I would not say it's 'basic'. This is a bullet proof set-up for longevity (high mileage) kit and/for max hp tuning. On later model M8s, there's no need to upgrade the oil pump and cam chest if you typically just do day rides with your mates and/or intend not keeping your bike for years on end, then this kit is over the top, and especially if you do a Dyno tune and the tuner keeps some safety margins in the mapping so the motor is not stressed out to the max. Either way, if you have the money and are willing to spend it on this upgrade, it's a free country. All that said, this is a very informative video, thank you, the only things missing is an estimate of typical HP/Tq increases this chap gets for your hard earned USD3,200 + the tuner license, for this "basic" kit and then extrapolate the cost per HP to determine if we are just motor heads or if we should just a buy a Pan America so we have that HP right out of the box without spending the big bucks on a Stage II or III or IV upgrade.
Great explanation! I just finished building my fully custom Street Glide w 475 Cam, oil pump, cam bearing, feuling sprocket, head pipe, etc. Thanks to yours, Cyclefanatix, FlyNride and Daval videos they helped me to make a perfect choice to use the parts I am very happy with! I’ve done all the work myself w no help and bike runs amazing!
This really breaks it all down beautifully - I've pieced together over the years what I wanted/needed for stage 2 and it took some research to get my own undersatnding and this vid packs it up perfectly - thank you for the content
Even the Star Racing guy says the stock plate and pump are perfectly ok for a bolt in cam. If you want to spend the money, go for it, but it’s not necessary. And the “plastic” lifter cuffs are perfectly ok too. Same composite anti-rotation device that GM uses in their LS engines. The only reason you need to change the cuffs would be to allow for a higher lift cam. So you could have spent a lot less money. But hey, a blue cam plate is cool.
Jim Berry... The stock cast cam plate has poor oil passages thru it and a weak oil pump so the motor suffers from the improper oil pressures....the aftermarket bliilet plates and oil pumps are made to remedy that flaw in the stock harley design, so the bliiet plates and pumps are definitely worth the money. You'd think for 30 grand and up your brand new 2023 harley would come with a billet cam plate and bliilet oil pump.....I guess if you want all that fancy crap on a stock bike you roll off the dealership floor you'll buy a 100 thousand dollar Arch motorcycle........
@@freebehindbars8654 I agree with you. I just don’t like to hear people bash HD with comments like “junk plastic parts” or “Harley is using crap parts”. I’ve heard these comments on several you tube channels and I just don’t think that’s a correct assessment.
@@Jim_Berry I’m not a fan of plastic in a motor, especially air cooled, but it is what it is. I removed as much plastic as I could(retainers, intake..) from the LS in my Square Body Chevy. If nothing else, it’s for my peace of mind.
Yea, the "while we're in there" stuff, the shop owner keeps recommending seemed incredibly excessive to me. I know it's the absolute best and top of the line way to do it, and good on them if they have the clientele. For a guy like me, I'm looking at about a third of the price. I also am surprised he said 4-6 hours for a dyno tune on a stage 2 setup. That's a lot of money on the dyno, especially if the tuner is building off a saved tune from a similar setup. Upselling $800 in plate/pump, extra $100 for race lifters, $40 for a cam bolt, $80 lifter cuffs etc etc etc. I trust George Bryce's logic on this type of thing.
I just did my 2011 FLHX I used all S&S parts 1. TC3 cam plate 2. S&S oil pump 3. S&S precision lifters 4. S&S quickie adjust pushrods 5. S&S 551 cams w/ new bearings and hydraulic cam Chain tensioners I did the work myself it’s fairly basic just need to take your time and the instructions with the kit are spot on. Only cost me $1800 for the kit I also did a complete exhaust swap for another 1k and tuned it myself using a V&H FP3 tuner Bike runs like new pulls all day long so for $2800 bucks I have a kick ass bike now. The saved cash can go to other goodies for the bike lol just make sure you download the service manual and check your crank runout The whole job took me 6 hours by myself
Nice setup , the only issue is the FP3 tuner is emission controlled nowadays, the old ones weren’t but we all k is that’s changed with the government getting up our ass’s. Shiney Side up my brotha
I’d done the cast intake manifold and at least 5.5gs injectors. The cam plate/oil pump was a good addition but not necessary. The revised HD pump which you had works good. The only time you need an aft market plate and pump is with .520 lift or greater. Also it will depend on the crankshaft runout.
Thumbs up on you posting this. I have no doubt this gentleman knows his stuff. I have no doubt he could sell ice cubes to an Eskimo. I put a 22XE, Torrington-Koyo bearing, HP+ lifters, S&S adjustable pushrods, and S&S lifter cuffs on my '22 FXLRS for $1070 including the cam tool and taxes. If I had a do over, I would not change the lifter cuffs. All that stuff he mentioned that does not cost a lot, adds up to cost a lot.
Gunna have mine done with the 3/4 star racing cam along with the throttle body / injectors / intake, then all the bits & parts you have listed here. Thanks for the info!
