30 years ago I trained my dog to compete in Obedience Trials and NEVER gave him a treat! We had a bond in that he wanted to please me and we were an actual team. I could take my dog anywhere, off leash and he behaved. I used positive reinforcement with praise, voice commands and consistency. THAT is how dogs were trained. No one used food to train a dog! Now it seems that every trainer uses food and weird gadgetry like "clickers." I am getting a new puppy and I want my dog to obey me out of love and eagerness, not by bribery or gimmicks. Nice to see this video that actually makes sense and is "old school". BTW, I didn't bribe my kids either and I have two great adult children.
My first dog was not trained with treats. Best dog in the world. Newfoundland GSD mix from SPCA. Off leash and adored me and I adored him. Max was an SPCA find too, 14 years later and we are advised to train with treats. I did but mostly for “trick” training and introducing “find it” games for him to use his nose to find something. Now at 18 months old he doesn’t need treats to listen but I do keep some on me I suppose out of habit. Two different dogs, with different energy levels and temperaments but they both turned out pretty incredible. Just I spent a lot more money buying treats for Max 😂 😮
Finally I find what I am looking for. Dogs get free room and board. They like any member of the family have chores to do. Most dogs want to work. Pleasing the family is it's job. I didn't give my GSD a treat until he was 4ish. When I did I never gave it as a reward. I did it because I loved him. The same reason why his recall was absolute. He did it for love.
I love that. He did it for love. That is how it should be and many dog owners don't understand it or don't try to figure it out. Thank you for the feedback.
the historical context makes total sense to me! i'm a first time dog parent and have never treat-trained. we just do life together and work on our communication constantly. one interesting thing is that is my dog "disobeys", she usually has a logical reason, like she's focused on protecting me when there's a threat I can't see or hear! such a good girl.
I’ve just found this very good video, and decided to add a comment. Treats may have their place in extreme cases. But surely positive reinforcement refers to praise, patting and playtime! Many years ago I trained my English Springer Spaniel to a very high level without treats, it took quite a while as this breed is more easily distracted than some others, but we succeeded. After she passed away I took my next Springer Spaniel to classes, as the distractions during training are a good thing to get used to. But the same training club now only trained with treats. I decided to keep an open mind and gave it a go. It was a useless method, as my dog was so distracted with the prospect of a treat that she paid absolutely no attention to where she was going while at a heel command. Then when we got to the park and I gave her the free time command, she never left my side and kept looking for the treat. This is not normal for a breed that is naturally very very interested in checking out the smells all around her. I believe using treats is just to speed the training process. Everybody wants fast results. I would rather learn how to get a dog (or any animal for that matter) more interested in what I’m saying and doing, than my commands being something that are a by-product of food.
That is an amazing testimony. Thank you for sharing that with us. I see the similar experience many times when I head to the parks and I see dogs staring either into their owners pocket or hand that is holding food or even a stick or a ball.
I use bribery sometimes. Only if I really need to. If the run somewhere and I need them to come back and things like that and calling them isn't working I will yell "cookie" and they will rush over. Sometimes bribery is your best option.
I’m not even sure treats are ‘fast’. Nowadays it’s typical to put a dog directly on a harness and expect them to walk by holding a treat where you want them to be, over and over-you need thousands of treats! 8:21 A slip collar and commands gets the job done in no time at all-but some think that’s no better than a ‘cruel’ prong collar. Eye roll.
I am a truly believer that dogs as pets and their human companions and friends have to relate entirely by creating bonds of love, obedience, intelligence and dedication to each other. By saying this, your opposition on the “food as treats” approach to the “so called obedience training”, is the right way to raise an emotional, balance dog as a pet. I am extremely lucky I came across with your channel as my husband and I, just got a Shitzu puppy, 2 months old and needed to understand better how to bond with him without “food treats”. Thanks. We’ll follow your wisdom.
Great. There are lots of content on my channel for you to watch and learn to improve your relationship with your dog. Feel free to browse and ask questions.
Even with a treat or reward system training, the goal is to eventually wean them off the treats. The point was never the treats and to actually provide play as reinforcement at the end of each training. But many people forget this part or leave it up to the pet parents to decide. Giving them different rewards such as toys, praise and touch are used as effective ways to encourage a strong bond in positive training. The right trainer will teach this way. The dog will love doing the work when being with you is rewarding on its own. All good things take time.
my dad has for the last few years been helping me learn how to train dogs (im 14) and we recently got our second rescue. hes a lab german shorthair cross. and we dont use treats, i never really understood why because most trainers ive talked to or watched encouraged treat training. so ive been researching and it all makes sense now! thank you for explaining it so clearly.
yes, it makes perfect sense......i never liked the idea of "bribing" a dog with food, and since my Akbash is not food motivated, i was feeling it was about hopeless to get him to come when i called.......BUT....i noticed that when he sees me pick up his leash......that motivates him to come to me, better than any food treat!
You plus leash means walk which is a perfect interaction for your dog which means the best reward for your dog as I explained in my new video. ua-cam.com/video/Vn6effmJjVw/v-deo.html
Excellent point! I've always thought that dogs motivated by food can also be motivated by a burglar offering a steak. So much for loyalty! I've never used treats when training my dogs. When I see dogs "behaving" in Obedience Competitions--and always looking for their treat--I'm not at all impressed. Thanks for your message!
I'm not a specialist in dogs, and now I have a female husky that is 9 months old, and I tried and still trying to know the best way to raise her and train her because she can be very stubborn at times. What you are saying makes complete sense, because dogs are basically beast babies, like human babies. They can have different personalities and charactaraistics and that means different upraoches. My dog for example is crazy active and all the she wants most the times in cool days and cool evenings is to play and run. And she loves her stomach so much. Food is a priority for her still. In most cases. And that huge attachment to loving to swallow and eat makes it even harder to make her focused. I learned sofar that she needs a few things to behave. As you said easy yet hard. Like being fed properly and have variety of options. Also like spending physical efforts with me and around me and my family, she is extremely social, yet too hyper. She also needs emotional bond, like praise, like assurance that she is allowed to do certain things, without feelings not sure about what's OK and what's not. She needs to be around me without having to do anything together. My presence when she is in these period at the day where she just needs to sit and chew somethin, like stuffed toys, which are her best toys. She likes it when she chews on them when I'm sitting around. She also needs to be praise, verbally or by patting her. Although she doesn't accept still a lot of physical contact which I respect, she comes for short cuddles or brief tummy rubs. I don't totally agree that we should praise them with food, as you said, because I also noticed, that treating her as soon as she does what I ask for, turns her into a treat freak, she would do anthying possible or not possible to get her treat, and as soon as she realizes that the treats are over she can totally ignore me or ignore the game that we playing. Which makes her look very egoistic maybe. I share my treats that she can eat with her. I share my big portions with her.. We often eat certain things together as a matter of fun of her and a matter of building a real bond with her, especially on the days when I don't want to over eat. Sharing is caring I guess, and she eats so politely when this happens because she learned that I eat a bite and then I give her the bite size that I want her to eat, and usually she gets the bigger half. and that doesn't happen when I know she is hungry. because treating hunger and just snacking, ,if I can use that word for a dog, are completely two different things that surely need different approaches. when i actually give her her actual meals, I let her eat alone, at her own pace or tension over a meal. I let her in peace. I might be around but I don't interrupt her. yes dogs' use changed and yes we need to remember why they exist, but at the same time we need to make them know and feel like family with us and that we are family to them. Again treating her too often makes her less focused on the situation, and more on the food. thanks, maybe you are right. I need to see more of your videos and it's good to see how your dogs behave. because actual successful examples are the best in the world . thanks for your time and efforts and your passion about dogs is obvious.
Thank you for your comment. Please take the time to watch my videos and learn as much as you can. My approach to dog training is very different so, you may find new way to help you raise your puppy.
