Turning Into Disaster (Air India Flight 855) - DISASTER BREAKDOWN
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- Опубліковано 17 жов 2024
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Twitter: / chloe_howiecb
The case of Air India Flight 855 is one of the Worst Air Disasters ever recorded. On the first night 1978, in the dark night sky, this massive plane photographed plunged into the Arabian sea less than two minutes after takeoff. This was a devastating case that really was a simple accident, yet it claimed so many lives. The accident involved the largest plane of the day, the Boeing 747.
The Boeing 747 today is in its Twilight years, yet it is still one of if not the most iconic plane to ever fly. For the longest time there was no plane as big as it, no plane commanded such awe as the four engine Queen of the Sky. We’re going to unpack how this very short flight unfolded. Lets travel to India and see if we can gain an understanding as to how these lives were lost.
#aviation
Sources:
aviation-safet...
baaa-acro.com/...
issuu.com/band...
procaffenation...
simpleflying.c...
www.nytimes.co...
www.nytimes.co...
www.nytimes.co...
www.independen...
web.archive.or...
• Turn Coordinator VS Tu...
airandspace.si....
www.indiatoday...
diabetes.org/t....
www.diabetes.o...
If you found this video to be interesting, be sure to subscribe as there is a new video every Saturday. This video also went out to my Patrons on Patreon 48 hours before going out publicly. Consider joining here from £1 per month: www.patreon.com/DisasterBreakdown
Twitter: twitter.com/Chloe_HowieCB
Great video, could you do a similar video with air India flight 182 bombing? That would be awesome
A very good video but i have a question.
When are u going to make a video about Air India 182?
@@mikesusiest.
Please call it Stick or Yoke and not Wheel -.- it's not a DC3 :D
TL:DR - In the space of 120 seconds the plane took off, banked too sharply and crashed.
From the CVR it seems obvious that Boeing's claim that the instrument didn't fail is bogus given that both the captain "my instrument" and the flight engineer "don't use that one" referenced the faulty instrument.
Never ever trust Boeing.
Maybe they assumed the captain’s was faulty
That's where you are best with a Swiss Army Knife dangling on a string.
@@20chocsadayThat's a common misconception. Acceleration is indistinguishable from gravity, so a weight on a string (or your inner ears) cannot tell you which way is down. If you do a barrel roll correctly, the string will point to the floor of the aircraft the whole time, even when the aircraft is upside down.
@@kkobayashi1 True, but I did not offer the idea for use in extreme circumstances. Only desperate ones
There is one final tragic point to bring up. Almost 22 years later, on the 22nd of December 1999, a near identical accident to Air India Flight 855 took place. Korean Air Cargo Flight 8509 from Seoul, South Korea to Milan, Italy had just taken off from Stansted International Airport in London, England. In this case, the Captain's Attitude Direction Indicator malfunctioned, tricked them into thinking they were flying straight and level when they were genuinely rolling to the left. A very interesting power and cultural dynamic led the First Officer to not intervene, and the Boeing B747 crashed shortly take-off. All four people onboard were killed. Perhaps this incident is best saved for another day, and another video.
ROKAF Culture
@@joaobaptista8377 more like entirety of asian culture
@@kuro9410_ilust no
"Almost 21 years later, on the 22nd of December 1999"
That would be almost 22 years.
@@knrdvmmlbkkn Thanks.
I remember the Emperor Ashoka crash vividly. I was about 12 years old. I was in Bombay at the time, and my home was right by the beach, not too far from the airport. I vividly remember a loud thunderous explosion, and everyone in my family wondered what it was. Given that it was January 1st, we all thought it was just fireworks. But we still felt it was too loud for it to be fireworks. Later that night, when we turned on the TV we heard that a plane had crashed upon takeoff. For months after that, I still remember seeing shoes, bags, and other personal items float up to the shore where I lived. It was terrible. After that, aside from news reports and such, didn't hear much about that crash until this video. Thanks for making this video.
Do you live in Juhu?
Wow. That must have been incredibly disturbing and difficult for a young child to comprehend.
gyaniadmi2347 That person is making things up for feeding his megalomania
Hmmm u must be riiicch living by the beach n Mumbai!
What really sucks about this disaster is that it happened right during the 2nd most critical phase of flying, the initial climb. when you only have 2000 feet between you and the ocean surface, you had maybe...20 seconds time from the intial 'toppling' of the captain's ADI to the plane hitting the ocean? 20 seconds for the copilot and flight engineer to react. 20 seconds for all 3 crew members to look at the damn backup ADI in the center and use it to level off. And then check if it matches the copilots.
