Ratchet springs are signficantly lighter. I wonder where the savings came from. Is this not the "weakpoint"? I mean if spring tension degrades over time, the engagement becomes compromised, no?
Hello! I have question regarding those waterslides... by any chance still have not figured out way to get them off? It seems to me that lot of bike brands are replacing basic painted graphics or decals with waterslide ones and it makes me furious, because I can not de-brand anything :(
We haven't tried too hard, but nothing seems to get a waterslide off....this seems to be why companies like using them because they're affordable and easy to apply and don't come off -TT
@@bthomas518 The looks. I generally prefer clean looking bike. Besides, most of graphical designs of bike brands are just trash. Never understood why people even bother designing disgusting graphics when they could just make it simple and clean. Not exactly case of DT with 350s, since it is cleand and B&W... but try matching 240s with their red color :D
Hi Alex. All spokes use rolled (not cut) threads so a 2.0mm spoke like a regular Competition or Aerolite has a thread diameter of around 2.3mm. This means they wouldn't fit into a 2.0mm hole. Most good quality hubs have spoke holes around 2.4 to 2.5mm in diameter. DT Swiss didn't change the spoke hole diameter between the two generations of hub. -Tristan
Thanks heaps for the overview. I want to use my old 350 hubs in a new wheel build. 1) Are the spoke length specs the same? 2) is the ratchet ring available as a seperate part and is that the only part needed for the upgrade? Really appreciate your advive.
Thanks for uploading - very interesting. I just ordered some Shimano RS400 (Tiagra) road hubs 36 hole (non disc). Going to build up some carbon wheels in 18spoke radial front and 27 spoke rear in triplet (18 spokes 2x DS, 9 spokes radial NDS). Should be an interesting build....edit: I forgot to say. Shimano hubs are not light, but are super cheap to buy and service. Last for ages too as long as you remember to replace balls and grease regularly! Look pretty good in silver too.
Most hubs (including these DT Swiss ones) use the same endcaps between a 100 and 110 hub, and have a different shell. The distance from the dropout to rotor is the same between Boost and Non Boost which is why the endcaps are the same, and the extra width of a Boost comes from between the flanges to increase wheel stiffness ~Tristan
The Ratchet LN 370 is pretty similar to the old 350 hub. Ratchet LN is a bit of a clusterfuck though as it uses the same internal parts as the Classic hubs (like all model 350 and pre-2022 240 and 180 hubs) but with a totally different and NOT interchangeable freehub body. We've got a couple of Ratchet LN vids coming up to help explain this better -Tristan
Hi. I just also watched your excellent video on the Hope Pro5 Hub. I'm interested to know, in your opinion, which of the Hope Pro5 or DT Swiss 350 would be better on a Winter Training Wheel? I know the Pro5 is easier to service but needs bearing replacement more regularly than the DT350 but I'm thinking in terms of 'weatherproofing' and strength/robustness for the heavier rider (95kg)? Also does the difference in 'points of engagement' make much difference?
I think on the whole more engagement points is better, all things being equal. Both are good hubs...if you like the UK-made aspect and the colours then go Hope. If you prefer the star ratchet idea then go DT Swiss. Honestly you can't go wrong either way ~Tristan
I just bought a set of the 2022 350 hubs. I’m a newbie, do I need to lube them? What’s the deal with end caps? Are they required in all applications or just some? I don’t get it and no one seems to explain the options and needs to make them function, even DT Swiss. I have a TA frame which is non boost. It appears I need 15-12mm end cap adaptors to fit my 100x12mm fork. The back is also 12mm at 142mm. Does this take a special end cap too? Nice to have options but where is the chart or video explaining the actual figment needs?
Oh man what a stack of questions! 1) You'll need to lube the inside star ratchet system every 6m or so. You'll need the DT Swiss Special Grease for this - don't use anything else. 2) Endcaps are included when you buy a hub. They're a modular way of being able to swap between different axle types using the same hub. On a DT Swiss hub these are friction fit and pull on/off. It sounds like your rear hub is ready to use. It sounds like you'll need a set of 12mm endcaps to use on your 12mm fork. DT part number is: www.wheelworks.co.nz/shop-2/hub-part-front-axle-adapter/dt-swiss-small-part-endcap-front-pair-100x12-thru-axle-350-only/
I just put some 2022 dt swiss 350 hubs on my mountain bike but they’re so much quieter. Is it possible I installed them incorrectly or put too much grease?
Does 2022 HG freehub comes in steel? I think I read before that the old vs new bearing position have been moved outward more or something. What about the QR end caps for boost and non boost to QR, front and rear, are they the same? Thanks a lot! You are the best on this technical stuff!
Thanks for a great summary comparison. I want to buy a DT Swiss 350 rear mtb hub to upgrade my Pinion and Gates drivetrain bike, but cannot find a suitable hub in boost 148x12 format that is single speed (so as to make the rear wheel symmetrical undished, since no room is needed for a cassette). Any advice?
Old style rear 350 hub: The most recent one I bought with the quick release ends for now and the through axle ends for "later" and the 6 bolt rotor for "later." It went on an elderly campy 10speed bike for now. Concern: my 240 pound very strong son snapped apart a 17 or so tooth cog in the middle of an 11 speed ultegra cassette and the DT hub body has some serious nicks that made the next ultegra hub hard to slip on.
Hello! I recently bought a set of dt swiss 350 classic road hubs with QR clamping system. although it says on the box that they are manufactured in 2022, the design looks exactly like the ones from 2021. the body of the hub is shiny, they have stickers, the position of the logo is exactly like the 2021 model... why is that? I'm a bit confused, can you clarify this aspect for me? Thx !
The newer design ("2022") wasn't rolled out across all variants at the same time. I'm unsure whether the QR style hubs will get the 2022-treatment. It will be interesting to see what DT Swiss do here. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels I have just received the "new" 350 road hub which as the same waterslide labels and graphics, along with the end cap notches, as the MTB hub in your video. It also uses a 36T ratchet (the old road model used 18T).
