Synthetic Winch Line Breakage
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- Опубліковано 22 кві 2018
- TBT to synthetic rope breakage. MYTH: Synthetic winch rope falls to the ground when it breaks. Well, the truth is, sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn’t. This video was sent to us from our friend and GenRight Off Road Ambassador Jeff Perkins. In this particular case, the synthetic winch rope broke suddenly without warning and the recoil was significant. Sure, there is less energy stored when compared to a steel cable, but you still would not want get hit with this rope.
The mode of synthetic winch rope failure is uncertain. At times it can fail by sequential strand failures. In a sequential failure, as each one of the individual strand fails, a small portion of the overall stored energy is released from the system. As this type of failure mode continues, energy is released in steps over time until there is little energy stored in the system and the final strand finally fails and the rope drops to the ground. The problem is that there is no way to predict that this mode of rope failure will occur versus a more dangerous sudden catastrophic rope failure.
A sudden winch rope failure is quite possible, especially if the winch line is either shock loaded, or in this case the rope may have been overstressed by an undersized corner radius on the fairlead, or the rope possibly contacted a small burr on the fairlead. Regardless of the cause, it’s important to play it safe and plan for the sudden failure and recoil of the rope. What’s the take away here? Be cautious and don’t count on a sequential rope fiber failure, use a rope damper, and stay away from the recoil danger zone.
So do any of you have any experience with winch rope failure? Sequential or sudden?
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Had rope snap and hit me. Felt like being struck with a belt. Left a red lash on my leg but inwas able to keep working like nothing happened. It hurt for a few but got over pretty quickly. If it were a steel line i would have lost my legs. To this day i will never work with steel cable. Shit stretches and yields without warning. Rather get my ass beat by a rope then to be ripped into pieces!
That’s what she said 😂
This is why I use roller heads even on synth.
They have a much larger minimum radius.
I had a very similar incident, the rope was under huge load and I had actually stalled the winch trying to pull a Land Cruiser out of mud (I should have done some digging and used a snatch block). The rope did recoil, but sooner be hit by that than by a steel cable.
It also recoils ,not so extreme as a steal wire.Inspection the full rope lenght before a 4x4 tripp will be necessary.
That’s Crazy safe
This really makes me think they should put a sleeve of nylon or something to not let in dirt, or abrasive as much, as they do for boat wake ropes and such
Hit a burr on the fairlead and ware spot on rope from dirt and grit +probably sun spot
It was rubbing on the left side pretty good.
Broke right at the winch exit, is it sharp? even just a slight 1/8 inch nub will weaken the rope by half if 15k pounds is on it.
It bothers me when people say that synthetic rope just drops to the ground. That is demonstrably false. It can still hurt you but it is unlikely to kill you like steel cable can. Still have to have proper safety when using it, but should it snap death is very unlikely.
I've literally seen videos where it drops right where it is....
Death? More like a booboo if that hits you.
@@Johnny-tq9no That's going to be a function of how much strain it was under when it finally let-go. If it let-go in stages slowly enough then the tension on the final strands might have been low enough relative to the weight of the 'dead' strands that the final relase wasn't enough to cause the rope to snap-back violently. If most of the strands let-go at the same time then that would definitely mean more energy released at the same time, and thus a greater propensity to recoil.
So, got my first winch installed and went out to unspool and respool under the weight of the vehicle. It’s a synthetic rope and was making random popping noises while winching under pressure/weight. Is it normal for it to make a noise the first time?
Yes
Lol that "fell to the ground" 👌
I don’t think it matters if it falls to the ground or not, that frayed rope coming back at you is not gonna do anything.
Any info on the material of this rope and the age?
The rope was most likely contacting some steel that was not cleared all the way from behind the fairlead mouth opening. The build-up of tension and friction running the line over this spot snapped the line under load. The rope was standard Smittybilt winch line and was fairly new from what we were told. Dyneema fiber is very strong but one thing it cannot deal with is abrasion.
@@Factor55 Smittybilt is NOT Dyneema 12 strand synthetic cable. Had to read all these comments to get to the meat of it. Anyone can make a video claiming something that could be true or not. DONT BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU SEE ON THE INTERNET!!
