[Easiest Ever Grain Tek] No Soak, No Boil, Grain Spawn for Growing Mushrooms
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- Опубліковано 20 гру 2024
- I use a no soak and no boil method (tek) of making grain spawn. By the name implies I do not soak or boil my grain before pressure cooking it. Let me know if you have any questions in the comments. Like and subscribe for more videos coming soon!
CORRECTION: I said 2 Micron in the video when I meant to say 0.2 micron.
** I meant to say 10T filter bags instead of 14T. **
Sterilized Grain Spawn Bags are available for sale on our website.
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contaminants are as small as .3? So why not .3 microns instead of 2?
I did mean to say 0.2 micron not 2 micron. Sorrry! The T filters are 0.2 micron.
If contaminants are .3 and the bag is .3, contaminants will enter. If the contaminants are as small as .3 and the bag is .2 micron then the won’t fit through the bag filter
@@jbigg333 I meant to say that most contaminants, that ruin projects anyways, are larger than .3
I contacted you for the agar plates I bought ten from you and you mentioned your grain bags and how you made to order and nothing sat around to long witch was a big deal in my eyes and that alone is big selling point for myself happy to deal with you I have a question about that Im trying to grow p.cubes and was wondering if the type of grain you use a good host for those types of strains
@@willywonkaredford1845 Plenty of info online. He is a gourmet company not medicinal. And to answer, any grain works.
I like what he said, "I make it as simple as possible, because I don't like doing things that take longer than they should."
Seriously. This method is the way. It works. It's beautiful. No messing around soaking grain.
Makes it so much easier!! It’s the only way I do it now.
“If this isn’t easy for you try something else.” Great advice.
Or get good
This tek is a god send
-Faster colonization times than soaking. I can already see mycelium forming at day 2 from a liquid culture soaking then drying sometimes takes 1 week to form
-No prep time just drop'em in the pc. I used to soak them for 12 hours which makes them ferment and sometimes get contam.
You just saved me a lot of time man keep it up!
After so watching so many grain spawn videos, finally someone mentions not having to have the pressure cooker on max. Love the minimalist approach, thank you
Yo! This worked for me as well with quart jars! I did 1 pint of producers pride whole oats from TSC and 200ml of water. Came out damn near perfect. I would suggest to others to play around with it (try a couple different jars.. 150ml, 175ml, up to 225ml) and see what works best. Essentially doing the 75% water weight to oat weight worked for me as shown in the video.
sick, i was cruising the comments for someone mentioning jars, ty. im going to try it next time i do up some grain jars.
This is an AWESOME way to do this. For anyone who wants to use quart jars, 8 oz oats and 3/4 cup water is perfect. When you put 8 oz of oats in you may say to yourself "hey I can fit a lot more oats in there", but after absorbing the water, the oats will expand, and 8 oz gives you just enough room to be able to shake your jars without issue. Thanks again for this technique.
Is 8oz of oats about 1.5 cups ? Just making sure...
Can you go into more detail about how long you cook? I keep getting mush on the bottom and seemingly normal grain above.
Would you do same amount for rye? Or a little more of water and rye?
@Elliott Ergon Thanks Elliot. My guess is that this works better for bags than jars. I'm going to try putting in a double layer of a trivet and lids so that I can keep the jars entirely out of the water while retaining the 3 quarts of water sufficient for PC for 90 minutes. I suspect that the oatmeal effect is coming because the bottom of the jars are underwater and cooking.
@Stephen Brockhoff, how long do you PC your jars for? I'm trying to replicate your success by precisely following your process
11:30 - 'Keep it at that (15psi) for 2 hours' - Thanks for all the detail in this video!
Seriously the most helpful verbal and visual explanations! You've just made my life so much happier, thank you :)
Happy to help!
typically overcomplicated processes are extra. Problems are usually solved by doing the few correct things, NOT a million tiny touches that take forever.
Right! I like to break from habitual processes that are only around because that's what everyone else is doing. When it's possible to do so of course! This method has been serving me well for years.
