I really miss your videos. All the other "reviewers" are just reading specs or follow the prewritten bullet points the company wants mentioned. Everything is amazing and a super deal. We need honest reviewers like you making content again. Please!
(spreading love) You know some of these new kids out there be blinded by sponsorship dreams and ambition, throwing dirt, saying oh he never posts anymore, or oh he's not as thorough as he used to be, etc.. but then they say some praise quickly before moving on and say look at his back catalog etc,etc.. EVERYONE in this scene knows you are the Bob Ross of Sim, bringing joy to those who watch thru calm, collected, educated information, you LEGEND: Barry Rowland - classic formula, love it! :)
A true master of all the reviews. I was waiting for this and never thought it'd come that quick; I ignored any other reviews and waited for this patiently to make a decision. He's the only guy that could put you behind the wheel and make you feel exactly what's going on without actually being behind it. You're the reason why Sim Racing experience is improving. Cheers Barry!
I've been looking forward to SRG's review for a long time because it is so thorough. Thank you Barry. Every analysis of simracing hardware you make is an enjoyable discovery journey. I've been using the T818 for 3 weeks now and I am positively impressed (that is coming from a TS-PC) and I am very, very happy with what this wheelbase can do. What this direct-drive wheelbase has given me over my previous belt one is more confidence, by providing more detailed information about the track's conditions and the behaviour of my car (grip, tyres, weight transfer) at a much faster rate. This has allowed me to push the limit to which I exert the car on track further than before, which has turned into improved lap consistency and extra tenths of a second. So yes, this wheelbase has made me a bit faster, because it communicates more and it does it swiftly. I am currently running it at 70% power on Performance mode and that's enough to give my forearms a good workout on 3 hour stints. I do think it is unfortunate that TM does not include either a desk or rig mount with the T818 out of the box (you have to buy either separately). I can definitely recommend the rig-baseplate, which is what I have. It provides a broader contact area and more screws (8 instead of 4) to share the FFB load. The bottom of this rig-baseplate is made of very sticky silicon so it feels as if the T818 is now "glued" to the rig-plate. I had to re-tighten all other screws on the rig to ensure rigidity because wheelspin shakes the whole thing, haha! From my experience the T818 is a proper, solid DD wheel, just like Barry says. Of course, we still have to wait for the most important test (after Barry's scrutiny): the test of time.
Hi, thanks for your comments on this. Can you tell me, does the baseplate have an angle to it? I notice the bottom of the main unit is very flat which would obviously mean your wheel was at 90' to the horizontal once mounted. Thanks.
Your Reviews are always on point and so detailed. The time and effort you put into these is unbeliveable. Im still hyped for the day you get the chance to test out the logitech dd :D
27:00 Seeing this from above would be very helpful for seeing the amplitude of movement, given the direction of the torque applied. Great video as always, thank you!!
Me before I click the link, "I don't know if I care enough about the T818 for one Barry's 40 minute in-depth reviews". Click the link 1 hour, 22 minutes, 57 seconds! Now some how I'm going to watch the whole thing. Well played sir! 😆
Hi Barry, thanks for your usual deep dive review into our new direct drive T818! We're super proud of what we have made, and we love seeing our gear torn apart and explained so thoroughly. One quick note, as you didn't fully take apart the motor - we actually are proud to share that the direct drive shaft inside our motor is made from 100% metal! We are unable to recreate the same level of flex you are experiencing, which is unfortunate. We do think it is an issue with a loose screw within the SF1000, possibly when you reassembled it after that review?
Happened in both wheels, just accept it was a flawed design and trying to stand by your original flawed mount instead of ditching it was a poor idea. P.s I got rid of all my TM equipment for simagic. You are a bunch of clowns.
Hello Thrustmaster. Will the T818 support more than 1080* rotation? I like to drive trucks in games like Euro Truck Sim 2 or American Truck Sim or BeamNG,drive & usually those have 1440 or more steering degrees, I would like to simulate such an amount for a bit more immersion, but from the small handful of videos I've seen, the TM Control Panel only lets you set it to 1080, just like your other non-DD wheelbases. Is that due to the power/signal cable running on the inside of the motor's shaft that prevents you from going any higher than this?
Recently I bought a TS-PC Servo and a P310 wheel that came with loose screws and the quickrelease was semi-loose, flexing and slighly angled. Tightening screws didn't fix it. during first 15 days of warranty the shop gave me another P310 that was in perfect condition.
yes .i dont have flex with sparco p310 in my t818,but i have oscillation in iracing e acc, for remove oscillation i set damping in panel control t818 at 70% but i prefer feeling with default setting 10%
You are the craziest tester I follow 👍 Checking the item with a microscope is unique, have never seen anyone thorough like you. Keep this quality, thank you!
Your reviews are difficult to comment on. I love your thoroughness of illustrations for each component, but what I love most is your demonstration with the test and tuning that you go through. Food for thought. Tighten the composite mounting collar again, and put the screw in it to prevent failure caused by wide frequencies of vibrations during use. The center adapter will absolutely bottom out. After the collar is tightened, there should be a minute amount of gap. Please install the screw to secure and stabilize the wheel hub and collar. When looseness is felt, check the estimated torque of the nut, put the screw back in the collar and wheel hub assembly, and drive on. I've never seen a review quite as detailed as yours. Keep up the good work sir. Well done.
If your already in the Thrustmaster ecosystem, I highly recommend the T818. I upgraded from the TX wheelbase and the difference is shocking. If your new to sim racing, please do your research before committing to an ecosystem.
Thank you for your incredibly detailed and thorough review of the new Thrustmaster T818. Your reviews are always so informative and insightful, so glad I found your channel. I'm hoping you'll be doing an SRG review of the new Logitech DD Pro wheel and pedals soon.
It’s an outstanding base. If you’re already invested in the Thrustmaster ecosystem and you do PC only, not sure this can be beat. The people who naysay typically just like to hate on Thrustmaster.
Whoa! 27:30 put me off completely. Even though I have the two Thrustmaster Sparco rims, that amount of flex made me instantly consider the Simagic Alpha Mini, even if I have to buy the wheel rim.
Way late to the party here, but that level of flex was either related directly to his wheel or that unit. To my eye, the majority of that flex looks like it was associated with the wheel. Like he didn’t properly torque all of the screws when he put the wheel back together.
