Thanks for taking the time and effort of making and sharing Your videos, spreading Your knowledge. I.m.h.o. smaller "channels" like this contribute to a very large extent to the "utility" and ACTUAL value of UA-cam, rather than the bulk of "vacuous time-wasting channels" that seem to dominate the platform. Best regards.
Thanks for checking out my video. I've since started using Kapton Tape to prevent a short in the unlikely event of the shims moving. What are your thoughts on Liquid Polyimide vs Conformal Coating vs Kapton tape for these types of applications? Have you worked on cards that used shims and Putty? What are your thoughts on Aluminum Nitride shims which are an electrical isolator.
I've done 3 mods with copper shims, all was long shims, not individual for each M. module. Why long? to compensate for the hotter M chips and spread it. All 3 cards alive with no issues and good temps, one is already 3 years since I've done it. If done properly copper shims can't escape the mounting pressure therefore can't make shorts (unwanted electrical connections). Don't mount your GPU vertically can't vouch the copper shims will be there when T pads or putty dries and contracts. Also don' t go to thick with the shims take in consideration the dilation which will occur. Pure copper starts to do that at 17-18C. Copper alloy differs but, not by much. Yes, people bought shims, thickness wasn't right didn't use proper thickness pads or putty to compensate for the right thickness, mounted card vertically and kaboom they shorted it because copper shims slipped from initial mounting their place. Another factor-- pads may dry and shrink in time losing grip of the copper shim letting it slip but that is only on vertical GPU mounts. If you mount horizontally your GPU even the sandwich materials dry out copper shims can't slip. Needless to say you can't expect a copper mod to be unchecked at least every 2 years at depending on the quality of pads or putty you combine with. I know your channel and I really respect your work and effort. Yes if done careless copper mods will destroy your card. The 2 video of your containing failed copper mods was actually made up copper square that didn't fit properly in one case, while on the other case sandwich was not made properly. Also in one case the copper mod was expected to make perfect contact with the cold copper plate, plain stupid. Also Kapton tape is not a solution!!!! will heat trap all the components you cover with Kapton SMD, capacitors etc. Anybody knows heat threshold on those parts how long they last at certain temps????? Nope! So why do it ? You are under the impression that your GPU doesn't need the power rails working? I don't consider Copper Mods dangerous, if done properly. Copper shims will work always because of the NiZn plating of many cold plates now days, will improve the loss from Ni and get some more in top of that.
NYC. What thickness range Copper shims do you use? Or how do you go about determining the thickness? I'm convinced. I'm going to take the extra time to captain tape and put shims/putty.
As a general guideline for MAXIMUM shim thickness, I recommend not exceeding 75% of the stock thermal pad thickness. For the cards I worked on, most used pads around the 2mm mark. I measure the factory pads when I remove them using digital calipers (very carefully). Most of the cards have been 1.8mm gap, and I've used 1.6mm shims (leaving 0.1mm of putty on either side). When the card is still assembled, you can often measure the total gap between PCB and backplate, and sometimes PCB and cooler (depending on card design). I can then measure compinent height off PCB and crunch the numbers, comparing to the pad thickness I find once disassembled. Now that we have even higher performing putties available, I would probably go with a shim that is 50-60% thermal pad thickness, and guve a little more room for putty to squish easily. So for a 2mm thermal pad (1.8mm gap), I would probably use around 1mm shims and have 0.4mm of putty on either side. If using shims I think there is a case for using a putty that is sticky, rather than clay like. This will help it adhere to the shim material and keep it in place. It's also important to clean all surface very well before application, ensuring any oils and dirt are removed, which can negatively effect adhesion.
Yes, unfortunately it is now obsolete. It was such a great product. I wish I had more of it. **EDIT: T-Global has some non-silicone based putties but I've since found out they conduct electricity so I've edited this comment in hopes more people can avoid ordering the product. I've also ordered some Jeyi Thermal Putty off Aliexpress which claims to be rated at 10 W/mK. I'll be testing it out as well.
@@snarksdomain I know your trying to fill in the gap of the thermal pad but you don’t need to use that much putty. It can actually cause higher temps with too much applied. I’m sure you know this, but everyone on the internet has an opinion lol.
@@LegionGamingTV The TG-NSP80 is a great performer but expensive. JEYI is decent and a bit more expensive than TG-PP10. I have some putties that should arrive in the next week or so. I still need to order some TG-NSP50 to test to see if it will perform well. It's more affordable than the others, and as we can see from the tests I've run, thermal conductivity ratings don't line up with actual performance a lot of times.
If you broke a screw off, what I've done in the past, using a drill bit tip with a spacer tube on it to keep it centered, drill a hole in the center of the broken screw, and cut threads into the broken screw, & then you can use liquid-lock-nut you new screw into the new threads you cut into the hold broken screw, this may not work for you unless you have a way to cut threads for a screw this small. Or grab the bottom of the screw if it passes through the the board from the other side. You could also try drilling a hole into the broke half of the screw, & with a toothpick inside of a coffee straw from WaWa or 7-11, put fractions of a drop of epoxy on both sides, along with a rod glued into half of one screw, & marry to two screw halfs back together along with the rod, this is if it is a clean break on the screw, you in the end you'll be gluing the screw back into one piece with a metal rod running between both ends, how they fix broken femur after a bad alpine skiing fall. OR you can do what I've done in the past, buy better screws of a higher grade steel, but I was only doing this because I wanted screws that matched the rest of the ones I had in all of my water blocks. If you just type in "screw" in amazon's search & hit search it will give you a menu to pick the specs you're looking for, with the screw cap type, its threading, color, etc You can not go with steel, & go maybe with nylon, this way you can't damage much with them, you're not going to torque them down so hard, & if you to snap one, easy to drill out. Really I never tried them, could be way too weak to use, but if they're not, could be best. The real reason I used other screws was an ex/gf that wanted me to stop playing games on the PC, so she loosened screws on a water pump housing so the seal would leak, hoping to break my PC so I'd spend more time with her, so I bought tamper proof screws & replaced the crazy gf. ...all she did was burn up my pump & flood my desk, luck for me the pump was in the lowest point of the PC, & yes running MOST if not all water pumps dry will kill them fast.
You're ballsy for not using any kapton tape, but a really good informational video! I'm still waiting for my batch of TG-PP10. You should try MX4/MX5 instead of TG-PP10 for the next 3090 so we can compare TG-PP10 vs thermal paste. #science
Thanks for mentioning Kapton Tape, I may do that in the future. As for the MX4/5, I likely won't do that on a GPU, but I'll do it on the test apparatus I made for testing stuff like this. I personally don't think Thermal Paste is the right product to use in this application as they bake and dry out over time. They also aren't designed as a gap filler, but rather designed to fill imperfections between CPU and cooler. I'll still test it out on the hot plate though. I hope your order arrives at some point. TG-PP10 has been discontinued unfortunately, so now I'm hunting for a replacement and will test a few out. Update: I've ordered some Kapton tape and will use that going forward. Thanks for the tip 😀
@@snarksdomain My TG-PP10 lead time is still says no lead time... Wonder how long it's going to take. Also, is the putty reusable? I have some on an 3080 XC3 that I want to copper mod. Did you use 1.8mm copper shims?