Can you do the opening of the bag without a flowhood
This is one of the stellar videos out there on bag procedure in a pressure cooker. A lot of videos whiz thru the part about how much water should be in the cooker, so I really dug how you took some time to show exactly where it should go and explained why. Oh, and it was great to see the bag folding done in a slow way too. Thanks a lot and keep up the great content!
Thanks Steve! That's very encouraging. I like to discuss the little things because I've also noticed a lack of info.
I use 4 nuts and bolts through the holes in the water spacer metal thing to raise in to 2 inches works great
Great video all together. One question in the last part is it necessary to open the bag and let air in if you are going to seal it and remove the air out of it again ? I feel like i missing something but it seems like an unnecessary step that might lead to contamination.
You are a great teacher! I love seeing videos that simplify grain as much as this. All the rye teks that rinse and soak and a bunch of nonsense steered me wrong for a long time.
It's a great time saver for sure!
Does this process go for all grain?
For metric folks slightly heavier bags:
1kg oats
750 ml water
I love this , great to see sombody eles that doesn't soak grain, the nutrients is water soluble you loose so much nutrients by soaking it. Force hydration all the way, great video buddy.
Yes! Thank you!
If you were using oats in jars, would you keep the same ratio of grain to water? That ratio being 4 parts oats, 3 parts water.
i dont soak either but i do a simmer, it makes a huge difference i found.... and my buddy didnt believe me when i said my rye bags colonize in 7 days or less lol
The very last part where you open the bags slightly to let some air in, can this be done inside of a still air box if you don’t have access to a flowhood?
Yeah. Lots of folks don't have hoods, so just use what you have.
U can do anything anything them then u put in pressure cooker and it sterilized it all
really great info, no beating around the bush.
Thanks a mil for taking the time and making the effort to make and upload this golden nugget! very much appreciated!
I always keep a few extra gaskets on hand, I've learned my lesson thru the years that they fail at the most unexpected times lol
Can i use the same process for rye berries or whats the difference...this would help me greatly when you get a minute..thx
@@rachelle1 Rachelle, I have had similar results for wheat and rye, but not experienced with oats
This video saved me SOOO MUCH TIME!!!! Thank you!!
Glad it helped!
Do a video on that flow hood that things impressive
I'm doing a batch of spawn right now and I did a few jars like this to test it out. I did 4 parts oats to 3 parts water and added a spoonful of gypsum. I'll give em a shake when the pc loses pressure and see how it goes. If this works then it's a game changer for me. Thanks for sharing!
Awesome! Let us know how it goes for you. There have been other commenting about doing it with jars as well.
Right off the bat, the moisture content looks good upon visual inspection. Honestly I feel silly for not realizing this ahead of time, but the gypsum wasn't a great idea. It's almost all still on the bottom of the jar. That's why I only did one jar that way though. I'll open the jar up and see what the grains are like since I'm going to toss that one anyway. If the moisture content is as good as it appears then tomorrow I'll do a whole batch of the no soak, no boil tek but without gypsum this time and I'll give it a whirl.
I have my PC loaded up with no soak, no boil oats. Man, I'm pretty stoked about this lol. I'll have to see if I can find a way to get gypsum to fully dissolve in water so I can sneak it into the jars. I think I'll see if gypsum dissolves better into hot water. If so, I can just boil it on the stove and dissolve the gypsum before I add the water to the oats, and just make sure it doesn't cool off before the PC reaches operating temp.
@@mikecurry6847 Gypsum is a mineral and won't dissolve. Honestly, most commercial growers (including myself) don't even use it.
@@midnightmushroomco.2091 I've noticed that. I worked in the inoculation lab at a pretty big mushroom plant up here in Michigan. I never mixed up the substrate or spawn, but I did notice that they didn't add any minerals or any supplements/ammendments other than various plant materials. I guess I've always just kind of assumed it to be true, but I was under the impression that gypsum can add slightly to contamination resistance. I live in a pretty old house and my work areas are pretty substandard lol. So to make up for it, I go extra hard on anything I can do to stay clean and keep things contam free. I've got things worked out pretty well though and don't have issues anymore. Is that even true, that gypsum can help just a little bit in terms of contamination resistance? Maybe that's not even true.
omg right! i new there had to be a way to avoid that step that even the biggest names on the forums promote. it just seemed so repetitious. Its hard for me to get the bags locally, in jars how are the proportions.
