American F-86 Sabre Vs Soviet Mig-15 BIS Dogfight | Korean War | Digital Combat Simulator | DCS |
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- Опубліковано 17 лип 2022
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On this channel we like to do a lot of dogfighting most videos are some sort of dogfight between 2 different aircraft as we explore their different capabilities. From time to time I like to dabble in Virtual Reality, I think VR is a great new technology and I love to show that stuff off for the channel from time to time.
If you enjoy war thunder or Microsoft flight simulator 2020 or even dogfighting in Battlefield 2042, consider getting yourself into Digital Combat Simulator by Eagle Dynamics, the Combat side of Aviation with the BVR and Dogfights really provides a different and interesting perspective on aviation. You can fly all kinds of combat aircraft including the F-16, F-15, F-14, JF-17, Su-27, Mig-29, Mirage and the F-18 Hornet along with many other aircraft and helicopters like the Ka-50 and Mi-8. - Ігри
I feel it’s worth noting that it’s 9 days until the F-15s 50th birthday, in case you wanna plan something special for the Eagle’s big day!
Well that's quite the good idea. A big ass Eagle fight is needed.
Maybe a 50 eagle flight against 75 mig 29s?
I heard they were getting an AESA Saber upgrade.
How about an F-15C dressed up in the Eagle's original birthday suit? The air superiority blue of the F-15A when it was at First Fighter at Langley, Virginia USA! Such a pretty jet in that color!
MiG vs Mustang? 🤔
@@debbiestimac5175 I lament the overly-practical, gray, drab, ugly paint schemes of USAF and USN aircraft today.
We must return to flamboyant, stylish, bold paint schemes!
also hooray somebody who knows the F-15 was originally blue. unfortunately there doesn't seem exist an air superiority blue skin for the DCS Eagle, yet.
I love these first generation jet fighters. There’s just something awesome about their simplicity and elegance.
Yea, they are elegant, but they're 2nd generation jet fighters. 1st gen would include stuff like the F-80, Gloster Meteor, Me 262, and the Mig-9
@@argon7624it rly depends wat classification system you are using
I remember reading in a book where Sabre pilots said the key to fighting the MIG-15 was to keep the speed as high as possible. The MIG's unassisted flight controls made the stick and rudder very heavy at high speeds and it couldn't maneuver as well and it would tire the pilots out quicker.
Turns out the issue of the F-86's guns having limited effectiveness against the MiG-15 was due to the API rounds commonly used by the the US in Korea had unreliable detonation upon impact at high altitude, significantly reducing the damage caused by each hit. Supposedly the Sabre's guns were more effective (still not great) below 25,000 MSL.
AFAIK, there was no detonation involved with the M20 API-T round, instead the rounds relied on aerodynamically heating Magnesium that was etched into the bullets. Since it's aerodynamic heating, it makes sense that it could easily fail at higher altitudes.
Ah, I was under the impression the non-tracer cartridge was impact detonated, but I am always happy to learn, especially if the tracers operated that way.
Very interesting. I always thought their small caliber was the problem, coupled with the mig’s ability to take punishment.
"unreliable detonation upon impact at high altitude,"
Dubious. The compounds they used in those bullets should have worked fine in a vacuum. Like gunpowder, they burned so fast that atmospheric oxygen wasn't a factor.
@@noele6588 USN did the math and decided 1x 20mm cannon is worth 3.5x 50cal in firepower. 4x 20mm is equivalent firepower to 14x 50cal.
Uncanny how the technology of the day was able to produce such closely matched fighters. Similar to how close in performance the BF109 and the Spitfire were in WW2.
An illustration of how science and design were/are open source fields of study.
Probably because both of them based on WW2 German project Messerschmitt P.1101 and Focke-Wulf Ta-183.
Similar to submarines: both US Tang, Barracuda and Soviet Projects 611, 613, 614, 633, and 644 were derivatives of German Type XXI submarine. Soviet Project 611 was basically a Type XXI built in USSR.
Only later on both US and USSR design schools went their own different way including their respective doctrines, experiences and needs.
The British "sold" the USSR its best jet engines shortly after WW2, under the "promise" that the USSR wouldn't use them for military purposes. The Soviets never had any intention of keeping said promise, and gave the Soviets cutting edge jet engine technology.
