Red Bull BORA Don't UNDERSTAND the Risk

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  • Опубліковано 24 гру 2024

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  • @reedjacksonmaccom
    @reedjacksonmaccom 3 місяці тому +7

    ya know whats weird about you Chris? you have so much awareness of what you do and what you did racing pro, and awareness of dozens of possibilities in any given moment and you can talk about it with ease and clarity and you convey complex issues simply…. its pretty freaken weird but truly impressive…. its a gift and explains a lot of how you rode so well in your career. I really like listening to and watching your shows.

  • @stephenmagee3766
    @stephenmagee3766 3 місяці тому +84

    I liked what another person said: "Primoz did everything but get in the car and change the radio station."

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +6

      Hehehe. Agreed 😂😱🦋👊

    • @wm.b.bowman2634
      @wm.b.bowman2634 3 місяці тому

      😂😂😂😂

    • @tenzingyurme4058
      @tenzingyurme4058 3 місяці тому +4

      Be interesting to have heard the discussion in the team bus about why they thought changing bikes was a good idea.........Primos burned Waaaay too many matches trying to get back to the front of the peloton........

    • @Tubesmaney
      @Tubesmaney 3 місяці тому

      Lol…

    • @foobar5809
      @foobar5809 3 місяці тому +1

      @@tenzingyurme4058I dont think he spend much energy. He used the draft of the car for that 😁

  • @ShimmyD-u7g
    @ShimmyD-u7g 3 місяці тому +34

    The final bits of the race was nuts, it was so brutally steep that it forced everything into almost slow motion. Watching Castrillo give it everything he has to try and get the win. Seeing the pain in Vlasov as he tried to claw back Castrillo, only to not quite get there. The thrill as Castrillo took the win, the pain was over, and the emotion of winning a 2nd stage. Seeing Roglic go and watch as Mas passed him. Being amazed that O'Connor didn't blow up and actually maintained the gap, still in red for another day. Wow, I loved it.

    • @lesleykuramoto3943
      @lesleykuramoto3943 3 місяці тому +3

      And watching Sepp come through the fog w the GC group.

    • @epincion
      @epincion 3 місяці тому

      I would not be surprised if Vlasov has PTSD from his experience of intense effort and being on Castrillo’s wheel and then falling back

  • @AlanForkosh
    @AlanForkosh 3 місяці тому +43

    Dan Lloyd on the GCN Racing News really came down hard. He noted that the 20 seconds was the minimal penalty and that the maximum was 5 minutes. He indicated the RBBH group got lucky. He also expressed his distate for planned bike changes on time trial and suggested that push-offs after planned bike changes should be illegal since push-offs are illegal if you don't change bikes.

    • @leduch
      @leduch 3 місяці тому

      he did !

    • @sldulin
      @sldulin 3 місяці тому +9

      I agreed with most of what he said but I just can't get upset about push offs from most of the schlub bike mechanics that I have seen. Usain Bolt they are not.

    • @secretagent86
      @secretagent86 3 місяці тому +4

      I HATE planned bike changes

    • @reflectionsdetail
      @reflectionsdetail 3 місяці тому +4

      Anyone figure out how much time he SAVED by having drafted? Hell if they are giving out Yellow cards for stupid road blocks, should get a yellow for that too then.

    • @borisgurevich5504
      @borisgurevich5504 3 місяці тому +4

      @@reflectionsdetailI don’t know how much he saved but I think the penalty needs to be 5 to 10 times that advantage to work as a deterrent

  • @johnwalsh9285
    @johnwalsh9285 3 місяці тому +18

    Thanks Chris thanks Garrett for all your time and work on the show

  • @patrickwong4824
    @patrickwong4824 3 місяці тому +54

    Nothing RBH did yesterday makes sense tactically. Roglič was lucky he was penalized only 20 seconds. Yes, Roglič is most likely going to win this version of the Vuelta but he is not making it easy for himself.

    • @yelapa999
      @yelapa999 3 місяці тому +4

      He seems to win like Andy Murray used to win in tennis-likes to have a little struggle. Ha!

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +17

      With just a little bit of riding on the front of the race, Red Bull would have had the red jersey since stage 4. That’s how out of control this Vuelta has been for Bora and Roglic. 🤪😜🦋👊🇪🇸

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому

      I get it that they gave the jersey away, but the amount of time was a bit much. still one minute for the last week should not be a problem.