Wow I stumbled onto your channel by accident. Great review and format... I have learned more about direct drive wheels in the last video then the last weeknof research. Chapeau
No flex with the SF1000 wheel, very happy. It looks like Garry may not have tightened the qr adapter enough, I see more play near the wheel plate in the footage than anyting at 1:03:12, but it could be as well an issue with that particular wheel. Great FF enabled also because of the lightweight construction. As an avid cyclist, I know how weight numbs the responsiveness of a wheel. I tested other base combos (La Prima, Alpha and Alpha mini) and wasn't at all disappointed with this base. Smooth around the middle and very reactive, very easy to set up. The 599 wheel flexes a bit near the button box, but it is not related to the qr adapter.
Hello, I searched for someone who can compare t818, simagic Alpha Mini, asetek, simucube. The ffb its not a big difference in your opinion? Please Tell me more! 😀
@@Ehrenwerter Sorry for the late reply. I think the T818 is the easiest to get right setup wise and the light wheels really make it responsive. Asetek rims are to heavy, and do not get the most of the wheel. Hard to say which is best, but I am happy with the T818. The weight of the wheel is crucial in my opinion for a base in this class of around 10 NM,
I am just patiently waiting for TM to update this or make a PS5 compatible version. I play rather casually, so I'm very happy on console with my T300 and my SF1000. But, all these new DD wheelbases make me want to upgrade in the nearish future. As soon as TM brings out a PS version, I'm there!
I'm sort of in the same boat. I have a Thrustmaster T500RS wheel and pedal set that won't work with my PS5 because they chose not to license the older wheels, but it doesn't seem worth it to upgrade to the T-GT II base since it's basically the same system as my T500RS. I was holding out for the new T818, but my heart sank when they said it will be PC only for now.
@@smileonempty Man, I feel you. I was the same with the PS4 and my G27. It felt insane to buy a G29 which is essentially the same as the G27, but without the shifter. I skipped that whole generation, and bought a PS5 and a T300RS for GT7. In the meantime, the G27 worked well for PC sims, so I never felt the need to really upgrade if it didn't make sense. That T818 sure looks like it makes sense to me!
same im on pc but i still have to wait for release it came out in the uk first. i love my t300 with rally wheel and i have the open wheel just got into on road stuff
I had received this for the first time three weeks ago and it stopped working four hours into Assetto Corsa. I sent it to France for repairs and two weeks later, it's up and running without incident. Hopefully it stays that way. Other than that dreadfully inconvenient hiccup, it's a great base in my opinion. What I like about it is that if you have the adapters, and if you can find a universal hub, you can attach wheels from other companies like Fanatec. I got a Fanatec NASCAR rim to use with it and it really does work! The T818 adapter isn't even connected to any electronics on the wheel, there aren't any, it works and receives ffb regardless! I'm curious to try this with a Fanatec wheel that actually has electronic connections and buttons..
Thank you very much ! was waiting for this review even as I have mine since december! Regarding the flex, I have a ricmotech momo mod31 wheel connected to the thing and it does not flex as much as this . (And not as much as my real car when I tried 10 min ago btw... ) so I dont think it would cause any issue, but we'll see what the future brings.
I got this t818 dd almost 2 weeks already the ferrari edition and comes with sf1000 steering wheel, and honestly, I have not experienced that flex in the steering wheel, and I have been playing with 10 NM in sport and performance mode with 75% FFB in game ACC and it feels great the bumps in the road the rumbles the information you get when driving over the the curves and grass is great. No overheating issues so far. The immersion you get from this wheel is very, very good. I would say better than moza r9 that I had for 4 months, and also, the moza had overheating issues at least my unit. But I agreed the build quality might not be the best time will tell, but so far, no flex and funny noises or over heating issues
Guys you can fix the flex in the quick release system by using a rubber or plastic shim (like a big washer). Also fixes occasional rim disconnection from base. just cut a circle with 70mm outside diameter and a 40mm inside and should be the thickness of a credit card. Make sure you tighten the QR all the way against the steering wheel like Barry did, you have to use some kind of tool just by hand its not enough. Once you get rid of the gap on the wheel side, you will have created a bigger one on the base side. That is where you gonna put the plastic/rubber shim. I have done this myself with rubber and it worked very well and its a great improvement, it removes all the play in the shaft and you are left only with the flex on the rim itself. The only disadvantages of this fix is that becomes a hard job to remove the QR adapter and if the shim is too thick the latch on the QR becomes very stiff. Hope it helps. Barry thanks for the review, great as always. really helped me to make my choice.
The flex is mostly in the wheels itself. Frontplates too thin and narrow distance of the front plate bolts (not 70 mm like race car wheels). However, one of my adapters has no flex at all to the QR and a second one did have a little gap, so I just put a bit of tape inside where the lever pushes the adapter tight. Should not be needed, tolerances could be better by TM. Other than that the T818 performs very well!
@@ryanblumenow Well, it works very well, you just make a ring to fill the gap left on the QR system. I guess being able to retrofit so many different wheels they had to be quite loose with the tolerances of the QR. So some of them might be gapier then others. Once you fill that gap with a shim it becomes very very sturdy. You might feel the latching system get a bit tighter as its tighning everything together but that's all. Its quite simple when you look at it in front of you. I found the rubber shim with the sizes described before to work very well for me. It really makes a big difference. Hope that helps
@@jackwinder I dont really agree Jack, at least in my case I would say 70% of the flex was coming from the shaft and 30% from the 599xx rim. Now with the Acelith Design rim that I use with the 599xx buttonbox and the solution for the shaft I would say im left with 5% flex on the shaft and 10% on the rim. At this point you 100% cannot feel any play when racing and barely any even if you force it.
Great review, thanks! I have flex with my TM wheels (on a TS racer) now and then because some bolts on the front plate loosen and looks like the flex you have. Once tightend the flex is much less..Anyway, receiving my T818 Monday, so I am excited to try (with your recommendations)!
I think TM does most things right with this base, except for not having any new wheels for it's release. I would like to see this base tested with a more solid wheel and an adaptor.
I agree! When using one of the new wheels TM will release in 2023 you won't even need an adapter as they will already use the new quick release and they said they will be higher quality so I'm sure they will be more solid. I'm sure the experience with the T818 will be even better with them. But as you said it's a shame they didn't release at least one of that new wheels alongside with the T818. I would have bought the T818 immediately if they would hsve released a new high quality wheel where you don't need the adapter. But as they didn't and I didn't want to wait anymore because my T300 is 8 or 9 years old I bought the Moza R9 instead
Do you plan on reviewing the Logitech G Pro and opening it for comparison? Some people were praising it so much I got really curious about what your feedback on that base would be.