Mike also said that these are the kits that the shop found to have the best reliability and be bulletproof! I don’t think he is saying that you can’t use your stock oil pump, and Camplate, or the stock tappet cuffs but he recommends that you replace them all those kits are recommendations for reliability!
@Holy shiFt thats extremely important and I love how the use solid pushrods. I've always noticed that when shops cut the stock pushrods to do a cam chest job, they use adjustable pushrods so they don't have to open up the top end. They always are more noisy and will need tightened over time. Solid is the way to go. Your bike is amazing man and can't wait to see more content with it...
@@HOLYSHIFT they seem very straightforward ,sincere and competent. Sometimes that is sometimes very hard to find in order to establish a good working consistent relationship with.
Wasn’t the S&S oil pump designed & created before Harley Davidson redesigned and updated the stock oil pump I believe in 2020 and current M8s? I spoke with a very reputable person in the business that said there’s no benefit to purchase the colored oil pumps if you have the most current HD pump.
Consider watching some of George Bryce videos. He created the star racing cams. He currently drag races a police bike with the 30/30 cam running stock cam plate and oil pump.
And also in his opinion he thinks the stock pump and plate is superior to feuling and s&s. He has a video on it. His position seems to be that the stock pump and plate has better scavenging which he claims is more important than increased pressure. I’ll go by Georges advice until these other guys show me how many national championships they have. George also doesn’t see a problem with the stock tappet cuffs.
@@1962egl I put S@S in mine simply because 75 dollars is not a factor when it's torn down. I would be curious if a stock bike would ever wear them out. By the time the tappets wobble enough to touch the tappett cuffs you would have a ton of problems.
Hi 👋, Great info, I love the Norton in the back of the shop, I have owned 3 , Dominator with chop frame , Norton Commando 750. Norton Interstate 850 , back in the late 60s early 70s , This was a great Territorial for your M8, Ride Safe, Phil from the moulin France.
Holy crap that brass bushing is the reason I went with the race fueling pump. And if you get the wrong guy to install s@s they might mess with oil pressure setting The brass can wear and clog oil passage screen. At least you can take it apart and clean it. Kevin baxter I think is the video I watched him mention it. Fueling is 1 piece. It starts as smaller hole and they use a honing process as they enlarge the hole it gets stronger. fueling hp 6061 aluminum oil pump fueling Race is billet 7075 hard anodized oil pump and camplate
Another very informative video Sandy.. great shop you go to in NJ.. so basically with a stage 2 and dyno your around 4,000 and your good to go.. surprised he didn’t mention the comp sprocket
Excellent video, very informative. Thanks Sandy! Tom M. 2023 RG-ST (117, Stage-1 at this time). Previous bike: 2021 RGS, Stage-2 114 (all S&S, full cam chest kit, S&S 2-1 long exhaust, Trask M8 checkvent, HD Oil Cooler Fan & Dynojet PV3b Tuner with map by Fuel Moto.
The Screaming Eagle Oilpump and Camplate are better. You should of bought that one, man. As a combo, it's better than any mechanic. 2nd is Fueling, hands down.
I like seeing what can be done to these engines but I’ve heard a couple professional racers on UA-cam make a good point, you probably will never utilize the max performance of the stock setup let alone with upgrades. I figure if it isn’t specifically a track or race bike it’s probably a waste of money for the average person but that being said that setup is awesome on that bike and I bet it’s a blast to go rip on
I was told by s&s my 2022 low rider s the oil pump or cam plate doesnt need to be replace also said the tabs exhaust isn't good if I add a cam ?what your input?
After watching this the Harley dealership guys are wacked to say 2200 to put me a 3030 cam in my bike . To just change the lifters and cam in my 2023 fat bob . I want these parts all in my bike . Especially that cam Barring
Mike is awesome I was talking to him the other day about my 2021 Fatboy he's the only guy I'll go to if I have to get work done on my bike. I'm an hour away but that's the only guy I'll go to
Sandy im shocked you guys didnt mention replacing the M8 Compensator. As soon as I installed my cam 2 weeks later comp broke. Very weak link in the m8.
so we are talking about 4k at least for a stage 2 build? This makes the 8k stage 4 build look more reasonable. I guess I will stick with the stock engine and sell the bike if I want something quicker.
For me, the cost is ridiculous... stock is fine for me. I would have liked to hear what he does if the crank run out is excessive. Excessive run out will destroy that oil pump. I know someone who installed that oil pump with excessive run out. It destroyed his engine. HD denied his warranty claim because they blamed the new pump. It cost him north of $10,000 to make his engine whole again. The amount of money someone can spend on upgrades is prohibitive for many. With that said, it is fun watching people mess with these engines. Great video :-)
The irony is that after all the time and money spent, it still isn’t a high powered motorcycle that doesn’t have a chassis designed for extra power/performance
@@jjjjjjjjrifufjssjosskenf I get that some people love the horsepower, torque, choppy idle and notorious HD exhaust notes... I am old enough to remember the horsepower wars back in the late 60s and early 70s.. young men were building monster engines all for that bragging right. if one could wrench on his own bike today and actually do quality builds, then these upgrades are doable. with that said, I would never spend north of $25,000 and then dump another $10,000+ into it. I would start out with an affordable older bike and go from there. these engines are getting so damn big that their air-cooled features cannot keep the bike cool enough to establish reliability. that is why many hotrod builders stick with the small block engine setups. they run so much cooler than their counterpart big block engines. I love my HD. but I don't love the amount of money it costs to change the look and performance of the bike. I purchased the bike to cruise around. not break land speed records (LOL). stock is fine with me along with a few parts to keep the engine healthy and cool (external breathers and oil cooler fan). : - )
Stock is worse for that bike than a professionally installed/tuned stage 2. That stock tune/setup is so hot it’s the first thing we get away from when bringing a bike in our garage.
