Zealand is an energy field, created by all living things. It surroudns us, it penetrates us and it binds the galaxy together."
I also have a zipped folder of AE maps with 333 km radii covering most of the land on Earth, linked in a video description.
Video is called "Build your own flat Earth map," or something like that.
The small areas shown on each map are pretty good matches for reality, as long as you don't mind dot cities and the simplified polygonal coastlines.
I've been able to stick a whole line of them together into a pretty good map of the Greenwich Meridian from north of Scotland to south of Benin.
Mapping the Pacific coast of the USA or the Tropic of Cancer would work alright, too, but any attempt to combine all the maps for Europe or Africa or Brazil or the contiguous 48 States or Alaska or China or Australia or India, let alone the whole Earth, requires a curved surface to line features up.
I met my first flat earther 2 days ago in the gym, and after I asked him why can't you see North Star from southern hemisphere, he just walked away and i burst into laughter, he doesn't come to the gym anymore.
ua-cam.com/video/V_RceH0-hSk/v-deo.html
Was this Gym in southern England by any chance….
@@newforestpixie5297 I have no idea but I guarantee it wasn't in the southern hemisphere
Well done, they should be called out and mocked at every opportunity. These morons are homeschooling children with flat earth videos.
Gloves off
I like to throw a curve ball at them. Instead of the popular map of the Flat Earth with the north pole in the center, tell them Antarctica is in the center. They hate this because it kills their model while being every bit as plausible as the one they prefer.
If they argue, demand that they prove you wrong. They don't have any arguments aimed at disproving an alternate version of the Flat Earth.
This model puts North America and Russia on the outer rim. Just as they're waffling trying to shut you up, explain that's why the USA and Russia have such large navies. To keep people away from the edge of the world. And they have plenty of nukes to stop anyone who tries. This is why the arms race. It was always a scam to keep people ignorant.
I saw that cylinder and was like, "you are so close to understanding the earth is a globe. Think about it a bit more and you will get it"
It's actually a brilliant thought that after over a hundred years of flat earth research, they're now finally ready to admit that the world curves. But only in one direction. Maybe a hundred years from now they'll take the next step, and evolve their theory to the point where the flat earth model is just a sphere. I bet they'll still be insisting that gravity isn't real.
Well, that's the whole point! In the flat earth world, there is no gravity. The whole world just sucks! That's what keeps everything firmly planted on the ground! 🤣😂
"This cylinder model is obviously wrong. Instead, I propose the obvious solution that anyone who does their own research would agree with. It's like a cylinder, except that the top and bottom are sorta pinched together to a point...and the equator sorta bulges out from the cylinder. This model explains all observations and is really just a flat plane that is sorta shaped similarly to an oblate spheroid in 4 dimensions!"
That's bullshit, an spheroid?? It's clearly a perfect sphere, designed by aliens from the 9th dimension!!!
@@Jimschrbr Oh, _that's_ why Dan Olson called them Gnostic. Because they think the world sucks
@@Ezekiel_Allium The world DOES suck, just not in the way that the Flerfs think.
As always, the flat-earth argument boils down to "I don't understand physics, so it must be false".
Don't you try to confuse them with maths!
It's not only physics they don't understand, they already fail at totally basic geometry. As the point about the visibilitiy of Polaris and Sigma Octantis shows. That point alone essentially kills _every_ flat earth model.
Why not? Every religion boils down to "I don't understand this phenomena, therefore God."
I see no difference for Flat Earthers.
@@johncochran8497t’s less “I don’t understand” and more “I have faith you’ll forgive us and allow us a chance at eternal happiness” according to the ones I know are grounded in reality. The only ones I’ve ever seen chalk everything up to God are the crazy ones.
I still find it hopelessly naïve to believe either, but to each their own.
Flerfs can't even convert metric units, such as km to m. And they will ARGUE about how they are correct when they are obviously wrong.
Flerfs accept every stupid non working earth model except a globe.
Dave: "Flatearthers cant agree on a flatearth model."
2 Flatearthers: "We do! Here's the model!"
Also 2 Flatearthers: *provide two compleatly different models*
Dave: "Case and point."
(Btw, it's "case in point", not "case and point")
Put 6 flurfs in an room and you will get 12 different contradictory models.
@@dogwalker666 And none of those 12 models actually works to explain even half the stuff you an easily observe.
@@bertholdb9037 indeed, yet every thing works perfectly with a globe.
Yes and its atlas always stretches out the continent of ANTARTICA!! When are they going to make a map featuring the south pole !! Wy dont ferfs take a trip by boat to see if there is a worlds edge?? Its the only way to prove it!!
It's absolutely stunning how flerfs can more easily believe an infinite flat endless loop fOuRtH diMeNsiOnAL scroll Earth than the (almost) spherical model that works in every way explaining every observable celestial phenomenon.
And they have a problem with things being on the "side" and "underside" of a globe, but no problems with being on the sides of a cylinder?
This is what being a denialist is all about. Finding truth isnt part of their game
It's a mental illness.
They know inside the earth is round.
They feel special in their group when their IDEA is respected by others with the same illness.
