His relationship with Jesus is not your business. You may of missed the point of this deep conversation about morality. Our path to knowing GOD is personal.
@@JoHn-if6wy yeah but this a ticket to the club of no return, for your own good, because He's the only way out of our mess (Jesus), it's truth, it's like when you can't unsee something, it's just there, it really happened, and it's about what you do with that fundamental truth that makes all the difference
@JoHn-if6wy What is the church anyway? But a hospital for hypocrites. A hospital for chief sinners. A hospital for broken people to be fixed. Thank God I am all 3 of those things. Had it be not for The Church, I wouldnt know I was those things. I wouldnt know that I need grace. The question here is: do you?
Yup. We are all striving towards “The Real World” whether we know it or not. “This world was only the cover and the title page and the Real world is chapter one”
What C.S Lewis created is a wonderful world, which makes us discover the beauty of the spirituality of faith and of everything that surrounds us. Great job Stuart, and see you soon. 😍
Indeed, though I don't think it was inappropriate to credit Lewis in this conversation. Kant seemed more philosophical, and Lewis, the more practical. The latter would resonate with the everyman like Joe Rogan.
Follow the path of Ma’at, for it is the path of righteousness. Avoid wrongdoing, speak the truth, and maintain a pure heart, for only then can you achieve harmony and order in life. -Teaching of Ma’at circa 2613-2181 BCE
I often discussed how many people skip church because of churches taken over by con men or compromised propaganda speakers. If someone doesn't want to take part in such a thing, maybe it is for the best. I say that many of those megachurch guys are just corporate motivational speakers that sprinkle God and Jesus in the script.
but why???? the why is the point. his plan was for a perfect creation. the saved will be there on the new reformed earth. God's not finished. The more saved the better
the 5 levels of morality - righteousness (Love) - failing full righteousness, with repentance (Love and regretting failure) - indifference towards righteousness (careless) - failure without repentance (intentfully careless; evil) - enjoying unrighteousness (wicked) We have failed to stay at level 1, but The LORD wants us to at least come to level 2, that He may lift us up with Him.
Joe you have misunderstood THE LORD JESUS CHRIST .... NO-ONE is good BUT GOD ALMIGHTY ... as THE LORD JESUS CHRIST stated before obeying THE FATHER'S WILL of being chosen to be sacrificed on the cross for EVERY SIN EVER commited BUT only those accepting THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA as their SAVIOUR being granted access to THE HIS KINGDOM!
It's Jesus, God is Love... True Love. Man, He is calling Joe Rogan... Father God, please bring your son to Christ, to the knowledge of you. In Jesus Christ's Holy Name amen.
This is spiritual warfare a battle for our souls and we need God every second of this battle. The weapon and armor we use is God's Word. If satan can't get to you he will use other people to get to you. To try to tempt you with sin. I also think there is different types of evil spirits that are called demons lust, addiction, anger, depression, confusion, greed and other negative feelings that tempts you to sin and goes against God. Stay strong especially in times of temptations. The second you feel tempted is the second you pray against it. Because if you give satan more than a second he will take that second and stretch it out longer. It gets harder to fight temptation that's why you don't give satan any chances. You pray against temptation the second it enters your mind. Because that's satan tempting you it's not sin to get tempted. Because Jesus was tempted by satan and Jesus never gave into sin. Jesus fought temptation with God's Word. We have to do that too. We can be willing vessels for God or we can be willing vessels for satan. There is no in between. The only way people can be willing vessels for satan is if they give into those temptations to carry out evil. satan likes deceiving people so they blindly keep doing evil without realizing it. It's like being hypnotized willing to do something evil without realizing the true effect of it. The only way you become a willing vessel for God is accepting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior and asking forgiveness for your sins. Also being obedient to God's Word and putting God first is also important. Then you will feel God as you walk in the Spirit. Ephesians 6:11-12 "11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." KJV
Goodness or moral living won't get you into heaven... Heaven is the Father's abode, and the Father doesn't let unrighteousness into His presence. The Father wants all of mankind to be with Him in heaven. As it is, however, because of the curse of sin, all mankind is separated from God - because God the Father is holy. He put His eternal plan into motion and sent His only Son, Jesus so that Jesus could pay for sin with His perfect blood. Anyone who believes that He is the Son of God and that He died for their sins - literally calling on His name - will get into heaven when they die, or when Jesus comes back.
I wish that conservative politics did not so gleefully celebrate cruelty, revenge and exclusion. Lots of young people abandon the church or decide in advance not to investigate faith because of how it represents itself in halls of power.
Lewis wrote good books but so did L Ron Hubbard. (Battlefield Earth was a guilty pleasure.) That being said, his philosophy about a universal "god derived" morality is nonsense. It's like new world creationism but for societal norms. Except this is even easier to debunk.
it‘s not like young world creationism at all. You’d have to use a very specific strawman of a _‘sky daddy‘_ magically snapping his fingers to believe that, which isn’t representative of the natural theology of the past two millenia whatsoever. The Flintstones isn’t theology.
It is naive, in the extreme, to believe that everyone recognizes a universal notion of ‘good’. Analysis of ubiquitous barbaric practices throughout history, at essentially any level, will show this.
Lewis doesn't describe the Tao as a universal consciousness, but rather a set of common attitudes towards objects and ideas in the universe that are shared between all mankind. He discusses it in The Abolition of Man, where he compares it to the modern attitude of nihilism.
