Goes to show how weird the 90's were for big swings in Hollywood. Hard to believe there was a time that Hollywood seemed very hesitant to dig into book/IP adaptations, but the proof was there in the 90's. So many big budget flops that were adaptations. Mostly, I think, because the filmmakers didn't really "get" the properties they were trying to make. Too many filmmakers were more interested in putting their own spin on an established IP while ignoring the spirit or appeal of the source material (Tim Burtons's Planet of the Apes, the Stallone Judge Dread movie, the painful Mario Brothers film). With some rare exceptions, of course (Addams Family). I don't disagree that Hollywood is playing it too safe these days, but they haven't recovered from having all nearly all of the best screenwriters going to prestige cable TV series, where writers get multiple seasons to craft far deeper narratives than what they can squeeze into a 100 minute script for a Hollywood feature. Steaming hasn't helped matters either.
ironically, the most recent writers' strike is due to streaming platforms stiffing them on royalties... so there is a chance that good writing returns to hollywood filmmaking for a while? altho some of these streams are themselves hollywood 😱
Dwayne Johnson hasn't had a 'box office bomb' at the level used by this video (less than 50% budget in domestic gross, e.g. Black Adam still made ~90% of the budget in domestic gross, which is still a significant loss for investors but does not fit the definition of this video). Based on the data used for this video alone, the rock should actually be considered the risk-adverse 'safe choice' more than an actor who keeps getting jobs despite the bombs. Alternatively, you could say this study used a way-to-high-bar in their definition of 'box office bombs'.
Thank God for A24 for supporting original stories. I hope Everything, Everywhere, All at Once isn't a flash in the pan and more studios take risks like that.
What I love about A24 is that it takes familiar ideas/concepts and expands on them to create a whole new story. A multi-universe is not a new idea. Family drama and having an existential crisis are not new ideas. In fact, Everything, Everywhere, All at Once is pretty much a combination of The Matrix and A Christmas Carol but with more nuance and an Asian family at the center. A24 is succeeding because not only do they value fresh ideas and engaging storytelling, but they know how to take a basic/familiar idea and turn it on its head to create a new story. They don't have to rely on continuing a franchise or existing IP to help them get attention from audiences (they can choose to do so if they want to, for example, X and Pearl, but they don't heavily rely on that option). Nowadays when A24 comes out with a new project, there's excitement because A24 has accumulated a lot of trust in their studio.
Event Horizon didn't kill Anderson's career because it turned into a cult classic that did much better on home release. Soldier absolutely did finish him off, though. And Formon? Well... Amadeus is one of the greatest movies of all time, period. One Flew one of the greatest novel adaptations, too. It's understandable how people assumed Man on the Moon was a fluke.
John Carter deserved better. It was really truthful to the original material (updated, of course). I feel that it flopped in part because of bad marketing -- the trailers were meaningless for anyone who did not know the original novels already! (For those who still don't, it's the series that begins with A Princess of Mars, by Rice Burroughs). But it's one of the few movies I enjoy rewatching, and near the end has one of the funniest unexpected jokes in movie history.
Event Horizon and Man on the Moon might have ben flops but they were really good which might help explain the directors' survival. Another key is how successful they (whatever role) might have been prior huge household names are more likely to get another shot
This was super interesting. Thanks Fandom. It always makes me sad when people don't show up for great, unique movies (Nice Guys comes to mind) because it just reinforces studios position of never making anything not based on existing IP. Which is just boring.
Actors like Pacino, Depp or DeNiro show up for the paycheck more than creativity. Maybe that's why they don't care if it's a flop. They're still gonna get new car money regardless.
When even your fart has more charisma than a hot actress in her 20's, you just showing up would give the movie more magic than some talentless actors after-burning their souls on set. For artists, talent is the only thing that matters. To be honest, when you have actors like those on set, it's more of the director's fault when the production flops.
I personally enjoy John Carter. Wasn't a masterpiece but I thought that movie was a lot of fun and I was hoping for a sequel. Unfortunately we didn't get it due to it's failure in the box office.
