Battlestar Galactica: Razor | Becoming A Razor
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2024
- Admiral Cain opens up about her past and lets Kendra know what the future holds.
From Battlestar Galactica: Razor (2007), Lee Adama embarks on his first mission as commander of the Battlestar Pegasus.
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On that same day, Cain and Adama both faced a trauma. For Cain, it convinced her to leave those you love behind in order to keep going. For Adama, it convinced him to never leave a man behind. It's not the trauma that shapes us, it's how we react to it.
Cain left her little sister beyond behind and then the sister was kidnapped by the cylons!? Geez, that's harsh.
Adm. Cain was an exceptional military leader, but lost sight of the fact that the primary purpose of the military is to protect the people, not win wars -- the latter of which is to accomplish the former.
She failed to consider what sort of future the human species would have if Pegasus' crew was left to carry on. Mothers and future mothers are most precious when the entire society is small. Males are relatively expendable.
This is why when there is a genocide, the women and girls are specifically targeted.
It’s true! Females are the common denominators in any species.
If there are more males than females the males have to wait until the females pregnancy term is over ; but a single male or small group of males can fertilize a larger group of females. It’s the same principle for lions 🦁 wolves 🐺 fish or more chiefly ants 🐜 and 🐝 bees .
Men made society as we know it. Speak for yourself.@@wralford
Excellent Point. The guilt they carried Adama , Cain, and Shaw
So she left her sister to die and only fought back when she herself was cornered and about to die, and she thinks she's strong because of that?
Yeah, her story is more of a TIFU post on Reddit than some grand life lesson.
Razor was such a good episode/movie.
It was good but the poor visual effects for the old school Centurions let it down.
It'd be far better if they took the original version and expanded that one; this remake was goofy at best. Especially with the touch of *what* exactly the Cylons were following; and trust me, it's as far from "God" as it is possible to get. The actual entity they used as the baseline for their Imperious Leader they called "Count Iblis" in "War of the Gods"; and it turns out that mobster seraphim is best thought of as the devil.
Never seen that clip of the Cylon War before. Make's Cain's ruthlessness all the more understandable.
It's makes her instability understandable. Her ruthlessness was just a side affect
Kinda makes me feel like she was just traumatized and good at hiding it. Still doesn't change the fact she's a war criminal.
@@schiefer1103 In war, the only crime is defeat.
@@munkykng416 She wasn't mentally unstable. You could say that she hated Cylons, but honestly, who didn't? They literally killed tens of billions of people.
@Drew Taylor if you win, none dare call you criminal.
The thing I liked about Razor is that it had consequences and in the case of Cain's little sister there was no resolution leading to lifelong trauma. Her sister was taken prisoner and never seen again. The Cylons kept their prisoners for experimentation and the colonies never got them back. End of story. It's like POWs that never come home and you don't get answers. This approach to storytelling has a real emotional impact. Cain is a deeply damaged person but there is a hint of regret at the type of person she has become.
Her flashback, this story about her trauma that we're supposed to believe shaped her into what we see on screen, only enforces how wrong so many of her decisions are. It doesn't make her strong. It doesn't turn her into some mythical blade. It turns her into a petty little tyrant who craves nothing but control and is only interested in her own survival. If I were her CO and learned of this story the last thing I would have done is given her a fucking promotion. There's a big difference between cutting your losses to save the ship and cutting your losses to save yourself. Cain should have never been allowed to command a ship.
This showed how utterly gutless she was.
I have always wondered if Admiral Cain would have made the same mistakes (i.e. stripping and abandoning her fleet, killing her XO, wasting her men's lives in that botched attack, etc.) if her sister Lucy had survived that final day. Would Cain still have enlisted later in life? Would she still have had the will and ambition to become the Admiral of Pegasus by the time of the fall? Who knows. I would like to think that if Lucy was never taken from her at that age, she would have continued down the same path in life but without the extreme hatred for Cylons and guilt that she must have carried through her whole life. And she may have been a more noble version of herself by the time she met up with Galactica's fleet. I'd like to imagine that she instead saved her fleet, that she didn't execute her XO and instead jumped away. And that these noble actions in the face of adversity and hopelessness convinced Pegasus' Six Gina to not betray them but help them, just like Athena chose to do.
Well, that looks to me like good/bad aligned fem!Shepard in Mass Effect.
Baring in mind she was given Pegasus because it was not a front line Battlestar. It was a fleet centrepiece designed to be self sufficient, and supply the ships around it with no supply chain from home.
