Hearthstone Has Changed WAY More Than You Think
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- Опубліковано 17 жов 2024
- Rarran watches all the hearthstone world championships to see how much hearthstone changed over the years
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Edited By: / mf_daveed
#hearthstone #Rarran #hs
How Much Has Hearthstone Changed?
Dude is litteraly in the grand finals of the biggest tournament for the game and Rarran the Hearthstone goat is out here making fun of his class choices
first
Rarran the what? Ahahahah
@@adrianopatuzzi2771goat stands for greatest of all time
@@adrianopatuzzi2771do you not know what goat stands for? Lol
@@ButtercoreFTW I know what "goat" means, do you not know what irony is????? ROFLLLLL
I miss old Hearthstone. Quit some years ago but aprecciate your videos of bringing the old legends back from time to time like Reynad or showcasing highlights of the big hearthstone era. Back in GvG and Grand Tournament Hearthstone was constantly up in the Top 5 most watched categories on twitch. Now it is barely in the Top 20 .. sad to see the decline but it was only natural with so many new sets and bad decisions from Blizzard
Thank you Rarran for still being a Hearthstone creator. It feels like basically everyone else is gone now, and with the game in decline. But I do like the kind of nostalgia, historical slant you take with things. Don't know how long the channel's been around, but it feels like you've emerged with just the right content at just the right time.
the game is definitely not in decline, they are just doing a bad job on the marketing side of things. In terms of actual game design and balance and affordability, hearthstone is way better now than it was in the past imo
@@shubhod9569 yeah the game has actually been on the rise in terms of player count since last September which is crazy
@@pete5516 I returned to the game after quitting for years and it's actually a good game now. It is strategic and feels rewarding to put time into
this is well written
@@shubhod9569 For silliness, I guess it's alright. For what it was, not at all. It's just pure random. Nothing matters, because hunter will twisting nether you, shaman will play star power, and warlock will drop pack the house. Make the turn timer infinite so she can read, and my grandma who's never played could wipe the best hearthstone player in the world, because so much of the game is a coin flip. On top of that, catering to mobile kills the game, and catering to casuals/noobs to be more user friendly and mass appealable, makes the skill ceiling and plateau very low. Any time there's a playstyle that is too much APM for mobile, it gets removed. Everytime there's a deck that has any kind of skill ceiling and is't straight forward do this turn 1, do this turn 2, win or lose the game depending on if they draw X, it gets removed.
The best examples of this are razakus priest, miracle rogue, patron warrior. There's a 4th deck here I can't remember. To some extent even classic handlock, freeze mage, and control warrior, but not as much they could win by anyone but not as consistently and dominantly. Razakus had a terrible win rate, same for patron warrior like 30-40%, miracoli was better but the difference between first time playing it or bad at it and great was huge. Forsen had way above avg win rate since it was his jam.
On the battlegrounds side, they removed Chadgar because it took too much APM for mobile and people who couldn't do it weren't happy. Literally skill issue.
It's quite frustrating and there's not much to actually get better on. Imagine if CSGO nerfed headshots and added more randomness to where the spread goes, because beginners couldn't aim as well. There's legit no reason to nerf Patron, it had dogshit win rate played by the average player. It was absolutely dominant played by a good player. Are they gonna get better? Nah, just complain till it gets nerfed. Am I supposed to get better at discover? 50/50 effects? Evolving my shaman board into the right cards? Like I'd rather just go play Valorant and progress.
2:48 dude imagine you play one minion on turn 4 and nothing b4 that, and you havent lost half health. #missoldhearthstone
there classic if you want to play that, but its full off bots. hmm i wonder why thats the case 🤔
I remember playing against Undertaker Hunter and being dead at turn 4.
Well not against face hunter
i miss dropping yetis and ogres on curve Sadge.
And azure drake was like one of the best cards, 5 mana for a decent body, spellpower AND card draw? The value.
I've been watching old kripp and kibler videos from 6 or so years ago. So crazy to see how much as changed since then
The games were so much clear and it just became more and more chaotic and unpredictable lol
Whole agree. Just now is a roulette. Not an strategy game anymore.
we told them during the beta, no one listened
@@BBRocker75it was always roulette, you draw random cards.
It got more gamefied, sure, but they didn’t really introduce that much rng.
Dude it was a roulette before @@TreiberSeptim
@@TreiberSeptim But in a meta you know what cards your opponent is running and what his possible outs are. Now people are discovering cards every turn and I don't know what he's going to play at any given moment. I just have to yolo and hope for the best. No counterplay
raran is on of the few creators where i watch a 80min video without skipping or getting board or even to lazy to click on
23:10 you could show also next turn (I think) where Amnesiasc played Thaurisian and Pavel answered with second Babbling Book and Fireland Portal.