@@jvu316 I assume you ordered from Digikey? If they invoiced you then it's on the way. I definitely reuse the putty. As long as it can be shaped and is clean the it's good. It may be harder to squeeze out of the piping bag with stuff that is a couple years old, but will still work just fine. I just wish I could have ordered a couple more 1KG tubs of it before it got discontinued.
@@jvu316 almost forgot. I used 1.6mm copper shims here. The gap brmetween the VRAM and Coldplate is ~1.80mm so in this case it left 0.2mm to be filled wirh thr putty (0.1mm either side). I'd be cautious in using shims thicker than 1.6mm. Even going to 1.5mm shims would work well. I bought 16 gauge copper as it was the closest size available. The next available size was ~1.2mm which could also work well. I've seen some people use little copper squares measuring 15x15mm but I'd recommend cutting your own coper strips if you have the means. This way there isn't any excess hanging over the edge.
Where did you get your copper sheet . Also what thickness would you recommend if i wanted to use mx4 thermal paste. They do not make the putty anymore. 1.8mm? 1.9mm please let me know thank you in advanced.
I bought 16 gauge copper sheet from a local store that sells different kinds of metals. The sheet I got was exactly 1.60mm (as listed in the video description) I'd still recommend putty. My current best advice would be to buy some Jeyi Putty on Aliexpress. You can watch my video where I test 2 new putties. Will have another video at some point with 3 other putties, once they arrive.
You are correct. It stopped being sold last year in the spring, although there had been some limited stock at Digikey. Now we have lots of other and luckily better options for putty. Currently the 2 best putties are Penchem TH949-1 and EVGA Putty The next best putty is Jeyi 8100 (found in Lenovo gaming laptops), followed by Penchem TH855-5. Finally there is Penchem TH930 which achieves the same performance as TG-PP10 did.
I couldnt get from digikey either...i found K5 pro putty as a good replacement....and thermaltake TFX as a close second for paste with putty-like properties ( thick, chunky, wet but not runny)
The best putties available are now: Penchem TH949-1 Jeyi 8100 Penchem TH855-5 Penchem TH930 ...all of which either match or outperform TG-PP10's performance
Aren't you supposed to use thermal grease (the same stuff you use on the die) between either backplate-shim or VRAM chip - shim and fill the remaining gap with the putty? Also, the thermal pads that aren't on the VRAM can't be replaced by putty. I've been in contact with the manufacturer of the K5-PRO putty and they confirmed that some (or all) of the other thermal pads are also necessary for proper alignment of the cooler. Also, putty without the shims might not be enough to transfer the large amount of heat the GDDR6X chips put out.
I've had no issues using just putty on several GDDR6X cards (mostly 3080's) and have at least 1 video documenting that. I've done at least 3 3080 FE's, an EVGA 3080 XC3, an ASUS TUF 3080, and a Strix 3090 with just Putty and no shims or thermal pads. For every card where I've only used putty it was never worse than the stock pads. When I did my own 3090 there was only a few degrees of improvement over stock pads which is why I went to shims. K5Pro is only rated at 5 W/mK so that's not surprising. This stuff works really well, but is unfortunately discontinued so I'm hunting down an alternative. As for paste with shims, I believe the gaps are larger than paste/grease was designed for. With the way paste will bake/dry and pump out I don't think it's the best product for a shim application.
Tell me. you were or are mining and your cards are overclocked. I buy mining cards and everyone I buy from says they undervolted their cards and don’t overclock them. In my mind I call bullshit on that. Am I correct? I do clean and repaste all the cards. Haven’t tried the copper heatsinks and putty, but would like to try. What thickness are your copper heatsinks?
My gut says you are correct. I would call bullshit too. So I did, and still do, mine on cards (and also game on my 3090). Most cards you see out there were likely only mining Ethereum back when that was possible, which is memory intensive, but not core intensive. Nearly everyone was using similar settings for the most part, which was to lock to core fairly low, run fixed fan speeds (which is actually better than variable, for motor/bearing life), and overclocking the memory. The goal was to make cards memory bandwidth as fast as possible while using as little power as possible, and maintaining stability. The stability part was crucial, because if a rig went down for 8 hours while you slept, you'd lose out on a lot of profit. GDDR6X ran hotter than GDDR6, but GDDR6 could still get hot, especially with the inconsistencies we saw with stock thermal pads. The issue with Nvidia GPU's that had GDDR6 was that nobody knew what temperature the VRAM was. We'd only notice if it wasn't stable, or if the hashrate was lower (thermal throttled). On the other hand, cards with GDDR6X ran hotter, but had Memory Junction Temperatures so folks would know if the temperatures got too high, and this temperatures were discussed quite a bit by the UA-camrs everyone was learning from and following. I hope that gives a rough overview of the previous phase of mining. Mining now is all over the place, and varied. Some algorithms are only core intensive, with memory locked at an idle. Others are a mix of core and memory, and some are similar to how Ethereum was. In general, the folks mining now keep a close eye on card temperatures, and will be running as efficiently as possible.
I went with 1.6mm copper shims for a 2mm pad that gets squished down to 1.8mm (leaving 0.1mm putty on either side). Even 1mm shims will see and improvement though. These days I mostly opt for a higher performing Thermal Putty by itself, and no shims.
@@snarksdomainThank-you so much for your response. Your videos are simply awesome and I’m glad I found you. I build high end gaming rigs but buy used cards all the time. Many are former mining cards. I also buy from a local guy who buys broken cards and fixes them. Never had one come back……so he must know what he’s doing. I’ve always looked for a better way to cool the memory and your vids have given me a path forward. once again…….thank you.
To help quantify the reward of overclocking the memory during ETH days, we would often see ~20% more hashrate, meaning 20% more revenue. During the peak, that could have meant an extra couple dollars per card per day.
Looks like you will want to use 2 different thicknesses for core side and backplate side. You will need to measure to be sure, but it looks like the stock pad sizes for VRAM are 1mm on core side and 2mm of backplate side. In this case I would recommend 0.5-0.7mm shim core side, and 1.5-1.6mm shim on backplate side. And use a thermal putty either side of the shims. And putty on all other components. Then use something like PTM7950 sheet for the GPU core itself That being said, you may want use one of the newer and much higher performing thermal putties that I've tested, and avoid shims altogether. Currently, I am recommending Upsiren UX Pro thermal putty for VRAM, VRM, etc. And Honeywell PTM7950 sheet for GPU core. Here is a video I found where someone is replacing the stock pads for your card and they post the thicknesses. ua-cam.com/video/qzDLGvIMPGc/v-deo.html
Or you could just get Thermalright Odyssey thermal pads and get a 20-30 degree improvement. My 3090 was hovering in the high 90's. Replaced the pads with the aforementioned ones and now memory temps are almost the same as hotspot, @81c, where it ideally should be.
These days I mostly just use Thermal Putty by itself. Now we have found much higher performing putties available. Feel free to check out the charts at the link in my channel about page. I have an older chart that has putty/pads/shims compared aide by side. I consider the chart Obsolete as I've made large improvements to my testing and am retesting everything. Will start testing Thermal Pads again soon and add to the Testbench 2.1 charts.
@@snarksdomain Thanks for sharing your video. It is interesting to watch! I can recommend Thermalright's Odyssey pads. Excellent quality and performance. A bit pricy, but worth it.