I really do agree that treats should not be used to train a dog. I have a 4 month old puppy and we are struggling with training because she won’t listen unless I have treats. I want to change this asap! I want to try your methods before she gets too much older.
It is so much easier and much more fun than you think to train a dog without treats. It is simple as long as you understand the core secret of dog training which I have explained in this short video. ua-cam.com/video/-sNQ-mtVVuA/v-deo.html
We have an 8 year old Labradoodle. Never used treats for her. She did what we asked and that was it! BUT now we have an Australian Labradoodle that is very Alpha. Decided to stop using treats and we will see how we progress. Liked this video and will definitely will go in this direction. Thank you
The hardest part is the mindset. I am doing a free webinar about no treat dog training which you are welcome to join. Here is how to registrar. sarodogtraining.com/notreatdogtrainingwebinar/
I totally agree about training without treats. I don't know how to do it, that is why I am here, so thank you. All creatures react to positive reinforcement, which equals love.
Very helpful! I knew there must be something out there like this! We have a 12 week old retriever named Cooper and I am trying to train him. Everywhere I go, people tell me he needs treats and I’m disgusted. Surely there must be a better way!!
Unfortunately, that is the reality of dog training these days. All dog owners, dog trainers and professionals are addicted to treats and can not do anything without it. If you are series about learning how to train your retriever without the use of treats, you are welcome to join one of my online programs. sarodogtraining.com/
Thank you for sharing this HELPFUL information! The treat system looked so concerning and is probably for people that have the desire to control every move (the over thinkers, the obsessed). It just seems like we as humans just complicate the simplest form of communication. So grateful there are others out there that don't agree with Pavlov's ignorance to animal behavior including his.
Thank you for your feedback. That is a great observation and point of view that you make. Dogs are simple animals and we can have simple and pure relationships with each other but we make it complicated because we don' spend enough time to just BE. Pavlov's study was basically for digestion and not related to dogs or dog training.
Using of treats is actually developed rather for us humans, because it gives us a trick how to simplify understanding of our dog, versus to bond in a real and deep way with him/her so that the dog will want to obey and serve us! Dogs in my teenage years (I am originally from Poland) learned to obey me and some of my family members because they loved us over everything!
Yes, it is possible to train dogs without treats. The problem is that most dog owners start training their dogs with treats and then realize that it didn't work or they didn't need the treats but now, both the dog and the dog owner are dependent on the treats.
Is there a difference between treats and their regular food during training? I've been hand feeding my little 10 week old, 3 pound Havanese puppy all of his meals piece by piece as he does what I tell him to do: sit, down, spin, etc. I feel like in a sense this is him working for his food like you mentioned dogs have done for hundreds of years. It's obvious to me that he's "listening" to me b/c I'm holding his meal in my hands. I can also report that he will sit on my command without food now. However, some of the harder commands are not performed without food. I've noticed as he's getting full his attention on my commands fades and he looks around for a toy. So I see your point there! I enjoy feeding him instead of just him devowering his food out of a bowl. I'm excited to watch more of your no-treat training videos. Thanks!
You are very welcome. These are great points that you brought up and also these are some of the common issues dog owners who use treats or food to train their dogs face. In my opinion, we shouldn't bother dogs with their food or treats. It is their time to enjoy and eat their food. They don't have to work while eating the food. The work should be done before eating, if the dog has to work. The other point is that when you use food to train dogs, they don't focus on the task that you are teaching. They focus on the food and finally, the food or the treats need to be used precisely at the right second or faded out from being used earlier than many dog owners do.
Not to take away anything from this guy, he seems like a very knowledgeable dog trainer, but he has his niche/audience/target dog-handler demographic. What I have learned in the dog training world, is that any two dog trainers will agree on is that the third trainer is doing it wrong. What I have learned throughout a lifetime, is that there a many, many, successful methods to dog training, that all will achieve the same end. There aren’t absolutes in dog training. It’s almost like martial arts, there isn’t one fighting style that is above all, they all have their purpose and audience. The key to do training is using what works best for the dog and handler and recognizing these needs and adapting. If a method works for you and you and your dog are happy, do it. No matter what any third party or trainer says. If something doesn’t work, don’t give up and try something different.
Treat trained dogs are conpleting tasks with "honesty" they are doing it for the entire sake of the treat. Not exactly for you. Thus there is a perso ality disconnect. If you treat train a dog for years. Then randomly stop mire so then not theyll stop responding as much or as accurately and sometimes even out right refuse to listen.
Veteran dog trainer Ross Allan (Australian) noted that training with treats was also present during the 1st industrial revolution in some western countries, in early 1800s, (most likely for the same reason - working dogs lost jobs or owners moved to cities). Using treats in training comes in and goes out of fashion over the years, but it never produces lasting results. It is a form hyper-active training, together with use of toys, tugs, etc. to over-stimulate distressed dog that has no proper leader, or to distract an over-anxious dog. A method to somehow approach a distressed/anxious dog (via his stomach), is not the way to approach all dogs.
I like the idea of play and praise and bonding with my beagle. The problem is teaching her how to do the commands I want her to do. Example with sit, using treat and moving it above her head. Her head goes back her rump goes down. The only think I can think to do is the old fashion way of putting a hand on her rump and gently pushing down u til she sits then saying "YES" and praising her. Playing when starting out doesn't work very well because she wants to keep the stuffed bear and not give it back.
Great questions. So, the behaviour that your beagle is giving you (she wants to keep the stuffed bear and not give it back) is part of the play session. So, you start with a play session and then once the brain is stimulated, you start with the training. NOw, the toy does not have as much as value that it had before but yet it is a great motivator. You will not great results if you go straight to training without having accomplished the first part of the formula which is exercise (or play) and then training. Are you familiar with a dog's daily five essential formula? I explain more in detail about hoe to teach commands in this video: ua-cam.com/video/87LPfD-Vg1Y/v-deo.htmlsi=OKpWPHC_j6vU0cnN
Thank you for your point of view. I find it frustrating how many trainers and people use treats. What I see in those situations is the dog watching the hand waiting for the food.
Thanks for sharing! As you said you can easily tell which dog is treat trained and which is not just by watching the dogs watching the humans hands all the time.
I started training my dogs with food. Then I started to notice they looked at the food but not me... I mean they will look at me but the food holds all the real attention... Also, when I gave a command without food in my hand they did not listen. I began to wonder "will hey listen when we are out and there is no food around?" SO now I am working them without food in sight and only after they finish a series of commands / jobs do I feed them. I do not use a lot of treats I tend to use their actual food. It is a hard road but I am liking the results knowing that they see me and not the food bowl!
I am so happy that you are understanding the negative effects of training dogs with treats. It's simple and I have many videos on my channel that I show how to do that. In order to get results you need to have great results inside of the house. Here is a video that I explain how to get results when training your dog outside. ua-cam.com/video/bWegce38Es4/v-deo.html Also if you want to learn how to train your dog without treats, watch the following videos. ua-cam.com/video/2CvtFcNJTuM/v-deo.html
When I was younger, I always had dogs. UA-cam doesn't even exist, neither social networks, and never teach them a single command, just treat them as an intelligent animal. Now that i will soon have a new friend, i just find everywhere the importance of "dog trainning". Everybody is telling me the importance of treats in the "trainning", but i refuse to have a dog constantly looking at my hand. It just feels so unnatural to me and even cruel for the dog. I will show them this video. Thanks
I have to keep looking for more information on this type of approach. I get my dogs to follow me without belt, not to push it when walking on the city, cooming quickly when I calle them or not to be too over exited when they dont have to be. I think thats all i ask them in order to make a good coexistence. I did It just with positive reinformece and being affective to them all the time. But on the other hand, i also punish them when they did things that were not right. By punish i dont mean being cruel or hurt them in anyway. Just raise my voise, be angry for a few seconds and, if needed, raise my hand. But It seems nowadays this is totally prohibited.