@@jjjjjjjjrifufjssjosskenf I want reliability and longevity... I am older now and don't care about loud pipes and insane horsepower. I just want to cruise. stage 2 does nothing for me.
@@freebehindbars8654 I don't disagree... but you do not need a stage 2 setup to make the bike run better. people use tuners on stock engines to richen the factory lean tune. one of the problems is finding a dyno tuner who knows what they are doing. I have observed firsthand the detriment of having a poorly tuned engine go south because of lean spots in the tune. then what?
“Give & Take “ : Whenever I see a question ? ? In the comments I like to see if the person asking the question thinks it’s fair to also subscribe to my channel first …👍🏻😜
Wow, Sandy, that's about $5K + the cost of a new exhaust to end up with a tuned stage 2. You Harley guys have to be rich, starting with 25-30K for the bike, then another 5-6K to get it to run well. Is it true that a stock M-8 114 puts out 74hp? Thanks though for sharing the prices.
The Dyno cost was why I dropped $400 for a V&H Fuelpak 3. I can dyno tune the bike in learn mode rolling around on the highway for a few days. Money well spent.
any recommendations for shops near south east Pa or Delaware that would install this type of stage II in a 2020 M8114 Electra glide police model.? I like the combination of Fueling and S&S. and would you substitute any HD Screaming eagle components?
Guys kinda crack me up when they do a cold start with a fuel injected it’s not like a cam early model dyna or fxr where you do a cold start to show that it fired right up it’s a m8 they fire right up Every time mine does at least lol Anyways much love and respect
Nice informative video Sandy, but Iam leaving this bike stock……LOL😂 Like I’ve never said that before😂😂😂 I still don’t believe Harley has the M8 oil pump figured out yet😂😂😂 and IF I open up my 23, an S&S cam plate/oil pump would go in……Whoops, I said I was leaving it stock
I’d like to personally watch one of these guys sit 4-6 hours in a dyno bay tuning one of these builds. Like seriously not leave the dyno bay because they say it takes this long and we are getting charged for it. I like how they say like” you know, it typically takes 4-6 hours”. I’d like to see what I’m paying for.
New Jersey...I'm sure guys mean well, but there's no way a stage II costs in excess of $4k.... I'm in Arizona and a stage II same parts, $2900 installed. You could buy a stage III S&S For what you're wanting.... So glad I moved from there...
Was interested in seeing how much the parts cost purchased online and I have a total coming up of $2,147.70 NOT including the S&S Oil Pump, Cam Plate or Chain Tensioner. S&S Tappet Cuffs - 79.95 Fueling Race Series Solid Lifters - 269.95 Fueling Solid Push Rods - 169.95 Fueling Outer Crank Sprocket - 59.95 Fueling Rocker Shaft Stud / Nut Kit - 319.95 Fueling Inner Cam Bearing 19.95 Star 30/30 Cam - 369.00 Star Racing High Performance Valve Springs 559.00 Price also doesn't include labor so if you're getting all that installed for $2,900 (and keep in mind I left out some parts) that's a freaking steal!
Was interested in seeing how much the parts cost purchased online myself and I have a total coming up of $2,147.70 NOT including the S&S Oil Pump, Cam Plate or Chain Tensioner. Prices also do not included taxes or shipping so lets say $2,500 which is over inflating it a bit I'm sure. S&S Tappet Cuffs - 79.95 Fueling Race Series Solid Lifters - 269.95 Fueling Solid Push Rods - 169.95 Fueling Outer Crank Sprocket - 59.95 Fueling Rocker Shaft Stud / Nut Kit - 319.95 Fueling Inner Cam Bearing 19.95 Star 30/30 Cam - 369.00 Star Racing High Performance Valve Springs 559.00
@@terrellgarren7125 My point is I rode my 2020 RGS to the Laughlin River Run in April, met a dude with a Ducati Diavil V4 with a after mkt Akrapovic racing header, rode with him and his bike made my 114 M8 with 4 1/2" Rinehart's and a zippers red shift 472 cam sound like a kitten on the HWY that's all.
Spendy for sure. $3300 for the stage 2, $1000 for exhaust pipes and air cleaner, $1000 for dyno tune and you’re at $5500 for a stage 2. No thanks, buy it and drive it and save the $5500 for down payment on your next bike.
