I wouldn't mind seeing more anarchy systems in the outer reaches of the "bubble"...and I guess further down the line they become lawful and add more anarchy system to that outer shell which would increase the size of the inhabited "bubble".
I like the anarchy doughnut around the bubble being pushed out further. Maybe even around those new megaships that Brewer is building to Colonia. You know near scoop-able stars.
I love the tortuga idea. Here is my part: Make the pirates take over one of the megaships along the bubble to colonia highway. If you choose the right ship. It's both far enough from civilization and in a logical place for pirates to apear.
So is the original game if you played BGS and Powerplay around Objectives. Its the core part of the game people refuse to accept. Stop worrying about playstyle and play the game they made.
Agreed. I suspect there will eventually be more to do at settlements, and I hope so. Settlements look cool, I would like ways to interact with them that isn't just sneak or slaughter.
NPC Pirate Fleet Carriers. They can relocate when security gets too tough, and provide some bonus to anarchy factions within the same system and neighboring systems based upon player involvement from missions provided on the ship.
I would love a pirate haven, i have wanted that since i started playing. It could become a hub for a lot player combat interactions so there would be a lot of danger there, it would be so cool
I like Tortuga! What I miss is a non-lethal weapon. In missions in non-anarchy systems, you eventually get to a point where it's quite hard and you need a lot of patience to steal stuff. That's where it would be easier if you could take out an NPC without making any noise and without killing them. My idea would be to modify the energy tool so that it only stuns enemies and doesn't kill them. The effects could also last only a "short" time, so you have to hurry afterwards. But this would give you a way to get past NPCs for illegal missions. Another thing would be to have the choice of what you get in the missions. There are also missions from NPCs where you can trade. Why not take the possibility that you can choose materials as a reward. If you go to an NPC, you can choose the material you need and the NPC will calculate how much you get. That would make the grind a little easier.
The reason there's no nonlethal weapons is because according to PEGI, if you can disable someone and then kill them, that's more heinous and more deserving of a higher rating than just murdering someone outright. Since FDev is terrified out of their minds of having a high PEGI rating, we're forced to massacre people.
Being able to change your mods is a must. I’m stressing about putting Extra Backpack on my Maverick because at some point I won’t be picking every single thing up and I’d rather use that spot for something else. Being able to put it on now and replace it later would be perfect.
That temporary utility is the reason I didn't put Extra Backpack on my Mav. Now I'm done with the EDO upgrade/engineering grind for all my gear, and I'm glad I went without it in favor of other mods.
@@ScottSlooper What mods did you go with? For missions/stealth I'm thinking Quieter Footsteps, Improved Jump Assist, Night Vision, and I was going to used the last spot for backpack but now I'm wondering what would be good there. Maybe sprint duration
@@BoardGameClub I use my Mav suit for raids/looting/missions and supporting my squadron when we attack military sites together. At G5 I can fight in it np. My style is maximum mobility so I outmaneuver opponents rather than tanking them, similar to the same ship fighting style. I put Quiet Footsteps, Sprint, Jump, and Night Vision on it. Dominator I only use in CZs and squadron military site attacks, and you need to decide how you're going to play and either make it a tank or a maneuver suit. My Dominator is also an outmaneuver suit with one change, I have Shield Recharge instead of Quiet Footsteps. I do not sneak anybody in CZs, and I think the Fast Recharge is better utility than Quiet Footsteps by a large margin for what I do in the Dom . IDK why a lot of people don't put Night Vision on Dom. Night Vision is vastly superior to fighting in the dark with a flashlight, for situational awareness, finding rechargers, finding targets, finding escape routes or approaches, and targeting targets at distance. There are also some good tank build approaches in Dominator. When I do the Bio Sampling I'm always hopping in and out of my SRV, so I haven't put any mods other than Sprint and Jump on my Artemis yet, and it works almost just the same, just a bit slower, totally unmodded. I think they need to do something significant to make the Artemis suit relevant, because as-is the only thing that matters about that suit that I can find is the fact it has the scanner. Making it another suit so far to me is totally unnecessary. Just make it possible to trade the cutter for the scanner on the Mav would make a lot more sense. I heard that some have figured out a way to make the Artemis suit a super mobile flying combat suit, but I haven't seen it proven better than a good build and skillful use of the Dom in combat.
An easier system would be to have a set of anarchy systems in the Bubble that always are filled up - exclusively with anarchy factions. If there is no space, no other faction could expand there. And since it is all anarchy, the controller will also always be anarchy.
Fullerene C60 is a Tourist system composed of only 3 factions. All of which are anarchy. Located a very short distance from the edge of the bubble, this essentially makes it a perma-anarchy system. If it can be done in one system, it is reasonable to say that FDev can do this for multiple systems in or around the bubble to create sort of designated locations to collect Odyssey materials. Ironically, I could see this creating an unintended centralized player activity spot similar to how Deciat became a murder site. Fitting for a system of brigands and despots.
a simple fix would be that you would NOT get a fine or bounty UNLESS another NPC saw you. getting a fine when the only guy that saw you is dead is a bit much. that would make it so you have to run more stealth, OR have to turn off the alarms first, and Kill everyone at the base so there are no witnesses .
So to complete some upgrades, you will have no choice but to become a criminal. So much for "play your way"... I played thousands of hours of Elite with no more than a few accidental crimes. I went out of my way to keep a low crime stat. This just feeds me another reason to never go back.
There are more ways to play EDO than EDH. I am a law abider in EDH and a total criminal in EDO. We have squadron members who have maintained their (mostly) lawfulness in EDO, and they are definitely grinding slower than we criminals. It's actually kind of fun!
You dont have to go to anarchy systems, ive never done that for mats. I just go to Davs hope, it isnt particularly exciting but the amount of stuff you get means that ive only ever gone there twice for a total of probably about 4 hrs
@@Noreceipts400 Dav's Hope (and sites like it) requires relogging to be used effectively. That's just silly, and something FDev should have nuked years ago.
@@Noreceipts400 Been there, done that... The crashed conda too... If taking advantage of a broken game mechanic and mindlessly relogging every three minutes is the most viable method for progression , I'm going to take that as another sign that it's just time to go.
The solution is simple, to affect the BGS you should play in open mode. In this way the owners of anarchy factions can defend themselves through pvp. This would be a major improvement for the BGS
Let players buy materials with credits (the bartender will pay you peanuts for your materials, which annoys me) People only farm materials because getting them the intended way is too slow
There is no need to do this by coding. Just allow players to do their things and Tortuga may pop up as a reality. Of course, the bgs is so poorly designed that this will not be possible xD
an other option would be to give as a tool for stunning without counting it as murder like at the release where you could stunn some one with the overcharge energy toolm that would be awsome
Basically they need to move the things found for odyssey engineers in anarchy systems to other government groups as well...honestly would really like to see some non-fps odyssey related missions.
For the Commanders' Toolbx, how about a summary of what actions positively and negatively influence (help/hinder) an anarchy faction. Many, like myself are probably not sure of these things, not being immersed in BGS. Then the non BGS CMDRs could decide or help, hopefully.
When I played Elite as a beginner in solo space, it was safe to go to anarchy because even if you misfire, you won't be penalised as long as you win that battle. It gave an extra net of safety to a very open world. Anarchy systems could get beefier soldiers so that it is more of a pain to target and lorewise because they have access to illegal armor and weapons. You would need more than this, but it's a start.
Good idea. Mayhap faster responses by mercenary reinforcements who are just hanging in the system itching for a fight vs lazy overworked system security who aren't getting paid enough.