@TechnologyHive I'll be sure to test those pads out on my test card. If you decide to stick with pads, you might want to try GPURisers thermals pads. From my previous tests, they were the best performing traditional thermal pad, but were bested by the top thermal putties. 3D Grpahite pads basically marched the top performing thermal putties, but are single use so would beat be used with a Phase Change Material that would last many years (Like Honeywell PTM7950, Upsiren PCM-1, or Thermalright Helios).
I buy copper sheet and cut my own using a mitre saw and hack saw. Smoothing the edges with a 400 grit water stone (sandpaper would work as well). I'll make a video soon showing what I do.
@snarksdomain. Thank you for making this video. Very informative. Thank you for also recommending TG NSP-80. Can you post the measurements of your copper shims?
I've got the dimmensions of the shims listed in the description, but have pasted them below for your convenience. I would note some cards may need thinner shims depending on gap between VRAM and Coldplate. I think a TUF 3080 would need closer to 1.3mm shims vs 1.6mm but I will confirm that when I shim my TUF 3080. Copper Shim Dimmensions: =========================== One GDDR6X module 14mm x 12mm x 1.6mm Two GDDR6X modules (for other cards like some 3080's) 14mm x 25mm x 1.6mm 3 GDDR6X modules 14mm x 37.5mm x 1.6mm 4 GDDR6X modules 14mm x 50.5mm x 1.6mm
Not sure if you saw my other warning vieo but avoid using TG-NSP80. It conducts electricity so not safe for GPU's as we initially thought. T-Global has updated their datasheet accordingly
i wuld not use copper becouse it can get hot enough to melt of the solder if its slightly out of alighment... i coodked off a mem chip with it becouse it moved around when the putty i was using went too soft
Hmmm....that seems quite odd. I can't see the copper becoming hotter than the VRAM itself. Many have been running GDDR6X at 110 Celcius and this mod helps to keep it below 90 Celcius or better. The copper can't become hotter than the VRAM as the VRAM is the source of the heat. You definitely want to use a quality putty and not paste or K5 Pro (viscous paste that boils/out gasses). Which putty were you using?
@@snarksdomain i used quality stuff and the angle of the card contributed to the copper moving... it deffinetly wasnt hotter than the vram but it was hot enough to udo the solder
Using copper pads it might be possible to thermal epoxy into position on the heatsink. You would need to be absolutely sure if the gaps first though so that you get the perfect shim size.
@@Justin-sm1no It's in stock on the Canadian site too and can be added to cart. Still obolete...but currently in stock. I have some new info I hope to share soon but have to check on a couple things before I do.
I bought 4" x 12" copper sheet at a local metal store and cut them into 14mm strips using a mitre saw and then cut them to length either with the mitre saw or a hacksaw. I then smooth the edges off on a 400 grit water stone. Sandpaper would also work well.
I plan to keep using old putty as it is no longer made. In this video I applied new putty whe I did the shims even though the stuff I took off was only 2 days old since it was easier to use what I already had in the piping bag. Sometimes when I take a card apart I'll find areas where there is a little dust on an edge of putty and I'll toss that tiny bit, but save all the clean stuff. I put it back in a putty tub and seal that in a large Zip-lock bag.
@@svenstasch1739 3 cans? What size? A laptop would likely need around 50-80 grams I think. I never weighed the putty when I did my laptop unfortunately.
you have to have a very thin layer between the shim and the memory, superglue in my experience works best by far but also very hard /dangerous to remove. ideally you would just do super thin ca layer on top of mem, copper shim and then I have very good results adding the rest of the shims to either the heatsink or the backplate
Not sure I'd want to use Super Glue. It's only got a Thermal Conductivity of 0.2W/mK but would keep the copper shims in place for sure. I'm not too worried about the shims shifting around as the putty doesn't bake/dry like Thermal Paste does, but I will be redoing this card and using Kaptop tape as mentioned by Justin.
@@snarksdomain thats the thing, its weird, even with its very low conductivity something about the extreme pressure superglue bonds things with i think significantly powers it up for thermal applications, at the bare minimum try supergluing the excess shims onto the backplate, it looks absolutely amazing too, some gpus i have made very heavy backplates out of those shims and it can lower the temp 20-30c more than stock
@@RonnieMcNutt666 Thanks for the info. I may try some Thermal epoxy on an old R9 290X for fun. I really like this putty so will keep using it until it runs out, and hopefully find a good replacement putty at some point. I don't plan to use pads anytime soon on any components.
It's quite different. Thermal paste: -typically low viscosity -designed to fill tiny voids between direct metal to metal contact from CPU/Die to cooler Thermal Putty: -high viscosity -designed as a gap filler to replace Thermal pads Now we have much better putties available that rival the performance of high end Thermal pads. You may want to watch a few of my newer videos. Current best Putty options: -Upsiren UX Pro -EVGA Putty -Penchem TH949-1 -Upsiren U6 Pro
Nice video...i was looking for a vid like this last year.. What oc settings if any?..did this putty+shim on my 3090 ftw3 ultra... i can 100% confirm I also got the same 89C average at the same hashrate...but the difference is that on the same OC..the stock air cooler was at 78C...if it wasnt for new world..I wouldnt be lucky to get an RMA last month...the replacement I got maintains that 78C...and i dont think I will open it again...
At this point I would tend to agree with you. I have had luck with just TG-PP10 Putty on several GDDR6X cards but those cards were in ideal cooling situations. Once you have cards stacked next to each other the shims are the best way to increase VRAM cooling effectiveness.
Try using copper mode using thermal paste and high heat resistance tap to cover around the memory's small component to avoid damage. I think you will get much lower temps then this result!!!
I've moved on to using Kapton Tape, but have no plans of using Thermal Paste. Thermal Putty works great and doesn't bake or dry out like Thermal paste. I'm pretty happy with these temps, especially while mining. When gaming my temps are much lower.
Yes, but It require hi precision thermal pad (in micrometers), ideal contact with cooling system аnd minimum thermal grease (only for filling very small surface roughness). But It's not easy, due to curvature cooling system. It big work for many hours. Liquid thermal grease (like TG-PP10) - easyly solution for lazy manufacturers :-) .
The copper shims aren't really doing anything since the TG-PP10 is going to be the weakest link between the memory and the heatsink. I've tried the shims + TG-PP10 and also generic 1mm pad on the memory and temperatures were pretty much identical. I've also used straight putty by itself and some cards will work fine for a few months but after that the temperature start going over 100c again probably because too much TG-PP10 will cause it likely to wiggle around in the long-term even though the putty itself is still good. The only reason I experimented so much is because I bought the largest tub of TG-PP10 last year and didn't realize it has a shelf-life of only two years.
Not sure I agree with you in the shims doing nothing. The gap that the TG-PP10 fills is negligible in my applications and I've achieved personal record low MJT with aggressive overclocks this way.
I did prior to applying TG-PP10 the first time around. It's not required to remove residual TG-PP10 as long as any dust or dirt hasn't accumulated. I usually use a soft toothbrush and 99% Isopropyl to scrub the nooks and crannies.
TG-PP10 was the only putty I knew of back then. Now we have much higher performing putties. Feel free to go to my UA-cam channel description and find the Google Drive link. I post all my up to date charts there (with logging ambient temps in real time) Kaptop tape is good, and I've used it 9n a couple other cards with shims+putty. If I were to shim a card now I'd likely go woth Conformal coating (MG Chemicals 422C, floureceses under UV light).