Why all of this cost so much ??? I spend all of my money for stock new Harley FXBBS and now started considering to do stage 1 &2. Probably Harley is not for me :( Maybe just I should buy Kawasaki Sx 1000 and forget about all Stages.... :(
No feelings hurt. I did my own cam upgrade last year on my previous bike . I payed for parts and did the work myself. If you feel comfortable doing it yourself- do it , it’s fun and rewarding. If you’re not confident and want to take it to a good reliable shop do your comparisons and choose what seems best for you . 👍🏻
You can almost do a 131 for his stage 2 price. I would feel violated if i had to pay for two more hours on the dyno to tune a inferior 475 cam to a star 30/30.
Pretty sad HD internal parts are cheaply made or added to a “high end” reputable motorcycle and customers literally buy into the hype no pun intended 😆 or is a stock HD just fine the way it is? A bike with no engine warranty ok stage 2. These shops are making a fortune from all the suckas who fall for this hype. I know friend who have a 4 stage and never race and regret S4. Stage 1 is suffice and still keep your warranty.
It's all nice stuff. But 80 percent of it is just a pointless up sell non-sense made for a wayyyy bigger build. It adds a ton of cost and a ton of extra labor for no reason on such a small cam
Shout out to this dude for giving a cost breakdown on the parts he uses and the work his shop does. Much respect .
I would not say it's 'basic'. This is a bullet proof set-up for longevity (high mileage) kit and/for max hp tuning. On later model M8s, there's no need to upgrade the oil pump and cam chest if you typically just do day rides with your mates and/or intend not keeping your bike for years on end, then this kit is over the top, and especially if you do a Dyno tune and the tuner keeps some safety margins in the mapping so the motor is not stressed out to the max. Either way, if you have the money and are willing to spend it on this upgrade, it's a free country. All that said, this is a very informative video, thank you, the only things missing is an estimate of typical HP/Tq increases this chap gets for your hard earned USD3,200 + the tuner license, for this "basic" kit and then extrapolate the cost per HP to determine if we are just motor heads or if we should just a buy a Pan America so we have that HP right out of the box without spending the big bucks on a Stage II or III or IV upgrade.
Great explanation! I just finished building my fully custom Street Glide w 475 Cam, oil pump, cam bearing, feuling sprocket, head pipe, etc. Thanks to yours, Cyclefanatix, FlyNride and Daval videos they helped me to make a perfect choice to use the parts I am very happy with! I’ve done all the work myself w no help and bike runs amazing!
This really breaks it all down beautifully - I've pieced together over the years what I wanted/needed for stage 2 and it took some research to get my own undersatnding and this vid packs it up perfectly - thank you for the content
I like that he prefers to upgrade other supporting parts to strengthen the build .
Thanks for doing this. Appreciate the clarity.
Even the Star Racing guy says the stock plate and pump are perfectly ok for a bolt in cam. If you want to spend the money, go for it, but it’s not necessary. And the “plastic” lifter cuffs are perfectly ok too. Same composite anti-rotation device that GM uses in their LS engines. The only reason you need to change the cuffs would be to allow for a higher lift cam. So you could have spent a lot less money. But hey, a blue cam plate is cool.
Jim Berry...
The stock cast cam plate has poor oil passages thru it and a weak oil pump so the motor suffers from the improper oil pressures....the aftermarket bliilet plates and oil pumps are made to remedy that flaw in the stock harley design, so the bliiet plates and pumps are definitely worth the money. You'd think for 30 grand and up your brand new 2023 harley would come with a billet cam plate and bliilet oil pump.....I guess if you want all that fancy crap on a stock bike you roll off the dealership floor you'll buy a 100 thousand dollar Arch motorcycle........
Cuff is $60 and is replaced free with installation. Wouldn’t call it a waste to remove plastic with billet. Imo
@@freebehindbars8654 I agree with you. I just don’t like to hear people bash HD with comments like “junk plastic parts” or “Harley is using crap parts”. I’ve heard these comments on several you tube channels and I just don’t think that’s a correct assessment.
@@Jim_Berry I’m not a fan of plastic in a motor, especially air cooled, but it is what it is. I removed as much plastic as I could(retainers, intake..) from the LS in my Square Body Chevy. If nothing else, it’s for my peace of mind.
Yea, the "while we're in there" stuff, the shop owner keeps recommending seemed incredibly excessive to me. I know it's the absolute best and top of the line way to do it, and good on them if they have the clientele. For a guy like me, I'm looking at about a third of the price. I also am surprised he said 4-6 hours for a dyno tune on a stage 2 setup. That's a lot of money on the dyno, especially if the tuner is building off a saved tune from a similar setup. Upselling $800 in plate/pump, extra $100 for race lifters, $40 for a cam bolt, $80 lifter cuffs etc etc etc. I trust George Bryce's logic on this type of thing.
