@Damsen The thing is tho they dont want to incentivize the use of traditional, there is a reason when u started the beta it automatically put u on modern. They want you to use modern and is the way they see the future of their game.
@damsen978 Daigo in his play sessions played people on modern, and he fell to some of the Modern traps, you know how many times? once. He adapted to modern control shenanigans in one fight. Top players aren't top just because they do qcf,qcf very fast. Modern or not top players gonna keep being top and scrubs will keep being scrubs. The only ones they might suffer are the middle ranks, the ones that because can easily beat bottom of the bottom of the barrel players think their shit doesn't smell, those are the ones that gonna cry foul when they lose to someone using modern.
@@xeno5384 as soon as they make it so modern does same damage everyone will switch and classic players will be mad and they might loose hard core fans who rage when fighting games are made more new gamer friendly. Calling it now a player is gonna a major with modern and everyone will rage
All I'm saying is viewership gonna tank if dudes just be standing there reacting with 1 button. Gonna make things stale to watch. Imagine evo moment #37 but daigo just held parry.. think the whole convention would have gone crazy like they did?
How good modern controls are seems to depend on what character you are playing. Chun-Li for example loses her entire stance moveset. QCB is used by both Hasanshu and stance cancel, in modern controls QCB + button gives Hasanshu. I guess it avoids having to assign one type of stance buttons to the actual buttons and the other to assist + button. The thing is stance canceling is reasonably important for Chun's (early) optimal combo routes, so I think not having that hurts her a lot. That being said modern seems to hurt Chun the most of any character so far.
Hilarious that I didn’t notice I was missing inputs until I played against another Chun and went to check Classic movesets after the matches. Honestly made me cry
I'm just now getting into street fighter and she was gonna be my main. I've been wondering if modern or classic is better but by this comment I feel like I should 100% choose classic moving forward
@@Gerud0 Plus if you get over the learning hurdle for playing in classic (since you're a newcomer & I'm saying this not knowing at all how much fighting game experience you have in general), you'll really be able to do a lot more in general. It'll honestly feel amazing being able to do all these different things you otherwise couldn't do in modern. Chun-Li has always been my main in Street Fighter & I can say for sure that once you get the hang of her she is amazing.
All charge characters are also super bad in modern because you still have to charge the exact same, but you still lose tons of good stuff for the characters, so the very very little you gain is offset by what you lose, and the hard parts of the character type in the first place still exists entirely
Those players played really well and made some smart decisions! I noticed the Luke had trouble with buttons in neutral and mostly relied on sandblast to protect his space to avoid getting punished. Wonder if it has to do with the moves and the fact that the assist button has to be held on the fly to get the "correct" move?
That's the modern trade off. For the onebutton specials you lose half your buttons, which can and will make or break a match. You just have to adapt and deal with the new restriction since you've gained so much elsewhere.
@@shirakani Yeah that's what I was thinking too. The trade off becomes really apaprent when you watch Modern users play. Haha, I wish people would just watch the match before complaining, but oh well.
@@demidevilqueen I actually do like to watch how Modern players deal with the trade off... Losing half your buttons is a lot harder than most realize and in this example Luke is supposedly one of the 'better' characters in Modern. Capcom definitely have a very hard task ahead of them balancing the viability of Modern vs Classic but if they can do it, then it'll benefit everyone as a whole as this sort of evolution of FG's is required for the genre to go past being a niche thing that only certain people can play.
@@shirakani Like I mentioned, just add the special and assist button to the classic mode, this way the players can keep the benefits from the both world.
They sacrifice optimal combos and some command normals but not gonna lie the ability to have instant reversals and been able to punish with super on reaction is really tempting.
I played modern controls through the beta and to be honest the only character I liked it on was Chun Li and Guile. I guess it will be good on Zangief too. But I am determined this game to learn Dhalsim properly.
Most character combos are easy to learn except for Dhalsim and Akuma, I welcome Modern Controls so I can pull off the combos I want now with minimal mistakes.
@@vendictawhitford488 combos aren't the advantage of modern, not really. The best thing is not showing buffering in neutral. If your character isn't crouching before throwing out a hadoken, your opponent has less time to react. You also get more reaction time, such as if you get jumped on. In actual combos, you want to do the motion input to maximise your damage.
If the games moving on from classic controls I understand but for me it means changing what I feel in love with and I don't really like that. To me it's not street fighter if there's no dp motions.
@@NeverToBeSeenAgain Sure, but do we really want everyone to start playing with ''this'' because it's more optimal? Modern control are less expressive, offer less control, are less kinetic and fun to use (imho), offer less variety in play style and execution, it lowers the skill ceiling... it will make the game more accessible but leave less room for mindgames and impressive plays. Having access to it doesn't make it a good thing for me, because if Modern is the only way to be competitive at this game, then I'd rather not play.
@@Psil0 oh yea I'm not saying its a good thing, but that is why there is less pushback. I'm still on the fence until I see more play at the top level because it does have its pros and cons, just gotta see if its balanced or not. I do think it opens the door for Capcom to do interesting things with balance because they could swap out moves in a characters modern moveset to change their balance.
aint no way im ever gonna super punish neutral drive rush like that on classic. also jamie ex palm for the otg in corner? im gonna have to remember that
0:00 The takeaway here isn't even that "he reacted". The most important thing to know here is that he had the luxury of doing _anything he wanted,_ with _zero_ mental stack, because "reacting" to a punish opportunity was a literal button press away. Know what would have happened if he'd had to spend the normal 15 frames inputting that super? Yes: He would have gotten hit instead. This will come to a head eventually. The game is _not_ balanced for this. Worst case scenario is Capcom says f it and adds 1-buttons to Classic Controls.
