We gotta talk about that "Deluge Sound"
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- Опубліковано 1 січ 2024
- If there's one criticism I hear about the Deluge often, it's that it has that "Deluge Sound." Let's talk about what that is... and why I think it's bullshit!
the sounds I was using as a demo in this video became this song (if you wanna hear how much the deluge can be anything!)
• Neolithica (Synthstrom...
#synthstromdeluge #ambientsounds #chillmusic #synth #jamuary #letstalkfacts
Apologies for the bumpy camera😢. I threw this together in the middle of a session and apparently my new desk accentuates EVERY SINGLE BUTTON PUSH when using a table mounted camera arm… I promise I’ll do better next time! 😂
Synthstrom should consider acquiring a batch of Boards of Deluge presets from Krzysztof, some from Rephazer and incorporate them into the default lineup instead of the current ones, which are perceived as subpar. There's literally hundreds of excellent ones. Or even contract them to make new original ones. I believe that many people form their opinion of a synthesizer based on its stock presets, and this is the issue at hand. On the other hand I love how lowkey the Deluge is, like a rare gem.
This is an excellent point. Totally agree! The presets should definitely showcase the capabilities of the machine and it’s probably due time for a new ‘stock preset pack’ to ship with it. I’d buy it!
I agree, especially with so many synth companies hiring musicians to make their presets now (Arturia comes first to mind but I think Korg is doing it too) it's really telling what a difference that makes.
@@kaitlyn__L can't agree with this enough!
Boards of Deluge presets are so, so good. I'm not a preset guy, but it is hard NOT to use the BOD presets once you have them. It's mind blowing what Krzysztof does with the Deluge engine.
@@longacre4932 you’re so right. Dude is a wizard! Very few sessions go by where I don’t use or tweak at least one BOD patch.
Great vid I've been considering getting on of these and the sounds you made are lovely.
You should! It’s an awesome awesome inspiration machine!
Bass Amount 30-35, Treble Amount 30-35, Bass EQ Cutoff 30-35, Treble EQ Cutoff 10-20
If I recall in the manual, this will do a shelf EQ boost to stuff under 300Hz and stuff above 2kHz which really amplifies the sub and higher harmonics for more articulation. Also if you bring the EQ cutoff of bass up to 50 and the treble cutoff down to 0, it'll amplify the lower and upper Mids. If anything is sounding a bit dull, samples, synths, FX, I tend to do this to the sound to make it more full. Sometimes I'll just use the Treble EQ to roll off a lot of the higher harmonics to soften the sound if I'm modulating my low pass filter a lot. Just messing with the EQ makes the synth init patch sound good.
Excellent tips! Thanks for sharing!
Great content and demonstration. Love this
That is a FABULOUS track you're working on there!
Thank you!🙏 really happy with how it ultimately turned out. Check it out here if ya wanna! ua-cam.com/video/vw95ULxRdPM/v-deo.htmlsi=k2BwUF3rrWftrLO1
Agree everything i hear this all the time that its metallic i think they can use the LP cutoff lol
Totally! I hear it with bass too- but there’s an EQ people forget about all the time.
I have to admit that if I don’t take time to create my own sounds that I have felt the sound pallet feels limited on the Deluge. Thanks for making this. I’m going to dig in deeper and try some new things in my Deluge. Right after I upgrade to the community firmware. It looks really nice.
The community firmware really opens a whole slew of sound design tools. Automation view alone is just a world of crazy possibilities, but community firmware also gives you a bunch more filters. Really cool stuff for sure!
Complete BS most haven't learned the machine well enough to understand why that's not true. Most underrated synth-sampler-drum machine out.❤
💯
People (like myself who owned a deluge for around a year) complain about the sound of the device not about its synths. It’s headroom is way too small, it sound muddy and cuts crispy highs, and it’s nearly impossible to get a clean, balanced mix in it. And to be honest: your example presents that very well!
I guess I’m not too concerned about headroom and crispy highs when I’m still exploring- those are final mix concerns. That said, having used the deluge for over a year myself- i think it’s more than capable. The ‘final’ version of this example sounds pretty good to me but you can be the judge: ua-cam.com/video/vw95ULxRdPM/v-deo.htmlsi=XdSM2g9t1PgaV2vf
"I just don't like that Deluge sound"
Roughly translates into
"I just can't afford the Deluge man"
😅🤣😂☠
It's a top notch sequencer with 5 more than capable Synth engines ranging from subtractive to FM to the new Drum synth options, marry that off with sampling capabilities.