They are NOT located without an axle fitted, if that's what you mean. This has been the same with the last few generations of 350 hubs. The 240 endcaps are threaded onto the axle and don't move. -Tristan
How about the flange and pitch dimensions? When I go to the DT Swiss spoke calculator I have option for "2021+" hub. This option gives different dimensions than other selection. Don't know if 2021+ are the new style that you show in your video or not. I want to move a DT Swiss straight pull rear hub from 27.5 E1700 wheel to a 29 XM481 rim and trying to calculate spoke lengths. Now I'm really confused! I'm also trying to figure out what nipples are included with XM481 rim so I can select the proper nipple in the calculator.
We don't work much with the straight-pull DT Swiss hubs other than the 180s, and DT Swiss make it really confusing as to what hubs are inside their 'factory' wheels so I really can't help you with that one. Best would be to measure what you've got and compare it to the ones on the DT Swiss spoke calc and hope it matches up The 481 rims include DT Swiss 12mm aluminium Squorx nipples and washers. Enjoy the wheelbuild! -Tristan
Can the new hubs be converted to different axle types? For instance, say you have older bike with 12x142, is there an ability to upgrade the same hub to boost or superboost?
Read a comment you wrote in a reply about rotor and cassette placement for road vs Mtb being a little different. So do you mean to say I can’t use a 142 Mtb hub with my road bike? Or should it be fine? Thanks guys
There are no 'standard' measurements for rotor and cassette placement so each hub company will do things a little differently, even like DT Swiss having the rotor placement different between the 350 and 240 hubs. You might need to adjust the brakes / gears, however there is nothing stopping you from using your 142 "mountain bike" hubs on a modern road bike -Tristan
Hey Tristan thanks for these videos. I want to use two wheelsets on the same disc bike without shimming the rotors or anything. I want to know if I truly need the exact same hub or if I can just have a wheelset with 240 hubs and the other with 350 hubs. Thanks
Great question. There is no published standard for where the rotors or cassette sit on a hub - just some guidelines. Over time most of the main hub makers have settled on very similar dimensions so it's easier than ever to get two hubs / wheels to be interchangable. Having said that - even hubs from the same manufacturer are different. When DT Swiss made their 240 hubs in Switzerland they had different locations to the 350s which were made in Taiwan. Now that the whole hub range is made in Taiwan they seem to be pretty similar. It's also worth noting that the type of cassette and rotor will vary offsets. Shimano road rotors, for example, are slightly different to their mtb rotors. Short answer: Good luck ;-)
what about a comparison between the 350 6 bolt/ ISO and the 350 Centerlock. Which builds the stronger wheel??? Centerlock flanges are the same diameter while the disk side flange on the ISO is a larger diameter. Shorter spokes at wider angle but lower tension. Which wheel ends up strongest/ stiffest?
The *strength* of a wheel isn't really dependent on the flange dimensions, however the *stiffness* of the wheel is. The center-to-flange of both models is the same, so the larger flanges of the 6-bolt version will build into a stiffer wheel. Great question and it could be interesting to do a video on this? ~Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels yes, it works. I received the hub and the adapters today, removing the original end caps was not very easy without a dedicated vice...but the 12x100 adapters now work great 👍
Any more news on when the road variants of the updated 350 will be released? I knew they were coming after the mountain bike version but didn't think it'd be this long.
Yes. In both the Center Lock and 6-bolt versions there are small differences to some of the PCD and center-flange measurements. Nothing significant to the wheels' stiffness or performance but enough that if you're calculating spoke lengths as accurately as we are you'll need to take them into account. -Tristan
These hubs are definately my next choice to go. In a 1 year time span, I paid the price of a 350 already on my crappy SunRinglé SRC, and I am fed up. The Shimano XT seemed to be a good value, but the Scylence tech seems to be a total disaster, and not as reliable as it used to be (I still ride one of the FH-M770, no wear at all, after 16 years...). All alternatives disappeared from the market, so there is no really any alternative for a 148 boost hub with Micro Spline cassette other than DT Swiss. The only thing that kept me off from buying one of these is how loud they are, but I think it is time to get used to it
good to hear that there are old xt hubs that last that long ...ich had only trouble with them ...the freehub broke after around 2 years on 4 of them ...so i now give the 350 a try since its so easy to repair :D in the late 90's i never had any trouble with any hub ..no matter if it was an stx lx or xt they all worked for years and now it all breaks in short time
No EXP version of the 350 - they've stuck with the traditional system with two star ratchets. All the new 2022 model 350 hubs are listed here. -Tristan www.dtswiss.com/en/components/hubs-and-rws/hubs-mtb/350
Freehub bodies in the new line of DT swiss 240s are not interchangeable with the older hubs. Correct me if I'm wrong. I tried and they don't work together.
Any of the "Classic" and "EXP" freehub bodies are interchangeable. Just make sure you have the red HCDXXX00S0978S washer installed on the EXP hub. -Tristan www.wheelworks.co.nz/shop-2/hub-part/dt-swiss-small-part-dt-shim-ring-%ef%bf%bd25-9-19-9x2-3mm-exp-hcdxxx00s0978s/
I think you must have done something wrong as they're complete interchangeable. The Ratchet LN freehub bodies found on the 370 LN won't fit but any "classic" star ratchet (so any 350 and all pre-2022 model 240 and 180 hubs) will fit the EXP hub with the HCDXXX00S0978S and visa-versa with the HCDXXX00S0978S removed. -Tristan
I don't think that's true...in fact I think it's the opposite. This is something I want to do a lot more research on and we're really hoping to do some interesting videos on this later in the year. Get subscribed if you're not already and we'll geekout together -Tristan
I like a more silent hub. I also want a lower engagement hub to prevent kickback so Onyx is off the list. Can I apply more grease on the DT Ratchet to lower the sound of the hub?