RIP to the 200 people aboard this ill fated queen of the skies.
So much like KAL 8509 - including the flight engineer being the only one who truly knew what was going on.
which country is it from
@@carterstoinis3397 Korean Air Cargo, departing London Stansted in December 1999.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Cargo_Flight_8509
@@carterstoinis3397 KAL- Korean Air Lines Flight, this was a cargo aircraft which crashed shortly after takeoff. If you such up KAL 8509 you should see some videos :)
That CVR transcript is tragic. “Bank.”
Thanks for making this video and giving tribute to all the unfortunate souls who lost their life on that fateful day.
AMEN!!!🙏😢✈️❣️
My father, brother and I flew first class on this aircraft from Heathrow to Delhi via Paris (Orly), Frankfurt and Beirut in early May 1975. My brother (9) and I (15) were lucky given the opportunity to share the jump seat behind our Csptain during takeoff and climb out of Paris that day. The Emperor Ashoka was beautiful aircraft with Air India's distinct ornate interior decor. What a tragic end for such a magnificent 747.
Adi wás called artificial horizon before. The. New name is more accurate.
I miss those days when kids could go to the cockpit and meet the pilots. It was my dream job growing up, but unfortunately I never grew tall enough to make my dream a reality.
sian2337 Life has its schema for everything.
Thank you so much for sharing your personal moments, life thoughts with us.
And indeed, those were classier yet relaxed, happier times.
Much wishes and prayers for you to have peace, joy in life.
We all appreciate your hard work on creating this informative content…Thank you.
Thank you so much for watching.
Blame the dead guy, protect the megacorp, nothing new here.
Great video
Can you do a video on All Nippon Airways flight 58 (involving a mid air collision with a 727 and a JASDF F-86 Sabre)? It’s a very overlooked accident, and it will make for a quite interesting video.
I'm glad you're bringing this up.
When you look up how many planes went down due to a single instrument or pitot tube failure in an otherwise perfectly fine airplane, you can't help but wonder why so many people had to die for no good reason at all.
In this particular case Boeing is going extra cheap by just accusing the pilot of being under the influence.
As these kinds of disasters keep on happening, I do not get the feeling, that these types of problems are adequately addressed by the FAA or the industry as a whole.
Those pitot tubes sure seem to play a part in a lot of accidents. Seems like they could come up with a better design or something.
It would be good if there was a different way of measuring airspeed, in fact two different techniques to show which one was wrong.
Shit! Have 3,4,5,6 pito tubes on the bottom of the plane. How do they argue redundancy with those if you can have a fatal flight with only one malfunctioning… sheesh…
Hello Chloe. I enjoy your videos so much. You did another great job on today’s episode. Until I started watching your videos, I never realized how important pitot tubes are. I am always surprised how many air accidents happen because of a small failures in instruments or their performance.
This is my shocked Pikachu face at Boeing denying any responsibility in the most ridiculous way imaginable.
On the note of other flights, I cannot imagine being on that Qatar flight and the crew just deciding to continue on as normal after plunging at such a speed. That's kiss-the-ground-when-you-deplane type stuff.
It feels intuitively weird, but why should they have returned instead of proceeding? The emergency was over, and returning would delay the passengers severely as well as costing a fortune in fuel, labor, and possibly hotel bills for everyone onboard with no real reason. And what would they have done when they returned to make the flight safer? I'm not sure I agree with that part of your comment.
Thanks for covering this air crash. Even though this was a very big accident, this was not covered much by the western media. Thankyou ❤
Yes indeed
Chloe, your videos are always a masterclass in production, explanation, and narration. Thank you for your excellent and accessible work!
his name is chloe ? AHAHAHAHHAH XD!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@@liukang3545 *her
@@kais3297 HAHAHAHAHA ITS A GIRL NARRATING ? HAHAHAHAHHAAHA ARE YOU KIDDING ME? ;D
@@liukang3545 and exactly what is so funny about that….
@@liukang3545 i didn't know either but you don't have to act that shock bro
As soon as you sad that a captain's side instrument failed, I was like "oh no, it's gonna be a crew management problem again :("
It wasn't really a CRM problem tho, the problem was that both the FO and the Flight Engineer spoke in a very unclear way 😕
Though in such a situation, it's probably understandable that you get nervous and don't clearly articulate what you want to say. It'd be unfair to blame anyone here tbh, Boeing is hardly responsible for a random Artifical Horizon error and the pilots didn't have any point of reference in the pitch black night... R.I.P. everyone on board 🙁
@@KoffinKat Boeing was responsible for this. They had a bad reputation for many equipment failures. And they had many crashes.