The sound design possibilities on this machine are endless...
😂 💯
It's extremely simple: it's all about time. The time you spend with the instrument. I have created several soundbanks for various synthesizers (including Deluge) and it always turned out that they can do much more than I expected. Always :) In the case of Deluge, we have just received one of the most unique features in recent years when it comes to all available grooveboxes: Automation view. Outstanding idea and development. I still can't imagine how many new sounds I can do now.
Well said. Completely agree. It’s the same with any instrument (guitar, drums, you name it) and maybe more so with synths because of all the parameters and modulation you can do. Automation view is a game changer. It’s crazy how quickly you can completely alter even the simplest of sounds!
The BOD wizard himself! Cant wait to hear with what you come up for the Deluge next! ❤🔥
@@volsteh Yes I will try to do something but now it's so easy to experiment and generate interesting sounds! It's an amazing piece of gear.
@@Synth-PatchesComalso, yes! Big fan of your work my friend!
great little vid here!! your points are all well made & well received. & I'm really digging the music you're conjuring up here. bravo!!
Thank you! 🙏 still working this track out into a final song but I’m close now! Excited to post how it all shakes out!
@@oaklandghosts0510 I'll look for you on bandcamp....
Subscribed. Excellent video and I appreciate you demonstrating the depth of the modulation and sound engine. I recently installed the community firmware on my retrofitted deluge and a personal goal is spend more time with my deluge and other synths this year.
I should add that while I have downloaded other’s shared presets, I have not purchased any.
Thank you. Glad it was helpful! I feel like the more time I spend with the deluge, the more impressed I am with it! The OLED screen def helps a lot, and the new community firmware is really amazing. Can’t wait to hear what you come up with!
Appreciate the video. I agree, it sounds how you want to make it sound!
Right on!
I have the same feeling about my OP-1, but then again, it is fun to just sit outside and noodle and see where it takes me.
I think that this is much wider problem across the industry. Very few great instruments come with really good factory patches. This might be arbitrary, and I will not call out specific manufacturers, it is more of a general case. Then, you have people who don't want to explore instruments and go straight to presets only. You are correct, there is no "Deluge sound", just like Octatrack is not "dark" (there is a different reason for this misconception tho). I have synths from the eighties, and when you play DX7 cartridges, you can feel the full power of that synth. Jupiter 6 too, I quite often use some of the presets made 40 years ago lol. Even og Prophet presets are super usable. Some companies do a really good job and hire great designers to work with the internal team on the factory content. Take something like REV2 - matrix, tons of modulation, you really can showcase full power of the synth.
Amen! 🙏 agreed.
the deluge sounds great, the synth engines are what makes it desirable.
in the category of grooveboxes that actually sound good you have this and the play+
100%
I have to agree its an odd criticism, especially given the broad variety amazing patches folks have made with the Deluge internal synth engine. I 'd wager folks could not possibly tell what device made a sound.
💯! The boards of deluge patches are incredible and I’ve heard excellent recreations of famous sounds and Junos and such all recreated in the internal engine.
Nicely said.
Thank you!🙏
I do not own one, but the presets sound extremely usable. I'd much rather have simple presets as building block, something to tweak from.
Yes exactly! They have a certain aesthetic for sure, but I wouldn’t call them bad by any means. It’s a taste thing. And they’re excellent building blocks and learning tools. On the deluge it’s pretty easy to see how things are patched together with a little digging so it’s a great way to learn how to build your own patches.
> simple presets as building block
Seconded 😊
Indeed. Its easy to forget that not every sound you use is to sound epic. Wouldn't work in an arrangement
This is fantastic! More tutorials and explainers please, esp with the community firmware
Thank you! They’re incoming! I have a series called ‘Songs from Scratch’ that’s a kind of tutorial/explainer vid series mostly focused on building a song using the deluge, and also a newer companion series called ‘Track Anatomy’ that’s like songs from scratch but in reverse, dissecting songs I’ve already made and looking at how kits and patches were built.
I’ll def have more featuring the community firmware now that I’m digging into it! Thanks for the feedback! Cheers!
Completely agree. I think the presets are to be used as jumping off points, just like the presets in Ableton. People just jump in and try to make music without doing much of their own sound design. It's a shame, because you can really make this box sing!
Yup. I think the same argument could be made for literally any synth (or instrument for that matter!) if you’re just using it as is and not spending the time to develop good sound design.
@@oaklandghosts0510 Definately. I will say that I think the reverb could be better though. I hear talk about people trying to incorporate Mutable Instruments Braids into it though, but it's going to take some work. Pretty excited to see where this box goes in the coming year!
