This explains why I have SOOOOO much cooldown reduction & minion damage after getting The Ring of the Sacrilegious Soul & Blood Moon Breeches. One of Ring of the Sacrilegious Soul's perks is that it autocast's Raise Skeletons every 1.4 seconds (procs 3-5 seconds on average) if chosen out of the three perks (other 2 being Corpse explosion every 1.4 seconds and Corpse Tendril every 11 seconds with the specific ring I have) which as you mentioned procs Aphotic. It also procs the Raise Skeleton active effect of empowering minions for 8 seconds, increasing damage from minions by 30% and healing minions for 25% of max health. I basially have near instant Golem cooldown reduction (around 1-3 seconds), near instant Blood mist (every 1-5 seconds) and near instant Bone Storm Ultimate going from a normal 60 seconds down to between 15-20 seconds on average (mind you Bone Storm last 10 seconds on it's own WITHOUT Bone Storm duartion temper which I have) all basically on autopilot. The Blood Moon Breeches has a 7% chance for your minions to curse enemies which applies the cooldown reduction from decrepify and empowers you for 70% overpower damage. It's has been smooth sailing ever since I got those two Uniques.
I have similar cdr on my thorns minion necro. I'm not using aphotic/shadow damage at all. My golem has virtually no cooldown and i can spam tendrils back to back to back when there's enough enemies. The cdr gets so high that sometimes it looks like tendrils doesn't even cast, but it does. Army of the dead can be maintained 100% uptime with enough density. The only downside is that this only works if you don't have enough dmg to 1shot everything. If you wanted to figure out what's causing that i can send my build over.
I swapped out Hulking for Aphotic, and the difference in cooldowns to every skill was immediate and profound. Bone storm CD went from 40ish seconds to less than 20.
Hi Mac. I believe whats happening is…. Aphotic turns their dmg into shadow… then 10 attacks from the warriors will proc shadowblight. This damage from shadowblight has 100% luckyhit against abhorrent decrepify. This is why CD reduction is more when u use aphotic.
This aspect is not just reducing the skill cooldowns, it also causes stacking up shadowblight faster. I tested it with my necro and it takes approx. 11 seconds without the aspect to get the 10 stacks and with the aspect just approx. 7 seconds
would be a bug if that wasn't the case... you increase the instances of shadow damage dealt with the aspect. so shadowblight should proc faster / more often =)
Hah, here I was thinking the increase in decrep procs I were experiencing, was due to Tyrael's Might! - But when I swapped to Tyrael's Might I also swapped from Golem focus to Mage focus which also made room for Aphotic. I did a few tests (no where near enough to be considered a reliable sample size) and I don't think Tyrael's Might is proccing it at all... The more you know :)
Why does Abhorrent Decrepify work with minions anyway if their lucky hit coefficient is 0? This is referenced many times in the videos about this build but I'm just curious why it works. Edit: apparently its because Reapers and Defenders have a special attack which has a non-zero (probably 100%?) coefficient. Scythe attack on the Reapers and a shield slam on the Defenders. Normal melee attacks do indeed have 0 coefficient and all lucky hit interactions for those are disabled.
Most shadow minion builds don't seem to use Aphotic. Does anyone have a build link for an endgame build that has been updated now that the season has been out for a couple of weeks?
Wow, I like these kind of videos. Very informative with data to back it up. I will subscribe to your channel. BTW, I have a question: Does Minion thorns trigger Abhorrent Decrepify? Last season you made video saying they "fixed" minion to not trigger decrepify lucky hit anymore. But, how about this season?
I've seen a situation, my golem hit a crit over power, every single attack from all of minions were crit overpowers for the next six seconds or so. I was awesome
It may have started that way. But during the time there were ZERO white numbers or yellow. It was solid orange. And I don't do my own damage, all damage comes from minions, no shadow procs for me I only run Edict. Accept tendrils damage. All damage that was on screen was a combination of 14 minions and the holy bolts.
I like a lot of people love being able to play minions but you just reminded me about shadow surfer. Do you have a s4 version? I really liked playing it
Thank you for the vid! This is why I copy tested builds vs building one; viability is limited by code which is beyond my control. I wish I could customize, would be more fun. Cheers!