I know what you mean. When I was a kid. I also didn't train my dog and didn't even use treats to do anything with my dog. It just did it. But life has changed and we are more urbanized now. Lifestyle has changed so therefore training can replace some of the activities that dogs used to do naturally maybe even 40 years ago.
No hassle with treats, clicks, etc., and no harsh dominance and physical correction. I subscribed and look forward to hearing your ideas. My dogs have always just figured out how to behave on their own without all the training.
I noticed very quick that my chihuahua mix got more distracted by the treat then actually listen to what needed to be done. Without worked better. I am however looking for how to train my dog who is very hyper which stresses me out, and she is pulling on the lead a lot when we are out for a walk. I just found your chanel and watching your videos now and so far i like this. Make souch more sence rhen other trainers ive seen
Reward does not only come in form of food. It comes in forms of love, affection, play, praise, walk, training...I explain a bit more in the following video: ua-cam.com/video/rZohUKIMQbk/v-deo.html
Help, attacking 13 month old puppy. Total 10 dogs, rescue, 9 mature and obedient. Have reviewed your training tips and realize my shortcomings. Starting from scratch, thank you. So as do it correctly
If you'd like to learn about how to train dogs without the use of treats, food, tools, force or domination, please check out my channel ua-cam.com/users/SaroBoghozian to learn more and to subscribe so you won't miss high-quality content like this.
Hi saro. I know it’s a lot of work, answering people here. You have once before helped me and I really appreciate it.. I really hope you can help me on this as well.. I have a 14 week old jack Russell girl. I train without treats only. She has never gotten any treats. At home it works. It’s beginning to work in the garden. But at the puppy training course I have zero connection. She doesn’t know I even exists. She doesn’t care at all for her favorite toy. So I have nothing to motivate her with and I cannot even get her to look at me. My trainer says I should start treat training and I feel she gave up on us and that I’m a bad dog mom.
That is a very good point that you brought up and a great question to ask and for me to answer and everyone to learn. So, what this means is that your puppy is not ready to be involved in that form of distraction. It is just too much for her. She is not ready to handle that much distraction. You need to back up and go back to the previous level that worked for her. I am going to post a new video on Tuesday and in it, I explain about this. You need to start working with your puppy at home, level 1, then in the back yard, level 2 for some time, then add another level of distraction which is the front yard, level 3, and then after a few months you get to the streets, level 4 and then the park level 5. Now, think about it. Which level the dog training classroom would be? I would say level 5. So, you need to go back to level 2 and 3 in order for things to work. You went from level 1 to level 5 all of a sudden. No matter what method of dog training you choose, this will happen. Don't be pressured by the trainer to force you or push you to use treats. You just have to maybe pause the class and work with a trainer in private for some time. Maybe when you and your puppy are ready to join a classroom environment. Don't rush and don't push your puppy to learn. Focus on the time and the space that you need to provide for your puppy to learn. As a dog trainer, I don't use treats in my puppy classes or any classes because it is not the right space and time to use it. The dog trainer that you are using, needs to inform you that you are not in the right class yet but because they need your money, they won't say it to you. In my puppy training classes, we don't focus on training, we focus on training and educating the dog owners and allowing the puppies to socialize and play with each other which are the best forms of training a puppy. ua-cam.com/video/7mZ7kErxsVk/v-deo.html
Thank you so much Saro!! You have been there more for me than my trainer has! I wish I could train with you Instead. I will definitely do what you say and stay with level one and two until we rock it. Again thank you so much! I will for sure continue watching your great videos.
@SaroDogTrain @SaroDogTraining Hi there! I agree 100% with what you said and I'd like to get your input for some of my clients....I live in NYC and many of my clients don't have options for level 2 or 3, they live in apartments so no backyard or front yards/ (per say) and most buildings are already situated on busy distracting noisy city streets. Often times even the apartments themselves can be pretty noisy and distracting. It makes it a lot harder to train their dogs ...with time will their dogs be able to focus and train in these areas without treats?
I will make a video about it. How to transition from training dogs using treats. Keep an eye on my channel or subscribe and hit the bell icon so you won't miss it.
First, thanks for pointing out Rudolph Schenkel and his biased study on wolves. I would like to point out some misconception i have found in your video : First, it was not Pavlov who "invented" "treat training". It was B.F Skiner in the 40's. Pavlov's conditioning is a reflex conditioning, meaning the dog does not have control over it, like saliva for exemple. Skiner's conditioning is "operant conditioning", where the subject has control over the behaviors. All the points you make against using treats derive from a misunderstanding of operant conditioning. Ill explain it quickly : Positive/negative are to be taken at the mathematical sense, adding something/removing something. Punishment means descreasing the frequency of a behavior. Reinforcement means increasing the frequency of a behavior. So positive reinforcement mean increasing the frequency of a behavior my adding an appetive stimulus, negative punishent means decreasing the frequency of a behavior by removing an appettive stimulus, positive punishment means decreasing the frequency of a behavior by adding an aversive stimulus, negative reinforcement means increasing the frequency of a behavior by removing an aversive stimulus. While Pavlov's conditioning has its own place in modern behavior study and modification, Skiner's is the one that we use the most, willingly or not. When i give a treat to my dog when he responds to a sit with a sit, i use positive reinforcement. This assure that i am likely to see this behavior more often in the future. When i close the door when my dog wants to rush out, i use negative punishment, wich assure that i am less likely to see this behavior in the future. It is not about what kind of anthropomorphic argument you can make against usng treats, it's about these very core studies in behavior modification.
Great observations. Pavolv didn't invent treat training, people and trainers took away his idea and used it in dog training. All the details that you explained for average people does not make sense and it is not easy for them to learn and understand. Dog training should be simplified and that is my goal. To simplify the process of dog training, I focus on creating videos on my channel. One of them is the following: ua-cam.com/video/yr80Lf90wsk/v-deo.html
@@ethanswimmer1287 Let's be nice and kind. You are free to express your opinion as long as you respect others and just simply share your thoughts. Now, domination happens in the wild for sure but you have to realize that dogs are not wild animals. They are domesticated pets. Therefore the domination theory does not work on dogs but it works on wolves who live in the wild.
100 % First dog training coach 🙌 agree with ... i new with all the wrong information about treat didn't make sense to why the f! Why would you keep giving your baby dog snacks all day long if don't do that yourself because it not healthy better to have a true connected with your dog mentally and emotionally 😉 Thanks i love it .. keep sharing lots of interesting facts 💫 well done!👏
I've just adopted a street dog 2 weeks ago, I've started training with treats and it felt wrong and what you say correspond to what I've noticed in the last week. Thanks!
An interesting point,I’m having a local dog trainer for 3 sessions and treat tracing is her method. I shall now try not doing that and see how my pup responds to commands,he’s still learning so should be ok.Thank you.
Yes, I highly suggest giving it a try to not use treats to train your dog. You will be surprised by the results. If you need more info or example of how to do it, how to train your dog without treats, please watch the following videos. ua-cam.com/video/2CvtFcNJTuM/v-deo.html
How to answer a phone...? First we look at the phone and hear it ringing... and we know it’s ringing because it’s making a noise. Some phones make different noises ranging from high pitched sounds to funny noise and even music. If we look back over history we can see that once there was a time when phones just made a ring ring sound. This was the norm back then but as times changed, so did our need for variety. So again if we look at the phone and we here it’s ringing....we can extend our hand, left or right it doesn’t really matter. Then we pick it up and say hello... simple. Why didn’t you just show how you train a dog without using treats... you didn’t need to talk about it for 8 minutes. Total waste of time. So how do you train a dog without treats? Use rewards like toys or praise.... job done
I appreciate your comment. This video was one of the earliest videos of mine and I needed to explain the theory to my audience first. Since then I have made many videos that not only I explain more but I also show how you can train a dog without treats. I have a entire video playlist or series showing how to teach the basic obedience and also how to rehabilitate a dog without treats. I will link them here, if you are interested to watch them. For obedience series watch the following: ua-cam.com/video/2CvtFcNJTuM/v-deo.html for one of my newest videos where I rehab a dog. ua-cam.com/video/uDhQe8VE3kU/v-deo.html
The dogs quickly learn with treats because they are food oriented. However such a training is shallow and if they are really intelligent they learn to manipulate us with the treats. Dogs should and can learn because they connect with us and perceive us as their leader ( if we really are the one) and they want to obey, first because it's a pack instinct to follow a leader and secondly, when they grow to love us they want to please us!