I just did my 2011 FLHX I used all S&S parts
1. TC3 cam plate
2. S&S oil pump
3. S&S precision lifters
4. S&S quickie adjust pushrods
5. S&S 551 cams w/ new bearings and hydraulic cam
Chain tensioners
I did the work myself it’s fairly basic just need to take your time and the instructions with the kit are spot on. Only cost me $1800 for the kit I also did a complete exhaust swap for another 1k and tuned it myself using a V&H FP3 tuner
Bike runs like new pulls all day long so for $2800 bucks I have a kick ass bike now. The saved cash can go to other goodies for the bike lol just make sure you download the service manual and check your crank runout
The whole job took me 6 hours by myself
Nice setup , the only issue is the FP3 tuner is emission controlled nowadays, the old ones weren’t but we all k is that’s changed with the government getting up our ass’s. Shiney Side up my brotha
Thanks, I’m getting the power vision with the target tune kit to make it easy to tune and dyno. Ride safe brother
I’d done the cast intake manifold and at least 5.5gs injectors. The cam plate/oil pump was a good addition but not necessary. The revised HD pump which you had works good. The only time you need an aft market plate and pump is with .520 lift or greater. Also it will depend on the crankshaft runout.
Thumbs up on you posting this. I have no doubt this gentleman knows his stuff. I have no doubt he could sell ice cubes to an Eskimo. I put a 22XE, Torrington-Koyo bearing, HP+ lifters, S&S adjustable pushrods, and S&S lifter cuffs on my '22 FXLRS for $1070 including the cam tool and taxes. If I had a do over, I would not change the lifter cuffs. All that stuff he mentioned that does not cost a lot, adds up to cost a lot.
This is great very informative
Gentleman seems extremely knowledgeable competent. Great video.
Gunna have mine done with the 3/4 star racing cam along with the throttle body / injectors / intake, then all the bits & parts you have listed here. Thanks for the info!
Mike also said that these are the kits that the shop found to have the best reliability and be bulletproof! I don’t think he is saying that you can’t use your stock oil pump, and Camplate, or the stock tappet cuffs but he recommends that you replace them all those kits are recommendations for reliability!
Exactly Glen - well said ! Thanks
Agreed, don't skim what he said and listen to it fully :)
Good video and information!
Awesome shop, those guys do great work. Very precise.
Yes they are! They know their shit , honest and nice people!
@Holy shiFt thats extremely important and I love how the use solid pushrods. I've always noticed that when shops cut the stock pushrods to do a cam chest job, they use adjustable pushrods so they don't have to open up the top end. They always are more noisy and will need tightened over time. Solid is the way to go. Your bike is amazing man and can't wait to see more content with it...
@@HOLYSHIFT they seem very straightforward ,sincere and competent. Sometimes that is sometimes very hard to find in order to establish a good working consistent relationship with.
Wasn’t the S&S oil pump designed & created before Harley Davidson redesigned and updated the stock oil pump I believe in 2020 and current M8s? I spoke with a very reputable person in the business that said there’s no benefit to purchase the colored oil pumps if you have the most current HD pump.
You are correct. This is all a waste of money. Even the Star Racing guy says the HD pump is perfectly ok.
@@Jim_Berry that’s exactly who I was speaking with about it. Lol 😂
Consider watching some of George Bryce videos. He created the star racing cams. He currently drag races a police bike with the 30/30 cam running stock cam plate and oil pump.
And also in his opinion he thinks the stock pump and plate is superior to feuling and s&s. He has a video on it. His position seems to be that the stock pump and plate has better scavenging which he claims is more important than increased pressure. I’ll go by Georges advice until these other guys show me how many national championships they have. George also doesn’t see a problem with the stock tappet cuffs.
@@1962egl Stock tappet cuffs become an issue when a cam lifts over .500, some say .515
@@carlbruhn1772 this is true. But the implication is that they prone to failure because they are plastic.
@@1962egl I put S@S in mine simply because 75 dollars is not a factor when it's torn down. I would be curious if a stock bike would ever wear them out. By the time the tappets wobble enough to touch the tappett cuffs you would have a ton of problems.
@@carlbruhn1772 yep
What a great video. Inam saving this for future reference.
Hi 👋, Great info, I love the Norton in the back of the shop, I have owned 3 , Dominator with chop frame , Norton Commando 750. Norton Interstate 850 , back in the late 60s early 70s , This was a great Territorial for your M8, Ride Safe, Phil from the moulin France.
Holy crap that brass bushing is the reason I went with the race fueling pump.
And if you get the wrong guy to install s@s they might mess with oil pressure setting
The brass can wear and clog oil passage screen. At least you can take it apart and clean it.
Kevin baxter I think is the video I watched him mention it.
Fueling is 1 piece. It starts as smaller hole and they use a honing process as they enlarge the hole it gets stronger.
fueling hp 6061 aluminum oil pump
fueling Race is billet 7075 hard anodized oil pump and camplate
Another very informative video Sandy.. great shop you go to in NJ.. so basically with a stage 2 and dyno your around 4,000 and your good to go.. surprised he didn’t mention the comp sprocket
What sprocket?
We do offer the star racing compensator ramp as an option along with clutch options. But most client come back for that. It just adds up.