@sturdyelement You do not understand the game or its nuance. IT has nothing to do with boomer controls, the issue is the game is designed around boomer controls fundamentally. You need to balance for both control archetypes and execution should be rewarded. Even ryu in ssbu has quarter circle inputs that gets rewarded. Also walking up and doing these commands is difficult to do without misinputting. The game is designed around this.
@sturdyelement modern is supposed to remove inputs so newcomers who cant get a grip on that mechanic dont feel overwhelmed. the problem is they also change specials and supers so theres no delay. the pros are already starting to realize they have to use this. why is this a problem then? because modern is also packaged with a negative thats meant to balance out the ease of use: you lose normals versatility. this doesnt help. removing the delay for inputting specials is way more important than a couple of neutral options. but the reduced moveset is still going to make the game more boring to watch. and like the other guy said already, the game isnt balanced for instant supers, meaning offensive options will be shut down by the threat of instant punishes, making things even more boring. its a fn mess tbh
@sturdyelement and if people don't like it and the game dies then capcom will have to get over it and maybe focus on stuff the casuals actually want which is more fair monetization
I'm a classic Luke and pull of lvl 3 supers like that all the time. The modern player read Justin and was prepared to react with super most likely and it is very possible to do that on classic if you have the read and you're just waiting for them to run into you or DI or w/e
It'll be interesting to see if modern controls will be degenerate at high levels or not. Right now, I feel like the influencer types might not want to weigh in too strongly on the matter in order to not alienate Capcom. Time will tell.
This has potential to create a Strive situation where the identity the series once had, and it's fans, are completely alienated for the hopes of mass appeal. A risk with deep and extreme downsides. They're relying on all the other mechanics and content of the game to distract. If SFV had this, the franchise would've been killed there and then.
@@riffcrypt8438 Except this is SF and has a much easier time actually reaching out to a wider player base. Guilty Gear isn't in the same league in this particular case (Not saying it's not a good series). Have you played on Modern Controls yet? It didn't remove the games identity at all.
Nice combos! Do you tap forward x 2 for each drive rush or how would you recommend for consistency? I drop the drive rush combos more than normal combos :/
weird question, when Jamie is drunk with his hair down, his upper body sways when he moves backwards. Does this change his upper hitbox, making you need that little bit of extra space to hit?
Modern control Luke doesn’t give him perfect and doesn’t do drive rush combos. You have to use the auto button to get the confirm and then you release it at certain times to manually input moves to get optimal combo
Hit confirm and option select are problems. Much worse than faster reactions. It changes how you approach the matches. Maybe because of my scrub level, but I think it changes the meta too much. I feel like I´m fighting against modern controls instead of the player.
Modern controls are completely braindead. Any twitch of the opponent can be punished with instant super. No buffering needed. Only one input frame to get the startup frames going. Modern is broken and too many do not realize it..
People are so focused on the damage nerf (that is much smaller than people realise and can also be bypassed with manual inputs) and just ignore what other implications it could have for the game. I think nerfing the damage on normal attacks too will go a long way to solving it.
@@evilweevle Ironically, the damage in modern is actually higher than in classic. 1. Most of the supers executed in classic will be hit confirmed with prior strings. And the scaling for supers at the end of a combo is much higher than the damage penalty for raw supers executed in modern. There will only be rare occasions in classic where a raw super will connect because you have to buffer it or executing it on reaction will limit the usability to a smaller range of use-cases. 2. Substitution of supers in classic for a special move does not result in a much lower overall damage. 3. Modern does not restrict you to modern shortcuts. You can still do the motion and deal the same damage. 4. Modern gives additions options to dump meter resulting in less waste. 5. The threat of an instant raw super or easy dp reduces the opponents' options drastically. => Allows the modern player to play more offensively. => More damage.
@@darkchild130 You always have to sacrifice a number of moves in modern. Some normals entirely. Some can only be used when pressing the assist button or after prior use of other normals.
As a new fighter game player, I am really struggling with enjoying how Modern Controls are. I am encountering a problem I am not seeing anyone actually talk about, and that's how it punishes people who actually want to spend the time to learn Classic Controls. I have played against other players very few times, and every single match they have been using Modern Controls. This is where the problem comes in, because I am using Classic, I want to actually fully learn the game. Everyone I have gone against has had no issue whatsoever throwing combos out, and I know it's only because they are using the Modern Control scheme. I however don't have the luxury of just spamming the "do combos" button, and actually have to time my inputs. The existence of Modern Controls, a control scheme that was supposed to make it easier for newer players to pick up the game, is actually punishing for people who actually want to learn the game. I am still learning the muscle memory to execute 10+ different key strokes to make a combo happen, everyone I have played against has only really had to use 4 different keystrokes to make the combo happen. I wish I could opt out of playing against Modern users as it's very unfair that a newer player who is using Classic has to actually learn what to do, whereas a newer playing using Modern doesn't. It isn't a case of higher level players already having experience with fighters and knowing how the game works. This is a new player with a clear advantage against a new player who has to actually learn the inputs. Edit: I feel I should mention also, I have seen the argument that "uHm It'S bAlAnCeD because Modern deals 20% less damage !!1!" Or "it's balanced because when using modern you don't have access to the full moveset!1!" However this isn't enough. 20% less damage isn't enough compared to how easy it makes the game. A super easy to execute 15-20 hit combo that only does 20% less damage is always better than a difficult to execute 15-20 hit combo that does full damage. 20% less damage on a whole combo that happens instantly isn't anywhere near as strong of a downside as some people think.