Zawsze urywa się na ślizgu
I had my 3/16" Amsteel synthetic line break pulling my atv out of a snowbank today. It had very little stress on it when it broke, maybe 150 pounds. Couldn't see anything that would have cut it on the fairlead. There was a bit of sand stuck on the rope, but nothing that hasn't been on it before during other winching. The rope is spooled inside the atv so it's never in direct sunlight except during winching. The rope was about 4 years old, and was always dried out after washing or crossing streams so it couldn't have rot weakened. When it snapped, it did exactly what it did in this video. About 25 feet whipped into the tree I had anchored to, and it hit hard enough to knock some bark off the trunk.
Not too sure I'm going to replace the syn rope with more. I might just go back to steel. I find myself winching over sandstone ledges mor than anything else, and syn rope is kind of a pain to keep from getting cut if the rope rubs on the sandstone at all. Steel will just grind through it with no problems.
utah wanderlust700 3/16 is very small diameter rope. We are not cordage experts but from our experience we would use a minimum of 1/4 or 5/16 winch line to caution on the side of safety.
Winch rope is a consumable and should be replaced over time. With so many variables it’s hard to say what lead to the failure.
We are by no means suggesting that steel cable is bad. In fact there are still many recreational winch users using steel cable for the exact reason you describe. Abrasion is a big problem with synthetic rope. We have similar rocky terrain here in Idaho and for that reason even a couple of our staff members still use steel cable on their winches. That’s one big advantage of our winch line shackle mounts, they work with both steel cable or synthetic rope. Just be sure to spool it on smoothly making sure the steel cable is wound tightly on.the drum and watch for burrs and you should be fine.
If you decide to upgrade your rope I would suggest contacting MasterPull, JM Rigging, C4RS, or Custom Splice for more info.
Thanks for your comments!
Factor 55 The winch line that broke on me was from Custom Splice, and 3/16" is the correct size for atv winches. Anything fatter will jam the smaller spools of atv winches. CS says its rated to 5100 pounds.
I'm just glad it decided to break when I was just buried in a snowbank rather than someplace dangerous. Last month, I winched up the Widow Maker in Moab. If it had broken on me there, it would've dropped my atv about 8 feet onto it's rear axle!
I use steel. I see very little benefits in going to rope. I think the benefits are embellished to make sales.
LandC there are many benefits to using rope, easy to repair, lighter weight, higher breaking strengths, but Rope does not deal with abrasion or UV damage very well. We still use steel cable on 2 of our crawlers for this reason. That’s one of the biggest benefits of our products. They work with steel cable or synthetic rope.
if it had 150lbs of tension, bark wouldnt of flew off... you can pull that much with your hands
Oh that sucks. Reasons not to get a small ton winch. And looked way less life threatening than a steel cable.
Ropes need to be washed every time, debris left in the fibers cuts the inside, out of sight.
Everyone bagging on rope winch line, I can show you 100 videos of “Aircraft rated steel line” breaking time after time …..you can break anything…even diamonds if you push hard enough …..some operator error here….this vehicle appears to be high centered …
I used to work at Lakehurst where we broke 1 3/8" arresting gear cable on purpose
Looks like a atv cable
..."for every action...there is an equal and opposite reaction"...
...seems to me I heard that in school somewhere...
Einstein's theory? Maybe, can't remember, lol
@@betogray9765 ...newton's third law...Einstein was relativity...E=MC2
@@paradiseroad6405 OH, THAT'S WHAT IT WAS!!
Synthetic will DROP TO THE GROUND when it snaps
🤣🤣🤣😂😂😂
Well that is what it did..
@@TheAmericanUhate Eventually.
I just wanted to be the 55th comment. That is all
Woohoo!! Thanks!
Is that quality dyneema synthetic winch rope or some cheap knock off made of something else?
Dyneema does not store energy and whip lash like that - not that I've ever seen anyway. It just drops to the ground.Even if it did whip it won't flay you open like a splayed steel cable will:
ua-cam.com/video/hw4BEwxO-gE/v-deo.html
No, all dyneema has some degree of stretch. The longer the rope the more potential for stretch. No matter which type of dyneema used there is always an element of recoil from shock loading or under heavy loads when it breaks.
