How to make ENEMY RANGED units WORTHLESS! - Total War Tactics: Warhammer 3
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- Опубліковано 20 вер 2024
- This tactic could well be the most essential in Total War Warhammer given the strength of ranged units! Control them, or they will RUIN you!
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I used to think warhounds were useless T1 trash that was outclassed by any cav, but ive come to understand that their use is to harass, not solo the enemy infantry
They can solo light missile infantry nicely. And are great for chasing off strong routed units too.
Yeah war hounds are one of those units that can reliably get over a 100 kills in most battles
Harass, but also great finishers. If you manage to route anyone the dogs seem better at killing them as they flee than almost any other unit, even better than a lot of cavalry. I don’t know if it’s animations or attack speed or just number of units, but if they attack a fleeing enemy they turn into absolute shredders.
oh, absolutely. having such a high speed stat is really useful, especially considering the malus applied to most other stats at certain fatigue thresholds ("doggos" etc. are even useful against non-shooty stacks like chaos knights-at least when controlled by ai-as you can bait elite units into chasing your faster-moving light cav/doggo trash. this way, you can effectively remove some of the strongest enemy fighters from the battle until you've tipped the scales in your favour, _and_ by the time the rest of your army is ready to fight the elite cav, they'll have completely exhausted themselves trying to catch your dogs (reducing their combat effectiveness and morale))
Honestly even if you forget them after setting them off to attack low tier ranged you haven’t exactly lost much. No unit is worthless but doggos are certainly more disposable than proper cavalry.
Me as a Dwarf Player excited for this... "This will work for everyone but the Dwarves"
Me: "Let the Vengeance begin!"
This one's going in the book
Who needs tactics when you have guns and bombs.
@@bananajoe8370 When the Elgi shoot at you with a bow and you retaliate with a good ol' GrungnI certified cannon ball.
@@inwit594 From that cannon? Thr one my sisters of the thorn got into?
@@Nemmy72 The Elgi can never foresee the immense power of the mighty Dawi. Our 2 units of thunderers have already taken aim before your cowriders even arrived.
Would you consider a video with tips on how to prevent your archers from being disrupted? Essentially the polar opposite of this one?
I’d like that, too. The only thing I know of is to keep a melee or cavalry unit or two behind to protect the ranged units.
@@bluemilkalienmonster522 yeah, have to try and catch units going for your archers and move the melee/cav unit through your ranged units from behind to cover them.
Another good option is hang some flying units back and then same thing, but the flyers will get there faster. Then just use the new land feature to plop them down right in front of your ranged units.
@@bluemilkalienmonster522 focus fire to make a unit route, routing can bleed over
& pretend to charge them in the back so they turn around, and get shot in the back
even just the turning around delays them
Same goed for sumonning so they get delayed
checkerboard so they fight 1 unit, stop with a blob to fight that 1 archer unit and get shot by the non melee engaded groups
use 2 groups of cheaper units instead of 1 group of better units
the expendable units and double the amount of archers might perform a lot better
Use any fast units you have or single characters to block these fast unit and range attack when they stop, for the flying one use flying unit/lord to block them or snipe that from far or just leave a melee dps unit around your range to guard them
First disable skirmish mode. Skirmish mode is useful on skirmish units but useless in every other ranged units. It means they will actually shoot at enemies instead of running away from them. Then you need cav or spears to babysit your ranged units. Also any flying unit should be focussed immediately when they come in range.
1:53 that spearman just kicked a dinosaur
His name was Chad.
When you're a greatsword main at heart, but never got enough money to buy one...
wood Elves are basically designed to smash ranged armies. They have super fast heavy hitting cavalry, fast disrupting fliers, and stalking archers with great range that pretty much ensure they always get the first, or wven more volleys before a tradeoff starts
you can also pull stalked archers back right when their missiles are getting released and dodge the incoming volley so you dont get hit at all
Wood Elves are my favorite faction by far. Super fast hit and run to take out heavy hitting artillery? Got it.