It's basically a place where life's losers can come tother and prop each other up against the people who fit in and are successful
Yeah, and going over the poles isn't quite there...
Isn't it true that most of their models accept that celestial bodies as spheres but for some reason the Earth is the only one that's flat?!? Also, isn't the intersection of two cylinders just a sphere?
The second model is hilarious to me, since it is like they are almost there. Now they just need to figure out the north to south problem and come full circle to realize it was a globe the whole time
If I'm a pre-school teacher, I'll give this guy 8/10 for being "almost there"😂
Think the diagram guy was sniffing that marker ALOT before he started drawing
"full circle" heh
Okay, Dave, *here's* a working flat earth model!
You just take that cylinder and close it off at the top and bottom - shrinking the distances more and more towards each end (pole) to correct for the Mercator projection.
It's important that the scrunching together of the top & bottom (North & South Poles) be done so that the sides meet at those two points smoothly, sp it's flat where they meet.
As a rule of thumb, keep the distance to the center of the cylinder (at a point halfway between North and South Poles) equal (±0.001%) at all points on the surface.
And voilà: a working flat earth model!
Of course, it's only flat, roughly, on small scales (distances under a kilometer), but it does explain *all* the phenomena you've described in your videos!
What😂
@@Iserate globe... he described a globe, it's a joke
Dave made the same joke at 13:03
@@Iserate he described the globe he is joking
"What? It does not look like a globe at all! It's, um, an infinitely wrapping flat Earth model, like a combination of two perpendicular cylinders! Yes, there's a slight curve... I mean, not a curve, it's, uh, bending, yes, it's a bend. Not a curve. A bend. Totally different. Definitely not a globe though, nuh-uh!"
Gotta love how his dog keeps pawing Dave the moment he stops petting it. Those fluffly friends never can get enough petting.
Great video!
I gotta give them that, flerfs are a very creative bunch. The first model would be very interesting to explore in a game setting, or perhaps as the base world of a TTRPG campaign. Also, the 4D model was so close to getting the right answer. When you factor in the travel patterns North-South together with the East-West, you get the general topology of something that is uniformly round, also known as a sphere. A globe, if you will
But not a spinning ball, that would be dumb to say, of course 😂
The 4d model is just a Civilization map.
I like how they skipped over the 3rd Dimension straight to the 4th because somehow that is more reasonable.
Bro it’s not even a sphere or globe lmao according to your cult leaders in modern astronomy and nasa ….is a pear or a oblate spheroid
Don’t know how it can be a pear and oblate spheroid …but that what world renowned astronomers Neil said the earth shape is ….all these years down in class rooms with perfectly round sphere globes and I find out in 2018 on ajoe Rogan short that it’s not a sphere or soccer ball shaped it’s tangerine shaped lol….somebody lying …sorry if alotta y’all to gullible and within your ego to see it …think a bit something ain’t true one way or another
Or a torus :)
This is an old model. The new model has us living on an MP3.
Earth is a digital simulation confirmed
I prefer FLAC myself, best quality, and the additional file size is only a problem with smartphones.
As a fun literature exercise, we should all create our own fictional world !
The 4D model works, if you change from a cylinder to a sphere, and then you can drop a dimension, to simplify it. That "flat earth" model works ... oh.
Simple solution for the 4-D cylinder model: Pinch off the ends of the cylinder so that they form smooth arcs. You put Polaris way out in hyperspace and the Southern Cross way out in subspace. Voila. Problem solved. In fact... you don't even need four dimensions. You can safely eliminate one. But what to call this model? I mean, what do you call a 3-D shape that's round in every direction?
Don't tell me, don't tell me, don't tell me...a sphere? 😁
Or even simpler, use what physicist say: a 3-D shape (like a sphere).
But it is big enough that for small objects at the surface (like people), you can use a 2-D shape (like a flat surface) that will be accurate enough for measurements small compared to the radius of curvature.
(When distances get larger, those 2-D predictions will become increasingly inaccurate.)
The FEs love complicated solution for a simple problem... 😅
The shape of the Earth depends on the drug you are high on at any given time. When youre sober its Round though
uhhhh donut
I remember reading about how children, during the first few months of development, are not able to understand that an object can still exist, even when it's out of view. This is why babies often cry when a parent walks out of the room, because in their minds, they think that the parent has stopped existing until they walk back into view. Although the specifics may be different, this same general and basic level of comprehension of the world and universe around us is very much like that of a flat earther.
There is a term for this, it is called object permanence.
Ahhh.... so you're comparing flerfers to barely cognitive infants.... yeah, sounds about right.
@@jamescollins8397I think that's unfair. Infants work very hard to figure out the world around them
@@rulerofworlds43 - Ah, yes, thank you! :)
That's why peekaboo is a thing ^-^
They should rename themselves the flat brain society.
W
Flat Brain Indoctrinators or FIB for short.
The Flat Ulence Society.
