For game like FGO and Hoyo games I can see that but if a gacha game let's you get all the characters as a free to play player then I will give it a pass because pulling on banners are where the money comes from so if you can get everything without spending then I can't say it's diabolical may be just annoying,Nikke for an example. But there are games who shamelessly use FOMO and awful rates for banners who brings bad reputation.
Agreed. If I can knock out my daily in 2-4 minutes and I can spend deeper time when I have it, and you have a decent gacha currency system, I'm most of the way there. My mains are reverse 1999 and star rail.
Same here, but I believe it have to do with us being experienced with gacha games. For newer/more casual players, they tend to fall easily for fomo, cash grab tactics etc. Nowadays when I feel a game is just becoming a hassle I quit without worrying too much, while for some people it's hard to give up, even though they feel miserable doing their dailies/weeklies they still go for it cause they feel like they're loosing money and the opportunity to pull on the next character if they don't play these games daily. Which is sad, cause they do pay but with their own time, without even enjoying what they're doing.
I play Nikke for at least an hour a day, and usually spend money for skins (never pulls). It genuinely feels good and I think of myself as an investor, I supply money I can, so that they provide quality content in the future, while I'm getting a neat little skin as a thank you.
Personally, dailies are rarely the main time sink. Usually I can set them off to the side, let them run their course and do whatever else meanwhile. The real time sink is that very first day of new content where there's a lot new to do and logically you want to get the most out of it so you try to do whatever is available right away. Even if its only the one time, it's probably a lot longer than you're spending on the game normally and RNGesus forbid if your gachas decide to overlap release days.
I recently started to learn to play gachas not necessarly every single day, and found out it was totally okay. It is fine to come back once in a while to enjoy the new content/event, and the time you win for missing on some dailies is far more valuable. You can use it to work which most likely will give you enough money to buy in game what you could never have gotten as being a f2p daily login player anyway. Only game I play everyday is Brown Dust 2 cause it's the most generous, time friendly and overal the most fun too.
The true cost of gacha games being g far higher in time sinks and money than you think? The scandal! I am gonna keep painting warhammer minis here in my pretty glass house.
I play one gacha (Nikke), and I play other old games afterwards. I have squeezed decades of fun out of old games I have, spending probably $60 at the most, one-time purchase. Which is a problem for gaming companies, I'd imagine, if they can only sell the game once and not monetize on it. That's why studios we loved in the past are gone; they got a hit once and then struggled to sell other games and just became bankrupt. So I rarely blame companies like Shift Up that want to consider going the gacha route, because it keeps their lights on and invest on proper games like Stellar Blade.
Dailies are rarely the time-sink, it is usually the events and their related stories that take up the most time. HSR dailies don't even take me 10 minutes, Genshin is a lot better these days with their updated daily system since I just burn my resin and I am done. I do notice that most games that have more involved dailies are the ones I typically end up dropping though, just too big of a time-sink when I play multiple gacha. That said, I rarely feel the urge to pick up new games these days and only really go for ones I am super interested in as a result of playing Gacha, all the money I usually budget for new games typically goes to my gacha funds unless I take a break for a new game I want to play like Metaphor.
My dailies are around 5 min twice a day for three gachas, the problem is when all 3 gachas release a new event that eats time, especially because gachas often but farming stages for events near the end. (Reverse 1999 fast, Limbus Company very fast, Arknights medium fast but needs some time AFK to auto away the stages)
I used to be a big gacha gamer playing 5-7 gacha games, but now I just play NIKKE. One day I was too lazy to keep up with all of them, and my phone needed space so I uninstalled all but NIKKE. Gacha games are very time consuming and I don't wanna prioritize so many, especially when they're going to one day shut down anyways. I kept NIKKE because it's a fun game that can mostly be played on auto and doesn't require much grinding. I'm at end game (f2p)
I think HSR dailies being so quick as they are is a big reason why I don't feel burnt out at all on the game. There are so many overlapping tasks so just autoing half of your max daily fuel and redeploying the idle resource gets them done all at once, usually in less than 5 minutes.
In life, everything will cost your time and/or money. I am playing 5 gacha games, and 1 of them I only play for the story at this point (FGO). If anything, the gacha games cut into my time playing other games, such as Metaphor Re Fantazio that I got for Christmas.
Good food for thought! I do feel that thought. My limit for gacha games these days is 2 at most. And really as long as I enjoy the game I don't mind it as much. Unfortunately for me, I think I've enjoyed gacha games long enough to where FOMO is not something I feel anymore. xD I either feel inclined to play or I don't. This can be both a good and bad thing. But for the most part it works nicely for me. For any other gacha games though? I much rather watch other people play side games and have fun with them. Yes, I much experience a gacha vicariously through others at that point. I just don't got the time and energy for all of em. BUT, it is fun as a common ground topic to chat with friends about. So even that works out nicely.
I think of gacha profits like “Some Japanese salaryman blows half of his paycheck so I get to enjoy the story and mini games in NIKKE for free” The whales are just redistributing their money back into the game!
The opportunity cost related to time is certainly the biggest hurdle when it comes to gacha games. I wish it could be as easy as do all I need within an hour of the day, but depending on how I'm multi-tasking that evening, I can be super sluggish and feel like I spent the bulk of my available day time on it. Once you start putting that money in, the cost from there only escalates if you don't have the self control. So many times I feel like it would be better to just not play gacha games or other such daily life games in general and just play games that have an end or are "party games" I play with others on occasion.
I stopped playing Genshin Impact a few years back because I could see how much time I was spending just to do the daily's plus using the Limited resources every day. In just two months of me stopping I finished 4 games. Now days I'm playing ZZZ where finishing the content every day takes less then 40 min depending on if you're doing Hollow Zero which one section can be done over the week. And the events last a few weeks for the most part. And gaining upgrading materials can be gained quicker if you go to a lower difficulty level. In saying that I've stopped playing this week just to see how much time I save and to work on finishing at least one more game before this year is out. I've tried Infinity Nikki and I can only really see myself logging in a few times a week.