When I played I'd pirate in anarchy systems, specifically anarchy agricultural systems when in ''boom'' with my Fed Corvette. Find a large hauler, interdict, knock out it's FSD, then thrusters, then as it's repairing thrusters I'd take out all but it's weakest hardpoints generally leaving a single S pulse laser which does pretty much nothing Vs my 2,800 shields with 45% thermal resistance and.... was it 5 or 6 shield cells.... either way I'd just let it shoot with that single laser while I rotate spamming hatch breakers and collection limpets, always huge hauls of low temp diamonds in agricultural systems 🤣
@@psyanide1603 Never got very far, due to feeling like a grind a little too fast. I used anarchy mining sites to train basic combat just in case. No police to hit and less messy from a crime perspective. Shipwise I just got to Cobra mk III.
How you figure that? These updates clearly shows that FD still cares. They dont handle it very well, but clearly they care enough to try to fix things.
A more effective "tortuga" would be, rather than spawning a system out of expansion range of the others, simply make a permit available for one of the still-locked systems in the bubble and fill THAT system with nothing but anarchy factions. The permit lock would prevent expansion in, so the system would be permanently lawless. Alternatively, one could seed a system with 7+ native anarchy factions - since native factions can't be retreated, they'd effectively end up in a state of forever-war with themselves and lawful factions wouldn't be able to move in. Bizzarely, this almost exactly matches the lore for Riedquat in the older games: a system ruled by constantly warring criminal gangs that only ever join forces when it comes to repelling any attempt by outsiders to impose any order besides themselves. FDev missed a golden opportunity by not setting Riedquat up that way at launch.
There was a wing recruiting recently on Reddit... some front/mafia wing, a transport company, pumping up Anarchy across the bubble and letting anyone in the wing play however they want. The ad was funny.
FDev could just choose a collection of uninhabited systems within or just outside, bordering the bubble directly, and fill them with 7 native all anarchy pirate minor factions each. With 7 native factions, none of them could possibly be forced to retreat, so there will always be 7 anarchy factions; there would constantly be pirate-wars for command of the pirate-bubble, and it would also be a source of anarchy expansions into the rest of the bubble. Problem solved.
I was thinking they could add an "agent of the state" flag, which gets activated when you take a mission from the ruling faction in a given system (or maybe one of their allies), and would allow you to treat and loot non anarchy settlements associated with your mission target as though they were an anarchy settlement, regardless of the owning faction's actual type, without fines or bounties. Just during the window of the mission, and perhaps making crimes rack up 'hypothetically' while you loot, and either apply or be forgiven based on completion or failure of the mission you took?
Another possible solution would be to debuff criminal penalties based on your status with a system's ruling faction. Allied? You could get minimal fines, and only fines.. even killing could amount to a fine for you. To reign this in a bit, the crimes could still chip away at your relationship with said ruling faction, and/or apply a debuff to mission rewards (maybe based on the notoriety stat?), in particular reputation and influence rewards. Makes sense that a bad apple working for a faction might hurt their influence. (But still get paid well by them for doing their dirty work)
I'm just glad to see more people talking about the abysmal state of weapon balance and engineering grind. I am almost certain they won't at this point, but I think simply removing the weapon level system - or at least not directly tying damage to it - would be a small, but good step to take. As it stands it feels like grinding the tormentor up to level 5 is the bare minimum before actually trying to engage in on foot combat. If the weapons felt usable unupgraded, I wouldn't feel like I need to go literally murder farm to just be able to start potentially having a good time. Then maybe I could aquire the upgrade materials in a natural way instead of turning into a walking war-crime/kleptomaniac.
Solution to the material grind is really so simple: 1. Missions should pay only high grade materials, not some low grade scrap that lies around everywhere. 2. Missions should pay at least 6 and up to 18 pieces of a material, depending on threat level. Illegal missions should pay from 12 to 30. 3. Missions should have equal chance to give any type of material. Right now I mostly see data, and I've seen ionized gas as a reward only once. 4. Salvage missions should be way more lucrative for goods like ionised gas, compression-liquefied gas etc. 5. Lower the material amount needed for weapons and suit upgrades by half. 6. Trading between the same grade of materials (ie, core dynamics composites for imperial shielding) should be 1:1 exchange plus a 100 credit service fee for each transaction. That's it. No more relogging the same USS or going around anarchy settlements like the most depraved murder hobo in the Galaxy.
My suggestion for anarchy factions; if the dominant faction is non anarchy, c&p works like now, settlements track crime based on the owner. If the dominant faction IS anarchy, then settlements in that system have limited crime tracking. As you murder and steal, you acquire a bounty with that faction. HOWEVER if you leave the instance, that bounty is wiped. If you get killed by the guards, you have to pay off the bounty. If this works how my limited bgs understanding thinks it will, then anarchy systems will attract engineer farmers, but the negative bgs will be spread out to all factions present in that system, not just the anarchy settlements.
Grade 3 weapons and suits can be purchased from vendors if you can find them. That’s the only reason I even have my gear in grade 3. Low pop military and high tech systems reliably stock them. So you technically wouldn’t have to start completely over. Just at grade 3. But even 3-5 is still a pain in the ass to grind.
In a reality based universe anarchy would be far more common than most other forms of government. Especially for outer rim smaller population systems. Or, it should be that way. But Frontier fixing such things is quite unlikely. If they can't optimize their game or build a decent meaningful story driven game to begin with, they sure won't use dev resources to poke around with the BGS. Hard enough to get them to work on things that are a serious problem as it is.
I would happily do it for free. I care about elite and want to see the game become the best it can be. On top of that being on frontiers payroll would give some conflict of interest for the channel here.
on foot npc notoriety points seem to be different from in ship, about 15 minutes per npc you killed, i had one point of notoriety from killing 5 npcs and it went away in about a hour
Ok, I am not a player of Elite ( but I enjoy watching the vids) but it doesn't make sense to me that Anarchy systems can't place bounties on players. Not increasing Noteriety I get. That's like the Science Fiction equivalent of a lawful APB. But in many SF fiction properties Bounty Hunters aren't exactly Official Law Enforcement but more of a exception to the rules. So unless I am missing some over-riding in game reason ( and I probably am) I figure they could have murder in Anarchy Settlements just incur bounties but not noteriety. Whoever's running these Anarchy settlements doesn't want thier workers getting killed left and right. Anarchist or not, dead workers are bad for productivity.
I have not poked at the BGS much I admit but this does sound bad. Perhaps if 2 factions are at war you could get spec-ops raid missions at settlements. The mission involves clearing out x number of settlements owned by the opposing faction. While operating under the mission you gain lawless status only against that faction and you cannot gain notoriety fines or bounties from the opposing faction. In return the faction threats you as hostile until the mission is complete or lapses. Giving players an alternative to picking on anarchy factions. Perhaps also as an aside give factions with higher system influence more and better loot. They have more influence they can source the stuff better.
Could also create Anarchy systems by killing absolutely every single living thing, including the police force in the system, except for wanted ships. Sure it will give you a few billion in bounties but that will turn a whole system into Anarchy if it becomes a major need, especially with console coming in.
Frontier should change it's "It's not a bug, it's a feature" mentality. Most of us are constantly working around the new bugs which appear in every 2nd greater update.
Grinding is a problem. When you go to a gunshop and you want to upgrade your gun, the gunsmith does not tell you that you have to provide all the products that will be used for said upgrading. When you need to have some work done on your car, the mechanic doesn't tell you that you have to go and source all the hoses and spark plugs. When you call a plumber, the plumber doesn't make you go and buy your own pipes and fasteners. It is all just money. Take my damn legal tender and render the damn service. Sourcing all the stuff is the professionals job, not mine.
I pretty much stopped upgrading suits and weapons. The grind is awful, yes, but with mods locked forever it feels like the suits and weapons don't actually belong to me. I'd love to see a way to remove grades (remove a grade, lose a mod) AND, when doing so, get a portion of your mats for the grade and the lost mod refunded. You'd lessen the need to grind and add a path to get needed mats by downgrading items. I know ships don't do that, but ships upgrades aren't freakin' locked. Ok, maybe you have to deliver it to the engineer who has the mod for them to downgrade it and it costs massive space money. That's fine.