That’s the one I put in my bike. Thanks for the follow up!
Great video, Sandy!!👍💯🇺🇸😎
Thanks brother
Great video. Thank you. Mine is going in for a dyno tune tomorrow!
Excellent video, very informative. Thanks Sandy!
Tom M. 2023 RG-ST (117, Stage-1 at this time). Previous bike: 2021 RGS, Stage-2 114 (all S&S, full cam chest kit, S&S 2-1 long exhaust, Trask M8 checkvent, HD Oil Cooler Fan & Dynojet PV3b Tuner with map by Fuel Moto.
Tom, get a 2” lifted front suspension and a 14” rear suspension on the bike. You’ll love it.
I thought my quote was high but the guy was right on the money
The Screaming Eagle Oilpump and Camplate are better. You should of bought that one, man. As a combo, it's better than any mechanic. 2nd is Fueling, hands down.
Surprised Woods cams and lifters did not make the list . There are so many quality aftermarket parts today compared to years ago .
They do make good cams. We just have requests for these cams more. I have nothing against woods
@@TorqueCustomCycles ALL GOOD CHOICES ! The rider wins !
I like seeing what can be done to these engines but I’ve heard a couple professional racers on UA-cam make a good point, you probably will never utilize the max performance of the stock setup let alone with upgrades. I figure if it isn’t specifically a track or race bike it’s probably a waste of money for the average person but that being said that setup is awesome on that bike and I bet it’s a blast to go rip on
You’re probably right ! We like to feel that we have the best and show off and brag about it ….. 😂
@@HOLYSHIFT yup it’s all bragging rights at some point
So say I were to do this exact setup on my Low Rider ST. What horsepower and torque should I expect to see after dyno tuning?
Any cooling issues that would probably come up?
I was told by s&s my 2022 low rider s the oil pump or cam plate doesnt need to be replace also said the tabs exhaust isn't good if I add a cam ?what your input?
Star Racing says the 30/30 is good with stock valve springs. Any concern not replacing the springs? 🤔
Who’s blue bike on the lift 😂 end of the video. Man the bike running strong and crisp
After watching this the Harley dealership guys are wacked to say 2200 to put me a 3030 cam in my bike . To just change the lifters and cam in my 2023 fat bob . I want these parts all in my bike . Especially that cam
Barring
Nice thanks for sharing
Can he tune with a thundermaxx if that's the tuner we choose?
Great job bub
Mike is awesome I was talking to him the other day about my 2021 Fatboy he's the only guy I'll go to if I have to get work done on my bike. I'm an hour away but that's the only guy I'll go to
Great information 👍
Sandy & Mike thank you knowledge is key!!! Do you have any dyno runs on this set up?
Yeh we do . Check out a full video about it on my channel
Sandy im shocked you guys didnt mention replacing the M8 Compensator. As soon as I installed my cam 2 weeks later comp broke. Very weak link in the m8.
What exhaust do you have on your bike?
Thanks in advance 👍🏼
@Holy shiFt I’ve got the same American Half Finger Gloves very nice 👍
awesome video and good information
so we are talking about 4k at least for a stage 2 build? This makes the 8k stage 4 build look more reasonable. I guess I will stick with the stock engine and sell the bike if I want something quicker.
Whatever you can afford and makes sense to you buddy
For me, the cost is ridiculous... stock is fine for me. I would have liked to hear what he does if the crank run out is excessive. Excessive run out will destroy that oil pump. I know someone who installed that oil pump with excessive run out. It destroyed his engine. HD denied his warranty claim because they blamed the new pump. It cost him north of $10,000 to make his engine whole again. The amount of money someone can spend on upgrades is prohibitive for many. With that said, it is fun watching people mess with these engines. Great video :-)
The irony is that after all the time and money spent, it still isn’t a high powered motorcycle that doesn’t have a chassis designed for extra power/performance
@@jjjjjjjjrifufjssjosskenf I get that some people love the horsepower, torque, choppy idle and notorious HD exhaust notes... I am old enough to remember the horsepower wars back in the late 60s and early 70s.. young men were building monster engines all for that bragging right. if one could wrench on his own bike today and actually do quality builds, then these upgrades are doable. with that said, I would never spend north of $25,000 and then dump another $10,000+ into it. I would start out with an affordable older bike and go from there. these engines are getting so damn big that their air-cooled features cannot keep the bike cool enough to establish reliability. that is why many hotrod builders stick with the small block engine setups. they run so much cooler than their counterpart big block engines. I love my HD. but I don't love the amount of money it costs to change the look and performance of the bike. I purchased the bike to cruise around. not break land speed records (LOL). stock is fine with me along with a few parts to keep the engine healthy and cool (external breathers and oil cooler fan). : - )
Stock is worse for that bike than a professionally installed/tuned stage 2. That stock tune/setup is so hot it’s the first thing we get away from when bringing a bike in our garage.
@@jjjjjjjjrifufjssjosskenf I want reliability and longevity... I am older now and don't care about loud pipes and insane horsepower. I just want to cruise. stage 2 does nothing for me.