@@aasamspb967 Did Boeing make the instrument or did they buy it in the same way that the car industry operates?
@@20chocsaday But it is Boeing's responsibility to get better equipment.
If Boeing didn't know about the equipment failure then the companies of the respective equipments should be blamed.
@@aasamspb967 equipments fail. That's why there were 3 of them. It was low class on Boeing's side to put the Captain's name on the dirt, but no plane should be crashing due to an ADI malfunction when you still have 2 others working in perfect condition.
Thank you so much for covering this incident. There is so less information available on the internet regarding this accident but bang ! You covered it. The Qatar Airways incident gave me goosebumps because throughout the video I was thinking that it doesn't and cannot happen in modern aircrafts. It's so unfortunate , wish there was something that we could train humans to not to lose spatial orientation !
Pilots are trained not to lose their orientation during instrument failures, but since it's so rare they rarely ever use that training unless they're in a simulator with a check airman or instructor looking over their shoulder, when they KNOW something bad is about to happen. In real life they don't know when something bad is about to happen, but they should always trust their instruments, no matter how they feel, and check the backup ADI when in doubt. Those two items should be automatic. That's basic instrument training.
Great video! I really appreciate the extra effort you put in to research all the evidence
Another well researched and brilliantly edited and narrated video. Boeing does seem to have a history of telling mistruths to minimise their culpability when things go wrong. I’m afraid I have little trust in them now as their automatic defence invariably blames the pilot. Whilst in this case pilot error was critical, the Captain’s confusion was caused by the ineffective artificial horizon so Boeing should shoulder some of the blame.
Things break, which is why Boeing had redundant instruments in the cockpit as backup. The first officer's instrument was working fine, and the comparator also worked fine. The Captain for some inexplicable reason chose to ignore the signs. Why should Boeing be at fault?
@@tiadaid It is true that Adi breaks down in every type of plane, but this does not change the fact that Boeing blaming the pilot for intentionally crashing the plane is very inappropriate, I will also add that the captain did not ignore the second pilot's instrument, but there was probably a misunderstanding between the crew
Chloe, thank you for another incredible video 💖
Something that leaps out at me is okay but, what was the crew dynamic. To me the F/E could say hey no look at the backup ADI, because he was older than the Captain or /O, so they'd look up to him. I'm wondering if the F/O didn't feel comfortable speaking up and just said yes, mine has toppled because it wasn't showing straight and level, as well as not feeling able to speak up due to a lack of what we now know as CRM
This is surely one of your very best, Chloe. I treat these productions now as works of art - every word well chosen and in the right place, excellent clear graphic diagrams where needed, a beautifully-paced narration, the whole work being a rare delight for me to follow. Thank you so much, Numero Uno! lol
Thanks for reliably delivering, the effort really shows 💜
That was a great video Chloe! Thanks for all the hard work.
I would like to make a point regarding this accident as well. An important point here was that the whole idea of crew resource management (CRM) was not such a well-known training aspect back then. In fact it was quite common for less experienced first officers to rarely speak up and contradict the captain as they felt they were not nearly as experienced as the captain. This was very common in the culture in India at the time as well. In many fields in fact. So unfortunately I feel if there is a better CRM the pilot monitoring certainly would’ve taken aircraft himself and corrected issue rather than not speaking up. There’s been numerous accidents and you know in the past regarding failure of CRM and now much less since training hasn’t been Instituted. However it should be said that the culture of experience and higher rank in India during the time contributed to this accident as well
Thank you for covering this one. It is almost as if no one remembers this incident!
Honestly i really like you vids man especially the 747's air disaster documentaries i hope you upload more of those vids
The tragedy is compounded by the fact that the accident could have been avoided had proper CRM training been a priority in those days. As you said, there is a reason for the redundancies in instrumentation and in other flight systems. Had they been utilized effectively... well... Keep up the excellent work!
Unless you are at low altitude, and heading for a mountain range, when in doubt, fly straight and level. The dregs in your coffee cup don't lie.
Then monitor ALL instruments, take time to work out the solution, then have another cup of coffee and a final chat before you put your plans into action.
An experienced pilot should know roughly the requires settings and thrusts for level flight. If these are not happening as you start any manoeuvre, stop and work it out again. There's no shortage of sky.
If all that fails, keep a safety margin of altitude, before working out the simplest and straightest way of getting back on the ground.
Stay classy, Boeing 😒 Thanks for this video Chloe, you do great work!!
