I think its ironic that you are trashing this company for smoke and mirrors BUT you have never tested or used their product. I've used it in various ways and have been happy with its performance. I think that why it can work as a replacement for one sheet of the drywall in a double stud wall (and perform slightly better) is that it decouples the outer drywall from the wooden studs in a similar way to resilient channel. It also adds a soft deadening layer that has no conductive breaks in it. I was also happy with the way it acts like a gasket to the floor and ceiling, completley sealing them without the need for caulk. I thiink you are missing the point by suggesting that the drywall will work better, as they do totally different things, but there is no way to know for sure until some intrepid youtuber does a full head to head test comparison. Which I look forward to! Thanks for the channel...
I would love to do that. I do feel one day when things are bigger with the channel I would love to have a warehouse to just build and test, but right now I am left to using theory. Nonetheless, I do see it working similar to polyurethane foam as a spring system. However, I still stand by my point that you can get better results with cheaper materials.
@@soundproofyourstudio *_"I would love to do that. I do feel one day when things are bigger with the channel I would love to have a warehouse to just build and test, but right now I am left to using theory."_* I repeat what the other guy said, you have NOT tested it. *_"However, I still stand by my point that you can get better results with cheaper materials"_* I repeat what the other guy said, you have NOT tested it. You can talk until you weigh an ounce, several TESTS are mandatory when you review a product, the huge majority will agree with me.
You shouldn't broadcast your opinion as an expert without having tested it for your self, you are leaving yourself open to looking really really silly should your "factual opinions" not be correct
How can you call your channel 'Soundproofing Workshop' when you provide almost no credible information on how to soundproof a space? In watching this video all that seemed to be communicated was 'don't use this...' and 'don't do that...'. With this and some of your other videos you seem to want to discredit most products claimed to be best at 'soundproofing' (i.e. Rockwool and Sonopan...and probably 'Greenglue' adhesive). You don't take anything that resembles a neutral starting position and you don't present factual evidence to support your criticisms. Build soundproof spaces for testing and comparison....otherwise......shame on you!
Ouch! I do take a scientific perspective to the best of my ability. I still don’t think these products are necessary most of the time. Also, don’t believe me. This is my channel and my opinion. I am not the all seeing soundproof God. This is a space for learning and constructive criticism, not trolling like what you are doing.
Have you looked at his other videos? I haven’t seen loads of them but I’ve already seen several showing exactly how to soundproof a space. He’s saying that these “sound proofing” products claim to do things they don’t/can’t. This is also mostly aimed at people trying to sound proof studios. He even gives the basics at about the 14 minute mark in this video.
I have my carts filled on Lowe's and HomeDepot sites. And I contacted local SONOpan distributor to get the product. But then YT showed me the video. Now... It seems I have to watch more videos on the channel. I can confirm your assumption that you made a good point in the video. I am staying tuned.
Dude. This is the video I’ve been waiting for. I saw a video awhile ago with a guy who used these and the fact that no data is advertised by the company is weird. I thought it was a gimmick then, glad to know I’m not alone. I think the worst part is dubbing it “soundproofing” was my first red flag. Thank you for the information. Really enjoy your content.
Hey Kyle! Thanks for watching. Yeah I don't like calling out companies, but I honestly was pretty blown away after doing some research. I always say use whatever product you want, but I am not going to stand behind anything I don't believe in.
Wilson, I appreciate your content and expertise! I have subbed, subscribed and watch often. Low frequencies are my nightmare, especially during lawn mowing season!! Grrrr. Anyway, thanks for these videos.
My understanding of how it works, is that Sonopan sits between the drywall and studs. Being that it's a soft material, it physically isolates the drywall form the studs, simulating a double wall. The benefit is that it's cheaper and used much less valuable space than a double wall. Does it work? Maybe someone can test it. They claim an STC rating on a single wall using sonopan as double wall system. If that's true, then it's a really useful product. To soundproof bass is next level stuff. You need mass and space to do that.
Yes it might be a good layer as a spring but certainly not for mass. Other materials are mineral wool and foam. I still would not use it in place of a layer of drywall.
Sonopan does sell to a distributer in the U.S. called FullScaleAV. Not sure why they said they don't sell Sonopan in the U.S. Sonopan is in all the home depot's in Canada. They're trying to get into the Home Depot's in the U.S. sometime next year. I don't represent them, I've just done a ton of research for my future basement studio.
I don’t recommend using it, but they seem to be convincing everyone that it works wonders. Just double check test data and build decoupled walls if you use it.
Thank you for the video! I think you could achieve the same effect with double drywall. It's funny because it's marketed as if it's some unique material, but it's just a layer of wood.
That was my thinking. Although it does have great sound absorption, which could make it great for acoustic panels. It’s funny, fiberglass works the same way and is an important part of soundproofing, but you put it in the air space not on the walls.
For what you said @ 12:41 you should try to contact them again. I saw it being sold in Home Depot yesterday 4/25/24 for $34.98 3/4 4’X8’ in Long Island. So it’s officially being sold in the USA now.