For sure. Use the DT Swiss Special Grease (HXTXXX00NSG20S) and it will go nearly silent. The grease will thin out with use so you'll have to do this pretty frequently. You want to apply the grease to the contact faces of the star ratchets. You *can* over-pack the hub so be careful. -Tristan
Hey! Did you do video on DT Swiss 370 hub? It finally has Ratchet system now, and is supposed to be basically very similar to older 350 and even 240 (before exp). Would love to see some info on 370, just got it with X1900 wheels and for now I am super happy and interested more in details and break down. Thanks!
No video yet...the Ratchet LN system is good but also a pain in the arse. We'll do a video at some point explaining the differences but it's low on the list at the moment sorry -Tristan
yes they are. The Hybrid hubs use a steel freehub body, but they are functionally interchangeable with the aluminium one used on any 350 "Classic Ratchet" or "EXP" hub. They are NOT interchangable with the "Ratchet LN" hubs . Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Thanks! When I emailed DT Swiss they said the hybrid hub shell was different with thicker flanges and for thicker spokes only. Good to know that they are functionally interchangeable. I wanted to build a wheelset for my eMTB that I could swap the freehub on and use on my hardtail with higher engagement ratchets. Thank you!
@@DISABLED12-7 Did they say what spokes need to be used? The flanges on the newer Hybrid hubs are thicker, however they still fit regular Competition spokes, and we've had nothing to indicate otherwise. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels This is the reply I got. "No, the Hybrid hub comes with an entirely different hub shell that is thicker at the spoke flanges and has larger spoke hole drillings. The Hybrid hub is only compatible with 2.34mm spokes, while the standard hub can use 2.0mm and smaller. The Hybrid hub also comes with 24T ratchets which were specifically designed to handle the extra torque from an Ebike."
Да, у меня есть вопрос! как Вы думаете, почему компания DT Swiss прекратила производить велосипедные втулки Straightpull 32H 350 ??? Лично я очень хотел бы их купить, но к сожалению их больше не производят (((
"why do you think DT Swiss stopped making Straightpull 32H 350 bicycle hubs??? Personally, I would really like to buy them, but unfortunately they are no longer produced (((" I think the geometry on the 28 hole hubs (14 spokes per side) works better for straight-pull as it makes it easier to lace the wheels without the spoke heads overlapping. That's only my guess though :-) -Tristan
Isn't it so that the cover ring on the front wheel end caps are only there if you run 15 mm thru axle? If you run 12 mm thru axle the end caps are of the plugged in type without cover ring?
We're unable to buy the Ratchet LN hubs "aftermarket" as they appear to be an OEM (original equipment) thing only - so it's unlikely we'll do a review on them. I would like to do a comparison of the LN to "Classic" star ratchet though so hopefully we can make that happen. -Tristan
Thx. As far as I can see the only difference between 350 and ln is where the seal is placed. In the hub edge on 350 resp on the freewheel body itself on ln. Same place as 3-pawl 370. But that seal could be important.
i honestly like these more than 240s, the 350s use bigger bearings which are made by quality bearing companies like skf, nsk, ntn etc. 240s are proprietary dt or garbage aftermarket bike brands like enduro or generic imports. everyone makes a 6902 and they are longer lasting than the tiny 1526 you find on the 240exp rear, or, there's another weird one in the front with the 240exp. the 2022 350s are stellar
Don't get me started on the DT Swiss front hub bearings! They use some super weird combos on the "higher end" front hut. 6802 bearings 4 life! To be fair 15x26x7mm bearings are becoming more popular across brands and they do tend to last well. -Tristan
@@michaelbondad3912 there is no difference between the EXP and "Classic" freehub bodies and they're completely interchangeable. The Ratchet LN freehub bodies are NOT interchangeable with "Classic" or EXP. All driveside endcaps between the Ratchet LN, Classic and EXP are the same and interchangeable. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels cheers. The flanges seem a little thicker though by the looks of it... wonder why (not that the older ones have any issues with bending or breaking)
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels "They're trickling in now: road-disc and 6-bolt mountain bike are in stock. Center Lock and SuperBoost to follow soon" Do you know if centre lock version is now available (BTW, aren't all road wheels centre lock?) Also, could you shed some light on the issues with centre lock and Shimano discs - as shown here ua-cam.com/video/O26Uw_0p3cE/v-deo.html It seems shocking that they'd have released hubs which require adapters to get standard Shimano discs fitted on them.
Hi, love the video, just what I was interesed to... I am about to pull the trigger on some 350 '22 Hubs, but I am not sure about the spokes. I love the looks of the straight-pull, but I am not sure if there are any disadvatanges. What are your thoughts about straight-pull wheels?
Yep! You'll need two of HCDXXX00N3304S or you can buy them in a kit with two ratchet rings, two new springs and some grease as HWTXXX00NSK54S . We have both in stock. -Tristan
we've talked about doing a comparison of the 370 3-pawl and Ratchet LN hubs but we never have...mainly because the 370 is oem-only and not a hub we sell so we put our limited time into the hubs we're able to sell -Tristan
I have old 350 hubs with 18 tooth ratchet and it is nearly silent (which I like). I also have older 240s hubs with 36 tooth and they are louder but not unbearable. I recently picked up wheels with new 350 & 36 tooth and they are much louder. Adding grease didn’t help much. Have you noticed this?any tips?
None of the DT Swiss hubs come with the 54t ratchet. All of the 350 "mountain bike" sizes (Boost and SuperBoost) come with 36t for 2022 and all the "road" sizes with 18t. All of the EXP hubs (the new 240 and 180) come with 36t regardless of whether they're road or mountain. -Tristan
When they're new and packed with grease they're nearly silent. As that grease breaks down and thins out they get pretty loud and will turn into an 8 on your scale. Fresh maintenance brings them back to 0 or 1. -Tristan
@@alen-commentnazi8774 You didn't hear it from me, but if you run a really thin lube like TriFlow it will make them loud! You'll need to service the freehub body more frequently though as the thinner lube won't be able to function as well as the DT Swiss Special Grease. I'm also guessing this would void your DT warranty but that's your call :-D -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels i've actually heard of quite some people using chain lube in their freehub. also what does the exp mean exactly? some people said exp is supposed to be some new more reliable edition and some say its supposed to be quieter than non-exp hubs i'm glad you guys made the video about the faulty dt240s and how i can check the serial number to see what i need to do as far as warranty goes
@@alen-commentnazi8774 I've got lots more watching for you! We did this video which explains the EXP system and it's potential issue: ua-cam.com/video/TeZXukqzon4/v-deo.html This video is an overview of the old 350, the 240 EXP and the 180 EXP: ua-cam.com/video/_solStr8PnU/v-deo.html If that's not enough info this video is a full deepdive breakdown of them: ua-cam.com/video/7Y-BjpMkIaY/v-deo.html And finally here is the sound of a 240 EXP: ua-cam.com/video/Amw70og8c4U/v-deo.html Now go do your homework :-D There is a test at the end....