It wasn’t Boeing’s fault. It’s amusing how you all a Boeing haters seemingly want Boeing to be perfect when that’s an impossible reality. Airbus isn’t perfect either and has been having many problems throughout its history too. Including this year (2024.
Hey! Thanks a lot, I remember asking for this video on AI 855. Thanks a bunch
As usual Chloe, your videos have superb narration and keep me enthralled. Love this channel ❤️💙 blessings to you and yours and your followers
There are so many air disasters which would not have happened if the flight had been during the day. It would be an interesting endeavor to research and compile a list of each one. This crash, American 965, AeroPeru 603, AirFrance 447, Copa 201, Gulf Air 072, Flash 604, Kenya 507, FlyDubai 981, maybe Birgenair 301, etc, etc… To make an exhaustive list would take quite a bit of time.
I’m very weary of all videos on UA-cam today with it being April 1st. Thank you Chloe for this video. 😊 fantastic as always.
Hear me out. Your videos are priceless. Im going thru some dark dark stuff and after being able to sleep ( the pill way ) each day like in to a coma, I started listening to your videos about 90 mins before each time, laying in bed. Last night I had a absolute f***** realistic feeling dream where I was in a plane crashing in to the ocean. Idk man still I am hooked. After the wake-up phase being totally stressed out, I now find myself kind of cool with the expierence. It's surreal. Haven't gone there before.
I'm amazed by knowledge you have and how much research you do. Good on ya!
As always, great video, thanks!
Another well done presentation. I was not familiar with this accident. As always, I learned something despite being fascinated by passenger plane accidents and reading whatever I could find about them. And that began the same year this crash occurred after an accident affected me personally. I like all your content, but these days I am particularly interested in crashes from the propliner era. I am not as familiar with crashes prior to 1970 or so. So I am looking forward to any future episodes covering that period.
Is it possible for you to do Korean Air Cargo Flight 8509 which crashed in the Same problem like flight 855
I remember that day very well. It was new year, I was 16 years old. living in the suburb of Bandra (Bombay), along the shoreline where the plane crashed.
We had gone for a new year family gathering (in the city) and returned home after midnight. Saw big crowds along the shoreline and lights on the sea. Then realized it was a plane crash.
Another interesting tidbit... At that time, my classmates' father had a senior position in charge of Air India's engineering maintenance. After the crash, he got demoted and transferred to New York.
_(Which seemed to work very well for my classmate)_
I was living at Prabhadevi Sea Face during that time. On thar night which was a Sunday, we were watching the weekend film and distinctly remember hearing a thud. Later we came to know that a plane has crashed off Bandra coast. Next few days Navy choppers came very close to the beach looking for debris. I was only 10 yrs old. 45 years back....
I will never understand why a pilot monitoring doesn't take control when they see the pilot in control making a huge mistake. My instructor would purposely make a smallish mistake to make certain I was paying attention and ask or correct the deviation or mistake, this taught me a great lesson as I did not pick up the temporary lack of carb heat when it was needed, he asked me what was wrong with our decent, then I leaned to always pay attention to what is going on especially critical points of the flight. To be an instrument rated comercial pilot with a perfectly working ADI in front of him and do nothing is very very hard to understand, self preservation at the very least shoukd kick in, see this too often where a FO will just watch the train wreck (that he/she happens to be on)...difficult to understand for me, humans make mistakes and that is why there is more than one in the cockpit of a commercial flight. The captain is ultimately to blame as he is the captain but the FO has a massive burden also, this definitely shouldn't have happened.
This happened because in an era before CRM, the culture of authority/seniority among flight crews, plus deference to age and experience that occurs in some cultures especially Asian ones, means that a subordinate or younger crew member may not challenge an older or more senior colleague even if they are obviously making a mistake.
@@Sashazur definitely agree
Sounds as if you had a good flight instructor. It's hard to understand how that co pilot didn't do anything to correct the Captain's mistake. Maybe he was just as confused as the Captain. More likely it came down to poor cockpit resource management.
@@kevinmalone3210 had to been the issue, but if you see your colleague doing something that will kill himself and you, as a pilot no way could I sit by and do nothing...👍
I believe it was a culture of authority especially in those days. And after watching all of these crash videos, I feel it's also the junior pilot's faith in the experience of the senior pilot. No one expects death to be a sure outcome and keeps quiet because he's scared of speaking up. There's no seniority after death. They probably think, the older pilot has seen and handled such situations numerous times and will handle it. And should be able to handle it. They don't anticipate death until it actually comes and in air disasters it's often a matter of seconds.