I like all the presented solutions and I don’t think any single solution will solve it. When you first mentioned the problem last time, naturally I thought how much does Frontier grow the bubble to compensate for BGS interactions causing unbalancing and downstream problems? But I think you explained very well why they need root-cause solutions.
o7, i'm from the anarchic faction Despair Owls, I would love to tell you how we managed to stay safe, but a Chef doesn't talk recipes in public. (Well, it has to do with a naughty background pictures on our daily BGS report, increasing interest in BGS from our pilotss by a factor of 10) CMD Raoul Bitenbois
while im sure mat farmingis the largest factor, the fact that you can't legally bounty hunt in settlements is another thing that pushes ppl to anarchy. Unless they have changed it attacking someone in a settlement wont be considered a crime however the entire settlement attacks you and it is a crime to then defend yourself.
i can stil find them all over . what bugs me is on some you still get the murger charges when getting mats when you should not if the system is anarchy
Why not have mission sets in anarchy space that when completed will expand the anarchy system almost like a comunity goal with a nice payout at the end for the risk
There are so many things that need too be reviewed and fixed in this game. The fact that everything is connected makes mistakes like this so much greater. The fact that a lot of those things are tied with the way we grind should be the sign to FDev that a true revision of what it means to progress in Elite needs to be enacted.
Don't bother replying, don't care it's just my opinion, had SC, returned the buggy mess after a couple days fixing some game breaking bugs the whole time i owned it, was enough for me
Farming should have consequences in anarchy systems. Though it wouldn't be an actual police response, a faction getting targeted should start hunting down people who farm the same faction over and over. Also, I think notoriety should go up, though slower than in a policed system. No traditional bounties would incur, but there would be a chance domeone would put out a hit on you. I would think that in an anarchy system you should be able to bounty hunt. The bounties would not be issued by a police, but more like hit contracts by a more diverse group of parties. It would counteact the mentioned lockdown and unrest states. In addition, the grind should be adressed. Recover some of the used materials, when changeing upgrades. Give more good options to get the materials.
Thanks for making this. A lot of good points well made and it's great to see this issue being talked about! One point of contention I have is with the idea of godhanding where anarchies are placed. Anarchy-supporting playergroups have been building their BGS diligently alongside all the other government types - some date back to the very beginning of the game's lifespan. While a structured Tortuga kind of idea would work for ensuring random players have immutable anarchy content available to them, it would be a cure worse than the disease for the BGSers and squadrons who've been empire building on (more or less) fair terms prior to Odyssey. I know a lot of people would sooner quit the game than have Fdev godhand their factions out to the sticks. It's limiting and challenging to develop new ideas for a game that has this much history and sunk cost, but I think where the BGS is concerned the efforts need to remain firmly rooted in balance and player agency over godhanding. We were given a modest amount of sand in this sandbox and having it taken away would be tragic. With that in mind I would personally rather see solutions like (ranging from blunt to complex, and including things you have mentioned): - Remove notoriety and reduce the material grind. - Remove the negative effects of settlement attacks on Anarchy INF and security. We don't have any security anyway, so how is it being damaged so much? - If lawful factions issue notoriety and ATR, anarchy factions should issue death marks and hitsquads. If you attack us, we attack you, seems only fair. - Add additional BGS levers for Anarchy factions who currently lack bounties and have no obvious recompense. - Add factionless "pirate" settlements that exist outside the ebb and flow of the regular BGS and can therefore be used as reliable content depots and for material gathering without throwing the balance of the player-led BGS out of whack. - Rework C&P with emphasis on the C. Currently being a criminal is just a PITA for everyone, including career criminals and anarchy supporters, people live a life of crime purely for intrinsic reasons, not because the game makes it attractive in any way. Part of the issue is that the vast majority of players have no short term incentives to work for anarchies, only long term ones they can't discern. Make piracy and smuggling fun, for example, that could go a long way on its own. Personally I think item 2: remove the negative effects of anarchy settlement assaults, at least on security state, would be the best thing to do in the short term - we need action now, and Fdev don't seem like they have the capacity to do anything more complex at this stage.
The only answer is to listen to what is actually at the root of their problems. STOP DESIGNING GRIND. It is like they know only one trick. GRIND. ENDLESS GRIND. Just earn faction with suppliers of different types of materials. After that, you just purchase them once you unlock them. If you need more later, then just go buy them. Grind kills a game. Whoever sits at the high FDev desk that keeps demanding "MORE GRIND!" is grossly incompetent. Push them down into the mail room or fire them. Then they can start putting love back into their creation.
We were just debating this in our squadron chat yesterday! And I guess unsurprisingly we have people on both sides of the issue: this needs to be fixed or EDO dies and also don't care I already did the grind.
what Frontier might also consider is restricting BGS to open play only. So if you do something in solo it just doesnt impact it. BGS in solo is a bit of a problem anyways and has always been. Because if a couple of dedicated players have decided to do CZs in solo against a faction you want to push there is nothing you can do against it than bring more ppl. That sucks. Especially in CZs because if we tarlking war have us fight directly over the victory.
I'd love to have a Pirate Bubble, like "New Nassau" rather than Tortugas Nassau was the place were the republic of Pirates born during the golden age of piracy but this is just a detail of name :D but I love the idea to have a safe heaven for the Pirates and a dangerous area for explorers. Piracy Gameplay lack of new gameplay and is not really considered by the Developpers. Or maybe I missed something but I didn't hear any new features for Piracy gameplay. They improved the mining some time ago now but Piracy there is nothing new for many years now.
There also needs to be more legal missions. Yesterday i went to do a couple missions just to check FPS after the patch and mission board had just one legal mission with materials that i need. Illegal ones tho? There was no shortage of those that for sure.
They need to remove notoriety for kills of ALL NPCs (ships and people). Bounties are enough. That or it should be a REALLY high number to incur notoriety (10 NPC ships, wipe out 3 settlements, etc.). Bounties are fine, notoriety is a pain that should be reserved for PVP run amok. Farming isn't the only problem for anarchy systems. I haven't done farming in months. I do missions. And I typically do missions in anarchy systems looking for anarchy faction targets. Even if they are lawful missions (bounty hunt), it's a hassle in lawful settlements vs. anarchy because of bounties and notoriety. I get the "immersion" reason for why the in-game legal system is the way it is. However, this is a game and ground missions are VERY different from space missions. If you have a bounty target in space, it isn't surrounded by dozens of innocent meatshields that will attack you if you take down the target. And if you return fire, now you're wanted. That or they need to fix the whole bounty hunting system. When I go somewhere, scan and NPC on the ground and pull up their bounty/wanted status, they should be fair game to kill - like flashing a badge. Bottom line: they need to do something. Otherwise, a lot of us are still going to keep targeting Anarchy factions for our MISSIONS because everywhere else is too much of hassle (maybe do it occasionally, but not regularly).
The REAL problem is the Odyssey Grind and until that is SIGNIFICANTLY nerfed I'll just stick to my store bought pre engineered items. Like my plasma shot gun with scope and extended range that took 5 min. to acquire
Not being able to remove Odyssey engineering mods is a complete perversion of the idea of fun. It's poor game design and Frontier know it because they've attempted to offset it by making some pre-upgraded suits and weapons available for purchase rather than fix the actual problem.
It is so awefull for those players that have put their time in playing the bgs. To have all their hard work destroyed! This is punishing some of Elite's most loyal players past breaking point! SHAME! Frontier... Sort it out! Give them some hope!
It's almost as if FDev haven't thought through launching Odyssey. Calling out a "DLC" that's not been thought out and implemented properly sure as shit isn't "called whining", it's called having standards that a professional game studio should be able to match with a product they are selling to us at full price as a complete DLC.