Melee the crap out of hordes of Skaven? Got it. Stealthy sneaky harrassment first strike? Got it. Lord /monster sniping? There's no one better. They've got it all. They don't take losses too well, but everything has a decent means of surviving.
Greenskins come second, having stealthy spider cav is awesome. I prefer the spider archers - you can put them in skirmish mode and leave them alone for a bit. I just wish they could climb walls. They're also just fun. 'When I gets there, I'm gonna stab. '
whats wild is they have ranged superiority, and are superior at dealing with ranged, like wheres THE GIVE?
In WH2 if you fought Elves with Greenskins 90% of the time they would just sit there and shoot whatever was closest, so you could just plop your goblin spears, with their silver shields and tiny hitboxes, in front of them to waste all of the ammo before rushing in with the rest of the army.
As dwarves, I'm usually able to focus fire down enemy missile units in sequence. Grouping quarrellers together and getting them all to nuke one unit at a time is good fun.
Quarrelers will just win the duel using shields and armor so it's honestly really routine
Focus fire is absolutely essential in winning the ranged fight. Put the enemy ranged to flight and then once you’ve got ranged supremacy the melee fight is all but certain.
As a Empire main (Singleplayer) I tend to recruit 1-4 milita men for The very specific task of distrupting ranged. Sure, not the fastest or strongest, but they can fire whilst moving, and as mentioned in this video, AI tend To put their ranged on skirmish mode. So literally just sneak some milita men behind the enemy line and start running their ranged down. They will turn their back and run, letting your milita men shoot them in the back, and by the time they decide To fight back your milita will be out of ammo and the enemy unit too injured To actually fend them off.
So that's what these units are for.
I always just recruited crossbow men or musketeers because the skirmishers seemed to weak.
@@molybdaen11 Mortars are useless now too, the AI just dodges them. They dodge some spells too, others not. I've gone over to use hellfire rockets or just cannons.
They don't dodge Pit of Shades but dodge the "raining spells" like the cheap lore of metal one.
@@etuanno They tend to evade now, jes.
But they still have problems with 2 or more aiming at the same unit.
I do jot know if you can aim at a certain area with [alt], some artillery has it, some not.
@@molybdaen11 You can aim with most I think.
I find it very satisfying to take a powerful melee lord (like Skarbrand or Taurox) and let them charge solo into the enemy army.
...ofc your lord must be some kind of durable to survive this.
At least 50% of the enemy units will clump around your lord (mostly) then your main force arrives, surrounds them and just squish them even more together.
Such "Killbox" always reminds me of The Battle of the Bastards from GoT ^^
I had a battle with the Iron Bull when I was the Dark Elves. He indeed did get surrounded by spears and pin cushioned by 4 units of dark shards. Lived for 3 volleys.
You can use that tactic where you hide all of your units in a forest, let the enemy army clump up around your durable melee lord (near the forest) and then destroy them with magic of the hidden mage.
turn kholek into a one man army and do this, it's exactly what i do, my kholek sitting at 10k hp with 1k melee strength lmao
@@fladormon ye with Kholek you don't need to tank until your army arrives...
you are the army 😅
Not sure "don't stand still and let the enemy shoot you in the face" warrants a 12 minute tactics video
Remember to turn off Guard Mode for units chasing down enemy missiles. If the enemy routs and runs away, your unit will stop chasing. The enemy can then rally, while your unit stands still like a bunch of gits, getting blasted in the face.
i see a few comments on how to prevent their range units from being disrupted. this is what i do.
Pro tip: I call it the hammer, anvil, and fire.