I play on Pad and classic is a BITCH to use. I feel like I’m fighting the controls especially on World Tour when I try to use Manon’s half circle back command grab. Modern controls allows me to play better without dealing with the complications from screwing up my inputs.
@@ADreamingTraveler Meh... You don't get to jump on Guile players anyway. And they still have to charge. Flash kick is basically up + kick on classic. Modern doesn't improve flash kicks much. It's actually better with Shoryukens because 1 the motion is slower and 2 classic input makes you leave crounching stance and makes you hurtbox bigger for a few frames.
@Guy Montag hitbox classic is faster then modern flash kick. I am controller player that plays classic.. Only time I enjoy modern is with zangief.. Even I can win more in modern.. It's just not as fun.. I have never taken zangief ever in any game.. So me using modern on him feels like im playing him as intended.. If I were to use ryu as noder id feel off.
Im completely new to street fighter (trying to play it at a higher level) but I fell in love with street fighter 6 . Should I opt for modern or should I grind classic. At the moment Im thinking of maining chun li, Ken or Luke. Leaning towards Chun Li the most but feel like I'm naturally better with Luke
Go classic. If you want to play at a "higher level" then having part of your moveset removed is off the table. Grind classic. You'll eventually be able to do everything someone using modern can do and more.
Learn classic and modern, try to find what’s best for you, fighting games will take years to play at a high level, at least 2 years most, depending on the game and character So just grind it out and find what’s best for you and mess around with other characters if you’re interested in different archetypes likes rushdown, zoners, grapplers ect
@@jonathansuttle7678Well…not *everything* but you can get close. No matter how good a super buffer is that’s still a millisecond more than a single button tap
After that critical art, that dude was angry next round, but I love the J.W Ryu play as a Ryu player, I learn a lot from him to be top 5 in my region if you include modern controls, top 15 😆 great gameplay. 🎮👊
Very interested to see how Modern Control will affect the game, I'm very excited for it. Also love how people can just jump-in and play. 2ND JUNE COME FASTER OMG
I just bought SF6 a few days ago and even tho it’s my first SF ever and I’m on modern controls I’m so obsessed with this game I’m watching this at 1AM literally wanting to play more!!! I have downloaded and played SF5 when it came on psplus but I couldn’t get past the tutorial cause it felt like you had to be a pro from the beginning like wtf.
I get the point that modern control should grab new people but talking about losing the people who are at best mid range cant probly out skill the button of doom punishment from m. C. Players. Not really feeling it at this point
Modern mode makes everything that you used to be able to react to fast enough to block but not counter now easy to counter. Like, most people can react to an overhead in time to block it but not DP through it because by the time you react to the overhead there's not enough time to input the DP. Modern mode fixes that.
@@dillpickl4416If not a cop out because even if you practice all of that, you still have to practice your reactions and your spacing. There is still skill even with one button reactions. The solar the game is not built on input alone
@@dillpickl4416 Actually it's not a practice issue. Ryus overhead is 20 frames of start up, the average human reaction time is 15 frames, the game has been tested to have 3 frames of input lag, that gives you 2 frames to input a DP which is impossible because a DP requires three directions. Even if you take someone like Daigo's 12 frame reaction time that gives you five frames to input a DP which is ridiculous, maybe a hotbox shortcut could pull it off but it's still pretty unfeasible hence why even pro players resort to just blocking overheads.
Is Street Fighter 6 thaaat different from other Street Fighter games? Because from what i know, the more specials the opponent tries, the more opportunities for massive punishes.
Its funny how a lot of competitive fighting game players I know scoffed at simplified controls in rising thunder. Now theyre a problem and Japan bout to win Evo with them 😅
There's something satisfying about gettig the motion inputs right. With Modern controls, you loose all that kinetic feeling of connecting with your character pulling off moves.
This shit ruins the game FAR MORE than people realise. It removes a ton of depth and I sure as **** won’t be getting the game if this isn’t fixed. For one, breaking down your opponent’s defense is partly about staying in a place where they’re not comfortable buffering anti airs due to the risk of eating pikes or losing ground while doing so. Now this aspect is completely removed since they don’t need to buffer at all.
When I played my first rank match I didn't switch out of modern controls and I swear to god I couldn't do a goddamn thing. I was button mashing everything, I have no clue wtf it is and I got nearly double perfected. I was using juri Idk if that made a difference
Just play what you find fun. As someone who will only be using Classic: The only people dragging others for what control type they use, are losers. That being said, Classic is the more difficult option. It's not impossible, but you just need to spend more time practicing. But anyone can do it.
@@demidevilqueen very incorrect. How the ppl who put time and effort in the game are losers make that make sense.? The real definition of a loser is a person who wants everything easily handed to him without trying. One button supers and specials really!! How is that challenging? How can that build mental fortitude? No wonder it's so many weak minded young ppl in the world. SMH. BY your logic easy is a winner, and execution, trials, effort, to become better in due time is a loser. Your parents failed you.
If you're new to the game feel comfy playing on Modern. I think people are whining about experienced players playing on Modern to exploit it's advantages.
@@mac7114 At last someone who realize it. They literally play smash with the possibility to crouch, supers are even more easy than in smash somehow...
I think modern mode is going to replace classic mode going forward, so players focus more on developing their strategy, just like in other modern fighting games.
i'm akuma main (rip nerfed sfv akuma) so i'm curious how modern control would work on such character. first i'm going to try cammie as main, loving her style (I swear that's the real reason)
Nah. The in game matchmaking(ranked and unranked) system is not seperated, and there was no option to do so in the beta. So I think it's fair to assume official CPT events won't be seperate either. And if CPT event's won't be, it's unlikely and majort tournaments will either.