Well if you don't have a suggestion or idea on how to fix the issues it is called whining. If criticism is not constructive it should be tossed in the bin.
@@TheWeeJet Right, I forgot that as a PAYING CUSTOMER I should provide the ideas TO A PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPING STUDIO how to fix their broken incomplete DLC sold at full price. My bad.
I'm very tired to try getting ''Opinion Polls''. I did lots of run at Tourist Settlement, tried even days, just got 6 of 20 for engineer. Missions must pay this kind of DATA! I really am tired...
A soft lock out for x amount of time on a settlement is a great idea! Give them time to recover from a raid as it were would slow down the grind reset etc. One thing I never personally liked was the ability to just farm the same settlement over and over and over. With a game that evolves around realism. If frontier made it so if you raided a facility it doesn't just reset right away the system or faction or w/e needs time to get the settlement back up and going and being able to see that they are working on getting it up and going should you visit again. Basically no loot at a settlement until people have had time to bring in more loot to get it back up and going and you can get missions provided your notoriety or bounties are gone to help rebuild it with similar rewards It would slow down the massive faction changes it would increase parts grind but would also be really fun to see a settlement you just wrecked rebuilding!
I pre-purchased Odyssey and have never been able to load it from Steam. I have stuck with Horizons for the last six months and until recently have been comfortable grinding mining and trading for credits.. Frankly, I have no interest playing a game that funnels players into committing indiscriminate murder for material gain. Further, my computer is no longer cutting edge and with the graphic card shortage it might be some time before I decide to upgrade it. Seems to me that Fdev's publishers want to cash in on the first person shooter bonanza but didn't consider how it would fit into the game thematically or morally.
I wish there was way more ease of loot drop. I haven't touched the game in months, the grind, RIDICULOUS. I CAN'T EVEN BOTHER. Nerf the Oddy GRIND Frontier. Plasma repeater rifle also needs huge buff and the ability to change color of plama rounds like ship weapon colors. I would much rather dominate in this game with ship bombardments and overpowering the settlement defenses much more easily! Need a hard rebalance to increase enjoyment for all the players who have left for months.
honestly, the idea that a populated system wont investigate a mass murder, record travel traffic, and eventually, track down the perpetrator is ridiculous. If I'm flying in an unpopulated system and I find a stray mining ship, nobody is going to find me. If I set up a laboratory, I am probably recording transponders and taking pictures of the foot traffic. The grind for mats making mass murder seem like the way to go is equally unrealistic, considering that if I want a battery the people who make batteries would be happy to sell me a battery If you are in it for murder, than you probably aren't going to mind a few victims coming to collect your bounty also, yes, mod swapping is a must, what kind of engineer can't undo their own work?
I think a combination of your solutions is needed. I rarely take on missions simply because pay is meh. And I almost never take on missions for materials. I don't want to spend an hour or two of game time doing missions just for a little rep and a couple high grade mats when I need many dozens of thos mats for upgrades.
I can't find anything a bit exciting about Odyssey. At least, I am still laughing at the "Deppressor". Props to the commander who put it that name XD, I can't remember his name.
The problem is that FDEV is fundamentally broken; they either don't know how or don't care to expend the effort in actually developing gameplay. Piling on grind after grind after grind is the EASY solution, the minimal effort solution they've come up with to keep players busy so they don't have to fix their lack of game-loops. Everything FDEV has done in the last two years has been an utter embarrassment: bases that are identical everywhere you go with minor colour differences is the kind of thing you expect from a 90's-era game. The on-foot game is an early-2000's era FPS badly bolted onto a game that has always been, fundamentally, about FLYING SPACESHIPS. And the endless parade of bugs that should never have made it out the door or recur after supposedly being fixed shows lack of discipline in the coding process. When you look at what FDEV has pushed out and just how terribly it performs compared to the performance in other titles with VASTLY more complex environments, it really is showing itself to be a fundamentally amateur effort.
And you missed a point: Odyssey new gameplay is a whole new different game included inside a space ships game, with 0 synergy between pilot and fps gameplays
I agree the developers need to lighten up with all the grinding you have to do to get what you want. If Starfield turns out to be a viable option for me I may not come back to ED unless they figure out that some of us don't want a game that feels like one big endless grind.
I personally think odyssey needs a complete revamp but thats just me personally. Basically three guns, one sniper (that cant snipe mind you) one gernade launcher oh and mats/instances/gear that spawns once a week or not at all, in fact i've completely given up on ground engineers because of this, im. DONE with grinding in elite, ground is the ONE PLACE grinding shouldnt be possible its LITERALLY A STARTING POINT, you get your loaned ship and some ground kit and boom, even with level three gear all around you're still getting 1 tapped you cant go get a back pack at the store or train to increase stamina you need to do stupid shit bs to get a suppressor, you cant even get level 5 gear yet you can go out and by a PA that can destroy a city? Im sorry but WHAT the fuck is FD thinking? Hello? Are they all high? Im spending more on a suppressor in not just money but effort and time then getting a fuckin WMD!? Fuck off! on top of the fact i went from high/ultra settiniigs frunning 120fps to lowest of the low barely tapping 50 fps wtf...this is literally the worst DLC i've ever bought so far, its literally made the game worse in every way for me and im seriously pissed off especially sense its been like 6 months or more...
I had to go out into the black, it was either that or I would have quit playing Elite because of that ridiculous grind. FDeaf clearly don't believe that their game can be fun enough to keep players playing, without an endless grind. For me it does the opposite and I also stopped trying certain missions, because I have no stealthy guns for stealth missions and I'm too vulnerable anyway when I get detected. Odyssey is just a really good example of really bad game design.
Does it seem like the game is getting any better? I haven't played since alpha ended, I really got tired of all the failed landings and the fact that I could not find any materials or jobs when it relaunched. I've been thinking about getting back into it but I want to see if it's worth it first.
I wouldn't mind seeing more anarchy systems in the outer reaches of the "bubble"...and I guess further down the line they become lawful and add more anarchy system to that outer shell which would increase the size of the inhabited "bubble".
I like the anarchy doughnut around the bubble being pushed out further. Maybe even around those new megaships that Brewer is building to Colonia. You know near scoop-able stars.
#PopTheBubble
I love the tortuga idea. Here is my part:
Make the pirates take over one of the megaships along the bubble to colonia highway.
If you choose the right ship. It's both far enough from civilization and in a logical place for pirates to apear.
Maybe if we'd only get bounty/notoriety once the alarm is raised. Wich would make sense because going stealth... they should not know what hit them
The real problem here is that Ody gameplay more or less forces you to be a murderhobo. Which incidentally is why I refuse to play it.
I love the game but dont like being forced to be a criminal. The best way us to sneak and kill wanted people but restricted zones are another problem.
So is the original game if you played BGS and Powerplay around Objectives. Its the core part of the game people refuse to accept. Stop worrying about playstyle and play the game they made.
@@That90sKid no worries I slaughter my way through to get those mats. Not before I pound the settlement with dumbfires to make it a bit easier.
@@tgherman3619 haha
Agreed. I suspect there will eventually be more to do at settlements, and I hope so. Settlements look cool, I would like ways to interact with them that isn't just sneak or slaughter.
NPC Pirate Fleet Carriers. They can relocate when security gets too tough, and provide some bonus to anarchy factions within the same system and neighboring systems based upon player involvement from missions provided on the ship.
I would love a pirate haven, i have wanted that since i started playing. It could become a hub for a lot player combat interactions so there would be a lot of danger there, it would be so cool
I like Tortuga! What I miss is a non-lethal weapon. In missions in non-anarchy systems, you eventually get to a point where it's quite hard and you need a lot of patience to steal stuff. That's where it would be easier if you could take out an NPC without making any noise and without killing them.