Enage with your melee(the anvil) and proceed to flank with your cavalry(the hammer) behind the hammer is your ranged units, they flank around with your hammer so when your hammer comes in and begings to disrupt their range units/hammering the melee line the range units will then be free to fire at anyone routing, or disengaging to attack your calvary.
your welcome.
tl;dr; Use range units to flank, your range units cant be disruppted/flanked if they are the ones doing the disrupting/flanking
I'm so thankful for your videos!! Every tactic video is making me enjoy MP even more. I used to dread 1v1 matches because I was simply that bad, but now, especially seeing this one, it's a godsend!! Me liking the villainous factions like the VC, fielding more flying units made all the difference. I used to fear the Empire, but it was so amazing to shut them down quickly. 3/5 Empire opponents quit mid match!!
This is why I use lother. Seaguard a lot of at least keep a few spear units behind to defend missiles. Chariots are really good at stopping missiles because they can run though them all
This is incredibly helpful as my current Valkia campaign has the entirety of Ulthuan launching an assault on my territory, and their missile units are melting my forces before I can close the distance.
Perfect points. I know it, but again, it's useful and pleasant to hear well structured information.
Great video. I have used fast units to do what you do but the idea of using them just before your front line hits is good.
Does raise an interesting point that maybe CA should change it so that unless a ranged unit has 360 fire while moving for the AI have skirmish mode off by default for those units. Might be a good thing to make the game harder so you don't get the one hound unit soloing three archers like in a vid or the time wasting that can happen early on where because you don't have any fast units your melee just chase the archers the entire length of the map. Not just Warhammer either as I remember that being a real issue in early Troy where it often felt like delaying the inevetible and they'd accomplish more if they just stood and shoot.
I like Legendoftotalwar's strat which is to have a lord dance in front of them as they waste all their ammo.
The Skaven have the best ways to deal with missile units. Plus cannons and such units. Menace below and their speed deals with them. Clanrats get a good ammount of kills for a summoned unit.
Skaven don't have to deal with missile units anyways since their catapults far outrange every missile unit in the game and are great for deleting archers and such. In field battles you can just pick them apart with Jezzails and catapults. But yes, menace below and plague priests that can summon are also very useful at disrupting earlier in the game.
I basically dont wanna play dwarfs because of constantly fighting skaven
That tip regarding enemy ammo tied to models is clutch! I never knew this!
This is why cheap quick units, like spiders and fell bats, are very useful. You can use them to occupy ranged units, or catch up and "grab" some cavalry unit until some haldberdiers arrive to decimate them.
If you want some practice with this element of the game id highly recommend a beastmen Taurox playthrough. Very fun and different from most other games, While also having a Fun as helll roster for getting at those pesky ranged units. The Dark elves also love to spam ranged units in the early game, So lots a free practice.
Honestly my early tauox campaign was just me ambushing and annihilating with a mass charge. Beastmen are all faster than elves with good charge bonuses
I dont know if the strongest lord of the strongest faction against ranged really would be the best example for practice but true.
I really like your videos, even those with tips like this one that aren't new to me, I still enjoy watching them. My only criticism would be how much you repeated yourself in the beginning of this video. I think it's almost 3 minutes into the video when you first start explaining the actual tactic, and before that you are effectively repeating the point that ranged units who cannot make use of their ammo are effectively useless. Which of course, is a correct point, but also not really that hard to understand that it would justify repeating 5 times phrased slightly differently to drive the point home. I mean absolutely no disrespect with this comment, again I very much enjoy your content and just wanted to leave some feedback. This way if you pick up a trend of people giving similar feedback you might just pay a bit more attention to it in the future.
This tactic actually works 'best' with dwarf gyrobombers. Archers still try to keep skirmish distance from flying units if you give move orders past them.
“There’s usually a tool to hold back missile units unless you’re playing dwarves.”
As a dwarf main I cri evrytim
1:53, Spearman sees giant dinosaur "I'll kick it"
Is spreading the units out like in your example armies actually helpful? I have a massive problem of the battle lines just turning into a clusterfuck but I'm afraid to spread the units out because in theory the enemy can just walk straight through the gaps, or the enemy could technically be surrounding my units. But I wonder if its just worth it anyway.
It is. Clumped up archer units are actually in danger of being disrupted even more ( because an enemy charge can hit 2-3 units and tie them up instead of 1 unit )
You also tend to be more resistant to spells when you're spread out in a line.
