As a 30 year law enforcement officer who supervised the detective division and attended the University of TN Forensic Academy and taught at the law enforcement academy, I would always send the entire piece of clothing so the lab could test various places on the clothing and inspect the entire piece of clothing with equipment. I have written this before: I can't find anything that this police department did correctly thus far. It is an embarrassment to law enforcement. Their mishandling of an investigation could cause an innocent person to be convicted or a guilty person to go free. We will never know what really happened because of this shoddy investigation, which is a disservice to the victim and the defendant.
As a watching juror, this is painful. I'm at the point where I'm waving at the judge and going "Excuse me, your honor? Can we just skip to the deliberations because uhhh, even though I'm supposed to wait for all the information I can't get past the open solo cups of blood in the stop and shop bag. The reasonable doubt has been found, I wanna go home."
Lally calling ryan and his ex was a dumb move bc all they did was contradict each other about seeing john in the car, so it confirms NOTHING which creates DOUBT which is ALL I HAVE FOR THIS CASE!!!!
Replay crew here!! I absolutely love watching EDB’s reaction to all the shenanigans in this investigation. I know what’s coming and her reactions are priceless! It’s also nice to know that I’m not the only one with a similar reaction. DEFCON WTF here we come!!
A major question for me is how did several pieces of tailight wind up being found ON TOP OF SEVERAL INCHES OF SNOW? KR is supposed to have backed into JO prior to several inches of snow falling. So those pieces of tailight magically levitated to the surface of several inches of snow, hours after the supposed accident and were then found by investigators? Common sense would tell you that those pieces shouldn't have been seen until the snow had melted or been removed. This Prosecutions theory of what happened, their timeline and how evidence was discovered MAKES NO SENSE! It's maddening! I guess we're all supposed to turn off our brains and ignore our commonsense.
Karen knows people are going to that house. She doesn't know when they got there. Other car or cars are coming and going. So... with the uncertainties of the coming and going to and from the house, she decides to deliberately run down her boyfriend in front of the house? Why hit him with the back, why not the front of the car which would be much easier. She may have been the most sober person in the bunch. Nothing makes sense.
I think this is a big point! Why wld she choose to hit him after she dropped him off, knowing both that other people might be coming right along (and might actually see her hit him) and that people would be leaving the house relatively soon-ish, might find him, realize she dropped him off, and put two and two together. Excellent point no one else has brought up yet.
I suppose the argument may be that she didn't know that she ran him over? But so far they haven't even proven (or suggested really) that she was intoxicated. And the witnesses thus far have said the vehicle was facing forward where the body was found, so what... she drove forward 50 feet and slammed the car into reverse after she had passed the Albert property to run him over? That feels like a much bigger stretch than the Alberts were involved and are covering something up.
@@VirginiaGeorge she’s charged with second degree manslaughter- there has to be intent to get that. So prosecution can’t argue it was an accident, but I have no idea what they’re up to 2 weeks in 🤷♀️
@@VirginiaGeorge she’s charged with second degree manslaughter- there has to be intent to get that. So prosecution can’t argue it was an accident, but I have no idea what they’re up to 2 weeks in 🤷♀️
And within minutes of being in front of others for hours without tension or arguments, appeared happy to those that were honest about what they saw of their interactions that night. That’s not to say a disagreement can’t explode within a minute, but I think it’s more likely he did make it in the house and something happened between him and Higgins. Did JO know about the flirtation? If so, any sideways comments by BH would likely cause a confrontation. That seems much more plausible than the states theory. And normally I don’t speculate that much, but the lack of credible evidence introduced that doesn’t involve interested parties/witnesses at this point is so frustrating. I’m a science girl. Witness testimony is helpful, but give me some facts that are not so easily disputed left and right!
Were Ryan Nagle and his sister Julie raised by the same parents?!!! 😯Ryan is SO POLITE & trying to be helpful!!! Complete opposite of his sister! Then again, she tells her brother to pick her up, he and his friends go to the trouble to give her a ride and she's like "never mind.. go away". 🤪 spoiled baby sister maybe?
Absolutely, she seems like she was a bully in High School. A big girl who threw her weight around(literally)until she got her way. It’s also clear from her testimony that she had been drinking a lot of beer.
@@jasl9987 Yes! Which is so helpful and I love the timestamps. The times for the DNA testperson got overlooked though, and as I was searching for that myself, I added the comment. 😊
Replay team after the stream - i am still holding out hope that this trial will go somewhere (anywhere) once expert testimony starts to come in - coroner, the wounds, the DNA, phone data. Proctor, Jen will be spicy, add to the coverup theory. But not give me the clarity I need. 😢
YES!! The street does curve slightly! I saw a vid by another creator who was on the street doing an “experiment”, and it’s CLEARLY curved!!! Good observation!!