Yep, a game needs to respect your time and feel like you are getting a good payout for that time. Nikke buffed certain resource farms with some harder difficulties to help mitigate the previous sunk time while providing new features and challenges i.e. rocks and gear.
It's not really a waste of time if you're having fun. The real problem is that some people are horrible when it comes to their finances and some will even go into debt for their PNG that's eventually going to go away when the servers shut down, which WILL eventually happen for every single live service/gacha game. Imagine going into debt for some pixels just to find out a bit later that the server will be shut down for X reason. I can't imagine the psychological strain that would put on some people. I usually just buy the monthly pass which is $5 USD on average and maybe the BP if there's something really good I want but anything more than that is overkill IMO. I want to support the developers because they do put out quality games that are arguably better (some of them) than console games but I also don't want to spend too much on a service that is guaranteed to end at one point. You can always go back to a regular game whenever you feel like it but you can never go back to a live service game whose servers have been shut down. Babylon's Fall will forever remind me to not spend more than the bare minimum so that I don't get a surprise EoS (end of service) notice. I remember spending like $30 on cosmetics and voice packs just to find out that the game would be terminated like a month after. As far as a time sink for dailies go, it's not that bad for the games I play. Dailies in Wuwa and ZZZ take me about 10 minutes each, FGO takes like 2 minutes, Re:1999 takes like 5 minutes and it's automated, so in reality it takes like 2 minutes. We waste more time just struggling to get out of bed or doing other random useless things throughout the day so it's no skin off my back to do my dailies.
I just can't play much more Gacha Games on my own, I want to have enough Time for other Games and so on, and This wouldn't be so easy with more Gacha Games on my Phone, PC, or Console Nowadays you can Play Them Everywhere, they Look and Sound for the most Part so good, and their Gameplay is getting better and better, but its just too overwhelmed for me 😅 I just Play Reverse 1999, and yes, as long as you enjoy a Gacha Game, it is not a Bad Thing for playing It, especially when you have Fun with it, just know your Personal Limits o7 Thank you very much for this interesting Video Boss, and for putting your own Experiences in It
Man rip Dragonia Lost. I never played it but I heard so many good stories about it how it was an entertaining story how the music was solid and a lot of the events were very well done. It's a darn shame we don't have anything like that anymore but at least I stopped playing FGO after a few years ago becasue it made my old phone slow down and I only play GI because at least it was on PS4 and aside from in the beginning i did spend some money but afterwards, I stopped, focused on daillies and story when it drops and just don't draw on a lot of banners. That's the strategy I've been doing for the past few years and it's been going pretty well especially since I don't play that many gotcha games since a lot of the recent ones keep making my phones Go by ridiculously slow aside from this one Disgaea mobile game I played before that got taken down because I enjoy the Disgaea series. Also I did try to play one game but for some reason it kept doing stupid things that made it not want to run on my tablet so I gave but still at the end of the day mobile games are definitely a huge amount of a drug and we'll probably never know when most of these games will ever reach an actual ending until the developer say we're pulling the plug and it's gone forever I think that's the only way these mobile games will end. That being said small Pam teaching a class sounds like the best idea for a spin-off ever.
It's moer about wanting to spend time on a game than feeling obligated to spending time on a game. I have another "daily login preferred" non-gacha game that I used to play before Nikke, and while I still boot it up daily, it takes me about 2 minutes to finish my dailies rather than the 25+ for doing all the constant lengthy repeating content. I felt obligated to grind out as many points and scores as possible, and found myself not really enjoying it. Now because I only play it for lengthy times when I want to, its more enjoyable again. And I still don't pay anything other than my time. But if that time would otherwise be consumed by other stuff, like waiting for food to cook, waiting for public transport, etc, I consider that effective time management instead
The best way to play gachas is that you play until you find yourself unable to progress without grinding for two days a week. Once you do that, you stop while you're ahead.
I feel like the key is to not let FOMO take over your decision making and to play when you enjoy it and stop when you don't. I used to play 5 gachas, now I only play 2. I realised it felt like a chore and I stuck with the games that I truly enjoy and with short dailies. (AL and BA pls let me skip events to the last 3 stages pls. I doubt my level 125 ship will lose to a level 80)
I would like to point out once you reach a certain level or point of the game the dallies get easier to do and doesn't have to feel like a grind fest if you aren't focusing on saving for a character and can take your time during events.
It is worth it for me, but I could never handle more than two. I play Genshin for the gameplay and Nikle for the stories and characters. (Sounds so odd, when I write it out) On top of that I have my favorite games I cycle through. Warframe, Helldivers, Path of Exile. The only non-live service game that mixed between these is the main line Monster Hunter. (60 days until Wilds yippie!) And that makes me really happy. A bit of time for the Gacha games, and the rest I can spend the way I like it to.
I usually do Nikke daily while working or in break time, i don't care what other people say because most of them also play gacha game lmao some even play Nikke now
As of DEC 2024, my gacha games are ZZZ, Star Rail, Nikke, and GBF. ZZZ and Nikke are the ones I reliably do dailies on. ZZZ has the quickest dailies. GBF has the longest dailies, though it heavily depends on what you consider to be 'dailies'. RIP Dragalia Lost. Cygames still haven't put Mym in another game; a damn shame.
Yeah the time sink is real. I kind of wish these types of games would target 3 or 4 days a week for logins. At that point, it's still a part of your life, but you don't feel the FOMO if you miss a day for whatever reason. I doubt that will happen considering the main goal of these kinds of tactics is to form a habit, get them emotionally invested, then frustrate them enough into spending.