DT Swiss do make a range of ebike hubs (they call them "Hybrid" models) but we've had really good luck using the regular 350 and 240 models on ebikes. The only thing to look out for is the HG style freehub bodies will suffer cassette cog damage quickly on an ebike so upgrading to one of the steel HG freehub bodies would be worth doing. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels thanks i wanted to use my Santa Cruz reserve wheelset on my ebike so i just need to find a steel free hub body now I’m stoked!! Thanks
Nice. Seem there is now little reason to get the 240, because even though they use the exp system the bearings on exp might also wear out faster and weight savings alone seems not really worth it now. If you want light, you would go for 180!
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Yes! Almost all the benefits of yesteryears 240 but without the new exp system which for some is a huge benefit. I had one of the defect 180 hubs, and I am still a bit uncertain about the exp even with new internals. It was scary when it stopped working!
@@TeamCykelhold It's understandable to be nervous but we haven't had any reported problems with the EXP system once the updated bits have been installed. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels good to know. I have seen varying reports on mtbr, but I think it was mostly one guy who didn't actually get the proper repair from the service center because the freehub body sides looked worn where the ratchet fits.
Going from 31.7g to 22.6 is a 28% weight saving...while 9g isn't huge in the context of the whole bike it's a considerable amount on such a small item -TT
correct..and sometimes the cheaper products will cost more to make like the Ratchet LN freehub bodies which are more complicated than the Classic / EXP freehubs yet retail for less. -Tristan
Really good side by side comparison. Appreciate it
Are all the internal parts made of metal? no plastic ?
Ratchet springs are signficantly lighter. I wonder where the savings came from. Is this not the "weakpoint"? I mean if spring tension degrades over time, the engagement becomes compromised, no?
Hello!
I have question regarding those waterslides... by any chance still have not figured out way to get them off? It seems to me that lot of bike brands are replacing basic painted graphics or decals with waterslide ones and it makes me furious, because I can not de-brand anything :(
We haven't tried too hard, but nothing seems to get a waterslide off....this seems to be why companies like using them because they're affordable and easy to apply and don't come off -TT
@@bthomas518 The looks. I generally prefer clean looking bike. Besides, most of graphical designs of bike brands are just trash. Never understood why people even bother designing disgusting graphics when they could just make it simple and clean. Not exactly case of DT with 350s, since it is cleand and B&W... but try matching 240s with their red color :D
Spoke hole diameter. Seems like it went from 2.5 to 2mm?
Hi Alex. All spokes use rolled (not cut) threads so a 2.0mm spoke like a regular Competition or Aerolite has a thread diameter of around 2.3mm. This means they wouldn't fit into a 2.0mm hole. Most good quality hubs have spoke holes around 2.4 to 2.5mm in diameter. DT Swiss didn't change the spoke hole diameter between the two generations of hub. -Tristan
What are these rims for a mountain bike gravel bike. Can you put them on a lightweight e-bike? Will they fit a Trek EXE
Did you see our video on DT Swiss rims? ua-cam.com/video/jki2T4lE9xc/v-deo.html
Thanks heaps for the overview. I want to use my old 350 hubs in a new wheel build. 1) Are the spoke length specs the same? 2) is the ratchet ring available as a seperate part and is that the only part needed for the upgrade? Really appreciate your advive.
Thanks for uploading - very interesting. I just ordered some Shimano RS400 (Tiagra) road hubs 36 hole (non disc). Going to build up some carbon wheels in 18spoke radial front and 27 spoke rear in triplet (18 spokes 2x DS, 9 spokes radial NDS). Should be an interesting build....edit: I forgot to say. Shimano hubs are not light, but are super cheap to buy and service. Last for ages too as long as you remember to replace balls and grease regularly! Look pretty good in silver too.
Enjoy the wheelbuild Richard! -Tristan
Do 110mm front hubs use the same hub shell as 100mm front hubs? If so what changes, just the end caps? Or is the internal sleeve shorter as well
Most hubs (including these DT Swiss ones) use the same endcaps between a 100 and 110 hub, and have a different shell. The distance from the dropout to rotor is the same between Boost and Non Boost which is why the endcaps are the same, and the extra width of a Boost comes from between the flanges to increase wheel stiffness ~Tristan
Love the videos. Do you have any idea what the difference is between the dt swiss 350 and the newer dt swiss 370ln ratchet hubs?
The Ratchet LN 370 is pretty similar to the old 350 hub. Ratchet LN is a bit of a clusterfuck though as it uses the same internal parts as the Classic hubs (like all model 350 and pre-2022 240 and 180 hubs) but with a totally different and NOT interchangeable freehub body. We've got a couple of Ratchet LN vids coming up to help explain this better -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Awesome thank you, I'll keep an eye out.
Hi. I just also watched your excellent video on the Hope Pro5 Hub.
I'm interested to know, in your opinion, which of the Hope Pro5 or DT Swiss 350 would be better on a Winter Training Wheel? I know the Pro5 is easier to service but needs bearing replacement more regularly than the DT350 but I'm thinking in terms of 'weatherproofing' and strength/robustness for the heavier rider (95kg)?
Also does the difference in 'points of engagement' make much difference?