Earlier in the trial, several people testified that Brian Higgins parked his Jeep on the street by the mailbox after he plowed the driveway before the Alberts drove into the driveway. I think Ryan and ex girlfriend have now refuted that…. But they’re all prosecution witnesses, so 🤷♀️
So we finally get an expert in information I badly want to know and the test is on the freaking shirt and not on the wounds?? Ahhhhhh i need a goat scream.
@@Aja1222 I quit watching the opening statement because there were so many names and I could not follow. I wanted to go back and see what their theory of the case is, but it seems they never presented it so I haven't.
I did that with Depp v. Heard too, the only other trial I've ever watched from start to finish, and it was a JOY to find EDB & LawTube!! I began working in a law firm right at the end of that trial...what a coincidence!! 💜
In regards to everyone coughing in the courtroom......I live 15 minutes away from Dedham, there's alot of respiratory illnesses going around, not just allergies. I work in a Healthcare facility. But allergies are bad here right now too.
14:56 The timestamp on the video doesn’t identify Teri Kun, the first full witness of the day (Forensic Expert). It still lists her as Julie Nagle - Re-Direct. Thanks for all the fantastic coverage!
Just a point about how Bostonians (and other locals) describe direction... unless the Atlantic is right beside us, we have no idea the direction we are facing. We don't give directions in terms of north, south, etc.. We "take a right" or "take a left" and that's about it. so, I find it amusing when the out-of-state lawyers ask witnesses about the direction in which they were driving.
@@galaxyvictoriano9999 Agree, the only reason that I have some idea is that I live reasonably close to the coast so I can say well if that is east then these must be the other directions, other than that I can't do it.
In 🇨🇦 we give directions based on time, place and conditions. For ex, to get to grandmas it’s 3 hrs drive, 4 w/heavy traffic, 2 hrs w/out traffic & pushing the speed limit. It’s half hour past town A, taking highway B. Or you can take the scenic route & make a day of it. It’s 4 hrs to town B, then an hour from there to grandmas. Add 2 hrs for lunch & bathroom stops. We also say up/down for north & south. Ex Its a 4 hr drive up island from town a to town b. Or, if you’re going to drive down to town a from town b, it will take you 1 hr doing the speed limit, you take the 3rd exit past the mall, drive about 20 min, then turn left at the gas station & the house is about 6 blocks past there.
Emily! You are also doing the podcast while we are in this trial? You have a lot of Content for me to watch! Thank you- and I hope I can keep up with you 🙉💜
The text message is photoshopped 💯. 3 smoking guns: 1. The date doesn’t change at midnight. 2. Colin’s messages have no speech bubbles and the font is larger. 3. The dates on Colin’s phone are a different format to Ali’s phone - but they both have iPhones?!?
Right! It seems weird that the others would be "calm" since a fallen coworker is on the front lawn. Seems to me that Karen's reaction makes sense. I would be losing my mind too. But I'll wait to pass judgment. But the prosecution is making it hard.
Karen seems to be having a genuine reaction to seeing her life partner on the ground unresponsive. Everyone else seems to be unbothered at seeing a friend/coworker in that state.
Karen’s reaction isn’t one of someone who hit a 200 pound object and didn’t realize it either- she’s freaked out because this is not the outcome in her wildest imagination she expected to find and she’s filled with panic, horror and grief.
Absolutely and we should thank him for his testicular fortitude for just saying what he saw. This poor town is divided that friends aren’t speaking to each other. It’s become the “townies vs the outsiders”.
@@sashie253 I lived in a small town like Canton. I’m still in the Facebook group & so glad that we moved 😂. I hate that it’s like that for you. There’s often more outsiders than townies. Remember there’s strength in numbers!
As a juror i dont think i would believe these witnesses that were not interviewed immediately. The details some of these folks remember stretch incredulity.
Someone needs to sit Lally down and spend a few days teaching him the difference between evidence and irrelevant information. I bet he’s the kind of guy who tells you every single detail of his life when you ask him what he did over the weekend.
The defence has a job to defend their client they do what they need to do the state is way too long winded they could half their wittnesss and still get to the point of proving anything....
@Emily D. Baker were you trying to drop as many subtle sum 41 references as possible during commentary this stream? Still waiting, in too deep, etc. If so, well done!!! 🎉🎉
Honestly i dont think the state has a chance. They havent proven Karen Read was there and the only reason we know there was even a crime is the body. Seriously can anyone explain what the prosecution has established besides drinks bar after party please?
Glad you had fun at the concert! I know all about having a great time and waking up with the physical consequences of having done so in one's 40s. Usually I do it by hiking as if I was in my 20s but the same principle applies to the subsequent day of feeling sore and sometimes even hungover because I always drink and hike.
@@jay-el-bee Hahahaha Right on! I smoke weed and hike too. lmao It's legal here in California though. I supposed one could get in trouble in the national forest but I usually walk in hills that are presumably not federal. In all honestly, no cop around here is going to show up because someone smells weeds, let alone show up and be willing to get out of their car for a big hike.