Another great review, and actually very positive about the product, bar the Quick Release Adapter for the legacy wheels. But I guess there was always going to be a compromise. If the legacy wheels weren't supposed in some way, there was going to be a shit storm, so at least Thrustmaster considered their existing customer base to try and accommodate any wheels that people might already have. Personally I am really happy with my T818.
not in the adapter but in the wheel itself... I dont think flexing is a problem anyway. Try in a real car and it "flexes" also and sometimes a lot more when you hang on the steering wheel.
@@MrRikko951 dude my car wheel can hold my entire 90kg weight without flexing and I hold on to it every time I get in and out. Absolutely no flex is acceptable and this is a garbage product with a shit QR
The amount of new, proprietary changes is a massive turn-off for mea Edit: Regarding the collar you're mentioning around the 13:00 minute mark, that's GF Nylon, or Glass-fill Nylon. It's extremely strong and hard, and that stuff looks to be a pretty high fill percentage. Used to deal with it all the time when I worked in plastics molding. Kind of a pain in the butt when it breaks, though, as it's alot more "brittle" than regular plastics
Looks like you need to tighten the fasteners on the steering wheel. My thrustmaster wheels don't flex anything like that on my T818. I had something similar happen with my TM wheel and it was fine after I tightened the screws back up again.
Thanks for showing that the buttons on the side can be removed with a bit of work, with my set-up currently using a G27 run in a rig designed to look like a Daytona USA cabinet I wouldn't have anywhere of getting to the buttons, so extending the wires and remounting them seams like it may be possible.
Yo, Barry. I’d love to see a review on the Simagic alpha Ultimate and see how it stacks up with the other big boys if you have the time and accessibility. I believe the firmware and tuning software have also been improved since you did the alpha mini review
Great review again! Love this. The flex you are experiencing I didn't notice in a German/ Austrian youtuber review. If the T818 was console ready I already would have ordered one. Now I stick with my T300 T-LCM'S, because I switch between console and PC.
Concerning the stiffness remarks made in this excellent review: Important to distinguish between BENDING stiffness and TORSIONAL stiffness. The bending stiffness could be better, as Mr Rowland points out, but you never load the steering wheel heavily in this direction while driving. The torsional stiffness is far more important. Lack of torsional stiffness would give the feeling of a steering column made of rubber.
Cool review - great to see what is inside the wheel base ... Any chance you wanna open up the QR adapter as well to see what gives with that? From what I understand there is a chip inside there which also has its own firmware (TM control panel says CAN: 2.11 next to the wheel base firmware 5.20) ... be interested to know if they are changing bit rate or something (eg to run more complex button configs or rims etc in future) or if there is any voltage stepping eg 3v-5v since afaik the old rims are 3v 🤔 Other thoughts ... maybe TM are right below that you have a loose screw after your rebuild of your F1 rim? I have two rims on this base (P310 and TM open wheel) and neither flex anything like yours was doing.
@@palestragenesi2.042 Check the Iracing forum for suggested settings. Ffb smoothing at 0 for example. Personally I use IRffb for Iracing, it gives a much better ffb and the default one imho
@@palestragenesi2.042 On iRacing game for all DD wheels (not only the T818) it's important, in the options of the game to: * Always activate "Use Linear Mode" (specialy made for DD wheels as they are perfectly linear) * Always activate "Reduce force when parked" (to avoid some oscillations on the pit) * Always keep at 0% "Smoothing" slider (this slider is not for DD wheels - if you want to add some damper to decrease oscillations on this game, then do it in the T818 Control Panel)
@@ParlierEddy yes i have linear mode ,0 smoothing 0 damping but after last update i have oscillation,for remove this i use damper in t818 at 70% but i prefer feeling with max 20% damping in t818 panel control
@palestragenesi2.042 if there is any setting along the lines of "wheel friction" that's what you should adjust, assuming that the FFB is well made, that's just the nature if havubg extremely low friction and innertia steering components
shows how much i am out of the loop, i dint even know TM had a direct rive wheel(base) so a very welcoming review :) Well, it looks quite good actually. That it have that "analoge" feel at the top middle is a very good sing. Not bad a price at ~£600 for DD base either.
That type of power connector is known to have some issues. Very important to make sure it is pushed in all the way!! Any type of wiggle on its socket can cause a lot of heat problems.
I really dislike the screw because it indents the adapter on the steering wheels and even though you’ll never see it when in use its still something I subconsciously think about since I’m ocd about keeping my things nice.
Thank you for the review. I was considering staying in the thrustmaster echosystem, but after this review I am thinking I could invest in better products. Currently using a TS-XW with the F1 wheel, but wish I had something smoother.
Hello, BARRY It's always a pleasure to see your videos , as well as your extensive experience in the field of Simracing. Could you make a video about Thrustmaster's new steering wheel, the 488gt3, in the future, and enlighten us on the functions of the steering wheel that are not taken into account on consoles as well as on Pc?? Thank you very much and long live the chain ✌️👍🤗
is it worth upgrading from Thrustmaster T300 to T818? I have also NLR GT track cockpit, thrustmaster T-LCM pedals, with T8pa shifter and nobrand ebay e-brake.
Bonjour, Merci pour ce test détaillé, je viens d’acquérir le miens, je suis entrain de préparer mon châssis pour l'installer, je pense très rapidement travailler sur un système quick release tout métal qui je pense ce justifie pour ce direct drive.
Almost 18 months on, is there any chance you have had chance to try a newer model of the T818? I have seen some mention (and I hope it's true) that Thrustmaster might have reduced the flex somehow? It looks like a good wheel, but I am still concerned about the flex, it's the only thing putting me off. You're evaluation is always honest and thorough and I'd really appreciate your up to date view on this.
My T818 has developed a stiff area that is about 50-60 degrees of the rotation. It gets worse after about 2 hours use(heat makes it worse). Its almost got like a metallic grating feel to it. I don't know what it could be. I've opened it up and can't see anything. Guess I can't send it back now. 😔
⁴For anyone who reads this. The problem may be solved. My dad stripped the motor down to reveal a gap between the outer casing and the ring of stator poles. He managed to work it back into the centre, then put glue from a glue gun all around the gap between the stator pole ring and the casing, to hold it in position better. Put it back together and the friction is gone. I panic bought the Ferrari sim edition of this wheel and experienced the exact same issue a year later. We have a theory why? I made a 15mm solid steel spacer to raise the height of the wheel. We think it somehow messed with the magnetic field and pushed the stator ring off centre. That's the theory anyway. Hopefully this will deter people from over engineering a 15mm solid blocked spacer that weighs a ton. Like an idiot, like me.