Well done, and thank you. Great video. Worked to little with putty and used only one, OEM. But certainly now I will use it more often. Is very handy when some cards got 3 different thicknesses on the pads. I know is messy to clean it up, when dried out, but hey is very useful to. If you hash your card consider adding 2x 92 mm like in this video ua-cam.com/video/MfaVVInZt5A/v-deo.html I really think will help out. You can try 120 mm but, I found 92 mm working better, see the results yourself. Is an old mod I use, first in 2000 and now I'm happy to use it again. You have to take in consideration my 120 mm exhaust fan in close proximity of the GPU has no grill now and that helped to in cooling VRAM in the end of the day that was my aim. If I'd seen 10C less in gaming is worth trying for hashing.
@pete0274 lately I've been using higher performing outties without adding shims into the mix. Although a 3090 can still benefit from shims on the backplate, m9st other cards don't have the same VRAM thermak issues. You may want to check out my "Thermal Putty Guide" video and also take a peak at the charts located at the Google Drive link in video description (Test Chart Repository>VRAM TIM>ETCHASH). Some really great putties available these days.
@@snarksdomain I had quiet a hefty amount of cards having thermal problems and in gaming not hashing( which is more aggressive in rising the temps) in my experience. So I've done copper mods and fans or only copper or only fans on the backplate. Copper backplate crafted instead of plastic coated aluminum or painted or whatever manufacturer thrown at people. Other factors was dust, dust and humidity, bad cases , silent fans only mods and others. That's why went to from the simple and cheaper mods to to more complicated with sandwich of heatsinks and so on. For example RTX A 4000 - 5000 are great cards but, requires cooling mods. Mostly blower cards does. "Although a 3090 can still benefit from shims on the backplate" of course so does 3070 and 3080s but, I was referring to 92 mm fans. Although for a 3090 that is hashed I would go with a new copper backplate and a square low profile heatsink over VRAM and GPU area. I' ll do that for any card that also have VRAM on both sides of the PCB. Al will do for the low profile heatsink. I checked your other video on story of Upsiren, that is good enough for the start and I'll go from there to higher quality if need it.
@pete0274 I honestly wouldn't go with either of the putties from that video. There are much better outties and often similar price or cheaper. In your scenario, I'd recommend one of 3 Thermal Putties. 1) Upsiren UTP-8, which is only slightly behind Honeywell HT10000 in performance, but can often be bought for a d3al of 3x100g for ~$31 CAD each. That would do 6 typical cards (50g each) or 4x 3090's. 2) CX-H1300 13.5w is one of the best budget puttiws and only a few degrees behind the Upsiren UTP-8 in performance, but at a much cheaper price. Can usually get 70g for arpund $15 CAD. It has been stiffer lately, ut I feel like you could master it since you've done a lot of copper shim jobs and would quickly become good at manipulating it. Still softer than. Pads, so you'd do fine with it and great price per gram. 3) If you wanted to use putty with shims (longer lasting than paste with shims), then I'd recommend getting some Halnziye HY236 or HY256 as it is very sof5 and an ideal putty to use with shims. For shim size you'd want to go 0.2 or 0.3mm smaller than the gap si,e between VRAM and Cooler, that way you'd easily compress the putty down to a thin layer on both sides and still get great core contact. For the cores I'd recommend buying a bulk 400x160mm sheetof Honeywell PTM7950. It lasts longer than paste and often gets better performance than pastes.
So I came here to see another copper mod in order to plan mine, but I also know you are an evil miner who is driving GPU prices up. Mind self-blown. Oh, and your putty fail was down to using far too much.
Heh. Thanks for the comment. The memory temps on GDDR6X while mining are quite high in general. This card was sent to me to get copper molded, but decided I'd try putty on it first. I've had great results on some 3080's, namely the FE's, woth just putty, but the 3090 lacks active cooling on the backplate so it will always run hotter. I may be a miner, but I'm a gamer first. I only found out about mining when I went to build a new gaming rig, as my 8+ year old FX-8370 and R9 290X 4GB were showing their age. Couldn't find a videocard in stock anywhere and was like "What is going on?". Bit the bullet and bought a card off Kijiji for a slightly over MSRP and started mining. Ran the numbers and was shocked to realize I could have had my computer buy it's own upgrades every ~4 years. Getting cards at MSRP had been harder than normal but not impossible. I got my first MSRP 3080 from Memory Express about 13 months ago. Just put my name down for a card and waited a few months and it came in. They even honored the original lower MSRP from when I put my name down. Since then I've helped several gamer friends and associates realize mining on one overpriced card is a good way for it to help pay off the price difference if not pay for the card completely. We'll have to wait another 3 years before that will be true again. Will be interesting to see what GPU's are like then performance wise. Maybe they'll be so powerful we'll be able to see into the past/future 😆.
That's where I apply TG-PP10 Thermal Putty using an Icing Piping Bag. I found it works much easier and cleaner than other methods. I'm using the 1/4" round tip. Looks like some other Thermal Putties come in syringes right from the manufacturer, such as A7000 and TG-NSP80.
Thanks for taking the time and effort of making and sharing Your videos, spreading Your knowledge.
I.m.h.o. smaller "channels" like this contribute to a very large extent to the "utility" and ACTUAL value of UA-cam, rather than the bulk of "vacuous time-wasting channels" that seem to dominate the platform.
Best regards.
Anyone following "copper shims" advice, be sure to add me to your favorites because once you kill your card, i am the man to see.
Thanks for checking out my video.
I've since started using Kapton Tape to prevent a short in the unlikely event of the shims moving.
What are your thoughts on Liquid Polyimide vs Conformal Coating vs Kapton tape for these types of applications?
Have you worked on cards that used shims and Putty?
What are your thoughts on Aluminum Nitride shims which are an electrical isolator.
Thermal glue/ epoxy your shims onto the heatsink
I've done 3 mods with copper shims, all was long shims, not individual for each M. module. Why long? to compensate for the hotter M chips and spread it. All 3 cards alive with no issues and good temps, one is already 3 years since I've done it. If done properly copper shims can't escape the mounting pressure therefore can't make shorts (unwanted electrical connections). Don't mount your GPU vertically can't vouch the copper shims will be there when T pads or putty dries and contracts. Also don' t go to thick with the shims take in consideration the dilation which will occur. Pure copper starts to do that at 17-18C. Copper alloy differs but, not by much.
Yes, people bought shims, thickness wasn't right didn't use proper thickness pads or putty to compensate for the right thickness, mounted card vertically and kaboom they shorted it because copper shims slipped from initial mounting their place. Another factor-- pads may dry and shrink in time losing grip of the copper shim letting it slip but that is only on vertical GPU mounts. If you mount horizontally your GPU even the sandwich materials dry out copper shims can't slip. Needless to say you can't expect a copper mod to be unchecked at least every 2 years at depending on the quality of pads or putty you combine with.
I know your channel and I really respect your work and effort. Yes if done careless copper mods will destroy your card. The 2 video of your containing failed copper mods was actually made up copper square that didn't fit properly in one case, while on the other case sandwich was not made properly. Also in one case the copper mod was expected to make perfect contact with the cold copper plate, plain stupid.