Ooh that’d be rad! Ya i agree. If anything the effects (especially the reverb) is a little underwhelming- but that’s why we have a zoia! 😂
@@RSKT_musicagreed on the reverb. If it had a way to sample back into itself I’d just run it through a pedal and sample. You can make the deluge sing but you need the know how. How do I make this sound beefier, how do I make this sound more lush, etc because there aren’t enough starting points/presets that show the potential of the engine. I would love to see a series on creating synth patches 😉
@@mrfork True! I actually filmed a bunch for a workflow guide once, but I'm not sure it'll see the light of day at this point, and I'd rather redo them anyways as I've gotten a bit better at sound design since then. Honestly though, the new stereo unison and lfo shaoes has really changed the game
I’m not sure what people who don’t like the Deluge synth engine are expecting: it seems to cover all the basics of classic subtractive synthesis, simple FM and wavetables. Perhaps they’re hoping for some sort of super-shiny EDM-focused in-your-face VST-like sounds? I know that you’ll never get the quirky richness of vintage analogue or the extreme versatility of modular, but the Deluge makes a decent stab at classic synth sounds, and I don’t really want it to sound like Serum or whatever. I know that the presets do have a distinct feel, and I think that reflects the musical influences of the developers at the time they were working on it: more along the lines of synthwave, vaporwave and chiptune than club-friendly EDM. And I’m okay with that!
Totally agree! I mentioned in the video I thought the same thing about the presets- that they’re not bad, just an aesthetic choice. Likely by the developers reflecting what they wanted to make at that time, and so much of it before the multiple firmware updates that expanded the synth engine capabilities. There’s a lot of sound in this box if you’re willing to find it!
I think I get what you mean but it does have a “sound” just like any synth that is the sum of its effects, filters, etc. Jeremy from Red Means Recording has mentioned in a video that he can hear when something is made with the deluge. I would definitely agree though that most people have only scratched the surface of what it’s capable of which I think was your point. Great video and a good reminder to learn the gear you have.
I think a case could be made for that, at least if you’re sticking only to the base waveforms the oscillators come in with - but the the beauty of the deluge is you don’t have to! You can plug in your own waveforms or samples or any combination therein! Certainly you are limited by the filters and effects that are inherent to the deluge - which, as you pointed out is the same with any synth. So there is some ‘sound’ to that. But I think there’s a pretty vast gap between the stock presets and say, the boards of deluge patches for example that most people wouldn’t be able to place as coming from the same synth engine. I’m not sure the likes of moog or Juno could say the same.
Cheers, and thanks for the conversation!
@@oaklandghosts0510 "But I think there’s a pretty vast gap between the stock presets and say, the boards of deluge patches for example". 100% agreed about that and loading your own oscillators (which is a huge rabbit hole). The range of sounds you can get is really good... if you put in the time to make those sounds yourself (assuming you know how). The frustration is likely what you mentioned about the presets/starting points. If there isn't anything close to what you're looking for then it can really throw off your writing session. Any tips for that?
@@mrfork this is actually a really really good point/question, and I think probably what gets people complaining about ‘that deluge sound.’ If you have something very specific in mind and can’t find it, or don’t have the chops to make it (believe me- I can sometimes create some cool stuff when I luck into it but I def don’t have the chops to create what I hear in my head - YET.. ya right. Who am I kidding? I’ll never get there. 😂) but I try to use that limitation/personal handicap to my advantage to write things on the deluge I wouldn’t normally (in say my DAW, or my band, a guitar etc) let me explain..
So I often go in with no real preconceived idea. At best, maybe a simple melody or rough ‘mood’ but often neither. I’ll start exploring sounds until something inspires me, tweak it until I’m happy and then knock out a chord progression or melody. Now that I’ve got that starter, I’ll build around it. Picking sounds/kits/countermelodies that compliment that initial sound. Basically sound design around that first spark instead of trying to get exactly a sound I’m looking for and not having the skill to create it. One of the things I’m pickiest about is bass sounds (I used to play bass 🤷♂️) so I tend to make those myself either from the synth engine or a ton of samples/multi-samples I have laying around. Having a good sample
Library helps a ton but it also sometimes screws you over having TOO many options. i rarely save the instruments i make (from samples, the synth engine, etc) unless i know its one ill use again. i prefer each song kinda has its own vibe. same with drums. i pretty much always make my own custom kit picking sounds that compliment the sound and vibe im building (tho often ill use a stock kit as a placeholder in the meantime.)
in short, i find that first spark and then sit back and try to be a conduit instead of an electrician. let the song show me what it wants to be. hope that makes sense! give it a try!