Thank you so much for your comments. I agree. Dogs are way more intelligent than we think they are and we are not using that the way we should and are not giving them enough credit. Dogs connect with us not because we are their leaders but because we have been building an amazing relationship with each other through thousands of years.
How do i get my dog to stop barking and being so anxious around other dogs when we go outside he turns into another dog.its crazy it's like he's having a major panic attack! !! Plz..help..??
That is a common issue dog owners have. There are 2 reasons that cause that. Excitement and stress. Watch the following video for all the details to learn what to do an dhow to approach your dog's barking. ua-cam.com/video/io5AYPhyP0I/v-deo.html
I don't want to turn my poodle into a food obsessive with 'treats'. This poodle is supersmart I have to figure out how to get him not to nip and grab our clothing without an argument!
I also don't suggest to use treats to train or correct a dog's behaviour. In any case, you can teach your poodle a verbal cue to stop unwanted behaviour. Since, as you say, poodles are super smart, you won't have a hard time accomplishing this. Also, try to provide enough mental physical stimulation. The main reason they nip and bite is that they are bored and not tired. By understanding this, I have a video which you can watch and learn how to develop a verbal cue to stop your poodle. ua-cam.com/video/MhU3ykPHpJs/v-deo.html
Well, about that burger, yea we kind of have the same deal. We need to do some tricks to get the money to buy the burger.... no one is just giving you the food... and yes it can be frustrating. In the end I don't think dogs are that stupid to not know what's going on and there is always all other time besides feeding/training to bond with your dog. So, in my opinion, any method works when it works.
Absolutely, it's understandable that sometimes we need to navigate various methods to make things happen. Dogs are incredibly intuitive and perceptive creatures, often understanding more than we give them credit for. While training methods differ, what truly matters is the bond and understanding we cultivate with our dogs beyond feeding and training sessions. Building a strong connection extends beyond specific activities; it's about trust, consistency, and genuine interaction throughout our time together.
That was the most Vague answer ever. "give your dog what it needs...." isn't that what you are doing when you feed it? Seems like the logic is very contradicting. I love when people tell you what NOT to do and then don't give you an answer for what TO do.
Thank you for watching the video. If you are a follower of my channel, you'll know what I meant by "giving what your dog what it needs and it will give you what you need" concept. It is my mistake that I've not been clear on that in my video but there are cards on the video that you could click to watch where I explain what a dog needs are. In any way, here is the video that I meant and please let me know if you have any questions. ua-cam.com/video/7PLTj5zNSVw/v-deo.html
The breed I am getting (Lab retriever) tends towards obesity and the last thing I want to do is give my puppy treats so she'll obey. A dog as trainable and eager to please as a Lab shouldn't need to be fed. I see so many fat dogs these days.
Oh i see, treats make them interested because its food and thats why people use treats? But then their focus isnt on human, but on food. Food for me wouldn even work because my dogs refuse everything and idk how to fix it
Hm, the history of man-dog relationship is a bit wrong imo, there have been non-working companion dogs since dogs and humans formed the first relationships, the 'jobs' just formed after that. Starting the 'history' with special breeds for special tasks is starting a bit late in the history... ^^ The treat work is not based on Pavlov, he just wrote down how it works ;-), and not all dogs are food-oriented. But of course training without treats is the way to go!!! :-)
I agree. The early relationship of humans and dogs was based on necessity and then turned into human asking the dogs to work and building a working relationship. Pavlov research had nothing to do with training dogs and it was just an experiment about learning by conditioning. Treat training method was developed based on this experience. I explain more in the following video: ua-cam.com/video/ChKuDy4lpHI/v-deo.html
Sorry wrong key stroke. 13 month old 40 lb mix breed attacking smaller dogs, all female. No training to this point, have reviewed your basic tiring method and will proceed
No worries. I can help you out. The first and the most important tip that I have for you is to not off leash the puppy for the next 2 to 3 weeks. The puppy is not ready to be off leash yet. Something, maybe the number of dogs, is stressing it. Only off leash the puppy if it is playing nicely with the dog(s). If not, put it back on the leash and the puppy stays on the leash until it gets the point. You can watch the following video to get an example and some ideas. ua-cam.com/video/99vu4ueEaVE/v-deo.html Work on these and let e know if you have any other questions.
Interesting that you didn't get any value out of this lesson. Maybe you were not paying attention or were looking for a quick solution but basically, I explain why you don't need to use treats as the main source of reward for your dog and if you provide what your dog needs are, your dog will give you what you need.
That is because you and your dog are dependent on it. I explain more and how to solve this issue in the following video. ua-cam.com/video/nNNcNixSRag/v-deo.html
Of course you can use treats to train dogs but it is not necessary to use it because, it makes you to be dependent on treats and your dog will also expect treats. Plus it causes dogs to develop health issues. Please watch the following video for more information. ua-cam.com/video/S2DulURA41w/v-deo.html
30 years ago I trained my dog to compete in Obedience Trials and NEVER gave him a treat! We had a bond in that he wanted to please me and we were an actual team. I could take my dog anywhere, off leash and he behaved. I used positive reinforcement with praise, voice commands and consistency. THAT is how dogs were trained. No one used food to train a dog! Now it seems that every trainer uses food and weird gadgetry like "clickers." I am getting a new puppy and I want my dog to obey me out of love and eagerness, not by bribery or gimmicks. Nice to see this video that actually makes sense and is "old school". BTW, I didn't bribe my kids either and I have two great adult children.
When I was younger, I never thought and was told to use treats or food to train dogs.
My first dog was not trained with treats. Best dog in the world. Newfoundland GSD mix from SPCA. Off leash and adored me and I adored him.
Max was an SPCA find too, 14 years later and we are advised to train with treats. I did but mostly for “trick” training and introducing “find it” games for him to use his nose to find something. Now at 18 months old he doesn’t need treats to listen but I do keep some on me I suppose out of habit. Two different dogs, with different energy levels and temperaments but they both turned out pretty incredible. Just I spent a lot more money buying treats for Max 😂 😮
Thanks for the comments "ajf5823. I'm trying to learn how to train my 8 month old beagle, and the comment about forming a bond with her sounds great.
As a veterinarian and owner of 3 large energetic dogs I must say he is SPOT ON!!!
Absolutlly right! The dog WANTS to impress you and be your partner. You don't need to bribe him with treats.
My dog is absolutely not like that
Finally I find what I am looking for. Dogs get free room and board. They like any member of the family have chores to do. Most dogs want to work. Pleasing the family is it's job. I didn't give my GSD a treat until he was 4ish. When I did I never gave it as a reward. I did it because I loved him. The same reason why his recall was absolute. He did it for love.
I love that. He did it for love. That is how it should be and many dog owners don't understand it or don't try to figure it out. Thank you for the feedback.
the historical context makes total sense to me! i'm a first time dog parent and have never treat-trained. we just do life together and work on our communication constantly. one interesting thing is that is my dog "disobeys", she usually has a logical reason, like she's focused on protecting me when there's a threat I can't see or hear! such a good girl.