I just used it on half a residential basement in an area I wanted to isolate (rental). It goes up easy, although extremely dusty to cut. It's not as heavy as drywall, but not as stiff either. I used it as instructed on one of the options for existing structure in the pamphlet, that is I decoupled existing drywall corners, creating a gap, and put it directly over the existing drywall. The instructions made clear that removing drywall might not be worth all the extra work involved. I then used resilient channel over the sonopan, then used 1/2 acoustical drywall over the resilient channels. All corners were filled with acoustic caulk. All recommended techniques were used properly. The outcome after all the work and effort? Not impressed, I can still easily hear the dog barking quite loudly, and the wifes music where one could sing along. It does nothing for impact sound above. Lower volume sounds, like tv and normal speech are muted better definitely, but for the costs (especially the acoustic drywall) it doesn't seem to be worth the effort. I'm wishing I had removed the drywall and insulated with safe and sound first... another basement room has only the safe and sound with a drop ceiling and I believe the sound transfer to upstairs is better with safe and sound only. The other half of my project I will stick to removing the drywall and insulate, and have no plans to use sonopan this time. My 10 cents.
Thanks for the sharing. Yeah, I just don’t see how it can help with soundproofing with such little mass. If you decouple with hat channels and iso clips you will get even better results. The safe in sound is more expensive so stick to the cheapest insulation possible. It all works the same.
Sonopan is not a miracle product, it is supposed to be used in conjunction with safe and sound, resilient channel and aqoustic caulking. Once all is air tight you'll get a great result. Obviously 5/8 drywall as well. Same principles, just adding an additional product.
Your results may not measure up because you made a mistake installing your layers. You put down the sonopan and then used resilient channel over it followed by the drywall. What this means is that you created a triple leaf effect. Basically two air spaces in the assembly. The small air gap created by the resilient channel will transmit sound very effectively. Your results would likely have been better if you left out the resilient channel. Better still, you should have knocked out the original drywall ceiling and filled the space with insulation. Then installed resilient channel over the joists, then the sonopan, then the drywall. 5/8ths would have been better too, with green glue between the layers. By doing this you would only have one large air cavity that sound doesn't transmit through very easily.
@@bearclaw5115 the obvious solution would be to take down ceiling and put insulation, that's the key missing here. To compensate for that he would need sonopan and green glue most likely and 5/8's drywall to make up for that missing component. 1/2" drywall does nothing for sound transmission
@SG-uj8tj exactly. R12 for walls, r20 for ceiling then sonopan then 5/8 drywall. Same with the walls. Went from hearing every step the upstairs tenant made and even when they went to the bloody bathroom. Used this on my ceiling and walls, blocks them and blocks the sound of the cars. If done correctly it works as intended.
I really enjoyed your presentation on the topic, articulated well and in depth, the why does this work backed by facts as well as comparisons/contrasts, examples to help illustrate the point. Kudos for callling out the marketing tactics too, they have been a doozy. Subbed 👍
Great video! I found your channel through the studio tour you did on another UA-cam channel as I dive into my research for soundproofing. (Amazon is delivering me the Rod Gervais book today!) Exciting times for me as I plan to move my studio into a creative space surrounded by a couple like-minded artists I really respect! I will be moving my studio to a 16'x15'3" room in a warehouse in an industrial complex this September. I have free reign to do any type of construction to the room that I please. I am a mixing and mastering engineer as well as an electronic music producer with walls of synths. I say that information because I rarely ever use my studio space for acoustic recording. The combination of being in an isolated area from residential living and not doing acoustic recordings has got me looking at solutons that are more cost effective solution for some "soundproofing" without aiming for the stars. I am grateful I found your videos because I had just learned about MLV and Sonopan in other videos and thought it might be a simpler solution than building a double wall. My situation is quite unique because I am more worried about external sound coming into my studio and interrupting my ability to work rather than me trying to isolate my sound from disturbing others. The owner of the warehouse is the Southwests main dealer and repair man for a major PA speaker manufacturer so there will be times when horn loaded PA systems are being tested on the facilities. Is a dual 5/8" drywall with r15 insulation on a single wall with no air gap enough for me to at least get some level reduction? I don't need total isolation but it would be nice to only hear a low rumble if possible. Sorry for the long post and thank you again for the awesome video!! 😊
Great analysis. Sonopan is slightly cheaper than drywall at Home Depot, so might as well use it. Unless it performs worse than drywall I don't see the problem.
Great video. Pricing is off. SONOpan at HD in Canada $30/panel. 5/8" in Canada is also $30/panel. Like your room acoustics analysis at the end. Keep it up.
You did it! I asked you about this maybe a month or two ago and you made this vid! Love that you made it happen and I’m glad I never bought SONOpan it felt super shady when I was trying to get my hands on a panel. My only critique of the vid is you say, SONOpan is voodoo which actually is a West African religion so you’re alienating your Haitian market with stuff like that and YT could view it as hate speech, its a phrase folks say so no hate here just letting ya know love your videos keep them coming I’m a fan
Ah yes, great point about using Voodoo in this manner. I didn't even think about that. It is an old fashioned and misappropriated term. I will make sure not to use it again.