Mankind innately has the law of God written on our conscience...and we know the difference between right and wrong; but now, God expects us to accept Jesus as our Savior; and performing "good" deeds" is not enough. He is the possessor of all of creation, and we have to acquiesce to the way that He deems is the only way to be saved...repent and turn to Jesus!🙏🏾🙏🏾🩸🩸🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾💞💞
Do better in what way? Though there is certainly an overlap in concepts and implications of Dow and natural law, they're not synonymous. Lewis was speaking specifically about the dao, though the principle he describes here is indeed part of natura llaw.
The problem with this is that we now live in a western society that embraces and pushes the idea of " personal truth". This idea that an individual can claim that " my truth " is as legitimate or even exceeds objective truth. This is what has lead to people rationalising things then justifying objective evil. Just look at society and its views on crime, abortion, look at how the murder of Christian children by a deranged person in Nashville was rationalised that the person commiting the murders was actually a victim. Look at the moment how people rationalise the unspeakable crimes that Hamas committed at the music festival and surrounding area, you have people rationalising rape and infanticide , that hamas have a " truth " and they are somehow victims. Dao is a nice idea but it doesn't change that people are evil. The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
It's not necessarily "personal truth" but absolute truth, which each person is able to rationalize. However that's why community exists so the absolute truth is identified by comparison of truth. Hence why absolute truth when discovered must be continually documented because no one can argue against that
@joerogan I would like to encourage along the journey, that this/my existence right here right now is better because of my spiritual walk with the creator and his son Jesus Christ. I would love to share it with you.
I love how they say that Rogan explains Lewis…….. I mean………I just watched that. Pretty sure someone else quoted Lewis while Rogan sat and listened. I love Lewis and I definitely tune in for some of Rogan’s stuff but the headline is flat out false…..that is all ✌️
@@sleeaap Hmm, I guess I don't really believe in objective right and wrong yet - there is for some things but not every single thing can be categoriesed into a cosmic right/wrong imo
@Sean-xr1xj the idea isnt about the "middling gray", but the fact that we can all agree some things are undeniably morally good or bad. Without being explicit here I'm sure there are certain acts that you can imagine that everyone except the most mentally depraved would agree are evil. There are probably acts of bravery sacrifice or love that you would also agree are universally considered good. It's the fact that we universally recognize something called good and something called evil that indicates a few things: 1. There exists something outside of our universe beyond the material. Material things can never be inherently good or evil. If Good and Evil exists, it exists in a way that is beyond the physical universe. 2. It supports the biblical idea humanity has been endowed with an understanding of good and evil by a creator. He has given us moral responsibility in light of this knowledge.
Man… I have GOT to stop kicking old ladies in the shins.. road to recovery is rough you guys, but I’ll get there. Just have to put one foot in front of the other, just, just not into an old ladies shin…
No doubt our ideas of good come from the evolutionary advantages of being social creatures but their could always be more to it. Kind of impossible to know one way or the other
Morality cannot stem from evolutionary processes in a materialist worldview. It done any logically work 🤦🏿♂️ people just yell “biology” as a default without having any understanding as to whether it’s even possible or not. Heck, people don’t even understand what they say they “believe”, they just yell it out confidently.
So CS Lewis’ pro-God argument is a Taoist (non-theistic) one? Huh. That seems dishonest. Kind of like how CS Lewis says he was an atheist who was angry at God for creating the world. Like dude. Then you were never an atheist. It’s embarrassing that Christians still hold him in such high regard. Specifically because his ideas are self-contradictory and the average Christian will never take the time to honestly go through them.
Not embarrassing at all if you actually "take the time to honestly go through" the points you've challenged. Dao is simply a way to describe the apparent order of the universe. It is not a concept that is exclusive to Taoism. Here's the quote from Lewis that you are referencing: "I was at this time living, like so many Atheists or Antitheists, in a whirl of contradictions. I maintained that God did not exist. I was also very angry with God for not existing. I was equally angry with Him for creating a world. Why should creatures have the burden of existence forced on them without their consent?" The whole point of this passage is to highlight the contradictions that Lewis himself was experiencing as an intellectual atheist. These internal struggles are not uncommon to Lewis and I would venture to say they are very common to many atheists. Rather than weakening Lewis's position, I believe you have highlighted the weakness of your own position. The common conflict in the heart and mind of the atheist only further supports the idea that there is an internal sense of tao in us all--one which only makes sense if there is an ultimate Creator of Order.
@@IntotheWardrobe don’t break your back doing those mental gymnastics. Where do you get off acting like CS Lewis was an atheist? You’re self-contradicting and so was he. If he had anger at God then he was not an atheist no matter what internal conflict he had. He just wasn’t a full blown believer yet. I don’t have any anger at God, because he doesn’t exist so that would be dumb, and self-contradictory… I’m angry at the narcissistic Christians like Lewis who think they have a corner on truth, who colonize eastern ideas, and who teach everyone that being a human is a punishable offense. The fact that there’s truth in Taoism means nothing positive for Christianity. Taoism: derives ethics through observation and harmony with the natural world (no god needed) Lewis completely redefined and missed the point of Taoism but speaks on it like an authority. Sure, you’re going to flat out deny that, but I actually care enough to study Lao-Zhuang philosophy and I can tell the difference. Lewis doesn’t even represent Nihilism correctly. Bro. And you’re over here talking about “take the time” and “honestly going through the points.” Look at yourself in the mirror. Most Christians, and evidently you, immediately assume anyone else must be ignorant if we disagree with your NARROW view of things. No god who gives infinite punishment for finite crime is worth the second thought. You better hope he doesn’t exist cause even if you made it into the book of life, half the people you care about or have ever met will be burning. No other message is more dehumanizing than the gospel. Not even nihilism since everything would just be meaningless. In Nihilism you don’t start life “in debt” the way you do in Christianity. But yeah. Go ahead and tell me I haven’t taken the time. That I haven’t read the books. That I haven’t done the work. That I haven’t attended the seminars and debates. That god put the truth on my heart and I’m just in denial. That I just have to come to the right understanding. Go ahead and say that faith is evidence. Go ahead and baselessly claim that morals and order can only come from a god. Go ahead and project your Christian cognitive dissonance onto me. And then, since you apparently know, go ahead and tell me what I have going on inside me, this apparent “conflict in the heart and mind of the atheist.”