I’ve just found this very good video, and decided to add a comment. Treats may have their place in extreme cases. But surely positive reinforcement refers to praise, patting and playtime! Many years ago I trained my English Springer Spaniel to a very high level without treats, it took quite a while as this breed is more easily distracted than some others, but we succeeded. After she passed away I took my next Springer Spaniel to classes, as the distractions during training are a good thing to get used to. But the same training club now only trained with treats. I decided to keep an open mind and gave it a go. It was a useless method, as my dog was so distracted with the prospect of a treat that she paid absolutely no attention to where she was going while at a heel command. Then when we got to the park and I gave her the free time command, she never left my side and kept looking for the treat. This is not normal for a breed that is naturally very very interested in checking out the smells all around her. I believe using treats is just to speed the training process. Everybody wants fast results. I would rather learn how to get a dog (or any animal for that matter) more interested in what I’m saying and doing, than my commands being something that are a by-product of food.
That is an amazing testimony. Thank you for sharing that with us. I see the similar experience many times when I head to the parks and I see dogs staring either into their owners pocket or hand that is holding food or even a stick or a ball.
I use bribery sometimes. Only if I really need to. If the run somewhere and I need them to come back and things like that and calling them isn't working I will yell "cookie" and they will rush over. Sometimes bribery is your best option.
I’m not even sure treats are ‘fast’. Nowadays it’s typical to put a dog directly on a harness and expect them to walk by holding a treat where you want them to be, over and over-you need thousands of treats! 8:21
A slip collar and commands gets the job done in no time at all-but some think that’s no better than a ‘cruel’ prong collar. Eye roll.
@@stepha2642😂so funny! I think we might as well name our dog cookie! lol! My dog is probably gonna be named Cheese cuz that’s what he loves 😅
I am a truly believer that dogs as pets and their human companions and friends have to relate entirely by creating bonds of love, obedience, intelligence and dedication to each other.
By saying this, your opposition on the “food as treats” approach to the “so called obedience training”, is the right way to raise an emotional, balance dog as a pet.
I am extremely lucky I came across with your channel as my husband and I, just got a Shitzu puppy, 2 months old and needed to understand better how to bond with him without “food treats”.
Thanks. We’ll follow your wisdom.
Great. There are lots of content on my channel for you to watch and learn to improve your relationship with your dog. Feel free to browse and ask questions.
I agree 100%. Dogs love having a job!
For sure!
Even with a treat or reward system training, the goal is to eventually wean them off the treats. The point was never the treats and to actually provide play as reinforcement at the end of each training. But many people forget this part or leave it up to the pet parents to decide. Giving them different rewards such as toys, praise and touch are used as effective ways to encourage a strong bond in positive training. The right trainer will teach this way. The dog will love doing the work when being with you is rewarding on its own. All good things take time.
Yes, few dog trainers remember to mention and also few dog owners to remember to fade out the treats when training.
my dad has for the last few years been helping me learn how to train dogs (im 14) and we recently got our second rescue. hes a lab german shorthair cross. and we dont use treats, i never really understood why because most trainers ive talked to or watched encouraged treat training. so ive been researching and it all makes sense now! thank you for explaining it so clearly.
I am glad it is making sense and bravo for starting to learn to train dogs at such a young age.
thank you! love your videos and views on training!
True Mr. Sero, the biggest argument for me is, the dog wil do it for the food and not because the curiosity to learn. Big LIKE !
yes, it makes perfect sense......i never liked the idea of "bribing" a dog with food, and since my Akbash is not food motivated, i was feeling it was about hopeless to get him to come when i called.......BUT....i noticed that when he sees me pick up his leash......that motivates him to come to me, better than any food treat!
You plus leash means walk which is a perfect interaction for your dog which means the best reward for your dog as I explained in my new video. ua-cam.com/video/Vn6effmJjVw/v-deo.html
Excellent point! I've always thought that dogs motivated by food can also be motivated by a burglar offering a steak. So much for loyalty! I've never used treats when training my dogs. When I see dogs "behaving" in Obedience Competitions--and always looking for their treat--I'm not at all impressed. Thanks for your message!
Absolutely!!
I'm not a specialist in dogs, and now I have a female husky that is 9 months old, and I tried and still trying to know the best way to raise her and train her because she can be very stubborn at times.
What you are saying makes complete sense, because dogs are basically beast babies, like human babies. They can have different personalities and charactaraistics and that means different upraoches.
My dog for example is crazy active and all the she wants most the times in cool days and cool evenings is to play and run. And she loves her stomach so much. Food is a priority for her still. In most cases.
And that huge attachment to loving to swallow and eat makes it even harder to make her focused.
I learned sofar that she needs a few things to behave. As you said easy yet hard. Like being fed properly and have variety of options. Also like spending physical efforts with me and around me and my family, she is extremely social, yet too hyper. She also needs emotional bond, like praise, like assurance that she is allowed to do certain things, without feelings not sure about what's OK and what's not. She needs to be around me without having to do anything together. My presence when she is in these period at the day where she just needs to sit and chew somethin, like stuffed toys, which are her best toys. She likes it when she chews on them when I'm sitting around.
She also needs to be praise, verbally or by patting her. Although she doesn't accept still a lot of physical contact which I respect, she comes for short cuddles or brief tummy rubs.
I don't totally agree that we should praise them with food, as you said, because I also noticed, that treating her as soon as she does what I ask for, turns her into a treat freak, she would do anthying possible or not possible to get her treat, and as soon as she realizes that the treats are over she can totally ignore me or ignore the game that we playing. Which makes her look very egoistic maybe.
I share my treats that she can eat with her. I share my big portions with her.. We often eat certain things together as a matter of fun of her and a matter of building a real bond with her, especially on the days when I don't want to over eat. Sharing is caring I guess, and she eats so politely when this happens because she learned that I eat a bite and then I give her the bite size that I want her to eat, and usually she gets the bigger half.
and that doesn't happen when I know she is hungry. because treating hunger and just snacking, ,if I can use that word for a dog, are completely two different things that surely need different approaches.
when i actually give her her actual meals, I let her eat alone, at her own pace or tension over a meal. I let her in peace. I might be around but I don't interrupt her.
yes dogs' use changed and yes we need to remember why they exist, but at the same time we need to make them know and feel like family with us and that we are family to them.
Again treating her too often makes her less focused on the situation, and more on the food.
thanks, maybe you are right. I need to see more of your videos and it's good to see how your dogs behave. because actual successful examples are the best in the world .
thanks for your time and efforts and your passion about dogs is obvious.
Thank you for your comment. Please take the time to watch my videos and learn as much as you can. My approach to dog training is very different so, you may find new way to help you raise your puppy.
I really do agree that treats should not be used to train a dog. I have a 4 month old puppy and we are struggling with training because she won’t listen unless I have treats. I want to change this asap! I want to try your methods before she gets too much older.
It is so much easier and much more fun than you think to train a dog without treats. It is simple as long as you understand the core secret of dog training which I have explained in this short video. ua-cam.com/video/-sNQ-mtVVuA/v-deo.html
Thank goodness found someone who doesn't treat train. Thumbs up.
We have an 8 year old Labradoodle. Never used treats for her. She did what we asked and that was it! BUT now we have an Australian Labradoodle that is very Alpha. Decided to stop using treats and we will see how we progress. Liked this video and will definitely will go in this direction. Thank you
The hardest part is the mindset. I am doing a free webinar about no treat dog training which you are welcome to join. Here is how to registrar. sarodogtraining.com/notreatdogtrainingwebinar/
I totally agree about training without treats. I don't know how to do it, that is why I am here, so thank you. All creatures react to positive reinforcement, which equals love.
You are so welcome!
Very helpful! I knew there must be something out there like this! We have a 12 week old retriever named Cooper and I am trying to train him. Everywhere I go, people tell me he needs treats and I’m disgusted. Surely there must be a better way!!