Great information! Thank you for the testing. Keep the tests coming. Looking forward to your blight video, I assume you're dropping soon. I really want more info on Ebonpiercer. Can you test and verify if the minions can abuse any of the lucky hit stuff from tempering? I can be more specific if needed.
Ok Mac please correct me if I am wrong in my understanding: curses have an unseen 100% lucky hit chance - all/both curses? I am running Aphotic but with Iron Maiden because of the Torturous Aspect as a test for a dark/minion build. Am I going to see this same bugged interaction?
Drop Void, it’s easily the most useless part of the build when trying to add something else. Blight is mainly used for elites and bosses, but the pull from Void is best for mob packs. It’s even more redundant if you’re using corpse tendrils.
Absolutely, i just changed this bugged aspect to the blood mist one to check if i could get more shadowblight procs with the corpse explosion and i kept dying in pit lvl 80 where i was farming My cooldowns were much longer for some reason and apparently this is it. I already dont use the golem aspect and i guess ill remove the grasping veins to get the infinimist feel back
Hewed flesh does not seem to proc off of warriors or mages hits, unless they are the reapers. Is that intended?? shouldn't i be creating corpses off any dmg??
@@MacroBioBoi ok...just to clarify since there was another opinion posted here. On a Shadow Minion build with a Golem, you'd swap the Hulking aspect instead of the Void aspect for the Aphotic?
@jackwebb2425 Hulking is there for golem CDR so it'd be redundant with bugged Aphotic. Void is there for the Blight package, but if you want to swap out of that, Blood Getters is the go to.
I thought to gain this ability you had to use raise skeleton to get that timer and that is what the priest effects are. Have I been misunderstanding how to trigger the priest effects?
@@MacroBioBoi so with that legendary effect wouldn't you need to be triggering it? When testing with blood wave in both instances I must have missed you triggering the priest to grant the bonus or what else am I missing lol. I have gotten my necro to 100 and am trying to build it out for dropping ubber boss's and higher pit clears but I can't break 80. Love all your videos Macro. Thank you for the hard work.
@@Archangelmd You can see when I use Raise Skeleton in the video. I show tests first without triggering it to set a baseline, maybe you stopped after that first part?
@@MacroBioBoi thank you very much I am not fully masterworked yet I just have all the affixes and stats on my gear your build has listed like attack speed/crit chance on my rings etc. The cooldown isnt awful but if I can abuse a bug till its gone why not? LOL Thank you for replying
@@dklien6443 sever, the initial damage of blight, the initial damage of ultimate shadow blood wave, the base damage of ultimate shadow bone storm, the proc off shadowblight
wait, couldn't you get infinite Bloodmist uptime with this plus the ring of sacrilegious souls and still have all your strong minion stuff? The cooldown reset took 22 seconds on a 50 second skill, so on a 20 second skill it should be like 10 seconds and maybe even less when you slap some Bloodmist Cooldown Reduction on it. Sounds like you could still have your golem hit for billions of damage while being completely immune yourself
Casting the priest is increasing attack speed isn't it? The minions are just hitting 4x as many times per second. Run the same test without the aphotic equipped and still spamming skeletal priests to buff the minions attack speed. Probably same results.
Does this kind of answer the mystery of why minions specifically trigger decrepify lucky hit? Its not the minions and decripfy really. Rather, its the stun from decrepify causing the lucky hit procs
@@MacroBioBoi I use physical CE with minions, no curse on my bar - Bloodmoon pants have my minions apply Decrep for me. Since I slotted in Amplify glyph, it seemed like Abhorrent Decrep procs much more. I have always used corpse reapers but I don't see why that would proc more often since the cooldown bug is time gated every 10 sec. So it seems to be some kind of interaction with Amplify glyph as that is the only thing I changed.