@@oaklandghosts0510 I like that idea. I'll have to give that a go. Cheers!
@@mrfork first thing that came to my mind was putting the Prophet VS waves in as oscillators hahah
Ive been consisering a deluge for a while now, and this gives me even more hope for the possibilities of the device! It sounds like whatever your mind can set its ears on and more!
I definitely feel that way about it! I mean, there are certainly limitations - but that can be said for any instrument. Personally, I haven’t felt handcuffed yet, but I’m also not a big synth head trying to make something very specific very often. I explore, find something I like, tweak it to my delight and build around it. Like… you’d be hard pressed to make it sound like a moog for example - but you could sample one! Or audio line in one!
@@oaklandghosts0510 amen! Definitely want to use the Deluge as the heart of my analog setup, in which I have a minilogue and a couple EPs, so I'm thinking itll be a great base to build off of. Like you said, you can always sample in or track audio from other devices for specific sounds!
@@Cloud_Brn ooh nice! Yes! If you already have a couple analog pieces you love the deluge is an excellent brain to tie it altogether! It’s like a sequencer on steroids!
I have over three decades-worth of analogue synth, sampler, sequencer & other stuff accumulated. when I got the deluge, I was like "well, this is everything in one box.... the rest can go now!" & I'm pretty sure it will, now I have two deluges. even the hardware loopers seem a little redundant. the deluge is just so far ahead of the competition, in having integrated all of this stuff into one UI. first day I had it, I was at my desk at work pootling about with it, & someone asked if they could have a listen.... hygeine-conscious, I unplugged my headphones to let him plug his in, & was astonished to discover it had a built-in speaker.
do not hesitate any longer. pull the trigger.
@@duncan-rmi Amen! Another raving review, so good to hear. Similarly, I have a TR-6S, and a Boss 505, but am selling both to help fund the Deluge, and it will do everything they can do over and over again! I'm very excited to get my hands on one, and would love to add videos to the ever growing UA-cam fanbase, hah!
Totally agree. Did you get your unit with that screen already? If not, how long was the turn around? I'm really interested in getting mine done. Thanks!
I got my unit last March I think? so they were already shipping with the OLED… love the look of the old 7seg, but working on the OLED is just great. I think the turnarounds pretty quick now that community has mostly taken over firmware. Cheers!
Oakland is a good city for music! You are right about the near unlimited possibilities, but also they must remember: Deluge is as much a Sequencer for other gear as it a sound module! So MIDI out to anything and everything else.
Oakland is a great city for music! And yes- totally agree. The deluge (like most any instrument on the planet) was designed to play well with others. You really want that ‘authentic Jupiter’ sound? Midi in your Jupiter!
That IS the Deluge sound! For those of us who know the Boards of Deluge -- the LFO warble, the noise -- that sound is very very familiar. :) It's not a bad sound. It's just a sound.
I will tell you what I think people "miss". Deluge is an all-in-one groovebox and people want an all-in-one sound which means they probably want the synths to be able to make some great keys, wide pads. But for whatever reason I haven't heard these from the deluge. Maybe someone can prove me wrong. I'm not saying it's not there in the FM synthesizer. But it's not there in the presets and Boards of Deluge doesn't do it. Most of the other all-in-one grooveboxes (thinking of Syntakt, OP1, etc.) rely on complex bespoke synthesizers rather than just going in barehanded with a pair of oscillators and LFOs. But at the end of the day I'm sure you are right: the wavetable synths are unexplored territory.
Every synth has a sound. That's not a bad thing, but most synths are meant to be paired with other devices, not all-in-one. It's only with all-in-one-devices that you can get into a sonic rut because of the synth's "fingerprint".
The little melody is a tweaked boards of deluge, yes. I think the boards of deluge have a pretty distinct signature. Same with the stock presets. But I think the contrast between the two actually highlights pretty well what a vast difference in sonic capability the deluge has. And that’s just between 2 sample packs mostly using the subtractive (and some fm) synth! Add to that, that it’s not limited to its synth engine and many forms of synthesis (which most synths don’t have) it also supports sampling and multi sampling so it can very easily sound like just about anything. Plus it plays nice with other gear as a brain! Or you can line in anything you can dream of. It’s really a pretty incredible little machine capable of so much more than most people give it credit for, and if someone is complaining about ‘that sound’ based mostly on the stock presets available… I think they’re missing the forest for the trees.
