Update (Aug 30th 2024): Look have responded to my support ticket (within a few hours of this video going live). They're currently looking at the diagnostics performed within their app on their sensors. The initial feedback from the app was 'no issues'. I'll keep this pinned comment updated with the progress. Update: (13th Sept 2024): Look have requested the return of the pedals to their factory for analysis.
Had issues with my road ones. Didn’t get round to comparing them to the neo. Mine have kept dropping out with my bolt 2. So after a lot of going backwards and forwards they ofter to exchange them. They then went totally quiet on me. So spoke with my supplier and they are taking them back for analysis with the distributor.
DC Rainmaker has been very quiet on these since his initial quick look that ended in failure. At least, I've not seen anything. Your review is excellent because not only you report they're inaccurate, but you were able to figure out exactly why. Gold medal.
Thank you! I appreciate your kind words as these reviews are low-view, low engagement, and only end up isolating me further from companies who should be making better products. It would have been wiser for me to return these pedals, forget reviewing them, and post another Zwift how-to video that'd get 5x the views. 😅
@22:20 change pco means I'd guess a shear gage design of the pedals (same with the last ones prior to this). Lower electrical sensitivity, some gotcha's about how the strain gage itself is designed, but also limitations I covered in a the video related to IQ2 like 4 years ago, and as you just saw there is some pedal center offset sensitivity. If it is shear gage (or differential bending sensed as one) it cannot measure the PCO so at best only power phase. Install angle is algorithmic guessing based on force vectors. Small angular error can lead to pollution of the desired measurements. That one should be improvable.
Well done Alice. Another rabbit hole badge achieved. And another company one less on their christmas card list. How do these companies churn this stuff out and not expected to be compared to their cheaper and invariably better competitiors? Straight out of the SRM book of marketing.
I’ve been testing the road version of these pedals for the past two months or so and I’m seeing some of the issues you are reporting with your unit. The summary for now is that mine read a little low, but the ‘good’ thing is that it’s consistent across installs and cranks (carbon and aluminium but have not tested with pedal washers). I’ve set the power scale factor to +2% and you could even say it’s an ok meter if you were not doing any deep analysis of the data. From day 1 I could tell something was not right just by looking at leg balance on my head unit. Pedals think my left leg is stronger on oval rings vs round which I know is not the case based on years of experience on other dual sided PMs which work with oval. On round chainrings reported balance seems much better but still not confidence inspiring. I can make them read 10-15w higher by modifying my pedaling style and pushing more on the inside closer to the crank, but not on the outside… It feels like some problems can be addressed with future firmware updates but ultimately can’t help but wonder if they’ve taken the right decisions when they started this project regarding the power sensing hardware within the pedals… Please keep us updated when you hear back from Look!
thanks for this Shane, Im still super happy with both items i purchased based on your reviews those being the magene spider based power meter and my elite direto which has served me well. i like the fact that some companies are afraid to let you at there gear, to me it indicates they have something to hide
Same as their X-Track pedals. On my second set within 5 month - Shot the left bearing rendering them noisy and loose. If the second one fails, I'll go back to Shimano.
I did for a second imagine trying to test/review these with a Shimnao meter. That make me extremely sad. How in 2024 things remain this untrustworthy is amazing. Though it keeps me busy.
Charging - if you intended to keep them, could you enlarge the circular hole on the rear face of the crank boot to enable the charging clip to connect?
25:04 to 25:56 sums up most of customer service in Europe. If a brand has a good customer service, it's usually because something or someone from outside Europe is involved. Having lived in and visited many Asian countries, I now enjoy my employment in Germany while suffering as a customer on a daily basis.
I find it very interesting that only the right side goes wonky when changing q-factor. I would expect both side to do so, if both crank arms behave similar. Also you are using a SRAM crank which has the chainring is basically attached to the BB axle. Maybe they only tested with Shimano cranks, where the right side may behave different? Who knows.
