The Ancient Cistern, Light, Dark, & The Spider's Thread - Dungeon Design in Zelda (Skyward Sword HD)
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- Опубліковано 31 лип 2024
- The Ancient Cistern is my favourite dungeon in the Skyward Sword.
It's themes look at the balance of light and dark, and it draws inspiration from a certain piece of folklore. Let's take a closer look!
Special thanks / shoutout to the amazing dude know as @RMFHGaming for providing me the green flame effect used in this video.
0:00 - Intro
0:36 - Before The Dungeon
6:17 - Dungeon Themes & Progression
23:46 - The Dungeon Boss
27:37 - Conclusion
#SkywardSwordHD #Zelda - Ігри
A lot of people don't notice, but each transformation of the Goddess Sword thanks to the Sacred Flames has a slightly different name. It isn't just the Goddess Sword anymore. It's nothing spectacular until it becomes the Master Sword, but with Farore's Flame it becomes the Goddess Longsword, and with Nayru's Flame its name changes again, this time as a surprising reference to the first Legend of Zelda; the Goddess White Sword.
I can't even describe how excited I was when I got the "White Sword of the Sky" AKA the Goddess White Sword in Tears of the Kingdom. I'm so glad I did that side quest, but at the same time, I don't even want to use the white sword because I don't want to break it lol
@@__idfk__ You can spend Poes at a bargainer statue to get back any reference item you break or sell
@@jadethenidoran I've checked it and the white sword isn't an option. I can buy the Fierce Deity sword but not the white sword. I even looked online, and apparently the only way to get the white sword again if you break it is to bring another set of the dragon claws to the goddess statue in the forgotten temple, which I don't really want to do because tracking down the dragons and getting their claws is a pain in the ass.
@@__idfk__ Ah. Maybe put it up in link's house then, save the Inventory space by putting something you're not going to use on display
26:11 Using his weapons against him is one of the most satisfying boss battles I remember. A very well designed boss
Also raising the Statue's head to the highest point into a small room with recovery hearts takes me back to "Inside Lord Jabu-Jabu" where after defeating the Big Octo you also rise up into a small healing room and then proceed through the 3rd and final act of the dungeon. Just so happens to also be a "Water" themed dungeon you could say 😄 haha
This dungeon is spectacular, as is the boss at the end of it.
Though, I have one _tiny_ complaint. Koloktos, Ancient Automaton, suffers from localization. Or rather Malgare, Demone dalle mille lame, as it is called in Italian, does. First of all, as a native Italian speaker, I have no idea what "Malgare" is supposed to mean. It's so needlessly different from "Koloktos", which, by the way, would have been a perfectly fine name in the Italian localization as well, as it resembles the word "colosso" meaning "colossus" (duh). Yet, for some reason, they had to go with Malgare. But there's more. Its description says "Demone dalle mille lame", which literally translates to "Thousand-blades demon". That completely defeats the purpose of this being. Demons are depicted as evil throughout the entire game, and then this thing, which supposedly tries to stop Ghirahim, the Demon Lord, from doing whatever he's trying to do, comes out as a demon. Like, what the actual Fi
That is a really strange translation choice! “Ancient Automaton” sounds like a far more suiting description tbh. Never got the impression Koloktos was a demon, but rather a corrupted piece of ancient technology. So strange!
I agree, that makes no sense. Koloktos was an automaton created by Hylia to protect the sacred flame in the Ancient Cistern, which was then corrupted by Ghirahim. Even after its corruption, it's not a demon. It's not even a living being. It's basically just a giant robot that Ghirahim tried to control with dark magic.
The dungeon draws heavily from Buddhism, so while calling him a demon might not be consistent for the game it’s consistent with the usual translation of its inspirations.
As for not using Koloktos, I can only assume they thought the clock reference wouldn’t scan.
Even Koloktos is a localized name anyway. His original name is Da Irouma, a lot of localisations in SS seem to have gone in completely different directions for boss names
@@Doudoussin Sure, but Koloktos makes sense as a localization. Its German name is Da Ilohm, which is very close to the original, so that makes sense as well. The Italian name is just one big question mark to me
i freaking loved all this before dungeon stuff... im probably alone XD
Folks, if you like hindu/buddhist themes both in design and scenario, I highly recommend you Digital Devil Saga duology for PlayStation 2.
Ancient Cistern is my favourite dungeon in Skyward Sword. I'm happy to hear that most people prasie this water type dungeon which is the most disliked theme in Zelda series, thanks to infamous Water Temple from Ocarina of Time.
Hd version was my 1st time playing this game and did not have an issue with the tasks asked to get to this temple expect I can see the skyview temple revisit. Perhaps it is more egregious to ppl who have played it b4 knowing what is coming? I think just about every dungeon has a lot of lead up content tbh but rarely felt like filler to me except 2nd girihiam n 3rd imprisoned boss fights. But das just 1 chickem's POV
This is my favorite dungeon of all time, awesome video!