The argument is flawed, since movies cam still turn in a profit after the initial run. There are many classic movies that are bombs by this metric. Stuff like The Wizard of Oz, Blade Runner and The Shawshank Redemption. In the 90's, a movie could end up earning more on DVD sales than in theatres. This is why they were seemingly more happy to take risk, because it wasn't really a big risk. There was a big secondary revenue stream.
Its bad writing that kills their careers. Some films maybe had bad reviews like Rambo, but over time they're becoming more relevant and Stallone is still making films.
I would add the rating agencies and internet to this. It seems a bit strange that the risk aversion of studios happen to coexist with the blooming of internet ratings like rotten tomatoes and imdb.
I'd like to say that I enjoyed this, but you spoke so fast and didn't explain yourself adequately. Perhaps if I was in showbiz and was used to speaking about this stuff all of the time, I would have appreciated your video more (and understood it better). I understood the conclusions you were trying to prove. I just wish I could have understood the steps you took to get to those conclusions better.
I agree, it's like Hollywood is to afraid these days to make good movies and just want sequels of already established ips. No new room for creative ideas.
Show me how Star Wars Attack of the Clones & Star Wars Revenge of the Sith were flops according to your definition. I thought they made a ton of money despite the hate that some people piled on them.
Tim Allen is kind' of a wang, but Big Trouble is super underrated. Great cast, well edited, the directing is good. In a lot of ways, its kind of just Ocean's 11 if it were a dumb comedy and well rounded female characters
Several of the flops that “lucky” actors survived are very good but didn’t get marketed well (Soldier, Rosewood, Rock Star) and two are legit masterpieces: Big Trouble in Little China, Man on The Moon.
It’s based off an IP literally nobody knows about anymore on a ridiculously massive budget, the acting was laughable, the characters were brainless cardboard cutouts, and it clearly didn’t understand or respect the source material. This was the first film I ever saw where I was rooting for the bad guys.
@@inktea256You are crazy. John Carter is not unknown. It was bigger than Conan the Barbarian. It is a very famous and huge selling book series. Disney just dropped the movie with no promotion. Most people never even realized that it was made and released.
Agreed, I remember seeing it at home (on TV or something, I didn’t rent it) & was surprised how much I enjoyed it for a film I’d heard nothing or next to nothing about. I can’t even recall any marketing linking it to it’s influential origins. Maybe they did, I just never saw any. And it was definitely better than any impression any marketing I might have seen left on me.
Your video is interesting and entertaining. Please remove the scanning bits, they are not necessary, your content is good enough to not need distractions.
I’m guessing A Wrinkle in Time ? I haven’t seen it but I think that’s Mindy Kaling running & Oprah in the background & they both look like their characters from what I recall.
Why isn't Elizabeth Berkley on the list of Fallen Performers for Showgirls? Colin Farrell and Nicole Kidman's careers are just fine. They bounced back.
@@MrSpartan993 because most people find him to be a likable character himself so when he plays a version of himself it’s all many people want to see. Keep in mind most people go to the movies to have a good time, and that’s generally something he’s good at.
The number of flops really due to efficiency or playing safe? Or selling off or diverting movies that look likely to flop in theaters to Netflix or Disney Plus release instead of theatrical release?
0 seconds ago The drop number of flops really due to efficiency or playing safe? Or selling off or diverting movies that look likely to flop in theaters to Netflix or Disney Plus release instead of theatrical release? Ditto new promising stories.
I WAS going to give this video a Like, then you called John Crapper underrated. That was the film which made me realize I needed to be careful about what films I see. It took me years of lying to my dad I liked it to realize that.
"John Carter, underrated btw." Thank you Spencer!!! Probably my favorite bomb ever haha
Goes to show how weird the 90's were for big swings in Hollywood. Hard to believe there was a time that Hollywood seemed very hesitant to dig into book/IP adaptations, but the proof was there in the 90's. So many big budget flops that were adaptations. Mostly, I think, because the filmmakers didn't really "get" the properties they were trying to make. Too many filmmakers were more interested in putting their own spin on an established IP while ignoring the spirit or appeal of the source material (Tim Burtons's Planet of the Apes, the Stallone Judge Dread movie, the painful Mario Brothers film). With some rare exceptions, of course (Addams Family). I don't disagree that Hollywood is playing it too safe these days, but they haven't recovered from having all nearly all of the best screenwriters going to prestige cable TV series, where writers get multiple seasons to craft far deeper narratives than what they can squeeze into a 100 minute script for a Hollywood feature. Steaming hasn't helped matters either.
ironically, the most recent writers' strike is due to streaming platforms stiffing them on royalties... so there is a chance that good writing returns to hollywood filmmaking for a while? altho some of these streams are themselves hollywood 😱
I suppose the lesson to executives is: stow your egos, and make sure you have good writers. Not that they will ever heed this lesson.