Another Question? There are so many minions and shadow minions builds, ist your shadow minion viable? I saw many builds from pwnyhof with blood Mist. I dont know which is better now. Too much builds 😂
i feel this season u can look at almost any S tier build that clears deep pit and immediately know they either have a buggy interaction or unintentional double dipping XD blizzard should just observe tier lists and leaderboards and hotfix this kinda stuff the moment it gets discovered cause its kinda lame how these bugged builds skew the power expectation of builds. Also R.I.P to sorc that cant bug abuse 🤣
I always thought minions had our lucky hit chance since they inherited 100% of our stats...so you are telling me minions are good because they are bugged ? NotLikeThis
Minions are good regardless now. The bugs are just the ability to trigger Abhorent Decrepify's CDR in the first place, and Aphotic adding more triggers to that already bugged interaction. The bugs are purely CDR related. (Well, that and Elixir of Holy Bolts, but that's its own can of worms.)
@Orthus100 I guess. But im playing army of the dead, and without them triggering CDR through decrepify and lucky hit, my build would be shit. That's why im sad knowing it's a bug. Doesn't make make sense to me why Blizzard would not want lucky hit to occur on minions attacks.
This explains why I have SOOOOO much cooldown reduction & minion damage after getting The Ring of the Sacrilegious Soul & Blood Moon Breeches. One of Ring of the Sacrilegious Soul's perks is that it autocast's Raise Skeletons every 1.4 seconds (procs 3-5 seconds on average) if chosen out of the three perks (other 2 being Corpse explosion every 1.4 seconds and Corpse Tendril every 11 seconds with the specific ring I have) which as you mentioned procs Aphotic. It also procs the Raise Skeleton active effect of empowering minions for 8 seconds, increasing damage from minions by 30% and healing minions for 25% of max health. I basially have near instant Golem cooldown reduction (around 1-3 seconds), near instant Blood mist (every 1-5 seconds) and near instant Bone Storm Ultimate going from a normal 60 seconds down to between 15-20 seconds on average (mind you Bone Storm last 10 seconds on it's own WITHOUT Bone Storm duartion temper which I have) all basically on autopilot. The Blood Moon Breeches has a 7% chance for your minions to curse enemies which applies the cooldown reduction from decrepify and empowers you for 70% overpower damage. It's has been smooth sailing ever since I got those two Uniques.
I have similar cdr on my thorns minion necro. I'm not using aphotic/shadow damage at all. My golem has virtually no cooldown and i can spam tendrils back to back to back when there's enough enemies. The cdr gets so high that sometimes it looks like tendrils doesn't even cast, but it does. Army of the dead can be maintained 100% uptime with enough density. The only downside is that this only works if you don't have enough dmg to 1shot everything. If you wanted to figure out what's causing that i can send my build over.
I really admire how much efforts u put in those tests. Amazing man.
I swapped out Hulking for Aphotic, and the difference in cooldowns to every skill was immediate and profound. Bone storm CD went from 40ish seconds to less than 20.
Hi Mac. I believe whats happening is…. Aphotic turns their dmg into shadow… then
10 attacks from the warriors will proc shadowblight.
This damage from shadowblight has 100% luckyhit against abhorrent decrepify.
This is why CD reduction is more when u use aphotic.
I believe if we remove shadowblight key passive
aphotic wont increase decrepify CDR .
Shadowblight has nothing to do with it. I'm not using that on the video.
@@MacroBioBoi got it Mac! Nice to know this!!!
out of curiosity, did you test this without applying the curse just to see if the shadow/stun buff alone made them proc cooldown reduction ?
This aspect is not just reducing the skill cooldowns, it also causes stacking up shadowblight faster. I tested it with my necro and it takes approx. 11 seconds without the aspect to get the 10 stacks and with the aspect just approx. 7 seconds
would be a bug if that wasn't the case... you increase the instances of shadow damage dealt with the aspect. so shadowblight should proc faster / more often =)
I think that is, by and large, why the aspect was introduced.
That's the point of the aspect. They do shadow damage now, and can trigger shadowblight
Hah, here I was thinking the increase in decrep procs I were experiencing, was due to Tyrael's Might! - But when I swapped to Tyrael's Might I also swapped from Golem focus to Mage focus which also made room for Aphotic.