Having only the right side report lower with a positive PCO and not the left was interesting. This is why I'm thinking there could be an issue with that specific spindle. If I was to keep testing these, I'd perform more tests with more washers to keep changing the install angles.
@@gplama Sure, but sadly you're not being payed. Trying that right side spindle with different cranks (Shimano, Zwift bike, ...) would be one of the next items on my agenda.
I'd need to remove all of the rubber around the charge port and a chunk towards the BB for it to sit properly on the pedal. It'd be possible. It'd make the crank boot sloppy.
@@gplama Hello, question on reliability. I've heard that the assioma axles lasts about 3/4 years max. Then needs to be replaced. Is it true ? Is something that could be comon to all pedal base power meters ? Thanks for your opinion on this
@@romainf8041 Not true. I'm still using a set of Assioma DUO from 2018 with no issues. These are also different to the bearing setup of the DUO-Shi. which I assume you're referring to.
Im looking at the road version of these pedals for a bike where power meter options are restricted to pedal based. Would it be safe to assume the same issues would pop up on the road pedal body considering the spindle design is the same? Can anyone chime in with their experiences? Reviews are hard to find of this thing!
Would it be possible to disconnect the right pedal and test as a single pedal as the results on the left looked good? As an owner of the Keo version was really interested to see this video. Think I'll be doing some tests of my own to see if I can do the same with the keo model.
That would have been on the cards if I was to spend more time on these. I'd be interested to know your results by replicating the positive PCO pedalling. Find a smooth section of road, press more to the outside of both pedals while keeping the power as even as possible. Keep me posted.
@@gplama have neo 2t and vector 3s. Never done a full on test to compare but they are in same ballpark. Will do a proper test with those then test the Keo
The SRAM Force crank arms on my gravel bike are taking a beating! What crank boots are you using and where did you get them? I found a couple of SRAM crank boots and asked SRAM if they were compatible with my Force crank arms. I was told they were designed for MTB cranksets so they are not sure if the crank boots will work on road cranks.
I’ve found all crank boots usually fit any crank. I use a few different types off AliExpress that do the trick. Yesterday some SRAM boots from Temu arrived. They look legit.
@@gplama The only "SRAM" related crank boot I found on Temu has this title "2-Pack SRAM Compatible PVC Crank Arm Protector Boot Cover for XX1, X01, XX, XO, RED Cranksets". There are multiple photos in that listing and the first one has "RAM" 😆 on the boots but other photos do show what appears to be legit SRAM packaging.
8:32 If only there was some kind of simple device with a kind of edge for cutting, a "cutting edge" if you will, that could be taken to those crank boots to expose the charging port. 🤔 Alas, such a thing is the stuff of dreamers😜.
@@gplama It looks like there is a step in the charge head thing between the plastic body/ring magnet and the end of the spindle, and on all my cranks the spindle falls somewhat flush with the back of the arm. I'm not overly familiar with Carbon cranks, are they by any chance slightly thicker, causing the end of the spindle to sit deeper in the thread? If that's the case, then it's kind of forgivable that they overlooked it.