I think on the whole more engagement points is better, all things being equal. Both are good hubs...if you like the UK-made aspect and the colours then go Hope. If you prefer the star ratchet idea then go DT Swiss. Honestly you can't go wrong either way ~Tristan
I just bought a set of the 2022 350 hubs. I’m a newbie, do I need to lube them? What’s the deal with end caps? Are they required in all applications or just some? I don’t get it and no one seems to explain the options and needs to make them function, even DT Swiss. I have a TA frame which is non boost. It appears I need 15-12mm end cap adaptors to fit my 100x12mm fork. The back is also 12mm at 142mm. Does this take a special end cap too? Nice to have options but where is the chart or video explaining the actual figment needs?
Oh man what a stack of questions!
1) You'll need to lube the inside star ratchet system every 6m or so. You'll need the DT Swiss Special Grease for this - don't use anything else.
2) Endcaps are included when you buy a hub. They're a modular way of being able to swap between different axle types using the same hub. On a DT Swiss hub these are friction fit and pull on/off.
It sounds like your rear hub is ready to use. It sounds like you'll need a set of 12mm endcaps to use on your 12mm fork. DT part number is: www.wheelworks.co.nz/shop-2/hub-part-front-axle-adapter/dt-swiss-small-part-endcap-front-pair-100x12-thru-axle-350-only/
Drooling. Need some new wheels for my hardtail.
sales@wheelworks.co.nz ;-)
I just put some 2022 dt swiss 350 hubs on my mountain bike but they’re so much quieter. Is it possible I installed them incorrectly or put too much grease?
When the hubs are new the grease makes them very quiet. After some riding the factory grease will thin out and the hubs will become louder. -Tristan
Will you still recommend the older 350s? Planning to build wheels for gravel riding.
Yep! The old 350s are still great hubs. -Tristan
Does 2022 HG freehub comes in steel? I think I read before that the old vs new bearing position have been moved outward more or something. What about the QR end caps for boost and non boost to QR, front and rear, are they the same? Thanks a lot! You are the best on this technical stuff!
Is it also true that the centerlock hubs have smaller bearing sizes than the 6 bolt versions
Thanks for a great summary comparison. I want to buy a DT Swiss 350 rear mtb hub to upgrade my Pinion and Gates drivetrain bike, but cannot find a suitable hub in boost 148x12 format that is single speed (so as to make the rear wheel symmetrical undished, since no room is needed for a cassette). Any advice?
The Hope Pro5 is available in 148mm single speed. It will work really well on Pinion bikes -Tristan
Old style rear 350 hub: The most recent one I bought with the quick release ends for now and the through axle ends for "later" and the 6 bolt rotor for "later." It went on an elderly campy 10speed bike for now.
Concern: my 240 pound very strong son snapped apart a 17 or so tooth cog in the middle of an 11 speed ultegra cassette and the DT hub body has some serious nicks that made the next ultegra hub hard to slip on.
You can buy a steel freehub body in both HG 35mm and GH 36.8mm widths for the DT Swiss hubs -Tristan
Hello! I recently bought a set of dt swiss 350 classic road hubs with QR clamping system. although it says on the box that they are manufactured in 2022, the design looks exactly like the ones from 2021. the body of the hub is shiny, they have stickers, the position of the logo is exactly like the 2021 model... why is that? I'm a bit confused, can you clarify this aspect for me? Thx !
The newer design ("2022") wasn't rolled out across all variants at the same time. I'm unsure whether the QR style hubs will get the 2022-treatment. It will be interesting to see what DT Swiss do here. -Tristan
Have the 350 road hubs been updated? I've seen references to the "new" 350 road hubs but there's nothing on the DT Swiss web site.
We've yet to see anything other than the mtb hubs in the "new" style -TT
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels I have just received the "new" 350 road hub which as the same waterslide labels and graphics, along with the end cap notches, as the MTB hub in your video. It also uses a 36T ratchet (the old road model used 18T).
Do the ends cap of the front hub dt swiss 350 2021 move? Aren't they fixed? Thanks in advance
They are NOT located without an axle fitted, if that's what you mean. This has been the same with the last few generations of 350 hubs. The 240 endcaps are threaded onto the axle and don't move. -Tristan
How about the flange and pitch dimensions? When I go to the DT Swiss spoke calculator I have option for "2021+" hub. This option gives different dimensions than other selection. Don't know if 2021+ are the new style that you show in your video or not. I want to move a DT Swiss straight pull rear hub from 27.5 E1700 wheel to a 29 XM481 rim and trying to calculate spoke lengths. Now I'm really confused! I'm also trying to figure out what nipples are included with XM481 rim so I can select the proper nipple in the calculator.
We don't work much with the straight-pull DT Swiss hubs other than the 180s, and DT Swiss make it really confusing as to what hubs are inside their 'factory' wheels so I really can't help you with that one. Best would be to measure what you've got and compare it to the ones on the DT Swiss spoke calc and hope it matches up
The 481 rims include DT Swiss 12mm aluminium Squorx nipples and washers.
Enjoy the wheelbuild! -Tristan
Can the new hubs be converted to different axle types? For instance, say you have older bike with 12x142, is there an ability to upgrade the same hub to boost or superboost?
Yep! Take a look at this page for help on how to convert to Boost: www.wheelworks.co.nz/converting-your-hubs-to-boost/
Read a comment you wrote in a reply about rotor and cassette placement for road vs Mtb being a little different. So do you mean to say I can’t use a 142 Mtb hub with my road bike? Or should it be fine? Thanks guys
There are no 'standard' measurements for rotor and cassette placement so each hub company will do things a little differently, even like DT Swiss having the rotor placement different between the 350 and 240 hubs. You might need to adjust the brakes / gears, however there is nothing stopping you from using your 142 "mountain bike" hubs on a modern road bike -Tristan
Informative videos from your channel, thanks!