The rate of flops reduced because obvious bad projects were shifted to Straight to DVD and VOD/Streaming
"Straight to video (VHS)" also existed, e.g. the Aladdin sequels of the 90s.
If it was true the rock would have stopped making movies a looooong time ago!! lol
I hope he does....what he did with Shazam was bad
Dwayne Johnson hasn't had a 'box office bomb' at the level used by this video (less than 50% budget in domestic gross, e.g. Black Adam still made ~90% of the budget in domestic gross, which is still a significant loss for investors but does not fit the definition of this video). Based on the data used for this video alone, the rock should actually be considered the risk-adverse 'safe choice' more than an actor who keeps getting jobs despite the bombs. Alternatively, you could say this study used a way-to-high-bar in their definition of 'box office bombs'.
@@cea6770 I guess I always associate bombs with terrible movies and that for sure is D
dwayne. If he is the main character, the movie is terrible. lol
The problem is that so far , the rock still manages to be in films were it's NOT a disaster ..financially at least
The rock is like Ben stiller character in tropic thunder.
Thank God for A24 for supporting original stories. I hope Everything, Everywhere, All at Once isn't a flash in the pan and more studios take risks like that.
What I love about A24 is that it takes familiar ideas/concepts and expands on them to create a whole new story. A multi-universe is not a new idea. Family drama and having an existential crisis are not new ideas. In fact, Everything, Everywhere, All at Once is pretty much a combination of The Matrix and A Christmas Carol but with more nuance and an Asian family at the center. A24 is succeeding because not only do they value fresh ideas and engaging storytelling, but they know how to take a basic/familiar idea and turn it on its head to create a new story. They don't have to rely on continuing a franchise or existing IP to help them get attention from audiences (they can choose to do so if they want to, for example, X and Pearl, but they don't heavily rely on that option). Nowadays when A24 comes out with a new project, there's excitement because A24 has accumulated a lot of trust in their studio.
Glad you mentioned John Carter by name. Movie was highly underrated!
This could be a 2 hour documentary style vid!!
People are scared of original Blockbuster movies, two examples are Edge of Tomorrow and Oblivion!
Definitely! However, they basically set up Edge of Tomorrow to fail when it released.
Well EoT was great and Oblivion wasn't
EoT wasn't really an original (it's an adaptation of All You Need Is Kill)
This video really shows the reality of the movie landscape we are in, a sad reality where bottom lines rules what we the audience get to see.
Event Horizon didn't kill Anderson's career because it turned into a cult classic that did much better on home release. Soldier absolutely did finish him off, though.
And Formon? Well... Amadeus is one of the greatest movies of all time, period. One Flew one of the greatest novel adaptations, too. It's understandable how people assumed Man on the Moon was a fluke.
John Carter deserved better. It was really truthful to the original material (updated, of course). I feel that it flopped in part because of bad marketing -- the trailers were meaningless for anyone who did not know the original novels already! (For those who still don't, it's the series that begins with A Princess of Mars, by Rice Burroughs). But it's one of the few movies I enjoy rewatching, and near the end has one of the funniest unexpected jokes in movie history.
Event Horizon and Man on the Moon might have ben flops but they were really good which might help explain the directors' survival.
Another key is how successful they (whatever role) might have been prior huge household names are more likely to get another shot
"Thank you" for reminding me that Cats exists :/
Yeah. Now if you’ll excuse me I gotta go throw up.
This was super interesting. Thanks Fandom. It always makes me sad when people don't show up for great, unique movies (Nice Guys comes to mind) because it just reinforces studios position of never making anything not based on existing IP. Which is just boring.