Sonopan on its own doesn't work, and shouldn't be thought that it can. But when used as intended, ie, r12-r20 insulation, sonopan then drywall, it works perfectly. And it's bloody cheap, no idea why everyone is crying about it. Its 20 bucks for a 4x8
I used this to sound proof my theater room. Its hard to hear a movie playing outside since i used sonopan. And i did not decouple the wall or ceiling or use double layers of sheetrock.
There's a little physics that's somewhat ignored in soundproofing, it's regarding reflection and scattering. Normally the waves are treated like plane waves that transmit through (or are absorbed by) the material. In this case mass matters a lot (or absorption). There's also 2 components - a reflected wave (which is also mass) and refraction / scattering. Refraction happens when there's a change in density of the material. Ideally you get the wave to go parallel to the material and it never goes out, but that's basically impossible. Less ideally, they can be scattered through the sonic equivalent of lenses. I believe that's what those dimples do. It's something like egg crates but denser.
@@eldricliew6223 very interesting and makes sense. However, I think one thing I didn't like about Sonopan was the lack of acoustic testing of their product. If I remember correctly it was hard to find proof that this reflection and scattering is really doing something or not. The only way to compare would be two walls in a lab that are tested. One with sonopan and the other without. These walls would have to be soundproof assemblies too, double wall, double drywall all that jazz.
Does 2 lb. mass loaded vinyl do considerably more to reduce noise transferred between apartments compared to 1 lb? When just applied to bare walls, would a pressure self adhesive be best to remove air gaps and provide a less permanent solution than glue or drywall?
If you use Sonopan I would only do so if the mass of your wall is enough. Sonopan is a sound absorber like insulation or rockwool mineral wool. I see it as being marketed very similarly to rockwool safe n sound as a soundproof material.
I was planning to hire contractors to install SONOpan till I saw this video. Thanks for the info! I want to reduce noise from my next door neighbor. I live in a new construction townhouse and my plan was to put SONOpan on my living room in 1st flr and directly above to my BR wall connecting to my neighbor’s side. What would you recommend if not SONOpan?
Considering it works when used properly, only those who used it by itself were scammed. I agree with ine thing in the video, it should never, ever, be marketed as working by itself. I never even knew it was before seeing this video. But with insulation, sonopan and 5/8 drywall, it blocks everything that I had an issue with, and my theater set up doesn't go through the ceiling to my upstairs tenant, nor can I hear him piss at 3 in the morning now either.
@@TobiasKryze Unless you did an actual test of your situation of insulation/sonopan/drywall vs the same build without sonpan you don't know if it made a difference. You would have gotten a better reduction if you did insulation and then 2 layers of 5/8" drywall. Sonopan used in that placement will provide not much of anything at all. The wall build deisgns and they interact you need mass in that aspect of the mass. Sonopan does not add that
@jasonmartin9337 don't make assumptions. I bought the house, removed the old drywall and old tile ceiling and replaced. Also, the build before was insulation and drywall..like a normal house. Ceiling was insulation and drywall..like a normal house. That said, outlets being uncovered, light fixtures, etc also help noise travel. I've no idea what sono did to hurt you but it costs next to nothing and is incredibly dense. 20 bucks for a 4 foot by 8 foot sheet. Not exactly scamming people put of much if thats the case. Did my walls and ceiling for like 200 bucks.
So are you saying two layers of 5/8s is the same as Sonoran and one layer? I have a townhome that already has a STC of about 56 with staggered studs and 5/8s on each of our walls. Banging my head off the wall on what to do to reduce deep bass from their TV and hearing thuds.
This didn't exist when I sound proofed my HT room, I used 2 sheets of 5/8 with green glue on the inside and outside walls 1 sheet of QuietRock with green glue and 5/8 drywall.
I think you are better off. This stuff can help as a layer of insulation and it might damp as well, but it is not heavy enough to use without serious mass around it.
I have, in my theater room. Done correctly it has worked perfectly. Any questions and I can answer them. I've used it in my rental, parents house and soon to be my own house.
@burakbey1068 yes we are installing it this week actually in my own house and last house i hope lol. R20 insulation first and this putty stuff around any electrical boxes, then the sonopan then some strapping and then 5/8th drywall.
I am from Canada, and I also asked for the verified lab reports. They basically blew me off as well. They just sent be back the STC rating that was on their website. I was really not impressed.
@@andrewd5135 I can think of using 5/8" plywood with 5/8" drywall over it (for ease of finishing the walls) instead of two 5/8" drywall, but I'd be curious about the results
I couldn't finish your video, you use to too much assumptions and zero test (factual prof). Why instead of bla bla bla, don't you do a test for yourself? You are the one who is doing too much voodou here. If you want to make more mass than build a concrete wall and then do the whole covering. What this companies are trying to do is avoiding to spend too much money to build that mass that you you keep speak about it... Bla bla bla .... I advise anyone to check videos where they actually test the several products and layers. ua-cam.com/video/hFQVbSCP1Cs/v-deo.html ua-cam.com/video/SiqEvlAomvI/v-deo.html It seems too me that 3/4 of plywood is better than drywall but the mix of plywood and Sonopan is the winner mix. I know that some of this tests are not really for a music studio, but you can have an idea what those products really do (factual) without your voodou talking.