    • @jaskepinski1096
      @jaskepinski1096 3 місяці тому

      @@ChrisHornerCyclingthis just goes to show that RBH and roglic are far from the level of pogacar and uae or jumbo and Jonas. There is no way they could win against the top squad

  • @charlestoddsullivanforpres6628
    @charlestoddsullivanforpres6628 3 місяці тому +23

    You're right about watching that stage compared to TV shows - that stage was far better and more exciting.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      Right. Thursday night tv not only brought families together, it brought friends and work friends together on Friday talking about Thursday night TV. 📺 👊🦋

  • @markvonwisco7369
    @markvonwisco7369 3 місяці тому +5

    The steepest gradient I ever rode was a 25% stretch on a climb near Passau, Germany. That part of the climb was about 500 meters. I didn't get off the bike, but I probably could have pushed the bike faster than I was riding at some points. One of the longest climbs I ever did was the Furkajoch in Vorarlberg, Austria. It's just under 22 km, with an average gradient of 5.6%. The steepest section is 16.1%.

  • @spacecadet8460
    @spacecadet8460 3 місяці тому +29

    I thought I saw the ghosts of cycling past in the foggy mountain top!

  • @kraftwerk977
    @kraftwerk977 3 місяці тому +3

    @Chris, maybe a stupid question, but if Bora already knew where they want to change the bikes, why wouldn't they send someone up the road with the bike to wait for Primoz? That bike change would for sure be a lot faster than waiting for the car at the back of the peloton ...

    • @OsellaSquadraCorse
      @OsellaSquadraCorse 3 місяці тому

      I believe that is fully against the rules. Getting a 'spare' from the car is OK, but having 'extra' bikes en route is definitely banned. Technical support:
      *2.3.029 Riders may only receive technical support from the technical personnel of their team or from one of the neutral support cars or else from the broom wagon.* Mechanical assistance at fixed locations on the course is limited to wheel changes only except for races on a circuit where bike changes can be made in the authorized zones.
      *2.3.031 No equipment for riders may be prepared or held ready outside the following vehicle.* Persons riding in vehicles shall not reach or lean out.

  • @GOlone9597
    @GOlone9597 3 місяці тому +20

    imagine if O'Connor win this Vuelta and only got 19 secs gap to Roglic...

    • @fabiovalentinuzzi5589
      @fabiovalentinuzzi5589 3 місяці тому

      O Connor Was a knucklehead too because the stage that he won he slowed down in the last km just to celebrate and enjoy the moment. I think he lost 30 seconds there.

    • @bronzilla5
      @bronzilla5 3 місяці тому +4

      @@fabiovalentinuzzi5589he went full gas

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому

      Unlikely, O’conner will have a hard time holding the podium for 2e or third. possible, but not a given)

  • @epincion
    @epincion 3 місяці тому +7

    Thanks Chris, In his interview on the 2nd rest day Roglic was quite insouciant about the 20s penalty - he had a 'it goes with the territory' attitude
    When he got to 24km before the summit finish line he knew that changing his bike in a preplanned way would require a large effort to get back because the peloton was flying along chasing down the breakaway group.
    He could have just called it off and stuck with his usual road bike. My impression was that he was only sorry that he got caught drafting and did not care one bit that drafting his team car in a preplanned manner in this situation is cheating and illegal.
    This is disappointing from one of the best riders in the world who is an inspiration to many.
    Its did not help him win the stage anyway as soon after he launched his big attack on the steepest part he hit the wall and had to slow down which is when Mas passed him by.

    • @flyingberserker3965
      @flyingberserker3965 3 місяці тому +2

      Roglic was always a wheel sucker 😂

    • @chriskelly7398
      @chriskelly7398 3 місяці тому

      He’s not one of the best in the world. He’s a sly conniving individual

  • @TheVbchaos
    @TheVbchaos 3 місяці тому +2

    Contador stood up a little bit? Oh come on, Chris. That is an understatement if ever I saw one. There is even a Contador-Challenge (riding uphill out of the saddle for 20 minutes). Contador rode up more or less the whole Mortirolo without sitting down

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому

      It was in gest, not too serious. (Im the same until it gets too steep, it allows for a less static position and more of the body to be utilised but if you can keep that +90 rpm, momentum keeps ya going)