If you are interested in a unique incident look into Qantas flight 30. It depressurised when an O2 bottle ruptured and rocketed from the hold into the cabin.
Yes I second this suggestion!!
Since it happened, that has been my "favorite incident" in terms of how unlikely the sequence of events was but there being good solid evidence that it happened!
They did a pretty good job of following up the findings with looking for evidence of problems with other oxygen bottles. So I'm not sure there's much they left out, which is what this channel is so good in digging out and highlighting but perhaps we will see...
Hey! I've been a fan of your content for a while, and one thing I was always confused about was attitude vs altitude... I think it would make a good short video to explain the difference. It might also be good to have shorts explaining other common terms/tools so you don't have to redefine them every time.
It would be very off putting to new viewers just to be bombarded with jargon with no explanations given. I dont mind them they help remind me too as a non pilot :)
Once you’ve been bitten by the
av-geek virus, all these unfamiliar phrases will become first and foremost in everything you say and do!
Attitude: the position of the plane in respect to the horizon…going up, down banking left and right.
Altitude: simply the height of a plane from either sea level or ground level.
Above sea level is based on atmospheric pressure and is subject to errors if not calibrated exactly. Not as big a problem flying at a higher ‘Altitude’
Above ground altitude is more exacting as it is an electronic radar that works like a radar gun but instantly calculating and showing distance to the ground and not speed.☺️
@@57Jimmy I'll probably only add to the to the confusion by pointing out that aircraft attitude isn't about "going up"/"going down", it's about the aircraft's nose pointing up or down relative to the horizon. (And in the case of an erroneous instrument, we are talking about the real horizon, not what the instrument indicates). It's particularly important to understand the difference for accident investigations, as the aircraft often has a nose high attitude but is "going down"! (Stalled).
@@alanm8932 thanks for clarifying this. I know what you say is correct, I just cant think of the right words to describe what I try to say!😂👴🏻
This same thing happened to COPA AIRLINES a 737. Flying at cruise over the Amazon the captain initiated a turn to the right and his ADI stuck in that attitude. He performed his rollout to the left and just kept going until it rolled over inverted and eventually broke apart after over-speeding durning the dive to the forest. This happened in pure darkness over the Amazon forest, obviously having no reference to the horizon. Interestingly the gyro source switch was found with “both” on #1 system. That little standby ADI has its own gyro “inside” the instrument. My guess is that it was operating normally. Lasers, fiber optics, and newer glass has made aviation safer, unfortunately even with safer systems “spatial disorientation” will always be a lurking danger.
2:38 So he was in India Air before he got to Air India, nice!
Such a pity as all the captain had to do is look at the heading stability to see if the plane really was banking or not.
It’s crazy that Boeing was more interested in saving face, and saving money in a lawsuit, rather than trying to get to the truth. 😢
They went about it in a horrible way I agree , it was ultimately not their fault and they should not have been sued but yeah they should not have gone about it that way
@@lonemaus562 it’s very sad
What I like most about this channel is that older crashes are covered. Mentour is great but I'm more interested in actual crashes up to the 80s.
great video, as always!
I only pilot (and even fly) myself in video games, specifically VTOL VR, the idea that someone wouldn't notice that an instrument displays data that just doesn't seem right, like an artificial horizon not moving with flight control inputs, bothers me, especially an experienced pilot, but sadly it seems to be a quite common occurence.
lol give it a rest
I've been researching why the pilot didn't follow the co-pilots ADI instead. Thanks for posting this in word form (other than other resources on the internet) about this accident. Quick question, can you check out Delta 723? And keep up the good work, Chloe.
I was on a flight recently where the plane had to take off on a moonless night over the sea. After reading about numerous crashes partly caused by no visual reference I must admit to feeling slightly nervous.
A very good video but i have a question.
When are u going to make a video about Air India 182?
Tbh it was just a bomb went off there’s no detail to be explained
Look forward to that cheery Hello every week! Another top video from the top plane crash channel on UA-cam. That extra info about the pilot and the lawsuit was super interesting. I don't think he was drunk either. He obviously loved his job so much that he worked hard to control his diabetes properly so he could fly. Responsible diabetics don't drink a lot! Smh
It was a India’s first Boeing 747 that crashed the Arabian Sea in 1978. It was the first delivery of Air India is first is Boeing 747. It accidentally crashed in the Arab heading to Dubai.
I just piloted a Piper Cub, many years ago.
However, I'm a passionate for aviation and I kept following all my life aviation safety, issue that leads me to follow also this channel, alas enjoying its balanced approach.
