Very insightful and nuanced presentation. Really gets to the heart of these problems by going beyond the usual troubling politics related to the gun debate. Very illuminating and thorough.
This was very helpful, informative, and educational. It shows how the media dramatizes the few fatalities from mass shootings while ignoring the many fatalities from suicide and homicide.
I wonder how you would feel reading your own comment back if you were the parent or spouse of someone who was killed in a mass shooting? Those few fatalities are no less devastating, important or impactful in society, just because there are fewer of them.
Im a 31 year old black male from haiti been in and out of jobs for over a decade. At 31 things get really annoying but im not a mass muderder i just keep pushing
Good for you! You still have some circumstantial factors in common with factors in some mass murderers. That's not a judgement of you. They may or may not contribute to pushing an individual liable to go over the edge, over the edge.
very timely read for those who have not already seen this. We need to understand the causation better. Also watch PBS's Sky Blossom the next greatest generation. I was shocked to read about teen boys who consider themselves "incels [those who cannot get sex because they are always rejected]. Really? be successful - wait - much of life happens after 30 but you have to get there. I was also shocked by social media sites that foster harassment by those who are not yet mature enough to even know what the future holds for any one!
I can see a lot of people calling 'bullshit' on mass shootings being associated with people being in crisis, being under stress etc. and calling those things excuses when - they maintain - actually the truth is simply that the person who does those things is abnormal, twisted and evil, and/or has overly-lenient parents or parents in denial who think their children can do no wrong no matter what's staring them in the face, or who teach them evil or if not that, at least fail to be involved enough to teach them the right way and enforce it. I think this is part of the problem. Culture would rather separate shooters in their minds as people who are abnormally twisted and evil, or else lay blame squarely on parents for turning killers into the world simply by dint of either being awful people themselves, or of hiding something or not facing up to something obvious, or of not being competent parents. Why do people so many people so aggressively guard and maintain these thuggish lines to themselves and to others, and refuse to listen to any other line of thought? I think two main reasons: a) nobody wants to have to examine the 'brand' image and cultural rhetoric of what represents the best of a country in the national and international eye, or of any society's ideal citizens and subcultures, and ask if there might be something within those that has somehow contributed to fostering a culture of mass shootings. They don't want to lose their stereotypes or their popular poster-children, since both have sentimental value. So those poster-children always have to be the ones who are framed as people who can do no wrong, and the stereotypes always have to favour them in that way. The sports stars, the beauty queens, the all-Americans, the devout Christians. For that to happen, critical analysis and deconstruction of them, their truths (or not) and the effects of how they are represented, are often aggressively resisted by the masses, and unofficially policed into taboo, perpetually-undiscussed status, by the general population. In fact, such discussions are often framed and shamed as victim-blaming. This is part of building and preserving the idea of a unified culture that looks a certain way collectively deemed desirable by those with the most influence, with its traditions, ideas, and a type of camaraderie that makes up cultural consciousness and politicised nationalism. It's what allows good-looking, high-flying, ethnically-privileged, middle and upper-class kids to be bullies, and instead of receiving discipline for bullying, to have teachers and society at large defend them, maybe even support them in their bullying. It's what makes life easy for the conformers and tough on the non-conformers. It's what makes conformers rewarded by society and non-conformers ostracised, stigmatised and alienated. b) Many people who are not mass shooters themselves may be going through crisis, divorce, be immigrants, be mentally ill, be outsiders, be poor, feel alienated or suicidal etc. They don’t appreciate things associated with them being spoken of in the same breath as mass shooters, first because they consider it insulting, and secondly because they are afraid they will be stigmatised and viewed with suspicion if too strong a connection is forged between the two in public consciousness. Basically, nobody innocent wants to be perceived as being in any way like a mass shooter. Other people can be like them in other ways, but not they themselves. And c) It's every parent's worst nightmare to raise a mass murderer. Or at least, if there are parents for whom it very obviously isn't their worst nightmare then they will be absolutely torn to shreds by the rest of society for that very fact. Given this fear, people feel a need to pinpoint obvious, simple causes - and obvious people to categorically unequivocally blame for them. So it's the parent's fault for being an idiot, and since I wouldn't be nearly as idiotic as they were in doing/not doing what they did/didn't do, what happened with their kid as a consequence absolutely can't happen with any of mine. The kid is abnormally twisted and inherently evil through and through; anyone with half a brain can see that. Therefore it's ok for us to channel our grief about what they did into hatred for them, and to do so with a clear conscience. Plus I KNOW my own kids aren't inherently twisted and abnormal - they're not evil through and through. It's the same kind of fear and denial that feeds the cry of every parent when it comes to mental health: 'I KNOW my kid isn't depressed/suicidal; they're really happy and invested in their life. They laugh all the time, and they are making plans for their future.' Oh, parents - I know you don't want to hear this, but these things are SO much more complicated than that! It could be your kid. It can happen to anyone. You could be the best parent in the world and still miss it/still have it be your kid. Sorry to break it to you.