Im an F2P player who started Genshin just a few months ago. I was lucky enought to pull for Raiden and Nahida as their reruns are right next to each other. My current team is traveler, Nahida, Raiden and Barbara. Im just waiting for Kokomi to rerun and replace Barbara. I will never again try to pull/grind for other characters. Grinding for 1 character alone is a tedious task already especially as an F2P (especially when Artifacts, Talents etc are accounted for. Getting good artifacts requires RNG luck too.) I am already level 90 (all four members) and AR53. My artifacts are still trash. I wont even try to get new characters like Mavuika. The resources are just limited and even if I used money, there is no guarantee to get the best weapons/characters and grind them all to the max. (Especially when constellations and weapon refinements are accounted for.) TL;DR: Im going to stay F2P because even if I used money, I still wont be able to max out 1 character to the fullest due to various factors like RNG. I will also stick to the same 4 characters that I like because irs just impossible to grind for all characters that you have.
The dailies really did make me drop a lot of Gacha games. Then what if you play non Gacha games that have dailies too? Like Fortnite, Apex, Valorant, etc. It is a lot of time when playing more than one gacha/ games with dailies. It starts feeling like a chore/job for me. So I also just play 1-2 gacha games and spend my time playing actual games or something else.
So, I've hit a bit of a mental wall lately I love Granblue Fantasy, ZZZ and Genshin, but I really don't enjoy the daily timegating that comes with them. I can't fault devs for making them this way, but I might be at a point where I just can't feasibly take part in them as much anymore.
Gacha games aren't a threat to the industry. Game publishers are getting raging hard ons just thinkin of them. The amount of whales they can milk forever gives every CEo a wet dream.
Im just getting into them Hoyoverse, Nikke, Arknights and such. Im going to see how they are and be the judge but I think it comes down to scheduling for time sake and knowing how much youre willing to save for those games.
I could definitely stand to trim the number of gacha I have installed on my device. In fact, that's always been the intent. To only keep a fraction of the titles that I end up trying for one reason or another. Which does often include the incentive they give you to pre-register. The problem is the hesitation and uncertainty that is the dreaded sunk cost fallacy. I greatly underestimated how dangerous such a thing can be. A good reason to be much stricter about what to try in the first place. As to reduce how often that decision has to be made. That said, I think one thing to consider is our level of interaction with the gacha we have installed is allowed to vary title by title. From actively making progress to simply leaving the game dormant on our device. In other words taking a break from even so much as doing the daily login. A few of the gacha I have installed include Heaven Burns Red, Fate Grand Order, Honkai Star Rail and Blue Archive. None of which are under consideration for being removed from my device.
Usually. If you suddenly find yourself having logged into the game every day for six months and not done anything but dailies. It's probably time to considering stopping. Cause good lord did it take me too long to realize that....i had like 5? Maybe more gacha i hadn't really played for months sometimes a year and only logged it , get free stuff, do dailies. Ignore for 24 hours 💀
side note : weekly for goddess of victory nikke give 1 summon ticket,300 gems dailies 100 gems 5 mid quality molds, 50 core dusts and some bond tickets
Guess im dead i got like 8 gacha games 2 are rhythm game which i dont do dailies (D4DJ and Bang dream) 1 is just empty all energy then dip (Limbus) 1 is just not even trying to get all rewards or just dont do dailies altogether because i plan my pulls(Arknight) The other 4 are me doing the dailies every day (Nikke,GFL2,Blue archive,PGR) Yeah im absolutely cooked
I do not like Gacha games, but i do like Nikke. Despite me only spending 50 bucks once a year ago, the game has been generous to me at all times. Enough that im a top 15% competitor in my pool. Money is one thing, but patience, time and effort matter more. If you operate within your limitations, the game gives you the means to go far.
I stick with one gacha game only, Genshin, because I have a day job and Genshin has the gameplay I enjoy the most. I briefly tried playing a second gacha but quickly dropped it as soon as I realized it would take up too much of my time from doing other stuff. So only a single gacha game for me.
Not Dragalia Lost! *Crying in the corner* But still it is true, as much as I loved that game, it was too kind with the gacha. One copy and done, never need to summon again. That was the killing blow for that one.
hello, obake! For me it didn't worht it anymore, I took a break after playing genshin for 2 years and honkai star rail for 1 year, seeing how many other games I could pay and play when I don't spent money nor time in gachas was a point of no return to me, i still play gachas occasionally but I don't do dailies anymore, I dont spend money on gachas and don't care about temporally events either. I just log in to do some new content and honestly I enjoy them both gachas and games more like this
I only really play NIKKE in terms of gacha, and the dailies I don't feel take away that much out of my day. For example I can complete dailies during my lunch break at work while I eat or if it is on a day off I normally multitask and only really give it my attention when I do Interceptions or Simulation Room. Both together about 5 mins. So really if one takes a multitask approach to NIKKE the time sink is much more smaller. And that is going to be more true with Simulation Room coming quicker soon. All in all I have been playing up until this point F2P and have but about 6 missing nikkes(Summer Neon, Chainsaw man Collab, Joker, and base Soda)
I play nikke, and I've been playing for over a year now, it was a game where I thought "oh I'll try this booty shooty game that probably costs an arm and a leg just to get through the first chunk of the game" when in reality it has a very emotional, intense, and sometimes depressing story, especially in it's big events, and in reality, it's probably one of the friendliest F2P games out there, you could not spend a time a realistically get through the entire story at a steady pace with meta characters, they practically hand out some of the best units in the game and getting pulls is super easy, so tldr: nikke is pretty cool
The real cost of gacha is end of service. Sincerely, ~#85 in KoF All-Star (it's dead now). Also, don't do dailys every day. MOST gacha games have "returning player bonuses," usually when inactive 15 days. So you don't play them all constantly, you play a ROTATION of them. Or in my case, it was 4 KoF All-Star accounts. If my free pulls worked at the start of the event, I played the account, otherwise I set it down and came back later.
This is why I've never checked out a second gacha game. Cuz what would stop me from getting three or four or however many more? Self-control? Yeah, like anyone has that these days.
As long as you're having fun it's fine, indeed. But I do believe a looot of gacha games players do feel bored and miserable about some of their daily grind. It's just that the fomo, the emotional/financial attachment they have for the game and other factors make them keep going for it, until they burnout. There's a lot of games I would still play from time to time if I did not made the choice to keep logging in daily until it drove me away from it completely.