Thanks for the comment and the food for thought!
Cheers!
@@oaklandghosts0510 Yes, don't get me wrong. I *utterly* love the thing. It is beloved and dear to me.
I guess I'm at the stage where I'm trying to take every piece of hardware for what it is rather than trying to turn it into something it's not. Nobody is bothered that a guitar doesn't sound like a violin. And yet we tend to demand of our synths and sequencers that they be able to make *any* kind of sound rather than taking them for what they do, exploring the possibilities, pushing the instrument to its limitations rather than holding it up to preconceived notions of what it *should* do.
@@aravartanian7578 yes totally! Agree 💯! Very well put.
This is why I sold my OP-Z to get a Deluge, and am now reluctantly looking at passing the Deluge along. The music made on them sounds distinctly like the sound pallet of the device. Your song is a great jam but it still sounds like a Deluge jam to me. Nothing wrong with that, I'm just looking for more sound variety at this point.
I think this is something you will ultimately bump up against with any synth. A synth is a sum of its parts. However, I’d argue the gap between sonic possibilities is wider on the deluge than most. And the deluge is also not just a synth. It’s a sampler and supports multi sampling. Want it to sound like a moog? Sample a moog. Voila! It can quite literally sound like anything. And then you can further manipulate that sample and or combine it with another to create something entirely new.
@@oaklandghosts0510 That's all true, but what I kept coming back to is the thought that if I was going to "finish" any Deluge songs, I'd have to process or even replace a lot of it in Ableton. And multisampled instruments can sound good on the Deluge, but generally not as good as a VST. I remembered that Ableton Push Standalone exists, and I'm mulling over selling the Deluge for one. But this is all obviously personal preference for workflow and taste in sounds. Just something I've been thinking of and it seemed highly relevant to your video. Don't worry, I'll keep watching your channel even if I become an ex-Deluge user!
@@jorujorumusic if there's one major disadvantage to the deluge it's definitely getting things OFF it to finish. Uggg. I've got my own tedious workflow to do so, but even so it's time consuming. Agree with VSTs generally sounding better, usually cuz they are properly set up to translate well. I have found tho that even the sounds I come up with on the deluge are more than usable in a finished product with some additional processing in my DAW. The Push 2 looks really interesting! Would def be interested to hear what you think. I'm coming from Pro Tools and Logic Pro and never really got into Abelton, so the closest I ever got to an Abelton like workflow is probably the deluge. I'm definitely not dedicated to ONLY using the deluge - mostly just documenting my journey and learning with it. I'm slowly adding to and expanding the arsenal a bit (I really wanna get my hands on some of the semi modular Moog stuff) but even when I do, as the brains/sequencer/arranger of a Dawless setup, I don't see the deluge going anywhere. It's those damn Blinky lights hypnotizing me!
Def didn’t intend for the channel to be so deluge focused, but gosh darn it I’m enamored with the thing! Until the next thing comes along anyway.. 😂
@@ryanhayford I'm sure/hope someone in the community is working on a capable and flexible stem export for Deluge 🙏
My criticism about the sound isnt about the the synthesis but the overall output. Idk what the quality of the output is I just wish it was better. Its not enough for me to think about selling it though.
Interesting. I don’t feel like I’ve had much problem with it myself. Granted it’s no DAW as much as it wishes it were… the EQ is pretty limited and until recently (with the community firmware update) it didn’t have a compressor.. but even so stereo out into the daw with some light EQ and Compression usually sounds decent. For anything I really wanna pursue, I’ll track out everything individually into my DAW and remix/post process/master there and the results have been pretty good for me.
Very valid point and great demo to make it. Thank you. The Deluge is a great and extremely versatile device. As you say, if you cannot make it sound very good, the weak link is certainly not the machine...
Couldn’t have said it better myself. 🙏 cheers!
I think maybe the FX (distortion / reverb / bitcrush etc) are the telltale signs of a Deluge track? I have zero problem with its ability to sound like anything you want it to. I don't use any presets and all my work is sample based.
My experience with the inbuilt FX is hitting a wall where I wish I had more control maybe... I think the community automation view will help me here a lot. Not installed that yet!
But I'd love to see a few more FX added - 2 or 3 different approaches to distortion etc. Otherwise I'm going to want to 'finish' some stuff in a DAW - which I would really prefer not to do.
and if you listen to any of my (hundreds of) improv, ambient Deluge uploads, you'll hear all the synths I've got samples of: Virus, Moog, OP1, Oberheim, Omnisphere, etc.........if you use good multisamples, the Deluge is truly unlimited in its' ability as a chameleon.......