Awesome - thank you R3G
Hey Tristan thanks for these videos. I want to use two wheelsets on the same disc bike without shimming the rotors or anything. I want to know if I truly need the exact same hub or if I can just have a wheelset with 240 hubs and the other with 350 hubs. Thanks
Great question. There is no published standard for where the rotors or cassette sit on a hub - just some guidelines. Over time most of the main hub makers have settled on very similar dimensions so it's easier than ever to get two hubs / wheels to be interchangable.
Having said that - even hubs from the same manufacturer are different. When DT Swiss made their 240 hubs in Switzerland they had different locations to the 350s which were made in Taiwan. Now that the whole hub range is made in Taiwan they seem to be pretty similar.
It's also worth noting that the type of cassette and rotor will vary offsets. Shimano road rotors, for example, are slightly different to their mtb rotors.
Short answer: Good luck ;-)
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Thanks. So it wouldn't be that big of an issue if I get different hub brand for my gravel and road wheels?
@@Carftymk I can't say for sure but it's better than it used to be
what about a comparison between the 350 6 bolt/ ISO and the 350 Centerlock. Which builds the stronger wheel??? Centerlock flanges are the same diameter while the disk side flange on the ISO is a larger diameter. Shorter spokes at wider angle but lower tension. Which wheel ends up strongest/ stiffest?
The *strength* of a wheel isn't really dependent on the flange dimensions, however the *stiffness* of the wheel is. The center-to-flange of both models is the same, so the larger flanges of the 6-bolt version will build into a stiffer wheel. Great question and it could be interesting to do a video on this? ~Tristan
Can a new DT 350 Classic 32h 6-bolt front hub be converted from 15x100 to 12x100? The DT Swiss website does not provide any information about this...
Yeah, same endcaps for the 6-bolt and Center Lock hubs -TT
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels yes, it works. I received the hub and the adapters today, removing the original end caps was not very easy without a dedicated vice...but the 12x100 adapters now work great 👍
Thanks for this video! Very helpful.
Glad it was helpful!
Is a 150x12 rear the same as a 148x12, but with different end caps? Or does the 150 has a different shell? Thanks.
No. A 150x12mm hub is the same as a 157x12mm hub with different endcaps. It shares NO compatibility with a 148mm hub -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Thanks. Much appreciated.
Any more news on when the road variants of the updated 350 will be released? I knew they were coming after the mountain bike version but didn't think it'd be this long.
We're still showing ETAs for the pre-2022 version hubs in late 2022 with no ETAs on the '2022' version. Weird. -Tristn
have flange offsets, PCD or spoke hole diameters changed for these hubs?
Yes. In both the Center Lock and 6-bolt versions there are small differences to some of the PCD and center-flange measurements. Nothing significant to the wheels' stiffness or performance but enough that if you're calculating spoke lengths as accurately as we are you'll need to take them into account. -Tristan
These hubs are definately my next choice to go. In a 1 year time span, I paid the price of a 350 already on my crappy SunRinglé SRC, and I am fed up. The Shimano XT seemed to be a good value, but the Scylence tech seems to be a total disaster, and not as reliable as it used to be (I still ride one of the FH-M770, no wear at all, after 16 years...). All alternatives disappeared from the market, so there is no really any alternative for a 148 boost hub with Micro Spline cassette other than DT Swiss. The only thing that kept me off from buying one of these is how loud they are, but I think it is time to get used to it
good to hear that there are old xt hubs that last that long ...ich had only trouble with them ...the freehub broke after around 2 years on 4 of them ...so i now give the 350 a try since its so easy to repair :D in the late 90's i never had any trouble with any hub ..no matter if it was an stx lx or xt they all worked for years and now it all breaks in short time
Do not go novatec :) had one that lasted 2 rides before cracking in 5 spots. What a waste of wheelbuilding time :)
Oddly the 157 Super Boost hub only comes as IS 6 bolt rotor mount. Why no Center Lock for Super Boost?
I've wondered the same - when I asked Hope they said they didn't think there would be demand.
hey, can someone tell me if you can remove the decals from the 2022 hubs? Thank you guys
You obviously didn't watch the video 🤣 2022 decals cannot be removed -Tristan
I can't find the new 350 on the Dt Swiss web site. So no Exp version of the 350?
No EXP version of the 350 - they've stuck with the traditional system with two star ratchets. All the new 2022 model 350 hubs are listed here. -Tristan www.dtswiss.com/en/components/hubs-and-rws/hubs-mtb/350
is the HG freehub fits 12spd HG cassette? like NX eagle or 12spd Sunrace HG cassette?
There has been no change to the HG-11 freehub so any cassette which fits a modern HG-11 (like NX) should fit the 2022 hubs as well -Tristan
Hi! ¿is it possible to insert the new stylized hub axle in an old 350? Thanks
Yes - the axles are fully interchangeable -Trisatn
Freehub bodies in the new line of DT swiss 240s are not interchangeable with the older hubs. Correct me if I'm wrong. I tried and they don't work together.
Any of the "Classic" and "EXP" freehub bodies are interchangeable. Just make sure you have the red HCDXXX00S0978S washer installed on the EXP hub. -Tristan
www.wheelworks.co.nz/shop-2/hub-part/dt-swiss-small-part-dt-shim-ring-%ef%bf%bd25-9-19-9x2-3mm-exp-hcdxxx00s0978s/
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels But the other way it doesn't work I think. I tried to fit EXP freehub body on the old hub. It didn't work for me.
I think you must have done something wrong as they're complete interchangeable. The Ratchet LN freehub bodies found on the 370 LN won't fit but any "classic" star ratchet (so any 350 and all pre-2022 model 240 and 180 hubs) will fit the EXP hub with the HCDXXX00S0978S and visa-versa with the HCDXXX00S0978S removed. -Tristan
For a road set up can you change the 18 tooth engagement for the 54 tooth engagement and would this bring any advantages or disadvantages?
The sonic resonance of high engagement should make you significantly more aero
Don't forget improved torsional stiffness! ha!
No, the 54t won't do anything on a road bike other than make you slower while coasting. -Tristan
Is it a correct understanding that the louder the hub while spinning = more energy loss (more energy is converted to sound) ?