There needs to be a solution that changes how people engage with games and spend their time and money on gaming. So many companies are dollar chasers and not gaming studios. Money launderers who will sell our your kids to steal money from your wallet. These gacha games will end up causing countries to look at their people's development and I fear that there is gonna be a mass exodus from gacha real soon. The cost is adding up, and the money goes into the hands of people with agendas other than making good games... and when we find out where the money goes/who the real shareholders are, its gonna get ugly. Think Crypto bros but much worse.
I am not a gacha game player, in fact I refuse to play them because of some of the fundamental design elements of the genre. However, it is nice to see the perspective of someone who engages with these types of games regularly. I have a better understanding of why a person would want to play one of these games. Still, even with all of the points you raised at the start of the video, I will never play a gacha game on a regular basis, regardless of how great the game is. I'd rather spend a fixed amount of money to have a complete experience than pay nothing, be bombarded with monetization, and be punished for not engaging with the monetization.
Once you hit level 150+ in nikke you can stop doing dailys and just do events. That's if you stop pushing story and just want to pull. Haven't done dailys in 8 months and got 80% character in games
I mean if you hate the time and dough you give then put effort into learning something to create instead of just reacting and playing to others work. Thats where you will really feel like youre accomplishing something.
Look gonna be honest? Take away the gatcha/mobile games I play. All of them. Leave me with nothing left. ...Oh look my mouse cursor is hovering over Rimworld. You can debate if this is better or worse.
Like most aspects in life, gaming works on a transactional experience. If you see benefit in the time and money spent on the game, then to that individual there is value in the resources (time, money and emotion) spent playing the game. Games are meant to be played. The problem becomes when the game starts playing you. When that happens, a step back really needs to be taken so that you can look at what you are doing in a wider perspective and determine how you wish to move forward. So far with NIKKE, I have been really enjoying the overall experience even pushing the hard mode campaign. The story, art, music, characters and direction of the game are quite phenomenal that it can offset knowing that you are playing a gacha game. Quite a bit of themes covered in the NIKKE story have been thought-provoking and even provided a basis on which I found myself reflecting my experience on what was being conveyed. As long as NIKKE continues to provide a high quality experience with its story, characters and music, I am willing to give it some of my time to continue with the journey.
All live service games are time sinks. A Warframe or Destiny player would die laughing at the suggestion that 180 hours a year is a lot of time. Those are rookie Warframe numbers. From a time sink perspective, gachas are actually on the lighter end of the live service spectrum.
This is just the nature of all free to play service games. Fortnite also needs time to grind passes and you can pay to skip or buy skins. So long as a game is fun I dont really care about the time sink. I'll play these games until a good one time pay game comes along or pick up an old game.
I think Gachas and F2P’s have become quite an escape from the AAA industry that has become too political, woke, and ugly to the point where I’m willing to pay the premium for nice stuff in gacha games since I hardly have any backlog of actual buy-once games. I honestly would rather spend $60 on a Scarlet skin than say Dragon Age Veilguard or Concord or most AAA games. Stellar Blade is one of those rare gems in the AAA industry everything else is just whatever to me.
For every pull you dont pay for gatcha, its gets closer to buy a good pc. As for games.....well if to expensive....YARRRRRR (most games are not even finished products this days) Also if you use 20 min on work instead of gatcha dailys, you will make more money overall. Oh......and lets make it all depressive: ALL THE MONEY AND TIME YOU SPEND ON GATCHA WILL BE GONE WHEN A GAME SHUTS DOWN AND ONLY WAY TO FIX THIS IS TO CREATE YOUR OWN SERVER YOU HOST FOR THIS GATCHA. (but this needs skill and time to reverse enginner) As for phone users .... i recomend you download game emulators and just play those games instead (+ no adds). Citra nighty emulator and drastic ds one for example. (only for android tho)
The real cost of any hobby is your time. I'd rather spend it playing based games than Western slop. But Nikke has one of the worst daily gameplay loops -- it's one of the most egregious pointless hamster wheel designs, like all AFK games that monetize that hamster wheel's illusionary progression. It not only wastes your time, but tries to rob you while doing it.
I'll tell you a gacha game that isn't worth time, Raid: shadow legends. They've been producing many lousy rares and epics, the gacha rates are incredibly low, the pvp is super aggressive, and the events take many hours and resources to complete: they expect you to work on them like a full time job
the merging of gambling addiction and anime girls was both ingenious and diabolical
For game like FGO and Hoyo games I can see that but if a gacha game let's you get all the characters as a free to play player then I will give it a pass because pulling on banners are where the money comes from so if you can get everything without spending then I can't say it's diabolical may be just annoying,Nikke for an example.
But there are games who shamelessly use FOMO and awful rates for banners who brings bad reputation.
More like diabolical.
I can vouch for this, I never cared for anime girls until I played Nikke, then it kind of just spiraled from there...
The more a gacha game respects my time, the more likely I am to give it money, personally.
currently I only play FGO and HBR (Heaven Burns Red)
Agreed. If I can knock out my daily in 2-4 minutes and I can spend deeper time when I have it, and you have a decent gacha currency system, I'm most of the way there. My mains are reverse 1999 and star rail.
Same here, but I believe it have to do with us being experienced with gacha games. For newer/more casual players, they tend to fall easily for fomo, cash grab tactics etc. Nowadays when I feel a game is just becoming a hassle I quit without worrying too much, while for some people it's hard to give up, even though they feel miserable doing their dailies/weeklies they still go for it cause they feel like they're loosing money and the opportunity to pull on the next character if they don't play these games daily. Which is sad, cause they do pay but with their own time, without even enjoying what they're doing.
Oh the irony. This video is about gacha games and the ad I had before this video was _Girls Frontline 2_ .
I play Nikke for at least an hour a day, and usually spend money for skins (never pulls). It genuinely feels good and I think of myself as an investor, I supply money I can, so that they provide quality content in the future, while I'm getting a neat little skin as a thank you.