I did a few tests (no where near enough to be considered a reliable sample size) and I don't think Tyrael's Might is proccing it at all... The more you know :)
Even if you dont play diablo this shit is still interesting just learning about how all this shit works
Why does Abhorrent Decrepify work with minions anyway if their lucky hit coefficient is 0? This is referenced many times in the videos about this build but I'm just curious why it works.
Edit: apparently its because Reapers and Defenders have a special attack which has a non-zero (probably 100%?) coefficient. Scythe attack on the Reapers and a shield slam on the Defenders. Normal melee attacks do indeed have 0 coefficient and all lucky hit interactions for those are disabled.
Oh man, this cleared up tons of confusion. I was running minions while leveling and I had no idea why my cool downs were being eaten away
Most shadow minion builds don't seem to use Aphotic. Does anyone have a build link for an endgame build that has been updated now that the season has been out for a couple of weeks?
I’d like this too - no idea where to fit it in
yes please...A recent Maxroll Shadow Minion end game/pit build would be fantastic!
If you watch robs videos he has a build on d4builds that has this aspect incorporated
@@Jake-hy6vp thanks! I see one that beat 141 pit with it
i got shaco and aphotic to replace with void and hulking
Wow, I like these kind of videos. Very informative with data to back it up. I will subscribe to your channel.
BTW, I have a question: Does Minion thorns trigger Abhorrent Decrepify? Last season you made video saying they "fixed" minion to not trigger decrepify lucky hit anymore. But, how about this season?
Minions thorns triggering Decrepify was a bug that was fixed.
I've seen a situation, my golem hit a crit over power, every single attack from all of minions were crit overpowers for the next six seconds or so. I was awesome
Your minions can't Overpower. That was the elixir of holy bolts.
Minion numbers will only be white or yellow, so perhaps another one of your attacks caused that awesome situation
It may have started that way. But during the time there were ZERO white numbers or yellow. It was solid orange. And I don't do my own damage, all damage comes from minions, no shadow procs for me I only run Edict. Accept tendrils damage. All damage that was on screen was a combination of 14 minions and the holy bolts.
And I know minions can't overpower. This is why it stood out to me. There's a bug somewhere that I have not been able to replicate.
I like a lot of people love being able to play minions but you just reminded me about shadow surfer. Do you have a s4 version? I really liked playing it
Thank you for the vid! This is why I copy tested builds vs building one; viability is limited by code which is beyond my control. I wish I could customize, would be more fun. Cheers!
Does aphotic help with other lucky hit chance items you are wearing? Not just cooldowns?
No
Great information! Thank you for the testing. Keep the tests coming. Looking forward to your blight video, I assume you're dropping soon. I really want more info on Ebonpiercer.
Can you test and verify if the minions can abuse any of the lucky hit stuff from tempering? I can be more specific if needed.
It's like they gave the Skelly Stun portion Aphotic Aspect its own separate lucky hit chance proc that is also a pretty high % chance.
Mechanics god!
Furry*
Ok Mac please correct me if I am wrong in my understanding: curses have an unseen 100% lucky hit chance - all/both curses? I am running Aphotic but with Iron Maiden because of the Torturous Aspect as a test for a dark/minion build. Am I going to see this same bugged interaction?
What aspect would you replace for Aphotic that's currently in the end game shadow minions build?
Drop Void, it’s easily the most useless part of the build when trying to add something else. Blight is mainly used for elites and bosses, but the pull from Void is best for mob packs. It’s even more redundant if you’re using corpse tendrils.
@@xR3DST4Rx good answer. thank you
@@xR3DST4Rx thank you!
Did season 4 change with minions and the interaction with thorns aspect? I cant find anyone that has tested if it was.
I use this aspect and I just spam blood mist during Lilith fights. There is literally no cooldown.
Wondering if i should replace Hulking aspect with it?
Absolutely, i just changed this bugged aspect to the blood mist one to check if i could get more shadowblight procs with the corpse explosion and i kept dying in pit lvl 80 where i was farming My cooldowns were much longer for some reason and apparently this is it. I already dont use the golem aspect and i guess ill remove the grasping veins to get the infinimist feel back
Super interesting - thank you for the breakdown!
Is there a way to work this in to a shadow minion bonestorm blight build?