Very good review as always;) In every second you can hear passion and years of experience with best solutions on simracing market, that's for what we're all here for;)
Has anyone found out what the peak NM is? I just bought this servo. A year after this video. It will be here today. I'll you know if they fixed any flex on the servo itself. I have the Sparco P310 Alc wheel . Jumping from the TS servo to the T818. I love my TS servo. I can't wait to feel the difference.
Shorter-"don't buy t818 for drifting" I had a t300 with both belts bearing mode(by the way I really recommend it I makes big difrence) , with all eco system from thrustmaster, so I got a t818, and first i was blown away how it works, and how good and quick the response is, but by the time I can figure it out how to set it up for drifting(99% time on sim drifting). One of the biggest problem of t818 is it smells like hot electronics after a quick session if it's intense like drifting and it's simple drivers, you just can't get It how u want it to be, with damper about(20-50%) the whell was to sponge, and without or little bit about(0-20%) it was to brutal(performance mode was the best). The biggest problem of this base(t818 for drifters) it's his constant torque, you can make it smoth like it should be with wheelcheck and lut for Assetto, but then the most of the details are gone. So you need to choose a pill. By the way flex on my with sparco wheel was very little. Soo I order moza r9 with cs steering wheel and spr pedals with load cell, I just download the moza pit house, choose drift preset, changed only force for about 3,5-4nm to make sure I'm driving all 3 wheels at exact same force, just open Assetto and drift like I was driving on this wheel all the time, it's just simply works. I linked the corners I never used to link that good. Moza just works and if u want you just can tinker the serting to your liking. Moza quality is like 2 levels above thrustmaster. Making my top 3 for the t300, t818, moza r9: sim racing 1.t818 (the best, fastest, and informative ffb) 2.moza r9(i think I can get most of it by the time I learn the pit house settings) 3.t300(just the belt driven wheel.) Drifting: 1.Moza r9 (it just works how it needs to and you can change it to your liking) 2.t300 (with bearings mode or without it's just good but the details are a little bit too late, to slow and soft) 3.t818(in other games it works better it's not as constant force or brutal like in assetto, but for me is the best sim drifting game, so the force is too constant and brutal, and after damper to spongy and slow so if you want to buy t818 for drifting just pick something else).
As always.... Very awesome, informative video!! Love your in depth overviews. Any chance you're going to be doing the Logitech Pro Direct Drive wheel and Pro Pedals? Just curious how it compares. Thanks again and keep up the fantastic work!
Hola, me gustaría preguntar, tengo el t818 hace un año, es normal que después de una hora de carrera, note un roce en el eje? será debido a algún tipo de dilatación por la fricción? gracias de antemano y saludos.
@@SIMRIG412 there IS a new DD wheel base, with a much stronger QR solution than on the T818. Logitech has always been dependable. No overheating problems like Thrustmaster has had, for example.
Forget logitech if you wanna spend 600 dollar go for sim magic alpha mini, which has much more ffb detail. For 900$ you should go with vrs direct force pro, those are as close as possible to a simucube 2 in terms of detail and strengh
I really miss your videos. All the other "reviewers" are just reading specs or follow the prewritten bullet points the company wants mentioned. Everything is amazing and a super deal.
We need honest reviewers like you making content again. Please!
The review we’ve all been waiting for!
Exactly!
All hail the grand master of sim racing. 🙌
FACTS!!
i know right we've been waiting. still waiting on u to review the VRS DFP
The Logitech G PRO is a waited one too... 😉
(spreading love) You know some of these new kids out there be blinded by sponsorship dreams and ambition, throwing dirt, saying oh he never posts anymore, or oh he's not as thorough as he used to be, etc.. but then they say some praise quickly before moving on and say look at his back catalog etc,etc.. EVERYONE in this scene knows you are the Bob Ross of Sim, bringing joy to those who watch thru calm, collected, educated information, you LEGEND: Barry Rowland - classic formula, love it! :)
and yes i posted this only half way thru the video haha
@GT Kodak haha too kind i guess {|}
not anymore he was....
A true master of all the reviews. I was waiting for this and never thought it'd come that quick; I ignored any other reviews and waited for this patiently to make a decision.
He's the only guy that could put you behind the wheel and make you feel exactly what's going on without actually being behind it. You're the reason why Sim Racing experience is improving.
Cheers Barry!
I've been looking forward to SRG's review for a long time because it is so thorough. Thank you Barry. Every analysis of simracing hardware you make is an enjoyable discovery journey. I've been using the T818 for 3 weeks now and I am positively impressed (that is coming from a TS-PC) and I am very, very happy with what this wheelbase can do. What this direct-drive wheelbase has given me over my previous belt one is more confidence, by providing more detailed information about the track's conditions and the behaviour of my car (grip, tyres, weight transfer) at a much faster rate. This has allowed me to push the limit to which I exert the car on track further than before, which has turned into improved lap consistency and extra tenths of a second. So yes, this wheelbase has made me a bit faster, because it communicates more and it does it swiftly. I am currently running it at 70% power on Performance mode and that's enough to give my forearms a good workout on 3 hour stints.
I do think it is unfortunate that TM does not include either a desk or rig mount with the T818 out of the box (you have to buy either separately). I can definitely recommend the rig-baseplate, which is what I have. It provides a broader contact area and more screws (8 instead of 4) to share the FFB load. The bottom of this rig-baseplate is made of very sticky silicon so it feels as if the T818 is now "glued" to the rig-plate. I had to re-tighten all other screws on the rig to ensure rigidity because wheelspin shakes the whole thing, haha! From my experience the T818 is a proper, solid DD wheel, just like Barry says. Of course, we still have to wait for the most important test (after Barry's scrutiny): the test of time.
Hi, thanks for your comments on this. Can you tell me, does the baseplate have an angle to it? I notice the bottom of the main unit is very flat which would obviously mean your wheel was at 90' to the horizontal once mounted. Thanks.
Your Reviews are always on point and so detailed. The time and effort you put into these is unbeliveable. Im still hyped for the day you get the chance to test out the logitech dd :D
27:00 Seeing this from above would be very helpful for seeing the amplitude of movement, given the direction of the torque applied. Great video as always, thank you!!