I usually dont play gacha. I would rather give my money to Boss so she can gach in my place 😎
I will never forgive Todd Howard for the horse armor and what he unleashed on the games industry.
this is just pam setting the groundwork before she asks for a bigger gacha budget from playasia
Personally, dailies are rarely the main time sink. Usually I can set them off to the side, let them run their course and do whatever else meanwhile. The real time sink is that very first day of new content where there's a lot new to do and logically you want to get the most out of it so you try to do whatever is available right away. Even if its only the one time, it's probably a lot longer than you're spending on the game normally and RNGesus forbid if your gachas decide to overlap release days.
Right? If you don't get on that winning track IMMEDIATELY, you'll NEVER catch up competitively.
40-50 mins a day of dailies for me with FGO, reverse and GFL2. Exactly the time I needed for toilet and work travel time. Perfection
I recently started to learn to play gachas not necessarly every single day, and found out it was totally okay. It is fine to come back once in a while to enjoy the new content/event, and the time you win for missing on some dailies is far more valuable. You can use it to work which most likely will give you enough money to buy in game what you could never have gotten as being a f2p daily login player anyway. Only game I play everyday is Brown Dust 2 cause it's the most generous, time friendly and overal the most fun too.
The true cost of gacha games being g far higher in time sinks and money than you think? The scandal! I am gonna keep painting warhammer minis here in my pretty glass house.
I play one gacha (Nikke), and I play other old games afterwards. I have squeezed decades of fun out of old games I have, spending probably $60 at the most, one-time purchase.
Which is a problem for gaming companies, I'd imagine, if they can only sell the game once and not monetize on it. That's why studios we loved in the past are gone; they got a hit once and then struggled to sell other games and just became bankrupt. So I rarely blame companies like Shift Up that want to consider going the gacha route, because it keeps their lights on and invest on proper games like Stellar Blade.
Gacha has ruined and enriched my life.
Dailies are rarely the time-sink, it is usually the events and their related stories that take up the most time.
HSR dailies don't even take me 10 minutes, Genshin is a lot better these days with their updated daily system since I just burn my resin and I am done.
I do notice that most games that have more involved dailies are the ones I typically end up dropping though, just too big of a time-sink when I play multiple gacha.
That said, I rarely feel the urge to pick up new games these days and only really go for ones I am super interested in as a result of playing Gacha, all the money I usually budget for new games typically goes to my gacha funds unless I take a break for a new game I want to play like Metaphor.
My dailies are around 5 min twice a day for three gachas, the problem is when all 3 gachas release a new event that eats time, especially because gachas often but farming stages for events near the end. (Reverse 1999 fast, Limbus Company very fast, Arknights medium fast but needs some time AFK to auto away the stages)
I used to be a big gacha gamer playing 5-7 gacha games, but now I just play NIKKE. One day I was too lazy to keep up with all of them, and my phone needed space so I uninstalled all but NIKKE. Gacha games are very time consuming and I don't wanna prioritize so many, especially when they're going to one day shut down anyways. I kept NIKKE because it's a fun game that can mostly be played on auto and doesn't require much grinding. I'm at end game (f2p)
I think HSR dailies being so quick as they are is a big reason why I don't feel burnt out at all on the game. There are so many overlapping tasks so just autoing half of your max daily fuel and redeploying the idle resource gets them done all at once, usually in less than 5 minutes.
The Fact I play 4 Gacha Games Like:
Goddess Of Victory NIKKE
Reverse 1999
Zenless Zone Zero
Girls Frontline 2 Exilium
Love your videos X3 ❤
These videos are so well made!
In life, everything will cost your time and/or money.
I am playing 5 gacha games, and 1 of them I only play for the story at this point (FGO).
If anything, the gacha games cut into my time playing other games, such as Metaphor Re Fantazio that I got for Christmas.
Good food for thought! I do feel that thought. My limit for gacha games these days is 2 at most. And really as long as I enjoy the game I don't mind it as much.
Unfortunately for me, I think I've enjoyed gacha games long enough to where FOMO is not something I feel anymore. xD
I either feel inclined to play or I don't. This can be both a good and bad thing. But for the most part it works nicely for me. For any other gacha games though? I much rather watch other people play side games and have fun with them. Yes, I much experience a gacha vicariously through others at that point. I just don't got the time and energy for all of em. BUT, it is fun as a common ground topic to chat with friends about. So even that works out nicely.
I think of gacha profits like “Some Japanese salaryman blows half of his paycheck so I get to enjoy the story and mini games in NIKKE for free” The whales are just redistributing their money back into the game!
The opportunity cost related to time is certainly the biggest hurdle when it comes to gacha games. I wish it could be as easy as do all I need within an hour of the day, but depending on how I'm multi-tasking that evening, I can be super sluggish and feel like I spent the bulk of my available day time on it. Once you start putting that money in, the cost from there only escalates if you don't have the self control. So many times I feel like it would be better to just not play gacha games or other such daily life games in general and just play games that have an end or are "party games" I play with others on occasion.
I stopped playing Genshin Impact a few years back because I could see how much time I was spending just to do the daily's plus using the Limited resources every day. In just two months of me stopping I finished 4 games. Now days I'm playing ZZZ where finishing the content every day takes less then 40 min depending on if you're doing Hollow Zero which one section can be done over the week. And the events last a few weeks for the most part. And gaining upgrading materials can be gained quicker if you go to a lower difficulty level. In saying that I've stopped playing this week just to see how much time I save and to work on finishing at least one more game before this year is out. I've tried Infinity Nikki and I can only really see myself logging in a few times a week.
Yep, a game needs to respect your time and feel like you are getting a good payout for that time. Nikke buffed certain resource farms with some harder difficulties to help mitigate the previous sunk time while providing new features and challenges i.e. rocks and gear.