@@IntotheWardrobe The new atheists replaced the tripartite form of monism into the worship of randomness (newtonian dynamics), nothingness (big bang) to equate to the monism of MEANINGLESSNESS! Find god, east or west, islamic or jewish.... god comes in many forms as god is light, and light is everything. Even matter. Even spirit. Even space and time are emergent properties of light. Light rules above time because god is light. Light is electromagnetism, electromagnetism is the 1st force and creates radiation and gravity.
But there are psychopaths and sociopaths. So, not everybody but most? If a person gets a brain injury it changes them in ways that their entire personality changes. So it seems like most of us have adapted a desire for "common good" because that has been our evolutionary advantage. We are social animals and if we work towards helping each other and not hurting one another, our entire species thrives better than if we didn't. And, our personalities are our brains, not a "soul". If a head injury can change your entire life, then that means we are not a soul but what our brain construction is. It's a nice thought but science has come a long way since Lewis.
Christian morality is not simply pragmatic. There are pragmatic elements but many seriously immoral things are pragmatic. The Roman Empire was functional and flourishing and they were involved in human sacrifice and polygamous fornication etc. and did not believe it was wrong. animals are pragmatic just how pagans were and they will kill their kids to ensure others survive etc. there is earthly ethics and God’s ethics. God’s ethics cannot be justified with earthly rational.
This exact response is actually discussed in-depth in CS Lewis' "Mere Christianity". I recommend reading the full source material if you're curious. A 30-second video really doesn't do this theory justice.
It's Context. You are Body Spirit Soul. It's like Trinity they all need eachother. Depending on time on purpose one is superior to the other but all work together. Without a brain,soul won't function but when soul is functioning it can guide the brain best.
@@Dr.Judy.N.Lubega Show me a soul? That's why I was brain injury can cause massive personality changes. From the things we have studied and observed, a soul just doesn't exist. Your personality and everything about the things you do are all dictated by brain chemistry. We can measure and see love with functioning MRIs.
@@matthew6427 okay I get you now. So you don't believe a soul exists & yet I do. so this is loong debated topic soul spirit body. Convincing you is what we need to embark on
Where was this good before humans existed? Morality emerged as humans developed their cognitive faculties. Not sure how that’s relevant to the universe.
How do you know this to be true? To say that morality doesn't exist unless a person's mind can conceive of it is akin to saying light doesn't exist unless a person's eyes can detect it. Or are you saying morality is just a mental construct and doesn't actually exist?
@@IntotheWardrobeLight would still be light without minds. Where is morality without a mind? Morality doesn’t seem relevant to the universe. It appears to be a product of the mind. It requires a certain cognitive capacity to compare behavior. Species that don’t have that capacity we don’t call moral or immoral. We don’t consider tsunamis, earthquakes, hurricanes, cancer, etc, to be moral or immoral.
@@IntotheWardrobe You - How do we know this to be true.? Does that mean light doesn't exist unless we are able to detect it. Response - Light comes from a material source: the Sun, candles, electricity. Morality is a concept invented by man. Man lists those things he deems good and evil. Morality constantly rises and falls, expands and contracts, alongside man. We know this is true because we can see its evolution throughout history. 1) There was a time when it was acceptable to r@pe your wife until man made it morally unacceptable. 2) There was a time when child labor was acceptable in coal mines until man made it morally unacceptable. 3) In 1880, the ages of sexual consent were set at ten or twelve in most states, with the exception of Delaware, where it was seven. It was acceptable until man changed the consent laws making it morally unacceptable.
@@fragwagon nah, he’s a controlled opposition shill. You don’t get to have the world’s most popular podcast, host multiple TV shows, and be the main UFC announcer without selling your soul. Literally.
@@chrismoney1468I think he has had to compromise throughout his career, but I believe him to be genuine. And I don’t agree with his personal beliefs usually or drug use but he is a good interviewer. Joe is just doing his thing, he isn’t out to deceive you.
Speaker: “Everyone thinks kicking old people in the shin for pleasure is wrong.” Me: Then explain why some people think titty-twisters are funny. For the record I consider titty-twisters full sexual assault, period. I’d much rather be kicked in the shin. My point is we can no longer assume anything is “universally wrong.”