@@freebehindbars8654 I don't disagree... but you do not need a stage 2 setup to make the bike run better. people use tuners on stock engines to richen the factory lean tune. one of the problems is finding a dyno tuner who knows what they are doing. I have observed firsthand the detriment of having a poorly tuned engine go south because of lean spots in the tune. then what?
Can Basic just be a cam, exhaust, performance air cleaner, and a turning? I feel like all that is just one step closer to stage 3.
Awesome video and learned a lot. Thank you.!! What’s the big difference between a Max cell cam an the star 30/30 cam ???
I don’t know anything about the max cell ☺️
@@HOLYSHIFT OK I appreciate it. Thank you.
You can auto tune your bike with a tuner, specifically on your riding style!!
What about head pipes? Didn’t see that. I’m been told I should do that as well.. I have Reinhart… slip on???
This is very informative. Give a thumbs up for Torque Custom Cycles.
Why not adjustable pushrods? Seems like everywhere else is suggesting adjustable for just a stage 2. Why pull the whole head apart when not needed?
“Give & Take “ : Whenever I see a question ? ? In the comments I like to see if the person asking the question thinks it’s fair to also subscribe to my channel first …👍🏻😜
@@HOLYSHIFT Good chance I would have subscribed if you had responded differently :)
You’ll never push the bike as hard as they do on that dyno!!
Get it done before Nov 5th.
Wow, Sandy, that's about $5K + the cost of a new exhaust to end up with a tuned stage 2. You Harley guys have to be rich, starting with 25-30K for the bike, then another 5-6K to get it to run well. Is it true that a stock M-8 114 puts out 74hp? Thanks though for sharing the prices.
All true except for the rich part ! Everyone here buys their Harley on a loan for 5 years ! We are a nation in debt !
Huge costs add up quick. 😮
Awesome video! Can you do the same for Stage 1? Curious to know how much that would run me
Would this set up work with just slip ons. Or do we need new head pipes now as well
It will work with slip ons.
Sandy do you have RDRS on your bike? Did the rdrs system cause any issues with the power vision tuning?
I don’t think this bike has RDRs
Will not cause any issues with RDRS. You just have to tweak a few settings 😊
Thank you bro
What's the turn around time with powder coating?
Do day doo something for goldwing tour 2022?
Whatever happen to JD Cycle ??
Do i need to upgrade clutch, compensator for stage 2? Or not necessary?
Subscribed?
@@HOLYSHIFT i would have if you answered my question directly instead of asking me if i'm subscribed. 😆
Anyone know of a good shop like this in the Boston Massachuetts area?
The Dyno cost was why I dropped $400 for a V&H Fuelpak 3. I can dyno tune the bike in learn mode rolling around on the highway for a few days. Money well spent.
any recommendations for shops near south east Pa or Delaware that would install this type of stage II in a 2020 M8114 Electra glide police model.? I like the combination of Fueling and S&S. and would you substitute any HD Screaming eagle components?
Whenever I see a question ? ? In the comments I like to see if the person asking the question thinks it’s fair to also subscribe to my channel first
Sandy, john left the plastic lifter cuffs in his bike 😂😂😂
Are you sure ? If that’s true - that explains why my bike is faster …😂
Cool. It just cost more if you go with that cam.
Guys kinda crack me up when they do a cold start with a fuel injected it’s not like a cam early model dyna or fxr where you do a cold start to show that it fired right up it’s a m8 they fire right up
Every time mine does at least lol
Anyways much love and respect
Nice informative video Sandy, but Iam leaving this bike stock……LOL😂 Like I’ve never said that before😂😂😂 I still don’t believe Harley has the M8 oil pump figured out yet😂😂😂 and IF I open up my 23, an S&S cam plate/oil pump would go in……Whoops, I said I was leaving it stock
Stay stock until you finish your warranty!
I’d like to personally watch one of these guys sit 4-6 hours in a dyno bay tuning one of these builds. Like seriously not leave the dyno bay because they say it takes this long and we are getting charged for it. I like how they say like” you know, it typically takes 4-6 hours”.
I’d like to see what I’m paying for.
why would I spend 3200 when I could do a 122 kit ? for the same price
Should be 2k to 2.5 k depending on what you want 😮 thats if you have a complete stage 1 already.
HS i know the cost already , my Tri Glide has a Stage 2 and my CVO has a Stage 4 it’s not cheap
Harley noob here, would this setup still be within an acceptable hp/tq range to keep belt drive, or would you have to start looking into chain drive?
ua-cam.com/video/zHTnnjh1ol0/v-deo.html explain if a cam can be added base on your crankshaft runout or you would need to conver to chain drive
You stole my gloves! I bought those at Sturgis!
New Jersey...I'm sure guys mean well, but there's no way a stage II costs in excess of $4k.... I'm in Arizona and a stage II same parts, $2900 installed. You could buy a stage III S&S For what you're wanting.... So glad I moved from there...