Define 'better' and why it's 'exponentially' so. Body count may represent grief, but not necessarily the full degree of trauma or danger. Plus intention to kill is important as well as actual numbers killed. Maybe the fact that fewer people were killed is due to sheer chance or good medical care or whatever, meaning the danger of death is no less if the body count is low. So if you number by body count alone, you aren't taking an approach that will best mitigate the danger. All you're saying by going by body count alone is that the danger someone is in only matters statistically if they die from it. It's not fair to expect people to have to die in order for people to take notice. In fact, creating a society where you only get listened to and counted if you either kill or die is probably a major factor in aggravating the mass shooting culture.
@@catherinespark it's all about getting a high score. More kills equals more evil there's no real healing from a loved one dying a violent senseless death, injured can recuperate. Now if they become traumatized n go out n also kill then there's no real way to measure this in terms of points. But all these killers r going to hell but the top score gets to sit at the right hand side of Satan.
No offense, but if your intention to do a mass shooting was stopped because someone baked you a blueberry pie, I don't think you really wanted to shoot anyone.
Very insightful and nuanced presentation. Really gets to the heart of these problems by going beyond the usual troubling politics related to the gun debate. Very illuminating and thorough.
I agree most of these videos are super political
This was very helpful, informative, and educational. It shows how the media dramatizes the few fatalities from mass shootings while ignoring the many fatalities from suicide and homicide.
I wonder how you would feel reading your own comment back if you were the parent or spouse of someone who was killed in a mass shooting? Those few fatalities are no less devastating, important or impactful in society, just because there are fewer of them.
Im a 31 year old black male from haiti been in and out of jobs for over a decade. At 31 things get really annoying but im not a mass muderder i just keep pushing
Good for you! You still have some circumstantial factors in common with factors in some mass murderers. That's not a judgement of you. They may or may not contribute to pushing an individual liable to go over the edge, over the edge.
very timely read for those who have not already seen this. We need to understand the causation better. Also watch PBS's Sky Blossom the next greatest generation. I was shocked to read about teen boys who consider themselves "incels [those who cannot get sex because they are always rejected]. Really? be successful - wait - much of life happens after 30 but you have to get there. I was also shocked by social media sites that foster harassment by those who are not yet mature enough to even know what the future holds for any one!
I can see a lot of people calling 'bullshit' on mass shootings being associated with people being in crisis, being under stress etc. and calling those things excuses when - they maintain - actually the truth is simply that the person who does those things is abnormal, twisted and evil, and/or has overly-lenient parents or parents in denial who think their children can do no wrong no matter what's staring them in the face, or who teach them evil or if not that, at least fail to be involved enough to teach them the right way and enforce it. I think this is part of the problem. Culture would rather separate shooters in their minds as people who are abnormally twisted and evil, or else lay blame squarely on parents for turning killers into the world simply by dint of either being awful people themselves, or of hiding something or not facing up to something obvious, or of not being competent parents.