Unfortunately, that is the reality of dog training these days. All dog owners, dog trainers and professionals are addicted to treats and can not do anything without it. If you are series about learning how to train your retriever without the use of treats, you are welcome to join one of my online programs. sarodogtraining.com/
Thank you for sharing this HELPFUL information! The treat system looked so concerning and is probably for people that have the desire to control every move (the over thinkers, the obsessed). It just seems like we as humans just complicate the simplest form of communication. So grateful there are others out there that don't agree with Pavlov's ignorance to animal behavior including his.
Thank you for your feedback. That is a great observation and point of view that you make. Dogs are simple animals and we can have simple and pure relationships with each other but we make it complicated because we don' spend enough time to just BE. Pavlov's study was basically for digestion and not related to dogs or dog training.
Using of treats is actually developed rather for us humans, because it gives us a trick how to simplify understanding of our dog, versus to bond in a real and deep way with him/her so that the dog will want to obey and serve us! Dogs in my teenage years (I am originally from Poland) learned to obey me and some of my family members because they loved us over everything!
I’d salivate if you had a taco with spicy salsa 😆
I never knew without treat dogs can obey. I recently start working dogs without a treat and I got them to listen to me
Yes, it is possible to train dogs without treats. The problem is that most dog owners start training their dogs with treats and then realize that it didn't work or they didn't need the treats but now, both the dog and the dog owner are dependent on the treats.
Is there a difference between treats and their regular food during training? I've been hand feeding my little 10 week old, 3 pound Havanese puppy all of his meals piece by piece as he does what I tell him to do: sit, down, spin, etc. I feel like in a sense this is him working for his food like you mentioned dogs have done for hundreds of years. It's obvious to me that he's "listening" to me b/c I'm holding his meal in my hands. I can also report that he will sit on my command without food now. However, some of the harder commands are not performed without food. I've noticed as he's getting full his attention on my commands fades and he looks around for a toy. So I see your point there! I enjoy feeding him instead of just him devowering his food out of a bowl. I'm excited to watch more of your no-treat training videos. Thanks!
You are very welcome. These are great points that you brought up and also these are some of the common issues dog owners who use treats or food to train their dogs face. In my opinion, we shouldn't bother dogs with their food or treats. It is their time to enjoy and eat their food. They don't have to work while eating the food. The work should be done before eating, if the dog has to work. The other point is that when you use food to train dogs, they don't focus on the task that you are teaching. They focus on the food and finally, the food or the treats need to be used precisely at the right second or faded out from being used earlier than many dog owners do.
Not to take away anything from this guy, he seems like a very knowledgeable dog trainer, but he has his niche/audience/target dog-handler demographic. What I have learned in the dog training world, is that any two dog trainers will agree on is that the third trainer is doing it wrong.
What I have learned throughout a lifetime, is that there a many, many, successful methods to dog training, that all will achieve the same end. There aren’t absolutes in dog training. It’s almost like martial arts, there isn’t one fighting style that is above all, they all have their purpose and audience.
The key to do training is using what works best for the dog and handler and recognizing these needs and adapting. If a method works for you and you and your dog are happy, do it. No matter what any third party or trainer says. If something doesn’t work, don’t give up and try something different.
Treat trained dogs are conpleting tasks with "honesty" they are doing it for the entire sake of the treat. Not exactly for you. Thus there is a perso ality disconnect. If you treat train a dog for years. Then randomly stop mire so then not theyll stop responding as much or as accurately and sometimes even out right refuse to listen.
Veteran dog trainer Ross Allan (Australian) noted that training with treats was also present during the 1st industrial revolution in some western countries, in early 1800s, (most likely for the same reason - working dogs lost jobs or owners moved to cities). Using treats in training comes in and goes out of fashion over the years, but it never produces lasting results. It is a form hyper-active training, together with use of toys, tugs, etc. to over-stimulate distressed dog that has no proper leader, or to distract an over-anxious dog. A method to somehow approach a distressed/anxious dog (via his stomach), is not the way to approach all dogs.
I've never treat trained my beagles. Always mutual respect and love gives the best results.
That is amazing. You are my kind of dog/beagle owner.
I like the idea of play and praise and bonding with my beagle. The problem is teaching her how to do the commands I want her to do. Example with sit, using treat and moving it above her head. Her head goes back her rump goes down. The only think I can think to do is the old fashion way of putting a hand on her rump and gently pushing down u til she sits then saying "YES" and praising her. Playing when starting out doesn't work very well because she wants to keep the stuffed bear and not give it back.
Great questions. So, the behaviour that your beagle is giving you (she wants to keep the stuffed bear and not give it back) is part of the play session. So, you start with a play session and then once the brain is stimulated, you start with the training. NOw, the toy does not have as much as value that it had before but yet it is a great motivator. You will not great results if you go straight to training without having accomplished the first part of the formula which is exercise (or play) and then training. Are you familiar with a dog's daily five essential formula? I explain more in detail about hoe to teach commands in this video: ua-cam.com/video/87LPfD-Vg1Y/v-deo.htmlsi=OKpWPHC_j6vU0cnN
Thank you for your point of view. I find it frustrating how many trainers and people use treats.
What I see in those situations is the dog watching the hand waiting for the food.
Thanks for sharing! As you said you can easily tell which dog is treat trained and which is not just by watching the dogs watching the humans hands all the time.
I started training my dogs with food. Then I started to notice they looked at the food but not me... I mean they will look at me but the food holds all the real attention... Also, when I gave a command without food in my hand they did not listen. I began to wonder "will hey listen when we are out and there is no food around?" SO now I am working them without food in sight and only after they finish a series of commands / jobs do I feed them. I do not use a lot of treats I tend to use their actual food. It is a hard road but I am liking the results knowing that they see me and not the food bowl!
I am so happy that you are understanding the negative effects of training dogs with treats. It's simple and I have many videos on my channel that I show how to do that. In order to get results you need to have great results inside of the house. Here is a video that I explain how to get results when training your dog outside. ua-cam.com/video/bWegce38Es4/v-deo.html Also if you want to learn how to train your dog without treats, watch the following videos. ua-cam.com/video/2CvtFcNJTuM/v-deo.html
Makes so much sense! Thank you. I love that you are so interactive with subscribers ❤️
Thank you so much. I love interacting with dog lovers. What part of this video stood out the most for you?
When I was younger, I always had dogs. UA-cam doesn't even exist, neither social networks, and never teach them a single command, just treat them as an intelligent animal. Now that i will soon have a new friend, i just find everywhere the importance of "dog trainning". Everybody is telling me the importance of treats in the "trainning", but i refuse to have a dog constantly looking at my hand. It just feels so unnatural to me and even cruel for the dog. I will show them this video.
Thanks
I have to keep looking for more information on this type of approach. I get my dogs to follow me without belt, not to push it when walking on the city, cooming quickly when I calle them or not to be too over exited when they dont have to be. I think thats all i ask them in order to make a good coexistence.
I did It just with positive reinformece and being affective to them all the time. But on the other hand, i also punish them when they did things that were not right.
By punish i dont mean being cruel or hurt them in anyway. Just raise my voise, be angry for a few seconds and, if needed, raise my hand.
But It seems nowadays this is totally prohibited.
I know what you mean. When I was a kid. I also didn't train my dog and didn't even use treats to do anything with my dog. It just did it. But life has changed and we are more urbanized now. Lifestyle has changed so therefore training can replace some of the activities that dogs used to do naturally maybe even 40 years ago.
No hassle with treats, clicks, etc., and no harsh dominance and physical correction. I subscribed and look forward to hearing your ideas. My dogs have always just figured out how to behave on their own without all the training.
Welcome and thank you for subscribing.
Sir all you said was right! I prove it and treat training thing didint work so i stoped it imidietley
Excellent!
I Agree!