No but if when they rest their case they haven't shown the elements of the crime then the defence can ask for one, then the judge decides whether or not to grant it. Its called a directed verdict
@@helensmusings I'll wait to see more of the prosecution's case, but right now they definitely haven't moved me from presumed innocent to guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, and definitely not to a moral certainty which I believe is required in Massachusetts. I don't know how the jurors can stand it!
Im confused about the timeline, so by 12.15 Higgins and Brian sr, the McCabes are all in the house bit where is Higgins truck? I thought he parked on the road or did he come up the driveway? Im cofused about all these ladies messing their rides around. Come get me, ope kidding, never mind that there is a snow storm coming..... no one else find this weird?
Very. I get changing your mind but not once your ride has shown up in a "blizzard" without a pretty good reason. I get Caitlin not wanting to be stuck at her parents house, but I don't get sending her boyfriend home because he has to work soon only to make him drive back halfway through the rest time he had. And no real explanations have been given.
Isn’t Lally running the risk of too many witnesses contradicting each other at this point? Just seems like he’s throwing every witness at it but not much is sticking so far (other than the snow 😂)
When the town asked for an audit of the police department. The town council made them put their hands up to vote. It was approved 903 vs 800. The people who voted in favor are now considered pro Karen instead of pro thorough investigations.
@@lauraramsey905that is so disheartening. Two things can be true at once. You can believe there is corruption in the department and not necessarily believe KR is innocent. I am still keeping an open mind until the end, but the scales are overflowing on the reasonable doubt side and the state is just not moving the needle at all. It seems to get worse the more time goes on. I can’t wait to see the defense cross examine the experts and what their experts will testify to. A lot of the witness testimony has had so many holes poked by the defense, and there are more questions than satisfactory answers as it continues.
It's immaterial at this point, they where all pissed. Basically everyone was pissed and the one they are trying to prove was drunk they can't prove its hilarious.
Why are Richard Dantuono and Ryan Nagle’s ex-girlfriend’s direct-examination SOOO long?! And WHY are half of the prosecution’s objections sustained? The forensic investigator should definitely let the jury know or not whether red solo cups and other “methods” used taint the samples.
I believe it was objected to as it was speculation. If he would have asked HAVE YOU ever used a Red Solo Cup to collect evidence or HAVE YOU ever placed evidence in a Red Solo Cup? Or something along those lines it would have been allowed. But because he asked would you it's speculative. .... however I'm a Paralegal not an attorney so take my opinion with a grain of salt.
Did i actually stop watching this to go watch the "we're all to blame" video Why yes yes i did But now I'm back and ready for the "What if anythings" lets go!
I just love Emily’s irrelevant questions 😂 “what did you order? Who has the best appetisers? Do they have wings?” 😂😂 “are you going to break up? Did you talk about it?” I LOVE IT 😂
I think she is feeling defensive and frustrated because her part of the process was done properly and she feels like she's being held to account for the improper actions of the cops and the state.
@@hnraj9441I think it’s partly because she’s very much a “facts, just the facts” type of person, and she misunderstood when asked the hypothetical scenarios about contamination that she was not being asked to answer to a scientific certainty what happened with the evidence she tested in this case. That’s how I took it.
Just a heads up! you're missing the time stamp between Jule Nagle's redirect and the start of Tammy's (?) testimony. Tammy's testimony starts around 14:30
Time stamps are auto generated. At least for the videos I’ve uploaded to UA-cam. I’ve never typed anything in, they just appear. So I think that’s the case here.
Yes, the bleach thing she's talking about is precisely to avoid contamination at the lab. Not much the lab can do once the cops bungle the evidence collection as much as they did in this case.
THAT is what got me watching this after the fact. I have worked with dogs my whole life. I saw those arm wounds on victim I have spend days in the hospital with them - NO DOUBT in my mind that is a dog attack. I have had them, seen them, worked with GSD (bite work), rehabilitated GSD with issues, worked with a breeder, trained, rescued, etc., etc. The victim was attacked by a dog. Oh! LOOK investigative work done correctly - ON THE PART OF THE DR. LAB ANYWAY…How refreshing! 😂 BUT, NOBODY KNOWS what and where the swabs submitted came from and look at WHEN submitted! 🙁 I LOVE the snark on this lawyer! 😂 You wouldn’t use a solo cup? 😂 His blood could inhibit the sample…AND WHY did they NOT receive the entire clothing item?!?
If I was on this jury, (so without the benefit of validation of others) I’d be blaming myself for not understanding what the prosecution’s version of events is. I would assume I was missing something huge. Having watched other trials , you see how the prosecution build the jigsaw puzzle picture of their case and every witness adds a piece of the picture. The more witnesses, the clearer the end picture becomes. I don’t know what this picture is and how it all fits together 30+ witnesses in. Sheesh.