That is assuming they behave a brain to speak. Though recent empirical evidence points to this not being possible, as easy math and geometry seems to be a problem even crows can solve
Should name themselves lunatics
I watched videos like this all the time, and argued with a lot of flat earthers around 2017. Eventually I drifted away from the topic and assumed everyone had pulled their heads out and the flat earth was dead. What a shock to find your channel in 2023 and realize that there are still just as many liars/idiots out there.
They don't know how to lie. They are just stupid, and regurgitating information the real liers told them. They literally have no idea what they are saying, it just sounds smart and makes sense to them, even though reality has proven otherwise countless times
Show them a picture of Antarctica from space. Ask them to identify what this land mass is.
Watch them have a conniption as they attempt to explain why Antarctica is a myth.
Bonus points if you tell them, "I was there in 2003 on an expedition to McMurdo Station. What do you mean it doesn't exist?"
@@protorhinocerator142 they'll just say that it was a fake expedition and they just sailed you through sea to a big(BIG) studio filled with Ice. Their first response to anything is to say "fake".
Picture from space😂😂
@@i.p2154 Flat Earther: FAKE!
They have conditioned responses to all the obvious evidence.
Videos like this showcase one of the biggest hurdles with trying to debate a Flat Earther (beyond the fact that their ignorance far exceeds the patience anyone has):
The entire community cannot agree on one model, so before you can even begin talking to someone you have to first establish what "their version" of the model looks and behaves like (lest you be branded intellectually dishonest or accused of strawmanning), which in itself automatically disproves the concept as a whole but obviously they won't listen to that.
Not helped by the way they just spout nonsense that is not even wrong. 2+2= 5, can be shown to be wrong. 2+2= a bag of potatoes is another matter entirely.
It's best not to debate them in the first place . . . just mock and belittle them.
I always get a kick out of flerfs coming up with all sorts of models that don't work when you examine them more closely, and that disagree and contradict each other. Some of them talk about everything being geocentric, but then they want to ignore what one of the biggest advocates of geocentrism, Ptolemy, stated about the earth. Here is a translation of what Ptolemy thousands of years ago stated about the earth (and you'll see why they want to ignore it):
4. That Also the Earth, Taken as A Whole, is Sensibly Spherical
Now, that also the earth taken as a whole is sensibly spherical, we could most likely think out in this way. For again it is possible to see that the sun and moon and the other stars do not rise and set at the same time for every observer on the earth, but always earlier for those living towards the orient and later for those living towards the occident. For we find that the phenomena of eclipses taking place at the same time, especially those of the moon, are not recorded at the same hours for everyone―that is, relatively to equal intervals of time from noon; but we always find later hours recorded for observers towards the orient than for those towards the occident. And since the differences in the hours is found to be proportional to the distances between the places, one would reasonably suppose the surface of the earth spherical, with the result that the general uniformity of curvature would assure every part's covering those following it proportionately. But this would not happen if the figure were any other, as can be seen from the following considerations.
For, if it were concave, the rising stars would appear first to people towards the occident; and if it were flat, the stars would rise and set for all people together and at the same time; and if it were a pyramid, a cube, or any other polygonal figure, they would again appear at the same time for all observers on the same straight line. But none of these things appears to happen. It is further clear that it could not be cylindrical with the curved surface turned to the risings and settings and the plane bases to the poles of the universe, which some think more plausible. For then never would any of the stars be always visible to any of the inhabitants of the curved surface, but either all the stars would both rise and set for observers or the same stars for an equal distance from either of the poles would always be invisible to all observers. Yet the more we advance towards the north pole, the more the southern stars are hidden and the northern stars appear. So it is clear that here the curvature of the earth covering parts uniformly in oblique directions proves its spherical form on every side. Again, whenever we sail towards mountains or any high places from whatever angle and in whatever direction, we see their bulk little by little increasing as if they were arising from the sea, whereas before they seemed submerged because of the curvature of the water's surface.
(Ptolemy, Almagest, Book 1, chapter 4.)
It's because Flat Earthers don't actually care about facts. Facts are subservient to what they see as "Truth" AKA the Bibical creation story. To them, facts and mathematics are simply things that can be manipulated, used, fabricated, and thrown away without a second thought. The end justifies the means. Which is why you never encounter honest Flat Earthers, why they seem so impervious to reason, and why they will happily use syncretic beliefs (ancient aliens, pseudo-ancient religions, etc.) that further their agenda. They're also obsessed with Armageddon. The Flat Earth movement is effectively a Doomsday cult.
If you examine their model at all it fails.
@@Rosivok Like a sad Schrödingers Cat. As long as you don't observe it you can still hope it's alive. But when you do, it's always dead.