Yo Justin, dope vid. Question, can you play mvc2 with team ryu, ken, and sakura? Saw your team shoto with ryu, ken, n akuma but would like to see your approach with sakura instead of akuma.
Friends and I were having a discussion bout modern controls on our podcast. I like the inclusion and once high level/pro players showcase and teach us how to optimize modern for competition, I’m definitely using both
So based on this video, skill still beats the controll, therefore Modern doas what it is supossed to do, give peopel who need it the chance to play the game normaly, without easer input power creeping the Meta. as Experience still beats it. i think Capcom did a Good Job with this. even tho i dislike that Modern is the default controll and not classic. But other then that, Modern Seems OK.
I really think capcom goofed on this. Im not saying modern is bad, but modern and classic should have their own ranks. If you want to play mixed it should be in casual. Now i havent ran i to moderns that have been to much trouble yet, but I just find it weird they would combine it. I remember on 3ds sf4 you couldnt fight 1 button touch screens controls vs classic controls.
Modern going to ruin the game down the line. They need to a least give the option for classic control only be a choice for the players who dont want to play against modern players.
That's exactly what my thinking was. If modern controls is too good it might end up hurting the longivity of the game. Literally every single other thing about this game was done to perfection but modern controls could be what harms the game overall
Make sure to download Captor Clash now: my-cdsocial.onelink.me/oQDs/fa3j8kf3
Stuff exceedingly easy to do in Modern:
-reversal supers/specials
-shoryuken on crossups
-aerial specials almost as leaving the ground
@Damsen The thing is tho they dont want to incentivize the use of traditional, there is a reason when u started the beta it automatically put u on modern. They want you to use modern and is the way they see the future of their game.
@damsen978 Daigo in his play sessions played people on modern, and he fell to some of the Modern traps, you know how many times? once. He adapted to modern control shenanigans in one fight. Top players aren't top just because they do qcf,qcf very fast. Modern or not top players gonna keep being top and scrubs will keep being scrubs.
The only ones they might suffer are the middle ranks, the ones that because can easily beat bottom of the bottom of the barrel players think their shit doesn't smell, those are the ones that gonna cry foul when they lose to someone using modern.
@Damsen lmao the Copuim is so hard
@@Shoedini then why is the damage lower on Modern, and why don't you have access to all of your moves like you do on Classic.
@@xeno5384 as soon as they make it so modern does same damage everyone will switch and classic players will be mad and they might loose hard core fans who rage when fighting games are made more new gamer friendly. Calling it now a player is gonna a major with modern and everyone will rage
At this point, the control selection can be seen as a sort of ISM system.
Pretty much. Modern has those quick reaction supers, so you have to be mindful of it like A groove in cvs2.
Ism my ass...Fast pitch baseball vs t-ball.
All I'm saying is viewership gonna tank if dudes just be standing there reacting with 1 button. Gonna make things stale to watch. Imagine evo moment #37 but daigo just held parry.. think the whole convention would have gone crazy like they did?
@@x260houtori that moment will never be topped so why even bring it up
How good modern controls are seems to depend on what character you are playing.
Chun-Li for example loses her entire stance moveset. QCB is used by both Hasanshu and stance cancel, in modern controls QCB + button gives Hasanshu. I guess it avoids having to assign one type of stance buttons to the actual buttons and the other to assist + button. The thing is stance canceling is reasonably important for Chun's (early) optimal combo routes, so I think not having that hurts her a lot. That being said modern seems to hurt Chun the most of any character so far.
Hilarious that I didn’t notice I was missing inputs until I played against another Chun and went to check Classic movesets after the matches. Honestly made me cry
I'm just now getting into street fighter and she was gonna be my main. I've been wondering if modern or classic is better but by this comment I feel like I should 100% choose classic moving forward
@@Gerud0 Plus if you get over the learning hurdle for playing in classic (since you're a newcomer & I'm saying this not knowing at all how much fighting game experience you have in general), you'll really be able to do a lot more in general. It'll honestly feel amazing being able to do all these different things you otherwise couldn't do in modern. Chun-Li has always been my main in Street Fighter & I can say for sure that once you get the hang of her she is amazing.
yoga guy as well
All charge characters are also super bad in modern because you still have to charge the exact same, but you still lose tons of good stuff for the characters, so the very very little you gain is offset by what you lose, and the hard parts of the character type in the first place still exists entirely
Those players played really well and made some smart decisions! I noticed the Luke had trouble with buttons in neutral and mostly relied on sandblast to protect his space to avoid getting punished. Wonder if it has to do with the moves and the fact that the assist button has to be held on the fly to get the "correct" move?
That's the modern trade off. For the onebutton specials you lose half your buttons, which can and will make or break a match. You just have to adapt and deal with the new restriction since you've gained so much elsewhere.
@@shirakani Yeah that's what I was thinking too. The trade off becomes really apaprent when you watch Modern users play.
Haha, I wish people would just watch the match before complaining, but oh well.
@@demidevilqueen I actually do like to watch how Modern players deal with the trade off... Losing half your buttons is a lot harder than most realize and in this example Luke is supposedly one of the 'better' characters in Modern.
Capcom definitely have a very hard task ahead of them balancing the viability of Modern vs Classic but if they can do it, then it'll benefit everyone as a whole as this sort of evolution of FG's is required for the genre to go past being a niche thing that only certain people can play.
@@shirakani Like I mentioned, just add the special and assist button to the classic mode, this way the players can keep the benefits from the both world.
@@shirakani Luke is missing only 2 normals on modern, and he has access to all of his specials.
They sacrifice optimal combos and some command normals but not gonna lie the ability to have instant reversals and been able to punish with super on reaction is really tempting.