I'd say, thus, that the artificial horizon failure was just a - very important - contributing factor.
It needs to be seen within the cultural environment of the time, regarding the airline safety and the flight management. Both the PIC and the PIM failed to assess the situation and act accordingly, but the warnings failed also to give an essential contribution to the situational awareness.
The alcohol issue was probably irrelevant, as it wouldn't interfere in the technique of flying, either as to the information that instruments didn't provide or the poor flight management in the cockpit.
Having just flown into Mumbai last night on the Dreamliner as PF. This was a great watch. CHEERS CHLOE
You could read a shopping list and I'd be enthralled.....you have an amazing voice!
Thank you so much for your in depth investigations.
Thanks highlighting other similar incidents. The recent Qatar incident was perhaps made worse by the pilots refusal to acknowledge what passengers must clearly have noticed given the rapid altitude loss.
Excellent investigation by the narrator.
Very detailed and one of the best I have heard.
Very enjoyable. Thank you.
As a diabetic I can attest that hypoglycemia can severely affect your mental state. If the captain was on new medications, he may have been experiencing low blood sugar without realizing it. If so, I can understand how a simple failure might have been too much for him to handle. Even with the 2nd officer telling him what to do. The claim that the instrument was totally fine seems pretty ridiculous though.
Well then mayyyybe you should NOT fligh a damn 747. Just saying
Such a tragedy 😞 And it involved one instrument that killed over 200 people 😔
I'm a huge fan of your longer videos!!
Good video on the implication of Boeing and pointing out that these events have happened again with younger and as you said ‘healthier’ pilots
Crew resource management is key to these accidents. The rest of the crew has to be willing and able to take control from the captain, immediately. There really shouldn't be a reverence to the position that stops them.
i call bs the instruments failed
I don't know if you've covered this accident and I can't search very good from my phone; but I would love to see your report on Santa Barbara Airlines flight 518, the second deadliest aviation accident involving the type.
Thank you very much for covering this almost unheard of accident.
And yes, spatial disorientation has been such a major cause behind so many air disasters that it's mind boggling.
However, we humans are not perfect just like the instruments in the cockpit. So it's very likely that a pilot could make a mistake.
Imagine having a spotless record of 18000 flying hours, all washed away due to a mistake of just 20 seconds. But what's to say, the guy was a human being like any other. But yes, the ones with him that night should have course corrected. Especially since the co-pilot was also a captain, so he should have been more confident in speaking up or snatching the control. Also his job was to monitor. When the pilot flying actually expressed mistrust on his instrument, the pilot monitoring should have verified what both HIS and the backup ADI were telling and spoken loud and clear as to what was happening. Or he could have snatched the controls himself. And where the hell were the GPWS and Bank angle alerts?? Had the Bank angle alert sounded, the captain would have been alerted as to how the aircraft which acc to his ADI was on a smooth right turn was suddenly having Bank angle alarms. He could have course corrected. So yeah, where were the GPWS and Bank Angle alerts. They could have saved the plane.
Thank you for covering this crash, you've done a rather good job! The Captain was Madan Lal Kukar. You may wish to correct that bit.
Very interesting. I wonder if there were cultural factors keeping the younger co-pilot from speaking up more emphatically or if he was just as confused by the two instruments not agreeing.
This is why CRM is so important. I desperately hope that AIr India has fixed this issue.
This guy's videos are so high quality, and his voice is relaxing too. Is it weird I watch these before bed? Lol
Her name is Chloe and she's not a guy.
@@PJay-wy5fx were a guy or biologically a girl ? Im just curious, no bad intention
@@PJay-wy5fx Oops, I couldn't tell from the voice.
8:55 What cockpit is this plane from?
I enjoyed the video, as always exceptional narration. I would like to point out that a pilots & co-pilots "Attitude indicator" would be helpful for passengers and fellow aircrew I think that an Altitude indicator might be better.
Great job, thanks!
Really diggin' you channel.
Thanks for watching!
Great video as per usual. Have you heard of LOT flight 5055? It would probably make an interesting video
Thanks for bringing up the drinking and pilot health allegations. I also tend to believe they were "Red Herrings" on the part of Boeing's lawyers, but if they hadn't been mentioned, someone would have probably referred to them in the comments. With three possible Attitude Indicators to refer to, it's obvious the Command Pilot failed to double check into why his control inputs were apparently not having any effect on the Attitude Indicator he was using as his reference. I'm not a pilot, but I have found, if something doesn't make sense, it's best to check your meter or instruments for proper function before proceeding.