Thanks for watching. You are missing my point. You don’t need Sonoran to soundproof. Keep it simple. Save money. Get results. That is what I try to convey.
No I’m not. I’m using science and facts to state what is clearly a marketing trick. You can buy sonopan. Tell me I am wrong. I’m always happy to learn and grow, but I am not guessing. Far from it.
@@soundproofyourstudio Sorry brother you can’t just state your opinion without doing any testing. Thats just not how it works. You’re presenting a hypothesis with no evidence to prove it. In my ‘opinion’ you are probably right but the real answer should have been “I think it won’t work but I don’t know until I test it”. You said many times we don’t know how it will preform at low frequencies then conclude it won’t work. The missing gap here is data. The true answer is we don’t know since even they didn’t provide data. Using facts to try take a good guess just isn’t good enough. Please take this as constructive criticism for a otherwise well put together video.
you priced sonopan in CAD and drywall in USD. not fair I just want to not hear my neighbours watching TV, I think sonopan will be good for that and for DIY I like that it's way lighter to lift. I don't own a bass drum.
All good points, the audio market has always been rife with snake oil. However, I think sonopan has its place. If you factor in weight, cost and ease of use; A sheet of Sonopan costs the same as a sheet of 5/8 drywall and weighs less, so it still might have a place in your system if you are trying to add to an existing system to keep the weight down. Say for instance on an engineered ceiling or a retrofit on a pre-existing wall or something. I’d absolutely love to see some low frequency tests, as I’m building a studio currently and I need to stop all sound 100% from leaking into the house from an attached garage. Drums are the killer.
@@soundproofyourstudio yeah that’s probably where I’ll end up. There is an existing insulated wall, so if I do another 2x6 insulated wall with staggered studs, with two layers 5/8ths on Sound channel. That should kill 90%. Then a layer of brick or concrete to finish it.
Your channel is great! You and @AcousticsInsider give an easy but in depth view into soundproofing and room acoustics. Ever thought of doing something together? You both got a similar philosophy on how to "teach science", I think...
Just out of curiosity, what would you recommend for a whisper booth/vocal booth for voice over work? Im in a rented space so I can't soundproof my room, so building a vocal booth (3x4x8 ft.) seems like a viable option.
MSL is a manufacturing company. The company I work for buys tons of their fiber boards which are a lot like SONOpan boards because they're made of recycled wood pulp except they lack the green colouration and indents. They probably have a contract with SONOpan because they have the machines to produce the product.
hey Kyle! I'm looking to soundproof a double brick wall with my neighbours which I can easily hear their TV. Due to space issues, I cannot build a 2x4 wall and I can only put 1 layer of... something. Should I invest in a Sonopan and 1/4" dry wall on top or simply glue 5/8 drywall instead? Thank you for your answer, love your content!
@@soundproofyourstudioThank you for your response. I'm located in Canada and 5/8 drywall and Sonopan is very close in price. Would you still go with 5/8 drywall? Quiet Rock is not available here.
I can't really build a double wall on a exterior wall. How would you build an exterior home wall to soundproof against a neighbour drumming? Great channel.
FREE Soundproofing Workshop: www.soundproofyourstudio.com/workshop
I think its ironic that you are trashing this company for smoke and mirrors BUT you have never tested or used their product. I've used it in various ways and have been happy with its performance. I think that why it can work as a replacement for one sheet of the drywall in a double stud wall (and perform slightly better) is that it decouples the outer drywall from the wooden studs in a similar way to resilient channel. It also adds a soft deadening layer that has no conductive breaks in it. I was also happy with the way it acts like a gasket to the floor and ceiling, completley sealing them without the need for caulk. I thiink you are missing the point by suggesting that the drywall will work better, as they do totally different things, but there is no way to know for sure until some intrepid youtuber does a full head to head test comparison. Which I look forward to! Thanks for the channel...
I would love to do that. I do feel one day when things are bigger with the channel I would love to have a warehouse to just build and test, but right now I am left to using theory. Nonetheless, I do see it working similar to polyurethane foam as a spring system. However, I still stand by my point that you can get better results with cheaper materials.
@@soundproofyourstudio
*_"I would love to do that. I do feel one day when things are bigger with the channel I would love to have a warehouse to just build and test, but right now I am left to using theory."_*
I repeat what the other guy said, you have NOT tested it.
*_"However, I still stand by my point that you can get better results with cheaper materials"_*
I repeat what the other guy said, you have NOT tested it.
You can talk until you weigh an ounce, several TESTS are mandatory when you review a product, the huge majority will agree with me.
You shouldn't broadcast your opinion as an expert without having tested it for your self, you are leaving yourself open to looking really really silly should your "factual opinions" not be correct
How can you call your channel 'Soundproofing Workshop' when you provide almost no credible information on how to soundproof a space? In watching this video all that seemed to be communicated was 'don't use this...' and 'don't do that...'. With this and some of your other videos you seem to want to discredit most products claimed to be best at 'soundproofing' (i.e. Rockwool and Sonopan...and probably 'Greenglue' adhesive). You don't take anything that resembles a neutral starting position and you don't present factual evidence to support your criticisms. Build soundproof spaces for testing and comparison....otherwise......shame on you!