Thank you for showing us and briefly summarizing "The Spider's Thread" for us! This is also my favorite dungeon from Skyward Sword, it felt like it had that special something to it and now I understand why! From the architecture, over the forsaken basement, all the way to the boss fight, this dungeon is incredible and more than worthy of housing a sacred flame.
if the water temple and shadow temple fused, it would be the ancient cistern. it has the water theme and puzzle box nature but is also very linear. i also noticed its structure is very similar to dodongo's cavern as well. you have a large central room, do the east wing and then the west wing which interconnects with the north wing, and then the basement. the big deviation is the mini-boss is fought in the central room where the item is obtained fairly early in the dungeon. that is where the water temple similarity applies plus the reversible switch.
although not recommended, you can go back to skyview temple before the giant tree. and mogma's are annoying in SS because of how intrusive they are. also if you miss the heart container, battling the stalfos trio will cause it to respawn.
this was the last dungeon I could beat on my own in the original (I have an anxiety disorder and couldn't get past the second silent realm ;-;) but my brother recently played through the game and I watched (because I wanted to see the rest of the game but knew I couldn't on my own... thanks anxiety) and this is hands down one of the best dungeons in the game... visually stunning, a great theme, a fun boss fight. also, the name makes me giggle because a cistern is where the water for a toilet is held before flushing...
To the defense of the water bottle section, it’s kinda cool you get to head back to a dungeon you defeated because maybe you missed out on some things and it’s short so it’s not that big of a deal.
Plus I was never fan of returning to the forsaken fortress especially to the parts you couldn’t reach because the Forsaken Fortress has always felt annoying to navigate around and other than maybe two meh boss fights it’s kinda tedious. Plus you have to sail there from whichever location you are from, with Skyview it’s only like a short jog from the water dragon section.
Atleast with Skyview you get an opportunity to collect a heart piece and a goddess cube Incase you missed out on it.
By the same token, there is a heart piece on forsaken fortress as well, and while the time spent there is longer, the way you have to go about traversing the dungeon is different from your initial visit. It drops the stealth in favour of combat.
For Skyview, I didn’t feel like there was enough difference between the two visits. You go through the same rooms, and fight the same enemies. You don’t spend as long there, but the time spent there feels like padding, especially being such a big detour that serves little story purpose.
Idk, of course that’s simply my feelings on it. One feels like a payoff for your struggles early on the game, overcoming obstacles that you previously couldn’t. The other feels like a retread, overcoming obstacles that you already did.
Man I am so impressed with this temple design. It is so beautiful. I really like that you provided the backstory to this dungeons theme, I love it!
With temple designs like these that have clear influence to real world religions, it makes you wonder how long those ancient civilizations of past have lived and existed, and how they came to design and believe in their gods aside from the Goddess. Aside from the Gerudo and the Sand Goddess or Heroines, I can’t think of any others where the civilizations coexist with the current existing temples.
Spare a spider!? Too much to ask for me ill just take the burning blood water in hell i reckon...
I’d just put it outside
This is my favorite dungeon next to the mining facility. Lol haven’t had much progress past this point so I should catch up before next weeks video LOL! Like I played the game before but I forgot what happens next. Like I know the story and how it happens and progresses but it’s been years since I played with the gem.
What’s also funny is that I remember the underground being more complex and much MUCH longer than what it is when I replayed the HD. Lol guess I was just a vegetable child back in the day lol 😂 the underground used to give me the heebie jeebies.
Also I questioned your theory on the pools being malice underground, until the scene with Ghirinhim’s fabulous ass pops up in the screen with the dismantled automaton. Wow can’t believe I didn’t notice that the automaton fell to Ghirinhim! And I thought I was the one who pays attention to detail. Lol once you pointed this out my Zelda theory gears started cranking and it made me think that those undead bokoblins were planted by him, as well. And the pools of malice is what’s influencing them to become undead. Which makes me think of the Stal family in BoTW since they are reanimated by the malice, including Stalhorses. Also I think those REanimated DEAD (Heh) bokoblins are the same ones that fell to Link in this adventure. See where I’m going with this theory? Decided I’d add on lol. Truly do appreciate this game a lot more than I did 10 years ago! Always loved it but I love it more now. I love dark Zelda.
Another fantastic video!
Wow this video is so well put together that my mind is blown! I am so happy for finding this channel!