My idea would be to modify the energy tool so that it only stuns enemies and doesn't kill them. The effects could also last only a "short" time, so you have to hurry afterwards.
But this would give you a way to get past NPCs for illegal missions.
Another thing would be to have the choice of what you get in the missions. There are also missions from NPCs where you can trade. Why not take the possibility that you can choose materials as a reward. If you go to an NPC, you can choose the material you need and the NPC will calculate how much you get. That would make the grind a little easier.
The reason there's no nonlethal weapons is because according to PEGI, if you can disable someone and then kill them, that's more heinous and more deserving of a higher rating than just murdering someone outright. Since FDev is terrified out of their minds of having a high PEGI rating, we're forced to massacre people.
Being able to change your mods is a must. I’m stressing about putting Extra Backpack on my Maverick because at some point I won’t be picking every single thing up and I’d rather use that spot for something else. Being able to put it on now and replace it later would be perfect.
That temporary utility is the reason I didn't put Extra Backpack on my Mav. Now I'm done with the EDO upgrade/engineering grind for all my gear, and I'm glad I went without it in favor of other mods.
You're gonna love Star Citizen.
@@ScottSlooper What mods did you go with? For missions/stealth I'm thinking Quieter Footsteps, Improved Jump Assist, Night Vision, and I was going to used the last spot for backpack but now I'm wondering what would be good there. Maybe sprint duration
@@BoardGameClub I use my Mav suit for raids/looting/missions and supporting my squadron when we attack military sites together. At G5 I can fight in it np. My style is maximum mobility so I outmaneuver opponents rather than tanking them, similar to the same ship fighting style. I put Quiet Footsteps, Sprint, Jump, and Night Vision on it. Dominator I only use in CZs and squadron military site attacks, and you need to decide how you're going to play and either make it a tank or a maneuver suit. My Dominator is also an outmaneuver suit with one change, I have Shield Recharge instead of Quiet Footsteps. I do not sneak anybody in CZs, and I think the Fast Recharge is better utility than Quiet Footsteps by a large margin for what I do in the Dom . IDK why a lot of people don't put Night Vision on Dom. Night Vision is vastly superior to fighting in the dark with a flashlight, for situational awareness, finding rechargers, finding targets, finding escape routes or approaches, and targeting targets at distance. There are also some good tank build approaches in Dominator. When I do the Bio Sampling I'm always hopping in and out of my SRV, so I haven't put any mods other than Sprint and Jump on my Artemis yet, and it works almost just the same, just a bit slower, totally unmodded. I think they need to do something significant to make the Artemis suit relevant, because as-is the only thing that matters about that suit that I can find is the fact it has the scanner. Making it another suit so far to me is totally unnecessary. Just make it possible to trade the cutter for the scanner on the Mav would make a lot more sense. I heard that some have figured out a way to make the Artemis suit a super mobile flying combat suit, but I haven't seen it proven better than a good build and skillful use of the Dom in combat.
@@Mortum_Rex That's my line.
An easier system would be to have a set of anarchy systems in the Bubble that always are filled up - exclusively with anarchy factions. If there is no space, no other faction could expand there. And since it is all anarchy, the controller will also always be anarchy.
Fullerene C60 is a Tourist system composed of only 3 factions. All of which are anarchy. Located a very short distance from the edge of the bubble, this essentially makes it a perma-anarchy system. If it can be done in one system, it is reasonable to say that FDev can do this for multiple systems in or around the bubble to create sort of designated locations to collect Odyssey materials. Ironically, I could see this creating an unintended centralized player activity spot similar to how Deciat became a murder site. Fitting for a system of brigands and despots.
a simple fix would be that you would NOT get a fine or bounty UNLESS another NPC saw you. getting a fine when the only guy that saw you is dead is a bit much. that would make it so you have to run more stealth, OR have to turn off the alarms first, and Kill everyone at the base so there are no witnesses .
So to complete some upgrades, you will have no choice but to become a criminal. So much for "play your way"... I played thousands of hours of Elite with no more than a few accidental crimes. I went out of my way to keep a low crime stat. This just feeds me another reason to never go back.
There are more ways to play EDO than EDH. I am a law abider in EDH and a total criminal in EDO. We have squadron members who have maintained their (mostly) lawfulness in EDO, and they are definitely grinding slower than we criminals. It's actually kind of fun!
You dont have to go to anarchy systems, ive never done that for mats. I just go to Davs hope, it isnt particularly exciting but the amount of stuff you get means that ive only ever gone there twice for a total of probably about 4 hrs
@@Noreceipts400 Dav's Hope (and sites like it) requires relogging to be used effectively. That's just silly, and something FDev should have nuked years ago.
@@Noreceipts400 This is relevent to EDO ground play, trying to do mats grind for suits and weapons. Not talking about mfg mats for ships in EDH.
@@Noreceipts400 Been there, done that... The crashed conda too... If taking advantage of a broken game mechanic and mindlessly relogging every three minutes is the most viable method for progression , I'm going to take that as another sign that it's just time to go.
The solution is simple, to affect the BGS you should play in open mode.
In this way the owners of anarchy factions can defend themselves through pvp.
This would be a major improvement for the BGS
Let players buy materials with credits (the bartender will pay you peanuts for your materials, which annoys me)
People only farm materials because getting them the intended way is too slow
Thank you for expanding on this subject. Started playing again after your other video and reading the comments.
The tortuga idea is cool and now i wish it was a thing
There is no need to do this by coding. Just allow players to do their things and Tortuga may pop up as a reality.
Of course, the bgs is so poorly designed that this will not be possible xD
an other option would be to give as a tool for stunning without counting it as murder like at the release where you could stunn some one with the overcharge energy toolm that would be awsome
Basically they need to move the things found for odyssey engineers in anarchy systems to other government groups as well...honestly would really like to see some non-fps odyssey related missions.
For the Commanders' Toolbx, how about a summary of what actions positively and negatively influence (help/hinder) an anarchy faction. Many, like myself are probably not sure of these things, not being immersed in BGS. Then the non BGS CMDRs could decide or help, hopefully.
When I played Elite as a beginner in solo space, it was safe to go to anarchy because even if you misfire, you won't be penalised as long as you win that battle. It gave an extra net of safety to a very open world. Anarchy systems could get beefier soldiers so that it is more of a pain to target and lorewise because they have access to illegal armor and weapons. You would need more than this, but it's a start.
Good idea.
Mayhap faster responses by mercenary reinforcements who are just hanging in the system itching for a fight vs lazy overworked system security who aren't getting paid enough.
When I played I'd pirate in anarchy systems, specifically anarchy agricultural systems when in ''boom'' with my Fed Corvette. Find a large hauler, interdict, knock out it's FSD, then thrusters, then as it's repairing thrusters I'd take out all but it's weakest hardpoints generally leaving a single S pulse laser which does pretty much nothing Vs my 2,800 shields with 45% thermal resistance and.... was it 5 or 6 shield cells.... either way I'd just let it shoot with that single laser while I rotate spamming hatch breakers and collection limpets, always huge hauls of low temp diamonds in agricultural systems 🤣
@@psyanide1603 Never got very far, due to feeling like a grind a little too fast. I used anarchy mining sites to train basic combat just in case. No police to hit and less messy from a crime perspective. Shipwise I just got to Cobra mk III.
I think it's pretty clear Frontier literally just does not care anymore
How you figure that? These updates clearly shows that FD still cares. They dont handle it very well, but clearly they care enough to try to fix things.
A more effective "tortuga" would be, rather than spawning a system out of expansion range of the others, simply make a permit available for one of the still-locked systems in the bubble and fill THAT system with nothing but anarchy factions. The permit lock would prevent expansion in, so the system would be permanently lawless. Alternatively, one could seed a system with 7+ native anarchy factions - since native factions can't be retreated, they'd effectively end up in a state of forever-war with themselves and lawful factions wouldn't be able to move in. Bizzarely, this almost exactly matches the lore for Riedquat in the older games: a system ruled by constantly warring criminal gangs that only ever join forces when it comes to repelling any attempt by outsiders to impose any order besides themselves. FDev missed a golden opportunity by not setting Riedquat up that way at launch.