The catch is that a "spaghetti" line ranged unit takes longer to turn ( as they have to keep formation even when attempting to fire ) and they occupy more space, which means you need to have a wider front to accomodate.
They both have their own drawbacks and advantages.
I remember the thing that made me give up on even trying to use cavalry was watching a group of Orc Arrer Boys beating cav in melee.
Nice vid. as much as I wanna watch my cinematic battles while playing, I still suck at micromanagement.
I have found that, for Dwarfs, the best counter to ranged forces is to use ranged forces of our own. but ESPECIALLY have a master engineer.
Quarrelers can box with any other bow unit in the game because of their heavy armor, now drop Entrench on them and they WILL win those trades.
Rangers are a good counter to skimish infantry, they're faster than quarrelers, but still tough for their role (they're also good with vanguard and can easily harrass the enemy backline from the start)
as for artillery or just a bit more counter play? Gyrocopters are really good, or just straight up using artillery to bombard their lines is a classic strat.
all in all however, if you can keep a master engineer with your dawi ranged line... oh yeah it's gunna be hard for the enemy to not only kill it but survive it's volleys
oh also a tip for the dawi line, ESPECIALLY the dawi line... get your boys off of skirmish mode and put everyone on guard mode, I dunno why the setting have the dwarfs set the way they are but seriously. dwarfs are tough combatants, let them fight in melee and slowly push, they're not good runners XD
Just found this channel, and I'm in love. Liked and subscribed! Thank you for this wonderful content!
This is great, but I wish there was some instructions for an ABSOLUTE total NOOB like myself. I find myself trying things like hammer and anvil and such but my battles usually end up with the units just punching it out due to chaos. Things like 'The basics of Unit Formations' (like should I just have them in a long ass line? Should I keep some units 'in reserve' for when the other guys get tired?) and other absolutely basic stuff would be appreciated A LOT. The TW:W3 tutorial actually got me into the game this time around and I'm enjoying the struggle ^^
I just started playing the game and this has been very useful!
Zerk putting Nurgle on the screen with Rush Factions 🤣.
In one of my beastmen campaigns I’ve been running around with a stack of ungors and basically tricking the enemy into running right into getting surrounded while my ranged units shred them. It’s incredibly effective
In my beastmen campaigns there are only two types of armies.
1: 1-3 mages plus the rest Ungor raiders
2: A proper doomstack with tons of heroes, minotaurs and Jabberslythes.
@@etuanno chad beastmen army user
1:51 Ironblaster : "Lolz, rhinox go stomp stomp"
I'm new. How did you know I needed this video in my life? 😆 I got mauled by wood elves in two battles yesterday.
I can't help but think of Dr Who when he calls out the Sontaran General as a coward for stopping bullets from firing
"Stopping bullets? Sontarans should face bullets with dignity"
Hi Zerk! Do you always use the normal battle/skirmish mode against AI for videos like this or especially the unit comparisons? Or is it a mod? Because when I try to compare some equal units its hard to compare it, if the enemy is changing it´s formation. Or do you play against a friend for making videos like this?
Watched two of your videos and already see the difference getting wayy less casualties
Well this ought to be helpful as an avid Beastman player
Beastmen have loads of units that are great for disruption: Warhounds, harpies, centaurs... I love Beastmen.
Also Minotaurs are big and fast enough to just charge through their frontline into their ranged units, works great with centaur vanguard deployed behind them
Your Minotaurs and other monsters are your damage dealers so you don’t need ranged units at all, dedicate your whole army to disrupting theirs
The problem is that you have to know about the enemies ranged unit capacity beforehand. You're constructing a specialized army that utilizes fast moving, disposable units that can skip like knights on a chessboard. Moreover, those fast moving units are even more prone to be disposable than archers with a cleverly set up army to counter them. You're kind of creating a scenario, where a specialist anti-archer army performs well, but that is not a generally viable strategy, because the composition of enemy armies, especially in multiplayer, is random.