Loved this one Daniel! The first part about how long it takes to get to the dungeon reminds me of why Skyward Sword drives me nuts haha
Burgerborgerburger 🍔 Another great video, man! I definitely agree that the list of backtracking and chores they have you do before the dungeon is over the top 😝 This dungeon was so fun! I actually played through the whole thing this morning so I could watch this now haha ☺️ I love the music in here, and the eastern story influence!! The juxtaposition of the upper levels and the basement was literally striking... I remembered it from the Wii version, but when I first got down there today it really took me by surprise. I felt like the mid boss came very early in this dungeon... The blessed idol was such a pretty key 😋 I also very much enjoyed the boss fight, it really was just a good time!! Another great video man, looking forward to the next!!! 😁
Absolutely amazing dungeon design here. The way the center part of the dungeon raises and lowers to let you into different areas, ultimately ending with letting you into the area with the boss key, and it lowering again to let you ride the water spouts to the top for the boss fight. It's such a gorgeous dungeon too. It might be my favorite in the series. Great video, I love how the designers were able to weave in a story like this into actual gameplay, it's so awesome.
Excellent video, sir! 🤯
Great video!
Amazing video
This part made me realize how this game is an in-between of twilight princess and botw. I noticed some elements taken from TP (the sillent level) and others close to what botw would become (resistance bar, shield customization and so on)
Probably my favourite dungeon in Skyward Sword as well, but i haven't played the HD version yet so I cannot be sure. Watching these HD vids though is definitely giving me a new appreciation/understanding of the animation in this game...even on the Wii I was thinking of it as a reaction to Twilight Princess' thematic (and literal) darkness...visually kind of a combination of TP and Windwaker. I definitely like TP better, and the Lakebed Temple does way more for me than the Ancient Cistern, but I agree with you that this boss battle slaps. One of the all-time greatest boss battles in the series, in my opinion. I hope they bring back the idea of a boss dropping an overpowered weapon so Link can use it
I only just realised the entrance is the zoras domain statue
@27:42, story of my life.
This is a boss I’m always excited to whip and chop into pieces 🤭
This is up there with the greatest of greatest. Not as good as Stone Tower Temple but very close!
Get your Indiana Jones on. This is one of the better dungeons in the game. Appreciate all your research into the themes, I had no idea. The boss is one of my favorites.
Link use a sword 2 times his size and swings it like no problem
The 'to do-list' before entering this visually stunning temple is really excessive to the point where I can recall getting really bored and definitely one of the game's low points. It should have been broken up into smaller sections, I agree. I personally quite liked revisiting Skyview Temple as it made the dungeon even more memorable and I liked the 'new mini-boss of three stalfos instead of one,' it made for an interesting fight and certainly a new take on dungeon exploration for the series by slightly changing things in the dungeon for a 2nd trip in order to obtain a different goal reward (in this case sacred water instead of a piece of the stone tablet) - I can't recall any recent 3D Zelda Game up until Skyward Sword's original release that had done this before...
Walking into The Ancient Cistern is like going to a foreign land somewhere in the east and just taking in beautiful architecture and being stunned at the intricate detail and beauty of it all - this is the first impression I get off this dungeon. That in itself deserves a round of applause for the game developers who made this temple and have clearly put so much thought into it (reflecting on the sheer detail and imaginative design and gameplay in this temple makes the divine beasts pale in comparison...) I absolutely adore the lotus flower symbolism in this temple and it really strikes me of Buddhism/Hinduism influences. I think the flower is supposed to symbolise 'spiritual growth' and I find it even more symbolic that the hero of men rises to the top of the ceiling at the final stage of this dungeon when completing all other tasks (proof of spiritual growth). The soundtrack for this temple is so therapeutic and calming that I would happily listen to it for hours. The soundtrack itself is so perfectly suited for this temple and is yet fairly simple using chimes that are most likely using pitches from a pentatonic scale (typical in ancient cultures, especially eastern cultures).
The central statue in the temple also suggests very strong buddhism/hindism (I'm not really religious or trying to put across any conscious bias here but I find this stuff interesting). Shout out to NintendoBlackCrisis as he goes into this stuff in more detail. The contrast of above and below is definitely symbolic of a 'heaven/hell duality theme going on in this dungeon.' The dungeon design particularly in the lower half of this temple definitely looks like Hades - the toxic pools (probably malice, I agree) the zombified enemies, the pit of bones and various traps seem all like typical depictions of Hades. All of this is reflected in the dead-like ambient sounds in this area - also emphasising the contrast between the two areas. Maybe this area is actually connected to where Demise originally came from? I love how there is a tale associated with the spider's thread in this temple as it adds to the tension of climbing to the top with enemies desperately trying to catch you to return you to the bottom - scary.
The upgraded stalfos (Stalmaster) is a very well-suited mini-boss for this dungeon, especially after visiting the depths of the temple, the extra two arms sets you up on how to deal with the dungeon boss who also has many weaponised arms (avoid the arms like hell!). I also love the addition of the whip as a dungeon item - it feels very classic Indiana Jones and perhaps that is also what the developers were thinking given that Nintendo does take some influence off popular western culture. The boss fight of course is one of the great boss fights of the entire series but it's also great because the dungeon was done brilliantly before reaching the boss. The fun aspect of disarming the boss who actually has the sense to cover his weak spot is incredibly satisfying. The destruction of the columns at the 2nd phase of the fight where the boss lifts itself out of the ground really adds to the drama and intensity of this fight (it has a decent threat level). The boss music also does this extremely well - par excellence. I can only wish there was a 3rd phase of this fight to make it more challenging as it is not the most difficult boss fight.