My golem slam isnt doing damage to bosses anymore since the update.
Is it still bugged in season 5?
Hewed flesh does not seem to proc off of warriors or mages hits, unless they are the reapers.
Is that intended??
shouldn't i be creating corpses off any dmg??
Your minions don't proc lucky hit EXCEPT Decrepify.
My thought was that the shadow damage allowed for additional shadowblight procs, triggering additional Decrepify CD.
Did not use shadowblight in this testing. You'd see the buff on my bar.
@@MacroBioBoi ah I see
Based on your shadow minions endgame/pit build what aspect would you recommend dropping for this aspect instead?
Hulking
@@MacroBioBoi that's what I was thinking thanks
@@MacroBioBoi ok...just to clarify since there was another opinion posted here. On a Shadow Minion build with a Golem, you'd swap the Hulking aspect instead of the Void aspect for the Aphotic?
@jackwebb2425 Hulking is there for golem CDR so it'd be redundant with bugged Aphotic. Void is there for the Blight package, but if you want to swap out of that, Blood Getters is the go to.
Im sure Blizzard will fix rhis soon, but barbs can still have their broken bugbuild😄
Can this "feature" of 100% lucky hit fit with Andariel's visage helmet for more poison damage?
It only triggers decrepify
part of the potential in this game thumbs up
We now needs attack speed breakpoints for minions!
I thought to gain this ability you had to use raise skeleton to get that timer and that is what the priest effects are. Have I been misunderstanding how to trigger the priest effects?
You are correct
@@MacroBioBoi so with that legendary effect wouldn't you need to be triggering it? When testing with blood wave in both instances I must have missed you triggering the priest to grant the bonus or what else am I missing lol.
I have gotten my necro to 100 and am trying to build it out for dropping ubber boss's and higher pit clears but I can't break 80.
Love all your videos Macro. Thank you for the hard work.
@@Archangelmd You can see when I use Raise Skeleton in the video. I show tests first without triggering it to set a baseline, maybe you stopped after that first part?
Awesome content! Was just curious if there are any youtubers (besides rob) that deep dive like this into barbarians as well? Anyone know?
Rob copies people. Deep Dive ? 😂😂
Any chance this affects the elemental surge temper with shadow damage ?
It does not
I only have the 11% version so far but holy %$@$ does this make bloodmist spammable.. ty!!!!!!
I am using the shadow minion bone prison build that you and raxx have posted
what aspect would I drop from that to apply this one?
sorry im new to this game altogether I have like 5 days on it
You don't have to add it unless you are having cooldown issues. If you want to add it you can drop hulking.
@@MacroBioBoi thank you very much
I am not fully masterworked yet I just have all the affixes and stats on my gear your build has listed like attack speed/crit chance on my rings etc.
The cooldown isnt awful but if I can abuse a bug till its gone why not? LOL
Thank you for replying
I am starting to enjoy your videos more than the game itself.
Can't tell if videos are good, or your enjoyment of the game is dropping xD
I’m running a standard golem necro that uses Kalans edict, if I use aphotic do I need to switch to shadowblight?
Yes
Edit: you don't have to switch for it, but the natural evolution of the build is over to blighted aspect with shadowblight.
Thanks! Would you recommend the shadow variant? Not sure which is stronger for pit or boss 1 shotting?
Would elemental surge trigger the same check, or because it’s an lucky hc itself it wouldn’t?
Asking for a victimize (rogue) friend
Lucky Hit does not beget Lucky Hit unless there is a specific bugged interaction.
so which aspect do we swap out for aphotic?
Hulking
@@MacroBioBoi I already swapped out hulking and void for shaco and sac soul though :_P
Appreciate the video.
This seems only proc decrepify -CD, not other lucky hit effect.
Correct
So can shadow damage crit, I've watched a vid saying you can't but u keep seeing crit damage colour number on shadow damage over time
Damage over time can't crit. Shadow damage on non-DOTs absolutely can crit
Which skills are shadow non-dot?