People find them funny because they know it's wrong. Or do you think people do things like titty twisters or kicking old ladies because they actually think theyre doing something morally good? Obviously people do - and enjoy - things that are wrong. That doesnt mean that theyre not universally understood to be wrong. What you're saying is "people do wrong Things with pleasure, therefore there is no right and wrong". That's a very weak argument
I believe by using a term from eastern philosophy, he is further illustrating the truth of the concept: that natural law is something that exists in all people and is universally recognized by all faiths. It isn't an acceptance of Taoism, it is an aknowlegment of an undeniable common ground which serves as convincing evidence of a Creator. Here's his quote: "The Tao, which others may call Natural Law or Traditional Morality or the First Principles of Practical Reason or the First Platitudes, is not one among a series of possible systems of value. It is the sole source of all value judgments. If it is rejected, all value is rejected. If any value is retained, it is retained. The effort to refute it and raise a new system of value in its place is self-contradictory. There has never been, and never will be, a radically new judgment of value in the history of the world. What purport to be new systems or…ideologies…all consist of fragments from the Tao itself, arbitrarily wrenched from their context in the whole and then swollen to madness in their isolation, yet still owing to the Tao and to it alone such validity as they posses."
@@IntotheWardrobe Morality is not one of the Laws of Nature cause if it was then every animal on the planet would abide by the Laws of Morality. Nature abhors a vacuum. Man is the epitome of life and he has a thinking brain. Stop thinking that mankind is so stupid that he can't conceive of moral law and be the foundation of it.
Because it’s an example that exists cross culturally, which is an argument made by Saint Thomas Aquinas. The point of theology is to study divinity, which all religions approach but can never fully articulate. This is also related to the concept of an objective monotheism as a unifying subject. Christianity is understood by Christians as the closest approximation of the nature of this divinity.
Keep drawing him Lord. He’s getting warmer. Praying for Joe Rogan to come to Christ Jesus! 🙏🏼
His relationship with Jesus is not your business. You may of missed the point of this deep conversation about morality.
Our path to knowing GOD is personal.
My sentiments exactly! He is so close! ❤
Amen We're agreeing in prayer.. where 2 or more are gathered in your name Lord Jesus.
@@c2daflowzoom zoom. "gathered" is a big boy word. I wonder what the Quenya word for "gathered" is?
@@Robert52700 Rogan is a Christian... The way he understands things can only come from GODLY revelation..
Can't wait to hear when he's accepted Christ
Same 🙏🙏🙏
He agrees with 99.9999% of his guest.
Hes just doing it for the money.
@@JoHn-if6wy yeah but this a ticket to the club of no return, for your own good, because He's the only way out of our mess (Jesus), it's truth, it's like when you can't unsee something, it's just there, it really happened, and it's about what you do with that fundamental truth that makes all the difference
@@1994wildchild I think joe rogans loves his image more than god. Thats what i think of him. And theres many more hypocrites within the church.
@JoHn-if6wy What is the church anyway? But a hospital for hypocrites. A hospital for chief sinners. A hospital for broken people to be fixed. Thank God I am all 3 of those things. Had it be not for The Church, I wouldnt know I was those things. I wouldnt know that I need grace. The question here is: do you?
Please don’t give up on the church Joe. We’re called to be Christ like. We need the body and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ. Praying for you, brother.
True evil doesn’t oppose good morals. It opposes faith. Be vigilant.
Yup. We are all striving towards “The Real World” whether we know it or not. “This world was only the cover and the title page and the Real world is chapter one”
How do you know
He must just be really smart and aware to know this thing we don't
The music doesn't help AT ALL
😂 still, praise Jesus!
What C.S Lewis created is a wonderful world, which makes us discover the beauty of the spirituality of faith and of everything that surrounds us.
Great job Stuart, and see you soon. 😍
Many of his works were propaganda to try to indoctrinate children into the cult of Christianity.
What "world" did CSL create? There is only ONE CREATOR - GOD ALMIGHTY!
@@ACuriousChild Narnia
. .And with "IN" us All
I pray that Joe Rogan accepts Jesus as Lord.
JRR tolkein is credited with helping Lewis become a Christian
I wish JR would understand that you can't define "good" truthfully without God
Literally the word God is the etymylogical root for the word Good
Which god ?
@@yoeyyoey8937 there is only one, you contrarian fool. Have you ever tried praying to Thor? Nothing happens
@@ryanparker4996 That's false. None of this is true
@@getasimbe the English language is built around the Bible. You know nothing, child.
Abolition of man is a great book. Highly recommended to all.
Come home to the One True Faith established by JESÚS CHRIST himself. The One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church. Established 33 AD
This is the first time im hearing about not kicking old ladies in the shins for fun. I’m gonna have to stop doing that.
It might be okay to do it if it's not fun.
Forgiveness with boundaries and connect with people. Foster loving supportive connections. Breed joy not hatred.😊
Actually Lewis got his idea from Kant. He brakes down Kants idea beautifully. The imersivas moral imperatives
Indeed, though I don't think it was inappropriate to credit Lewis in this conversation. Kant seemed more philosophical, and Lewis, the more practical. The latter would resonate with the everyman like Joe Rogan.
Did Lewis call it the taos, though? I seem to remember reference to the Natural Law. Sincere question, been a while since I read him.
In some of his work he did call it the Tao. The idea that there is a way things ought to be as present within the universe.
Yup, it’s in the Abolition of Man
@@ComicRaptor8850 thank you!
The Tao is from Buddhism not Lewis
@milanpatel5788 we all know that but thank you.
Good vid. Its mainstream to hate on Rogan nowadays
Follow the path of Ma’at, for it is the path of righteousness. Avoid wrongdoing, speak the truth, and maintain a pure heart, for only then can you achieve harmony and order in life. -Teaching of Ma’at circa 2613-2181 BCE
Don't judge people based on brick and mortar church attendance. Many true believers are coming out from under them.