Also Kapton tape is not a solution!!!! will heat trap all the components you cover with Kapton SMD, capacitors etc. Anybody knows heat threshold on those parts how long they last at certain temps????? Nope! So why do it ? You are under the impression that your GPU doesn't need the power rails working?
I don't consider Copper Mods dangerous, if done properly. Copper shims will work always because of the NiZn plating of many cold plates now days, will improve the loss from Ni and get some more in top of that.
Thank you so much for all the time you spent making this video available for us. Great Testing!
it looks like icing on cake, nice stuff there bro.
NYC. What thickness range Copper shims do you use? Or how do you go about determining the thickness? I'm convinced. I'm going to take the extra time to captain tape and put shims/putty.
As a general guideline for MAXIMUM shim thickness, I recommend not exceeding 75% of the stock thermal pad thickness. For the cards I worked on, most used pads around the 2mm mark.
I measure the factory pads when I remove them using digital calipers (very carefully). Most of the cards have been 1.8mm gap, and I've used 1.6mm shims (leaving 0.1mm of putty on either side).
When the card is still assembled, you can often measure the total gap between PCB and backplate, and sometimes PCB and cooler (depending on card design). I can then measure compinent height off PCB and crunch the numbers, comparing to the pad thickness I find once disassembled.
Now that we have even higher performing putties available, I would probably go with a shim that is 50-60% thermal pad thickness, and guve a little more room for putty to squish easily. So for a 2mm thermal pad (1.8mm gap), I would probably use around 1mm shims and have 0.4mm of putty on either side.
If using shims I think there is a case for using a putty that is sticky, rather than clay like. This will help it adhere to the shim material and keep it in place. It's also important to clean all surface very well before application, ensuring any oils and dirt are removed, which can negatively effect adhesion.
TG-PP10 looks to be OOS and is obsolete according to Digikey. Any alternatives?
Yes, unfortunately it is now obsolete. It was such a great product. I wish I had more of it.
**EDIT: T-Global has some non-silicone based putties but I've since found out they conduct electricity so I've edited this comment in hopes more people can avoid ordering the product.
I've also ordered some Jeyi Thermal Putty off Aliexpress which claims to be rated at 10 W/mK. I'll be testing it out as well.
I'm sometimes tempted to throw my cards in a tank of oil and call it a day.
I'm here for the putty suggestions
@@snarksdomain Did you ever try any of the other products? I have maybe 5 bottles of 50g left of tgpp10
@@snarksdomain I know your trying to fill in the gap of the thermal pad but you don’t need to use that much putty. It can actually cause higher temps with too much applied. I’m sure you know this, but everyone on the internet has an opinion lol.
@@LegionGamingTV The TG-NSP80 is a great performer but expensive. JEYI is decent and a bit more expensive than TG-PP10. I have some putties that should arrive in the next week or so.
I still need to order some TG-NSP50 to test to see if it will perform well. It's more affordable than the others, and as we can see from the tests I've run, thermal conductivity ratings don't line up with actual performance a lot of times.
Imagine you bought a second hand 3090 and you found a hole kg of some ramdom compound over its components
....or even just a retail EVGA 3080 or 3090.
If you broke a screw off, what I've done in the past, using a drill bit tip with a spacer tube on it to keep it centered, drill a hole in the center of the broken screw, and cut threads into the broken screw, & then you can use liquid-lock-nut you new screw into the new threads you cut into the hold broken screw, this may not work for you unless you have a way to cut threads for a screw this small.
Or grab the bottom of the screw if it passes through the the board from the other side.
You could also try drilling a hole into the broke half of the screw, & with a toothpick inside of a coffee straw from WaWa or 7-11, put fractions of a drop of epoxy on both sides, along with a rod glued into half of one screw, & marry to two screw halfs back together along with the rod, this is if it is a clean break on the screw, you in the end you'll be gluing the screw back into one piece with a metal rod running between both ends, how they fix broken femur after a bad alpine skiing fall.
OR you can do what I've done in the past, buy better screws of a higher grade steel, but I was only doing this because I wanted screws that matched the rest of the ones I had in all of my water blocks. If you just type in "screw" in amazon's search & hit search it will give you a menu to pick the specs you're looking for, with the screw cap type, its threading, color, etc
You can not go with steel, & go maybe with nylon, this way you can't damage much with them, you're not going to torque them down so hard, & if you to snap one, easy to drill out. Really I never tried them, could be way too weak to use, but if they're not, could be best.
The real reason I used other screws was an ex/gf that wanted me to stop playing games on the PC, so she loosened screws on a water pump housing so the seal would leak, hoping to break my PC so I'd spend more time with her, so I bought tamper proof screws & replaced the crazy gf. ...all she did was burn up my pump & flood my desk, luck for me the pump was in the lowest point of the PC, & yes running MOST if not all water pumps dry will kill them fast.
You're ballsy for not using any kapton tape, but a really good informational video! I'm still waiting for my batch of TG-PP10. You should try MX4/MX5 instead of TG-PP10 for the next 3090 so we can compare TG-PP10 vs thermal paste. #science
Thanks for mentioning Kapton Tape, I may do that in the future. As for the MX4/5, I likely won't do that on a GPU, but I'll do it on the test apparatus I made for testing stuff like this.
I personally don't think Thermal Paste is the right product to use in this application as they bake and dry out over time. They also aren't designed as a gap filler, but rather designed to fill imperfections between CPU and cooler. I'll still test it out on the hot plate though.
I hope your order arrives at some point. TG-PP10 has been discontinued unfortunately, so now I'm hunting for a replacement and will test a few out.
Update: I've ordered some Kapton tape and will use that going forward. Thanks for the tip 😀
@@snarksdomain My TG-PP10 lead time is still says no lead time... Wonder how long it's going to take. Also, is the putty reusable? I have some on an 3080 XC3 that I want to copper mod. Did you use 1.8mm copper shims?
@@jvu316 I assume you ordered from Digikey? If they invoiced you then it's on the way.
I definitely reuse the putty. As long as it can be shaped and is clean the it's good. It may be harder to squeeze out of the piping bag with stuff that is a couple years old, but will still work just fine. I just wish I could have ordered a couple more 1KG tubs of it before it got discontinued.
@@jvu316 almost forgot. I used 1.6mm copper shims here. The gap brmetween the VRAM and Coldplate is ~1.80mm so in this case it left 0.2mm to be filled wirh thr putty (0.1mm either side). I'd be cautious in using shims thicker than 1.6mm. Even going to 1.5mm shims would work well.
I bought 16 gauge copper as it was the closest size available. The next available size was ~1.2mm which could also work well.
I've seen some people use little copper squares measuring 15x15mm but I'd recommend cutting your own coper strips if you have the means. This way there isn't any excess hanging over the edge.
@@snarksdomain Is it best to store the putty in the fridge?
Where did you get your copper sheet .
Also what thickness would you recommend if i wanted to use mx4 thermal paste.
They do not make the putty anymore.
1.8mm? 1.9mm please let me know thank you in advanced.
I bought 16 gauge copper sheet from a local store that sells different kinds of metals. The sheet I got was exactly 1.60mm (as listed in the video description)
I'd still recommend putty. My current best advice would be to buy some Jeyi Putty on Aliexpress. You can watch my video where I test 2 new putties. Will have another video at some point with 3 other putties, once they arrive.