The only reason it's as huge as it is, is for the refinery and manufactory facilities.
Albeit it also carries a heck of a lot of long range munitions tubes.
She was not a good commander, and was given the "prestige" of the position in a show piece that Colonial fleet believed wasn't going to see front line action.
@@GrasshopperKelly You made so many assumptions in your comment that you cannot possibly claim to be true. Not a front line ship? Who says it wasn't? Do you realize that Battlestars in general don't make any sense since they combine the responsibilities of carrier and capital ship. In our reality those responsibilities are given to different vessels and would have completely different positions in a naval fleet. But this is BSG, this is a hypothetical universe where the same rules here on Earth don't apply. That is also seen in the fall of the colonies, which make no sense because any civilization with half a brain would never have all of their vessels running using the same computer software. You can't approach BSG with real world logic, you have to approach BSG with the mind of a sci-fi writer and the ideas that the writer wishes to convey. The whole fall of the colonies comes down to the idea that man should not place absolute trust in technology. And Cain's Pegasus was a metaphor of what would have happened to Adama if he didn't have Roslin to influence him and turn him into a protector. Also, they used the introduction of the Pegasus to "retcon" a few mistakes that they accidentally introduced in the pilot. They removed the Colonial's ability to create more Vipers by destroying all factories and facilities in the fall. And this is a show all about drama and space battles. So eventually fans would need to ask how can Galactica maintain the fleet's protection if they keep losing vipers with almost every engagement? Are the cylons that bad at fighting or are newbie colonial pilots that good at fighting. So that's probably why they gave the Pegasus it's ability to train new pilots in VR and the ability to make new vipers. Boom, problem solved. Now they could continue to tell their space drama while filling in the plot holes.
@@Ajax1063 That's coming from my knowledge of books and videogames (I say books... I should say comics).
While I agree, a lot of stuff in Sci-fi is deus ex machina because writers need something. Good writers explain or show stuff, so it doesn't just look like deus ex machina...
Such as in Star wars, the Death Stars ere under construction for years, and people knew something was up when millions of credits were going into a hidden project... Starkiller base just appears without anyone noticing.
If Jar Jar Abrams wrote Attack of the clones, there'd be no Kamino, the clone army would have just appeared.
The Six assigned to Pegasus (Gina) didn't help them. She was crippling their weapons systems in the guise of helping repair the damage to Pegasus. She's the one who opened the airlocks so that the Centurions could board the Pegasus. Despite her later trauma and after everything she went through at the hands of the humans, she went out as she came in, a Cylon soldier intent on the destruction of Humankind when she exploded the Cloud 9 ship right after Baltar was elected president.
As for Cain, she might have acted differently on The Day if her sister had survived and was perhaps with her on board the Pegasus at the time of the attack. Adama, in a different episode I think, tells Lee that he might have gone the way Cain did, reacted as she did and made the decisions she did except that he had his son and his best friend to face, plus the president in his face, arguing for the protection of all the civilian survivors and that that had influenced the choices he made.
The Centurions have good taste. They chose to base their small arms on the venerable M41A Pulse Rifle.
Imperial Stormtrooper have a better taste, they chose the MG-42.
I knew those guns sounded familiar.
That one centurion also was using some kinda tec-9 lookalike
@Elijah S *panicks*
umm . . . umm . .
Apollo, Starbuck, Hotdog, Kat, Chuckles, Stepchild, Joker, Hardball, Redwing, Narcho, Beehive, Catman, Fuzzy, Dipper (the OG CAG), Beano, Jojo, Jolly, Reilly, Stinger, Showboat, Hammerhead, BB, Longshot, Pike, Duck, Nora, Bulldog, Fireball, Raygun
@Elijah S anders is "longshot" fyi
Helena Cain would make a perfect agent of Section 31.
Or a member of the Marquis. ;-)
She lacked the subtlety and wisdom of an operative. She is a blunt weapon
Naw she is willing to sacrafice too much
And there’d be nothing left to protect
I disagree. Section 31 agents are idealists at heart. They believe in defending the Federation even at the cost of their lives. Remember how agent Sloane committed suicide rather than expose company secrets? Sloane was in many ways a frustrated philosopher. He was really dissapointed that doctor Bashir failed to see the necessity of covert operations in a time of war.