Yup. It's actually a balanced feature. There's also reduced damage on special moves done with modern inputs
I really want to see Modern Zangief move list.
Reversal Bear Grab for days.
He be dishing out the ZanGrief
I think there was Japanese blog post regarding it, he has one button SPD.
"The power of Gief, in the palm of my hand." "Unbalanced as everything should be."😂
1 button SPD 😮
I played modern controls through the beta and to be honest the only character I liked it on was Chun Li and Guile. I guess it will be good on Zangief too. But I am determined this game to learn Dhalsim properly.
I heard Gief will only have access to light SPD in modern, so the threat of being KOd with 3 SPDs is greatly diminished.
@@Danceofmasks is that light will be used for the ap button but you can still do the manual input like with Chun Li spinning bird kick? I hope so.
Dhalsim will probably be really bad on modern controls because losing a lot of his normals would make him much worse
Most character combos are easy to learn except for Dhalsim and Akuma, I welcome Modern Controls so I can pull off the combos I want now with minimal mistakes.
@@vendictawhitford488 combos aren't the advantage of modern, not really.
The best thing is not showing buffering in neutral. If your character isn't crouching before throwing out a hadoken, your opponent has less time to react.
You also get more reaction time, such as if you get jumped on.
In actual combos, you want to do the motion input to maximise your damage.
If the games moving on from classic controls I understand but for me it means changing what I feel in love with and I don't really like that. To me it's not street fighter if there's no dp motions.
Imagine evo moment #37 but daigo just held parry lol. The auditorium would have been silent lol.
Most people don't have the discipline to practice motion inputs. It's the reality sadly
If you turn on the option to confirm opponent in ranked, it should show you what control scheme they're using, not just their connection type.
Thank you my friend
Modern controls seems intriguing when high level play is involved.
People where mad about hitbox but now we have this and people seem fine, i dont get it .
For real this is literally more degenerate than hitbox lol
@@erikharnden7952 these modern controls are awful, not fair.
hitbox costs money, everyone who has SF6 has access to this.
@@NeverToBeSeenAgain Sure, but do we really want everyone to start playing with ''this'' because it's more optimal? Modern control are less expressive, offer less control, are less kinetic and fun to use (imho), offer less variety in play style and execution, it lowers the skill ceiling... it will make the game more accessible but leave less room for mindgames and impressive plays.
Having access to it doesn't make it a good thing for me, because if Modern is the only way to be competitive at this game, then I'd rather not play.
@@Psil0 oh yea I'm not saying its a good thing, but that is why there is less pushback.
I'm still on the fence until I see more play at the top level because it does have its pros and cons, just gotta see if its balanced or not. I do think it opens the door for Capcom to do interesting things with balance because they could swap out moves in a characters modern moveset to change their balance.
aint no way im ever gonna super punish neutral drive rush like that on classic. also jamie ex palm for the otg in corner? im gonna have to remember that
0:00 The takeaway here isn't even that "he reacted". The most important thing to know here is that he had the luxury of doing _anything he wanted,_ with _zero_ mental stack, because "reacting" to a punish opportunity was a literal button press away. Know what would have happened if he'd had to spend the normal 15 frames inputting that super? Yes: He would have gotten hit instead.
This will come to a head eventually. The game is _not_ balanced for this. Worst case scenario is Capcom says f it and adds 1-buttons to Classic Controls.
Yep, It's broken by design.
@sturdyelement You do not understand the game or its nuance. IT has nothing to do with boomer controls, the issue is the game is designed around boomer controls fundamentally. You need to balance for both control archetypes and execution should be rewarded. Even ryu in ssbu has quarter circle inputs that gets rewarded. Also walking up and doing these commands is difficult to do without misinputting. The game is designed around this.
@sturdyelement modern is supposed to remove inputs so newcomers who cant get a grip on that mechanic dont feel overwhelmed. the problem is they also change specials and supers so theres no delay. the pros are already starting to realize they have to use this. why is this a problem then? because modern is also packaged with a negative thats meant to balance out the ease of use: you lose normals versatility. this doesnt help. removing the delay for inputting specials is way more important than a couple of neutral options. but the reduced moveset is still going to make the game more boring to watch. and like the other guy said already, the game isnt balanced for instant supers, meaning offensive options will be shut down by the threat of instant punishes, making things even more boring. its a fn mess tbh
@sturdyelement and if people don't like it and the game dies then capcom will have to get over it and maybe focus on stuff the casuals actually want which is more fair monetization
I'm a classic Luke and pull of lvl 3 supers like that all the time. The modern player read Justin and was prepared to react with super most likely and it is very possible to do that on classic if you have the read and you're just waiting for them to run into you or DI or w/e
It'll be interesting to see if modern controls will be degenerate at high levels or not. Right now, I feel like the influencer types might not want to weigh in too strongly on the matter in order to not alienate Capcom. Time will tell.
Yeah. Noobs are thinking modern controls are broken or something because these influencers want clicks.
This has potential to create a Strive situation where the identity the series once had, and it's fans, are completely alienated for the hopes of mass appeal. A risk with deep and extreme downsides. They're relying on all the other mechanics and content of the game to distract. If SFV had this, the franchise would've been killed there and then.
@@riffcrypt8438 what do you mean “hopes of mass appeal,” everybody and their grandma knows street fighter
@@soupwithpotatos1542 Let me rephrase, hopes of gaining a new playerbase.
@@riffcrypt8438 Except this is SF and has a much easier time actually reaching out to a wider player base. Guilty Gear isn't in the same league in this particular case (Not saying it's not a good series). Have you played on Modern Controls yet? It didn't remove the games identity at all.