EVERYONE wanted to see THIS review before taking a dive.
Me before I click the link, "I don't know if I care enough about the T818 for one Barry's 40 minute in-depth reviews". Click the link 1 hour, 22 minutes, 57 seconds! Now some how I'm going to watch the whole thing. Well played sir! 😆
Hi Barry, thanks for your usual deep dive review into our new direct drive T818! We're super proud of what we have made, and we love seeing our gear torn apart and explained so thoroughly.
One quick note, as you didn't fully take apart the motor - we actually are proud to share that the direct drive shaft inside our motor is made from 100% metal!
We are unable to recreate the same level of flex you are experiencing, which is unfortunate. We do think it is an issue with a loose screw within the SF1000, possibly when you reassembled it after that review?
Happened in both wheels, just accept it was a flawed design and trying to stand by your original flawed mount instead of ditching it was a poor idea.
P.s I got rid of all my TM equipment for simagic. You are a bunch of clowns.
Hello Thrustmaster.
Will the T818 support more than 1080* rotation? I like to drive trucks in games like Euro Truck Sim 2 or American Truck Sim or BeamNG,drive & usually those have 1440 or more steering degrees, I would like to simulate such an amount for a bit more immersion, but from the small handful of videos I've seen, the TM Control Panel only lets you set it to 1080, just like your other non-DD wheelbases. Is that due to the power/signal cable running on the inside of the motor's shaft that prevents you from going any higher than this?
Recently I bought a TS-PC Servo and a P310 wheel that came with loose screws and the quickrelease was semi-loose, flexing and slighly angled. Tightening screws didn't fix it.
during first 15 days of warranty the shop gave me another P310 that was in perfect condition.
Great products thrust master. Will get this eventually. I currently have a t-gt and t300. Bother are excellent. Good job.
yes .i dont have flex with sparco p310 in my t818,but i have oscillation in iracing e acc, for remove oscillation i set damping in panel control t818 at 70% but i prefer feeling with default setting 10%
I am really glad that "big" companies are admitting they DO need you👍
You are the craziest tester I follow 👍 Checking the item with a microscope is unique, have never seen anyone thorough like you. Keep this quality, thank you!
The one review I was waiting for!
Your reviews are difficult to comment on. I love your thoroughness of illustrations for each component, but what I love most is your demonstration with the test and tuning that you go through. Food for thought. Tighten the composite mounting collar again, and put the screw in it to prevent failure caused by wide frequencies of vibrations during use. The center adapter will absolutely bottom out. After the collar is tightened, there should be a minute amount of gap. Please install the screw to secure and stabilize the wheel hub and collar. When looseness is felt, check the estimated torque of the nut, put the screw back in the collar and wheel hub assembly, and drive on.
I've never seen a review quite as detailed as yours. Keep up the good work sir. Well done.
If your already in the Thrustmaster ecosystem, I highly recommend the T818. I upgraded from the TX wheelbase and the difference is shocking. If your new to sim racing, please do your research before committing to an ecosystem.
good to see inside of this wheelbase 😁
Thank you for your incredibly detailed and thorough review of the new Thrustmaster T818. Your reviews are always so informative and insightful, so glad I found your channel.
I'm hoping you'll be doing an SRG review of the new Logitech DD Pro wheel and pedals soon.
The collar is Glass Filament reinforced plastic.
14:32 Probably PA6GF30 or similar plastic ( Nylon 6 with glass fibre ) or some sort of PC.
Nobody does better reviews of sim equipment. I love the way you tear everything apart!
Excellent review as always! Big thanks!
Top quality review as always
You are truly unique in how you provide reviews. Thanks much.
I’m so pumped for the console version!
The ffb on this base feels so good. I’m so glad I got this
How is it holding up?
It’s an outstanding base. If you’re already invested in the Thrustmaster ecosystem and you do PC only, not sure this can be beat. The people who naysay typically just like to hate on Thrustmaster.
Whoa! 27:30 put me off completely. Even though I have the two Thrustmaster Sparco rims, that amount of flex made me instantly consider the Simagic Alpha Mini, even if I have to buy the wheel rim.
Way late to the party here, but that level of flex was either related directly to his wheel or that unit.
To my eye, the majority of that flex looks like it was associated with the wheel. Like he didn’t properly torque all of the screws when he put the wheel back together.
The best review around as always! This wheelbase is really looking good as a first dd.
Im totally blown by the in depth look on all the Details of the Wheelbase. Great work.
He's my Bob Ross of the sim racing... so relaxing to listen and watch.
What they did to bob and his family is tragic.
Insert the screw in the adapter as mentioned in the manual and the flex is completely gone ;) I have zero flex with my SF1000 on the T818.
Haha a "quick" release you need to screw it in doesn't sound very quick tho, does it?
@@CHAPI929292 You do it one time only to secure the adapter in the wheel.
Wow I stumbled onto your channel by accident. Great review and format... I have learned more about direct drive wheels in the last video then the last weeknof research. Chapeau
Since you teased us on Facebook a couple of weeks ago, I've been checking your channel frequently. ...now for a great review as usual.
Really like your in depth reviews! Helps everyone who wants to tinker with sim racing hardware.
No flex with the SF1000 wheel, very happy.
It looks like Garry may not have tightened the qr adapter enough, I see more play near the wheel plate in the footage than anyting at 1:03:12, but it could be as well an issue with that particular wheel.
Great FF enabled also because of the lightweight construction. As an avid cyclist, I know how weight numbs the responsiveness of a wheel.
I tested other base combos (La Prima, Alpha and Alpha mini) and wasn't at all disappointed with this base.
Smooth around the middle and very reactive, very easy to set up.
The 599 wheel flexes a bit near the button box, but it is not related to the qr adapter.
Hello,
I searched for someone who can compare t818, simagic Alpha Mini, asetek, simucube.
The ffb its not a big difference in your opinion?
Please Tell me more! 😀
@@Ehrenwerter Sorry for the late reply. I think the T818 is the easiest to get right setup wise and the light wheels really make it responsive. Asetek rims are to heavy, and do not get the most of the wheel. Hard to say which is best, but I am happy with the T818.
The weight of the wheel is crucial in my opinion for a base in this class of around 10 NM,
I am just patiently waiting for TM to update this or make a PS5 compatible version. I play rather casually, so I'm very happy on console with my T300 and my SF1000. But, all these new DD wheelbases make me want to upgrade in the nearish future. As soon as TM brings out a PS version, I'm there!