As a 30 year law enforcement officer who supervised the detective division and attended the University of TN Forensic Academy and taught at the law enforcement academy, I would always send the entire piece of clothing so the lab could test various places on the clothing and inspect the entire piece of clothing with equipment. I have written this before: I can't find anything that this police department did correctly thus far. It is an embarrassment to law enforcement. Their mishandling of an investigation could cause an innocent person to be convicted or a guilty person to go free. We will never know what really happened because of this shoddy investigation, which is a disservice to the victim and the defendant.
Excellent breakdown so interesting with your background and relevant expertise
🎯🎯🎯🎯
It is stomach churning 😮🙈🤮💔
Thanks for confirming my thoughts on this ridiculous police work. Shameful or criminal?
@@eagle-eye29criminally negligent Imho
The Solo Cup question from the attorney and the response from the witness was hilarious 😂
As a watching juror, this is painful. I'm at the point where I'm waving at the judge and going "Excuse me, your honor? Can we just skip to the deliberations because uhhh, even though I'm supposed to wait for all the information I can't get past the open solo cups of blood in the stop and shop bag. The reasonable doubt has been found, I wanna go home."
Mood.
So agree with you...waste of time...let's find out what brand of beer everyone was drinking
I didn’t realize how important it is to be likable as a trial lawyer but Allen is so likable I get happy to hear him do his part lol
Does anyone know if GPS data was pulled on Higgins Jeep or was it rehomed too?
Lally calling ryan and his ex was a dumb move bc all they did was contradict each other about seeing john in the car, so it confirms NOTHING which creates DOUBT which is ALL I HAVE FOR THIS CASE!!!!
💯💯💯
and showed what more genuine witness testimony looks like
Replay crew here!! I absolutely love watching EDB’s reaction to all the shenanigans in this investigation. I know what’s coming and her reactions are priceless! It’s also nice to know that I’m not the only one with a similar reaction. DEFCON WTF here we come!!
Same! She voices what I feel LOL
THANK GOD I found you and your channel!! I finally can feel like I’m watching with my gal pals and laughing . You are always SPOT ON
A major question for me is how did several pieces of tailight wind up being found ON TOP OF SEVERAL INCHES OF SNOW? KR is supposed to have backed into JO prior to several inches of snow falling. So those pieces of tailight magically levitated to the surface of several inches of snow, hours after the supposed accident and were then found by investigators? Common sense would tell you that those pieces shouldn't have been seen until the snow had melted or been removed.
This Prosecutions theory of what happened, their timeline and how evidence was discovered MAKES NO SENSE! It's maddening! I guess we're all supposed to turn off our brains and ignore our commonsense.
Karen knows people are going to that house. She doesn't know when they got there. Other car or cars are coming and going. So... with the uncertainties of the coming and going to and from the house, she decides to deliberately run down her boyfriend in front of the house? Why hit him with the back, why not the front of the car which would be much easier. She may have been the most sober person in the bunch. Nothing makes sense.
I think this is a big point! Why wld she choose to hit him after she dropped him off, knowing both that other people might be coming right along (and might actually see her hit him) and that people would be leaving the house relatively soon-ish, might find him, realize she dropped him off, and put two and two together. Excellent point no one else has brought up yet.
I suppose the argument may be that she didn't know that she ran him over? But so far they haven't even proven (or suggested really) that she was intoxicated. And the witnesses thus far have said the vehicle was facing forward where the body was found, so what... she drove forward 50 feet and slammed the car into reverse after she had passed the Albert property to run him over? That feels like a much bigger stretch than the Alberts were involved and are covering something up.
@@VirginiaGeorge she’s charged with second degree manslaughter- there has to be intent to get that. So prosecution can’t argue it was an accident, but I have no idea what they’re up to 2 weeks in 🤷♀️
@@VirginiaGeorge she’s charged with second degree manslaughter- there has to be intent to get that. So prosecution can’t argue it was an accident, but I have no idea what they’re up to 2 weeks in 🤷♀️
And within minutes of being in front of others for hours without tension or arguments, appeared happy to those that were honest about what they saw of their interactions that night. That’s not to say a disagreement can’t explode within a minute, but I think it’s more likely he did make it in the house and something happened between him and Higgins. Did JO know about the flirtation? If so, any sideways comments by BH would likely cause a confrontation. That seems much more plausible than the states theory. And normally I don’t speculate that much, but the lack of credible evidence introduced that doesn’t involve interested parties/witnesses at this point is so frustrating. I’m a science girl. Witness testimony is helpful, but give me some facts that are not so easily disputed left and right!
You need to make a GIF of the “Red SOLO cup” and “excuse me. What?”response… priceless… imo
So Ricky does flooring!!! Does anyone ask if he has done flooring at the albert’s house???