There was a wing recruiting recently on Reddit... some front/mafia wing, a transport company, pumping up Anarchy across the bubble and letting anyone in the wing play however they want. The ad was funny.
FDev could just choose a collection of uninhabited systems within or just outside, bordering the bubble directly, and fill them with 7 native all anarchy pirate minor factions each. With 7 native factions, none of them could possibly be forced to retreat, so there will always be 7 anarchy factions; there would constantly be pirate-wars for command of the pirate-bubble, and it would also be a source of anarchy expansions into the rest of the bubble. Problem solved.
What if we can pay bounties off while having notoriety, but the notoriety will be a multiplier for how much you have to pay to be clean again?
Not a bad idea to be honest.
if the notoriety does not go down after a few hours, this can be huge. And is a solution very easy to implement
Yes! Welcome to the Fringe Worlds. Anarchy outside the bubble!
What about and hear me out this.... we get rid of the ludicrous grind and have something fun.
I was thinking they could add an "agent of the state" flag, which gets activated when you take a mission from the ruling faction in a given system (or maybe one of their allies), and would allow you to treat and loot non anarchy settlements associated with your mission target as though they were an anarchy settlement, regardless of the owning faction's actual type, without fines or bounties. Just during the window of the mission, and perhaps making crimes rack up 'hypothetically' while you loot, and either apply or be forgiven based on completion or failure of the mission you took?
Another possible solution would be to debuff criminal penalties based on your status with a system's ruling faction. Allied? You could get minimal fines, and only fines.. even killing could amount to a fine for you. To reign this in a bit, the crimes could still chip away at your relationship with said ruling faction, and/or apply a debuff to mission rewards (maybe based on the notoriety stat?), in particular reputation and influence rewards. Makes sense that a bad apple working for a faction might hurt their influence. (But still get paid well by them for doing their dirty work)
I'm just glad to see more people talking about the abysmal state of weapon balance and engineering grind.
I am almost certain they won't at this point, but I think simply removing the weapon level system - or at least not directly tying damage to it - would be a small, but good step to take. As it stands it feels like grinding the tormentor up to level 5 is the bare minimum before actually trying to engage in on foot combat. If the weapons felt usable unupgraded, I wouldn't feel like I need to go literally murder farm to just be able to start potentially having a good time. Then maybe I could aquire the upgrade materials in a natural way instead of turning into a walking war-crime/kleptomaniac.
Solution to the material grind is really so simple:
1. Missions should pay only high grade materials, not some low grade scrap that lies around everywhere.
2. Missions should pay at least 6 and up to 18 pieces of a material, depending on threat level. Illegal missions should pay from 12 to 30.
3. Missions should have equal chance to give any type of material. Right now I mostly see data, and I've seen ionized gas as a reward only once.
4. Salvage missions should be way more lucrative for goods like ionised gas, compression-liquefied gas etc.
5. Lower the material amount needed for weapons and suit upgrades by half.
6. Trading between the same grade of materials (ie, core dynamics composites for imperial shielding) should be 1:1 exchange plus a 100 credit service fee for each transaction.
That's it. No more relogging the same USS or going around anarchy settlements like the most depraved murder hobo in the Galaxy.
My suggestion for anarchy factions; if the dominant faction is non anarchy, c&p works like now, settlements track crime based on the owner. If the dominant faction IS anarchy, then settlements in that system have limited crime tracking. As you murder and steal, you acquire a bounty with that faction. HOWEVER if you leave the instance, that bounty is wiped. If you get killed by the guards, you have to pay off the bounty.
If this works how my limited bgs understanding thinks it will, then anarchy systems will attract engineer farmers, but the negative bgs will be spread out to all factions present in that system, not just the anarchy settlements.
Grade 3 weapons and suits can be purchased from vendors if you can find them. That’s the only reason I even have my gear in grade 3. Low pop military and high tech systems reliably stock them. So you technically wouldn’t have to start completely over. Just at grade 3. But even 3-5 is still a pain in the ass to grind.
Maybe non-anarchy settlements should have better loot/rng, to reward stealth over shooting everyone
A laser wont break a maglock. It's an electro-magnet. You have to cut the power source.
In a reality based universe anarchy would be far more common than most other forms of government. Especially for outer rim smaller population systems. Or, it should be that way. But Frontier fixing such things is quite unlikely. If they can't optimize their game or build a decent meaningful story driven game to begin with, they sure won't use dev resources to poke around with the BGS. Hard enough to get them to work on things that are a serious problem as it is.
FDEV should hire you as a consultant. And Yamiks
I would happily do it for free. I care about elite and want to see the game become the best it can be.
On top of that being on frontiers payroll would give some conflict of interest for the channel here.
@@DowntoEarthAstronomy You are a gentleman my friend.
Thanks!! i never know this, i guess I have to finish the handbook it quite a reading
on foot npc notoriety points seem to be different from in ship, about 15 minutes per npc you killed, i had one point of notoriety from killing 5 npcs and it went away in about a hour
Man that beard grew back fast!..
I like the Tortuga idea, Pirate safe haven.
Ok, I am not a player of Elite ( but I enjoy watching the vids) but it doesn't make sense to me that Anarchy systems can't place bounties on players.
Not increasing Noteriety I get. That's like the Science Fiction equivalent of a lawful APB. But in many SF fiction properties Bounty Hunters aren't exactly Official Law Enforcement but more of a exception to the rules.
So unless I am missing some over-riding in game reason ( and I probably am) I figure they could have murder in Anarchy Settlements just incur bounties but not noteriety.
Whoever's running these Anarchy settlements doesn't want thier workers getting killed left and right. Anarchist or not, dead workers are bad for productivity.
I have not poked at the BGS much I admit but this does sound bad. Perhaps if 2 factions are at war you could get spec-ops raid missions at settlements. The mission involves clearing out x number of settlements owned by the opposing faction.
While operating under the mission you gain lawless status only against that faction and you cannot gain notoriety fines or bounties from the opposing faction. In return the faction threats you as hostile until the mission is complete or lapses. Giving players an alternative to picking on anarchy factions.
Perhaps also as an aside give factions with higher system influence more and better loot. They have more influence they can source the stuff better.
I agree 100% anarchy systems around the bubble would be awesome I would love to be able to spread the feudal system out there lol
Could also create Anarchy systems by killing absolutely every single living thing, including the police force in the system, except for wanted ships. Sure it will give you a few billion in bounties but that will turn a whole system into Anarchy if it becomes a major need, especially with console coming in.
Frontier should change it's "It's not a bug, it's a feature" mentality. Most of us are constantly working around the new bugs which appear in every 2nd greater update.
Grinding is a problem. When you go to a gunshop and you want to upgrade your gun, the gunsmith does not tell you that you have to provide all the products that will be used for said upgrading. When you need to have some work done on your car, the mechanic doesn't tell you that you have to go and source all the hoses and spark plugs. When you call a plumber, the plumber doesn't make you go and buy your own pipes and fasteners. It is all just money. Take my damn legal tender and render the damn service. Sourcing all the stuff is the professionals job, not mine.
I pretty much stopped upgrading suits and weapons. The grind is awful, yes, but with mods locked forever it feels like the suits and weapons don't actually belong to me. I'd love to see a way to remove grades (remove a grade, lose a mod) AND, when doing so, get a portion of your mats for the grade and the lost mod refunded. You'd lessen the need to grind and add a path to get needed mats by downgrading items. I know ships don't do that, but ships upgrades aren't freakin' locked. Ok, maybe you have to deliver it to the engineer who has the mod for them to downgrade it and it costs massive space money. That's fine.