Ouch! I do take a scientific perspective to the best of my ability. I still don’t think these products are necessary most of the time. Also, don’t believe me. This is my channel and my opinion. I am not the all seeing soundproof God. This is a space for learning and constructive criticism, not trolling like what you are doing.
Have you looked at his other videos? I haven’t seen loads of them but I’ve already seen several showing exactly how to soundproof a space. He’s saying that these “sound proofing” products claim to do things they don’t/can’t. This is also mostly aimed at people trying to sound proof studios. He even gives the basics at about the 14 minute mark in this video.
I have my carts filled on Lowe's and HomeDepot sites. And I contacted local SONOpan distributor to get the product. But then YT showed me the video. Now... It seems I have to watch more videos on the channel. I can confirm your assumption that you made a good point in the video. I am staying tuned.
Dude. This is the video I’ve been waiting for. I saw a video awhile ago with a guy who used these and the fact that no data is advertised by the company is weird. I thought it was a gimmick then, glad to know I’m not alone.
I think the worst part is dubbing it “soundproofing” was my first red flag.
Thank you for the information. Really enjoy your content.
Hey Kyle! Thanks for watching. Yeah I don't like calling out companies, but I honestly was pretty blown away after doing some research. I always say use whatever product you want, but I am not going to stand behind anything I don't believe in.
Wilson, I appreciate your content and expertise! I have subbed, subscribed and watch often. Low frequencies are my nightmare, especially during lawn mowing season!! Grrrr. Anyway, thanks for these videos.
My understanding of how it works, is that Sonopan sits between the drywall and studs. Being that it's a soft material, it physically isolates the drywall form the studs, simulating a double wall. The benefit is that it's cheaper and used much less valuable space than a double wall. Does it work? Maybe someone can test it. They claim an STC rating on a single wall using sonopan as double wall system. If that's true, then it's a really useful product.
To soundproof bass is next level stuff. You need mass and space to do that.
Yes it might be a good layer as a spring but certainly not for mass. Other materials are mineral wool and foam. I still would not use it in place of a layer of drywall.
Sonopan does sell to a distributer in the U.S. called FullScaleAV. Not sure why they said they don't sell Sonopan in the U.S. Sonopan is in all the home depot's in Canada. They're trying to get into the Home Depot's in the U.S. sometime next year. I don't represent them, I've just done a ton of research for my future basement studio.
I don’t recommend using it, but they seem to be convincing everyone that it works wonders. Just double check test data and build decoupled walls if you use it.
Plain and simple. Thanks for the content. Marketing in the hands of inmoral people is worst than cancer.
Thank you for the video! I think you could achieve the same effect with double drywall. It's funny because it's marketed as if it's some unique material, but it's just a layer of wood.
That was my thinking. Although it does have great sound absorption, which could make it great for acoustic panels. It’s funny, fiberglass works the same way and is an important part of soundproofing, but you put it in the air space not on the walls.
For what you said @ 12:41 you should try to contact them again. I saw it being sold in Home Depot yesterday 4/25/24 for $34.98 3/4 4’X8’ in Long Island. So it’s officially being sold in the USA now.
Oh interesting. I am honestly more interested in using it as acoustic panels.
I just used it on half a residential basement in an area I wanted to isolate (rental). It goes up easy, although extremely dusty to cut. It's not as heavy as drywall, but not as stiff either. I used it as instructed on one of the options for existing structure in the pamphlet, that is I decoupled existing drywall corners, creating a gap, and put it directly over the existing drywall. The instructions made clear that removing drywall might not be worth all the extra work involved. I then used resilient channel over the sonopan, then used 1/2 acoustical drywall over the resilient channels. All corners were filled with acoustic caulk. All recommended techniques were used properly. The outcome after all the work and effort? Not impressed,
I can still easily hear the dog barking quite loudly, and the wifes music where one could sing along. It does nothing for impact sound above. Lower volume sounds, like tv and normal speech are muted better definitely, but for the costs (especially the acoustic drywall) it doesn't seem to be worth the effort. I'm wishing I had removed the drywall and insulated with safe and sound first... another basement room has only the safe and sound with a drop ceiling and I believe the sound transfer to upstairs is better with safe and sound only. The other half of my project I will stick to removing the drywall and insulate, and have no plans to use sonopan this time. My 10 cents.
Thanks for the sharing. Yeah, I just don’t see how it can help with soundproofing with such little mass. If you decouple with hat channels and iso clips you will get even better results. The safe in sound is more expensive so stick to the cheapest insulation possible. It all works the same.
Sonopan is not a miracle product, it is supposed to be used in conjunction with safe and sound, resilient channel and aqoustic caulking. Once all is air tight you'll get a great result. Obviously 5/8 drywall as well. Same principles, just adding an additional product.