@@gplama .....also, I was joking in my op, I didn't really think you would have overlooked such an obvious potential solution. I do have some cheap silicone boots on my winter road bike that are soft/stretchy enough to get over speed plays while they are installed, that could be a solution, just pop them over the end of the arm with the pedal still attached (they are the ones that come with a second protector that's supposed to go further up the arm that I don't use)
Hi Shane! Nice review, as always! 👏👏👏 Two questions. 1. Could you widen the hole in the crank boot JUST ENOUGH to allow the charging plug to engage the charging port? (I assume the crank boots are not easily removable so I guess your would need to do this before installing the boots.) 2. Apologies for steering this onto a different power meter pedal, but when you rotated the shaft of the LOOK power meter pedal and commented on its smoothness, it triggered me a bit because of my experience with the Assioma SPD SL Duo power meter pedals. I'll try to make this brief but not ambiguous. As you know, this particular PM pedal is not a dual roller bearing design like it's SPD brother. It has one roller bearing and one sleeve bearing. My experience with owning this unit is that the sleeve bearing is problematic. Even with proper lubrication, never riding my bike in the rain, not being a powerful rider by any means, and not riding many kms at all (4000 km max) that sleeve bearing is subject to enough friction between it and the shaft of the pedal to erode enough material to increase the sleeve's diameter and cause excessive play in the pedal. I contacted Assioma and they worked with me to solve the problem by sending me a kit that replaced the sleeve bearing. The excessive play is gone...for now. But the problem with the design of this pedal (I.e. The use of a sleeve bearing in a high stress environment) leaves me confident the problem of excessive play in the pedal will return and require another kit to fix. The kits + shipping are not cheap. Luckily Assioma was kind enough to provide me with a free kit this one time, although I did have to pay for shipping from Italy to the USA. 😢 Since I know you appreciate how beautiful data is, using a laboratory quality vernier caliper, I measured the diameter of the shaft section that rotates within the sleeve at 9.22 mm. The diameter of the original sleeve after about 3500 km of riding was 10.21 mm. That extra 0.2 mm is what caused the play. The new sleeve provide in the kit had a diameter of 9.22, explaining why the play went away after installing the kit. Have you heard from others about this? Have you experienced this with your SPD SL test units provided by Assioma? Do you think Assioma will try to address this issue for customers who bought the SPD SL Duo PM Pedals in a more substantive way than requiring then to purchase pricey sleeve bearing kits on a regular basis. So much for brief comments. I just blew up the UA-cam algorithm! 😬🤣🤣🤣
I hear you on the DUO-Shi. The bearing sleeve solution isn't ideal. I wasn't a fan of the q-factor change (and made no secret of it). My media review set were returned long ago.
The customer service is really bad. They key to service them is difficult to get hold of, even in the EU. And min creak and squeak and make any number of noises. Even with the look cleats. If I want a quite ride I switch to my shimano’s. I guess that’s what you get for being an early adopter.
Look have a plastic spacer available that you put between the cleat and shoe to eliminate that creaking. Apparently some shoes' soles do not have the same radius that look has designed into their cleats and that should solve this (it has for me)
Update (Aug 30th 2024): Look have responded to my support ticket (within a few hours of this video going live). They're currently looking at the diagnostics performed within their app on their sensors. The initial feedback from the app was 'no issues'. I'll keep this pinned comment updated with the progress.
Update: (13th Sept 2024): Look have requested the return of the pedals to their factory for analysis.
Had issues with my road ones. Didn’t get round to comparing them to the neo. Mine have kept dropping out with my bolt 2. So after a lot of going backwards and forwards they ofter to exchange them. They then went totally quiet on me. So spoke with my supplier and they are taking them back for analysis with the distributor.
The high price and lack of customer support in itself make this a no go, thanks for your in depth analysis.
When Favero come out with a new road pedal, they could make it painful for some of these other companies.
Really hoping they have an updated SPD-SL in the pipeline! They nailed the Pro MX, time to update the road lineup.
DC Rainmaker has been very quiet on these since his initial quick look that ended in failure. At least, I've not seen anything. Your review is excellent because not only you report they're inaccurate, but you were able to figure out exactly why. Gold medal.
@GPLama we appreciate you!!!!
Thank you! I appreciate your kind words as these reviews are low-view, low engagement, and only end up isolating me further from companies who should be making better products. It would have been wiser for me to return these pedals, forget reviewing them, and post another Zwift how-to video that'd get 5x the views. 😅
I can see them being returned to the retailer , and the retailer not being overly excited to return $2000.00 , awesome review Shane ,
@22:20 change pco means I'd guess a shear gage design of the pedals (same with the last ones prior to this). Lower electrical sensitivity, some gotcha's about how the strain gage itself is designed, but also limitations I covered in a the video related to IQ2 like 4 years ago, and as you just saw there is some pedal center offset sensitivity. If it is shear gage (or differential bending sensed as one) it cannot measure the PCO so at best only power phase. Install angle is algorithmic guessing based on force vectors. Small angular error can lead to pollution of the desired measurements. That one should be improvable.