Nice Guys is a great example. Really clever story, very good dialogue and great chemistry between the actors.
this is actually well made video, thank you fanda
Actors like Pacino, Depp or DeNiro show up for the paycheck more than creativity. Maybe that's why they don't care if it's a flop. They're still gonna get new car money regardless.
*new house money
*New private island money
When even your fart has more charisma than a hot actress in her 20's, you just showing up would give the movie more magic than some talentless actors after-burning their souls on set. For artists, talent is the only thing that matters. To be honest, when you have actors like those on set, it's more of the director's fault when the production flops.
@@kenneth6102 Or the writers.
Really great video. Would love to see more of these!
I personally enjoy John Carter. Wasn't a masterpiece but I thought that movie was a lot of fun and I was hoping for a sequel. Unfortunately we didn't get it due to it's failure in the box office.
The argument is flawed, since movies cam still turn in a profit after the initial run. There are many classic movies that are bombs by this metric. Stuff like The Wizard of Oz, Blade Runner and The Shawshank Redemption.
In the 90's, a movie could end up earning more on DVD sales than in theatres. This is why they were seemingly more happy to take risk, because it wasn't really a big risk. There was a big secondary revenue stream.
Its bad writing that kills their careers. Some films maybe had bad reviews like Rambo, but over time they're becoming more relevant and Stallone is still making films.
I would add the rating agencies and internet to this. It seems a bit strange that the risk aversion of studios happen to coexist with the blooming of internet ratings like rotten tomatoes and imdb.
John Carter is underrated.
Your mom is underrated, SON!
The ending broke my 8 year old heart when I first saw it.
It was SO good.
@@jnnx I appreciate this sort of joke
I saw 3 others I liked; Valmont, Man on the Moon and Soldier,
@@jnnx That she is. She's the best.
I don't know what the current state of the relationship but you guys should get Dan to host these segments.
"That's Capitalism, baby!"
I'd like to say that I enjoyed this, but you spoke so fast and didn't explain yourself adequately. Perhaps if I was in showbiz and was used to speaking about this stuff all of the time, I would have appreciated your video more (and understood it better). I understood the conclusions you were trying to prove. I just wish I could have understood the steps you took to get to those conclusions better.
I agree, it's like Hollywood is to afraid these days to make good movies and just want sequels of already established ips. No new room for creative ideas.
Jon Carter from Mars... I agree! Totally undrerrated movie. I thought is was a lot of fun.☺
Show me how Star Wars Attack of the Clones & Star Wars Revenge of the Sith were flops according to your definition. I thought they made a ton of money despite the hate that some people piled on them.
Can you do a by the numbers for Cobra Kai, who got scored the most hits, who took the most hits?
Unexpectedly informative. But I would have loved it if you spent more time talking about the actual flops. I am curious 👀!
Tim Allen is kind' of a wang, but Big Trouble is super underrated. Great cast, well edited, the directing is good.
In a lot of ways, its kind of just Ocean's 11 if it were a dumb comedy and well rounded female characters
Jared Leto keeps getting roles, it's crazy.
🤦
It’s the same thing with Amy Schumer.
Kurt Russel in Soldier was amazing, cant believe that movie flopped 😲. Its my guilty pleasure movie.
Coppola didn't direct Supernova, he was just brought in to re-edit it. And he's got flops of his own, like One From the Heart.
Several of the flops that “lucky” actors survived are very good but didn’t get marketed well (Soldier, Rosewood, Rock Star) and two are legit masterpieces: Big Trouble in Little China, Man on The Moon.
Thunderbolt and Lightfoot was really good
Wowowo : scorsese is the king of surviving flops
Great video
John Carter was underrated. Idk if it dropped during a bad time or they promoted it wrong or not enough
It’s based off an IP literally nobody knows about anymore on a ridiculously massive budget, the acting was laughable, the characters were brainless cardboard cutouts, and it clearly didn’t understand or respect the source material. This was the first film I ever saw where I was rooting for the bad guys.
@@inktea256You are crazy. John Carter is not unknown. It was bigger than Conan the Barbarian. It is a very famous and huge selling book series.
Disney just dropped the movie with no promotion.
Most people never even realized that it was made and released.