@@Raptor747 Yes, but British was neither stupid nor naive to believe a single word from Soviet delegation, they knew what Soviet are going to do with such technology.
British did that on purpose to put a pressure on US government which was refusing to allow GB to participate in US nuclear program despite all British contribution to Manhattan project. The result was domestic British nuclear program and after few years - the 1958 UK-US Mutual Defence Agreement, a bilateral treaty between the United States and the United Kingdom on nuclear weapons co-operation.
It's not that uncanny, since a whole lot of the Soviet bird was stolen from the West. For example, the engine was literally gifted to them by the British government. The MiG-15 was rocking a Rolls-Royce powerplant... that had been reverse-engineered... after the Brits simply handed several brand-new engines to the Soviets.
Unforgiveable.
Because of their history , these two are my fav jets of all time. What a treat seeing these two tangle in guns only like back in the day. My dad served in the Air Force in Korea, he worked in the payroll office. :)
god damn finance always fucking up my check
Always quick to take your pay. Always slow to pay you out lol.
My dad went on to be an accountant for a rum distillery. The one that eventually distributed captain Morgan rum
@@clint9040 Redemption for a nonner
...mine too...
Check out the Merch Store: growling-sidewinder.creator-spring.com
Although these aircraft are very similar on paper the F-86 had a higher kill to death ratio during the war, a couple of the reasons is the better trained pilots (although some korean pilots were actually secretly very well trained and experienced soviet pilots from the USSR), and also the fact that the American pilots were using G suits, which allowed them to pull more G's and to hold those G's a little longer than their Mig Counterparts. I'm sure you can imagine how much of an advantage that gave sabres during the war, anyway guys thank you for watching and I'll see you in the next one, Much Love.
Are there any differences statistically? Or are they practically copies?
F-22 VS Ten North Korean MIG-29's BVR
F-35 VS MIG-31 BVR
It'd be cool if you flew The F4U Corsair against The MIG-15 in a dogfight! As The F4U Corsair shot down a MIG-15!👍
8:55 OMG how dramatic...
More WWI content
That slomo at 5 mins is probably some of the coolest you've gotten. Your shadow going across his wing and then getting the casings. Pure gold
3:24 the F-86D is an interceptor variant of the F-86. It has been equipped with four 20mm cannons, a new nose(to fit the radar) and a new afterburning engine.
This variant became known as the "Sabre Dog".
Note: it wasn't supersonic.
F86F-2 also had 4 20mms
@@thomashanson6603 Well, haven't heard of that variant, i'll check it out later.
Subsonic jet interceptor wtf
You mean the F-2 sabre with the T-160 20mmcannons
@@zsepirpapkendo3223 well it was 1952
I always admire Longshot's full on, super agressive style. Props to both of you guys.
My favorite fight to watch, it never gets old! I'm an F-86 fanboy so would love to see this from the other side. Also would be cool to see a 4 v 4 like a simulated patrol intercepting over the Yalu!!
I would love to see you play both planes in the same video. One in the mig then one on the Sabre to show us the advantages and disadvantages of each aircraft.
Yo GS, I think it'd be pretty cool of you pressed the standard key bind of Right Ctrl + Enter before a fight. Itll bring up your control inputs on screen, and allow the viewer to have a better understanding of what you are doing in the fight to get the results that we see.
I thought this was real.......
@@ItsMeMikey998 sarcasm
@@ItsMeMikey998 hard to be sarcastic while typing something. UA-cam needs a sarcasm button.
The Sabre was upgraded with 20mm cannons if engine stalls due to gun fumes count as upgrading lol
That being said, the later F-86K Sabre Dog had 20mm cannons although that one was different from earlier ones.
Was that the Super sabre? I had a model of one of those I made as a kid.
@@ChalcedonXXX Super Sabre was the F-100, I think the 20mm test version was the F-86F-2.
@@TheIvanNewb Yep. F-100 Super Sabre kicked off the Century Series.
Definitely good for the longer format, additional rounds. Thanks.
The .50bmg struggled to do the damage desired because of aircraft having to be built stronger due to the added stresses of high speed flight.
There are many accounts of Migs being hit by Sabres repeatedly and escaping full of holes.