  • @joebriggs8422
    @joebriggs8422 3 місяці тому +17

    5:57 Primož is tucked in so close to the team car it reminds me of John Howard's land speed record (since eclipsed) at Bonneville Salt Flats...all that's missing is a huge wind deflecting shroud 😉

  • @stevengagnon4777
    @stevengagnon4777 3 місяці тому +3

    Hi Chris...watched your vidio about your Olympic experience....amazing story glad you made it to the finish line. That vision thing is real...as I experienced unfortunately....yeah turns out hitting a curb straight on at 18mph is not a good idea especially with 300 gram rim....made a perfect 🥨 out of it. Amazingly the Russian training tubular was unharmed....got that from Bob Mionske....he missed a bronze by a tire at the 1988 Olympics. Highest placed American since 1912 or so. He also turned those cranks at a ridiculous low RPM uphill. He lived down the hall from me in the dorms at UW MADISON. He was aspiring to be in Olympic down hill skiing . I wouldn't be surprised if he won his first bicycle race on that touring bike he had for cross training at the time. Always liked him . Amazing lone wolf out on the circuit and able to pull off a victory. As far as I'm concerned it was a gold medal ride. Have a wonderful day.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +2

      I remember Bob very well. 👊🦋

    • @stevengagnon4777
      @stevengagnon4777 3 місяці тому +1

      @@ChrisHornerCycling he went to law school afterwards. Became a personal injury lawyer and bicycle advocate. He had a regular column for bicycle law too.

  • @xander0901
    @xander0901 3 місяці тому +16

    I honestly don’t like the idea of switching bike types/configurations in the middle of the stage. I feel it eliminates a critical aspect of gear selection since a rider can just bring in multiple different bikes. I don’t like the tactic Primoz used on Stage 15, and I especially didn’t like how the race directors basically let him get away with it. A 20 second time penalty is a significant hit, but he still took time off Ben O’Connor, so Red Bull Bora will still see it as a worthwhile trade.

    • @ConsciousBreaks
      @ConsciousBreaks 3 місяці тому +3

      But it also introduces another strategic aspect of if/when/where to change bikes.
      It's almost a non-factor outside of mountain time trials anyway, given that bikes do it all now: they are getting down to the UCI weight limit again, have very large range 12 speed cassettes, and are quite aero. So you could say that modern bike tech is eliminating the aspect of gear selection.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +3

      I thought Roglic got off light at 20” also and I would bet that when Roglic saw how big the gap was to the peloton when he got back on his mountain road bike he thought, 20” penalty, I will take it happily. 🤔🦋😱

    • @xander0901
      @xander0901 3 місяці тому +1

      @@ConsciousBreaksA lot of teams were doing a mid-stage bike change during one of the ITTs at last year’s Giro and I absolutely HATED it. Regardless of whether it gives an advantage, it felt outside the spirit of the sport to me.

    • @ConsciousBreaks
      @ConsciousBreaks 3 місяці тому

      @@xander0901 Eh, I personally don't feel that way. Different strokes for different folks.

  • @CliftonDon74
    @CliftonDon74 3 місяці тому

    Hey Chris! I also prefer standing up on climbs, using my body weight to push down the pedals. 👍. I am not a professional, but the longest single climb I have done is 9 miles. It was painful and fun at the same time.

  • @parmijo
    @parmijo 3 місяці тому +2

    I ride Sram 1X on my cross bike. It makes a lot of sense on a cross type course with very short climbs and limited top speeds. But if I ride it on the road I find I am spun out at the top end (over 30mph). I can climb with a huge cassette but those things are heavy and have big jumps in teeth resulting in cadence that feels either too slow or too fast. I don't see 1x working in competitive road racing with high speed flats and big climbs.

    • @cjohnson3836
      @cjohnson3836 3 місяці тому +1

      People have been using 1x in tour races for multiple years now. Its not for every situation, but to say its not for competitive road racing...that ship has already left the port. 1x is here to stay, even in road.

    • @parmijo
      @parmijo 3 місяці тому +2

      @@cjohnson3836 Short memory. Aqua Blue sport tried 1x with the 3T Strada. Big fail. Team folded. It lacked flexibility to be competitive in the pro peloton. Weekend warrior its fine.