I noticed very quick that my chihuahua mix got more distracted by the treat then actually listen to what needed to be done. Without worked better. I am however looking for how to train my dog who is very hyper which stresses me out, and she is pulling on the lead a lot when we are out for a walk. I just found your chanel and watching your videos now and so far i like this. Make souch more sence rhen other trainers ive seen
What kind of dog and age? Can you elaborate more on your dog being hyper? Only on walks or at home too?
I like this guy.
Yes! Agree 100%
What happens when you don't have the food reward?
Dogs want to please - not just eat,its a confusing message
Reward does not only come in form of food. It comes in forms of love, affection, play, praise, walk, training...I explain a bit more in the following video: ua-cam.com/video/rZohUKIMQbk/v-deo.html
Tottally agree i was looking for someone whit that mind set
Great. You can learn so much more about this topic on my channel.
Same
Help, attacking 13 month old puppy. Total 10 dogs, rescue, 9 mature and obedient. Have reviewed your training tips and realize my shortcomings. Starting from scratch, thank you. So as do it correctly
I DO AGREE 100%
If you'd like to learn about how to train dogs without the use of treats, food, tools, force or domination, please check out my channel ua-cam.com/users/SaroBoghozian to learn more and to subscribe so you won't miss high-quality content like this.
thank you!
This is helpful because my dog is not treat motivated at all .
Hi saro. I know it’s a lot of work, answering people here. You have once before helped me and I really appreciate it.. I really hope you can help me on this as well..
I have a 14 week old jack Russell girl. I train without treats only. She has never gotten any treats. At home it works. It’s beginning to work in the garden. But at the puppy training course I have zero connection. She doesn’t know I even exists. She doesn’t care at all for her favorite toy. So I have nothing to motivate her with and I cannot even get her to look at me. My trainer says I should start treat training and I feel she gave up on us and that I’m a bad dog mom.
That is a very good point that you brought up and a great question to ask and for me to answer and everyone to learn. So, what this means is that your puppy is not ready to be involved in that form of distraction. It is just too much for her. She is not ready to handle that much distraction. You need to back up and go back to the previous level that worked for her. I am going to post a new video on Tuesday and in it, I explain about this. You need to start working with your puppy at home, level 1, then in the back yard, level 2 for some time, then add another level of distraction which is the front yard, level 3, and then after a few months you get to the streets, level 4 and then the park level 5. Now, think about it. Which level the dog training classroom would be? I would say level 5. So, you need to go back to level 2 and 3 in order for things to work. You went from level 1 to level 5 all of a sudden. No matter what method of dog training you choose, this will happen. Don't be pressured by the trainer to force you or push you to use treats. You just have to maybe pause the class and work with a trainer in private for some time. Maybe when you and your puppy are ready to join a classroom environment. Don't rush and don't push your puppy to learn. Focus on the time and the space that you need to provide for your puppy to learn. As a dog trainer, I don't use treats in my puppy classes or any classes because it is not the right space and time to use it. The dog trainer that you are using, needs to inform you that you are not in the right class yet but because they need your money, they won't say it to you. In my puppy training classes, we don't focus on training, we focus on training and educating the dog owners and allowing the puppies to socialize and play with each other which are the best forms of training a puppy. ua-cam.com/video/7mZ7kErxsVk/v-deo.html
Thank you so much Saro!! You have been there more for me than my trainer has! I wish I could train with you Instead. I will definitely do what you say and stay with level one and two until we rock it.
Again thank you so much! I will for sure continue watching your great videos.
@SaroDogTrain @SaroDogTraining Hi there! I agree 100% with what you said and I'd like to get your input for some of my clients....I live in NYC and many of my clients don't have options for level 2 or 3, they live in apartments so no backyard or front yards/ (per say) and most buildings are already situated on busy distracting noisy city streets. Often times even the apartments themselves can be pretty noisy and distracting. It makes it a lot harder to train their dogs ...with time will their dogs be able to focus and train in these areas without treats?
Sir u r right
I do agree with your opinion… I do not want to train my puppy with treats… However I am still a little lost about how I should train her LOL
I will make a video about it. How to transition from training dogs using treats. Keep an eye on my channel or subscribe and hit the bell icon so you won't miss it.
First, thanks for pointing out Rudolph Schenkel and his biased study on wolves.
I would like to point out some misconception i have found in your video :
First, it was not Pavlov who "invented" "treat training". It was B.F Skiner in the 40's. Pavlov's conditioning is a reflex conditioning, meaning the dog does not have control over it, like saliva for exemple. Skiner's conditioning is "operant conditioning", where the subject has control over the behaviors.
All the points you make against using treats derive from a misunderstanding of operant conditioning. Ill explain it quickly :
Positive/negative are to be taken at the mathematical sense, adding something/removing something.
Punishment means descreasing the frequency of a behavior.
Reinforcement means increasing the frequency of a behavior.
So positive reinforcement mean increasing the frequency of a behavior my adding an appetive stimulus, negative punishent means decreasing the frequency of a behavior by removing an appettive stimulus, positive punishment means decreasing the frequency of a behavior by adding an aversive stimulus, negative reinforcement means increasing the frequency of a behavior by removing an aversive stimulus.
While Pavlov's conditioning has its own place in modern behavior study and modification, Skiner's is the one that we use the most, willingly or not.
When i give a treat to my dog when he responds to a sit with a sit, i use positive reinforcement. This assure that i am likely to see this behavior more often in the future. When i close the door when my dog wants to rush out, i use negative punishment, wich assure that i am less likely to see this behavior in the future.
It is not about what kind of anthropomorphic argument you can make against usng treats, it's about these very core studies in behavior modification.
Great observations. Pavolv didn't invent treat training, people and trainers took away his idea and used it in dog training. All the details that you explained for average people does not make sense and it is not easy for them to learn and understand. Dog training should be simplified and that is my goal. To simplify the process of dog training, I focus on creating videos on my channel. One of them is the following: ua-cam.com/video/yr80Lf90wsk/v-deo.html
@@ethanswimmer1287 Let's be nice and kind. You are free to express your opinion as long as you respect others and just simply share your thoughts. Now, domination happens in the wild for sure but you have to realize that dogs are not wild animals. They are domesticated pets. Therefore the domination theory does not work on dogs but it works on wolves who live in the wild.
It would have been nice to see an example of you training without treats
I have many videos training dogs without treats. What do you want to learn? Here is an example. ua-cam.com/video/CkZAhgvAMsg/v-deo.html
100 % First dog training coach 🙌 agree with ... i new with all the wrong information about treat didn't make sense to why the f! Why would you keep giving your baby dog snacks all day long if don't do that yourself because it not healthy better to have a true connected with your dog mentally and emotionally 😉 Thanks i love it .. keep sharing lots of interesting facts 💫 well done!👏
Thank you so much for your feedback. You rock!
Have you made a crate training without treats video?
Here it is: ua-cam.com/video/z4A7Y6K5_o0/v-deo.html
I agree sir
Thank you. Which part of the video stood out the most for you?
I've just adopted a street dog 2 weeks ago, I've started training with treats and it felt wrong and what you say correspond to what I've noticed in the last week.
Thanks!
Thanks for sharing!!
Avi learn basics about dogs. 😉
An interesting point,I’m having a local dog trainer for 3 sessions and treat tracing is her method.
I shall now try not doing that and see how my pup responds to commands,he’s still learning so should be ok.Thank you.
Yes, I highly suggest giving it a try to not use treats to train your dog. You will be surprised by the results. If you need more info or example of how to do it, how to train your dog without treats, please watch the following videos. ua-cam.com/video/2CvtFcNJTuM/v-deo.html
Perfect !
How to answer a phone...? First we look at the phone and hear it ringing... and we know it’s ringing because it’s making a noise. Some phones make different noises ranging from high pitched sounds to funny noise and even music. If we look back over history we can see that once there was a time when phones just made a ring ring sound. This was the norm back then but as times changed, so did our need for variety. So again if we look at the phone and we here it’s ringing....we can extend our hand, left or right it doesn’t really matter. Then we pick it up and say hello... simple.