Helena Cain only thinks about saving her own life. She rationalised abandoning her sister to the Cylons as a means of protecting herself. She contitues to think about waging war, when it is obvious that the Twelve Colonies already lost. Instead of protecting the remnants of humanity she chose to conscript or kill the survivors she encountered. And for what? There was no purpose.
Would gladly exchange my butter knife status and be a razor instead...
Oi! Yer got a loicence ter be a butta knife, 'ave yew?
Robert Johnson The one time I was in England, I actually saw a pair of MP-5 toting policemen hassling some guy for having a pair of scissors in public.
Now you know what lead up to Admiral Cain's Assassination . The Treatment of her crew and of her prisoners .
I like that they stayed true to the old design of the base ships and raiders in the flashback clip. My only gripe is they used CGI cylons instead of actual actors in suits like the original series.
Cain was unbalanced...
God, that was powerful.
You don't leave family behind.
To be fair instead of just standing up and going with erh sister, she jut lies there like a lemon saying no i cant, for no reason at all.
Guilt and remorse. I bet that ate at her every day.
Would you rather both of you were dead? Cain obviously tried but the sister refused to help herself.
@@achillesrodriguezxx3958, Her sister was literally, a few feet away when she fell down. There was nothing preventing Cain from taking a few steps, picking her sister up, and carrying her to the shelter. That way, both would have survived.
Star Trek Discovery...Pay Attention...This is how it's done.
Sam Dog Comparing BSG to STD is like comparing a steak dinner to dog crap
Why isn't there a series about the First Cylon War?
You can play BSG Deadlock campaign to know more about the FCW.
I would love a tv series of the first war
There is Battlestar Galactica: Blood and Chrome which focussed on the first cylon war but it got cancelled
i heard it was pretty bad, got alot of bad reviews.
@@thehantavirus i think you are talking about caprica season 1
Giving on our values in the name of security is to lose the battle in advance.
Cain was a character in an impossible situation. She made a choice to do whatever it took to defeat the enemy because she saw that as the only means of survival. She had no president Roslin, no Saul Tigh, no Apollo. It was just her with people not entirely capable of questioning orders- but for one- and no civilian fleet to protect. As she said in her speech, war was her imperative, and it was all that the cylons had left them. Had Commander Adama not had the civilian fleet and president Roslin and Apollo to challenge him, he would have done the same.
I don't agree with her actions, yet given the same data set as she had, I very likely would have drawn similar conclusions. I find no fault in her actions, given the impossibility of the situation.
Actually she did have someone to stand up to her. Her best friend and exo. She shot him in cold-blood. Caine was a zealot
She did strip a civilian fleet of items she wanted
She also proved an inflexible commander, incapable of dealing with younger officers commanding smaller and much older Battlestars in wargames. She even took the manufactory facilities on Pegasus as a reasoning that vipers, raptors, and other small craft were "replaceable" when in reality, ace pilots cannot be replaced by simply building a new viper...
@@GrasshopperKelly Sure it is! All you do is click on the unit labelled "Viper" in the build menu, and after a short time, one pops out of the fighter foundry complete with pilot, who usually says something snappy when reporting in, like "kickin' tires and lighten' fires, command" or "I'm reading you 5x5, sir!"
@@allenharper2928 because Japan did so well in the 40's when they started using half trained pilots xD
Is this from the longer version of Razor? I don't remember this scene and I have seen Razor lots of times! But it usually has been the short version of it.
Yeah, this is from the extended DVD version
Cain was a coward. She wasn’t wrong, but she was coward and left her own sister for dead just to save herself. Adama did the exact opposite.
Adama died to protect his sister?
I wish she would have stayed on as Ro is star trek DS9 though I also like Nana Visitor. It would have given the bajorans even more weight.
Hell, Admiral Cain would be a perfect Section 31 operative
Glad she wasn’t nana visitor was excellent on DS9!
hard to watch for what it means
So odd, their technology is so high, but they shoot bullets
Cheap and effective
Can you please do the scene of major Adama arguing and trying to relieve Commander Gardner and the battle afterwards?
I loved the old school sound effects! I loved them back in 70s. Cool and terrifying all at the same time. Wish they had the old school blaster too. Oh well, this was more realistic.
Beautiful, smart actress
BSG: Razor is not available to watch on ANY streaming platform. Not even with the miniseries and entire 4 seasons on Amazon Prime. They have “The Plan”, but they don’t have “Razor.”