    • @cjohnson3836
      @cjohnson3836 3 місяці тому

      @@parmijo Lol are you really suggesting that a chainring choice is the reason ABS folded? Really? Or was it the fact it was a limited budget Conti team that immediately trashed its profile with a doping scandal and couldn't secure a merger to save its bank account? Please tell me, are you really this mentally handicapped?
      Like, I could go into a list of very successful current riders that have used 1x in high profile races. But, I need to know if you actually have a measurable degree of functioning mental capacity before I bother.

    • @DerAusdauersportler
      @DerAusdauersportler 3 місяці тому +1

      @@parmijoVingegaard used a 1x during this Tour. You missed a lot about those weekend warriors.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      Agreed. So long as the course doesn’t fluctuate greatly it can work well. Or you are someone is very slow. 🤪🦋👊😱

  • @irondistance4313
    @irondistance4313 3 місяці тому

    Love the insight, from a champion and the only other place we can get top tier DS insight like that is from Johan B your Jedi master. The idea looks good on paper but your right chasing for 4 Km coming into the climb had to burn some matches and then he had to get right at it. If he stayed on the primary bike he might have taken another 10 seconds on Big Ben and be 33 seconds or less down to start stage 16. I’m a Rogla fan and I think he can get that minute but they made life tougher for sure

  • @jameswright4732
    @jameswright4732 3 місяці тому +4

    I think Thomas Voeckler was the king of stand up climbing. I don't think I i ever saw him in the saddle on a climb, at least when he hasn't cracked.

    • @OsellaSquadraCorse
      @OsellaSquadraCorse 3 місяці тому

      I'd humbly suggest Marco Pantani!! Of course, it turns out there were reasons why he could stand-up sprint up hills, in the drops....

  • @sondjata
    @sondjata 3 місяці тому +4

    This is what I come here for. Great video.

  • @lorenwillis425
    @lorenwillis425 3 місяці тому +2

    Top 5! great to watch you.

  • @Thepaytonb
    @Thepaytonb 3 місяці тому +2

    Do the Race Directors issue a warning before issuing a penalty? Chris are you suggesting that RBBH knew that they’d receive a penalty for drafting the team car?

  • @deanpurcell7771
    @deanpurcell7771 3 місяці тому

    Thanks Chris, always enjoy your insights.

  • @spinoza311
    @spinoza311 3 місяці тому +4

    Switching perfectly good bikes based on terrain is one of silly features of contemporary road racing. You finish with what you started on unless you have a mechanical. Of all the stupid rules the UCI has, this could be a no brainer. But perhaps the fans and/or sponsors like the silliness.

  • @savagepro9060
    @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому +2

    O'Connor is BENjoying this! Could possibly be the record for holding the GC Jersey in a single Grande Tour!

    • @hanshalkes4978
      @hanshalkes4978 3 місяці тому

      Pogačar got the GC jersey after stage 2 in this year’s Giro and held on to it till the end. O’Connor got it after stage 6. I think Pogi’s record is safe. I would very much BENjoy seeing O’Connor win the Vuelta though.

    • @savagepro9060
      @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому

      @@hanshalkes4978 Thanks for the record statistics. Oh by the way, 'BENjoy'© is copyright protected. My lawyer 🤓will talk with you🤭🤭🤭🤭🤭👍

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому

      There have been instances of the winner starting with the yellow from the year before and keeping it till the end. Ottavio Bottechia in 1924

    • @hanshalkes4978
      @hanshalkes4978 3 місяці тому +1

      @ivarbrouwer197 Bottechia may have started the 1925 TdF in yellow after winning in 1924, but @savagepro9060 mentioned ‘single grand tour’. I took that as meaning in a single year. In 1924 he wore yellow for 14 of the 15 stages. Which in absolute numbers is fewer than the 19 days Pogi wore pink. As a percentage, Bottechia takes it though. 🙂

    • @hanshalkes4978
      @hanshalkes4978 3 місяці тому

      @@savagepro9060I’m sure your lawyer and my lawyer will reach an agreement that is to both their benefit. 😂

  • @MDP1702
    @MDP1702 3 місяці тому

    I believe the bikechange would have been Roglic's decision and not the team. He also did this several times at Visma while I haven't really seen Bora doing it before.
    And yes you can argue the team should have talked him out of it, but I don't think it is so easy to talk you best rider out of something he really wants and he has already done in the past too.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      If that’s true then we can just call Primoz a knucklehead. Instead of the whole team.🤪👊🦋