This is why I love Shielded Darkriders & Manticores. However the enemy can still overpower you with Strength Rank in IE fielding higher tier units. At that point its all about pregame like building diplomacy, & Hero play. Thanks to Morathi's campaign ive learned how to defeat stronger factions more indirectly or insidiously. A slow death is what they get. 👌
I sent a flying unit to engage them while another slower unit catch up and engaged them. Then move that flying unit to another archer rinse and repeat.
Infinite ratling gun ammo go-go brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr-BOOM! (The weapon malfunctioned)
Will you ever do Part 2 of the Army Guides of the other Warhammer 3 races? You’ve only done Khorne so far, but did Part 1 for everyone
I remember I used to clump my Hellcannons together so that I can cover them with a halberd to minimize disruption from fast large units or fast weak units. But they could still be destroyed if the enemy artillery focuses on that instead of my heavy melee units.
I like groms ability the dragon breath ammunition it is like my favorite bonus for him because greenskin ranged is not that great but they become so good with those
In my slanesh campagne i always saw the elves army as "trash and spearmen" the more missile units an army had the easyer it was to beat.
"Rush Factions"
Sees Nurgle. Lmao
I vote to make a special category, called "Grind Factions"
I’ve watched so many of your videos, and love them all! There is such a gargantuan amount of knowledge and tricks that is laid out in a way that is both easy to use to understand, and effective in the game. I’m still dog doo at the game, but that’s t”on me… Thanks a lot.
I feel like the empires pistol cavalry would be a great choice for disrupting. They are quick and can fire at the units they are disrupting
Goblin Wolf Rider Archers are great at disruption. They're super fast, get vanguard deployment, beat most archers/artillery crews in a fight & can shoot arrows themselves!
You are hands-down best tww tutor alive !!
Great video as per. Would be nice to see a video discussing how to play certain styles, e.g. a siege/ranged style, rusher, etc
I love to waste enemy ammo with a lord. When on the offensive, keep your army in the rear, preferably hidden, and take a fast lord to the front. Fast, so he will not get isolated by a sudden rush. Then, within artillery range, let him hide behind a big tree. Tariff made a vid on it, the strongest unit in all of Warhammer. A thick tree will stop 100% of all straight fire artillery, even the chaos canons.
In case you have a flying lord, or the enemy has mortars, or there are no (big) trees in firing range of the enemy, you can just let your lord run back and fro at maximum range of the enemy artillery, and when you see the shells come for you, turn 180 degrees, while staying in range. 99% misses, only the homing chaos rounds hit, so beware of those. Once the enemy is out of artillery ammo, you can opt to cheese the frick out of him by moving your lord into maximum archer range and repeating the same trick
Even worse is when you have a Sigmar statue in the middle, in range of enemy artillery. They will try to hit your lord, until he gets behind the statue. Not invisible, so they try to maneuver to hit him, and I have had enemy artillery drive around the statue to get me. Of course a short charge made short work of them once they were on my side of the statue and their troops could no longer intervene.
The best cheese is during sieges where the enemy has mortars. Hide your army or keep them out of tower range, then charge your lord towards the towers, and try to have him run towards a wall section facing sideways at the moment the enemy mortar fires. Their shots will land at the location you will be if you keep going straight. Only there is a wall with troops on it, and you would never try to run through that wall... The A.I. does not realize this, and so their shots often explode right on top of the walls, cleaning the troops on top. Can also work with wall pieces facing directly towards the front, but chances are the round will miss the wall. Once had a battle where four units were broken and three others severely damaged by two enemy mortar units... gotta love those
Love this videos. Even knowing this already i love to watch them.
I expected to see some secret but the secret is 'engage ranged units in meele' lol :)
in 1 of the 1st examples how did you deploy a unit BEHIND the enemy army? is it a special ability of the unit or how else do you get that kind of advantageous deployment? if i could do this regularly ranged units would be so much easier to deal with
2:55: WHO LET THE DOGS OUT
Half of the video is him saying that range units are useless if you make them stop using ammo.
do u have a guide on Vampire ( or other factions weak in range/rushers) for Siege Defense?