Were Ryan Nagle and his sister Julie raised by the same parents?!!! 😯Ryan is SO POLITE & trying to be helpful!!! Complete opposite of his sister! Then again, she tells her brother to pick her up, he and his friends go to the trouble to give her a ride and she's like "never mind.. go away". 🤪 spoiled baby sister maybe?
He really seemed very nice and polite. And not quite as fishy as many other witnesses so far.
I agree. The sister came in huffy and defiant.
Absolutely, she seems like she was a bully in High School. A big girl who threw her weight around(literally)until she got her way. It’s also clear from her testimony that she had been drinking a lot of beer.
Omg I was asking myself the same thing... her brother was so respectful compared to her. Maybe she was anxious or told not to talk too much
I love how Emily’s like “what did you think of the breakup?” Cause I had that same question
Ryan N. is a stand up man. Much respect 🙌
The DNA is at 14:38, Cross of DNA at 43:20
"I don't think he was wrestling boars!"
The video is time stamped
@@jasl9987 This timestamp is missing. Not a criticism to the EDB team, but a thank you to @literaturegeek1570.
@@jasl9987 Yes! Which is so helpful and I love the timestamps. The times for the DNA testperson got overlooked though, and as I was searching for that myself, I added the comment. 😊
Thank yooooou, was looking for this
Im rewatching this one. Thanks for your channel!
Sierra Nevada here. Beer is so important to this prosecutor
But they all drink crappy beer.
Replay team after the stream - i am still holding out hope that this trial will go somewhere (anywhere) once expert testimony starts to come in - coroner, the wounds, the DNA, phone data.
Proctor, Jen will be spicy, add to the coverup theory. But not give me the clarity I need. 😢
YES!! The street does curve slightly! I saw a vid by another creator who was on the street doing an “experiment”, and it’s CLEARLY curved!!! Good observation!!
Earlier in the trial, several people testified that Brian Higgins parked his Jeep on the street by the mailbox after he plowed the driveway before the Alberts drove into the driveway. I think Ryan and ex girlfriend have now refuted that…. But they’re all prosecution witnesses, so 🤷♀️
From the sounds of it the snow just started & was described as a dusting so not sure what he was plowing?
So we finally get an expert in information I badly want to know and the test is on the freaking shirt and not on the wounds?? Ahhhhhh i need a goat scream.
Hepatologists must be in great demand in Canton MA!!!!!
I've started watching Lally's direct at 2x speed and it's still slow and monotonous.
😂
Right? The poor jury.. 🥴
Lally's opening statement was the first indicator of how bad his questioning would be. He's continued to be quite flat. 🙁
That would be Hilarious! To watch Lally, the Chipmunk, squeaking " what if anything.." on double speed!! 🐿🤣😂
@@Aja1222 I quit watching the opening statement because there were so many names and I could not follow. I wanted to go back and see what their theory of the case is, but it seems they never presented it so I haven't.
Replay crew- I am loving EDB’s questions better than the prosecution. I am waiting for a dramatic reading of the menus from all 3 locations 😂
I wish the person with the plague would leave the courtroom.
😂😂😂😂
Often it ends up being a juror or essential person that can’t 🤣
The one I saw coughing hard is the woman defense attorney 😮
I would have given up watching this trial if it wasn’t for your commentary Emily. Love your work.
I really appreciate and enjoy going through this process as a juror would.
I did that with Depp v. Heard too, the only other trial I've ever watched from start to finish, and it was a JOY to find EDB & LawTube!! I began working in a law firm right at the end of that trial...what a coincidence!! 💜
Replay crew here. Is it bad that in this case, i instinctively zoom-zoom past the direct examination so i can get to the good stuff?
Me too!!!!
No, it's how I actually get chores done in a timely manner.
It must save hours 😂
I do the same thing. 🙋♀️ the prosecutor is very boring and I can't hear him most of the time.
Sometimes Lally buries himself, but Even then it's not interesting.
It's only been 12 days? My brain hurts...😮
Omgosh. Thank you for your commentary.. so appreciate it..
In regards to everyone coughing in the courtroom......I live 15 minutes away from Dedham, there's alot of respiratory illnesses going around, not just allergies. I work in a Healthcare facility. But allergies are bad here right now too.
Where was Higgins Jeep while they were there to pick up Julie Nagel?
I’ve been listening as part of the replay crew every day and it was not until today I realized you’re calling him Lolly and not Lally 😂
Because he lollygags A LOT. 😂
14:56 The timestamp on the video doesn’t identify Teri Kun, the first full witness of the day (Forensic Expert). It still lists her as Julie Nagle - Re-Direct.
Thanks for all the fantastic coverage!
Here in Amsterdam(the netherlands) we follow everything! We love 🎉😍
Thank you, For covering this important trial. Great analysis learning so much. 🌹🍃🌹🍃🌹🍃🌹
If there are texts when she picked up Colin….? Why are there so many questions about what time he left?
The texts are clearly doctored.