It's not really a waste of time if you're having fun. The real problem is that some people are horrible when it comes to their finances and some will even go into debt for their PNG that's eventually going to go away when the servers shut down, which WILL eventually happen for every single live service/gacha game. Imagine going into debt for some pixels just to find out a bit later that the server will be shut down for X reason. I can't imagine the psychological strain that would put on some people.
I usually just buy the monthly pass which is $5 USD on average and maybe the BP if there's something really good I want but anything more than that is overkill IMO. I want to support the developers because they do put out quality games that are arguably better (some of them) than console games but I also don't want to spend too much on a service that is guaranteed to end at one point. You can always go back to a regular game whenever you feel like it but you can never go back to a live service game whose servers have been shut down. Babylon's Fall will forever remind me to not spend more than the bare minimum so that I don't get a surprise EoS (end of service) notice. I remember spending like $30 on cosmetics and voice packs just to find out that the game would be terminated like a month after.
As far as a time sink for dailies go, it's not that bad for the games I play. Dailies in Wuwa and ZZZ take me about 10 minutes each, FGO takes like 2 minutes, Re:1999 takes like 5 minutes and it's automated, so in reality it takes like 2 minutes. We waste more time just struggling to get out of bed or doing other random useless things throughout the day so it's no skin off my back to do my dailies.
I just can't play much more Gacha Games on my own, I want to have enough Time for other Games and so on, and This wouldn't be so easy with more Gacha Games on my Phone, PC, or Console
Nowadays you can Play Them Everywhere, they Look and Sound for the most Part so good, and their Gameplay is getting better and better, but its just too overwhelmed for me 😅
I just Play Reverse 1999, and yes, as long as you enjoy a Gacha Game, it is not a Bad Thing for playing It, especially when you have Fun with it, just know your Personal Limits o7
Thank you very much for this interesting Video Boss, and for putting your own Experiences in It
Sometimes I do want to stop playing some Gacha games focus on drawing but then drawing so slow and hard so I cannot focus drawing anyway.
Man rip Dragonia Lost. I never played it but I heard so many good stories about it how it was an entertaining story how the music was solid and a lot of the events were very well done. It's a darn shame we don't have anything like that anymore but at least I stopped playing FGO after a few years ago becasue it made my old phone slow down and I only play GI because at least it was on PS4 and aside from in the beginning i did spend some money but afterwards, I stopped, focused on daillies and story when it drops and just don't draw on a lot of banners. That's the strategy I've been doing for the past few years and it's been going pretty well especially since I don't play that many gotcha games since a lot of the recent ones keep making my phones Go by ridiculously slow aside from this one Disgaea mobile game I played before that got taken down because I enjoy the Disgaea series. Also I did try to play one game but for some reason it kept doing stupid things that made it not want to run on my tablet so I gave but still at the end of the day mobile games are definitely a huge amount of a drug and we'll probably never know when most of these games will ever reach an actual ending until the developer say we're pulling the plug and it's gone forever I think that's the only way these mobile games will end. That being said small Pam teaching a class sounds like the best idea for a spin-off ever.
It's moer about wanting to spend time on a game than feeling obligated to spending time on a game. I have another "daily login preferred" non-gacha game that I used to play before Nikke, and while I still boot it up daily, it takes me about 2 minutes to finish my dailies rather than the 25+ for doing all the constant lengthy repeating content. I felt obligated to grind out as many points and scores as possible, and found myself not really enjoying it. Now because I only play it for lengthy times when I want to, its more enjoyable again.
And I still don't pay anything other than my time. But if that time would otherwise be consumed by other stuff, like waiting for food to cook, waiting for public transport, etc, I consider that effective time management instead
my daily time is added when my unit or my internet always hang up
boss help, infinity nikki calls 2 me with it's cute outfits, and i fear i'm not strong enough 2 resist....
The best way to play gachas is that you play until you find yourself unable to progress without grinding for two days a week.
Once you do that, you stop while you're ahead.
I feel like the key is to not let FOMO take over your decision making and to play when you enjoy it and stop when you don't. I used to play 5 gachas, now I only play 2. I realised it felt like a chore and I stuck with the games that I truly enjoy and with short dailies.
(AL and BA pls let me skip events to the last 3 stages pls. I doubt my level 125 ship will lose to a level 80)
3 gachas are my limit, anymore and I get burn out and start dropping every gacha game I play.
Pam doing maths!? 37 is proud.
Honestly I would prefer the games had a standard price to outright purchase limited characters with gacha as an option for those feeling lucky.
I would like to point out once you reach a certain level or point of the game the dallies get easier to do and doesn't have to feel like a grind fest if you aren't focusing on saving for a character and can take your time during events.
Solid work, boss.
Very punk rock of you.
🤘🏽💙🎸
It is worth it for me, but I could never handle more than two.
I play Genshin for the gameplay and Nikle for the stories and characters. (Sounds so odd, when I write it out)
On top of that I have my favorite games I cycle through. Warframe, Helldivers, Path of Exile.
The only non-live service game that mixed between these is the main line Monster Hunter. (60 days until Wilds yippie!)
And that makes me really happy. A bit of time for the Gacha games, and the rest I can spend the way I like it to.
I usually do Nikke daily while working or in break time, i don't care what other people say because most of them also play gacha game lmao some even play Nikke now
As of DEC 2024, my gacha games are ZZZ, Star Rail, Nikke, and GBF.
ZZZ and Nikke are the ones I reliably do dailies on.
ZZZ has the quickest dailies.
GBF has the longest dailies, though it heavily depends on what you consider to be 'dailies'.
RIP Dragalia Lost. Cygames still haven't put Mym in another game; a damn shame.
Yeah the time sink is real. I kind of wish these types of games would target 3 or 4 days a week for logins. At that point, it's still a part of your life, but you don't feel the FOMO if you miss a day for whatever reason. I doubt that will happen considering the main goal of these kinds of tactics is to form a habit, get them emotionally invested, then frustrate them enough into spending.
Im an F2P player who started Genshin just a few months ago.
I was lucky enought to pull for Raiden and Nahida as their reruns are right next to each other.