I often discussed how many people skip church because of churches taken over by con men or compromised propaganda speakers. If someone doesn't want to take part in such a thing, maybe it is for the best.
I say that many of those megachurch guys are just corporate motivational speakers that sprinkle God and Jesus in the script.
Do good, avoid evil, purify the mind. All enlightened teachers have taught thus. -Goutama circa 480 BCE
Amen! Keep Joe and all who do not yet believe in our prayers.
when is joe gonna have jeff durbin on?
YEEES
Hopefully never.
interesting
That would be lively.
but why???? the why is the point. his plan was for a perfect creation. the saved will be there on the new reformed earth. God's not finished. The more saved the better
Joe I’m making a t shirt with your quote! That was well said!
the 5 levels of morality
- righteousness (Love)
- failing full righteousness, with repentance (Love and regretting failure)
- indifference towards righteousness (careless)
- failure without repentance (intentfully careless; evil)
- enjoying unrighteousness (wicked)
We have failed to stay at level 1, but The LORD wants us to at least come to level 2, that He may lift us up with Him.
Joe you have misunderstood THE LORD JESUS CHRIST .... NO-ONE is good BUT GOD ALMIGHTY ... as THE LORD JESUS CHRIST stated before obeying THE FATHER'S WILL of being chosen to be sacrificed on the cross for EVERY SIN EVER commited BUT only those accepting THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA as their SAVIOUR being granted access to THE HIS KINGDOM!
No Dear.....The thought proccess He desires for us is aligned with Him and His Word. Even at our best isn't enough. That's why we need a Savior.
It's Jesus, God is Love... True Love.
Man, He is calling Joe Rogan... Father God, please bring your son to Christ, to the knowledge of you. In Jesus Christ's Holy Name amen.
This is spiritual warfare a battle for our souls and we need God every second of this battle. The weapon and armor we use is God's Word. If satan can't get to you he will use other people to get to you. To try to tempt you with sin. I also think there is different types of evil spirits that are called demons lust, addiction, anger, depression, confusion, greed and other negative feelings that tempts you to sin and goes against God. Stay strong especially in times of temptations. The second you feel tempted is the second you pray against it. Because if you give satan more than a second he will take that second and stretch it out longer. It gets harder to fight temptation that's why you don't give satan any chances. You pray against temptation the second it enters your mind. Because that's satan tempting you it's not sin to get tempted. Because Jesus was tempted by satan and Jesus never gave into sin. Jesus fought temptation with God's Word. We have to do that too. We can be willing vessels for God or we can be willing vessels for satan. There is no in between. The only way people can be willing vessels for satan is if they give into those temptations to carry out evil. satan likes deceiving people so they blindly keep doing evil without realizing it. It's like being hypnotized willing to do something evil without realizing the true effect of it. The only way you become a willing vessel for God is accepting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior and asking forgiveness for your sins. Also being obedient to God's Word and putting God first is also important. Then you will feel God as you walk in the Spirit.
Ephesians 6:11-12 "11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." KJV
Goodness or moral living won't get you into heaven... Heaven is the Father's abode, and the Father doesn't let unrighteousness into His presence. The Father wants all of mankind to be with Him in heaven. As it is, however, because of the curse of sin, all mankind is separated from God - because God the Father is holy. He put His eternal plan into motion and sent His only Son, Jesus so that Jesus could pay for sin with His perfect blood. Anyone who believes that He is the Son of God and that He died for their sins - literally calling on His name - will get into heaven when they die, or when Jesus comes back.
I wish that conservative politics did not so gleefully celebrate cruelty, revenge and exclusion. Lots of young people abandon the church or decide in advance not to investigate faith because of how it represents itself in halls of power.
Hey, if Joe Rogan turned his passion and fully surrendered his life to Christ man he'd be FIRE!! 🔥🔥🔥
Forget CS Lewis when you can read the red letters for yourself - what Bible? Rev 22;18,19 to what Bible?
Also if said old lady is carrying a pitcher of agent R... Fn roshambo is def acceptable.
I love real estate.
I hope and pray that I am watching Joe Rogan’s conversion in slow motion. Praise Jesus!🙏❤️
❤ Joe drops into his heart often and I adore the synergy between his thoughtful mind, heart & spirit!
Christ wants us to acknowledge he is thee sole creator/God of the entire universe and all therein , including earth!
To live in peace with everyone !
We dont all know whats good. History proves that time and time again when humans form into large groups we do not do good.
Wickedesness hides behind supposed well intended platitudes. It is a cloak of beautiful false light that blinds Mt 23:27
You have an open mind towards the narrow path, but not so narrow that there isn't room to grow.
So I have to give up old lady shinkicking now? Geez
JR is such a clown. He believes according to his guests…. L o s er
Lewis wrote good books but so did L Ron Hubbard. (Battlefield Earth was a guilty pleasure.)
That being said, his philosophy about a universal "god derived" morality is nonsense. It's like new world creationism but for societal norms. Except this is even easier to debunk.
it‘s not like young world creationism at all.
You’d have to use a very specific strawman of a _‘sky daddy‘_ magically snapping his fingers to believe that, which isn’t representative of the natural theology of the past two millenia whatsoever.
The Flintstones isn’t theology.
We don't all inherently recognize family as good. Some of us were raised in dysfunctional, abusive families. This video is emotional hogwash.