And as cherry on top, later Ragnaros that hit 50-50 and killed Arcane Giant and Amnesiasc conceded that game.
there's a reason people called it Paveling book for a while after that. I was so salty when that happened, i was really rooting for Amnesiac.
Rarran questions at about 17:59 if grim patron was played in the non-combo form (without warsong commander). It was actually a good counter to secret paladin (they mostly didn't run equality). It was very possible to make four patrons on turn 5, and some decks actually still struggled to clear that board. I think tempo mage had issues too because flamewaker is obviously terrible against a board of patrons.
Man, feeling old watching this. Remember 2015, what got me into watching Kripp and later 2016, I vividly remember just randomly tuning in into the tournament broadcast when Pavling Book was about to happen. Crazy that this was 8 years ago
23:45
Tbf they did finley dirty.
Every class have an insane autoinclude herocard, finly in coreset.
No current herocards exist in standard, no finley in core.
this video was super cool and reaffirmed my decision to quit, card games are supposed to be thinking games with outplay. rng was a good way to increase the scenarios to increase how much you had to think, but at this point when its just finding your own combo faster than them (with one printed disruption piece in glide you pray to get) its not better than yugioh OTKing so pple pray to go first.
Hunterace vs Viper was one of my very first experiences with competitive HS and it was a world championship at that. I remember how insane of a final it was to watch live as someone who had only started playing HS for like 3-4 months at that point.
As you noted: Force of Nature->Savage War was busted, especially since you had it twice. And don't forget Force->Savage->Innervate->Savage *shivers*. I long held we needed Legendary spells, with Savage being limited to one per deck.
And yes, classic Handlock was the best deck to play. I still remember a match I had against Control Warrior where I made a decision turn 9 to play Jaraxus on empty board with a War Axe in play because I knew I would die unless I started the 6/6 spam. Such a simple yet technical deck.
@@gamerk316 Handlock was such an amazing deck to play. It played fair, yet strong.
@@gamerk316 Handlock vs control warrior was a pure skill issue. I had a positive WR playing either one vs the other. Which is ofc the kind of thing that leads them to nerfing/killing decks, to appeal to a more casual audience.
@@Rspsand07 I played both, and honestly had very high win rates with both of them as well. But H2H it comes down to how well Handlock deals with Warriors removal tools.
Druid was always the problem, since the fact they had two chances at hitting the 14 burst changed how you had to play. Especially handlock, since your Drakes were just Keeper of the Grove bait.
I remember when Force+Roar was in the game along with Emperor Thaurissan, which was yet another way to enable Force+Roar+Roar - or even Force+Force+Roar+Roar!
Ah the day9 Druid jade idol rant. My favorite.
I always cite Descent of Dragons as the "Age of Powercreep" in Hearthstone. I felt like before that, the most broken decks of prior formats would still be broken in each other format if they hadn't been nerfed, and in general the power level had not risen that much from classic. You still saw basic and classic cards in people's decks fairly often. I think DoD was the first set where you read the cards and just went "these cards are just better than everything else". It might not seem that crazy now, but I remember seeing cards like Dragon's Pack, Scion of Ruin and even Amber Watcher and just questioning what the hell they were doing. 5 mana 4/6 heal 8 is nothing special at all nowadays, but keep in mind it hadn't been that long since people were playing Earthen Ring Farseer for healing.
I agree, I remember playing Hearthstone since Old Gods but the powerlevel really generally skyrocketed with Descent of Dragons, every card just had a good effect AND good stats, and following expansions just kept on getting slowly stronger and stronger, DH release following DoD shows how much they pushed the powerlevel too
Rarann does really good videos. The people he gives homage to is what got em into hearthstone in the first place I think. More of the Bazar creater plz
OMG, Day9's legendary rant on Jade Druid. Iconic.
GvG was the point where I gave up on Hearthstone Tournaments & HS as a competative Game in general.
Really nice to look back at older Hearthstone. I agree that Un'Goro was the "golden age" for a lot of people, lots of fond memories of that era.
Reliving the United in Stormwind meta gave me Vietnam flashbacks.
I remember watching the tournament live at work and I was yelling about paveling book getting a polymorph
They had a betting system for the packs and I put amnesiac as my vote lmao
Excellent video :D
😮
This was such a nice blast from past, thanks for this Rarran. I also used to love Handlock, did quit when they introduced standard/wild.