💯this is always my final argument on the matter as well. If the synth engine is just too challenging to get the sounds you want out of it or if for some reason you decide you just absolutely don’t like it.. the deluge is a sampler that supports multi-sampling so it can literally sound like
Anything you want it to.
agreed. I've had my Deluge for about 6 years. Love it, and all the improvements they (and the Comm Firm) have been making but honestly, I truly wish they'd develop a software editor. It would be so much more efficient to see all the parameters displayed on a screen, be able to Copy & Paste groups of parameters, etc. All the involvement required to do synth programming is quite antiquated, especially now that there are so many different options. Otherwise, still blown away with the instrument's sound, layout, workflow and potential.......
people making these kinds of reviews have only scratched the surface of the machine and stuck to the factory presets. This machine is perfect and it's a fantastic creation and inspiration tool that I haven't gotten enough of for the past four years! .., some should try to learn the guitar for example and they will see 😇
Well said! Totally agree! I will concede I’m biased in that I really like the deluge, so sure, I like how it sounds but I spend a good deal of time making it sound the way I want and the reason I like it so much is it CAN sound like just about anything!
@@oaklandghosts0510 🧚✨
It's more like that "XYZ-Product preset sound" There's also an "Ableton Live Suite Sound", a "Maschine Sound"... I mean... either stop using presets; at least tweak the preset to your liking (don't be lazy); or stop talking! xD
Thanks for the Video! I'm going to make some more Ableton Preset Music! :p
Yes! 😂 exactly!
I know my stuff tended to "samey" after a while, then i realised i was leaping in and choosing patch 001, kit001 (808?) ,120 bpm as my starting point all the time😅
After the OLED update, i have one of my own patches first in the order (that was a very 1 time sound) so i hunt around now and look for something that captures my imagination more. Also the default kit is now a darbukka that i sampled, so if i want something else i gotta go searching for it, or sample another thing.
It really is a great tool to let your imagination loose with.
Also, loving your content, especially where youre using both the Deluge and another piece of gear. I'm struggling a little with integrating my Zoia.
I hear you. I always try to set up rough parameters (like key, scale, tempo, etc) before I even get started in a session so when I’m exploring I don’t get too excited in something in C Major, 120bpm. I usually just pick arbitrary scales and tempos and see where it goes (you can always change it later if it’s not working!)
For the zoia, I haven’t dived too deep just yet. I’ve went through Ron C’s tutorials and some of the zoia bootcamp one’s empress put out just to wrap my head around it, but it’s more a piece of gear I’m looking to integrate later. I plan to get my hands on some of the moog semi modular stuff (if it’s ever in stock again!) and it really needs some external effects to sing properly. So I’m mostly future proofing. In the meantime I have downloaded some pretty cool patches. A couple synths, and some glitchy loopers (great to run deluge synths through individually when you track into a DAW for variety) and also some cool guitar patches to play guitar with the Delly. I would like to try to build a generative or semi-generative patch on it at some point to incorporate with the deluge too!
@@oaklandghosts0510 this is validating, I often set out like "I want to make something in x dorian or y lydian" (I've been trying to do other modes too but I keep being drawn to dorian and lydian lol) so I don't go "oh yeah! that!" when I run across yet another track in like E major or whatever
@@kaitlyn__L if feels like a great way to work, especially when you’re in a more exploratory mood or don’t have something specific in mind. If I start noodling a sound in C major, chances are I’m gonna find a sound and melody I like in c major that’s more difficult or doesn’t sound good when I transpose it. So just starting off somewhere else to begin with encourages me to fall in love with a sound/melody in a key I wouldn’t normally try.
@@oaklandghosts0510 it’s also a great excuse to internalise the muscle memory, without endlessly doing scales or exercises/obstacle courses haha. Not just the specific note combos but also the way it’s constructed regardless of root note (I lowkey hate the “it’s just C major but” method of memory, because then everyone thinks of dorian as D and lydian as F…)
@@kaitlyn__L hahaha totally! I really wish the Deluge pads were velocity sensitive because I 💯 percent prefer the isometric layout coming from guitar/bass. It’s fine dialing it all in manually, but if it had velocity I’d be in heaven.
In short, presets washed in reverb sounds good. Its the Korg dilemma in that the sound engine relies in the effects processor to sound good and the cheap sound you refer to is a dry signal with no washed out reverb or spaceous feeling
Guess what my moog sounds like without reverb? Or a Juno without stereo chorus? Or vocals without reverb/delay? Or an electric guitar without a host of effects? Effects are and have always been vital to sound design. It’s not a “korg” dilemma or any kind of dilemma. It’s not lipstick you put on a pig. It’s part of the process of making things objectively sound good.