Even those with abusive backgrounds still recognize that family is supposed to be good even when it isn't, do they not?
our Creator is Yahweh and He wants us to obey His Word The Torah.
It is beautiful but only if you take it all the way to Jesus Christ ❤
It is naive, in the extreme, to believe that everyone recognizes a universal notion of ‘good’. Analysis of ubiquitous barbaric practices throughout history, at essentially any level, will show this.
Meyer addresses this in the interview. There are, of course those whose conscious is corrupted in some or all areas of common morality.
CS Lewis did NOT use that language!😢
Expounds on Lewis’s belief in a universal conscience that he called the dao or tao.. what the source on that
Lewis doesn't describe the Tao as a universal consciousness, but rather a set of common attitudes towards objects and ideas in the universe that are shared between all mankind. He discusses it in The Abolition of Man, where he compares it to the modern attitude of nihilism.
The natural law is written on our hearts - see Heb 8:10
I believe that to. Deep in what I call " The Self " there is a very unique consionsness among us that dont need to be teached .
Read ROMANS CHAPTER 2
The Laws of God written in our hearts brother , our conscience also bearing witness
It’s also very simple empathy. Don’t like it when someone kicks you? Don’t do it to someone else.
We all got toward the same thing, even in the smallest way - Christ!
Joe Rogan for president of USA
Deep moral intuitions regardless of culture is not evidence of a God.
“Intuitions” supposes that there’s an inherent compass within each person regardless of culture as you put it
Wow 👏 Joe! Thanks for inviting this great scientist! It's sooo mind opening 👌👏🔥
Who is he?
@Jake.r.reinhart Steven Myers is one of the greatest contemporary minds and scientists who do not believe in chance!👍
God is not a fairytale!!!!
Muslims call this fitra
You're coming around Joe it's going to be earth moving when you finally figure it out.
Flying Guillotine?
It's called CONSCIENCE everyone has one, but most choose to ignore it.
Tired of his stupidity.
I farted.
It was beautiful.
Ahh the subversion of meaning. Genius level irony to say that on this video
Mankind innately has the law of God written on our conscience...and we know the difference between right and wrong; but now, God expects us to accept Jesus as our Savior; and performing "good" deeds" is not enough. He is the possessor of all of creation, and we have to acquiesce to the way that He deems is the only way to be saved...repent and turn to Jesus!🙏🏾🙏🏾🩸🩸🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾💞💞
Well put!
It’s called the natural law. Please do better.
Do better in what way? Though there is certainly an overlap in concepts and implications of Dow and natural law, they're not synonymous. Lewis was speaking specifically about the dao, though the principle he describes here is indeed part of natura llaw.
The problem with this is that we now live in a western society that embraces and pushes the idea of " personal truth". This idea that an individual can claim that
" my truth " is as legitimate or even exceeds objective truth. This is what has lead to people rationalising things then justifying objective evil. Just look at society and its views on crime, abortion, look at how the murder of Christian children by a deranged person in Nashville was rationalised that the person commiting the murders was actually a victim. Look at the moment how people rationalise the unspeakable crimes that Hamas committed at the music festival and surrounding area, you have people rationalising rape and infanticide , that hamas have a " truth " and they are somehow victims. Dao is a nice idea but it doesn't change that people are evil. The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
The greatest thing evil did to people was proving evil doesn't exist👍.
CS Lewis said the same thing in his opening remarks in "Screw tape letters"
It's not necessarily "personal truth" but absolute truth, which each person is able to rationalize. However that's why community exists so the absolute truth is identified by comparison of truth. Hence why absolute truth when discovered must be continually documented because no one can argue against that
Love is God
@joerogan I would like to encourage along the journey, that this/my existence right here right now is better because of my spiritual walk with the creator and his son Jesus Christ. I would love to share it with you.
I love how they say that Rogan explains Lewis…….. I mean………I just watched that. Pretty sure someone else quoted Lewis while Rogan sat and listened. I love Lewis and I definitely tune in for some of Rogan’s stuff but the headline is flat out false…..that is all ✌️
Not H A M A S
Go Joe
This blew my mind. I'm athiest but this was quite interesting, I'd like to learn more
@@Sean-xr1xj this is one of the many great evidences of a Creator, an objective right and wrong. Not a relative one.
@@sleeaap Hmm, I guess I don't really believe in objective right and wrong yet - there is for some things but not every single thing can be categoriesed into a cosmic right/wrong imo
@Sean-xr1xj the idea isnt about the "middling gray", but the fact that we can all agree some things are undeniably morally good or bad. Without being explicit here I'm sure there are certain acts that you can imagine that everyone except the most mentally depraved would agree are evil. There are probably acts of bravery sacrifice or love that you would also agree are universally considered good. It's the fact that we universally recognize something called good and something called evil that indicates a few things: 1. There exists something outside of our universe beyond the material. Material things can never be inherently good or evil. If Good and Evil exists, it exists in a way that is beyond the physical universe.
2. It supports the biblical idea humanity has been endowed with an understanding of good and evil by a creator. He has given us moral responsibility in light of this knowledge.
Man… I have GOT to stop kicking old ladies in the shins.. road to recovery is rough you guys, but I’ll get there. Just have to put one foot in front of the other, just, just not into an old ladies shin…
Or it's "just" biology.
No doubt our ideas of good come from the evolutionary advantages of being social creatures but their could always be more to it. Kind of impossible to know one way or the other
Prove it
Morality cannot stem from evolutionary processes in a materialist worldview. It done any logically work 🤦🏿♂️ people just yell “biology” as a default without having any understanding as to whether it’s even possible or not. Heck, people don’t even understand what they say they “believe”, they just yell it out confidently.