How do Assioma pedals determine installation angle?
Well done Alice. Another rabbit hole badge achieved. And another company one less on their christmas card list. How do these companies churn this stuff out and not expected to be compared to their cheaper and invariably better competitiors? Straight out of the SRM book of marketing.
I’ve been testing the road version of these pedals for the past two months or so and I’m seeing some of the issues you are reporting with your unit. The summary for now is that mine read a little low, but the ‘good’ thing is that it’s consistent across installs and cranks (carbon and aluminium but have not tested with pedal washers). I’ve set the power scale factor to +2% and you could even say it’s an ok meter if you were not doing any deep analysis of the data.
From day 1 I could tell something was not right just by looking at leg balance on my head unit. Pedals think my left leg is stronger on oval rings vs round which I know is not the case based on years of experience on other dual sided PMs which work with oval. On round chainrings reported balance seems much better but still not confidence inspiring.
I can make them read 10-15w higher by modifying my pedaling style and pushing more on the inside closer to the crank, but not on the outside…
It feels like some problems can be addressed with future firmware updates but ultimately can’t help but wonder if they’ve taken the right decisions when they started this project regarding the power sensing hardware within the pedals…
Please keep us updated when you hear back from Look!
Interesting. I respect Look for quality frames … not so much for their pedals or customer service. Keen to see what happens in 2 weeks
Thanks for the in-depth review! Appreciate the effort you put in!
thanks for this Shane, Im still super happy with both items i purchased based on your reviews those being the magene spider based power meter and my elite direto which has served me well. i like the fact that some companies are afraid to let you at there gear, to me it indicates they have something to hide
Always keen to hear about new power meter pedals but once again anyone will compare them with the Favero Assiomas. Why would you buy the LOOK pedals?
For a company such as look to not engage with you is not only rude it's stupidly as you're in a position to improve THEIR failing product.
Same as their X-Track pedals.
On my second set within 5 month - Shot the left bearing rendering them noisy and loose.
If the second one fails, I'll go back to Shimano.
Sad... I love LOOK pedals and was thinking of getting the power meter pedals.
In Agust France goes on holiday. The bosses were probably away and it was left for a junior employee to pick uo!!
These are dead in the water - Assioma for the win again
Are they trying to compete with Shimano for the most frustrating power meter? It's a close race for that title!
I did for a second imagine trying to test/review these with a Shimnao meter. That make me extremely sad. How in 2024 things remain this untrustworthy is amazing. Though it keeps me busy.
@@gplama And you can get boring powermeters for some 100 bucks from SRAM/Quarq. If they only would support Magic Zero for the cheap Rival powermeter.
Charging - if you intended to keep them, could you enlarge the circular hole on the rear face of the crank boot to enable the charging clip to connect?
25:04 to 25:56 sums up most of customer service in Europe. If a brand has a good customer service, it's usually because something or someone from outside Europe is involved. Having lived in and visited many Asian countries, I now enjoy my employment in Germany while suffering as a customer on a daily basis.
It, uh, LOOKS like the clock is ticking for them to respond. Sorry, couldn't resist.
I find it very interesting that only the right side goes wonky when changing q-factor. I would expect both side to do so, if both crank arms behave similar. Also you are using a SRAM crank which has the chainring is basically attached to the BB axle. Maybe they only tested with Shimano cranks, where the right side may behave different? Who knows.
Having only the right side report lower with a positive PCO and not the left was interesting. This is why I'm thinking there could be an issue with that specific spindle. If I was to keep testing these, I'd perform more tests with more washers to keep changing the install angles.
@@gplama Sure, but sadly you're not being payed. Trying that right side spindle with different cranks (Shimano, Zwift bike, ...) would be one of the next items on my agenda.
how about drilling a bigger hole in the crank boots?