Thank you Emily for all your comments, you makes me smile & laugh in my office (im sure people are wondering what is wrong with me) 😂😂
Just a point about how Bostonians (and other locals) describe direction... unless the Atlantic is right beside us, we have no idea the direction we are facing. We don't give directions in terms of north, south, etc.. We "take a right" or "take a left" and that's about it. so, I find it amusing when the out-of-state lawyers ask witnesses about the direction in which they were driving.
most people dont know which cardinal directions theyre facing, its not just a local thing
@@galaxyvictoriano9999 Agree, the only reason that I have some idea is that I live reasonably close to the coast so I can say well if that is east then these must be the other directions, other than that I can't do it.
In 🇨🇦 we give directions based on time, place and conditions. For ex, to get to grandmas it’s 3 hrs drive, 4 w/heavy traffic, 2 hrs w/out traffic & pushing the speed limit. It’s half hour past town A, taking highway B. Or you can take the scenic route & make a day of it. It’s 4 hrs to town B, then an hour from there to grandmas. Add 2 hrs for lunch & bathroom stops.
We also say up/down for north & south. Ex Its a 4 hr drive up island from town a to town b.
Or, if you’re going to drive down to town a from town b, it will take you 1 hr doing the speed limit, you take the 3rd exit past the mall, drive about 20 min, then turn left at the gas station & the house is about 6 blocks past there.
How can anyone remember what they did 18 months ago , especially when it’s something so mundane ??
….and they were all likely drunk
Emily! You are also doing the podcast while we are in this trial? You have a lot of Content for me to watch! Thank you- and I hope I can keep up with you 🙉💜
At this point I'm convinced Lally's intention is to just lull everyone to sleep
Lully
🎼🎶🎵 Lallybye and goodnight 🎵🎶
FYI - the time stamps in the description seem to be missing the testimony of the expert witness on the Dog DNA
Thank you! I thought I was going bananas. 🤪 This is where I stopped earlier and wanted to continue, but couldn't find it
Just an oversight. Mistakes happen. It was towards the beginning of the day. Emily is premiering the Podcast right now so just let her and Mods know.
starts at the 15 minute mark
@@jenmck23 ya I know, it wasn't a criticism I was just letting them know so the mods can correct
14:38 is when it starts for the DNA
The text message is photoshopped 💯. 3 smoking guns: 1. The date doesn’t change at midnight. 2. Colin’s messages have no speech bubbles and the font is larger. 3. The dates on Colin’s phone are a different format to Ali’s phone - but they both have iPhones?!?
Motion to make the red solo cup an emoji for the members 🤣
Question? Are the jurors going to see the video of Karen running around screaming while the woman next to her just stood there 🚩
Right! It seems weird that the others would be "calm" since a fallen coworker is on the front lawn. Seems to me that Karen's reaction makes sense. I would be losing my mind too. But I'll wait to pass judgment. But the prosecution is making it hard.
Karen seems to be having a genuine reaction to seeing her life partner on the ground unresponsive. Everyone else seems to be unbothered at seeing a friend/coworker in that state.
Karen’s reaction isn’t one of someone who hit a 200 pound object and didn’t realize it either- she’s freaked out because this is not the outcome in her wildest imagination she expected to find and she’s filled with panic, horror and grief.
@@noreengardner1075and it’s definitely not someone’s reaction who intentionally murdered another…
They already saw it during LEO testimony, but will see it again during defense's arguments.
Ryan nagel is the only truthful and non word salad witness so far
Absolutely and we should thank him for his testicular fortitude for just saying what he saw. This poor town is divided that friends aren’t speaking to each other. It’s become the “townies vs the outsiders”.
@@lauraramsey905 testicular fortitude 😂😂😂
@@lauraramsey905fun fact: it's aLWaYs been townies vs outsiders here, only difference is now eVeRYone is clear what that means, not just the townies🙃
@@sashie253
I lived in a small town like Canton. I’m still in the Facebook group & so glad that we moved 😂. I hate that it’s like that for you. There’s often more outsiders than townies. Remember there’s strength in numbers!
This defense team is a pleasure to watch!!
Agreed! The amount of prep they have done is evident
We don’t often see such good defense layering here lol
Agreed! I really like their style, how they question, and how they have their case put together.
As a juror i dont think i would believe these witnesses that were not interviewed immediately. The details some of these folks remember stretch incredulity.
My car has wings 🤣😂😘💜 You are hilarious 💜
Someone needs to sit Lally down and spend a few days teaching him the difference between evidence and irrelevant information.
I bet he’s the kind of guy who tells you every single detail of his life when you ask him what he did over the weekend.
Lol.What you're saying actually apply to the defence a lot more than the prosecution.
The defence has a job to defend their client they do what they need to do the state is way too long winded they could half their wittnesss and still get to the point of proving anything....
I love this comment
He could have been walking on the side of the road and got attacked by a wild bore....