Your results may not measure up because you made a mistake installing your layers. You put down the sonopan and then used resilient channel over it followed by the drywall. What this means is that you created a triple leaf effect. Basically two air spaces in the assembly. The small air gap created by the resilient channel will transmit sound very effectively. Your results would likely have been better if you left out the resilient channel. Better still, you should have knocked out the original drywall ceiling and filled the space with insulation. Then installed resilient channel over the joists, then the sonopan, then the drywall. 5/8ths would have been better too, with green glue between the layers. By doing this you would only have one large air cavity that sound doesn't transmit through very easily.
@@bearclaw5115 the obvious solution would be to take down ceiling and put insulation, that's the key missing here. To compensate for that he would need sonopan and green glue most likely and 5/8's drywall to make up for that missing component. 1/2" drywall does nothing for sound transmission
@SG-uj8tj exactly. R12 for walls, r20 for ceiling then sonopan then 5/8 drywall. Same with the walls.
Went from hearing every step the upstairs tenant made and even when they went to the bloody bathroom. Used this on my ceiling and walls, blocks them and blocks the sound of the cars. If done correctly it works as intended.
I really enjoyed your presentation on the topic, articulated well and in depth, the why does this work backed by facts as well as comparisons/contrasts, examples to help illustrate the point. Kudos for callling out the marketing tactics too, they have been a doozy. Subbed 👍
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great video! I found your channel through the studio tour you did on another UA-cam channel as I dive into my research for soundproofing. (Amazon is delivering me the Rod Gervais book today!)
Exciting times for me as I plan to move my studio into a creative space surrounded by a couple like-minded artists I really respect! I will be moving my studio to a 16'x15'3" room in a warehouse in an industrial complex this September. I have free reign to do any type of construction to the room that I please. I am a mixing and mastering engineer as well as an electronic music producer with walls of synths. I say that information because I rarely ever use my studio space for acoustic recording.
The combination of being in an isolated area from residential living and not doing acoustic recordings has got me looking at solutons that are more cost effective solution for some "soundproofing" without aiming for the stars.
I am grateful I found your videos because I had just learned about MLV and Sonopan in other videos and thought it might be a simpler solution than building a double wall.
My situation is quite unique because I am more worried about external sound coming into my studio and interrupting my ability to work rather than me trying to isolate my sound from disturbing others. The owner of the warehouse is the Southwests main dealer and repair man for a major PA speaker manufacturer so there will be times when horn loaded PA systems are being tested on the facilities.
Is a dual 5/8" drywall with r15 insulation on a single wall with no air gap enough for me to at least get some level reduction? I don't need total isolation but it would be nice to only hear a low rumble if possible.
Sorry for the long post and thank you again for the awesome video!! 😊
Best to decouple the drywall from the wall
Great analysis. Sonopan is slightly cheaper than drywall at Home Depot, so might as well use it. Unless it performs worse than drywall I don't see the problem.
It does because it has very little mass. It is essentially insulation board with great marketing in my opinion.
It's not, he literally showed you that sono pan is almost twice the price of drywall.
Great video. Pricing is off. SONOpan at HD in Canada $30/panel. 5/8" in Canada is also $30/panel. Like your room acoustics analysis at the end. Keep it up.
Wow the 5/8 is way more expensive in Canada
You did it! I asked you about this maybe a month or two ago and you made this vid! Love that you made it happen and I’m glad I never bought SONOpan it felt super shady when I was trying to get my hands on a panel. My only critique of the vid is you say, SONOpan is voodoo which actually is a West African religion so you’re alienating your Haitian market with stuff like that and YT could view it as hate speech, its a phrase folks say so no hate here just letting ya know love your videos keep them coming I’m a fan
Ah yes, great point about using Voodoo in this manner. I didn't even think about that. It is an old fashioned and misappropriated term. I will make sure not to use it again.
Sonopan on its own doesn't work, and shouldn't be thought that it can. But when used as intended, ie, r12-r20 insulation, sonopan then drywall, it works perfectly. And it's bloody cheap, no idea why everyone is crying about it. Its 20 bucks for a 4x8
I used this to sound proof my theater room. Its hard to hear a movie playing outside since i used sonopan. And i did not decouple the wall or ceiling or use double layers of sheetrock.
Glad it worked, it still doesn’t make sense to me how it works from a physics stand point.
There's a little physics that's somewhat ignored in soundproofing, it's regarding reflection and scattering.
Normally the waves are treated like plane waves that transmit through (or are absorbed by) the material. In this case mass matters a lot (or absorption).
There's also 2 components - a reflected wave (which is also mass) and refraction / scattering.
Refraction happens when there's a change in density of the material. Ideally you get the wave to go parallel to the material and it never goes out, but that's basically impossible.
Less ideally, they can be scattered through the sonic equivalent of lenses. I believe that's what those dimples do. It's something like egg crates but denser.
@@eldricliew6223 very interesting and makes sense. However, I think one thing I didn't like about Sonopan was the lack of acoustic testing of their product. If I remember correctly it was hard to find proof that this reflection and scattering is really doing something or not. The only way to compare would be two walls in a lab that are tested. One with sonopan and the other without. These walls would have to be soundproof assemblies too, double wall, double drywall all that jazz.
@@soundproofyourstudio. Agree. That's just theory, in practice everything needs to be tested.
