Guitar neck reset alternative for a fragile Classical, Nylon String 1960's Guitar
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- Опубліковано 24 тра 2020
- So I have been trying to learn about neck resets for a while so I could fix the action on this old fragile nylon string, classical guitar. I practiced the standard neck reset on a few guitars but it never quite worked, steam the neck off, scrape under the fret board and also drill into the fret board, yeah no, I did have some success with an old steel string by this alternative, the other video I posted, so I am ready to try this alternative on it, see what you think. I would suggest that a guitar like this one, old solid wood thin pine top with solid rose wood sides and back would get wrecked by a normal neck reset, well by me anyway. I do apologize for the obvious mistakes, some of the camera angles are off a bit, a few misplaced words but in the spirit of keeping just like I did it, well there you go.
I like what you're doing. One thing I might add is to trace the back out on to a piece of plywood and cut it out make a mold of it's shape. Things can get distorted and when you're trying to glue the back on again, now you've got an upper left and lower right bouts sticking out to wrestle with. Another thing is that sanding the brace that way you are shortening it, and it"s not locked into the kerfing anymore, so make another brace that tucks up under the kerfing. Thanks for the vids!
Started in NYC, moved to NJ, then to Westerly RI. They were in New Hartford CT for a while.
I have to say that I was very sceptical when I started watching this. I thought that messing with the bracing by such a small amount would do nothing and I thought your sides would deform as soon as the back came off. I thought you would struggle to fit it back on. I was 100% wrong. Great job and it was great you showed it warts and all. Nice one 👍🍺
Thanks for making this vid. I've the same problem but thought it must have been a plywood face that had delaminated so it became a wall ornament. I just looked and it was a solid wood face and not plywood and now feel confident enough to give it a go myself.🤔 Thanks again👍
Just wanted to say thanks for the video. Just did this to a 1972 Harmony H172 and it really brought it back to life! It had broken/missing braces and removing the back was defiantly the right move. Also arched the braces to bring the top back since it was also sunken in from time and someone putting steel strings on it. Again, thanks so much for posting!!!
Cheers!
Pure genius. Never heard of anyone doing this over a neck reset.
That was most certainly food for thought and very well explained and demonstrated. I'm about to try my first neck reset on a similar instrument and this will definitely make me reconsider my plan of attack. Thanks a lot mate.
good luck
nice approach
Nice Vid dude! BTW in Europe where the Metric system is common - Engineering does not use Centimetres - Only Millimetres and Meters - dressmaking and so on use Cm. 😊
I like your logic … makes sense to me … added benefit is watching your method in action … this gives me confidence this winter to try on my two 1965 Stella harmony 12 strings … unplayable action
I just picked up a Segovia Valencia Guitar made in Spain that needs a serious neck reset.. This video gives me a lot of valuable information that will come in handy at tackling this project. Thanks much
You may also want to consider the John miner steam neck reset
Excellent job. I had my doubts but it came out great. Put a carpet or soft material on your bench please. Thanks for posting.
Yeah, your right
I think top's correction is correct. back's gluing is suppressed by wrapping a string around it. It directly affects the sound.
This video outlines the boundaries of naive outsider luthiery.
Haphazard foolery.
Right .. how dare someone explore the boundaries of established customs of pretentious 'experts' while problem solving in learning a skill.
Love the concept. Pleased to see others below providing constructive criticism and recommendations more befitting your share. I've a couple sunken soundholes that I might explore this concept on.
Cool way to do a "reset". Thank you!!
An unorthodox method for a neck reset it worked fine the result was a playable instrument great stuff......I found the video difficult to watch because of the
fumbling and slipping clamps etc all carried out on an unprotected bench like a junk shop,,,but for all that ..well done that man,,kindest regards from the U.K.
True, I'll do better next time
The principle is right . But use a steamer to remove the back . I did this with a Spanish heel neck and no wood splinters at all .It works . A steamer has a flexible pipe to make access easier but leave that off and use the shortest connection to keep the steam hotter . That gives dry superheated steam. Mind your fingers. Any old hide glue can be softened by taping rolled up paper tissue along the join and wetting that --then leave it for 3 or 4 hours .It releases easily . Old gue on the surface --Use a small brush with boiling water and wipe it clean before it can soak in . Very quick and tidy . The bottled Titebond will soften with steam but you have to peel it off like elastic chewing gum . Better is cold Fish Glue that give lots of time and works like Hot Hide Glue. It cleans up perfectly with hot water .
yeah, good idea
Usually on a classical a refret or a heat press well fix warped neck. Typically steel strings get full neck resets where neck is steamed off the guitar.
With all the technology and advancements people still buy guitars with neck joints that will in time need adjustment. if not, they are taking care of it, well built, or they do not notice the high action or give up playing. I believe that the sound is so incrementally minor when it comes to glued versus bolted necks, I.e., Taylor method versus traditional dove- tail. Steaming off a neck and resetting according to some mathematical formula seems archaic. I am so happy you showed us your method. Practical. How is the intonation?
should have a 2 year update soon (intonation is good)
Nice work!
congrats! you nailed it!
I have a Guild mk 2 with the same issue, so viewing your work with great interest.
Excellent work...addressing the cause and not just the symptom. The only thing that I found discomforting was listening to the friction between the guitar and table top. Perhaps use a flannel sheet to protect the finish, especially when working on guitars with French polish.
Would you consider doing this work on a 1973 Gerundino flamenco guitar?
Would you
Yeah your right.