Very interesting video. As a 10+ year player of HS i feel the biggest problem in game design and balance is the discount on resource generation. Draw, discover and random generation is way too good nowadays. Power creep is unavoidable in storied card games, but if you scale all the stats and abilities upwards then resource replenishment automatically becomes better too, since the generated resources themselves are better. If your aggro deck doesnt't have to make any compromises to replenish their hand, or if your combo does not need to have slow turns to set up Thaurissan, or if your control deck has infinite value within just 1-2 cards then the game loses any semblance of rock-paper-scissors balance and the devs MUST step in more often to quell the objectively best strategies, rather than letting the playrate balance itself out.
It’s funny how the scariest thing in Hearthstone initially was 14 damage from hand, when nowadays there’s decks that can deal 36 from hand, and that’s just on the low end. It also assumes the games last that long with how hyper-tuned aggressive decks are. That’s why when I play I stick to the solo content (such as Tombs of Terror and Dalaran Heist) and to Battlegrounds for the most part.
Actually not, rogue was able to play leeroy 3 times on turn eight.
@@lartonki Leeroy did used to cost 4, huh? I forgot.
@@RMGamer31O yeah leeroy was orginal 4 mana, but allready 2014 it was nerfed to 5 mana
23:47 Omg the battle between DrHippi vs Pavel was freaking legendary!
The fact rarran doesnt know how strong Ostkaka's patron warrior post warsong was is crazy. It was still an S tier deck that dominated the meta
Awww, firebat. I always looked forward to his videos back when he was making content. Miss that guy
That first jade game all i could think of was the day9 clip
Thanks, great video and a reminder why I quited the game :). Good memories and nostalgy, just what I needed.
2017 was the best and worst time in hearthstone's history. Not only were a lot of the decks really fun to play, but after so many years of having hearthstone be soooo expensive, it finally hit a breaking point. People didn't want to justify spending so much money on digital cards and in 2018 Ben Brode stepped away from the game.
Fun fact the reason why Pavel stood there holding up the trophy was because Doug said to them, whoever won the tournament should hold the trophy for a little while to people take photos and give it impact so they were supposed to hold it for a while, but Pavel went kinda took it too far hahaha...
For those who don't know him, the host standing to the far left of frame @ 13:04, Is DJ Wheat. Not sure what hes up to these days, but back then he was a streamer and commentator who had been involved with casting since the early years of esports. At one point, i want to say early 2000's, he did audio only casts of games. He did so much in the early streaming era that i can't actually remember it all. Long story short, he was among the first (a.k.a the pre-youtube) wave of full time content creators, and is one of the people who kinda paved the way for the modern content creator.
[Edit] Maybe literally paved the way, as he ended up working for twitch. Not sure, havent really followed him since OneMoreGameTV spun down.
Rarran has to be the best consistent Hearthstone content creator rn. The criativity this man has for daily videos is unmached. Also, play Amnesia: The Bunker on stream lmao
he's almost as creative as your spelling of the word creative.
1:19:28
I think it speaks volumes that people just watched the final game of the championship and everyone in chat just asks for drops. No congrats or anything. No one is there because they want to be.
Nothing wrong there though
@@rotonek2887 oh absolutely not. I do the same thing. It just shows that people don't really care about the tournament
The good old days when innervate+innervate+Yeti on turn one had your opponent sweating.
I got my first Legend push with Miracle Rouge before the Leeroy Nerf. A real OG. Now I just come back every year or so to see whats new and play some arena.
I forgot how insane that Hunterace/Viper Rafaam game was. Freaking insane. Just haymaker after haymaker after haymaker, and Hunterace stands victorious at the end, bruised but not broken.
Handlock was the second most fun Warlock deck ever. The most fun was deck destruction with Fel Reaver and Treachery. Actually got that thing to topr200 legend.
Great Video Rarran. Thanks a lot for doing so good but still different content!
55:40 i loved the power level of Tomb, if i remember correctly both untapped potential druid going inf with copying your hand and nzoth priest with 3 10 drops and an insane curve was allot of fun to play :)
@31:20 For that year in particular, it needs to be noted Jade Druid is a dominating force even though Frozen Throne printed a neutral "Destroy All Jade Idols" ghoul to dismantle the deck's inevitability.
That is how broken Jade Druid was.
Better nerf Priest though, right? >:(
1:18:29 perfect emote they are practice mates and it was indeed a fulfilling journey ❤
For that first finals you looked at, both players also brought Hunter and Warlock, it's just that one of them banned Hunter and the other banned Warlock. Priest vs. Rogue was the only difference in classes in their lineups.