Maybe the pilot had a bad hangover? Did they do an autopsy? Should be able to tell his BAC?
It also doesn't make sense to me that if you would first bank say 10 or even 20 degrees to the right, then correct back, you would *keep banking left* for longer than the same time it took to make the original bank to the right. Even if the horizon showed any kind of reading that you were still banking right. Sounds to me like the pilot was out of his mind somehow, I don't think if it matters if it was alcohol or diabetes or whatever caused it, just that it shouldn't be blamed on Boeing.
@@GBOAC; I'm not a pilot, and I not blaming Boeing, but it if I was a member of a flight crew, and I even suspected the Command Pilot was "under the influence" of ANY substance, I would have been screaming bloody murder before the cabin doors had even been secured.
@@oldgysgt obviously, but it isn't always as clear how incapacitated someone is. Also often only the head of the cabin crew will talk to the pilots, and then sometimes just one of them does the talking. So there aren't many options for the rest of the cabin crew to validate the merits and capacities of the captain. Then thirdly it could also have been a combination of factors, like fatique, being slightly ill, diabetes as was mentioned, maybe some kind of food or drink reaction. All those things don't raise suspicion of being under the influence but can still lead to huge problems (although less nowadays with better CRM).
@@GBOAC; speculation about the pilot being "incapacitated" is of no real help, and without a breath or blood sample, it's only speculation.
Great video again. Have a nice weekend everyone.
Thanks for watching!
VT is not Victor Tango its Viceroy Territory which is still been use by Indian Government from British rule even after independence till today.
can't believe this is basically a repeat of Korean Air Cargo Flight 8509, only with passengers instead of cargo, one faulty instrument led to the deaths of the deaths of 213 people
As usual, another great video, and a proper reminder to take a deep internal view of one's self before diving too enthusiastically into the rush of becoming a Commercial Pilot...
It's worth acknowledging that according to the "Air Safety Institute" (who run a channel on YT of the same name ~ thus quotation marks), THE single most deadly weather related crash is the dreaded "VFR into IMC"... or more precisely "Visual Flight Rules piloting into Instrument Meteorological (weather) Conditions"... Meaning, the pilot, whether or not he's certified on instrument flight, starts out flying Visually, and suddenly plunges into Instrument Only circumstances (flying blind)... AND it's SO DEADLY that it causes more crashes than ALL OTHER weather related accidents combined...
Now, the Air Safety Institute (largely funded/operated by AOPA) IS primarily a General Aviation related association. It's here that I admit there IS some difference between a Commercial Pilot and a General Aviator... That's a LOT to do with the routines of training, refresher-training, simulator drills, and of course, their famous "CRM" or Crew Resource Management that nearly everyone brings up at every aviation-disaster video... At the same time, regardless of training, pilots ARE still relatively ordinary PEOPLE... just like you and me. They've just gotten a LOT more time and practice into flying a plane, both in the "solo-mode" and "as a team player".
That's what brings me back to the original sentiment. VFR into IMC (regardless of why you 'go blind') IS a treacherous fact of life with regular flying. It's often understated and likely underestimated as a force to be reckoned with. DO NOT understate the reality...
A big contributing factor is that banking turns in airplanes results in NOT being able to FEEL the turns being made. You can sit in the passenger cabin, a full drink in an open container (like a tumbler or coffee mug) can sit quietly on your tray-table, and they can take whatever turn they wish without changing the level of that liquid... not so much as a bobble. That makes it IMPOSSIBLE to "just know" when an Attitude Indicator or Artificial Horizon stops working mid-turn... or any time else. You have to simply and regularly scan over the other instruments, including the back-up Horizons to see that everything "is in agreement" or presume that "something's broke"... AND then start working on the basics of trouble-shooting and rectifying the problem BEFORE you get "in too deep" to do anything useful...
AND finally, for personal references if nothing else, I WOULD like to recommend everyone take a little time to pop into the Air Safety Institute's Channel on YT and check out a couple of their videos (they have A LOT of them) about crashes in GA and what we can learn from them... I'm bouncing back and forth on binges from their "Real Pilot Stories" and their "Accident Case Study" series... SO if you wonder what "the experience" might be like or would just like a sharper idea of what Chloe's talking about "in the moments", it might be worth the odd 15 to 20 minutes here and there... Chloe does an excellent job, but for some of us, it only helps to have things "drawn out in crayon simplicity" from time to time... just to be sure we fully understand it...
..AND that "Real Pilot Story" series puts a personal note to hairy situations, usually survivable, and gives some insight as to what was done RIGHT by the pilots who survived their "moments of truth" when everything else was going wrong... might be helpful or inspirational.