I'm sort of in the same boat. I have a Thrustmaster T500RS wheel and pedal set that won't work with my PS5 because they chose not to license the older wheels, but it doesn't seem worth it to upgrade to the T-GT II base since it's basically the same system as my T500RS. I was holding out for the new T818, but my heart sank when they said it will be PC only for now.
@@smileonempty Man, I feel you. I was the same with the PS4 and my G27. It felt insane to buy a G29 which is essentially the same as the G27, but without the shifter. I skipped that whole generation, and bought a PS5 and a T300RS for GT7. In the meantime, the G27 worked well for PC sims, so I never felt the need to really upgrade if it didn't make sense. That T818 sure looks like it makes sense to me!
same im on pc but i still have to wait for release it came out in the uk first. i love my t300 with rally wheel and i have the open wheel just got into on road stuff
same. PS5 GT7 DD wheel base needed from thrust master as Fanatec makes trash and has poor customer service
Agree, just waiting on PS5 and GT7 support... Must support PC too!
I noticed a Virpil icon on your desktop. You sir, got great taste.
As usual, awesome review! Thanks man!
I know this suggestion might draw some serious ire from the community, but I'd love to see Barry's take on the Logitech Pro direct drive wheel.
The only review we need when we want to buy something
I had received this for the first time three weeks ago and it stopped working four hours into Assetto Corsa. I sent it to France for repairs and two weeks later, it's up and running without incident. Hopefully it stays that way. Other than that dreadfully inconvenient hiccup, it's a great base in my opinion. What I like about it is that if you have the adapters, and if you can find a universal hub, you can attach wheels from other companies like Fanatec. I got a Fanatec NASCAR rim to use with it and it really does work! The T818 adapter isn't even connected to any electronics on the wheel, there aren't any, it works and receives ffb regardless! I'm curious to try this with a Fanatec wheel that actually has electronic connections and buttons..
Yes! The review I have been waiting for! Thank you.
You can measure Nm. Just attach 1m arm to the wheel and put end of it on a scale. Whatever you read from scale in kg multiply it by 9.80665 to get Nm.
Omg, the review we have all been waiting for. Fresh out the oven
Thank you very much ! was waiting for this review even as I have mine since december! Regarding the flex, I have a ricmotech momo mod31 wheel connected to the thing and it does not flex as much as this . (And not as much as my real car when I tried 10 min ago btw... ) so I dont think it would cause any issue, but we'll see what the future brings.
Thank you for this. Been waiting for this video to come out.
I've been waiting for this video....
I got this t818 dd almost 2 weeks already the ferrari edition and comes with sf1000 steering wheel, and honestly, I have not experienced that flex in the steering wheel, and I have been playing with 10 NM in sport and performance mode with 75% FFB in game ACC and it feels great the bumps in the road the rumbles the information you get when driving over the the curves and grass is great. No overheating issues so far. The immersion you get from this wheel is very, very good. I would say better than moza r9 that I had for 4 months, and also, the moza had overheating issues at least my unit. But I agreed the build quality might not be the best time will tell, but so far, no flex and funny noises or over heating issues
Guys you can fix the flex in the quick release system by using a rubber or plastic shim (like a big washer). Also fixes occasional rim disconnection from base. just cut a circle with 70mm outside diameter and a 40mm inside and should be the thickness of a credit card. Make sure you tighten the QR all the way against the steering wheel like Barry did, you have to use some kind of tool just by hand its not enough. Once you get rid of the gap on the wheel side, you will have created a bigger one on the base side. That is where you gonna put the plastic/rubber shim. I have done this myself with rubber and it worked very well and its a great improvement, it removes all the play in the shaft and you are left only with the flex on the rim itself. The only disadvantages of this fix is that becomes a hard job to remove the QR adapter and if the shim is too thick the latch on the QR becomes very stiff. Hope it helps.
Barry thanks for the review, great as always. really helped me to make my choice.
Can you give me a few more details on how this solution works?
The flex is mostly in the wheels itself. Frontplates too thin and narrow distance of the front plate bolts (not 70 mm like race car wheels). However, one of my adapters has no flex at all to the QR and a second one did have a little gap, so I just put a bit of tape inside where the lever pushes the adapter tight. Should not be needed, tolerances could be better by TM.
Other than that the T818 performs very well!
@@ryanblumenow Well, it works very well, you just make a ring to fill the gap left on the QR system. I guess being able to retrofit so many different wheels they had to be quite loose with the tolerances of the QR. So some of them might be gapier then others. Once you fill that gap with a shim it becomes very very sturdy. You might feel the latching system get a bit tighter as its tighning everything together but that's all. Its quite simple when you look at it in front of you.
I found the rubber shim with the sizes described before to work very well for me. It really makes a big difference. Hope that helps
@@jackwinder
I dont really agree Jack, at least in my case I would say 70% of the flex was coming from the shaft and 30% from the 599xx rim. Now with the Acelith Design rim that I use with the 599xx buttonbox and the solution for the shaft I would say im left with 5% flex on the shaft and 10% on the rim. At this point you 100% cannot feel any play when racing and barely any even if you force it.
Woo, I don't know much about electronics but appreciate all the detail. What a great review 👍. Love seeing the internals of this hardware
Great review, thanks! I have flex with my TM wheels (on a TS racer) now and then because some bolts on the front plate loosen and looks like the flex you have. Once tightend the flex is much less..Anyway, receiving my T818 Monday, so I am excited to try (with your recommendations)!
What do you think?
Hi Barry, I always find your reviews highly interesting, but you have never reviewed any simalution software. I would find that really interesting!
Please, back to action and new reviews on channel !!
I think TM does most things right with this base, except for not having any new wheels for it's release. I would like to see this base tested with a more solid wheel and an adaptor.
I agree! When using one of the new wheels TM will release in 2023 you won't even need an adapter as they will already use the new quick release and they said they will be higher quality so I'm sure they will be more solid. I'm sure the experience with the T818 will be even better with them. But as you said it's a shame they didn't release at least one of that new wheels alongside with the T818. I would have bought the T818 immediately if they would hsve released a new high quality wheel where you don't need the adapter. But as they didn't and I didn't want to wait anymore because my T300 is 8 or 9 years old I bought the Moza R9 instead
@@simracingwithhandicap502 the issue with moza is game compatibility
Could flex be reduced using a non-adapted wheel (when available)? It looks like the adapter builds a lot of length and thus more heave.