Does 2 lb. mass loaded vinyl do considerably more to reduce noise transferred between apartments compared to 1 lb? When just applied to bare walls, would a pressure self adhesive be best to remove air gaps and provide a less permanent solution than glue or drywall?
2lb is better but adding more mass using drywall is better or a combo of MLV and drywall.
Thanks for this video. What do you recommend for soundproofing Floors?
Concrete
that's funny but not very useful, what if I can't pour concrete on my old wooden floors?@@soundproofyourstudio
So now that drywall prices have skyrocketed and sonopan costs the same as 5/8 drywall, does this change anything?
If you use Sonopan I would only do so if the mass of your wall is enough. Sonopan is a sound absorber like insulation or rockwool mineral wool. I see it as being marketed very similarly to rockwool safe n sound as a soundproof material.
Have you seen the homerenovision video?
No I have not
@@soundproofyourstudio he goes into some of the stuff you do but he end up with a different conclusion. I highly recommend you check it out
I was planning to hire contractors to install SONOpan till I saw this video. Thanks for the info! I want to reduce noise from my next door neighbor. I live in a new construction townhouse and my plan was to put SONOpan on my living room in 1st flr and directly above to my BR wall connecting to my neighbor’s side. What would you recommend if not SONOpan?
You could look at quietrock or a similar product. I would recommend two layers of 5/8 inch drywall. Ideally you would decouple the walls too.
I used it for my theater room and yes there are no numbers to look at but subjectively it works. My theater room is a 7.2.4 system.
I'm wondering if SONOpan would be good for diy acoustic panels? Seeing how it's a lot cheaper than Rockwool insulation, at least here in Canada.
Yeah it would be interesting to try out. You want to look at the absorption coefficient
@@soundproofyourstudio Thanks I will. Seems like a lighter and thinner acoustic panel option.
Good video, so many people have been scammed by this
Glad you enjoyed it.
Considering it works when used properly, only those who used it by itself were scammed. I agree with ine thing in the video, it should never, ever, be marketed as working by itself. I never even knew it was before seeing this video. But with insulation, sonopan and 5/8 drywall, it blocks everything that I had an issue with, and my theater set up doesn't go through the ceiling to my upstairs tenant, nor can I hear him piss at 3 in the morning now either.
@@TobiasKryze Unless you did an actual test of your situation of insulation/sonopan/drywall vs the same build without sonpan you don't know if it made a difference. You would have gotten a better reduction if you did insulation and then 2 layers of 5/8" drywall. Sonopan used in that placement will provide not much of anything at all. The wall build deisgns and they interact you need mass in that aspect of the mass. Sonopan does not add that
@jasonmartin9337 don't make assumptions.
I bought the house, removed the old drywall and old tile ceiling and replaced.
Also, the build before was insulation and drywall..like a normal house.
Ceiling was insulation and drywall..like a normal house.
That said, outlets being uncovered, light fixtures, etc also help noise travel.
I've no idea what sono did to hurt you but it costs next to nothing and is incredibly dense. 20 bucks for a 4 foot by 8 foot sheet. Not exactly scamming people put of much if thats the case.
Did my walls and ceiling for like 200 bucks.
Bravo sir, I say BRAVO!
Thanks for watching
So what do you recommend instead. I was going to use Rockwool safe and sound with sonopan
Keep watching my videos, especially on how to build a wall. It is not about the insulation, but the whole system.
So are you saying two layers of 5/8s is the same as Sonoran and one layer?
I have a townhome that already has a STC of about 56 with staggered studs and 5/8s on each of our walls. Banging my head off the wall on what to do to reduce deep bass from their TV and hearing thuds.
I am saying I wouldnt recommend Sonopan. Mass and decoupling are what you need.
You need resilient channels
This didn't exist when I sound proofed my HT room, I used 2 sheets of 5/8 with green glue on the inside and outside walls 1 sheet of QuietRock with green glue and 5/8 drywall.
I think you are better off. This stuff can help as a layer of insulation and it might damp as well, but it is not heavy enough to use without serious mass around it.
Did you test it ?
No I have not used it
I have, in my theater room. Done correctly it has worked perfectly. Any questions and I can answer them. I've used it in my rental, parents house and soon to be my own house.
@@TobiasKryzehow did you use it? Can you explain the other materials were used?
@burakbey1068 yes we are installing it this week actually in my own house and last house i hope lol.
R20 insulation first and this putty stuff around any electrical boxes, then the sonopan then some strapping and then 5/8th drywall.
I am from Canada, and I also asked for the verified lab reports. They basically blew me off as well. They just sent be back the STC rating that was on their website. I was really not impressed.
Seems a little fishy to me
Great content.
Thanks for watching!
Since mass is what's important, wouldn't using plywood instead of drywall offer better results? (would be more expensive for sure though ahah)
Someone needs to test with low frequencies
@@andrewd5135 I can think of using 5/8" plywood with 5/8" drywall over it (for ease of finishing the walls) instead of two 5/8" drywall, but I'd be curious about the results
If it has more mass you will get better results.
I couldn't finish your video, you use to too much assumptions and zero test (factual prof).
Why instead of bla bla bla, don't you do a test for yourself?