OF COURSE, DO NOT forget to get your asses back here for Chloe's next! Ya' HEAR?? ;o)
Thanks for sharing. 😉👌🏻
I suspect another factor is culture. In Indian culture, you do not correct your superior. This is seen as undermining their leadership or competence. This can even be seen when a teacher explains something to student -- asking for clarification is a silent questioning of their ability to teach. As the Captain was in control, trying to correct him wasn't really done.
that's Japanese, it's kindof in the mid in India, but they may be shut as to be in the good books of the seniors
You are correct
@@FBI-bj9kr that seems right
That makes sense. The co pilot hesitated to correct his senior.
Pls don't suspect without having any knowledge about "human factor". Back then, a lot of things were not known leading to inadequate training about how to deal with a number if "abnormal" situations. And if u talk about Indian culture in this particular matter, u r wrong bro. Just read the final investigation reports of some of the accidents due to lack of CRM and then comment about the culture of any place. And one basic thing u shld remember : they were flying a plane and riding a bicycle.
I find it odd how the pilots don't feel the planes attitude. Once the bank passes 45 degrees the pilots are basically sitting on the wall, they would fall out of their seats if they didn't wear seatbelts. How is it possible for a person to think the plane is banking in one direction while he is literally falling out of his seat in the other direction?
Yeah but because the plane is also turning while it's banking the g force the pilots and everyone else feels is tilted sideways outwards away from the direction of the turn, it still feels like you are upright, just as in a perfectly executed 1 g barrel roll it always feels like you are the right way up even when the aircraft is completely upside down, if you were a passenger during a 1 g barrel roll and you had your eyes closed you wouldn't know that you just rolled over.
Another Flight channel, Mentour Pilot had a video about a United 777 that nearly dove into the Pacific right after takeoff from a Hawaiian airport during a bad storm. They recovered from a 500 KPH dive less than 800 feet above the water. If the clouds had gone down to sea level, they would have all died, This one was caused by an error in flap positioning after takeoff and disorientation because of the clouds.
...forgotten:
Here are "only a few" people killed, think about the island of Tenerif, two 747 crashed on the runway, 583 killed.
You mentioned in the video that the flight engineer, having the visual of both artificial horizons at the same time, told the captain to not use his instrument.
How could someone else - Boeing - go telling that there were no instruments fault?
Thanks for the video...
Thanks for the video sir
Your videos are quite informative
If possible try making the alliance air flight 7412 crash that occurred in Patna, Bihar- India.
RIP to all the souls on board the
plane
How can you expect that a particular instrument will never ever fail ? That's why they have 3x redundancy. If pilots don't know how to act in such situations, it just shows that their qualification level is very low. Irrespectively how nany hours they had spent in the cockpit before.
Thanks for making the video. There is a possibility why the copilot did not actively take over the controls. It's to do with the hierarchy culture that existed in Air India at the time. There was absolutely no CRM and in extreme cases the copilot was nothing but a radio operator unless the captain commanded him to do something else.
3:06 3:23 3:55 Looks beautiful
"Boing": One instrument failt.
Pilot: Does not use back up instrument, does not realize loosing speed and altitude.
"Boing": Lying (as usual) to don't pay compensation.
Can happen tomorrow again, nothing changed.
How can three pilots not recover from a simple instrument failure. The whole idea of instrument flying is that you dont need outside visual awareness....do we need more pilots in the cockpit? How many pilots do we need 12?
The altitude was 2000 ft, thats merely some seconds.
Love your voice 👌🏻
Thank you :)
I'm confused, shouldn't have been a bank angle warning to alert the pilots when the angle exeded normal parameters?
I'm assuming that this being an old aircraft maybe it wasn't installed yet even thogh it is still a 747 so I would assume that an aircraft like this should have it.
The video did state that the pilots had begun to recover from the bank but it was too late, I’m assuming because they were too low. So possibly there might have been such a warning but they didn’t react quickly enough, or because of their low altitude it was already too late when the warning did occur.
Most bank alarms go off the captains ADI or at least at the time they did
Exerted, not exhorted. But great video as always!
Thanks!
Always amazes me that, say, Honda will do a recall on millions of cars if the safety belts dont adjust correctly, but Boeing will hire lawyers to inform the customer that he/she has the problem despite multiple incidents of defective instruments
Quite unlucky, they made only small mistakes and spotted them within a few seconds. But they just didn't have enough time. This is why you have the old saying that nothing is less useful than runway behind you or altitude above you.