Was interested in seeing how much the parts cost purchased online and I have a total coming up of $2,147.70 NOT including the S&S Oil Pump, Cam Plate or Chain Tensioner.
S&S Tappet Cuffs - 79.95
Fueling Race Series Solid Lifters - 269.95
Fueling Solid Push Rods - 169.95
Fueling Outer Crank Sprocket - 59.95
Fueling Rocker Shaft Stud / Nut Kit - 319.95
Fueling Inner Cam Bearing 19.95
Star 30/30 Cam - 369.00
Star Racing High Performance Valve Springs 559.00
Price also doesn't include labor so if you're getting all that installed for $2,900 (and keep in mind I left out some parts) that's a freaking steal!
Good video
What I's the price just for the parts
Check online buddy
Was interested in seeing how much the parts cost purchased online myself and I have a total coming up of $2,147.70 NOT including the S&S Oil Pump, Cam Plate or Chain Tensioner. Prices also do not included taxes or shipping so lets say $2,500 which is over inflating it a bit I'm sure.
S&S Tappet Cuffs - 79.95
Fueling Race Series Solid Lifters - 269.95
Fueling Solid Push Rods - 169.95
Fueling Outer Crank Sprocket - 59.95
Fueling Rocker Shaft Stud / Nut Kit - 319.95
Fueling Inner Cam Bearing 19.95
Star 30/30 Cam - 369.00
Star Racing High Performance Valve Springs 559.00
Ok John I meant Sandy see you riding like your brother John
Sound like over kill to me. I mean if it makes you sleep better buying all that then ok but all that is not needed
Buy an Indian Challenger….even stage 2 on HD….can’t touch a stock challenger. Its cheaper too….
LOL......just buy a Triumph Rocket 3R with a balanced and blueprinted motor from the factory and be done with it!!
Fair point. But nothing sounds and feels like a H-D 45-degree V-Twin. Especially with a cam and exhaust.
@@terrellgarren7125 Guess you have never heard a Ducati V4 with Akrapovic headers.
Nothing like a Harley!👍💯🇺🇸😎
@@randyboisa6367 What’s your point? I did not say that a H-D 45-degree V-Twin was the only bike that sound good. A V-4 Ducati hardly sounds the same.
@@terrellgarren7125 My point is I rode my 2020 RGS to the Laughlin River Run in April, met a dude with a Ducati Diavil V4 with a after mkt Akrapovic racing header, rode with him and his bike made my 114 M8 with 4 1/2" Rinehart's and a zippers red shift 472 cam sound like a kitten on the HWY that's all.
Spendy for sure. $3300 for the stage 2, $1000 for exhaust pipes and air cleaner, $1000 for dyno tune and you’re at $5500 for a stage 2. No thanks, buy it and drive it and save the $5500 for down payment on your next bike.
Sandy, I'm a New Subscriber & you still don't respond to my comments! I'm thinking about buying a new ST & I would appreciate some feed back from you
Why all of this cost so much ??? I spend all of my money for stock new Harley FXBBS and now started considering to do stage 1 &2. Probably Harley is not for me :( Maybe just I should buy Kawasaki Sx 1000 and forget about all Stages.... :(
This guy is over the top on his prices , sorry if I hurt your feelings better your wallet than mine
No feelings hurt. I did my own cam upgrade last year on my previous bike . I payed for parts and did the work myself. If you feel comfortable doing it yourself- do it , it’s fun and rewarding. If you’re not confident and want to take it to a good reliable shop do your comparisons and choose what seems best for you . 👍🏻
It’s Jersey
You can almost do a 131 for his stage 2 price. I would feel violated if i had to pay for two more hours on the dyno to tune a inferior 475 cam to a star 30/30.
8k for stage 2 for additional 30ish ponies! That’s $260 per HP! Stage 4 is cheaper!
They took this guy to the cleaners! 😂😂 You do not need to spend that much... They saw this you tuber coming.🤣🤦♂️😀🤷♂️🤷♂️
Man
what a money racket. it's ridiculous.
Holly shucks....lol...stage 2 about $5000 dollar!!???? Lol. for about 30 more horse and a bit more torture!😮😢!😮😮😢
Pretty sad HD internal parts are cheaply made or added to a “high end” reputable motorcycle and customers literally buy into the hype no pun intended 😆 or is a stock HD just fine the way it is? A bike with no engine warranty ok stage 2.
These shops are making a fortune from all the suckas who fall for this hype. I know friend who have a 4 stage and never race and regret S4. Stage 1 is suffice and still keep your warranty.
It's all nice stuff. But 80 percent of it is just a pointless up sell non-sense made for a wayyyy bigger build. It adds a ton of cost and a ton of extra labor for no reason on such a small cam
Damn!!$$$$
Not a lot of money???? $800 oil pump…..that’s HIGHlarius. 😂
4-6 hours to tune off of a baseline map you already have? That seems quite inflated.
Please subscribe
So five grand for 20 hp lol what a joke
Please subscribe
Never touch another man’s bike………
Wow this dude’s prices are criminal. Run away.
go try doing this with a dealer :)