Mx4 + 5 suffer pump out, mx6 apparently is more stable.
I don’t think u can get this putty anymore, what’s an alternative to it?
You are correct. It stopped being sold last year in the spring, although there had been some limited stock at Digikey.
Now we have lots of other and luckily better options for putty.
Currently the 2 best putties are Penchem TH949-1 and EVGA Putty
The next best putty is Jeyi 8100 (found in Lenovo gaming laptops), followed by Penchem TH855-5.
Finally there is Penchem TH930 which achieves the same performance as TG-PP10 did.
@@snarksdomain thank you very much for the info. I been searching everywhere without a clue of where to find it or the equivalent version of it.
Very good video, Thanks for the informations 👍
I'm glad you found it useful :)
I couldnt get from digikey either...i found K5 pro putty as a good replacement....and thermaltake TFX as a close second for paste with putty-like properties ( thick, chunky, wet but not runny)
K5 pro is a mess don't do it
The best putties available are now:
Penchem TH949-1
Jeyi 8100
Penchem TH855-5
Penchem TH930
...all of which either match or outperform TG-PP10's performance
Aren't you supposed to use thermal grease (the same stuff you use on the die) between either backplate-shim or VRAM chip - shim and fill the remaining gap with the putty?
Also, the thermal pads that aren't on the VRAM can't be replaced by putty. I've been in contact with the manufacturer of the K5-PRO putty and they confirmed that some (or all) of the other thermal pads are also necessary for proper alignment of the cooler.
Also, putty without the shims might not be enough to transfer the large amount of heat the GDDR6X chips put out.
I've had no issues using just putty on several GDDR6X cards (mostly 3080's) and have at least 1 video documenting that. I've done at least 3 3080 FE's, an EVGA 3080 XC3, an ASUS TUF 3080, and a Strix 3090 with just Putty and no shims or thermal pads.
For every card where I've only used putty it was never worse than the stock pads. When I did my own 3090 there was only a few degrees of improvement over stock pads which is why I went to shims.
K5Pro is only rated at 5 W/mK so that's not surprising. This stuff works really well, but is unfortunately discontinued so I'm hunting down an alternative.
As for paste with shims, I believe the gaps are larger than paste/grease was designed for. With the way paste will bake/dry and pump out I don't think it's the best product for a shim application.
It's not k5 pro
Tell me. you were or are mining and your cards are overclocked. I buy mining cards and everyone I buy from says they undervolted their cards and don’t overclock them. In my mind I call bullshit on that. Am I correct? I do clean and repaste all the cards. Haven’t tried the copper heatsinks and putty, but would like to try. What thickness are your copper heatsinks?
My gut says you are correct. I would call bullshit too.
So I did, and still do, mine on cards (and also game on my 3090). Most cards you see out there were likely only mining Ethereum back when that was possible, which is memory intensive, but not core intensive.
Nearly everyone was using similar settings for the most part, which was to lock to core fairly low, run fixed fan speeds (which is actually better than variable, for motor/bearing life), and overclocking the memory.
The goal was to make cards memory bandwidth as fast as possible while using as little power as possible, and maintaining stability. The stability part was crucial, because if a rig went down for 8 hours while you slept, you'd lose out on a lot of profit.
GDDR6X ran hotter than GDDR6, but GDDR6 could still get hot, especially with the inconsistencies we saw with stock thermal pads. The issue with Nvidia GPU's that had GDDR6 was that nobody knew what temperature the VRAM was. We'd only notice if it wasn't stable, or if the hashrate was lower (thermal throttled). On the other hand, cards with GDDR6X ran hotter, but had Memory Junction Temperatures so folks would know if the temperatures got too high, and this temperatures were discussed quite a bit by the UA-camrs everyone was learning from and following.
I hope that gives a rough overview of the previous phase of mining.
Mining now is all over the place, and varied. Some algorithms are only core intensive, with memory locked at an idle. Others are a mix of core and memory, and some are similar to how Ethereum was. In general, the folks mining now keep a close eye on card temperatures, and will be running as efficiently as possible.
I went with 1.6mm copper shims for a 2mm pad that gets squished down to 1.8mm (leaving 0.1mm putty on either side).
Even 1mm shims will see and improvement though.
These days I mostly opt for a higher performing Thermal Putty by itself, and no shims.
@@snarksdomainThank-you so much for your response. Your videos are simply awesome and I’m glad I found you. I build high end gaming rigs but buy used cards all the time. Many are former mining cards. I also buy from a local guy who buys broken cards and fixes them. Never had one come back……so he must know what he’s doing. I’ve always looked for a better way to cool the memory and your vids have given me a path forward. once again…….thank you.
To help quantify the reward of overclocking the memory during ETH days, we would often see ~20% more hashrate, meaning 20% more revenue. During the peak, that could have meant an extra couple dollars per card per day.
What thickness of copper shims should I use for my inno3d RTX 3090 iChillx4 ?
Looks like you will want to use 2 different thicknesses for core side and backplate side. You will need to measure to be sure, but it looks like the stock pad sizes for VRAM are 1mm on core side and 2mm of backplate side. In this case I would recommend 0.5-0.7mm shim core side, and 1.5-1.6mm shim on backplate side. And use a thermal putty either side of the shims. And putty on all other components.
Then use something like PTM7950 sheet for the GPU core itself
That being said, you may want use one of the newer and much higher performing thermal putties that I've tested, and avoid shims altogether. Currently, I am recommending Upsiren UX Pro thermal putty for VRAM, VRM, etc. And Honeywell PTM7950 sheet for GPU core.
Here is a video I found where someone is replacing the stock pads for your card and they post the thicknesses.
ua-cam.com/video/qzDLGvIMPGc/v-deo.html
Any of you guys tried this method to dampen coil whine? Thinking of trying this method on my 3080 as the whine is driving me nuts
In theory a putty might stop caps from whining. Worth a shot. You could even still use thermal pads and just use a cheap putty around the caps.
Or you could just get Thermalright Odyssey thermal pads and get a 20-30 degree improvement. My 3090 was hovering in the high 90's. Replaced the pads with the aforementioned ones and now memory temps are almost the same as hotspot, @81c, where it ideally should be.
These days I mostly just use Thermal Putty by itself. Now we have found much higher performing putties available.
Feel free to check out the charts at the link in my channel about page.
I have an older chart that has putty/pads/shims compared aide by side. I consider the chart Obsolete as I've made large improvements to my testing and am retesting everything. Will start testing Thermal Pads again soon and add to the Testbench 2.1 charts.
@@snarksdomain Thanks for sharing your video. It is interesting to watch! I can recommend Thermalright's Odyssey pads. Excellent quality and performance. A bit pricy, but worth it.
@TechnologyHive I'll be sure to test those pads out on my test card.
If you decide to stick with pads, you might want to try GPURisers thermals pads. From my previous tests, they were the best performing traditional thermal pad, but were bested by the top thermal putties. 3D Grpahite pads basically marched the top performing thermal putties, but are single use so would beat be used with a Phase Change Material that would last many years (Like Honeywell PTM7950, Upsiren PCM-1, or Thermalright Helios).
@@snarksdomain I will be sure to check those pads out. I have heard of them, just never had the time or chance to grab some. 👍
@TechnologyHive Here's the link to the Test charts if you're interested:
drive.google.com/drive/folders/1CAJP7ojt3jaGxBrJNTzd1Kp5-gikdh_8?usp=sharing
Hey there, what is the exact thickness of the shims for the 3090?