  • @gypsybrother-z8q
    @gypsybrother-z8q 3 місяці тому

    💯 Chris 💯must see tv! 💥 It just seems he doesn't want the jersey until the end. Thanks for the must see content!🦋👊

  • @robbchastain3036
    @robbchastain3036 3 місяці тому +2

    That'd be an interesting discussion, Chris, one's preference for standing or sitting on climbs. And this is random but helmets with sponsor logos and colors sure make a lot of sense, very visible. The Redbull helmets on the road and The Feed helmets on gravel stand head and shoulders above the others. And was Primoz' 1x switch a paid sponsor deal? And he knows drafting team cars is wrong. Officials should lay another two-minute penalty on him, just to keep this race exciting. And for that matter, any team towing Bora should be penalized, too, for Knuckleheadism. :)

    • @GaiusPrimusMatius
      @GaiusPrimusMatius 3 місяці тому +1

      😂😂😂😂😂...2 min😂😂😂😂.. poor Primoz😂😂

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      I think that would also. Will have to find time later for it. 👊🦋👍

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому +1

      Standing vs sitting: I’m a standing climber too, but it depends on the gradient a bit. Although in my latter years I switch between the two modes from steep = standing & shallow or really steep = sitting. In general a bit of both is probably best.

    • @robbchastain3036
      @robbchastain3036 3 місяці тому

      @@ivarbrouwer197 Same here and I suppose I was always a freestyler when it came to climbing, doing one or the other or alternating or just giving up completely and dropping it into the tiny ring of my 3x, lol. And as I've thought about it, I think for me it came from a childhood on a Schwinn Sting-Ray, back in the olden days haha, and with a small frame and only one gear, you had to compensate and make the most of it and it was all we had for fun on streets and in dirt and up hills and down them, too. And I recall like yesterday being eight-years-old on my Sting-Ray in San Francisco and riding with my friends and looking up at a steep street to climb for the first time. But no problem, they started zig-zagging and up we went, a train of four of us and I was happy to be the caboose, learning the tricks of the trade. 😀

  • @AutiSam1974
    @AutiSam1974 3 місяці тому

    Bike changes should be logged by the race organiser and data submitted to UCI for analysis to ensure there isnt a pattern of rule-bending or suspicious activity by riders and teams. Tighten the rules in response if necessary.

  • @joseaphabaia1133
    @joseaphabaia1133 3 місяці тому

    I love hearing you allways looking for your explaination ...i think bora stoped too far from the uphill...so rogla couldnt come back ..he has no big ring ...😅😅

  • @johnsenior478
    @johnsenior478 3 місяці тому

    What you can see is BRB demonstrating 1. They’ve never had a GT winner leading the team before. 2. They’ve never ridden for GC before.3. They feel immense pressure to demonstrate they know what they’re doing to RB. 4. They’re desperate to close the gap on OConnor. 5. They think they can do it on this one stage by throwing all kinds of things at it and forget that there’s a long way to go and it ends on a TT. So.. they decide to do a bike change where and when it can’t have made much sense in the bus - and then..even with the race in front of them they don’t change the plan. If Rog wins this race it’s going to be in spite of, not because of their race strategy.

  • @markbradtke5962
    @markbradtke5962 3 місяці тому +3

    20 sec,...should have been a 1 min penalty for a non mechanical & technical advantage.

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому +1

      Nah, the barrage situation would have been great: let the race decide itself.

  • @jcoul1sc
    @jcoul1sc 3 місяці тому +15

    Is this the best butterfly effect yet

    • @leduch
      @leduch 3 місяці тому

      @@trappymctrapface1319 not yet

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      Just about 🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋👊

    • @swisstopia
      @swisstopia 3 місяці тому

      Butterfly Effect is the best cycling channel on UA-cam. 🦋👊👍

  • @Magnetohydrodynamik
    @Magnetohydrodynamik 3 місяці тому +1

    Even if the climb is super steep it is still not a reason to go on 1by.
    This was a decision of Marketing and Advertising from SRAM, which in this case was more important than the race/sport.
    unbelieveable

  • @janweyant8902
    @janweyant8902 3 місяці тому +2

    These stages are for cycling fans what netflix is for movie go-ers!

  • @JoostMehrtens
    @JoostMehrtens 3 місяці тому

    If you do a bike change have a domestique do it for you.
    Then you change with him which will be a lot faster.