I WISH you could just keep the boss weapon akin to the Biggoron sword, but hey, nothing is perfect.
Hylian Translations in this Video:
16:27
The Item: The Whip
The whip is a versatile tool and weapon you can use to grapple onto certain objects and swing across gaps, as well as snatch certain items from enemies. The end of the whip gives off a strange blue glow which allows it to grip things.
24:30
Koloktos
The Ancient Automaton Koloktos has increased power due to the evil energy which appears to be malice. Koloktos has weak joints and is vulnerable to its own weapons. Use this to your advantage to win!
Zelda fans every second that they aren't inside of a dungeon: 😡
It’s ironic because the part I complain about the most here isn’t even about not being in a dungeon… it’s about the blatant padding that is having to go back through a dungeon I already finished lol
I even say I enjoy the silent realm and imprisoned battle
@@CaptBurgerson I'm gonna be real with you, I was in a pretty bad mood when I left this comment. I do think that your critisicm is completely valid, as a lot of people really dislike backtracking. I'm personally okay with going back to Skyview, as it feels like the places in the world have more meaning, that a dungeon isn't just a place for you to complete a puzzle and move on, but an actual place of greater importance in the world. I also enjoyed seeing the mogmas there, because it helped make the regions of the world feel at least somewhat connected together (and I like their goofy personalities).
@Smashman79 I appreciate your honesty, and thank you
The ancient cistern is atmospherically my favorite dungeon so far in the game (just now beat the next dungeon afterwards) and I agree with almost everything said in the video. The dungeon is great and the boss is perhaps one of my favorites in the series so far. However, the stuff you do before the dungeon (the windmill stuff and especially backtracking to skyview) is really mishandled. I was moaning and groaning the entire time I was back in the first temple, it kinda sucked. Otherwise, great dungeon
Ok, so I think this is the most difficult dungeon in the game, solely cus of the puzzles. The only one I fully remember is the one time you have to use the whip to steal a key from a nearby Bokoblin, which is just dumb. One thing I hate about Zelda games is when they integrate a feature which is never used again in the game or the series and use it without telling you how to do it, so you’re left clueless. Kind of like in Wind Waker where you had to climb along an edge in the first dungeon or had to climb up the rope of your hookshot in the second one. That’s just cheap
I get what you mean about the whip puzzle, but wind waker examples kinda just… don’t work, since they’re things you end up doing a lot of in the game
@@CaptBurgerson Yeah, but when did the game ever tell you that you could just climb up your grappling hooks rope? The dungeon that’s supposed to introduce you to its capabilities never has you use it, and it’s not like Medli tells you about it either, so how are you supposed to know that? And yeah, you sneak around edges a lot, but climbing across one is also something you were never taught to do. It would have made a lot of sense to include that as well in the Forsaken Fortress, by having Link climb right above a room with tons of enemies, trying not to have them catch him
Also, I’m only past the second dungeon, so I suppose I wouldn’t know if you were using these mechanics a lot more, but the game sure did a sloppy job at introducing them
Did we play the same game? There's a whole mini game that is mandatory on the pirate ship that teaches you these rope mechanics before you even get to the Forsaken Fortress. That mini game gets expanded upon again later in another mandatory section after Forbidden Woods, just in case you didn't have it totally figured out yet. Not only that, but assuming you don't have the pro-hud on, the controls are always in the corner of the screen.
There's some legit complaints about Wind Waker, but it teaching you those mechanics is not one of them.
@@CaptBurgerson Yeah, there was a tutorial in the pirate ship, but all it taught you was to jump and swing properly. It never once told you to climb up and down a rope, so no, you can’t draw a connection from there. And yeah, I have the controls in the upper right corner of the screen, but how was I supposed to know that when I press ZR to stop, which I never ever had to before, I could also climb up on it?
Yo
Majora's Mask fetch quests are much, much more annoying. That overworld is pure annoyance.
Well that’s one opinion.
The way you pronounce some words tell me, that english is not your mothers tongue. Where are you from? I bet from a non english speaking european country 😁
I’m Canadian, so English is my first language but there are regional accents depending on where in the country you are
@@CaptBurgerson oh, then Iam sorry. It wasn't intended to be offending or something. I hope you didn't get the impression. Iam from germany and it sounded a bit like an accent from Here around. Haven't ever heard a canadian talking, so that's my fault, sry.
No offence was taken haha. I read it as a genuine question
Great video!