You are the one who is doing too much voodou here.
If you want to make more mass than build a concrete wall and then do the whole covering. What this companies are trying to do is avoiding to spend too much money to build that mass that you you keep speak about it... Bla bla bla ....
I advise anyone to check videos where they actually test the several products and layers.
ua-cam.com/video/hFQVbSCP1Cs/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/SiqEvlAomvI/v-deo.html
It seems too me that 3/4 of plywood is better than drywall but the mix of plywood and Sonopan is the winner mix.
I know that some of this tests are not really for a music studio, but you can have an idea what those products really do (factual) without your voodou talking.
Thanks for watching. You are missing my point. You don’t need Sonoran to soundproof. Keep it simple. Save money. Get results. That is what I try to convey.
Jesus Christ. I barely have enough space in my basement to make walls that are twice as thick lol
Thanks for watching
I agree with ya!... lol
Dude you’re basically just guessing 😂
No I’m not. I’m using science and facts to state what is clearly a marketing trick. You can buy sonopan. Tell me I am wrong. I’m always happy to learn and grow, but I am not guessing. Far from it.
@@soundproofyourstudio Sorry brother you can’t just state your opinion without doing any testing. Thats just not how it works. You’re presenting a hypothesis with no evidence to prove it. In my ‘opinion’ you are probably right but the real answer should have been “I think it won’t work but I don’t know until I test it”. You said many times we don’t know how it will preform at low frequencies then conclude it won’t work. The missing gap here is data. The true answer is we don’t know since even they didn’t provide data. Using facts to try take a good guess just isn’t good enough. Please take this as constructive criticism for a otherwise well put together video.
you priced sonopan in CAD and drywall in USD. not fair
I just want to not hear my neighbours watching TV, I think sonopan will be good for that and for DIY I like that it's way lighter to lift. I don't own a bass drum.
You compared the Canadian price of Sonopan vs the U.S. price for 5/8 drywall. 5/8 drywall is $34 at Home Depot Canada.
Gotcha fair point
Thank you! I fell for their nonsense here in the UK with high levels of FOMO🤣 I'll get back to reality
Glad it helped
It doesn't matter if it's good for soundproofing because it's not available in the U.S.
True
Recycled wood with wood binders... sounds like plywood.
Yeah, but it's green. Which means it's different. 🤦♂️
Yeah I haven’t figured out how it stops sound
All good points, the audio market has always been rife with snake oil. However, I think sonopan has its place. If you factor in weight, cost and ease of use; A sheet of Sonopan costs the same as a sheet of 5/8 drywall and weighs less, so it still might have a place in your system if you are trying to add to an existing system to keep the weight down. Say for instance on an engineered ceiling or a retrofit on a pre-existing wall or something.
I’d absolutely love to see some low frequency tests, as I’m building a studio currently and I need to stop all sound 100% from leaking into the house from an attached garage. Drums are the killer.
A solid concrete wall would do the trick! Sonoran might be great for acoustic treatment.
@@soundproofyourstudio yeah that’s probably where I’ll end up. There is an existing insulated wall, so if I do another 2x6 insulated wall with staggered studs, with two layers 5/8ths on Sound channel. That should kill 90%. Then a layer of brick or concrete to finish it.
Your channel is great! You and @AcousticsInsider give an easy but in depth view into soundproofing and room acoustics. Ever thought of doing something together? You both got a similar philosophy on how to "teach science", I think...
Great suggestion! Yes I have and will try reaching out to Jesco
Just out of curiosity, what would you recommend for a whisper booth/vocal booth for voice over work? Im in a rented space so I can't soundproof my room, so building a vocal booth (3x4x8 ft.) seems like a viable option.
I will have to do some research on those. Keep an eye out for a video in early June.
MSL is a manufacturing company. The company I work for buys tons of their fiber boards which are a lot like SONOpan boards because they're made of recycled wood pulp except they lack the green colouration and indents. They probably have a contract with SONOpan because they have the machines to produce the product.
Am I right that Sonoran is a product manufactured by MSL?
@@soundproofyourstudio as far as i know, yes.
hey Kyle! I'm looking to soundproof a double brick wall with my neighbours which I can easily hear their TV. Due to space issues, I cannot build a 2x4 wall and I can only put 1 layer of... something. Should I invest in a Sonopan and 1/4" dry wall on top or simply glue 5/8 drywall instead? Thank you for your answer, love your content!
I would just go for 5/8 drywall, but no guarantees it will be enough. You could also try quiet rock since you are short on space.
@@soundproofyourstudioThank you for your response. I'm located in Canada and 5/8 drywall and Sonopan is very close in price. Would you still go with 5/8 drywall? Quiet Rock is not available here.
Why don't you try something like MLV if you're short on space? I'm also having issues with my neighbors 😕
I can't really build a double wall on a exterior wall. How would you build an exterior home wall to soundproof against a neighbour drumming? Great channel.
You would keep the exterior and decouple your interior wall. Sound like the drummer should watch this channel.
That’s messed up from his part. I’m a drummer and I’m the one trying to reduce noise for my neighbors. It shouldn’t be the other way around.
Nice, thanks for the vid!
No problem!