Back then when card management was important. You simply draw and especially discover too many cards now.
Counting the opponent's outs is kinda useless now.
I still wish they would make that every discovered card is shown to the opponent as well. So you still get your card advantage but you can also try to play around cards again.
It kinda works in mtg. If you have to dig up your card in a deck you have to shot it your opponent most of the time
@@AlexandrYudin77 because you usually dig for specific card types - creature, sorcery, instant etc. or specific tribals.
You show the card to show you took the correct one.
I played a few tournaments in MTG and people are cheating like crazy.
@@fzoid3534 yeah, but anyway. It could be used in hs as mechanic too
@@AlexandrYudin77 definitely. As if it is now discover is out of hand imo. The pool of cards is too big to play around stuff. Your opponent could get nearly everything. Either show the cards or limit the pool of cards you can get from discover by a lot.
That's me as an old school HS player talking
@@fzoid3534 I’d donated to this garbage more than 2000 dollars, before I quit in 2020. Cause it became impossible to have fun for me. So randomly, so op some cards. I logged in yesterday, to see if something changed. No it’s worse even it was, so I’ll stay in mtg for a while
Lets fucking go!!!
You've got a new subscriber!
Representing the Aachen Local scene!
That Pavel polymorph was nasty. Top-decks a random chance at an answer, gets the perfect RNG back to back. "Lemme just win real quick."
For me peak hearthstone was around 2015-2017. I stopped in 2019. Watch these video's for nostalgia but have no idea how hearthstone is nowadays lol. I liked the slow gameplay alot and can't handle quick pasted card games
I really miss old Hearthstone, I'll be honest. I have played it around 2015/2016 ... took a break and came back around 2020.. and I'm playing it again. I do love that I can scrap all the wild cards and craft cards for Standard. I was always a fan of that as a f2p player. But man, I swear Its much harder to run Taunt cards nowadays. It used to be "Okay, I'll throw down a taunt so that I can at least stave the opponent off for a turn". Now they literally silence your taunt and beat your face in on the same turn like there was no taunt card to begin with. I also really miss frost mage.
Tom vs Frozen really was the peak for me, that whole tournament was such an exciting time
@29:00 its also just the game got worse
as expansions came out the game pushed more and more into rushdown decks and rng cards, you saying games got really wacky, well a LOT of people (including myself) hated that, every game stopped being about any measure of skill and just random rolling, the game @48:00 is a prime example of this, there is no skill involved on vipers side, he is just random rolling into legendaries and playing whatever he gets, if he gets bad cards he loses if he gets good cards he wins, no decisions, no thought no skill just rng
the push into discover and random generation turned every single game into just an rng fest of who gets more lucky which killed any interest a lot of people had in the game, matches were just dice rolls
then they also printed more and more cards/decks that just crippled the metagame as they were so powerful at excluding other decks (jade druid being the first of these where control decks literally could not beat jade druid, quest rogue, the one that made all your minions 5/5s is another example) and more "i win" cards like shudderwok that basicalyl turned games into a "did they draw the card" if they did they win, if they didnt they lose
its just not fun, not interesting
as a result it just stopped being fun and a LOT of people moved on
you then also had MTG arena coming out, and a fair number of old hearthstone personalities like kibler and day9 jumped onto mtg instead of hearthstone
so you have blizzard being blizzard, the game getting proceedingly worse and more expensive and horrifically random, and a serious competitor coming out causing a lot of people to jump ship
as a result hearthstone is just tiny compared to what it was
1:06:40 I started playing 2015 but just after 2 weeks when they release demon hunter i stop playing and i have never come back after that.
Old Gods was the best state the game ever was in.
Pavelling book - the card was called that after pulling that Polymorph.
Thanks for reminding me to keep my hatred for Druid high at all times - cannot ever slack off!
Oh man, when blade dance used to hit face 😂
In the Last Hero Standing format, you didn't have the option to switch decks after winning. So Firebat had to play Druid in the second and third game.
24:37 more warriors than that saw play from Nathria - Festival (excluding the mini set)
21:25 hero power does change the break point here.
Lethal without azure drake is just Blade flurry, destroy taunt and hero power for the last damage.
Did i really just watch 1 hour 20 min vid? Omg I didn't notice it at all. What a great video!
30:18 Dude i love DisguisedToast!!!
nostalgia is a crazy drug thank you
Man that first game...The WORLD TOURNAMENT...BOTH players brought Yeti.
Ok so now I need the most upset full play moments of all qualifiers, all games full moments. Every game. Ppppppllllleereeaaaaasssseeeee
Better title: Why hearthstone is a bot infested unbalanced meme with turn 3 OTK combos, every deck discovers or steals cards, and losing and winning relies entirely on card draw and discover/theft effects in many matchups.