I don't think that's true...in fact I think it's the opposite. This is something I want to do a lot more research on and we're really hoping to do some interesting videos on this later in the year. Get subscribed if you're not already and we'll geekout together -Tristan
Excellent video!
Thank you very much!
I like a more silent hub. I also want a lower engagement hub to prevent kickback so Onyx is off the list. Can I apply more grease on the DT Ratchet to lower the sound of the hub?
For sure. Use the DT Swiss Special Grease (HXTXXX00NSG20S) and it will go nearly silent. The grease will thin out with use so you'll have to do this pretty frequently. You want to apply the grease to the contact faces of the star ratchets. You *can* over-pack the hub so be careful. -Tristan
is it possible to remove the black paint & clear anodize them?
The 2022 hubs are anodized (not painted like the older ones) so you'd need to sand it all off. It would be a lot of work! -Tristan
appreciate the content!
We appreciate the comment!
Hey! Did you do video on DT Swiss 370 hub? It finally has Ratchet system now, and is supposed to be basically very similar to older 350 and even 240 (before exp). Would love to see some info on 370, just got it with X1900 wheels and for now I am super happy and interested more in details and break down. Thanks!
No video yet...the Ratchet LN system is good but also a pain in the arse. We'll do a video at some point explaining the differences but it's low on the list at the moment sorry -Tristan
370 inside seems same as old 350!
Good explication. Thank you!!!
Are the freehub bodies between the 350 and 350 hybrid hub interchangeable?
yes they are. The Hybrid hubs use a steel freehub body, but they are functionally interchangeable with the aluminium one used on any 350 "Classic Ratchet" or "EXP" hub. They are NOT interchangable with the "Ratchet LN" hubs . Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Thanks! When I emailed DT Swiss they said the hybrid hub shell was different with thicker flanges and for thicker spokes only. Good to know that they are functionally interchangeable.
I wanted to build a wheelset for my eMTB that I could swap the freehub on and use on my hardtail with higher engagement ratchets.
Thank you!
@@DISABLED12-7 Did they say what spokes need to be used? The flanges on the newer Hybrid hubs are thicker, however they still fit regular Competition spokes, and we've had nothing to indicate otherwise. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels This is the reply I got.
"No, the Hybrid hub comes with an entirely different hub shell that is thicker at the spoke flanges and has larger spoke hole drillings. The Hybrid hub is only compatible with 2.34mm spokes, while the standard hub can use 2.0mm and smaller. The Hybrid hub also comes with 24T ratchets which were specifically designed to handle the extra torque from an Ebike."
Да, у меня есть вопрос!
как Вы думаете, почему компания DT Swiss прекратила производить велосипедные втулки Straightpull 32H 350 ???
Лично я очень хотел бы их купить, но к сожалению их больше не производят (((
"why do you think DT Swiss stopped making Straightpull 32H 350 bicycle hubs???
Personally, I would really like to buy them, but unfortunately they are no longer produced ((("
I think the geometry on the 28 hole hubs (14 spokes per side) works better for straight-pull as it makes it easier to lace the wheels without the spoke heads overlapping. That's only my guess though :-) -Tristan
Excellent explanation. Thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Isn't it so that the cover ring on the front wheel end caps are only there if you run 15 mm thru axle? If you run 12 mm thru axle the end caps are of the plugged in type without cover ring?
And by the way: a review of the rachet ln hub would be very appreciated.
Correct - the silly covers are only for the 15mm axle and not the 12mm endcaps
We're unable to buy the Ratchet LN hubs "aftermarket" as they appear to be an OEM (original equipment) thing only - so it's unlikely we'll do a review on them. I would like to do a comparison of the LN to "Classic" star ratchet though so hopefully we can make that happen. -Tristan
Thx. As far as I can see the only difference between 350 and ln is where the seal is placed. In the hub edge on 350 resp on the freewheel body itself on ln. Same place as 3-pawl 370. But that seal could be important.
i honestly like these more than 240s, the 350s use bigger bearings which are made by quality bearing companies like skf, nsk, ntn etc. 240s are proprietary dt or garbage aftermarket bike brands like enduro or generic imports. everyone makes a 6902 and they are longer lasting than the tiny 1526 you find on the 240exp rear, or, there's another weird one in the front with the 240exp. the 2022 350s are stellar
Don't get me started on the DT Swiss front hub bearings! They use some super weird combos on the "higher end" front hut. 6802 bearings 4 life! To be fair 15x26x7mm bearings are becoming more popular across brands and they do tend to last well. -Tristan
I thought old free hub bodies weren’t compatible with EXP hub shells. Am I wrong?
@@michaelbondad3912 there is no difference between the EXP and "Classic" freehub bodies and they're completely interchangeable.
The Ratchet LN freehub bodies are NOT interchangeable with "Classic" or EXP.
All driveside endcaps between the Ratchet LN, Classic and EXP are the same and interchangeable.
-Tristan
Excellent. Thank you.
What about geometry changes? Anything worth noting?
Nope - flange diameters and offsets on the J-bend hubs remain unchanged -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels cheers. The flanges seem a little thicker though by the looks of it... wonder why (not that the older ones have any issues with bending or breaking)
Nice. When do these drop?
They're trickling in now: road-disc and 6-bolt mountain bike are in stock. Center Lock and SuperBoost to follow soon 👌
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels "They're trickling in now: road-disc and 6-bolt mountain bike are in stock. Center Lock and SuperBoost to follow soon"
Do you know if centre lock version is now available (BTW, aren't all road wheels centre lock?)
Also, could you shed some light on the issues with centre lock and Shimano discs - as shown here ua-cam.com/video/O26Uw_0p3cE/v-deo.html
It seems shocking that they'd have released hubs which require adapters to get standard Shimano discs fitted on them.
Hi, love the video, just what I was interesed to...
I am about to pull the trigger on some 350 '22 Hubs, but I am not sure about the spokes.
I love the looks of the straight-pull, but I am not sure if there are any disadvatanges.
What are your thoughts about straight-pull wheels?