1.6mm. All the copper shim dimensions are in the description.
Where you brought the copper shims ? any link ?
I buy copper sheet and cut my own using a mitre saw and hack saw. Smoothing the edges with a 400 grit water stone (sandpaper would work as well).
I'll make a video soon showing what I do.
@snarksdomain.
Thank you for making this video. Very informative.
Thank you for also recommending TG NSP-80.
Can you post the measurements of your copper shims?
I've got the dimmensions of the shims listed in the description, but have pasted them below for your convenience. I would note some cards may need thinner shims depending on gap between VRAM and Coldplate. I think a TUF 3080 would need closer to 1.3mm shims vs 1.6mm but I will confirm that when I shim my TUF 3080.
Copper Shim Dimmensions:
===========================
One GDDR6X module
14mm x 12mm x 1.6mm
Two GDDR6X modules (for other cards like some 3080's)
14mm x 25mm x 1.6mm
3 GDDR6X modules
14mm x 37.5mm x 1.6mm
4 GDDR6X modules
14mm x 50.5mm x 1.6mm
😅. I can’t I believe I missed that. Thanks for reposting the measurements
Not sure if you saw my other warning vieo but avoid using TG-NSP80. It conducts electricity so not safe for GPU's as we initially thought. T-Global has updated their datasheet accordingly
Top G. Thanks
i wuld not use copper becouse it can get hot enough to melt of the solder if its slightly out of alighment... i coodked off a mem chip with it becouse it moved around when the putty i was using went too soft
Hmmm....that seems quite odd. I can't see the copper becoming hotter than the VRAM itself. Many have been running GDDR6X at 110 Celcius and this mod helps to keep it below 90 Celcius or better. The copper can't become hotter than the VRAM as the VRAM is the source of the heat.
You definitely want to use a quality putty and not paste or K5 Pro (viscous paste that boils/out gasses).
Which putty were you using?
@@snarksdomain i used quality stuff and the angle of the card contributed to the copper moving... it deffinetly wasnt hotter than the vram but it was hot enough to udo the solder
@@RePlayBoy101 which brand of putty or was it a paste? I ask because the putties I've used hold shims in place very well.
Using copper pads it might be possible to thermal epoxy into position on the heatsink.
You would need to be absolutely sure if the gaps first though so that you get the perfect shim size.
I wonder if my putty will even ship. It is stuck on no lead time
Fingers crossed. You'll know it has shipped when they invoice you.
It shipped today. Better late than never lol
@@Justin-sm1no excellent!
@@snarksdomain omg they have it available to order on US site
@@Justin-sm1no It's in stock on the Canadian site too and can be added to cart. Still obolete...but currently in stock.
I have some new info I hope to share soon but have to check on a couple things before I do.
Where did you buy all those shims?
I bought 4" x 12" copper sheet at a local metal store and cut them into 14mm strips using a mitre saw and then cut them to length either with the mitre saw or a hacksaw.
I then smooth the edges off on a 400 grit water stone. Sandpaper would also work well.
Thank you
@@antonrv6269 For 1.6mm shims I used 16 gauge copper sheet. For 1.1mm shims I use 19 gauge copper sheet
I figured out the easiest way to make shims without power tools and with the lowest amount of cutting.
ua-cam.com/video/gxdFigMDXoM/v-deo.html
Do you use every time the same old putty or every repaste completely new putty?
I plan to keep using old putty as it is no longer made. In this video I applied new putty whe I did the shims even though the stuff I took off was only 2 days old since it was easier to use what I already had in the piping bag.
Sometimes when I take a card apart I'll find areas where there is a little dust on an edge of putty and I'll toss that tiny bit, but save all the clean stuff. I put it back in a putty tub and seal that in a large Zip-lock bag.
Ok thanks, I plan to made the same. I saw that pp10 is no longer made and ordered 3 cans for my 3070 laptop
@@svenstasch1739 3 cans? What size? A laptop would likely need around 50-80 grams I think. I never weighed the putty when I did my laptop unfortunately.
3 From the 30 gram can, the other sizes was sold out.
But I think 30gram is engough for my vrm vram
you have to have a very thin layer between the shim and the memory, superglue in my experience works best by far but also very hard /dangerous to remove. ideally you would just do super thin ca layer on top of mem, copper shim and then I have very good results adding the rest of the shims to either the heatsink or the backplate
Not sure I'd want to use Super Glue. It's only got a Thermal Conductivity of 0.2W/mK but would keep the copper shims in place for sure. I'm not too worried about the shims shifting around as the putty doesn't bake/dry like Thermal Paste does, but I will be redoing this card and using Kaptop tape as mentioned by Justin.
@@snarksdomain thats the thing, its weird, even with its very low conductivity something about the extreme pressure superglue bonds things with i think significantly powers it up for thermal applications, at the bare minimum try supergluing the excess shims onto the backplate, it looks absolutely amazing too, some gpus i have made very heavy backplates out of those shims and it can lower the temp 20-30c more than stock
@@RonnieMcNutt666 Thanks for the info. I may try some Thermal epoxy on an old R9 290X for fun. I really like this putty so will keep using it until it runs out, and hopefully find a good replacement putty at some point. I don't plan to use pads anytime soon on any components.
@Lurch7861 i agree, i like using a paste with copper in it too but i am very extreme, trying to have pure copper on the vram but is hard to do
Is thermal putty same as thermal paste?
It's quite different.
Thermal paste:
-typically low viscosity
-designed to fill tiny voids between direct metal to metal contact from CPU/Die to cooler
Thermal Putty:
-high viscosity
-designed as a gap filler to replace Thermal pads
Now we have much better putties available that rival the performance of high end Thermal pads. You may want to watch a few of my newer videos.
Current best Putty options:
-Upsiren UX Pro
-EVGA Putty
-Penchem TH949-1
-Upsiren U6 Pro
@@snarksdomain thanks a lot for the information.
Nice video...i was looking for a vid like this last year.. What oc settings if any?..did this putty+shim on my 3090 ftw3 ultra... i can 100% confirm I also got the same 89C average at the same hashrate...but the difference is that on the same OC..the stock air cooler was at 78C...if it wasnt for new world..I wouldnt be lucky to get an RMA last month...the replacement I got maintains that 78C...and i dont think I will open it again...
My OC settings were +1500 memory with the core locked at 1320 Mhz in Windows (MSI afterburner)
Copper shim is only solution for gddr6x
At this point I would tend to agree with you.
I have had luck with just TG-PP10 Putty on several GDDR6X cards but those cards were in ideal cooling situations. Once you have cards stacked next to each other the shims are the best way to increase VRAM cooling effectiveness.
Try using copper mode using thermal paste and high heat resistance tap to cover around the memory's small component to avoid damage. I think you will get much lower temps then this result!!!
I've moved on to using Kapton Tape, but have no plans of using Thermal Paste. Thermal Putty works great and doesn't bake or dry out like Thermal paste.
I'm pretty happy with these temps, especially while mining. When gaming my temps are much lower.
Get to the Copper!
If it mines, we can shim it.