Flat earthers: "Im gonna make a perfect flat earth model that proves my point"
(Draws swastika)
"I just dont understand how they dont take us seriously"
Yeah Dave definitely gave that model more respect than it was due. The standard disk model at least attempts to be reasonable but the CD model with the Nazi Sun is something I didn't expect lmao
WASTED, GTA LOVE, BITCHES WASTED
WASTED, I'M ON THESE DRUGS, I FEEL WASTED
WASTED, GET HER OFF MY MIND WHEN I'M WASTED
WASTED, I WASTE ALL MY TIME WHEN I'M WASTED
WASTED, GTA LOVE, BITCHES WASTED
WASTED, I'M ON THESE DRUGS, I FEEL WASTED
WASTED, GET HER OFF MY MIND WHEN I'M WASTED
WASTED, I WASTE ALL MY TIME WHEN I'M WASTED, WASTED
Hyperborean Flat earthers are the best tbh, because they don't try to explain shit with god or convoluted pseudoscience, they just go "yeah, nazi aryan magic bitch"
Its so hilarious how they struggle to find something that fits their insane lunatic toughts.... in stead of just accepting they were wrong and others are not😂😂
I've said this in response to "Why are there no stars in the Apollo Moon pictures", but it applies here too. That is, if you took a camera that had manual settings, and put those settings where they need to be for daytime pictures (like they would have done on the bright surface of the Moon), and then took a picture of the sky on the darkest nights full of stars that you can see with your naked eye, the ppicture you end up with would have no stars in it -- or possibly only a couple of the brightest -- even though the sky was full of stars when you looked with your eyes.
That's what you need to explain to people that think that stars disappear during daytime... Where did they go? Σ(°ロ°)
@@nati0598They go to Summerland, where the black sun is- you silly (winter) goose.
It'd be funny to see Southern-Hemisphere flat-earthers put together a 'flat-earth-model' where the South pole is in the center. It'd make sense, too, just given the circumstances of the situation.
I think that there’s just too much love of the idea that there’s this wall of ice…
@@markiangooley You still have that, it's just in the north. The north pole is the rim and the south pole is the hub.
It would be fascinating if one of you had a cartographer on, explaining maps and all their features why some are designed for navigation and others are merely references for political boundaries. Im sure the information would fall on deaf ears of flerfdom though.
There are only three real points of videos like this one:
1 - diving into some minute detail of science to explain a phenomenon flerthers show a particular lack of understanding about.
2 - money from merch, ad deals, patreon etc.
3 - making fun of flerthers.
I watch them mostly for #1, I don't mind #2 and #3 is just too easy to be fun in the long run.
@@57thornshaving a cartographer on would fulfill #1 in your criteria. So why did you post that?
@@jadedtwin So would Dave explaining maps and cartography, which he frequently does
There are videos like that. There's a Frenchman who explains how time zones are designed to hide the flat earth. He's sailed around the world and set speed records. What you'll find is globe believers are a religion and they use the same circular reasoning, appeal to authority, and ad ignorantiam logical fallacies.
well, obviously the automatic return teleporter at the northern and southern rim are programmed to return you to a different point on the northern and southern rim. and there is a spacewarp system in place that allows planes to fly faster the further north or south they are, so the great circle takes advantage of that. and the star dome to the north and south are rotating in different directions, and have cutoff baffles to prevent them being visible from the other side of the equator. I know it takes a lot of work to make a system like that, but it's important to be able to maintain the fiction the earth is an oblate spheroid rotating with a 15 degree per hour drift (RIP Bob)
It's God picking you up and setting you down somewhere weird to confuse this. This is how Santa claus works btw
This was a good laugh. Especially since we always complain that flerfs can’t think in 3D, then they completely bugger up 4D just for good measure!! Great stuff Dave 😎👍
Your ability to tie in those adverts is second to none Dave! Good job!
Thank you for the vid, always enjoyable
I mean it's obvious we don't live on CD, everyone knows this.
We live on an 8-track.
I only hear the gentle rumblings of the floppy disk
I thought it was vinyl
8 track tapes are an eternal loop with 4 unique musical universes existing simultaneously.
Model?
They don't even have a freaking map of the planet, how are they going to test a "model"?
13:08 Seems like the best flat Earth map is the one that you bend into a sphere.
fr flerfs are like the kinda kids to disagree with everyone to just feel special.
Right away that first one is a monumental fail. Ponders how light shining upwards can create a point light source in the sky that somehow doesn't light up under clouds at all times
Also how does the water not fall through, obsucuring the light in the first place.
@@nickdentoom1173 Oh yes good point
I like how the flat earthers tried to come up with a model for flat earth, but to fix every issue they just ended up creating a flat plan that just magically behaves like a globe instead of an actual globe. W
On the first model, what about there being a HUGE hole rather than greenland and the arctic etc? Seems someone could have easily filmed it if it existed.
On the 2nd model a set of people on a North/South line would all have parallel verticals. Thus they would simultaneously see the Moon with the same bit on top. Instead in reality they see the Moon rotated depending on latitude demonstrating vertical diverges.
They'll probably say there's a huge army stationed around it to keep people from getting close enough to see it.
My favourite model of the Earth is the *Torus* ; there are impassable barriers of storm and ice on the upper and lower "rims". This explains the positive curvature of the "Earth", and why spherical trigonometry works (i.e. all triangles have sum above π radians). We are stuck at the "outer", positive curvature, area. But that's only half the picture. Beyond the barriers lie the *NEGATIVE* curvature areas, where the Geometry becomes Hyperbolic. There, any triangle has angle sum less than π radians and our perception of reality breaks down. It's where our hyperbolic geometry counterparts live...