@@dklien6443 sever, the initial damage of blight, the initial damage of ultimate shadow blood wave, the base damage of ultimate shadow bone storm, the proc off shadowblight
I know you’re a minion man, but I’d really like a breakdown on the issues with sorcs vulnerability problems.
Dude, that's not cool. Nobody deserves to be called a minion.
@@BL00DYME55Wait lol he does look like a minion from despicable me 😭😭
What problems? My sorc is great
@MattyGamer9513 no it's not 😂😂😂 and that my favorite class and have level 100
Probably the wrong channel to ask for specific testing in some class different than the Necro
wait, couldn't you get infinite Bloodmist uptime with this plus the ring of sacrilegious souls and still have all your strong minion stuff? The cooldown reset took 22 seconds on a 50 second skill, so on a 20 second skill it should be like 10 seconds and maybe even less when you slap some Bloodmist Cooldown Reduction on it. Sounds like you could still have your golem hit for billions of damage while being completely immune yourself
How do you think ppl have been doing 130+ pits
@@justinpond7737 from what I've seen so far sorcerer is the only class with close to 100% invulnerability, that's why I'm asking
Is there any way to abuse X'fal with minions like this?
X'fal's only triggers from DoTs. Your skele hits are direct damage.
Casting the priest is increasing attack speed isn't it? The minions are just hitting 4x as many times per second. Run the same test without the aphotic equipped and still spamming skeletal priests to buff the minions attack speed. Probably same results.
Casting priest does not affect attack speed.
I was wondering wtf was going on. I thought my attack speed was just high af and i was getting lucky 😂
Does this kind of answer the mystery of why minions specifically trigger decrepify lucky hit? Its not the minions and decripfy really. Rather, its the stun from decrepify causing the lucky hit procs
The stub on Decrepify is a lucky hit effects itself.
Same thing seems to be happening with the amplify glyph... or am I late to the party and everyone knows this?
What phenomena do you mean?
@@MacroBioBoi I use physical CE with minions, no curse on my bar - Bloodmoon pants have my minions apply Decrep for me. Since I slotted in Amplify glyph, it seemed like Abhorrent Decrep procs much more. I have always used corpse reapers but I don't see why that would proc more often since the cooldown bug is time gated every 10 sec. So it seems to be some kind of interaction with Amplify glyph as that is the only thing I changed.
@@blasphemite interesting. I'll have to test that
is still still active after patch 1.4.1?
Yep
Another Question? There are so many minions and shadow minions builds, ist your shadow minion viable? I saw many builds from pwnyhof with blood Mist. I dont know which is better now. Too much builds 😂
Sir. I believe the more you stack ranks to golem mastery and ranks to hellbent commander and golem dmg, you can clear 130+ pits
@@CalebW451pretty much this
I didn't think minions would get your lucky hit chance
They don't... Except for Decrepify
@MacroBioBoi Oh okay 👍 thanks for the info as always
You so clever man 🫡
that's pretty cool
Are you doing Blizzard math all day or actually play the game?
12:03
:-)
Dude please shhhhh
i feel this season u can look at almost any S tier build that clears deep pit and immediately know they either have a buggy interaction or unintentional double dipping XD blizzard should just observe tier lists and leaderboards and hotfix this kinda stuff the moment it gets discovered cause its kinda lame how these bugged builds skew the power expectation of builds.
Also R.I.P to sorc that cant bug abuse
🤣
I always thought minions had our lucky hit chance since they inherited 100% of our stats...so you are telling me minions are good because they are bugged ? NotLikeThis
Minions are good regardless now. The bugs are just the ability to trigger Abhorent Decrepify's CDR in the first place, and Aphotic adding more triggers to that already bugged interaction. The bugs are purely CDR related. (Well, that and Elixir of Holy Bolts, but that's its own can of worms.)
@Orthus100 I guess. But im playing army of the dead, and without them triggering CDR through decrepify and lucky hit, my build would be shit. That's why im sad knowing it's a bug. Doesn't make make sense to me why Blizzard would not want lucky hit to occur on minions attacks.
does blizzard even test their games
it's ridiculous how much bugs/exploit there are in this game
d4 bugged
Wow, this stuff is complicated, lol
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东西很好，但真的是很啰嗦/
Si