Agreed, I remember seeing it at home (on TV or something, I didn’t rent it) & was surprised how much I enjoyed it for a film I’d heard nothing or next to nothing about. I can’t even recall any marketing linking it to it’s influential origins. Maybe they did, I just never saw any. And it was definitely better than any impression any marketing I might have seen left on me.
@@inktea256 yeaa the acting won't the best. Fast forward to today and it's showtime and HBO shows with terrible acting and several seasons.
Put Cara Delevingne in anything and you have a guaranteed flop
Your video is interesting and entertaining. Please remove the scanning bits, they are not necessary, your content is good enough to not need distractions.
You mean for every 100 heaven's gate there is 1 apocalypse now. The math speaks for itself from a risk reward point of view.
Whats the movie on 6:42 the girl running in flying flowers?
I’m guessing A Wrinkle in Time ? I haven’t seen it but I think that’s Mindy Kaling running & Oprah in the background & they both look like their characters from what I recall.
Wow very interesting! I knew Hollywood was playing it safe for a loooong while now, and now we know why.
😯wow! Big trouble in little China was a flop?!
😢 f(!
1:53 "Yes! I am invincible!"
(Pronounced "eenveenceebull".)
Read out those names next time please?
or use the pause button 🤔
I need to rewatch space jam a new legacy
Was it any good or just meh?
I know it’s a crazy ask for UA-cam but any chance you would show sources for your numbers?
Probably better to ask the original article this video was based on (see description). I would guess they have a Python or R dataset.
@@cea6770 I didn’t see that in the description, thank you.
Why isn't Elizabeth Berkley on the list of Fallen Performers for Showgirls? Colin Farrell and Nicole Kidman's careers are just fine. They bounced back.
why did you have to remind me about gods of egypt
So Margot Robbie and Zack Snyder?.
Well, turns out a lot of movies I enjoyed growing up were flops. Who knew?
Amazing work Team Fandom, and FANDOM AI
😂😂 damn I forgot about Meg Ryan 😂😂😂
Johnny Depp is the man...
Can you show the graphs by studio? What are the trends of the individual studios are are some more likely to flop than others?
Don't Google Heaven's Gate and horses unless you feel like crying
For people like The Rock, no, they’re fine.
Why IS he safe though? I’ve (been forced) seen a lot of his stuff over the years and it’s almost always mediocre at best.
@@MrSpartan993 because most people find him to be a likable character himself so when he plays a version of himself it’s all many people want to see. Keep in mind most people go to the movies to have a good time, and that’s generally something he’s good at.
On the plus side you can make a lot more for your budget and that will only increase with "AI"
Is John Wick from Long Island? I thought he had New Jersey plates on this Mustang
make a bad move.
we learned nothing and we wasted money.
and we will do it again
- netflix
Too true!
Please stop the scanning thing, its annoying
The number of flops really due to efficiency or playing safe?
Or selling off or diverting movies that look likely to flop in theaters to Netflix or Disney Plus release instead of theatrical release?
John Carter cost at least ten times more than John Wick, though.
0 seconds ago
The drop number of flops really due to efficiency or playing safe?
Or selling off or diverting movies that look likely to flop in theaters to Netflix or Disney Plus release instead of theatrical release? Ditto new promising stories.
If you’re not including their advertising costs, then what’s the point?
Remakes and sequels are getting annoying... Soon they will need to innovate again.
Is it just me or does the narrator sound like Sean Evans from Hot Ones ??
That made me depressed. Lol
Zack Snyder is definitely a director that's survived multiple flops somehow (watchmen, sucker punch)
I wish he wouldn’t at this point.
this could have been interesting, but you didn't go into detail about any of the examples
So indie films will do better. I'm fine with that.
EVENT HORIZON WAS A FLOP??? wtf
No, shitty attitudes do
3 idiots Indian movie review
please
Ya capitalism!! Hooray for the free market🤡😭
AGUANTE JOHN CARTER!
I WAS going to give this video a Like, then you called John Crapper underrated. That was the film which made me realize I needed to be careful about what films I see. It took me years of lying to my dad I liked it to realize that.
Outside of F&F movies, aren't all of The Rock's movies complete bombs? And Blade Runner 2049 was great btw
Ant-Man 3 isn't a Flop, in fact it's the Fourth highest grossing film of the year so far.