@@oaklandghosts0510 ok, call it sound design or whatever. I just noticed what seemed to differ between dilooge and the fantastic ambient sounds presented here was the reverb. Thats all. But perhaps it is lfos and envelopes too. But the presets would feel more animated with delay/reverb for a start. And less resonance, that makes it sound like goofy moog popcorn music. So, not all moogey stuff sounds awsome in my ears.
@@FredF78 I think that’s a good point for sure. Effects can take things a long way but I’m not sure reverb alone could rescue some of these presets… 😂 Kidding aside, I’ve def been able to tweak some of them into things that I think worked well in my compositions.
I think the devs made an aesthetic choice with those. It was a small team and I think that’s largely just the kinds of sounds they liked and wanted at the time (or maybe what the deluge was capable of before all the firmware updates.) unfortunately, I think a lot of people associate those sounds with all the deluge can offer and I’m just hoping to showcase that’s definitely not the case.
Thanks for the comment and reply! 🙏 cheers!
My limited understanding of the ‘deluge sound’ was due to the sample rate range for playing audio, at 24, 44.1?
The Deluge's outputs are 44.1kHz, 24-bit, but you can load samples at higher rates (limited to RAM and sd card playback speed) -any source material higher is down-sampled.
I think the Deluge actually sounds amazing, it's crazy what it can do considering its size!
It's also one of the best hardware sequencer.
It's also a good sampler, an audio looper, an effects processor.... maybe it will make your coffee with the next firmware update.
The only thing i don't like on the Deluge are its effects: the reverb is too discreet, the delay enters feedback loop above 50%, saturation completely destroys any sound above 10%, the "stutter" effect is pretty much unusable either in composition or in live performence situation, i don't understand why it's not just a simple roll with ajustable time ratios, which is actually missing for live performing the Deluge...
Nothing is perfect, but the Deluge is damn close !
Totally agree! It’s so versatile! I agree the reverb is a little underwhelming, not terrible by any means but not great. I sometimes add better reverbs after transferring the song to my DAW. You can get over 50% on the delay if you switch types (pressing in the bottom gold knob) to the analog delay I think? More taxing on CPU tho.. oh and the new community firmware totally fixed the stutter! It can be set to different segments (1/4, 1/8, 1/16, etc) so it’s actually usable now!
I'm wondering what the next comminity firmware update might offer in terms of reverb and other effects. New engines? Would be amazing. I agree that the preset sounds do the deluge no favours, but it takes little effort to drive some great sounds out of it. The Hydrasynth suffers from the same issue- idiosyncratic presets that don't push the true capability of the synth.
@@laurencehayes2061some
New reverb options would be great. I don’t hate the one it’s got but it’s def the weak link in the effects chain.
I think you’re right about presets/synths. I think most synths suffer this same problem (with the presets not doing a great job showcasing what they can do.) Less so with soft synths in a DAW. You can find great sounds off the bat there (tho I’d argue digging deeper on those yields better results too, just easier to be lazy and not tweak things) Maybe that’s why we expect so much from presets on hardware synths out the gate…
So you're saying these people are Delugeonal?
😂😂😂 nailed it!
I see your point, but all gear does have a sound to it, even samplers. Even with Roland, the ZenCore stuff doesn't sound good to me, but the ACB stuff does. The Deluge just doesn't hit my ear right, even though I like the workflow.
Can’t argue with that. If it doesn’t hit your ear right, it’s just not the right piece of gear for you. Hope you find the piece that works for you!
I just literally posted the other day on ron c's yt channel that the thing is a chameleon, sonically. yes, the idea of a "sound" is bs.
Totally! I mean like any synth it has limitations, but unlike most, it’s pretty hard to find the Deluge’s!
@@oaklandghosts0510 same thing was levelled at the mighty blofeld (I have six of them- three each desktop & keyboard, for the polyphony & also for reasons of geography & logistics 😂); when you dig in, the filters are great, the oscillators are great, the sample playback is whatever you make of it.... I think some people just poke at a few presets & walk away, basically. one day a synth maker will have the cojones to put something on the market with NO presets in it, & force these mooks to do the hard yards. 🤟
@@duncan-rmi haha. Funny you mention that… I just got my hands on some of the moog semi modular stuff and there is NO PRESETS to be found lol. The manual has some patch diagrams in it, but that’s as close as it gets. Def in for some hard yards!