Proportional I guess
Not a math major at all, but also working in qt jars, so will try to work out proportions.
2 lb oats = 4 qts or 128 oz (dry), 1.5 lbs water = 24 ounces water.
Divide in half; 2 qts or 64 oz oats, 12 oz water,;
divide in half again 1 qt or 32 oz oats, 6 oz water.
30seconds in already picked up good info. Thanks
Is that why my when I put grain in the .5micron bags they mold?
thanks you for explaining about melted bags
Thank you so much for this video and this channel! I appreciate your products and your spreading of knowledge. Still have spawn growing from you that I bought about a year ago.
Awesome glad it's helped!
tape 3 quarters together on the rocker to keep from loosing steam. also look into partial pressure. i purge my cooker for 10 mins b4 i put cap on. im excited to try this no boil method thanks man!
I haven't run grain in 3 years thiswas a nice refresher on water and grain ratios cause i totally forgot em
I just did this tek last night. I love it because it’s easy to replicate and modify your hydration ratio if needed. I also like it because I’ve been using miller for a while now and as you know, millet is expensive.
I’ve inoculate mine with liquid cultures of Phoenix oyster and pink oyster. I simply poked a hole in the bag and injected 20ml of lc into each bag. I then covered the hole left by the needle with tape.
Cross fingers
Matthew, how did the inoculation work out for you? How much LC did you use?
I’ve been searching this topic for two days. This is by far the best vid I have found, hands down!
One question: at the end you let in a bit of air and mix up the grains while still warm and then seal it. Do you cut open the bag to inoculate? Or do you allow it to cool and then inoculate and seal? Thanks 🤙
Let it cool first then inoculate and seal
You should do a video on all in 1 bag. I'm curious about the moisture content of the grain and substrate in 1 bag. Thanks for the knowledge
Yes!
Great video.
Could the oats formula be used for rye, since they are similar? Ever tried that?
I was wondering once your bags are done. You sealed the bags before cooling. What if u need to do a grain jar to bag transfer. Thanks
I notice you are folding the bag gussets back in before sealing the bag. I'm wondering if you have a specific type of sealer for making sure those seal. I've read that the gussets don't seal with all types of sealers. A post of the url to the one you are using in the video would be great or any general advice on sealers.
It’s a 5 mm impulse sealer. I can’t post links on here because UA-cam will pitch a fit. But here’s the model number AIE-405HIM
@@midnightmushroomco.2091 Thank you.
Atwood three washed oats don't ship to my area, seems they are oklahoma/arkansas/kansas. based. I'll look at my local feed stores and see what they have in stock
How important is squeezing the air out before sealing?
Ok i did some numbers made a excel spreadsheet to give me the math to use to the .00 decimal for a scale. Im experimenting with oats against... Oats, malted rye, malted wheat in one jar by 1/3rds. final weight for pints should be .5 pounds. Excel gave me .29 of grain and .21 water. added them to the jar.. let sit on counter for two hours then pressure sterilized as usual. 15psi 2.5 hours. I just threw them on a Tared scale and one weighs .513 and the other .517 I'd say so far NAILED IT! Ill report back with how they grow and which recipe wins. :)
I like to add 3 quarters to the top of my presto. Keeps it from losing alot of steam at 15psi. Nice video!!
I was using 3 quarts but my pressure would climb to 17 psi even when turning down the heat. When we removed the quarters it keeps 15 psi almost perfectly.
@@doctorjamos2096 gotta remember tho when that weight is rocking. You're losing water into the air. Which is why I like to keep the quarters on so my pc doesn't run out of water. Does require more babysitting though to keep it at 15
I just keep an eye on the gauge, and adjust the heat from rise to just where it's at 15. Just out of safety's sake.