😂🤣
Mmm. Donut Earth.
Donut Earth Society represent!
Imagine a DONUT with an infinitely small hope, kinda like a perfect Sphere. Then it would work PERFECTLY.
Homer Simpson's favorite. Ummmm.
@@StevenSiew2 That wouldn't be a sphere
Ah, bummer. Turns out even the working FE models don't work at all.
I am shocked. Shocked! 😆
Yeah, I was thinking about the cylindrical model in that video with the guy claiming the Mercator map had accurate distances. Of course, the another issue of the Mercator map is that it doesn't allow for continuous travel. So I figured, to get that, you have to make it cylindrical. At least, E/W. Still doesn't account for N/S. Of course, if you now curve in in the N/S direction to handle that, you'd have a good working model. And a sphere.
Consider how loopy flerfers need to be if you have to propose that the world is 4 dimensional to stick to your flat earth model. Darn, you are almost there! I've always said, the surface of the earth is flat ... in spherical geometry. That's basically the guy is doing with his cylindrical model (sorry, 4D model)
It's hilarious that the guy first claims that there is no measurable curvature and then goes on to invent a model in which the Earth _has_ a curvature - if only in the E/W direction.
@@bjornfeuerbacher5514 He's not claiming that it has curvature, if I'm understanding correctly. He's comparing his explanation to a cylinder because that's how it behaves, but it isn't actually curved. It's still completely flat and when you reach the edge you're teleported to the other side like it's a game of Pac-Man.
@@randomnpc445 He might as well take the extra step and claim it's flat in 3d, but a sphere in 4d.
@@bjornfeuerbacher5514 But...but...but...it's not really curvature because it's four dimensions!!!!
I don't have to add geometry on to the things they don't understand, because I never thought they understood geometry in the first place.
Well, the curve in the spacetime is 4 dimensional. It is the cause of gravity and the shape of the earth.
How do you get through an episode without even a hint of a giggle?
Leave about 3 weeks gap before filming 😂
Hard drugs?
I'm not sure what's more impressive, that Dave understands this tripe enough to debunk it, or that he can keep a straight face the whole time...
is there a blooper reel where he just keeps laughing uncontrollably every time he has to say "the black sun" like it's a real thing?
Hey Dan! Just found you from Scimandan's channel and loved your simplistic and logical explanation of how idiotic LEO's views really are! Got yourself a new sub!
And give Rusty a treat from me!!
On that cylinder model - He's so close to getting "it's a globe" but just can't bring himself to collapse the ends down and smooth it off. Because that would be admitting it's not flat.
I like the part where he uses higher dimensions to say "it looks flat but not really". This is why Occam's Razor is a thing.
@@battlesheep2552 It's a 2D shape with an extra dimension that wraps around on all sides, BUT IT'S NOT A GLOBE! *gasp* *pant* *wheeze*
I'm not sure that he was serious with his 4th dimension model - it all looks and sounds like trolling flerfs (there was another instance with this weirdly shaped earth, where I still think it was just trolling).
This shows why Occam's Razor is a thing. The lengths that people go to in creating a "model" for a flat earth. The simpler explanation - heliocentric model with a round earth and planets - is the correct one for so, so, so many reasons.
Yes, all you need is a model of the Earth that acts as a cylinder East to West, AND North to South, simultaneously. Better throw in NE to SW, and SE to NW as well just to be safe.
Following this example will give you a 100% accurate map that violates NONE of the common problems. The best part is you don't even need 4 dimensions!
Only 3!
3 factorial?!
I have a working flat earth model... it's like the second one only instead of a cylinder it's.., oh.., it's a globe... damn back to the drawing board it is
Fun Fakt about the second model: wenn you travel North to south and cross over the "pole" left and right become inverted.
In college we actually built an actual computer model of this.
So my right hand becomes my left and vice versa? Weird! It seems more like east and west appear different to us. You don't actually need to cross the poles for this, just stand facing north (or south) and turn through 180 degrees, voila!
Left and right is realitiv directions ,there are actually places where people dont refer to left and right in there language, instead n s e w.
When we agree on which side on the road you drive on , we also need to agree on that the front direction is the reference direction. On a ship starboard and portside is always referred
To the direction forward.
To facilitate a commen reference for observations you then use the ship as a compass, this to be able to swiftly report observations from the lookout (traditionally stationed on the bow )to the helmsman/ bridge (Trad in the aft)
The colours of ship channel markings, follow the jalla a or jalla b standard. These standards regulate if red marker is portside or starboard. Depending on if you sail to a port our from port.
So this right left ting is a bit confusing, and people may very well give false directions. and need to clarify (your /mine left/right. In absolut coordinate system like.
N
E + w
S
Or degrees 0- 360 (or 0- 300)
There are no need to specify.
"To my south "
Or "my 165°"
Makes me wish I had the energy to make a '5D double cyclical flat earth' model.
So, the more the flerfs try to have a model of earth, the more problems they encounter. It's as if the earth isn't flat, strange, innit?
too good man, too good... the two cylinders in both directions had me dying. Like hmmm what is that shape?