Deluge sounds too much like early FL cheese. Some people love it, some people hate it. But one can't deny that this sound is always gonna be popular just like your typical Yamaha wedding sound. I mean, Deluge have it's own personality for sure. Cheese never stopped Yamaha from selling millions and millions of units. Deluge will always be popular no matter what people think.
I don’t know man… I kinda feel like, if all you can get outta the deluge is cheese… maybe it’s not the restaurant. Maybe it’s the chef. 🤷♂️ I’ve seen people absolutely cook on this thing! It can def do a whole lot more than top pizza!
@@oaklandghosts0510 i just watched all the videos i can on YT, never planned to buy one, so there's gotta bad chefs all over, if you know some good videos, please share
I had a deluge, sold it and got a push 3 standalone. No regrets. Yes deluge is a much better device in certain ways. It can do just about everything. But i could not get it to sound the way i wanted it to. There is definitely a deluge sound to it even when tweaking every param possible. My main complaint was sampling and importing samples. I could not get them to punch through like i can with my push. I will say however the deluge was my favorite groovebox possible. Easiest to make music on anything i have ever played on including in daw.
I sold mine vs push 3s.
Still miss the delly. Whether it's better or not is moot - it just got so easy to use after a long learning curve.
@@LordoftheBadgers i miss it to. I have been debating on whether to get another
@@joeymc5272 yeah I hear you. Now my digitakt just got massively devalued too lol.
I dunno. I do think the p3s is a good fit for my style of playing. That midi capture is soooo good. Shame they keep under cooking it though. Haven't bothered with L12 yet.
@@LordoftheBadgers ya its shitty. Nowadays anything mono is dont buy. You know they will be coming with a stereo version. I still cannot believe they didn’t do a octa mkiii first. Thats been overdue for long time. Push 3 im great with. Im waiting for Reliq to release. Thing should be an absolute beast. Its just a controller but has just about everything you could want and so much i/o, cv, gates and i realize i pretty much live in the box. Im not a dawless cat so heading back to in the daw gear.
Do you find yourself using the standalone feature of P3 much?
@@joeymc5272 atm not as much as I want to. Distracted by mega purchase of nord stage 4 so more playing than recording. Aim to get back on track with that soon as I really need to get more solid work done on p3
Bloops and bleeps.
The synth engine is just mediocre. I had boards of deluge, I have been making patches for synths for decades so I have made my own patches, and got very mediocre results across the board. I had the best success with FM synthesis, surprisingly. Of course you can load it with samples and make it sound better, it still sounds very flat. More so, it's very easy to overload it CPU wise and has very little headroom (try to play presets with external keyboard with velocity and aftertouch, you will get digital distortion from DAC). You can make it sound like anything, it will just not be anywhere as good as that thing you want it to sound like.
Your examples are not convincing, I am afraid. Drowning stuff in reverb is not lush.
I think people need to adjust their expectations, it's a groove box which does everything. It won't sound like a good synth.
Just about completely disagree with the body of your comment except for one part - “people need to adjust their expectations” - I do think this is true for most pieces of gear and synths in general. We expect a great deal more from synths than most pieces of gear and I’d go so far as to say if you bought the deluge to be your synth… you’re using it wrong. While its synth engine is perfectly capable, It’s so much more than that.
I kinda agree. I had a lot of fun composing on the deluge, but a lot of them sounded very... digital? I guess? Thin, maybe.
Is it possible to get half decent sounding things? Sure, but the synth engine is still overall meh. Compare Deluge to something like the M8, its night and day. I havent touched my deluge in a while because of it. Its easy to write on, but if youre doing all that work to get an "idea," that you have to remake somewhere else, you might as well just work on that something else in the first place.
@@vangoghsseveredear Interesting. I haven’t personally felt like I couldn’t get good sounds out of the deluge, but then I’m not usually making entire compositions with the internal synth engine alone. Why would I when the deluge is not limited to just its internal engine? It wasn’t created to JUST be a synth…If I want that M8 I can midi control it, or live loop/audio in it. Or sample it. The deluge is so easy to compose on (for me) and I really like the workflow and sequencer so using it as a center piece to combine multiple pieces of gear in a session is great. It’s rare that I don’t make something that has some combination of internal engine synths, samples, multi-sampled instruments and maybe external gear to achieve what I’m going for and the deluge handles it all pretty easily. The only real hassle for me is getting it all out for finaling in a daw.. I have a workflow for it but it’s time consuming.