This brings me back to street fighter IV on 3ds lol.
How Ironic... Luke on Modern Control and Ryu on Classic... "many time we going to teach you a lesson Old man "ahhah
Running into Jonathan is crazy, be learning so much from his clips
4:27 - the strikes go to the music perfectly here :D
Nice combos! Do you tap forward x 2 for each drive rush or how would you recommend for consistency? I drop the drive rush combos more than normal combos :/
You can buffer in the forward x 2 inputs before the move finishes! It's very lenient too. That knowledge helped me with drive rush combos a lot
@@liljon042 Ahh thanks man! That's gonna really help ;O
I wonder if Justin ever got invited to Daigo's place to play some local stuff lol
Justin posted a picture with Daigo
Probably the footage isn't out yet
Feels like you are fighting AI against Modern
weird question, when Jamie is drunk with his hair down, his upper body sways when he moves backwards.
Does this change his upper hitbox, making you need that little bit of extra space to hit?
I hate to say it, but WHY does Luke look so fun. I wan to play Marisa, but all the characrers looks so fun!!
You havent tried him yet? Tried him for the first time in the SF6 demo, fun to play. I went back and tried him in SFV and feels overall the same.
I am really surprised out how good luke is at zoning and denying Ryu, using the same kit essentially (a hadouken and dragon uppercut).
Classic controls for life, at least you have access to the character's full moveset.
Agreed
Modern control Luke doesn’t give him perfect and doesn’t do drive rush combos. You have to use the auto button to get the confirm and then you release it at certain times to manually input moves to get optimal combo
So basicallly super easy compared to what u normallly would have to do
Hit confirm and option select are problems. Much worse than faster reactions.
It changes how you approach the matches. Maybe because of my scrub level, but I think it changes the meta too much. I feel like I´m fighting against modern controls instead of the player.
Modern controls are completely braindead. Any twitch of the opponent can be punished with instant super. No buffering needed. Only one input frame to get the startup frames going. Modern is broken and too many do not realize it..
People are so focused on the damage nerf (that is much smaller than people realise and can also be bypassed with manual inputs) and just ignore what other implications it could have for the game. I think nerfing the damage on normal attacks too will go a long way to solving it.
@@evilweevle Ironically, the damage in modern is actually higher than in classic.
1. Most of the supers executed in classic will be hit confirmed with prior strings. And the scaling for supers at the end of a combo is much higher than the damage penalty for raw supers executed in modern. There will only be rare occasions in classic where a raw super will connect because you have to buffer it or executing it on reaction will limit the usability to a smaller range of use-cases.
2. Substitution of supers in classic for a special move does not result in a much lower overall damage.
3. Modern does not restrict you to modern shortcuts. You can still do the motion and deal the same damage.
4. Modern gives additions options to dump meter resulting in less waste.
5. The threat of an instant raw super or easy dp reduces the opponents' options drastically. => Allows the modern player to play more offensively. => More damage.
@@romzen do you actually lose moves with Modern, or can you still do *all* manual inputs if you choose?
@@darkchild130 You always have to sacrifice a number of moves in modern. Some normals entirely. Some can only be used when pressing the assist button or after prior use of other normals.
@@romzen seems like a minor trade off for instance reaction times.
I just hope we can match make only with classic control players
Kof 94-95-97 extra mode players(boomers like me 😂) its our time to shine with perfect parries go for it
Great matches! Bitrate was killing me tho lol
Am i a grumpy old boomer?
I really dont like modern controls.
Even more in tournaments and high ranks.
Motion inputs require consistent 1-2 hours of deliberate practice. Most people aren't willing to do that which is why Modern controls exist
As a new fighter game player, I am really struggling with enjoying how Modern Controls are. I am encountering a problem I am not seeing anyone actually talk about, and that's how it punishes people who actually want to spend the time to learn Classic Controls.
I have played against other players very few times, and every single match they have been using Modern Controls. This is where the problem comes in, because I am using Classic, I want to actually fully learn the game. Everyone I have gone against has had no issue whatsoever throwing combos out, and I know it's only because they are using the Modern Control scheme. I however don't have the luxury of just spamming the "do combos" button, and actually have to time my inputs.
The existence of Modern Controls, a control scheme that was supposed to make it easier for newer players to pick up the game, is actually punishing for people who actually want to learn the game. I am still learning the muscle memory to execute 10+ different key strokes to make a combo happen, everyone I have played against has only really had to use 4 different keystrokes to make the combo happen.
I wish I could opt out of playing against Modern users as it's very unfair that a newer player who is using Classic has to actually learn what to do, whereas a newer playing using Modern doesn't. It isn't a case of higher level players already having experience with fighters and knowing how the game works. This is a new player with a clear advantage against a new player who has to actually learn the inputs.
Edit: I feel I should mention also, I have seen the argument that "uHm It'S bAlAnCeD because Modern deals 20% less damage !!1!" Or "it's balanced because when using modern you don't have access to the full moveset!1!" However this isn't enough. 20% less damage isn't enough compared to how easy it makes the game. A super easy to execute 15-20 hit combo that only does 20% less damage is always better than a difficult to execute 15-20 hit combo that does full damage. 20% less damage on a whole combo that happens instantly isn't anywhere near as strong of a downside as some people think.
These matches so good. Nice to to see your opponents using different characters.
I play on Pad and classic is a BITCH to use. I feel like I’m fighting the controls especially on World Tour when I try to use Manon’s half circle back command grab. Modern controls allows me to play better without dealing with the complications from screwing up my inputs.
When the Jamie player hit the drink and blocked that fast? It was on lol
I felt by that “Modern Controls reactions.”