TBH the BEST "map" I saw was that the one where the northern hemisphere took the full top of the plate, the equator would be the edge, and the southern would be the full bottom of the plate with both the polar regions being in the middle of the plate faces. The plate would still have the continents that wrap around due to being at the equator would still do that... The sun would rotate around the plate at roughly a 23 degree tilt. Of course this is best viewed when the plate is blown up with air from one of the poles....
The second Model is a overcomplicated version of a sphere that doesn't want to be a sphere and doesn't work with observations
My job requires me to post notices on the front door of houses. Some of the other guys send back pictures that are rejected because the front porch shades the image of the notice on bright sunny days. They have tried manipulating the setting on the camera, but there is a much simpler method. If the house is centered in the photo, it will include the sky and it will show clouds at the expense of making the shadows darker. If the camera is tilted down a bit to exclude the sky, the grass and the front door with the notice are completely visible.
This is the same concept as the disappearing stars. If the camera is set to capture the Earth or Moon, the background stars aren't putting out enough light to be captured.
Unlike Apollo 12's camera which got fried when pointed at the Sun, modern cameras can take videos of welding without frying them.
The universe is made out of 90% old AOL disks, obviously.
And ET Atari cartridges.
I think I saw my lost Frisbee the other night when I was playing with the telescope.
@@thomascrownbuerger Too soon . . . 😜
A man walks onto a stage at a conspiracy convention on live TV. He then proceeds to ask "Which is it? Is the earth hollow, or is it flat?"
Ensuing fights break out between conspiracy theorists across the globe.
That first guy is hilarious because it reminds me of that Thanos quote "You couldn't live with your own failure, and where did that bring you? Back to me." because of the "We don't live on a globe, we live on a flat Earth *INSIDE* a globe.
The thing that always cracks me up with these is flat earthers will argue "I can still see that boat and I shouldn't" but why then can't I see the sun and the moon all the time?
Magic light that only goes so far. They really believe that.
@Mandelbrot_Set really makes you wonder how delusional a person has to be to believe that kind of stuff.
"Is THIS your Flat Earth Model?"; "No, that is ridiculous"; "What about THIS one?"; "HAHAHA!! Preposterous!"; "This one?"; "Not even CLOSE!!; - its so easy to be a flat earther, YOU guys do all the work and i just sit back denying everything. No effort needed...
The simple reason as to why there isnt a flat earth map, is because the earth is a globe.
The compact disc esrth model has to be a piss take - regardless, it's easilliy my favourite thus far. Epic
I just discovered your channel. All I watch is UA-cam so I have seen many channels. You sir give a MASTER class in segways into your advertising. Truly masterful
Love your video! but I still prefer the ultimate argument against a flat earth, namely .....
"If the earth was flat, then cats would have pushed everything off the edge by now!" 😆
Occam's razor at its best... :DDD
Very well done. Your ventriloquism skills are off the scale.
I'm glad you're keeping your human-looking ventriloquist dummy, but we all know that you're not asleep, just very focused. Keep it up 🙂
#Rusty #dog
Reminds me of that Soundgarden song...
Black hole sun
Won't you come
And shine your swastika
Reflecting off the dome
Black hole sun
Won't you come
Up through my CD
From the Summerland
I could agree with that pringles tube map. Crunchy pringles on the inside makes total sense to me!
Only if it's BBQ 😉
Flerf: "Trust your eyes!"
Also Flerf ...
Never Imagined Living in a CD Player. Does that mean there's a civilization in my old CD Players??
The originator of the first theory came up with it while listening to Soungardens Black Hole Sun whilst smacked out of his head on LSD 🥴
I genuinely feel like that first video was a literal troll. It's so dumb that I can't fathom anyone being able to believe it, and I see people believing some stupid things.
Okay, never mind, I feel like they are both trolls.
The second model feels like a person that is so close to the most logical answer and yet does everything to refuse the most probable answer. :v
The correlation of flat earthers and that German political party is bizarrely scary
"The correlation of flat earthers and that German political party is bizarrely scary"
The correlation of flat earthers and anti-vaxxers is just about 100%
Ironic considering the Nazis had the first rocket to break the Karman lines, and even a few sketches for a sub-orbital spacecraft (Silbervogel)
Actually I according to Madonna we are living in a material world. I think I'm leaning more towards that.
How does Dave have the mental capacity to bring down his mind to the low level of processing that these guys have? Phenomenal
Which is more likely to be true; the guys who can't agree on any one model and constantly claim 'no, that's not an accurate model' to debunkers who 'get it wrong' and 'explains' one, maybe two or three things that are observable at the same time if they're lucky, or the guys who agree on a singular, working model that explains all the things that are observable at the same time?
Clearly the ones who can't agree on anything (other than a singular term they use all the time, but claim that it doesn't lead to any particular model at all) and contradict themselves all the time. Or what do you mean? 😁
i feel like ive seen it said before but some of these flat earth models make GREAT fantasy worlds. ive been toying around with one thats a flat and infinite world for a TTRPG setting
Discworld
The best thing ever would be for a Flat Earther who is skilled in 3D software to try and devise a model of the Flat Earth that solves all of the issues a Flat Earth would have and then the final model turns out to be a sphere. I can't begin to express how much joy a video like that would give me.