Just followed the first video I found on rye berries prep and was thinking the entire time this seems excessive ( rinse, soak, add gypsum, wait 24hr, boil, pressure cook). Excited to try this, thank you!
Did it work
@@raymondmorales8774 not really but I also havent gotten anything to grow on rye berries yet with the boiling method either. I've just been using brown rice since but I might try it again with more water, my only guess is that they're just not hydrated enough. Otherwise it cooked really evenly, I used 2lb bags in an instant pot. I'll update if I figure it out.
@@raeechil Instant pot doesn't get hot enough to properly stertilize. Be wary.
can you post a link to that sealer? mine is on the fritz, and that one looks a lot nicer than mine.
Gonna try this on my next batch! If it works its a game changer for me! Thx for the video!
Awesome!
you can hit up my dealer @kcxtrips on instagram he sells all kinds of psychedelic shrooms, DMT, LSD, growkits and spores, do tell him i recommended you.
Hey man, thanks for the video!!!. I don’t have a flow hood,,, can I just seal the bag right out the pressure cooker and then get air in through the filter??
Award for best music in a video!
I understand that the *steam* is ~120° C for sterilisation. But surely the sides of the pressure cooker are hotter than that (sitting on fire), and would melt plastic if they are resting on the sides of the interior?
@@conflagrationTuesday you’d think so but it doesn’t
I've used the same method except that I do leave it to soak overnight, such that endo spores are awakened, for a TOTAL sterilization.
For me 1 1/2 pounds h20 was to wet....I tried 1#5oz and that did the trick for me. Great tek though, saves a lot of time.
Thanks for the video! Does this work for Rye berries too? If cleaned
when i want to inoculate these bags with agar do i cut them open and re seal? TIA
Yes you cut the very top of the bag, drop in the agar and either seal or you can zip tie it back closed
Do you let the presto on the stove cooldown in front of the flowhood? I fold like you do wondering if I'll have issues
What is your favorite impact sealer? Most do not seal well in my experience when they come right put of the PC hot as shown. Usually I have to dry yhe bag and then seal
How do you do this without a flow hood
sure learn alot , feel my operational awareness swelling and surging past others who one shant be in competition
Hey Man, thanks! Awesome video. I'm a retired scientist and love shortcuts/hate unnecessary steps. I use rye grain. Do you happen to know the appropriate ratio of water for rye?
How would you recommend handling the opening and shaking step right at the end without access to a flow hood? Would you recommend sticking to jars as opposed to bags in that situation?
Anyone try the 2:1.5 water ratio with millet? I just did 2:1 and a lot of the grains are still dry, some bags half dry.
Thank you very much.
If I were to prepare the grain to be inoculated with colonized agar, where would that fit in? Would I cool the grain inside the pressure cooker over night, open the bags in my sterile conditions, drop the agar in and heat seal?
If you use jar are you putting a vent hole in the top? I saw Someone do a 1/4” vent hole with pillow stuffing stuffed in it.
I have only filled and pressure cooked 4 bags of grain, i know almost nothing; but have a dream, you may have prevented future pains in my ass. Thank You!
Any idea what formula to use for brown rice?
I wouldn’t recommend for grains without hulls like rice. They’ll turn to mush pretty easily.
Can you take the same ratio for water to grain and make bigger bags like 5 lbs?
Any reason this wouldn't work with grain jars as well? I'd assume as long the grain to water ratios were adjusted to account for what will fit in jars rather than bags it would otherwise give the same results, no?
Hi, do you put the same amount of water with the corn seeds and the other seeds?hope you make an update to see the results ? thanks
I have yet to do corn kernels but I do also use Millet with the same method. I just like to use 1.25 lb of water for them.
If i only have a still air box, im assuming this method isnt going to work as well since i would have put it in my box and open it to be able to distribute moisture.
Can you apply this same technique to using ball jars vs bags? Is there a ratio of grain to H20? Would a 1/4 tsp of gypsum added initially not be beneficial? Appreciate your KISS process...OUTSTANDING!!! 🙏🏼
2lbs grain to 1.5 lbs of water should be simple math at that point. But yes gypsum is beneficial to mycelium in spawn and substrate.