Justin is right about not being able to jump on anyone who had modern controls. Easys shoryus
That's what's going to make Guile so good with modern...100% flash kicks
@@ADreamingTraveler Meh... You don't get to jump on Guile players anyway. And they still have to charge. Flash kick is basically up + kick on classic.
Modern doesn't improve flash kicks much. It's actually better with Shoryukens because 1 the motion is slower and 2 classic input makes you leave crounching stance and makes you hurtbox bigger for a few frames.
@Guy Montag hitbox classic is faster then modern flash kick. I am controller player that plays classic.. Only time I enjoy modern is with zangief.. Even I can win more in modern.. It's just not as fun.. I have never taken zangief ever in any game.. So me using modern on him feels like im playing him as intended.. If I were to use ryu as noder id feel off.
Genius thumbnail
Im completely new to street fighter (trying to play it at a higher level) but I fell in love with street fighter 6 . Should I opt for modern or should I grind classic. At the moment Im thinking of maining chun li, Ken or Luke. Leaning towards Chun Li the most but feel like I'm naturally better with Luke
Go classic. If you want to play at a "higher level" then having part of your moveset removed is off the table. Grind classic. You'll eventually be able to do everything someone using modern can do and more.
Learn classic and modern, try to find what’s best for you, fighting games will take years to play at a high level, at least 2 years most, depending on the game and character
So just grind it out and find what’s best for you and mess around with other characters if you’re interested in different archetypes likes rushdown, zoners, grapplers ect
@@jonathansuttle7678Well…not *everything* but you can get close. No matter how good a super buffer is that’s still a millisecond more than a single button tap
How old are you curious?
Try both, see if you like which. I would start with modern, they give less mental burden and let you focus on more important thing.
After that critical art, that dude was angry next round, but I love the J.W Ryu play as a Ryu player, I learn a lot from him to be top 5 in my region if you include modern controls, top 15 😆 great gameplay. 🎮👊
How is this HD and still feels like 144p
Very interested to see how Modern Control will affect the game, I'm very excited for it. Also love how people can just jump-in and play. 2ND JUNE COME FASTER OMG
Can't wait to get my hands on modern controls Geif!!!!
One button 360 or 720!!!!
I just bought SF6 a few days ago and even tho it’s my first SF ever and I’m on modern controls I’m so obsessed with this game I’m watching this at 1AM literally wanting to play more!!! I have downloaded and played SF5 when it came on psplus but I couldn’t get past the tutorial cause it felt like you had to be a pro from the beginning like wtf.
I was in the same boat regarding first proper street fighter game etc. Trust me convert to Classic, its a game changer.
Just takes some time to practice mate. You appreciate the journey and when it becomes muscle memory
I get the point that modern control should grab new people but talking about losing the people who are at best mid range cant probly out skill the button of doom punishment from m. C. Players. Not really feeling it at this point
Modern mode makes everything that you used to be able to react to fast enough to block but not counter now easy to counter. Like, most people can react to an overhead in time to block it but not DP through it because by the time you react to the overhead there's not enough time to input the DP. Modern mode fixes that.
Practice more and you'll be able to. Don't cop out and take the easy way.
@@dillpickl4416If not a cop out because even if you practice all of that, you still have to practice your reactions and your spacing. There is still skill even with one button reactions. The solar the game is not built on input alone
@@dillpickl4416 Actually it's not a practice issue. Ryus overhead is 20 frames of start up, the average human reaction time is 15 frames, the game has been tested to have 3 frames of input lag, that gives you 2 frames to input a DP which is impossible because a DP requires three directions. Even if you take someone like Daigo's 12 frame reaction time that gives you five frames to input a DP which is ridiculous, maybe a hotbox shortcut could pull it off but it's still pretty unfeasible hence why even pro players resort to just blocking overheads.
they need to add the option to disable a type of control mode when u queue for ranked
cant wait to see how tournament is going to be...
Is Street Fighter 6 thaaat different from other Street Fighter games? Because from what i know, the more specials the opponent tries, the more opportunities for massive punishes.
Its funny how a lot of competitive fighting game players I know scoffed at simplified controls in rising thunder. Now theyre a problem and Japan bout to win Evo with them 😅
There's something satisfying about gettig the motion inputs right. With Modern controls, you loose all that kinetic feeling of connecting with your character pulling off moves.
You can still input motions depending on the character.
Luke still has sandblast and all his knuckle stuff
There something satisfying about being able to play like a pro, when you ain't even close and would likely never get there!
@formulaic78
I'm new to sf but I can sure input an EWGF
Gimme classic controls. AN INPUT IS AN INPUT
@@tacitozetticci9308 I can as well but doing it the exact frame you get up off the ground is something my brain can’t process
@@formulaic78modern ain’t making anyone play like a pro
this shit reminds me of when cvs2 ported to gamecube and had EO-ism
I remember that shit. Never touched that junk.
@semiserioussam it was good for beating shin Akuma and god rugal lmao.
Im still trying to decide if I wanna switch to modern or classic! 😫
😅😅 I seriously doubt you played that CAPTOR CLASH game 😅
Was it just me or did modern players have next level grab game in the beta
This shit ruins the game FAR MORE than people realise. It removes a ton of depth and I sure as **** won’t be getting the game if this isn’t fixed. For one, breaking down your opponent’s defense is partly about staying in a place where they’re not comfortable buffering anti airs due to the risk of eating pikes or losing ground while doing so. Now this aspect is completely removed since they don’t need to buffer at all.