I'd need to remove all of the rubber around the charge port and a chunk towards the BB for it to sit properly on the pedal. It'd be possible. It'd make the crank boot sloppy.
For road what would be the best power meter you recommend?
The ones I use as baselines. Favero, Power2Max, Quarq. There’s other options that work well depending on your budget and preferences.
@@gplama so in your opinion one of the best and most accurate pedals are the Assioma pedals?
Favero pedals (Assioma and PRO MX) always test well.
@@gplama Hello, question on reliability.
I've heard that the assioma axles lasts about 3/4 years max. Then needs to be replaced.
Is it true ? Is something that could be comon to all pedal base power meters ?
Thanks for your opinion on this
@@romainf8041 Not true. I'm still using a set of Assioma DUO from 2018 with no issues. These are also different to the bearing setup of the DUO-Shi. which I assume you're referring to.
I guess atleast the power meter doesn't read power while you're coasting...right? RIGHT?!
That's a FEATURE, not a bug. 😅
Im looking at the road version of these pedals for a bike where power meter options are restricted to pedal based.
Would it be safe to assume the same issues would pop up on the road pedal body considering the spindle design is the same? Can anyone chime in with their experiences? Reviews are hard to find of this thing!
I would assume the same issues with the road pedal body on these spindles. Something I’d be interested to test, but unlikely to happen.
It doesn't LOOK good for these pedals
Why don’t you enlarge the hole in the crank boot to allow charging without removing pedal?
It’ll need more than just enlarging the hole to work with the supplied charger. Not a concern until the other issues are resolved.
Would it be possible to disconnect the right pedal and test as a single pedal as the results on the left looked good? As an owner of the Keo version was really interested to see this video. Think I'll be doing some tests of my own to see if I can do the same with the keo model.
That would have been on the cards if I was to spend more time on these. I'd be interested to know your results by replicating the positive PCO pedalling. Find a smooth section of road, press more to the outside of both pedals while keeping the power as even as possible. Keep me posted.
@@gplama have neo 2t and vector 3s. Never done a full on test to compare but they are in same ballpark. Will do a proper test with those then test the Keo
The SRAM Force crank arms on my gravel bike are taking a beating! What crank boots are you using and where did you get them? I found a couple of SRAM crank boots and asked SRAM if they were compatible with my Force crank arms. I was told they were designed for MTB cranksets so they are not sure if the crank boots will work on road cranks.
I’ve found all crank boots usually fit any crank. I use a few different types off AliExpress that do the trick. Yesterday some SRAM boots from Temu arrived. They look legit.
@@gplama The only "SRAM" related crank boot I found on Temu has this title "2-Pack SRAM Compatible PVC Crank Arm Protector Boot Cover for XX1, X01, XX, XO, RED Cranksets". There are multiple photos in that listing and the first one has "RAM" 😆 on the boots but other photos do show what appears to be legit SRAM packaging.
RAM Boots! 🐏👢🤣
@@gplama I'm getting them just for the LOL.
Do you think wahoo will release a new computer to compete with the Garmin and Hammerhead this year?
There have been rumours. Nothing confirmed as yet from the 'hooligans.
Why do the chuckle brothers recommend these pedals? To meter you
(Only brits will understand this, sorry Shane)
And the review could be summed up as:
Oh, dear...............oh dear, oh dear.................oh dear, oh dear, oh dear,
eyup barry
I thought I had seen everything, but this video proved that the world can still surprise me💝
I think I can see your torque wrench in your profile picture.
8:32 If only there was some kind of simple device with a kind of edge for cutting, a "cutting edge" if you will, that could be taken to those crank boots to expose the charging port. 🤔 Alas, such a thing is the stuff of dreamers😜.
It'd require a fair hack out of the boots for the charger that has a circle and the body that sits flat against the crank arm.