I like all the presented solutions and I don’t think any single solution will solve it. When you first mentioned the problem last time, naturally I thought how much does Frontier grow the bubble to compensate for BGS interactions causing unbalancing and downstream problems? But I think you explained very well why they need root-cause solutions.
I never went to Anarchy systems for my upgrades I just did missions and powered down bases. Guess I was doing it wrong
Space Tortuga. Sounds amazing!
Oh I really like the space pirates idea. Could be an entire mini expansion.
o7, i'm from the anarchic faction Despair Owls, I would love to tell you how we managed to stay safe, but a Chef doesn't talk recipes in public. (Well, it has to do with a naughty background pictures on our daily BGS report, increasing interest in BGS from our pilotss by a factor of 10)
CMD Raoul Bitenbois
Listening to this 5 months later but a pirate "bubble" would be amazing, plus everyone agrees engineering should be able to be changed.
while im sure mat farmingis the largest factor, the fact that you can't legally bounty hunt in settlements is another thing that pushes ppl to anarchy. Unless they have changed it attacking someone in a settlement wont be considered a crime however the entire settlement attacks you and it is a crime to then defend yourself.
i can stil find them all over . what bugs me is on some you still get the murger charges when getting mats when you should not if the system is anarchy
Why not have mission sets in anarchy space that when completed will expand the anarchy system almost like a comunity goal with a nice payout at the end for the risk
Increasing the drop rate of things like opinion polls and smear campaigns would help too.
There are so many things that need too be reviewed and fixed in this game. The fact that everything is connected makes mistakes like this so much greater.
The fact that a lot of those things are tied with the way we grind should be the sign to FDev that a true revision of what it means to progress in Elite needs to be enacted.
All games are grinds.
@@teranmm agreed, but not like this one
@@trevor2213 true, at the time I made that comment I didn’t know about the inability to overwrite engineering mods for odyssey. That shit is dumb.
Hopefully they'll fix these issues, star citizen might be a viable option in about another 6 or 7 years there's time
Don't bother replying, don't care it's just my opinion, had SC, returned the buggy mess after a couple days fixing some game breaking bugs the whole time i owned it, was enough for me
Farming should have consequences in anarchy systems. Though it wouldn't be an actual police response, a faction getting targeted should start hunting down people who farm the same faction over and over. Also, I think notoriety should go up, though slower than in a policed system. No traditional bounties would incur, but there would be a chance domeone would put out a hit on you.
I would think that in an anarchy system you should be able to bounty hunt. The bounties would not be issued by a police, but more like hit contracts by a more diverse group of parties. It would counteact the mentioned lockdown and unrest states.
In addition, the grind should be adressed. Recover some of the used materials, when changeing upgrades. Give more good options to get the materials.
Plenty of anarchy systems outside the bubble. time to expand outwards
Thanks for making this. A lot of good points well made and it's great to see this issue being talked about!
One point of contention I have is with the idea of godhanding where anarchies are placed. Anarchy-supporting playergroups have been building their BGS diligently alongside all the other government types - some date back to the very beginning of the game's lifespan. While a structured Tortuga kind of idea would work for ensuring random players have immutable anarchy content available to them, it would be a cure worse than the disease for the BGSers and squadrons who've been empire building on (more or less) fair terms prior to Odyssey.
I know a lot of people would sooner quit the game than have Fdev godhand their factions out to the sticks. It's limiting and challenging to develop new ideas for a game that has this much history and sunk cost, but I think where the BGS is concerned the efforts need to remain firmly rooted in balance and player agency over godhanding. We were given a modest amount of sand in this sandbox and having it taken away would be tragic.
With that in mind I would personally rather see solutions like (ranging from blunt to complex, and including things you have mentioned):
- Remove notoriety and reduce the material grind.
- Remove the negative effects of settlement attacks on Anarchy INF and security. We don't have any security anyway, so how is it being damaged so much?
- If lawful factions issue notoriety and ATR, anarchy factions should issue death marks and hitsquads. If you attack us, we attack you, seems only fair.
- Add additional BGS levers for Anarchy factions who currently lack bounties and have no obvious recompense.
- Add factionless "pirate" settlements that exist outside the ebb and flow of the regular BGS and can therefore be used as reliable content depots and for material gathering without throwing the balance of the player-led BGS out of whack.
- Rework C&P with emphasis on the C. Currently being a criminal is just a PITA for everyone, including career criminals and anarchy supporters, people live a life of crime purely for intrinsic reasons, not because the game makes it attractive in any way.
Part of the issue is that the vast majority of players have no short term incentives to work for anarchies, only long term ones they can't discern. Make piracy and smuggling fun, for example, that could go a long way on its own.
Personally I think item 2: remove the negative effects of anarchy settlement assaults, at least on security state, would be the best thing to do in the short term - we need action now, and Fdev don't seem like they have the capacity to do anything more complex at this stage.
The only answer is to listen to what is actually at the root of their problems. STOP DESIGNING GRIND. It is like they know only one trick. GRIND. ENDLESS GRIND. Just earn faction with suppliers of different types of materials. After that, you just purchase them once you unlock them. If you need more later, then just go buy them. Grind kills a game. Whoever sits at the high FDev desk that keeps demanding "MORE GRIND!" is grossly incompetent. Push them down into the mail room or fire them. Then they can start putting love back into their creation.
Make the player factions who are dedicated to getting rid of anarchy systems famous.
So death doesn't reset notoriety? How do gankers respawn then?
Any BGS player hostile to an anarchy player faction: write that down, WRITE THAT DOWN!!!
We were just debating this in our squadron chat yesterday! And I guess unsurprisingly we have people on both sides of the issue: this needs to be fixed or EDO dies and also don't care I already did the grind.
what Frontier might also consider is restricting BGS to open play only. So if you do something in solo it just doesnt impact it. BGS in solo is a bit of a problem anyways and has always been. Because if a couple of dedicated players have decided to do CZs in solo against a faction you want to push there is nothing you can do against it than bring more ppl. That sucks. Especially in CZs because if we tarlking war have us fight directly over the victory.
I'd love to have a Pirate Bubble, like "New Nassau" rather than Tortugas Nassau was the place were the republic of Pirates born during the golden age of piracy but this is just a detail of name :D but I love the idea to have a safe heaven for the Pirates and a dangerous area for explorers. Piracy Gameplay lack of new gameplay and is not really considered by the Developpers. Or maybe I missed something but I didn't hear any new features for Piracy gameplay. They improved the mining some time ago now but Piracy there is nothing new for many years now.
There also needs to be more legal missions. Yesterday i went to do a couple missions just to check FPS after the patch and mission board had just one legal mission with materials that i need. Illegal ones tho? There was no shortage of those that for sure.
They need to remove notoriety for kills of ALL NPCs (ships and people). Bounties are enough. That or it should be a REALLY high number to incur notoriety (10 NPC ships, wipe out 3 settlements, etc.). Bounties are fine, notoriety is a pain that should be reserved for PVP run amok.
Farming isn't the only problem for anarchy systems. I haven't done farming in months. I do missions. And I typically do missions in anarchy systems looking for anarchy faction targets. Even if they are lawful missions (bounty hunt), it's a hassle in lawful settlements vs. anarchy because of bounties and notoriety.
I get the "immersion" reason for why the in-game legal system is the way it is. However, this is a game and ground missions are VERY different from space missions. If you have a bounty target in space, it isn't surrounded by dozens of innocent meatshields that will attack you if you take down the target. And if you return fire, now you're wanted.
That or they need to fix the whole bounty hunting system. When I go somewhere, scan and NPC on the ground and pull up their bounty/wanted status, they should be fair game to kill - like flashing a badge.
Bottom line: they need to do something. Otherwise, a lot of us are still going to keep targeting Anarchy factions for our MISSIONS because everywhere else is too much of hassle (maybe do it occasionally, but not regularly).