I felt so nostalgic watching this video, I miss the old Hearthstone
Its wild how you can remember who wins a world championship because of the card that was released with their name on it
This is the first Hearthstone video I've watched in years. After watching these last two grand finals shown here, with one being an hour long fight between two control decks and the one previous being a game where players are fishing through their decks for some combo that just autowins them the game, I'm pretty sure I made the right decision to quit playing years ago. They started killing the game with randomness a long time ago and the boring control deck play. The game was much more entertaining with tempo and face-hitting and with relatively little randomness. As others have stated, the game was also more enjoyable when they only real "combo" from hand dealt 14 damage and it was in the Druid deck, where it wasn't with a class that was hyper-aggressive.
The Babbling Book incident followed by the Jade mirror match reminded me why I quit HS.
i FEEL OLD WHEN I LOOK AT OLD Hearthstone i want the First Hearstone story back when i got the Beta Key
0:30 Was poggers a thing back in the day.... You know I think poggers originated shortly after overwatch 1 released, so probably
perfect time i needed a vid rn
1 and a half hours of Rarran? Hell yeah!
Oh man I almost forgot about the good old paveling book
Short answer: A LOT.
i've just noticed that rarran is now selling a shirt that says you got jailed! and i can't stop laughing
real ones remember how difficult it was for him to remember his own famous catchphrase
I found it amusing when Pavel didn't know about Rogue secrets whilst playing on stage.
Do people still play constructed?
Yep! Still hit legend most months playing Standard, & I've been playing since launch! May 2014 was my first month on ladder. I'm buying the Whizbang bundle & I'm looking forward to playing!!!!!!
Damn i liked this gsme back 2014 when i started grinding this
13:30 Seeing Kripp, felt so good
Un'Goro/Knights of the Frozen Throne was peak Hearthstone
the sadest shift from old to modern hearthstone is how you can see how player decision matters less and less.
In earlier game, you could often point at one thing the losing player could have done diferently to win. In latter games, most of the time a diamond player would have still won most of the time I feel.
Rarran perfect pause on Frodans accidental pog face 17:42
Can we appreciate the og legend thats Chillwind Yeti.
As a Swede. I think we should start saying "Ostkaka" the way you did.
day9 was the goat bro. love that guy
As a player who started playing Hearthstone again with a 2-3 Year break i can tell it changed A LOT. I mean, what is "Core" and what happend to "classic"
"When covid first came Out, acting like a company released it". Me :👀wellllll... 😂😂
it must be incredibly frustrating to be a professional HS player in a high stakes tourney and then to lose through no fault in your own play to randumb bullshit cards lmao
Dougdoug has a funny story about one of the winners. I think pavel, who held up the trophy for waay too long
VKLiooon vs bloodyface was just sad
The stomp.
She was like
"Yeah, another walk into the park"
Around 9:00 mark you get so excited that he plays around board clear, but the other bloke had like 8 cards in hand, meaning 9 next round, it is normal to assume, that with 4 cards that screw you up, at least one of them has already landed in his hand, since he's been through more than 50% of the deck already. Its normal plays, not 200 IQ plays you make it out to be :D
The algorithm tossed this video into my feed, and I felt the need to comment as to why Hearthstone fell of for me.
I played it early on, before the expansions dropped. It was a fun game that was simple to learn (at least to a MtG vet), had depth, and I could toss like $15-20 every month or two and still keep up with it. I didn't care about the pro scene, I didn't netdeck. I just built fun decks around the card pool that I slowly built up over time.
Then the real monetization dropped. It wasn't something that I could casually play and casually spend on in order to keep up. It needed a serious investment on my part, and there were better games out there that I was already investing in (both in time and money) that Hearthstone simply wasn't good enough to replace.
And then Blizzard decided to do Blizzard things, which had me walk away from them as a company. I don't play their games anymore. Even if Blizzard turns itself around from being the absolute disaster that it is, they're not going to change the monetization around the game.
I returned to HS very recently and any time I see a Stormwind card in wild, I just cant help but to think how broken it is
Played hearthstone up until the Tiawan player lost his money
Same here.
I love the back in the day meta where tech cards had more impact. Now decks are so overtuned to the point where tech cards is overshadowed by the shear easiness to reload your hand or back to back tempo swings.
i still remember rooting for firebat in the first world champs :')
Was One Night in Karazhan 2016? That was the last time I played this game.
I have never played this game but I still watched till the end😅