My current team is traveler, Nahida, Raiden and Barbara.
Im just waiting for Kokomi to rerun and replace Barbara.
I will never again try to pull/grind for other characters.
Grinding for 1 character alone is a tedious task already especially as an F2P (especially when Artifacts, Talents etc are accounted for. Getting good artifacts requires RNG luck too.)
I am already level 90 (all four members) and AR53. My artifacts are still trash.
I wont even try to get new characters like Mavuika. The resources are just limited and even if I used money, there is no guarantee to get the best weapons/characters and grind them all to the max. (Especially when constellations and weapon refinements are accounted for.)
TL;DR: Im going to stay F2P because even if I used money, I still wont be able to max out 1 character to the fullest due to various factors like RNG. I will also stick to the same 4 characters that I like because irs just impossible to grind for all characters that you have.
The dailies really did make me drop a lot of Gacha games. Then what if you play non Gacha games that have dailies too? Like Fortnite, Apex, Valorant, etc. It is a lot of time when playing more than one gacha/ games with dailies. It starts feeling like a chore/job for me. So I also just play 1-2 gacha games and spend my time playing actual games or something else.
So, I've hit a bit of a mental wall lately
I love Granblue Fantasy, ZZZ and Genshin, but I really don't enjoy the daily timegating that comes with them.
I can't fault devs for making them this way, but I might be at a point where I just can't feasibly take part in them as much anymore.
Gacha games aren't a threat to the industry. Game publishers are getting raging hard ons just thinkin of them. The amount of whales they can milk forever gives every CEo a wet dream.
Im just getting into them Hoyoverse, Nikke, Arknights and such. Im going to see how they are and be the judge but I think it comes down to scheduling for time sake and knowing how much youre willing to save for those games.
I could definitely stand to trim the number of gacha I have installed on my device. In fact, that's always been the intent. To only keep a fraction of the titles that I end up trying for one reason or another. Which does often include the incentive they give you to pre-register.
The problem is the hesitation and uncertainty that is the dreaded sunk cost fallacy. I greatly underestimated how dangerous such a thing can be. A good reason to be much stricter about what to try in the first place. As to reduce how often that decision has to be made.
That said, I think one thing to consider is our level of interaction with the gacha we have installed is allowed to vary title by title. From actively making progress to simply leaving the game dormant on our device. In other words taking a break from even so much as doing the daily login.
A few of the gacha I have installed include Heaven Burns Red, Fate Grand Order, Honkai Star Rail and Blue Archive. None of which are under consideration for being removed from my device.
Time drains. So many time drains. Days just get passed
So long as it only fills my time and doesn’t feel like a chore I’m cool with dailies tbh
Love the game, invest the time, become the strongest. It's been that way since long before gacha. Worth!
7:15 I miss Dragalia Lost....
Usually. If you suddenly find yourself having logged into the game every day for six months and not done anything but dailies. It's probably time to considering stopping. Cause good lord did it take me too long to realize that....i had like 5? Maybe more gacha i hadn't really played for months sometimes a year and only logged it , get free stuff, do dailies. Ignore for 24 hours 💀
side note : weekly for goddess of victory nikke give 1 summon ticket,300 gems dailies 100 gems 5 mid quality molds, 50 core dusts and some bond tickets
Pricone is dead and I have never learned to gacha again
Guess im dead i got like 8 gacha games
2 are rhythm game which i dont do dailies (D4DJ and Bang dream)
1 is just empty all energy then dip (Limbus)
1 is just not even trying to get all rewards or just dont do dailies altogether because i plan my pulls(Arknight)
The other 4 are me doing the dailies every day (Nikke,GFL2,Blue archive,PGR)
Yeah im absolutely cooked
I do not like Gacha games, but i do like Nikke. Despite me only spending 50 bucks once a year ago, the game has been generous to me at all times. Enough that im a top 15% competitor in my pool. Money is one thing, but patience, time and effort matter more. If you operate within your limitations, the game gives you the means to go far.
Nb4 comments are "now i just play [gacha that isn't even generous with expensive skins and pricy time limited events]"
I stick with one gacha game only, Genshin, because I have a day job and Genshin has the gameplay I enjoy the most. I briefly tried playing a second gacha but quickly dropped it as soon as I realized it would take up too much of my time from doing other stuff. So only a single gacha game for me.
Not Dragalia Lost! *Crying in the corner*
But still it is true, as much as I loved that game, it was too kind with the gacha. One copy and done, never need to summon again. That was the killing blow for that one.
hello, obake! For me it didn't worht it anymore, I took a break after playing genshin for 2 years and honkai star rail for 1 year, seeing how many other games I could pay and play when I don't spent money nor time in gachas was a point of no return to me, i still play gachas occasionally but I don't do dailies anymore, I dont spend money on gachas and don't care about temporally events either. I just log in to do some new content and honestly I enjoy them both gachas and games more like this
I only really play NIKKE in terms of gacha, and the dailies I don't feel take away that much out of my day. For example I can complete dailies during my lunch break at work while I eat or if it is on a day off I normally multitask and only really give it my attention when I do Interceptions or Simulation Room. Both together about 5 mins. So really if one takes a multitask approach to NIKKE the time sink is much more smaller. And that is going to be more true with Simulation Room coming quicker soon.
All in all I have been playing up until this point F2P and have but about 6 missing nikkes(Summer Neon, Chainsaw man Collab, Joker, and base Soda)
I quit Raid Shadow Legends when they banned cheat engine to speed up pve content, it made 30min daily into 3h one
yea
Well, with respect to NIkke, hopefully they commit to lowering the time sink for dailies, as they mentioned in their most recent update.
I play nikke, and I've been playing for over a year now, it was a game where I thought "oh I'll try this booty shooty game that probably costs an arm and a leg just to get through the first chunk of the game" when in reality it has a very emotional, intense, and sometimes depressing story, especially in it's big events, and in reality, it's probably one of the friendliest F2P games out there, you could not spend a time a realistically get through the entire story at a steady pace with meta characters, they practically hand out some of the best units in the game and getting pulls is super easy, so tldr: nikke is pretty cool
The real cost of gacha is end of service.