Why didn’t you just show how you train a dog without using treats... you didn’t need to talk about it for 8 minutes.
Total waste of time.
So how do you train a dog without treats?
Use rewards like toys or praise.... job done
I appreciate your comment. This video was one of the earliest videos of mine and I needed to explain the theory to my audience first. Since then I have made many videos that not only I explain more but I also show how you can train a dog without treats. I have a entire video playlist or series showing how to teach the basic obedience and also how to rehabilitate a dog without treats. I will link them here, if you are interested to watch them. For obedience series watch the following: ua-cam.com/video/2CvtFcNJTuM/v-deo.html for one of my newest videos where I rehab a dog. ua-cam.com/video/uDhQe8VE3kU/v-deo.html
The dogs quickly learn with treats because they are food oriented. However such a training is shallow and if they are really intelligent they learn to manipulate us with the treats. Dogs should and can learn because they connect with us and perceive us as their leader ( if we really are the one) and they want to obey, first because it's a pack instinct to follow a leader and secondly, when they grow to love us they want to please us!
Thank you so much for your comments. I agree. Dogs are way more intelligent than we think they are and we are not using that the way we should and are not giving them enough credit. Dogs connect with us not because we are their leaders but because we have been building an amazing relationship with each other through thousands of years.
True
Thank you so much for sharing this video here.
You are very welcome. Thank you for your support.
Totally agree Saro jan
Thank you so much. Shad shad merci.
Very interesting! Great work :)
Thank you very much.
Its not that he is obsessed with treats, he hates them! My dog wouldn't take treats and this video hopefully will help me!
I had a dog like that too. I understand what you mean. I use play and praise to reward my dog and got great results.
I’ve already been using food for training for awhile now and now I want to change that is it still possible to train my dog without treats.
Watch this video: ua-cam.com/video/lRiNRP8FZfY/v-deo.html
How do i get my dog to stop barking and being so anxious around other dogs when we go outside he turns into another dog.its crazy it's like he's having a major panic attack! !! Plz..help..??
That is a common issue dog owners have. There are 2 reasons that cause that. Excitement and stress. Watch the following video for all the details to learn what to do an dhow to approach your dog's barking. ua-cam.com/video/io5AYPhyP0I/v-deo.html
Refuse food motivation is a negotiation of the learning theory. 😉
What?
I don't want to turn my poodle into a food obsessive with 'treats'. This poodle is supersmart I have to figure out how to get him not to nip and grab our clothing without an argument!
I also don't suggest to use treats to train or correct a dog's behaviour. In any case, you can teach your poodle a verbal cue to stop unwanted behaviour. Since, as you say, poodles are super smart, you won't have a hard time accomplishing this. Also, try to provide enough mental physical stimulation. The main reason they nip and bite is that they are bored and not tired. By understanding this, I have a video which you can watch and learn how to develop a verbal cue to stop your poodle. ua-cam.com/video/MhU3ykPHpJs/v-deo.html
Well, about that burger, yea we kind of have the same deal. We need to do some tricks to get the money to buy the burger.... no one is just giving you the food... and yes it can be frustrating. In the end I don't think dogs are that stupid to not know what's going on and there is always all other time besides feeding/training to bond with your dog. So, in my opinion, any method works when it works.
Absolutely, it's understandable that sometimes we need to navigate various methods to make things happen. Dogs are incredibly intuitive and perceptive creatures, often understanding more than we give them credit for. While training methods differ, what truly matters is the bond and understanding we cultivate with our dogs beyond feeding and training sessions. Building a strong connection extends beyond specific activities; it's about trust, consistency, and genuine interaction throughout our time together.
That was the most Vague answer ever. "give your dog what it needs...." isn't that what you are doing when you feed it? Seems like the logic is very contradicting. I love when people tell you what NOT to do and then don't give you an answer for what TO do.
Thank you for watching the video. If you are a follower of my channel, you'll know what I meant by "giving what your dog what it needs and it will give you what you need" concept. It is my mistake that I've not been clear on that in my video but there are cards on the video that you could click to watch where I explain what a dog needs are. In any way, here is the video that I meant and please let me know if you have any questions. ua-cam.com/video/7PLTj5zNSVw/v-deo.html
Treats make them more salivated and makes them fatter....
Those are great points that you've made. Using treats also causes dog to develop health issues. ua-cam.com/video/S2DulURA41w/v-deo.html
The breed I am getting (Lab retriever) tends towards obesity and the last thing I want to do is give my puppy treats so she'll obey. A dog as trainable and eager to please as a Lab shouldn't need to be fed. I see so many fat dogs these days.
Oh i see, treats make them interested because its food and thats why people use treats? But then their focus isnt on human, but on food. Food for me wouldn even work because my dogs refuse everything and idk how to fix it
I explain what you need to do in this video. Feel free to ask any follow up questions. ua-cam.com/video/WzDMiTcCaik/v-deo.html
Interesting.
Thank you. Hopefully, it made sense.
It did. I really enjoyed the video.
That burger in hand, !! We'll said
That's great. I am glad it made the point.
Hm, the history of man-dog relationship is a bit wrong imo, there have been non-working companion dogs since dogs and humans formed the first relationships, the 'jobs' just formed after that. Starting the 'history' with special breeds for special tasks is starting a bit late in the history... ^^ The treat work is not based on Pavlov, he just wrote down how it works ;-), and not all dogs are food-oriented. But of course training without treats is the way to go!!! :-)
I agree. The early relationship of humans and dogs was based on necessity and then turned into human asking the dogs to work and building a working relationship. Pavlov research had nothing to do with training dogs and it was just an experiment about learning by conditioning. Treat training method was developed based on this experience. I explain more in the following video: ua-cam.com/video/ChKuDy4lpHI/v-deo.html
So.. don't use treats to train. Then how 🤔
Use play and praise to reward your dog instead of treats. My channel is all about it.
Sorry man, I had to back the video up because I stopped paying attention when you showed the burger.
Exactly my point. Thank you for watching and paying attention. 😃😀❤
Sorry wrong key stroke. 13 month old 40 lb mix breed attacking smaller dogs, all female. No training to this point, have reviewed your basic tiring method and will proceed
No worries. I can help you out. The first and the most important tip that I have for you is to not off leash the puppy for the next 2 to 3 weeks. The puppy is not ready to be off leash yet. Something, maybe the number of dogs, is stressing it. Only off leash the puppy if it is playing nicely with the dog(s). If not, put it back on the leash and the puppy stays on the leash until it gets the point. You can watch the following video to get an example and some ideas. ua-cam.com/video/99vu4ueEaVE/v-deo.html Work on these and let e know if you have any other questions.
8 minutes watching and no information how.
Interesting that you didn't get any value out of this lesson. Maybe you were not paying attention or were looking for a quick solution but basically, I explain why you don't need to use treats as the main source of reward for your dog and if you provide what your dog needs are, your dog will give you what you need.
What do you think about giving a treat when a pup goes into his kennel?
But my dog doesn’t listen without them
That is because you and your dog are dependent on it. I explain more and how to solve this issue in the following video. ua-cam.com/video/nNNcNixSRag/v-deo.html
XOXO
U can train dogs using treats . Then use less of them .
Of course you can use treats to train dogs but it is not necessary to use it because, it makes you to be dependent on treats and your dog will also expect treats. Plus it causes dogs to develop health issues. Please watch the following video for more information. ua-cam.com/video/S2DulURA41w/v-deo.html
Saro Boghozian Ok thank u 4 the advise . If i get anoter dog i will try not 2 use them that much.
Saro Boghozian When i call my dog back sometime I just say good girl. Or give her a stroke .
That is great and more than enough.
True