Do you plan on reviewing the Logitech G Pro and opening it for comparison?
Some people were praising it so much I got really curious about what your feedback on that base would be.
Another great review, and actually very positive about the product, bar the Quick Release Adapter for the legacy wheels. But I guess there was always going to be a compromise. If the legacy wheels weren't supposed in some way, there was going to be a shit storm, so at least Thrustmaster considered their existing customer base to try and accommodate any wheels that people might already have. Personally I am really happy with my T818.
are there "new" wheels yet?
not in the adapter but in the wheel itself... I dont think flexing is a problem anyway. Try in a real car and it "flexes" also and sometimes a lot more when you hang on the steering wheel.
@@MrRikko951 if your real car wheel is flexin you better get your steering column checked lol
@@simracingchannel7691 try any car; it will flex... if you push hard enough...
@@MrRikko951 dude my car wheel can hold my entire 90kg weight without flexing and I hold on to it every time I get in and out. Absolutely no flex is acceptable and this is a garbage product with a shit QR
The amount of new, proprietary changes is a massive turn-off for mea
Edit: Regarding the collar you're mentioning around the 13:00 minute mark, that's GF Nylon, or Glass-fill Nylon. It's extremely strong and hard, and that stuff looks to be a pretty high fill percentage. Used to deal with it all the time when I worked in plastics molding. Kind of a pain in the butt when it breaks, though, as it's alot more "brittle" than regular plastics
Looks like you need to tighten the fasteners on the steering wheel. My thrustmaster wheels don't flex anything like that on my T818. I had something similar happen with my TM wheel and it was fine after I tightened the screws back up again.
Thanks for showing that the buttons on the side can be removed with a bit of work, with my set-up currently using a G27 run in a rig designed to look like a Daytona USA cabinet I wouldn't have anywhere of getting to the buttons, so extending the wires and remounting them seams like it may be possible.
Yo, Barry. I’d love to see a review on the Simagic alpha Ultimate and see how it stacks up with the other big boys if you have the time and accessibility. I believe the firmware and tuning software have also been improved since you did the alpha mini review
Great review again! Love this. The flex you are experiencing I didn't notice in a German/ Austrian youtuber review. If the T818 was console ready I already would have ordered one. Now I stick with my T300 T-LCM'S, because I switch between console and PC.
Same and same setup as you... I miss the road detail.. In GT7 it's very low with the T300RS
Concerning the stiffness remarks made in this excellent review: Important to distinguish between BENDING stiffness and TORSIONAL stiffness. The bending stiffness could be better, as Mr Rowland points out, but you never load the steering wheel heavily in this direction while driving. The torsional stiffness is far more important. Lack of torsional stiffness would give the feeling of a steering column made of rubber.
Cool review - great to see what is inside the wheel base ... Any chance you wanna open up the QR adapter as well to see what gives with that?
From what I understand there is a chip inside there which also has its own firmware (TM control panel says CAN: 2.11 next to the wheel base firmware 5.20) ... be interested to know if they are changing bit rate or something (eg to run more complex button configs or rims etc in future) or if there is any voltage stepping eg 3v-5v since afaik the old rims are 3v 🤔
Other thoughts ... maybe TM are right below that you have a loose screw after your rebuild of your F1 rim?
I have two rims on this base (P310 and TM open wheel) and neither flex anything like yours was doing.
Nice review! And a new firmware V5.20 for the base is available since now 2 weeks and add a lot of improvements 👍.
j your setting damper?i have oscillation extreme in iracing with toyota gr6,i huse 10 dampin 100 gain and performance mode
@@palestragenesi2.042 Check the Iracing forum for suggested settings. Ffb smoothing at 0 for example. Personally I use IRffb for Iracing, it gives a much better ffb and the default one imho
@@palestragenesi2.042 On iRacing game for all DD wheels (not only the T818) it's important, in the options of the game to:
* Always activate "Use Linear Mode" (specialy made for DD wheels as they are perfectly linear)
* Always activate "Reduce force when parked" (to avoid some oscillations on the pit)
* Always keep at 0% "Smoothing" slider (this slider is not for DD wheels - if you want to add some damper to decrease oscillations on this game, then do it in the T818 Control Panel)
@@ParlierEddy yes i have linear mode ,0 smoothing 0 damping but after last update i have oscillation,for remove this i use damper in t818 at 70% but i prefer feeling with max 20% damping in t818 panel control
@palestragenesi2.042 if there is any setting along the lines of "wheel friction" that's what you should adjust, assuming that the FFB is well made, that's just the nature if havubg extremely low friction and innertia steering components
Great review sir!
Sit back, relax and enjoy..
I wonder if the distance between the wheel and base will be different between the new wheels and the old wheels with the adapter.
Thank you Barry.
shows how much i am out of the loop, i dint even know TM had a direct rive wheel(base) so a very welcoming review :)
Well, it looks quite good actually. That it have that "analoge" feel at the top middle is a very good sing. Not bad a price at ~£600 for DD base either.
it is very new tbh
best review on the world wide web
That type of power connector is known to have some issues. Very important to make sure it is pushed in all the way!! Any type of wiggle on its socket can cause a lot of heat problems.
What ever happened to the CSL DD review?
The flex is a deal breaker. I would not pay any amount to sit behind that wheel. Great review as always.
I really dislike the screw because it indents the adapter on the steering wheels and even though you’ll never see it when in use its still something I subconsciously think about since I’m ocd about keeping my things nice.
Love your revs Mate,...
😎
Thank you for the review. I was considering staying in the thrustmaster echosystem, but after this review I am thinking I could invest in better products. Currently using a TS-XW with the F1 wheel, but wish I had something smoother.
Hello, BARRY It's always a pleasure to see your videos , as well as your extensive experience in the field of Simracing. Could you make a video about Thrustmaster's new steering wheel, the 488gt3, in the future, and enlighten us on the functions of the steering wheel that are not taken into account on consoles as well as on Pc?? Thank you very much and long live the chain ✌️👍🤗
The strong plastic reminds me of the MAGURA Carbotecture technology used in their bike brakes. I wonder if it’s similar.
I tried to do the flex test with my Simucube 2 Pro but i broke the rim before i could see any flex
WHAT!!! hope you're joking...
Hello, very good review, waiting for an equal review of the logitech DD, and especially the interior.