Yes, but It require hi precision thermal pad (in micrometers), ideal contact with cooling system аnd minimum thermal grease (only for filling very small surface roughness). But It's not easy, due to curvature cooling system. It big work for many hours. Liquid thermal grease (like TG-PP10) - easyly solution for lazy manufacturers :-) .
66 grams of putty seems a little excessive...
Yeah, I probably could have used less. 50g should be fine for a 3090 with shims.
The copper shims aren't really doing anything since the TG-PP10 is going to be the weakest link between the memory and the heatsink. I've tried the shims + TG-PP10 and also generic 1mm pad on the memory and temperatures were pretty much identical. I've also used straight putty by itself and some cards will work fine for a few months but after that the temperature start going over 100c again probably because too much TG-PP10 will cause it likely to wiggle around in the long-term even though the putty itself is still good. The only reason I experimented so much is because I bought the largest tub of TG-PP10 last year and didn't realize it has a shelf-life of only two years.
Not sure I agree with you in the shims doing nothing. The gap that the TG-PP10 fills is negligible in my applications and I've achieved personal record low MJT with aggressive overclocks this way.
That’s a rectangle……..not a circle……honest mistake. I do that with shapes all the time 🥴
.....sometimes you gotta think outside the box 🤣
@@snarksdomainLol
Maaan ... use some isopropyl alkihol and clean all those nooks and crannies.
I did prior to applying TG-PP10 the first time around. It's not required to remove residual TG-PP10 as long as any dust or dirt hasn't accumulated.
I usually use a soft toothbrush and 99% Isopropyl to scrub the nooks and crannies.
Sooo……….no real change with just putty. You really should be protecting components with “captan tape” when using copper. Nice results though.
TG-PP10 was the only putty I knew of back then. Now we have much higher performing putties.
Feel free to go to my UA-cam channel description and find the Google Drive link. I post all my up to date charts there (with logging ambient temps in real time)
Kaptop tape is good, and I've used it 9n a couple other cards with shims+putty. If I were to shim a card now I'd likely go woth Conformal coating (MG Chemicals 422C, floureceses under UV light).
Well done, and thank you. Great video. Worked to little with putty and used only one, OEM. But certainly now I will use it more often. Is very handy when some cards got 3 different thicknesses on the pads. I know is messy to clean it up, when dried out, but hey is very useful to.
If you hash your card consider adding 2x 92 mm like in this video ua-cam.com/video/MfaVVInZt5A/v-deo.html I really think will help out. You can try 120 mm but, I found 92 mm working better, see the results yourself. Is an old mod I use, first in 2000 and now I'm happy to use it again. You have to take in consideration my 120 mm exhaust fan in close proximity of the GPU has no grill now and that helped to in cooling VRAM in the end of the day that was my aim. If I'd seen 10C less in gaming is worth trying for hashing.
@pete0274 lately I've been using higher performing outties without adding shims into the mix. Although a 3090 can still benefit from shims on the backplate, m9st other cards don't have the same VRAM thermak issues.
You may want to check out my "Thermal Putty Guide" video and also take a peak at the charts located at the Google Drive link in video description (Test Chart Repository>VRAM TIM>ETCHASH).
Some really great putties available these days.
@@snarksdomain I had quiet a hefty amount of cards having thermal problems and in gaming not hashing( which is more aggressive in rising the temps) in my experience. So I've done copper mods and fans or only copper or only fans on the backplate. Copper backplate crafted instead of plastic coated aluminum or painted or whatever manufacturer thrown at people. Other factors was dust, dust and humidity, bad cases , silent fans only mods and others. That's why went to from the simple and cheaper mods to to more complicated with sandwich of heatsinks and so on.
For example RTX A 4000 - 5000 are great cards but, requires cooling mods. Mostly blower cards does.
"Although a 3090 can still benefit from shims on the backplate" of course so does 3070 and 3080s but, I was referring to 92 mm fans. Although for a 3090 that is hashed I would go with a new copper backplate and a square low profile heatsink over VRAM and GPU area. I' ll do that for any card that also have VRAM on both sides of the PCB. Al will do for the low profile heatsink.
I checked your other video on story of Upsiren, that is good enough for the start and I'll go from there to higher quality if need it.
@pete0274 I honestly wouldn't go with either of the putties from that video. There are much better outties and often similar price or cheaper. In your scenario, I'd recommend one of 3 Thermal Putties.
1) Upsiren UTP-8, which is only slightly behind Honeywell HT10000 in performance, but can often be bought for a d3al of 3x100g for ~$31 CAD each. That would do 6 typical cards (50g each) or 4x 3090's.
2) CX-H1300 13.5w is one of the best budget puttiws and only a few degrees behind the Upsiren UTP-8 in performance, but at a much cheaper price. Can usually get 70g for arpund $15 CAD. It has been stiffer lately, ut I feel like you could master it since you've done a lot of copper shim jobs and would quickly become good at manipulating it. Still softer than. Pads, so you'd do fine with it and great price per gram.
3) If you wanted to use putty with shims (longer lasting than paste with shims), then I'd recommend getting some Halnziye HY236 or HY256 as it is very sof5 and an ideal putty to use with shims. For shim size you'd want to go 0.2 or 0.3mm smaller than the gap si,e between VRAM and Cooler, that way you'd easily compress the putty down to a thin layer on both sides and still get great core contact.
For the cores I'd recommend buying a bulk 400x160mm sheetof Honeywell PTM7950. It lasts longer than paste and often gets better performance than pastes.
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Yeah, it's really great as a Thermal conductive gap filler. Designed for gaps up to 8mm. It keeps it's shape really well and sticks to both surfaces.
So I came here to see another copper mod in order to plan mine, but I also know you are an evil miner who is driving GPU prices up. Mind self-blown. Oh, and your putty fail was down to using far too much.
Heh. Thanks for the comment. The memory temps on GDDR6X while mining are quite high in general. This card was sent to me to get copper molded, but decided I'd try putty on it first.
I've had great results on some 3080's, namely the FE's, woth just putty, but the 3090 lacks active cooling on the backplate so it will always run hotter.
I may be a miner, but I'm a gamer first. I only found out about mining when I went to build a new gaming rig, as my 8+ year old FX-8370 and R9 290X 4GB were showing their age. Couldn't find a videocard in stock anywhere and was like "What is going on?". Bit the bullet and bought a card off Kijiji for a slightly over MSRP and started mining. Ran the numbers and was shocked to realize I could have had my computer buy it's own upgrades every ~4 years.
Getting cards at MSRP had been harder than normal but not impossible. I got my first MSRP 3080 from Memory Express about 13 months ago. Just put my name down for a card and waited a few months and it came in. They even honored the original lower MSRP from when I put my name down.
Since then I've helped several gamer friends and associates realize mining on one overpriced card is a good way for it to help pay off the price difference if not pay for the card completely. We'll have to wait another 3 years before that will be true again. Will be interesting to see what GPU's are like then performance wise. Maybe they'll be so powerful we'll be able to see into the past/future 😆.
3:37 what the hell?
That's where I apply TG-PP10 Thermal Putty using an Icing Piping Bag. I found it works much easier and cleaner than other methods. I'm using the 1/4" round tip.
Looks like some other Thermal Putties come in syringes right from the manufacturer, such as A7000 and TG-NSP80.
Just like making cake. 🧁
It's all about the layers and the good stuff in the middle!