This lead to Project GunVal in 1953 which saw 12 Sabres being fitted with 20mm cannons and deployed amongst the in theatre Sabres to assess any advantage to cannons over HMG’s.
From the results it was decided that the cannons were the way to go, something that every major Air Force had already concluded in WW2.
As a direct result of Project GunVals findings all new model American fighter aircraft were cannon armed after 1953.
If memory serves it was a 13 to 1 kill ratio for the F-86 in Korea. One can only speculate just how much more successful it would have been if it had always been built with the heavier weaponry fitted.
Смешно 13 к 1
5:22 that was spectacular amazing flying from the both of you 😂🤌🏼💯
With two 23mm and one 37mm cannon, it doesn't take many hits from a MiG-15 to turn a fighter into slightly abused, miscellaneous spare parts ...
Thanks again for another great video... I can't wait to see what you do with the Mirage F-1 or the F-4 Phabulous Phantom!
Hopefully we’ll get the Phantom this year, that’s what has been claimed as the release date, sometime in Q4 2022. However as is so often the case in DCS, this very well may be postponed till Q1/2 of 2023. Can’t wait for F-4E/J and MiG-23ML in DCS. Mirage F1 in 2 days…
@@zooweemama911 - Same... My new Internet gets installed this week and the F1 is a top priority for me....
Ramen noodles for the month!
;)
@@Max_Da_G - Size matters.
That first round was one of the most epic dogfights I've ever seen. Bravo!
I enjoy the longer videos, gives more time for educational tips and explanations,I learn a lot watching your dogfights.
I'm addicted to these vids honestly, and I appreciate the consistency. Just got a t16000m and I hope to get to your skill level some day. Keep it up!
I just got the same and i'm having a blast just practicing with the p47!
Air Force One: I am the world's most secure aircraft.
MiG-15: Screw you, I got a combination lock.
In all seriousness, the detail in DCS just blows my mind. Look at the scratches in the canopy glass, the shell casings falling through the air. Absolutely god-tier.
PS: Does this mean you are getting closer to that which I've been nagging you for?
Another great video GS! Really appreciate the classics!
Broooo the video was released 4 minutes ago and there are already 25 comments GS you may feel the king of the prom!
Although this kind of videos had been repeated a lot but every time you upload it I like watching it
Love those vintage fights much more than any modern / contemporary confrontation
Another example of it comes down to the pilot. Good vid!
We almost had a revival of the watch yo jet video from last year at 5:22
Amazing video as usual too !
Great great video ! When you watch this - there is no question that these men, from both sides when going to battle in these jet fighters had BALLS OF STEEL !
These are some of my favorite videos!
Awesome always love this match up. The video of these 2 over the city is one of my favorites.
this is the content I subscribed for! Do more cold war and WW2 fights!
It might be the F1 hype but i've been very keen on pre gen 4 planes lately, really nice video
These are some of my favorite planes. It's great to see them in action. Thanks!
The shot at 08.20+ - fighter aces from WW2 often speak about being in turning fights and only pulling the trigger once the bandit disappeared under their nose. Great deflection shooting BTW!
That was a great video. I think that first merge might have been inside the 500ft safety bubble though 🤔😋
Good job Farmer I have not seen the Saber Mig 15 match up before.
This was a very enjoyable dogfight to watch. Absoulty, a very entertaining video!
Here’s your back in my day for the UA-cam algorithm.
That was a hell of a first round nice!!
That close in the downward rolling scissor reminds me a bit of the dogfight Col. Ralph Par had when engaging 16 Migs during the Korean War.
Nice vid as usual, are you using reshade or something ? look really saturated
It's always is a great fight between the mig-15 and f-86. love the content
Great video
Stunning fight…just wonderful
The Mig 15 has 2x23s, and a 37, but nearly the same.
Came to the comments for this
Request 3: GS in the F/A-18C vs a buddy in the Mustang or Spitfire!
Great vid as always :)
l started watching a couple months ago, and pretty much take them in any opportunity l get. Love it all. WW1 to F22 :) Also really appreciate your ability to explain the tactics you’re using WHILE doing them. My brain couldn’t handle that. And obviously, love the fun of seeing things explode. You’re good at that too :)
Very nice. Love these aircraft to bits.
Great videos keep it up!