One of the very best review out here, as usual ;)
Thanks, and hoping you'll do a review of the logitech pro soon
always great review ! i would like to see the Logitech Pro racing test ! i want to see trueforce test (0 to 100 % and the feeling )
is it worth upgrading from Thrustmaster T300 to T818? I have also NLR GT track cockpit, thrustmaster T-LCM pedals, with T8pa shifter and nobrand ebay e-brake.
Please do a review on the Logitech Pro Wheel! So much detail, very good!
Finally got mine stateside and can confirm I am not feeling any flex w/ the SF1000, I haven't gotten to check my 330mm Nardi yet though...
Bonjour, Merci pour ce test détaillé, je viens d’acquérir le miens, je suis entrain de préparer mon châssis pour l'installer, je pense très rapidement travailler sur un système quick release tout métal qui je pense ce justifie pour ce direct drive.
Almost 18 months on, is there any chance you have had chance to try a newer model of the T818? I have seen some mention (and I hope it's true) that Thrustmaster might have reduced the flex somehow? It looks like a good wheel, but I am still concerned about the flex, it's the only thing putting me off. You're evaluation is always honest and thorough and I'd really appreciate your up to date view on this.
My T818 has developed a stiff area that is about 50-60 degrees of the rotation. It gets worse after about 2 hours use(heat makes it worse). Its almost got like a metallic grating feel to it. I don't know what it could be.
I've opened it up and can't see anything. Guess I can't send it back now. 😔
⁴For anyone who reads this. The problem may be solved. My dad stripped the motor down to reveal a gap between the outer casing and the ring of stator poles. He managed to work it back into the centre, then put glue from a glue gun all around the gap between the stator pole ring and the casing, to hold it in position better. Put it back together and the friction is gone. I panic bought the Ferrari sim edition of this wheel and experienced the exact same issue a year later. We have a theory why? I made a 15mm solid steel spacer to raise the height of the wheel. We think it somehow messed with the magnetic field and pushed the stator ring off centre. That's the theory anyway. Hopefully this will deter people from over engineering a 15mm solid blocked spacer that weighs a ton. Like an idiot, like me.
I read that
@@fastmclaren71 Thats some good info,
Hi Barry.
Fantastic review as always.
Do you know when you are going to review the new model SRP GT-R 3p Black Edition pedals?
I have 3 Thrustmaster wheels and with no one a flexing like you found it!
Very good review as always;) In every second you can hear passion and years of experience with best solutions on simracing market, that's for what we're all here for;)
Has anyone found out what the peak NM is?
I just bought this servo. A year after this video. It will be here today. I'll you know if they fixed any flex on the servo itself.
I have the Sparco P310 Alc wheel . Jumping from the TS servo to the T818. I love my TS servo. I can't wait to feel the difference.
Shorter-"don't buy t818 for drifting"
I had a t300 with both belts bearing mode(by the way I really recommend it I makes big difrence) , with all eco system from thrustmaster, so I got a t818, and first i was blown away how it works, and how good and quick the response is, but by the time I can figure it out how to set it up for drifting(99% time on sim drifting). One of the biggest problem of t818 is it smells like hot electronics after a quick session if it's intense like drifting and it's simple drivers, you just can't get It how u want it to be, with damper about(20-50%) the whell was to sponge, and without or little bit about(0-20%) it was to brutal(performance mode was the best). The biggest problem of this base(t818 for drifters) it's his constant torque, you can make it smoth like it should be with wheelcheck and lut for Assetto, but then the most of the details are gone. So you need to choose a pill. By the way flex on my with sparco wheel was very little. Soo I order moza r9 with cs steering wheel and spr pedals with load cell, I just download the moza pit house, choose drift preset, changed only force for about 3,5-4nm to make sure I'm driving all 3 wheels at exact same force, just open Assetto and drift like I was driving on this wheel all the time, it's just simply works. I linked the corners I never used to link that good. Moza just works and if u want you just can tinker the serting to your liking. Moza quality is like 2 levels above thrustmaster. Making my top 3 for the t300, t818, moza r9:
sim racing
1.t818 (the best, fastest, and informative ffb)
2.moza r9(i think I can get most of it by the time I learn the pit house settings)
3.t300(just the belt driven wheel.)
Drifting:
1.Moza r9 (it just works how it needs to and you can change it to your liking)
2.t300 (with bearings mode or without it's just good but the details are a little bit too late, to slow and soft)
3.t818(in other games it works better it's not as constant force or brutal like in assetto, but for me is the best sim drifting game, so the force is too constant and brutal, and after damper to spongy and slow so if you want to buy t818 for drifting just pick something else).
gwt more muscles
As always.... Very awesome, informative video!! Love your in depth overviews. Any chance you're going to be doing the Logitech Pro Direct Drive wheel and Pro Pedals? Just curious how it compares. Thanks again and keep up the fantastic work!
Hola, me gustaría preguntar, tengo el t818 hace un año, es normal que después de una hora de carrera, note un roce en el eje? será debido a algún tipo de dilatación por la fricción? gracias de antemano y saludos.
The flex can be an issue! Hopefully Thrustmaster can fix that, some way, especially with the SF1000
On my side I don't have this flex with the SF1000 rim when installed on the T818 base.
I seriously don't have any flex with the SF1000 on my T818.
This flex is not normal!!! looks like it was helped...
@@Meutenpapa he didn't insert the screw in the adapter, I think that is causing this.
I dont have flex as much as my real car..... I have a ricmotech momo mod 31 connected to the t818
The 16 in the serial number represents the number of years TM fans have been waiting for this btw
Looks like there may be a spot in the market for some third party to make a metal wheel adapter for the older wheels.
Nice review! Sidenote for me the ffb test button in the driver is not working for me, if i click nothing happens. In game all is fine.
Make sure that your wheel is up to date with the latest firmware version = V5.20.
I need a Logitech DD review by Barry now to make up my mind lol
Logitech is still junk and over priced. Logitech has no shifter support or new dd wheel base yet and no changeable wheels.
@@SIMRIG412 there IS a new DD wheel base, with a much stronger QR solution than on the T818. Logitech has always been dependable. No overheating problems like Thrustmaster has had, for example.
Forget logitech if you wanna spend 600 dollar go for sim magic alpha mini, which has much more ffb detail. For 900$ you should go with vrs direct force pro, those are as close as possible to a simucube 2 in terms of detail and strengh
@@FuZioN1 they don't sell those brands in my country
@FuZioN1 For some of us Logitech or thrustmaster are the only real options