My concern is with opening the "container" after the Sterilization procress.
Another thing is the mixed advice out there about how long to let the pressure cooker cool and decompress- something about building up excess moisture or losing moisture. Alot of conlificting claims and info.
There’s conflicting info out there because everyone has a way they figured out and they all think that’s the only way. If you release the pressure too soon you’ll potentially cause your bags to burst. The plastic can withstand the temp but it’s still mailable. As the pressure is released, the boiling point of the water in the grain goes back down towards 212 degrees quickly. This causes a lot of liquified but super heated water (because of the pressure) to immediately turn to steam. That then causes pressure to build up quickly with the bags and cause them to essentially blow a bubble in the side of them and pop. Just some things we’ve noticed in our lab.
Ok so I replicated this procedure perfectly with the same scale and oats however, I used half gallon mason jars, for some reason my results were that 1.5 lbs of water is just a little to much even 1lb of water might bust grains, however it those batches will work... great simple method
Awesome! Glad you were able to get it to work with jars.
Great! but to be clear 1lb of water was good for you in jars??
@@Dmyra I wouldn’t use this method for jars unless you have really big jars, his recipe is perfect for bags, quart jars I do 400/400grams it’s perfect, but for half gallon jars I still haven’t perfected a recipe I’d say 1 .6 lb oats and .8 lbs water is ok maybe up the water, clumping is the issure
@@Hoi.808 so on quart jars you’re 1:1? 400g of water with 400g of grain?
Very cool approach… I used that exact presto cooker and did 4 bags exactly as you shared…. 24 hours later appears to be a tiny bit of condensation upper part of bags. But grain appears dry and perfectly hydrated…thoughts?
I always respect practical knowledge and try to apply what I learn. If you have a video about liquid culture, culture with agar and storing the produced cultures for a long time, I will look forward to it.
Hey there! Thank you for this. What kind of scale is that? Where can I buy one?
Hey I'll refer you to a mate that sells them very reliable and ships discretely bought from him a couple of times.
👆👆
Thanks but without a flowhood is better to use Jars then Bag's??
quick question... i do my grainspawn on glass jars, can I do the same and it will still work? just curious ...
How come you don’t need gypsum? Are the oats not as starchy, it doesn’t clump?
I have an instant pot, do you know the time and setting for it?
Helpful sound hint; if you’re only using the video mic, eliminate all other noise sources, including music overlays. They all compete with your voice.
Can you seal the bag before going in the pressure cooker?
LISTEN TO THIS:
I'm scrolling my feed and this video pops up, I click cuz it said I was halfway thru it previously, it played exactly at a spot talking about that seal. It's a problem I've tried to figure out in the last day or 2. What a weird synchronicity!! I never searched about this yet and dunno what this channel even was. 😳
I actually just received some 0.5 micron bags, why is it necessary to use 2 micro bags with this technique?
Hello. Such a great video ☺️. I saw some maize cob on the floor budding whitish mushroom spawn and they are everywhere. Can they be made to produce spawn or not? If yes how?
American stoves have the dial behind the pots, not in front? Don't you think it's a bit bizzair to say the least? :)
Keeps things interesting
Appreciate the tips. I just failed my first attempt because another video said you shouldn't have the water submerging your bottom bags at all, so it ran out of water after about 1h30 and stunk up the house. Will try with more water next and see how it goes!
P.S. if anyone has tips on how to remove melted plastic from pressure canner walls, please share :)
@@ChristopheLimpalair did you figure it out??
@@unreality4337 removing melted plastic from the walls? Nope, and I gave up after I realized that the bottom of my canner was completely warped which means the integrity of the canner was compromised. I had to buy a new one...
@@ChristopheLimpalair brother i literally had the same shit happen to me. I screamed when i realized i forgot and let it dry. Motherfuckers we are. Crazy how the exact same shit happened. I put extra water now fuck that shit never again.
Do we start the time when the rocker is at the appropriate steadiness or do we start the timer once it starts rocking period?