Should be the first 2 eps of season 4. They made it into a movie
First episode I watched.
A fear addled coward, she shouldn't be in that position.
Cain is awful.
When did she pick up the Melbourne accent?
Both of these women are drop dead gorgeous.
"... Ma'am that is a knife."
I honestly do not understand why people think Cain is crazy or attempt to define her by her trauma. Her world view is legitimate, and she proved that she was a skilled commander by waging five months of guerrilla warfare against the Cylons. Really, what makes her compelling as a character is not the fact that she is wrong (because then it would be easy to dismiss her), but that she may well be right, and her brand of cold, ruthless pragmatism is the best chance of survival that humanity has.
"Fun Info: For those who don't read the BSG comics and novels, Admiral Cain (while using the Pegasus) ended up actually losing in the war games repeatedly against older smaller Battlestars. The reason? Because she was incredibly inflexible, and not able to adapt to changing/unconventional tactics. She was too by the book. Other Captains, and ship commanders secretly made fun of her for inability to win with a larger more modern ship.
Also, we find out that even though it's almost twice as big as the Jupiter class, the Mercury class's extra interior is mostly taken up by fabrication facilities (not weapons). So being bigger in this case is not necessarily an advantage. The Mercury class was considered a "test-bed" for new technologies (like on-board Viper factories), but was never intended to be mass produced as it was absurdly expensive. So only a few were made.
Many Admirals considered the Mercury-class to be bloated, and preferred the smaller and cheaper Valkyrie-class (and older Jupiter class refits). Being posted to a highly expensive Mercury-class was considered a "prestige" post (but one with no fleet command authority). The Fleet Admirals stuck Admiral Cain on the Pegasus to "honor" her, but secretly they all thought she was crazy and unfit for commanding large fleets. They wanted her someplace where she wouldn't be able to make important decisions."
She became what she was fighting against because she lost her humanity and turned into a machine
@@Irfan87 Just collateral waste paper of zero value in the context of the series.
We never found out what happened to her little sister huh?
We can suppose that her sister, as many other during the first war, were harvested in the process to create humanoid cylons. After the fall of the twelve colonies, more humans (mostly, women) were abducted and used in reproduction experiences.
youreale oh right! I forgot about the “farm” Starbuck found on Caprica
There were also the hybrids
I'm pretty sure we would all be a lot happier if we never had to watch what happened to her sister...
Kain was from tauron the says everything depending on what colony you were from you had a curtain way of thinking given their environment and upbringing she didn't have do what she did though there is no excuse for the number of war crimes she committed well now that you mention it this whole fucking show was complicated humans and cylons practically did the same things but the cylons never did that type of things to one another
Actually, the Seven's got terminated and erased. Some raiders later on got lobotomized.
Brian Lindee you frackin racist! The Adamas were also of Tauron ancestry. lol
Ah, so she was a coward and then spent the rest of her life forcing her cowardice on others. Good to know.
?
I've became more mature now.
2:39 why didn't the centurion pull the trigger? Was it because of the order to withdraw ? Or maybe because he couldn't kill a defenseless human teenager?
I'm curious because he could have easily pulled the trigger she's armed (I don't think a knife would scratch him though) he could have ended her right there and there.
SHFH WATCH THE MOVIE!
@@highlander723 why that unecessary way of answering?
I'm curious as well.
It obviously got orders to withdraw.
@@LordTalax even so it could have kill her ,like just one more kill u know?
Wait, this doesn't make any sense. From BSG Deadlock Cain was already in-charge of the Colonial navy during the beginning of the war so why is this showing her as a teenager in the last day of the war?
Fearless 512 That Cain in Deadlock is the mother, I believe.
Julianne Stingray Nope its the same person
Fearless 512 Except, the Cain in BSG is called Helena. The Cain in BSG:D is called Lucinda.
Julianne Stingray Weird, I've seen videos where its the same person. Funny how Cain never mentioned that her mother served in the colonial fleet
Fearless 512 Ah, got it. Lucinda has to be the grandma. The mom's name is Saundra.
I was conceived through violence.
There is a lack of sex here... and Admiral Cain is lacking too.
Damn, talk about plot armor. Stupid writing.
..... Did you watch the movie or the series?
Grow up.
Um, except for the fact that he's completely correct... So ya, maybe it's you who needs to grow tf up 🙄
@@ericmorang3903Get a life.
she literally dies at the end of the movie.
Her accent ruined it. But otherwise good.