Absolutely beautiful video...
The first fight was so intense! The MiG-15 is my favorite plane of all time and seeing you fly it is awesome anytime!
Beautiful, amazing fight!
Ah some truly great golden oldies here both are very nice birds indeed and the fight even better
Maaaan that was an awesome video
F-86 is the jet I'm using to learn the basics of DCS, would love more videos from the perspective of the Sabre'
Frickin hate it when you fly as the Mig-15. Love the match-up, hate the perspective. Anyway, thanks for making the video!
Love these vids
Quick question: how do you do these beautiful - sometimes slow-mow - shots from the external camera? Is that capturing from the DCS Track file? These never work for me... weird stuff, that didn't happen while flying and such....
one thing too is that both engines on the f86 and mig 15 being centrifugal compressors instead of axial, imposed the same sort of limitations on both airframes nessesitating a wide cylindrical body because they both had to fit very wide engines
When he dove down on top of you, I think he scored a couple of hits with shell casings ... XD
It's also (in real life), a g-fight. Can you imagine how many g's these guys were carrying in these turns?
5:22 getting Top Gun Maverick vibes from the scene between Rooster and Mav.
Brings back the head-on collision in round 1
No comeback for the Sabre today.. you pilot that Mig quite well.
I was literally looking at the f86 in person right as this video was published lol
Always love to see F86 vs Mig 15. I saw someone said that F86 vs Mig 15 was the chess of dogfight . Totally agree.
MiG 15, 2 x 23x115mm and 1 37x155mm cannons. Not being a snob, just an fyi. Not 2 x 25mm.
Love the channel, thanks!!!
I actually wanted to ask you if you could make a sabre vs mig video, or some other gunfighters.
Nice
Oh that poor beautiful F86! Great fight.
Another case of how I wonder how the flight models are implemented compared to reality - I have this vague recollection that historically, MiG-15 pilots preferred higher altitudes while Sabres preferred the fight on the deck, opposite of what the feel is in DCS.
MiG pilots didn’t have G-suits or hydraulic controls, so it kinda makes sense they’d favour altitude because it gives them more time to recover if they suffer control compression, and the Gs would be lower taking wider turns at lower relative airspeeds.
Whereas the Sabres have a pretty significant advantage at low altitude in terms of terrain avoidance because of the roll rate and better resistance to control lock up etc.
In DCS there’s no genuine fear if you mess up so it flips the other way.
Last of the gunfighters! Love that matchup!
That was a spicy merge
2:42 - The cannon armament of a MiG-15 is two 23mm and one 37mm cannons.
Back about 20 yrs ago Mig Ally was one of my favorite games
do you plan to show the Mirage F1 when it comes out?
A 50v50 F-86 vs MiG 15 battle would be nice 😀
id love to see you fly both planes in the videos
Hey Growling, love the merch, but us MiG aficionados need something equivalent.
growling keep up the good work
it would be amazing if you flight f86 in a mission type video
...YES!!!! I LOVE THE MIG-15!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THANKS FOR ANOTHER MIG-15 BATTLE...
This fight was so competitive!
Can you do a video with the Vought F-8 Crusader? My grandfather flew one in early Vietnam, and it would be cool to see you take on a Mig-17 with one
I love the dog fights from this generation!
You gonna be showcasing the mirage F1 early release growling?
maaaaybe, not sure I will have time but I will try
The rolling scissors reminded me of the Top Gun scene
This is the perfect Dogfight
More please :)
great video
The historic fights are the best fights.
Exciting flight by these aircrafts.
13:58 BOOM "There he is..."
Loved it
Jesus christ that first merge was close lol
While we are reminiscing, could we get some of the iconic match ups from Vietnam? A4 Skyhawk vs Mig 17? F4 Phantom vs Mig 21? I know these fights have already been fought, but very few fights have not been fought on this channel, and these are some fights worth re-fighting...
The USAF leading ace in Korea found that firing the 50s at 50,000 feet was very effective as wind resistance was so reduced the accuracy at long range was not effected. Something to try, think his name was McConnell
Could you make a review of 003 Type Carrier?
Since the mirage 2000c retired last month, can you do a vid with it pls
Rate Fights in these early aircraft involved considerable use of the on-board flight computer (the Pilot's brain).