I do have issues with melted/burst bags and was only successful when I lined the pressure cooker with aluminum foil. I already modified my trivet and I put 3 qts of water in the PC and sits right under the trivet. So what is my problem ? … heat too high maybe 🤔. My rocker does spin and rock around a little wild
Trying this rn! Thanks! I keep forgetting my grains drying all the time so this should be clutch! Thanks!
I'm assuming one could use an insta pot for this as well?
Is contam an issue with this tek?
I’ve been using this tek for years and never had issues. As long as sterilization is achieved in the pressure cooker (hits 15psi for 2 hours) you’ll be fine. Now, what you do after is where contamination could happen. But the grain is sterile coming out of the pressure cooker
Would this work for ball jars with filter and injection ports or would they need prehydrated grains in that instance you think?
Great video thanks , can save alot of effort & time Will this Tek for MIllet / Sorgum or Wild bird seed and pop corn ?too??
Is there a reason we can't seal the bag before we put it in the canner? There is a filter there for air exchange.
The problem is the filters (especially T filters) don't allow much air flow. Seal up a bag, push on it and you'll see what I'm talking about. Inside the PC the water turns to steam and will puff up the bag. This can cause the bags to stretch. I've seen it even blow a bubble out the side of a bag.
@@midnightmushroomco.2091 Thank you for your reply, is there a way to seal the bag without a laminar flow hood?
@@rizi you could possibly use a “still air box” (SAB) to do the part of sucking in a bit of air and shaking. Maybe jars would be a better choice for someone without a flow hood. Since the jars would give some headspace that might be easier to shake the grain. I may need to test with my SAB. I just get a bit spoiled with my flow hood haha.
@@midnightmushroomco.2091 if you were to use jars what would be the ratio of water and oat per jar??
Can you grow reishi and lions mane in grain spawn bags.What other kinds as well.Asauming no Chaga
Thats great!! Im learning about this big world that mushrooms provides and everything now is useful for me, thank u! I wanted to ask if it would be a good idea to esterilize the grain and the substrate together in the same bag in order to just inoculate the LQ in the bag, let it colonize the grain and once it is done, mix the mycelium with the substrate that would be on top of it. Sorry about my english, huges from Argentina!!
You can certainly do that. We’re going to be offering that kind of bag soon.
What brand of scale you have
Would it be the same measurements for rye berry?
Apologies if this was already answered, but what kind of impulse sealer are you using?
AIE-405HIM
Great vid how about using rye berries
I hope you put the plate back on. Nice vid, thanks.
Nice and concise without all the YT hype, I like it. Subbed. Anyway, whole hulled oats is INSANELY expensive here in South Africa for some reason, and that's if you can even find it... I'm considering Wheat as a supplemental grain to the millet but there's not a whole lot of info out there on it
You can use straw as a sub, if thats any cheaper ?:) Stamets talks about how to do this in different books of his
@@myco_chaotix cheers for that. I have a bunch of info on straw, including cold pasteurization techniques but haven't put any of it into practice. A bale of straw is 36ZAR or about 2 dollars so yeah, a heck of a lot cheaper. 😅 Transportation is an issue tho, shipping cost to an outlying area such as mine are pricey for large, heavy goods and I'm definitely not going to be stuffing bales of straw in my i10 either 🤣
I have been trying oats from TSC. I have tried other grains with great success. Rye, WBS, Millet, Wheat Berries and my fav brown rice (its great) however I keep getting aspergillus flavus when using the oats from TSC. The worst kind. It has an endospore that seems to be able to live through the hottest depths of hades. Even after soaking and PCing for 2.5 hours( i have even done 4 hours!) it is still 50/50 on getting the same thing. aspergillus flavus.... I believe whoever supplies TSC has discovered the most heat resistant mold on the planet.
I've used oats from TSC as well with good success rates. Its a scientific fact that nothing remains viable through hours of pressure cooking. It must be entering through inoculation. What is your method of inoculating? And do you use bags or jars?
@@alex37211 scientific fact? 😂 Do you know what an extromophile spore is? Aspergillus does in fact produce extromophile spores. National Institutes of Health (NIH) (.gov)
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