I promise we'll be doing a straight-pull vs J-bend video in the next few months! It's a big topic -Tristan
Noob question, 2022 350's are still swappable to 54t rachet? Tia!
Yep! You'll need two of HCDXXX00N3304S or you can buy them in a kit with two ratchet rings, two new springs and some grease as HWTXXX00NSK54S . We have both in stock. -Tristan
Can you upgrade dt swiss 350 2021 rachet to 2022? To become 36T.
Yes! Either the 36t or 54t kits will work. -Tristan
can you do a review of 2022 DT 370 Hub?
we've talked about doing a comparison of the 370 3-pawl and Ratchet LN hubs but we never have...mainly because the 370 is oem-only and not a hub we sell so we put our limited time into the hubs we're able to sell -Tristan
I have old 350 hubs with 18 tooth ratchet and it is nearly silent (which I like). I also have older 240s hubs with 36 tooth and they are louder but not unbearable. I recently picked up wheels with new 350 & 36 tooth and they are much louder. Adding grease didn’t help much. Have you noticed this?any tips?
Which ratchets that the road biker use ? 18 36 or 54t
None of the DT Swiss hubs come with the 54t ratchet. All of the 350 "mountain bike" sizes (Boost and SuperBoost) come with 36t for 2022 and all the "road" sizes with 18t.
All of the EXP hubs (the new 240 and 180) come with 36t regardless of whether they're road or mountain.
-Tristan
That's for 6 bolt versions, CL versions are about the same in weight
Hey guys how loud is the dt 540t exp on a scale of 1-10? 1 being silent and 10 being a profile hub
When they're new and packed with grease they're nearly silent. As that grease breaks down and thins out they get pretty loud and will turn into an 8 on your scale. Fresh maintenance brings them back to 0 or 1. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels oooo i love loud
@@alen-commentnazi8774 You didn't hear it from me, but if you run a really thin lube like TriFlow it will make them loud! You'll need to service the freehub body more frequently though as the thinner lube won't be able to function as well as the DT Swiss Special Grease. I'm also guessing this would void your DT warranty but that's your call :-D -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels i've actually heard of quite some people using chain lube in their freehub. also what does the exp mean exactly? some people said exp is supposed to be some new more reliable edition and some say its supposed to be quieter than non-exp hubs
i'm glad you guys made the video about the faulty dt240s and how i can check the serial number to see what i need to do as far as warranty goes
@@alen-commentnazi8774 I've got lots more watching for you!
We did this video which explains the EXP system and it's potential issue:
ua-cam.com/video/TeZXukqzon4/v-deo.html
This video is an overview of the old 350, the 240 EXP and the 180 EXP:
ua-cam.com/video/_solStr8PnU/v-deo.html
If that's not enough info this video is a full deepdive breakdown of them:
ua-cam.com/video/7Y-BjpMkIaY/v-deo.html
And finally here is the sound of a 240 EXP:
ua-cam.com/video/Amw70og8c4U/v-deo.html
Now go do your homework :-D There is a test at the end....
I loved the silence of the old 18 tooth ratchets. Can these new generation be downgraded to 18 tooth using the old 240s ratchets?
No, they cannot. There are only 36 and 54t options for the EXP hubs -TT
Is 350 similiar to big ride hub
Yes - the Big Ride is the fat bike version of the 350 and does NOT use the EXP internals -Tristan
Still have to remove ratchet ring housing from to replace bearings?
Yep :-(
Will it work on an ebike?
DT Swiss do make a range of ebike hubs (they call them "Hybrid" models) but we've had really good luck using the regular 350 and 240 models on ebikes. The only thing to look out for is the HG style freehub bodies will suffer cassette cog damage quickly on an ebike so upgrading to one of the steel HG freehub bodies would be worth doing. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels thanks i wanted to use my Santa Cruz reserve wheelset on my ebike so i just need to find a steel free hub body now I’m stoked!! Thanks
You'll need part code HWRABX00S6530S -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels thanks so much
Nice. Seem there is now little reason to get the 240, because even though they use the exp system the bearings on exp might also wear out faster and weight savings alone seems not really worth it now. If you want light, you would go for 180!
The 2022 version of the 350 closes the weight gap to the 240 even more! -Tristan
ua-cam.com/video/MBRsMkLcEI8/v-deo.html
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels Yes! Almost all the benefits of yesteryears 240 but without the new exp system which for some is a huge benefit. I had one of the defect 180 hubs, and I am still a bit uncertain about the exp even with new internals. It was scary when it stopped working!
@@TeamCykelhold It's understandable to be nervous but we haven't had any reported problems with the EXP system once the updated bits have been installed. -Tristan
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels good to know. I have seen varying reports on mtbr, but I think it was mostly one guy who didn't actually get the proper repair from the service center because the freehub body sides looked worn where the ratchet fits.
Is anyone here knows if the XDR end caps is the same size as the XD end cap?
They're different and not interchangeable. The XD endcaps are 16mm in length and the XDR are 17mm (both for a 12mm thru-axle) -Tristan
I'm going to buy 2022 hubs boost 😍😍😍😍
Bruh... I wouldn't call 9g off the axle a "massive weight savings"
Going from 31.7g to 22.6 is a 28% weight saving...while 9g isn't huge in the context of the whole bike it's a considerable amount on such a small item -TT
These small machining variances are just factually not a significant cost. It’s a matter of seconds on a cnc.
correct..and sometimes the cheaper products will cost more to make like the Ratchet LN freehub bodies which are more complicated than the Classic / EXP freehubs yet retail for less. -Tristan
Por favor como adquirir para Ecuador
You'll have to check with your local DT Swiss importer or bike shop -Tristan
SAVING aluminum
cost saving
I don´t think so if it is CNCmachined from CUBE.
the new dt swiss hubs have terribly poor paint! it comes off after 3 months :/
The new 2022 matte version? We haven't seen any paint issues with these but the old gloss version tended to chip. Do you have any photos?
@@WheelworksHandcraftedWheels yes i do
count how many times this guy ses significant.
It's a significant amount!