@@Pappington101 I second Djard's comment on 'addressing the cause and not just the symptom'. Has got me thinking, very interesting approach. I've not done a neck reset (too complex for my liking so far) but I'm intrigued by the process of distortion of acoustic guitars and how SHORT a period of time it often seems to take for the guitar to become unplayable without any room for improvement via the saddle. It's like a hopeless battle between tone and strength where tone wins and the structure of the guitar loses every time.... yet it's almost like the industry pretends it's not happening and that their guitars are capable of withstanding the constant string loading when they're often not.
Thank you I will try that on y Guild Mark IV sometime ....nice work.
Thanks. Learned something here.
thanks for sharing mate! appreciated...
I'm 52 seconds in, i have a guitar with an identical problem so i will watch with great concentration.
excelente !!! me gusta tu alternativa para solucionarlo sin dañar la tapa !! gracias por compartir tu conocimiento , desde Argentina!!!
If you were dealing with wood glue it would be very hard to get apart. The guitars in the 60s were glued with hide glue but in the 70s wood glue was used and still is now days. With wood glue I would do the neck set. Good video!!!!))
Thanks for that. I have an old Maton F10 that has great sentimental value but is catastrophically damaged and unplayable. Have always wondered how I might fix it so it's playable. You've shown me a completely different approach.
Nice technique. Guild used good solid woods and traditional bracing. Hard to go wrong. Guild started in NYC, I think, moved to Hoboken, then to Westerly RI. It has been in numerous places since then.
Thanks for this… it’s something I’m considering doing on my Yamaha g50a 1972. Classical, nylon…. Low end at the time , but sounds great.. it would be worth a try, as it looks about the same distortion as yours… almost identical problem.. and the result looks great!!! but I keep wondering…. Is there any other way of dealing with this problem.??? Does anyone have any alternatives??? Thanks.. Sean. 👍 uk.
This guitar looks like it´s been attacked by termites at some time. Some of it is around the area where you noticed something from before but couldn´t remember if you had worked on it. Perhaps some bug killer was applied to the area through the sound hole.
Why not fix that crack in the soundboard first while you have the brace out? Then suction the glue into the crack and pyramid shape your cleats to allow better soundboard vibration.
Why remove the back? This could have been done easily through the soundhole .... But great work, you are lucky.
Very good video. Question.... so when you are running the straight edge across the top of the Frets on the fingerboard they were to the top of the bridge ? Or the top of the saddle ? I am asking because I know when you put tension on the strings it will pull on the neck.
good question, top of the saddle.
The straight edge should run from the nut groove to the top of the saddle --with 2 (3mm and 4 mm ) spacers at number 12 fret to give the right action.Reduce the spacers maybe 0.5 mm to allow for string tension . Use a strong wooden bar fixed along the neck to the bridge .
Do the fine adjustments to the action height -------while the open guitar is so flexible ------before gluing the back on . Most repair videos leave out that vital part . That`s the whole point of the job .
hi I am in the process of removing ther backplate of a classical guitar. the wooden strip on the inside that holds the backplate and the sideplate together seems like a solid (but curvy) wooden strip made out of one piece. I haven´t been able to establish an opening separate the backplate from the sideplate, yet. probably because that solid curvy wooden strip is pretty thick, 2,5 - 3mm. should I first establish an opening/separation and work from there?
I agree, I struggled with the separation of the neck heel and back plate, I rushed it a bit more than I should have, slow is better, small steps, on the other hand it did go together as long as I didn't sand any parts.
If I remember correctly that wooden strip is glued right at the point were the back and side meets, almost right in between them.
@@Pappington101 thanks.
I already established an opening. I applied hot water with a pinsel to soften the glue but the wood becomes weak too. I just bought an iron in the hope that that will work better.
My concern is still the slight diminishing of the wood from the sideplate (the thin stripe that meets the backplate)
@@Pappington101 yes indeed, the wooden strip is glued right at that point.
which makes it tough because it is solid, so there is glue all along the length of the connection and the strip is broad (4/5 mm with the sideplate included)
Try putting in the center clamps first, through the sound hole, then the side ones. I don't normally comment, but you are a true fumbler.
Thanks for sharing. Guild started in 1953 in Hoboken and moved around 1966 to Rode Island. So, if your guitar says Hoboken, than it was made in 1965 or before. Just picked up a Vicente Sanchis childrens guitar here in Spain which has the same problem. So, I will try the same method.
good luck, its been about a year and half and the fix is completely stable, forgot just how beautiful these guilds can sound.
I assume, almost 2 years later, it's still strumming along strong.
Yeah, in fact very nicely, I was thinking of a follow up, you just set it in motion, thanks!
Can't believe its been two years.
How many times are you going to say that you prefer working on the collapse over a neck reset?
2 more.
Bit more difficult if the guitar is built with a Spanish heel. Good idea though.
I just left a positive comment .. I then read further comments … “ There’s those that know . And those that think they know “
Sometime you have to think outside the box depending on your circumstances .. that you have done I expect stupid hateful comments upon this comment … yeah . Those that know all .
Generally classical guitars are built different to steel string ones the sides are fitted into a groove in the neck block making it difficult to remove the neck . Not like a steel string which has a dovetail joint which can be removed.
I did this same action on a steel string, another video, "Alternative neck reset" posted, same issue, not a neck problem but a top brace problem.
Maybe if you moved all the crap off of your worktop I might trust you with one of my instruments.
Yeah your right.
A neck reset is much more accurate and easier...hate to tell you.