@@ultracrepiderian What does "prove it" mean?
@@tayzk5929 that the having a conscience that's extremely similar all over the world is just biology.
😂 Did u forget what the video is about genius??
We all have the universal truth, but lots of us tend to block it out and do or say otherwise
Their discovering Christian morality 😮
Did she have a switch and ex roller derby player?
So CS Lewis’ pro-God argument is a Taoist (non-theistic) one? Huh.
That seems dishonest. Kind of like how CS Lewis says he was an atheist who was angry at God for creating the world.
Like dude. Then you were never an atheist.
It’s embarrassing that Christians still hold him in such high regard. Specifically because his ideas are self-contradictory and the average Christian will never take the time to honestly go through them.
Not embarrassing at all if you actually "take the time to honestly go through" the points you've challenged.
Dao is simply a way to describe the apparent order of the universe. It is not a concept that is exclusive to Taoism.
Here's the quote from Lewis that you are referencing:
"I was at this time living, like so many Atheists or Antitheists, in a whirl of contradictions. I maintained that God did not exist. I was also very angry with God for not existing. I was equally angry with Him for creating a world. Why should creatures have the burden of existence forced on them without their consent?"
The whole point of this passage is to highlight the contradictions that Lewis himself was experiencing as an intellectual atheist. These internal struggles are not uncommon to Lewis and I would venture to say they are very common to many atheists.
Rather than weakening Lewis's position, I believe you have highlighted the weakness of your own position. The common conflict in the heart and mind of the atheist only further supports the idea that there is an internal sense of tao in us all--one which only makes sense if there is an ultimate Creator of Order.
@@IntotheWardrobe
don’t break your back doing those mental gymnastics.
Where do you get off acting like CS Lewis was an atheist?
You’re self-contradicting and so was he.
If he had anger at God then he was not an atheist no matter what internal conflict he had. He just wasn’t a full blown believer yet.
I don’t have any anger at God, because he doesn’t exist so that would be dumb, and self-contradictory…
I’m angry at the narcissistic Christians like Lewis who think they have a corner on truth, who colonize eastern ideas, and who teach everyone that being a human is a punishable offense.
The fact that there’s truth in Taoism means nothing positive for Christianity.
Taoism: derives ethics through observation and harmony with the natural world (no god needed)
Lewis completely redefined and missed the point of Taoism but speaks on it like an authority. Sure, you’re going to flat out deny that, but I actually care enough to study Lao-Zhuang philosophy and I can tell the difference.
Lewis doesn’t even represent Nihilism correctly.
Bro. And you’re over here talking about “take the time” and “honestly going through the points.”
Look at yourself in the mirror.
Most Christians, and evidently you, immediately assume anyone else must be ignorant if we disagree with your NARROW view of things.
No god who gives infinite punishment for finite crime is worth the second thought.
You better hope he doesn’t exist cause even if you made it into the book of life, half the people you care about or have ever met will be burning.
No other message is more dehumanizing than the gospel. Not even nihilism since everything would just be meaningless. In Nihilism you don’t start life “in debt” the way you do in Christianity.
But yeah. Go ahead and tell me I haven’t taken the time. That I haven’t read the books. That I haven’t done the work. That I haven’t attended the seminars and debates. That god put the truth on my heart and I’m just in denial. That I just have to come to the right understanding. Go ahead and say that faith is evidence. Go ahead and baselessly claim that morals and order can only come from a god. Go ahead and project your Christian cognitive dissonance onto me.
And then, since you apparently know, go ahead and tell me what I have going on inside me, this apparent “conflict in the heart and mind of the atheist.”
The Elegance of Excellence.. 🙂
Who is the guest?
Stephen C. Meyer! His book Signature in the Cell was an incredibly important book for me.
@@IntotheWardrobe The new atheists replaced the tripartite form of monism into the worship of randomness (newtonian dynamics), nothingness (big bang) to equate to the monism of MEANINGLESSNESS!
Find god, east or west, islamic or jewish.... god comes in many forms as god is light, and light is everything. Even matter. Even spirit. Even space and time are emergent properties of light.
Light rules above time because god is light.
Light is electromagnetism, electromagnetism is the 1st force and creates radiation and gravity.
Who is he interviewing?
But there are psychopaths and sociopaths. So, not everybody but most? If a person gets a brain injury it changes them in ways that their entire personality changes. So it seems like most of us have adapted a desire for "common good" because that has been our evolutionary advantage. We are social animals and if we work towards helping each other and not hurting one another, our entire species thrives better than if we didn't. And, our personalities are our brains, not a "soul". If a head injury can change your entire life, then that means we are not a soul but what our brain construction is. It's a nice thought but science has come a long way since Lewis.
Christian morality is not simply pragmatic. There are pragmatic elements but many seriously immoral things are pragmatic. The Roman Empire was functional and flourishing and they were involved in human sacrifice and polygamous fornication etc. and did not believe it was wrong. animals are pragmatic just how pagans were and they will kill their kids to ensure others survive etc. there is earthly ethics and God’s ethics. God’s ethics cannot be justified with earthly rational.
This exact response is actually discussed in-depth in CS Lewis' "Mere Christianity". I recommend reading the full source material if you're curious. A 30-second video really doesn't do this theory justice.
It's Context. You are Body Spirit Soul.
It's like Trinity they all need eachother.