What joystick are you using please
And in which joystick do you advise us ?
hair is clipping
justing: hes a god
XD
I try to play on classic but the I just can’t get my inputs fastest enough on ps5 controller any skill advice
When I played my first rank match I didn't switch out of modern controls and I swear to god I couldn't do a goddamn thing. I was button mashing everything, I have no clue wtf it is and I got nearly double perfected. I was using juri Idk if that made a difference
No you were just bodied by a better player.
@@ElJosher I just beat your ass lmao
Are classic controls hard to learn cause I don’t want to get dragged for using modern😭
Just play what you find fun. As someone who will only be using Classic: The only people dragging others for what control type they use, are losers.
That being said, Classic is the more difficult option. It's not impossible, but you just need to spend more time practicing. But anyone can do it.
Modern controls are for modern people.
@@demidevilqueen very incorrect. How the ppl who put time and effort in the game are losers make that make sense.? The real definition of a loser is a person who wants everything easily handed to him without trying. One button supers and specials really!! How is that challenging? How can that build mental fortitude? No wonder it's so many weak minded young ppl in the world. SMH. BY your logic easy is a winner, and execution, trials, effort, to become better in due time is a loser. Your parents failed you.
If you're new to the game feel comfy playing on Modern. I think people are whining about experienced players playing on Modern to exploit it's advantages.
yes bro it takes years. modern is for ppl who drink soda for breakfast
Modern sweats vs classic sweats can’t wait for this game to get released.😎
This is more sf4 3ds, modern might need a deeper damage nerf to compensate.
Can you choose who u fight in ranked? Like can i only fight only classic vs classic. i honestly dont wanna fight any1 not using classic
I agree Capcom should give us the option to choose to fight classic control only. Modern is for scrubs, leave it to smash players
There was no option like that in any of the betas.
@@mac7114 At last someone who realize it.
They literally play smash with the possibility to crouch, supers are even more easy than in smash somehow...
@@mac7114 If only scrubs use, why to worry? Your neutral will help you run over them.
Its Modern.
Adapt.
We are not in 1990.
Where’s this sound effect from 4:44 ?
Cant you make special moves on classic with autohotkey and assign them to one button?
Or is this considered to be cheating?
I think modern mode is going to replace classic mode going forward, so players focus more on developing their strategy, just like in other modern fighting games.
i'm akuma main (rip nerfed sfv akuma) so i'm curious how modern control would work on such character. first i'm going to try cammie as main, loving her style (I swear that's the real reason)
Top class thumbnail. Thumbs up.
Do you think competitions will have separate ladders for M v. M, C v. C, and M v. C?
Nah. The in game matchmaking(ranked and unranked) system is not seperated, and there was no option to do so in the beta. So I think it's fair to assume official CPT events won't be seperate either. And if CPT event's won't be, it's unlikely and majort tournaments will either.
Yo Justin, dope vid. Question, can you play mvc2 with team ryu, ken, and sakura? Saw your team shoto with ryu, ken, n akuma but would like to see your approach with sakura instead of akuma.
Modern is great fun for newcomers.
Classic is more fun for me. 🤩👍🏼
Brings more players to the SF scene. So I can see the logic in implementing them
Does the game let you filter opponents by control type?
no
Friends and I were having a discussion bout modern controls on our podcast. I like the inclusion and once high level/pro players showcase and teach us how to optimize modern for competition, I’m definitely using both
Do you play with the thumb stick or d-pad?
So is modern better or worse on fight stick?
why is modern allowed in competitive?
Cuz if you can't beat em you should join me lol 20% less damage and half the moves lock.
Im a menace with the modern, no KAP
High-level street fighter is so fun to watch
They just need to lose the instant supers and I'll be fine with them
I see a modern mode nerff coming.
What fighting games should I download?
This thumbnail is incredible 😂
Are they gonna ban modern mode in tournaments?
No they are not lol all the big tourneys allow them including Capcom cup.
If i could get Manons Dégagé on low and mid height as modern, that would be nice =,(.
They need to add some iFrames to modern mode in terms of Supers
haha @jwonggg lobby 6:20 had that ass at hello like
Man.. U maining Ryu is feels so Woong xD
That bitrate tho 😬
I played modern mode Chun li by accident and smoked my little cousin… he needed to be humbled but I also felt so dirty. I apologised 3 times 😂😂
Online??
@@philliplamb-jh7bf yeah, during the beta. Forgot that when I changed character for the first time I had to change settings too 😅
the quality of the video made me feel I need glasses
So based on this video, skill still beats the controll, therefore Modern doas what it is supossed to do, give peopel who need it the chance to play the game normaly, without easer input power creeping the Meta. as Experience still beats it. i think Capcom did a Good Job with this. even tho i dislike that Modern is the default controll and not classic. But other then that, Modern Seems OK.
And this is the mentality of a pro gamer. Good for you 👏🏽💪🏾
Its not skill vs control it takes skill to use classic controls foool. Anyone without the skill to use classic controls has no bragging rights.
why is luke looking like jin and kazuya?
I really think capcom goofed on this. Im not saying modern is bad, but modern and classic should have their own ranks. If you want to play mixed it should be in casual. Now i havent ran i to moderns that have been to much trouble yet, but I just find it weird they would combine it. I remember on 3ds sf4 you couldnt fight 1 button touch screens controls vs classic controls.
Modern going to ruin the game down the line. They need to a least give the option for classic control only be a choice for the players who dont want to play against modern players.
There will be no segregation in the game
@@dhiogomartins7 ok lame what ever you to weak minded to even be in my type space
That's exactly what my thinking was. If modern controls is too good it might end up hurting the longivity of the game. Literally every single other thing about this game was done to perfection but modern controls could be what harms the game overall
1:35 😅😅
not related to this video but my most important request to date: justin play the dragon ball evolution game for psp