There is no evidence that did Not happen 🤷🏻♀️🐐💜
Makes as much sense as anything at this point 😅
Honestly makes more sense than anything else we've seen for 12 days lol
Haha
The labelling for the forensic scientist says julie nagle, but i am pretty sure thats was the previous witness.
I'm still waiting for why these charges were brought and why there is so much animosity tiwards Karen Read.
Sacrificial lamb, non-family.
@Emily D. Baker were you trying to drop as many subtle sum 41 references as possible during commentary this stream? Still waiting, in too deep, etc. If so, well done!!! 🎉🎉
Heme is not the same as hemoglobin. But both indicate possible presence of blood.
Honestly i dont think the state has a chance. They havent proven Karen Read was there and the only reason we know there was even a crime is the body. Seriously can anyone explain what the prosecution has established besides drinks bar after party please?
Snow, it was snowing 😂
Not a single thing
Red solo cups are forensically sterile in Canton
Don’t forget the donuts😂😂
@@lauraramsey905, this. This is what they have proven. And that the entire Albert family drinks crappy beer.
These defense attys did their homework.
I would say that samples collected and stored incorrectly could certainly be corrupted 😳🙄
Glad you had fun at the concert! I know all about having a great time and waking up with the physical consequences of having done so in one's 40s. Usually I do it by hiking as if I was in my 20s but the same principle applies to the subsequent day of feeling sore and sometimes even hungover because I always drink and hike.
You always drink and hike?! We could definitely be friends! 😆
@@jay-el-bee Hahahaha Right on! I smoke weed and hike too. lmao It's legal here in California though. I supposed one could get in trouble in the national forest but I usually walk in hills that are presumably not federal. In all honestly, no cop around here is going to show up because someone smells weeds, let alone show up and be willing to get out of their car for a big hike.
Can a case be dismissed when the prosecution doesn't get to the point in a certain amount of time?
No but if when they rest their case they haven't shown the elements of the crime then the defence can ask for one, then the judge decides whether or not to grant it. Its called a directed verdict
@@helensmusings I'll wait to see more of the prosecution's case, but right now they definitely haven't moved me from presumed innocent to guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, and definitely not to a moral certainty which I believe is required in Massachusetts. I don't know how the jurors can stand it!
Im confused about the timeline, so by 12.15 Higgins and Brian sr, the McCabes are all in the house bit where is Higgins truck? I thought he parked on the road or did he come up the driveway?
Im cofused about all these ladies messing their rides around. Come get me, ope kidding, never mind that there is a snow storm coming..... no one else find this weird?
Very. I get changing your mind but not once your ride has shown up in a "blizzard" without a pretty good reason.
I get Caitlin not wanting to be stuck at her parents house, but I don't get sending her boyfriend home because he has to work soon only to make him drive back halfway through the rest time he had.
And no real explanations have been given.
I think he's what we call here a Tinner. They work with the duct work in hvac. 1:14:08
I so bad wanted him to say “feet down ass up” when lolly asked how Heather was positioned. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ryan Nagle reminded me with all his body movements, Danno,Danny from Hawaii five-o,Scott caan!!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣
15:20 - Forensic Veterinary Genetics - Testimony
Isn’t Lally running the risk of too many witnesses contradicting each other at this point? Just seems like he’s throwing every witness at it but not much is sticking so far (other than the snow 😂)
I'm gonna replay crew the afternoon, and with Lally it's the greatest 2x speed gift ever!! Hahaha 🤣
Dog DNA expert starts at 15:01 🐶🧬
I hope there was draining of the swamp at this police station. I wouldn’t trust these people.
When the town asked for an audit of the police department. The town council made them put their hands up to vote. It was approved 903 vs 800. The people who voted in favor are now considered pro Karen instead of pro thorough investigations.
@@lauraramsey905that is so disheartening. Two things can be true at once. You can believe there is corruption in the department and not necessarily believe KR is innocent. I am still keeping an open mind until the end, but the scales are overflowing on the reasonable doubt side and the state is just not moving the needle at all. It seems to get worse the more time goes on. I can’t wait to see the defense cross examine the experts and what their experts will testify to. A lot of the witness testimony has had so many holes poked by the defense, and there are more questions than satisfactory answers as it continues.
Just had a thought, could Jen McCabe have wanted to give them a lift so they would/could find John as they left but no-one mentioned it?
She just said that they rolled the window down. Her BF said that they opened the passenger door and the back door to the jump seat 😮 2:44:22
It's immaterial at this point, they where all pissed. Basically everyone was pissed and the one they are trying to prove was drunk they can't prove its hilarious.
Why are Richard Dantuono and Ryan Nagle’s ex-girlfriend’s direct-examination SOOO long?! And WHY are half of the prosecution’s objections sustained? The forensic investigator should definitely let the jury know or not whether red solo cups and other “methods” used taint the samples.