Sincerely, ~#85 in KoF All-Star (it's dead now).
Also, don't do dailys every day. MOST gacha games have "returning player bonuses," usually when inactive 15 days. So you don't play them all constantly, you play a ROTATION of them. Or in my case, it was 4 KoF All-Star accounts. If my free pulls worked at the start of the event, I played the account, otherwise I set it down and came back later.
This is why I've never checked out a second gacha game. Cuz what would stop me from getting three or four or however many more? Self-control? Yeah, like anyone has that these days.
As long as you're having fun it's fine, indeed. But I do believe a looot of gacha games players do feel bored and miserable about some of their daily grind. It's just that the fomo, the emotional/financial attachment they have for the game and other factors make them keep going for it, until they burnout. There's a lot of games I would still play from time to time if I did not made the choice to keep logging in daily until it drove me away from it completely.
R1999's Limbo, UTTU and event minigames are NOT "dailies". They are EVENTS or CHALLENGE STAGES. R1999 dailies only take like 2 minutes...
There needs to be a solution that changes how people engage with games and spend their time and money on gaming. So many companies are dollar chasers and not gaming studios. Money launderers who will sell our your kids to steal money from your wallet.
These gacha games will end up causing countries to look at their people's development and I fear that there is gonna be a mass exodus from gacha real soon. The cost is adding up, and the money goes into the hands of people with agendas other than making good games... and when we find out where the money goes/who the real shareholders are, its gonna get ugly. Think Crypto bros but much worse.
It is so worth it
I am not a gacha game player, in fact I refuse to play them because of some of the fundamental design elements of the genre. However, it is nice to see the perspective of someone who engages with these types of games regularly. I have a better understanding of why a person would want to play one of these games. Still, even with all of the points you raised at the start of the video, I will never play a gacha game on a regular basis, regardless of how great the game is. I'd rather spend a fixed amount of money to have a complete experience than pay nothing, be bombarded with monetization, and be punished for not engaging with the monetization.
Once you hit level 150+ in nikke you can stop doing dailys and just do events. That's if you stop pushing story and just want to pull. Haven't done dailys in 8 months and got 80% character in games
I mean if you hate the time and dough you give then put effort into learning something to create instead of just reacting and playing to others work. Thats where you will really feel like youre accomplishing something.
Look gonna be honest? Take away the gatcha/mobile games I play. All of them. Leave me with nothing left. ...Oh look my mouse cursor is hovering over Rimworld.
You can debate if this is better or worse.
Like most aspects in life, gaming works on a transactional experience. If you see benefit in the time and money spent on the game, then to that individual there is value in the resources (time, money and emotion) spent playing the game. Games are meant to be played. The problem becomes when the game starts playing you. When that happens, a step back really needs to be taken so that you can look at what you are doing in a wider perspective and determine how you wish to move forward.
So far with NIKKE, I have been really enjoying the overall experience even pushing the hard mode campaign. The story, art, music, characters and direction of the game are quite phenomenal that it can offset knowing that you are playing a gacha game. Quite a bit of themes covered in the NIKKE story have been thought-provoking and even provided a basis on which I found myself reflecting my experience on what was being conveyed. As long as NIKKE continues to provide a high quality experience with its story, characters and music, I am willing to give it some of my time to continue with the journey.
All live service games are time sinks. A Warframe or Destiny player would die laughing at the suggestion that 180 hours a year is a lot of time. Those are rookie Warframe numbers. From a time sink perspective, gachas are actually on the lighter end of the live service spectrum.
This is just the nature of all free to play service games. Fortnite also needs time to grind passes and you can pay to skip or buy skins. So long as a game is fun I dont really care about the time sink. I'll play these games until a good one time pay game comes along or pick up an old game.
nice
I think Gachas and F2P’s have become quite an escape from the AAA industry that has become too political, woke, and ugly to the point where I’m willing to pay the premium for nice stuff in gacha games since I hardly have any backlog of actual buy-once games.
I honestly would rather spend $60 on a Scarlet skin than say Dragon Age Veilguard or Concord or most AAA games. Stellar Blade is one of those rare gems in the AAA industry everything else is just whatever to me.
The real escape is indies. They respect your time AND tend to not have the bs of triple A.
For every pull you dont pay for gatcha, its gets closer to buy a good pc. As for games.....well if to expensive....YARRRRRR (most games are not even finished products this days)
Also if you use 20 min on work instead of gatcha dailys, you will make more money overall.
Oh......and lets make it all depressive:
ALL THE MONEY AND TIME YOU SPEND ON GATCHA WILL BE GONE WHEN A GAME SHUTS DOWN AND ONLY WAY TO FIX THIS IS TO CREATE YOUR OWN SERVER YOU HOST FOR THIS GATCHA. (but this needs skill and time to reverse enginner)
As for phone users .... i recomend you download game emulators and just play those games instead (+ no adds).
Citra nighty emulator and drastic ds one for example. (only for android tho)
I quit all gacha games as it didn't feel worth the time or money
I'll play vergil over Miyabi any day
Video looks fun. Like and sub, and I promise I'll finish it :).
Edit: I did finish it. Nice one.
is Genshin given a AAA experience?
Play one or two and be happy. Playing too much of the same thing will make you sick of it. 😑
The real cost of any hobby is your time. I'd rather spend it playing based games than Western slop. But Nikke has one of the worst daily gameplay loops -- it's one of the most egregious pointless hamster wheel designs, like all AFK games that monetize that hamster wheel's illusionary progression. It not only wastes your time, but tries to rob you while doing it.
I'll tell you a gacha game that isn't worth time, Raid: shadow legends. They've been producing many lousy rares and epics, the gacha rates are incredibly low, the pvp is super aggressive, and the events take many hours and resources to complete: they expect you to work on them like a full time job
F2P 4life
First!