Why do people so many people so aggressively guard and maintain these thuggish lines to themselves and to others, and refuse to listen to any other line of thought? I think two main reasons: a) nobody wants to have to examine the 'brand' image and cultural rhetoric of what represents the best of a country in the national and international eye, or of any society's ideal citizens and subcultures, and ask if there might be something within those that has somehow contributed to fostering a culture of mass shootings. They don't want to lose their stereotypes or their popular poster-children, since both have sentimental value. So those poster-children always have to be the ones who are framed as people who can do no wrong, and the stereotypes always have to favour them in that way. The sports stars, the beauty queens, the all-Americans, the devout Christians. For that to happen, critical analysis and deconstruction of them, their truths (or not) and the effects of how they are represented, are often aggressively resisted by the masses, and unofficially policed into taboo, perpetually-undiscussed status, by the general population. In fact, such discussions are often framed and shamed as victim-blaming. This is part of building and preserving the idea of a unified culture that looks a certain way collectively deemed desirable by those with the most influence, with its traditions, ideas, and a type of camaraderie that makes up cultural consciousness and politicised nationalism. It's what allows good-looking, high-flying, ethnically-privileged, middle and upper-class kids to be bullies, and instead of receiving discipline for bullying, to have teachers and society at large defend them, maybe even support them in their bullying. It's what makes life easy for the conformers and tough on the non-conformers. It's what makes conformers rewarded by society and non-conformers ostracised, stigmatised and alienated.
b) Many people who are not mass shooters themselves may be going through crisis, divorce, be immigrants, be mentally ill, be outsiders, be poor, feel alienated or suicidal etc. They don’t appreciate things associated with them being spoken of in the same breath as mass shooters, first because they consider it insulting, and secondly because they are afraid they will be stigmatised and viewed with suspicion if too strong a connection is forged between the two in public consciousness. Basically, nobody innocent wants to be perceived as being in any way like a mass shooter. Other people can be like them in other ways, but not they themselves.
And c) It's every parent's worst nightmare to raise a mass murderer. Or at least, if there are parents for whom it very obviously isn't their worst nightmare then they will be absolutely torn to shreds by the rest of society for that very fact. Given this fear, people feel a need to pinpoint obvious, simple causes - and obvious people to categorically unequivocally blame for them. So it's the parent's fault for being an idiot, and since I wouldn't be nearly as idiotic as they were in doing/not doing what they did/didn't do, what happened with their kid as a consequence absolutely can't happen with any of mine. The kid is abnormally twisted and inherently evil through and through; anyone with half a brain can see that. Therefore it's ok for us to channel our grief about what they did into hatred for them, and to do so with a clear conscience. Plus I KNOW my own kids aren't inherently twisted and abnormal - they're not evil through and through. It's the same kind of fear and denial that feeds the cry of every parent when it comes to mental health: 'I KNOW my kid isn't depressed/suicidal; they're really happy and invested in their life. They laugh all the time, and they are making plans for their future.' Oh, parents - I know you don't want to hear this, but these things are SO much more complicated than that! It could be your kid. It can happen to anyone. You could be the best parent in the world and still miss it/still have it be your kid. Sorry to break it to you.
Could you normalize all data to the general population and your database?
30:02 Adam lanza's database( same as yours but exponentially better) was numbered by body count.
Define 'better' and why it's 'exponentially' so. Body count may represent grief, but not necessarily the full degree of trauma or danger. Plus intention to kill is important as well as actual numbers killed. Maybe the fact that fewer people were killed is due to sheer chance or good medical care or whatever, meaning the danger of death is no less if the body count is low. So if you number by body count alone, you aren't taking an approach that will best mitigate the danger. All you're saying by going by body count alone is that the danger someone is in only matters statistically if they die from it. It's not fair to expect people to have to die in order for people to take notice. In fact, creating a society where you only get listened to and counted if you either kill or die is probably a major factor in aggravating the mass shooting culture.
@@catherinespark it's all about getting a high score. More kills equals more evil there's no real healing from a loved one dying a violent senseless death, injured can recuperate. Now if they become traumatized n go out n also kill then there's no real way to measure this in terms of points. But all these killers r going to hell but the top score gets to sit at the right hand side of Satan.
4 or more shooting victims, not necessarily murdered
No offense, but if your intention to do a mass shooting was stopped because someone baked you a blueberry pie, I don't think you really wanted to shoot anyone.