The REAL problem is the Odyssey Grind and until that is SIGNIFICANTLY nerfed I'll just stick to my store bought pre engineered items. Like my plasma shot gun with scope and extended range that took 5 min. to acquire
Not being able to remove Odyssey engineering mods is a complete perversion of the idea of fun. It's poor game design and Frontier know it because they've attempted to offset it by making some pre-upgraded suits and weapons available for purchase rather than fix the actual problem.
It is so awefull for those players that have put their time in playing the bgs. To have all their hard work destroyed! This is punishing some of Elite's most loyal players past breaking point! SHAME! Frontier... Sort it out! Give them some hope!
It's almost as if FDev haven't thought through launching Odyssey. Calling out a "DLC" that's not been thought out and implemented properly sure as shit isn't "called whining", it's called having standards that a professional game studio should be able to match with a product they are selling to us at full price as a complete DLC.
Yup, it seems that they are constantly improvising since they delivered a really bad product thinking that no one will notice.
Well if you don't have a suggestion or idea on how to fix the issues it is called whining.
If criticism is not constructive it should be tossed in the bin.
@@TheWeeJet Right, I forgot that as a PAYING CUSTOMER I should provide the ideas TO A PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPING STUDIO how to fix their broken incomplete DLC sold at full price. My bad.
I'm very tired to try getting ''Opinion Polls''. I did lots of run at Tourist Settlement, tried even days, just got 6 of 20 for engineer. Missions must pay this kind of DATA! I really am tired...
This video is a year old now. Has anything changed in the game to help out anarchy systems? I still see lots of them on the galaxy map......
need to get rid of the materials that have no purpose would help
A soft lock out for x amount of time on a settlement is a great idea! Give them time to recover from a raid as it were would slow down the grind reset etc. One thing I never personally liked was the ability to just farm the same settlement over and over and over. With a game that evolves around realism. If frontier made it so if you raided a facility it doesn't just reset right away the system or faction or w/e needs time to get the settlement back up and going and being able to see that they are working on getting it up and going should you visit again. Basically no loot at a settlement until people have had time to bring in more loot to get it back up and going and you can get missions provided your notoriety or bounties are gone to help rebuild it with similar rewards It would slow down the massive faction changes it would increase parts grind but would also be really fun to see a settlement you just wrecked rebuilding!
Wait what?????? How the heck are they taking anarchy out??? Are they gonna put police spawn point in every system?
Dev's need to make lawful effective way to farm material. Go your own way...as long as your way is serial killer and robbery.
So much for ''personal narrative'' huh.
the grind wall keeps me from playing...
Your suggestions for solutions are very logical. Thus, your application to work at Fdev has been denied.
I pre-purchased Odyssey and have never been able to load it from Steam. I have stuck with Horizons for the last six months and until recently have been comfortable grinding mining and trading for credits.. Frankly, I have no interest playing a game that funnels players into committing indiscriminate murder for material gain. Further, my computer is no longer cutting edge and with the graphic card shortage it might be some time before I decide to upgrade it. Seems to me that Fdev's publishers want to cash in on the first person shooter bonanza but didn't consider how it would fit into the game thematically or morally.
I wish there was way more ease of loot drop. I haven't touched the game in months, the grind, RIDICULOUS. I CAN'T EVEN BOTHER. Nerf the Oddy GRIND Frontier. Plasma repeater rifle also needs huge buff and the ability to change color of plama rounds like ship weapon colors. I would much rather dominate in this game with ship bombardments and overpowering the settlement defenses much more easily! Need a hard rebalance to increase enjoyment for all the players who have left for months.
Back to square one grind is elite dangerous working as intended.
Of course, save the anarchyst because now they're important :)
I just never bought Odyssey. Win-Win!
honestly, the idea that a populated system wont investigate a mass murder, record travel traffic, and eventually, track down the perpetrator is ridiculous. If I'm flying in an unpopulated system and I find a stray mining ship, nobody is going to find me. If I set up a laboratory, I am probably recording transponders and taking pictures of the foot traffic.
The grind for mats making mass murder seem like the way to go is equally unrealistic, considering that if I want a battery the people who make batteries would be happy to sell me a battery
If you are in it for murder, than you probably aren't going to mind a few victims coming to collect your bounty
also, yes, mod swapping is a must, what kind of engineer can't undo their own work?
I would like to see them get rid of notoriety or reduce it On odyssey settlements.
Guess ima only come back after they allow mod changing >
Great stuff Astro! Thanks for helping to sound the alarm. Hope FDev starts hearing the alarm soon though...
I wouldn't be surprised if they cancel console at this point
I think a combination of your solutions is needed. I rarely take on missions simply because pay is meh. And I almost never take on missions for materials. I don't want to spend an hour or two of game time doing missions just for a little rep and a couple high grade mats when I need many dozens of thos mats for upgrades.
I can't find anything a bit exciting about Odyssey. At least, I am still laughing at the "Deppressor". Props to the commander who put it that name XD, I can't remember his name.
The problem is that FDEV is fundamentally broken; they either don't know how or don't care to expend the effort in actually developing gameplay. Piling on grind after grind after grind is the EASY solution, the minimal effort solution they've come up with to keep players busy so they don't have to fix their lack of game-loops.
Everything FDEV has done in the last two years has been an utter embarrassment: bases that are identical everywhere you go with minor colour differences is the kind of thing you expect from a 90's-era game. The on-foot game is an early-2000's era FPS badly bolted onto a game that has always been, fundamentally, about FLYING SPACESHIPS. And the endless parade of bugs that should never have made it out the door or recur after supposedly being fixed shows lack of discipline in the coding process. When you look at what FDEV has pushed out and just how terribly it performs compared to the performance in other titles with VASTLY more complex environments, it really is showing itself to be a fundamentally amateur effort.
The games dead right now.
And you missed a point: Odyssey new gameplay is a whole new different game included inside a space ships game, with 0 synergy between pilot and fps gameplays
I agree the developers need to lighten up with all the grinding you have to do to get what you want. If Starfield turns out to be a viable option for me I may not come back to ED unless they figure out that some of us don't want a game that feels like one big endless grind.
I personally think odyssey needs a complete revamp but thats just me personally. Basically three guns, one sniper (that cant snipe mind you) one gernade launcher oh and mats/instances/gear that spawns once a week or not at all, in fact i've completely given up on ground engineers because of this, im. DONE with grinding in elite, ground is the ONE PLACE grinding shouldnt be possible its LITERALLY A STARTING POINT, you get your loaned ship and some ground kit and boom, even with level three gear all around you're still getting 1 tapped you cant go get a back pack at the store or train to increase stamina you need to do stupid shit bs to get a suppressor, you cant even get level 5 gear yet you can go out and by a PA that can destroy a city? Im sorry but WHAT the fuck is FD thinking? Hello? Are they all high? Im spending more on a suppressor in not just money but effort and time then getting a fuckin WMD!? Fuck off! on top of the fact i went from high/ultra settiniigs frunning 120fps to lowest of the low barely tapping 50 fps wtf...this is literally the worst DLC i've ever bought so far, its literally made the game worse in every way for me and im seriously pissed off especially sense its been like 6 months or more...
I had to go out into the black, it was either that or I would have quit playing Elite because of that ridiculous grind. FDeaf clearly don't believe that their game can be fun enough to keep players playing, without an endless grind. For me it does the opposite and I also stopped trying certain missions, because I have no stealthy guns for stealth missions and I'm too vulnerable anyway when I get detected. Odyssey is just a really good example of really bad game design.
Does it seem like the game is getting any better? I haven't played since alpha ended, I really got tired of all the failed landings and the fact that I could not find any materials or jobs when it relaunched. I've been thinking about getting back into it but I want to see if it's worth it first.