Depending on time on purpose one is superior to the other but all work together.
Without a brain,soul won't function but when soul is functioning it can guide the brain best.
@@Dr.Judy.N.Lubega Show me a soul? That's why I was brain injury can cause massive personality changes. From the things we have studied and observed, a soul just doesn't exist. Your personality and everything about the things you do are all dictated by brain chemistry. We can measure and see love with functioning MRIs.
@@matthew6427 okay I get you now. So you don't believe a soul exists & yet I do. so this is loong debated topic soul spirit body. Convincing you is what we need to embark on
Thinking how I wanna hug Aslan*
natural law
Oh no...
That’s it!❤
Where was this good before humans existed? Morality emerged as humans developed their cognitive faculties. Not sure how that’s relevant to the universe.
How do you know this to be true? To say that morality doesn't exist unless a person's mind can conceive of it is akin to saying light doesn't exist unless a person's eyes can detect it. Or are you saying morality is just a mental construct and doesn't actually exist?
@@IntotheWardrobeLight would still be light without minds. Where is morality without a mind? Morality doesn’t seem relevant to the universe. It appears to be a product of the mind. It requires a certain cognitive capacity to compare behavior. Species that don’t have that capacity we don’t call moral or immoral. We don’t consider tsunamis, earthquakes, hurricanes, cancer, etc, to be moral or immoral.
@@IntotheWardrobe
You -
How do we know this to be true.?
Does that mean light doesn't exist unless we are able to detect it.
Response -
Light comes from a material source: the Sun, candles, electricity.
Morality is a concept invented by man.
Man lists those things he deems good and evil.
Morality constantly rises and falls, expands and contracts, alongside man.
We know this is true because we can see its evolution throughout history.
1) There was a time when it was acceptable to r@pe your wife until man made it morally unacceptable.
2) There was a time when child labor was acceptable in coal mines until man made it morally unacceptable.
3) In 1880, the ages of sexual consent were set at ten or twelve in most states, with the exception of Delaware, where it was seven.
It was acceptable until man changed the consent laws making it morally unacceptable.
Thank you
joe rogan 💀
Love this! What episode?
Interview with Steven C. Meyer
Natural Law
…..I mean… Lewis said it best.
Beautiful
Joe!!!!!!!!! That was beautiful Joe, you just made me cry! Thank you for this :-)
Where can I learn more about the debate?
This is from the Joe Rogan Podcast interview with Stephen C. Meyer.
I'm going to have a child. You just made me cry Joe. Refined
In Romans 6 Paul wrote that the law is written on our hearts.
Please don't bring him into this. I've already had enough.
C.S. Lewis?
Joe Rogan is a deceiver, for sure.
@chrismoney1468 nah, he's just a dude, and a mediocre standup. Good interviewer however.
@@fragwagon nah, he’s a controlled opposition shill. You don’t get to have the world’s most popular podcast, host multiple TV shows, and be the main UFC announcer without selling your soul. Literally.
@@chrismoney1468I think he has had to compromise throughout his career, but I believe him to be genuine. And I don’t agree with his personal beliefs usually or drug use but he is a good interviewer. Joe is just doing his thing, he isn’t out to deceive you.
Joe has represented the good for us. He is hearing a good voice.
Speaker: “Everyone thinks kicking old people in the shin for pleasure is wrong.”
Me: Then explain why some people think titty-twisters are funny.
For the record I consider titty-twisters full sexual assault, period. I’d much rather be kicked in the shin. My point is we can no longer assume anything is “universally wrong.”
People find them funny because they know it's wrong. Or do you think people do things like titty twisters or kicking old ladies because they actually think theyre doing something morally good?
Obviously people do - and enjoy - things that are wrong. That doesnt mean that theyre not universally understood to be wrong.
What you're saying is "people do wrong Things with pleasure, therefore there is no right and wrong". That's a very weak argument
Why did he call it the “Dao”? This is worrying considering that is associated with the false pagan religion of Daoism/Taoism worry 🤨
I believe by using a term from eastern philosophy, he is further illustrating the truth of the concept: that natural law is something that exists in all people and is universally recognized by all faiths. It isn't an acceptance of Taoism, it is an aknowlegment of an undeniable common ground which serves as convincing evidence of a Creator.
Here's his quote:
"The Tao, which others may call Natural Law or Traditional Morality or the First Principles of Practical Reason or the First Platitudes, is not one among a series of possible systems of value. It is the sole source of all value judgments. If it is rejected, all value is rejected. If any value is retained, it is retained. The effort to refute it and raise a new system of value in its place is self-contradictory. There has never been, and never will be, a radically new judgment of value in the history of the world. What purport to be new systems or…ideologies…all consist of fragments from the Tao itself, arbitrarily wrenched from their context in the whole and then swollen to madness in their isolation, yet still owing to the Tao and to it alone such validity as they posses."
@@IntotheWardrobe
Morality is not one of the Laws of Nature cause if it was then every animal on the planet would abide by the Laws of Morality.
Nature abhors a vacuum.
Man is the epitome of life and he has a thinking brain.
Stop thinking that mankind is so stupid that he can't conceive of moral law and be the foundation of it.
Because it’s an example that exists cross culturally, which is an argument made by Saint Thomas Aquinas.
The point of theology is to study divinity, which all religions approach but can never fully articulate. This is also related to the concept of an objective monotheism as a unifying subject.
Christianity is understood by Christians as the closest approximation of the nature of this divinity.