I use to never use cav in any total war game now no matter the army I will try to have 2 cav units to disrupt missles and if possible back charges but their biggest power is when they are not even engaged just disrupting units
Calling Nurgle a rush faction I think is a bit of a stretch. 😁
at least they get some doggos to help out!
@@alyssinwilliams4570 furies, rot flies, marauder horsemen too.
Rush has always been either tanky & slow or fast & feeble.
Nurgle is rash faction, not rush faction!
Most of the time I feel the best way to make enemy ranged units worthless is to have multiple armies so op that everything is worthless
Me at 2:00 "ffs get to the point already".
Dude imagine that, we already figured out that ranged units without ammunition are not that great. Oh great. "Use cav to counter ranged" f'ing genius.
Awesome tatctic guide! Did try chariots to do this tactic to eliminate range? Woudl it work?
Wow disrupt enemy archers with cav ty Sherlock i never thought about that
7:40 Flesh doggos? You mean corndogs?
Or you play tzeench and use changebringers to fly over in zigzag and drop literal napalm on gunners before they even got a chance to break their barrier
so weird seeing nurgle in the "RUSH" category xD
I find it amusing to see nurgle and rush in the same context.
Excellent content & insight
I am so glad that you don't include the infamous "ammo wasting hero" in this video. I hope that your videos help the newcomers to learn real tactics and properly enjoy the game as intended...
Imagine how much more powerful the AI would be if they could intelligently toggle on and off skirmish mode!!!
I imagine 75% of campaign cheese would finally go out of date!!
2:18 Wait tomb kings are ranged heavy armies? I thought they relied on giant monsterous units?
not trying to say tour tactics are wrong but the flying units you were using took a lot of damage by the time they got to the target is good to midgait the damage against your anti range units by having a shield or expendable get targeted first
The time of the ranged spam is over. The time of the Orks has come.
yes while the dwarfs dont have any fast options to disable ranged, they have so much armour that they just dont care if being shot at
This tactic will only work if the enemy leaves their flank exposed and only a rookie would do that
How many times did he tell us that RANGED UNITS ARE USELESS WITHOUT AMMUNITION!!!
I counted 5 during the first minute and a half
This is why you always bring an extra grudge thrower
laughs in chaos dwarf blunderbuss XD
Mortars/ catapults on archers and you're gud to go.
Pretty good advice for new players.
Any flying unit such as the cheap bats for vampire counts are perfect for taking out archers or artillery
Help.... How can one do this as Dwarves??? It's hard to fight against Wood Elves due to their mixture of treeman and ranged stopping the Dawi....
Great and helpful video. In my campaign as Azazel I am facing a lot of armies from Cathay with tons of ranges units. They are annoying as hell.
go to 2:45 if you want to skip the intro
love your videos!
question is how fo handle fast 360 armor piercing archers as a dwarf - even if they have a tool to shout down your missles and arthilery?
or be me and send in one angry lizard to kite ammo for a few minutes before sending the rest of the army in
Do someone know where I could find information about speed limit cap per unit?
Except this question... super video (happy to know that the ammo is associated to each models)
Something in me is saying this will work with a left or right side focus. Early game it's prob too easy mid-to late game I wonder if the potential loss of a unit will work. playing a lot of warriors of chaos currently, so I'm thinking while one side hold their own, a domino effect could happen. 🤔🤔🤔
main problem is currently the amount of settlement battles. hopefully CA will change it soon.
Remember the land battles from EAW? You would have the actual production buildings as your base and their garrison would spawn there. You could also use resources to give upgrades to their relevant units.
Nurgle *rush faction* 😄
POV you are retelling the entire story of modern warfare 2 3:29
How to do this with dwarfs vs elves or something quicker??