I love the idea of the endless 4th dimension model because for a loop to happen, something needs to curve. That model can’t even be flat.
It’s also funny because it’s infinitely more complicated and far more difficult to prove than the heliocentric model that already makes so much sense and fits our current understanding of everything lol
The guy with the cylinder model is so close, right? He understands a curved surface is required East/West to match observations in reality. Hopefully he will make that logical jump that North/South does to, and voila! A sphere!
However, he claims that there is no measurable curvature anyway. :D
The one with the black sun would be a pretty cool world for a fantasy setting.
So flerfs can't present an accurate model of flat earth. Gee, it's almost like it doesn't exist.
Can you present an accurate model of how seasons work?
@@Globeisahoaxx Ah yes, ask me to explain how things that have been thoroughly explained work. . .
Are you one of the flerfs who accept that the other planets are all globes, but Earth isn't, because "reasons"?. If so, walk away.
@@GlobeisahoaxxCan you present an accurate model of how seasons work?”
Yup, sure can ua-cam.com/video/WgHmqv_-UbQ/v-deo.html.
That model also perfectly accounts for the 24 hour sun observed in BOTH hemispheres during each Solstice, as well as the second celestial rotation, the shift in seasonal stars along the ecliptic, and it can be used in mathematics to accurately predict celestial events down to the second and square mile.
Now your turn, do you have a working model for your Earth, that can explain and be used for…anything? 🧐
@@GlobeisahoaxxYES. You can’t. And you don’t even realize it. Doubt it?
So tell me where am I expected to see the Sun “approaching” and “moving away” at 30°S in december? Take a good look at your flerf model and make that prediction. Can you do that, ding dong?
@@Globeisahoaxxin simple short terms,the angle of earth in regards to the sun
The cylinder earth people are so close. All they have to do is fold in the top and bottom edges to round it out a bit and they've got it.
Back when I was a kid in the 90s playing JRPGs on the SNES, I was fascinated by the geometry of the square world map that connects both north to south and east to west. It seems so similar to what happens on the real earth, but it's also so different. For a while kid me thought of it as still a sphere, with one pole in the center of the map, and the other in the center of one of the edges. But that doesn't work.
The classic JRPG map is, in fact, a torus (sort of). Think of yourself on the surface of a donut. If you walk around the circumference, you will eventually come back to where you started. And the same is true for walking perpendicular to that direction. The problem is, as usual, projection. The "inner" surface (adjacent to the hole) has much less surface area than the outer surface. And you don't change speed as you move around the map, so we can be certain that there really is no projection error in the map we see.
So we have to take that torus, and squash it until it's a ribbon that is infinitely thin. Now our inner and outer diameter are equal, eliminating the projection error. Of course now the world is truly two dimensional, which is incompatible with the general observations made in the games. Even if the game is presented in two dimensions, the world is clearly three dimensions as characters routinely do things like wear clothes, eat and move over things.
You see, it's easy to come up with a model if you just ignore some observations. Ignore the consistent distances and a torus works fine. Ignore the need for a third dimension and a ribbon works fine. Ignore the southern hemisphere and flat earth....no, wait it still doesn't work. But it is at least somewhat less _obviously_ stupid.
Man the first one would be a cool premise for a fantasy world
In one of the Myst books, a planetesimal was described to be shaped like a torus with an ocean on one side going down a massive whirlpool in the middle, and spraying out into the sky like a fountain on the other side. All the water then looped around in the gravity and fell as rain along the rim.
You keep thinking there can't be any more nonsense and then you're surprised by the opposite.
Part of me is thinking that the cylinder model is almost right. They just need to tuck in the ends and make it kind of round, you know, like a ball or something like that. 😊
I thought they were getting desperate before, but this brings a whole new level to things.
Exactly, it's level (and therefore flat.)
@@JosBergervoet 😂
If stupid hurt, then all of the flat earthers would be in constant agony.
I was sold when he drew a swastika into the circle. I knew his mind would only show us greatness.
While watching the video, a rather interesting thought came to my mind: what is the moon for the inhabitants of the flat earth?
In our spherical world where there is space and stuff, the moon is just a piece of rock that the planet is holding on to by gravity.
In the world of flat earth above us, for some reason, 2 celestial objects are spinning: the sun and the moon. The sun has meaning, at least it shines. But what is the moon doing here? And where did the sun and moon come from?
So many questions...
A popular theory is that the Moon is a self luminous holographic projection that emits cold light that actually makes anything it strikes colder.
Seriously.
oh, i've asked EVERY flat-earther i've encountered, "WHY would the sun and moon move in circles and not fly off the edge and never return?"
only ONE ever answered, and his answer as "goddoesit"!