@@Factor55 Stretching a bit is a different to the way a steel cable stores energy and bursts apart..... Plasma is safer and lighter but less durable when routinely wet, muddy or dirty. It's a trade off. I'll take the plasma any day over steel just for the weigh saving and safety alone.
@@titaniumquarrion9838 Agreed!
This is what happens when you use thick string, always go with cable, Have you ever known a crane to operate with thick string, NO because it doesn't work.
That's because cranes deal with friction often. That's where these are ropes fail. I've also seen cables fail on cranes...
I use a cable but I also inspect my cable after every trip.
@@veganpotterthevegan crane cables don't get subject to friction because cranes use shives and don't rub the cable on anything.
@@jasonh4167 What are shives?
@@jasonh4167 Not on purpose. But it still happens
The rope is thin
Michael xu it may have been frayed and was close to failing but this rope would have been considered a standard 3/8 line. Just goes to show you can never be too careful.
Factor 55 ok👍
must be that it was under load but it sure looked thinner than 3/8 to me too, video does funny things too though.
john lopes I want to say, please call me for the capstan rope, ha ha
Synthetic rope is used by people who don't know what they are doing which is why it is safer for the dummies. So the jeep is hung up on rocks so the pull required is going to be considerably greater but does the operator run a snatch block to reduce the load, no just hitches up and pulls. Looking at the rope on the drum either the winch is rated far higher than the rope can take or the rope is damaged and fails as there are lays on the drum which will also reduce the potential pull. If you understand loads and what you are doing wire rope is far more reliable but so many people fit a winch and just pull without any knowledge or understanding. Its like having a gun, you don't give real ammo to people who don't know what they are doing and this is the same. Synthetic rope is for the dummies who youd also give the blanks and leave the real job to real people who understand the forces involved and can be responsible. But anyway I am sure Factor 55 can just keep selling worthless bling for people who don't know any better to hang all over their trucks.
Hi Pete, interesting insight. Synthetic winch line found on most recreational winches fails between 18-22,000 lbs. highly doubt this little winch on this Jeep is larger than a 12K.
The rope failed because of possible binding in the line or was cut on a steel lip that had not been properly clearances behind the fairlead surface. This video is to show that synthetic rope does not simply fall to the ground.
Yes, synthetic rope has some downfalls but if steel cable were to fail like in this video, it would be far more dangerous. But you are correct, most people in general, do not care for their equipment or get the proper training needed.
Our products are used by the US Military, FIRE, SAR, and recommended by the 4WD training organizations worldwide. Not just bling. If you would like more information feel free to contact us at 208-639-1674. Thanks!
@@Factor55 I use hooks, chains snatch blocks and shackles from the lifting industry. Perfectly suitable, rated equipment for use with vehicle winches. I don't have the pockets to pay for the flash stuff being promoted everywhere like soft shackles, recovery rings and synthetic rope. I use what works and I know I can rely on. Most military, public bodys etc get a healthy discount as it looks good from your angle for advertising and sales. Your comment "if steel cable were to fail like in this video, it would be far more dangerous" is true but its far less likely to happen because wire rope is more robust. Plastic rope when, combined with sharp edges/binding and crushing on winch drums/ground abrasion/grit etc which are all found in off roading, is more likely to weaken the rope. If you want to spend your time resplicing/replacing plastic rope on the trail then fine but I go for the off roading.
@ Pete Wilson Take it easy bud. Contrary to what you say, it is much easier to damage wire rope by sinking down thru lower layers under tension, because the person didn’t properly tension the cable on the drum. I’ve seen many cables with the tell- tale damage of sinking thru layers. Then thats a common failure point. But when synthetic rope gets pulled thru lower layers it just basically flattens or conforms, and loses no strength, and can be easily worked back into shape. But theres definitely pros and cons for both, but it’s hands down safer, and that’s the main draw.
Simple fix! Buy a Toyota and you won’t get stuck! 😁