I didn’t understand that either
I believe it was objected to as it was speculation. If he would have asked HAVE YOU ever used a Red Solo Cup to collect evidence or HAVE YOU ever placed evidence in a Red Solo Cup? Or something along those lines it would have been allowed. But because he asked would you it's speculative. .... however I'm a Paralegal not an attorney so take my opinion with a grain of salt.
@@jaimiemason4933 “would you” isn’t speculative when you’re asking an expert witness a question. Or was she not deemed an expert?
@@jaimiemason4933 also I like your input!
@@basicallyno1722she was never offered to be qualified as an expert by lolly 💀
Did i actually stop watching this to go watch the "we're all to blame" video
Why yes yes i did
But now I'm back and ready for the "What if anythings" lets go!
I really liked Ryan’s demeanor on the stand. He seemed to be very respectful
I live in north- central Massachusetts; pollen was all over my car yesterday
I just love Emily’s irrelevant questions 😂 “what did you order? Who has the best appetisers? Do they have wings?” 😂😂 “are you going to break up? Did you talk about it?” I LOVE IT 😂
I'm so behind on this trial but I'm here for you loving Offspring and Interrupters 🤘
Why does the witness look so pissed off? 51:33 Asking her questions is why she is there?
Thought she got snarky when the defense asked questions. Clearly biased imo. Was she paid?
I think she is feeling defensive and frustrated because her part of the process was done properly and she feels like she's being held to account for the improper actions of the cops and the state.
@@hnraj9441 agreed! I’d NOT want my name on that crap.
The way the defense asks questions seriously comes off as accusatory, no matter the witness or question.
@@hnraj9441I think it’s partly because she’s very much a “facts, just the facts” type of person, and she misunderstood when asked the hypothetical scenarios about contamination that she was not being asked to answer to a scientific certainty what happened with the evidence she tested in this case. That’s how I took it.
Your reactions were especially hilarious today to Lally’s questions.
Idk if this was answered but yes, the street does curve. I'm a little late
Watching from Cleveland, Ohio and drinking diet coke.
A friend of a friend of mine drove a Deloraine with plates that read Tardis. The nerdy is strong with the good people in my orbit.
2:33:20 EDB everything about this case could have been quicker 🐐😵💫
Just finally getting to this. So excited 🎉🎉🎉
I wonder if there are Feds listening in the courtroom or watching the stream as part of their investigation.
Just a heads up! you're missing the time stamp between Jule Nagle's redirect and the start of Tammy's (?) testimony. Tammy's testimony starts around 14:30
Badly done.
???????
Time stamps are auto generated. At least for the videos I’ve uploaded to UA-cam. I’ve never typed anything in, they just appear. So I think that’s the case here.
Yes, the bleach thing she's talking about is precisely to avoid contamination at the lab. Not much the lab can do once the cops bungle the evidence collection as much as they did in this case.
However, as long as the evidence wasn't contaminated with the genetic information from another dog, it's easy to tell between human and canine DNA.
lol My first question also was what, exactly, was swabbed and sent to her for processing.
The witnesses closely related to the Albert's remember the SUV moving, the friends of Julie's brother who are further removed, don't recall it moving
Go Ags! Excellent vet program there!
I wonder if Ryan and Ricky were at CF McCarthys the same time as John and Karen?
Is it common practice for the Mass Crime Lab to only send swabs and not the articles to be tested? Was this done in the Walshe case as well?
The judge kind of looks like my son’s first grade teacher 😆
Thanks Emily 💜 you’re the best.
Hey just so you know, the timestamps are missing the expert witness! Love you Emily!
THAT is what got me watching this after the fact. I have worked with dogs my whole life. I saw those arm wounds on victim I have spend days in the hospital with them - NO DOUBT in my mind that is a dog attack. I have had them, seen them, worked with GSD (bite work), rehabilitated GSD with issues, worked with a breeder, trained, rescued, etc., etc. The victim was attacked by a dog. Oh! LOOK investigative work done correctly - ON THE PART OF THE DR. LAB ANYWAY…How refreshing! 😂 BUT, NOBODY KNOWS what and where the swabs submitted came from and look at WHEN submitted! 🙁 I LOVE the snark on this lawyer! 😂 You wouldn’t use a solo cup? 😂 His blood could inhibit the sample…AND WHY did they NOT receive the entire clothing item?!?
If I was on this jury, (so without the benefit of validation of others) I’d be blaming myself for not understanding what the prosecution’s version of events is. I would assume I was missing something huge.
Having watched other trials , you see how the prosecution build the jigsaw puzzle picture of their case and every witness adds a piece of the picture. The more witnesses, the clearer the end picture becomes.
I don’t know what this picture is and how it all fits together 30+ witnesses in. Sheesh.
If I was on this jury I think id be focused entirely on just trying to remain conscious and at least look like i am paying attention.
@@hnraj9441 true story 🤣
A weather app can tell the snowfall that night by the hour.
I’m so far behind, I hope I can catch up to watch these live 😅