Also some stars move in funny ways and are called planets
@@ImieNazwiskoOK Some *lights* in the sky move in funny ways. There's a great fraction of flerfs who claim that those aren't "celestial bodies", but just some lights ("illuminaries") somehow being pinned to a dome (some come up with "personal domes" to circumvent the obvious problems that come with the idea of a dome or "celestial sphere" - they hate to use the term "sphere", for obvious reasons … 😂). They have no answers for anything.
Im still waiting for a flat earther to explain why we always see the same face of the moon from every position on earth. Im starting to lose hope 😢
Or why the moon flips vertically as you move south/north
Magic
"the sun and moon is just an illusion clearly, it appears in your eye but it's not real, that's why noone has ever been able to go there
also planes aren't real, ships aren't real, stars aren't real, and if you think you're real but you disagree with any of the above then you're not real"
I think that's pretty much how the argument would go
@@WukongTheMonkeyKing It's the NASA overlords hacking our optical nerves man
The second one is basically going as close to a globe as they can without actually saying it's a globe
The "black sun" thing comes up in FE nonsense, it seems to be a mash-up of a Nordic symbol by that name (which resembles that political symbol, but with more arms) and Hindu astrology (which also uses that symbol that the political party appropriated). There's a lot of overlap between that party and flat-earthers (c.f. Eric Dubay's favorable opinion of its leader) so the use of that symbol on the "black sun" may be a dog-whistle.
Hindu astrology has things called Rahu and Ketu (check Wikipedia) which have something to do with eclipses, and if you Google Rahu together with black sun you'll find FE pages. I don't know anything about Hindu astrology so I can't tell if it identifies Rahu and the black sun, or if it's supposed to be underneath the Earth, or if that's something that flerfs made up.
As far as I know, the Black sun is not a historical nordic symbol, but first originated as a floor decoration in a nazi castle incorporating norse aspects. Maybe I've missed something, but I've never found an older source for it that a neonazi in a UA-cam comments section saying "trust me bro"
There is the Alchemical "Sol Niger" which is a black sun, but is not norse, and and was never represented with the black sun symbol, again, probably because that symbol was invented in the 20th century (again, near as I can tell, I'd love to know about and older source)
If we assume the black sun is a real thing that they knew about, pretty interesting they only used it as a floor decoration and no where else, huh? You think it'd be a bigger deal.
And here I was.. hoping FINALLY we would get a map :(
Unfortunately we'll have to wait for the space lizards to run over Earth with a giant steam roller before we get an accurate flat map 😂
Wtf was that first model? Like, this was definitely made up for trolling, the second one was at least trying to believe in what they're saying
Jos Leys has an excellent YT vid debunking the idea of the 3,000 mile high Sun --I recommend his vids on this topic in general, they are beautiful and clear.
In essence, specific to the 3,000 mile high Sun claim, you get that number by measuring the angle to the sun from the 45th parallel at the equinox, when it is at 90 degrees (straight up) from the equator. That gives you an isosceles triangle, on a flat Earth, where the two sides forming the right angle must be the same length. The distance of one of those sides, from the equator to the 45th parallel, is around 3,000 miles -- so, the distance from the equator to the Sun must be 3,000 miles as well. Clever, right?
Except, if you measure from any other parallel of latitude, you get different altitudes for the Sun. The most obvious example is from near the poles, where the angle to the sun is close to 0 degrees, and the Sn would have an altitude approaching 0! The Sun would have to be everywhere along a line from touching the surface to 3,000 miles up as you cross 45 degrees, then everywhere above that line on out approaching infinity as you continue closer to the equator -- all at the same time! That is clearly nonsense.
The solution is to plot the elevations of the sun onto their different latitudes onto a globe. No surprise, you get essentially parallel lines pointing to a distant sun -- an answer that makes sense, as opposed to one that is impossible.
The fact that the sun illuminates 100,000,000 (one hundred million) square miles of earth simultaneously kinda debunks their silly "small and local" sun.
Similar with determining the height of Polaris by triangulation from 45° North (and having 60 NM per degree, leading to a height of 45 x 60 = 2700 NM or 3105 miles or 5000 km) - the height you'll get varies from 0 km (at the equator, but actually it seems to be a bit higher than that) to much, much more the closer you get to the North Pole. Flerfs can't do basic geometry and math, and suffer from severe dyscalculia (as Wolfie6020 has stated more than once).
I would love to see flatearthers fighting with each other on yt about which model is accurate and calling themselves a names.
People circumnavigated the earth 500 years ago and came to the (indisputable) conclusion that we live on a globe. How can people still try and dispute their findings today??
People have known the Earth was round for a lot longer than that.
They'd known the Earth was a globe for a long time, and that theoretically you could sail West from Europe to go to China and India, but that in practice it would be too long a journey with nowhere to land to resupply, given the size the globe had been calculated to be. At that time sailing way out over the open sea was not really done. Most ships stayed quite close to shore. Columbus believed the calculation for the size of the Earth was wrong, and that the distance to travel was therefore much smaller. He was lucky America was there, or either his ships would have been lost, or his crew would have mutinied and come home. They were very close to doing so. He never fully conceded that he never actually reached Asia.
I got it! The working flat earth map is a cylinder with both ends closed in hemisphere's. Oh wait...🌍