@@gplama It looks like there is a step in the charge head thing between the plastic body/ring magnet and the end of the spindle, and on all my cranks the spindle falls somewhat flush with the back of the arm. I'm not overly familiar with Carbon cranks, are they by any chance slightly thicker, causing the end of the spindle to sit deeper in the thread? If that's the case, then it's kind of forgivable that they overlooked it.
@@gplama .....also, I was joking in my op, I didn't really think you would have overlooked such an obvious potential solution. I do have some cheap silicone boots on my winter road bike that are soft/stretchy enough to get over speed plays while they are installed, that could be a solution, just pop them over the end of the arm with the pedal still attached (they are the ones that come with a second protector that's supposed to go further up the arm that I don't use)
Hi Shane! Nice review, as always! 👏👏👏 Two questions.
1. Could you widen the hole in the crank boot JUST ENOUGH to allow the charging plug to engage the charging port? (I assume the crank boots are not easily removable so I guess your would need to do this before installing the boots.)
2. Apologies for steering this onto a different power meter pedal, but when you rotated the shaft of the LOOK power meter pedal and commented on its smoothness, it triggered me a bit because of my experience with the Assioma SPD SL Duo power meter pedals. I'll try to make this brief but not ambiguous. As you know, this particular PM pedal is not a dual roller bearing design like it's SPD brother. It has one roller bearing and one sleeve bearing. My experience with owning this unit is that the sleeve bearing is problematic. Even with proper lubrication, never riding my bike in the rain, not being a powerful rider by any means, and not riding many kms at all (4000 km max) that sleeve bearing is subject to enough friction between it and the shaft of the pedal to erode enough material to increase the sleeve's diameter and cause excessive play in the pedal. I contacted Assioma and they worked with me to solve the problem by sending me a kit that replaced the sleeve bearing. The excessive play is gone...for now. But the problem with the design of this pedal (I.e. The use of a sleeve bearing in a high stress environment) leaves me confident the problem of excessive play in the pedal will return and require another kit to fix. The kits + shipping are not cheap. Luckily Assioma was kind enough to provide me with a free kit this one time, although I did have to pay for shipping from Italy to the USA. 😢 Since I know you appreciate how beautiful data is, using a laboratory quality vernier caliper, I measured the diameter of the shaft section that rotates within the sleeve at 9.22 mm. The diameter of the original sleeve after about 3500 km of riding was 10.21 mm. That extra 0.2 mm is what caused the play. The new sleeve provide in the kit had a diameter of 9.22, explaining why the play went away after installing the kit. Have you heard from others about this? Have you experienced this with your SPD SL test units provided by Assioma? Do you think Assioma will try to address this issue for customers who bought the SPD SL Duo PM Pedals in a more substantive way than requiring then to purchase pricey sleeve bearing kits on a regular basis.
So much for brief comments. I just blew up the UA-cam algorithm! 😬🤣🤣🤣
I hear you on the DUO-Shi. The bearing sleeve solution isn't ideal. I wasn't a fan of the q-factor change (and made no secret of it). My media review set were returned long ago.
The customer service is really bad. They key to service them is difficult to get hold of, even in the EU. And min creak and squeak and make any number of noises. Even with the look cleats. If I want a quite ride I switch to my shimano’s. I guess that’s what you get for being an early adopter.
Look have a plastic spacer available that you put between the cleat and shoe to eliminate that creaking. Apparently some shoes' soles do not have the same radius that look has designed into their cleats and that should solve this (it has for me)
1099 Dollar/Euro ?
Nope, thank you.
You could probably enlarge the hole in the crank boot.
It’s still need a chunk taken out for the body of the charger too. Messy.
Amazing.
French and technology, never go hand in hand.
By the way never liked the brand because of their inconsistency and will remain the same!
Another tube in a tubeless setup , hehe ,
Now now.... tubeless is (mostly) awesome! :)
Nothing is harder than the truth! LOOK on it!
I thought it was gonna be IQ2 for sure! ;)
I still have a pair of those here. I should really throw them out.
@@gplama Dont have a wall of shame?
I have a room full of shame I have to keep clearing out every few months. 🤣