  • @stevenappelget3564
    @stevenappelget3564 3 місяці тому

    Knucklehead count: 4 (counting the video overlay)
    We learned in yesterday's stage there's a fine line between clever and knuckleheadism.

  • @ollaum
    @ollaum 3 місяці тому +1

    This is what I luv about YouToob. I get to criticise a grand tour winner criticising a multiple grand tour winner 😘💥😉. I’ll get my coat!

  • @michaelbergfeld8751
    @michaelbergfeld8751 3 місяці тому

    Maybe it would help if Roglic turned into Frogglic, because tactics haven been dreaming up till now.

  • @allphornunn
    @allphornunn 3 місяці тому

    This is the ONE channel where the sponsor promo is 100%
    fact. CH is brilliant to partner w Lupine, those lights are beyond premium. Too rich for my blood atm but one day... Anyway another first-rate, no-punches-pulled breakdown of all knuckleheadery lol. Sorry I just can't help drooling a bit every time i see the backdrop 😂✌🏻️

  • @jcoul1sc
    @jcoul1sc 3 місяці тому +11

    Indurain rode triple front campagnolo back in the day

    • @leduch
      @leduch 3 місяці тому +2

      me to 2024!

    • @savagepro9060
      @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому +3

      At some point in 'back in the day' triple chainrings were the rage. I remember that!
      Remember too, that 'back in the day' the largest cassette in the back was about 26 . . . not today's 32!

    • @stevengagnon4777
      @stevengagnon4777 3 місяці тому +1

      Still running 8s so I use a triple. The main thing is that it allows me to go back to a 42t chain ring again ( the 39 just never felt right and I do have a theory about that ) and a 30×23 is plenty low for Wisconsin. Never had an issue with chain drops either if so that would be easily fixed ...that third eye chain watcher is very effective.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +2

      The famous Tripple. Last used in my day for the San Francisco GP. So I’m told by the sprinters that were there racing. I never actually checked my self but heard the stories. No kidding, every time we turned the corner to start the climb I thought, Nope, it can’t be done, there’s no way a bicycle has enough traction to get up that road. 🤪😱🦋👊

    • @ivarbrouwer197
      @ivarbrouwer197 3 місяці тому +1

      At the time, gears at the back couldn’t have that wide spread, so a triple was great, but a pro would never need it then. But there are more and more steep climbs used in racing these days. The problem was I never had a good idea when it was time to use it. (And later when I was really fit I never needed to)

  • @blakefx
    @blakefx 3 місяці тому

    I suspect it was a favour to the sponsor, SRAM. Intended to be some nice publicity of their groupset but didn’t quite work out that way.
    Primoz ended up cheating and I think he got off very lightly with just a 20 second penalty. As you said, if it had been a flat tyre or similar issue, it would be more acceptable to be on the team car for a while.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      I always wonder about the sponsors asking him to ride 1x just a stage like this. 🤔🦋😳👊

  • @randyke8uvm443
    @randyke8uvm443 3 місяці тому +1

    Would it have been better to make the change after starting the uphill?

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      If you didn’t have the cars help. Absolutely. 😜🚗🦋👊

  • @AlexChristians-gn9nj
    @AlexChristians-gn9nj 3 місяці тому

    I wonder if this was a SRAM stunt? The new SRAM Red group now has a 10-36 cassette (vs 33 max before) and they could used a 46-33 chainset and still have a lower gear than what his 1x rig was running (likely 44/44 if he had any hope of keeping up on the run in). Doesn’t make sense to me and he should definitely have been penalised more. Dumb move.

  • @bjornlangoren3002
    @bjornlangoren3002 3 місяці тому +2

    He has swapped bikes for the mountain before as well.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      Roglic seems to like his 1X. But even in today’s article Rog admitted to it being the wrong choice. 🦋👊

  • @tamasvarga67
    @tamasvarga67 3 місяці тому

    Isn’t it possible that SRAM is pushing their 1x and Bora had to find a stage where to show it off?

  • @BoxCarBoy12
    @BoxCarBoy12 3 місяці тому +3

    I hope the knucklehead-ism continues from RBH and causes Benedict Roglic to lose this Vuelta. Then I can laugh and say that Judas Vingegaard and Benedict Roglic are nothing without Sepp because then the fact that neither of them have won a grand tour without him will still be true 😂

  • @Tommy31416
    @Tommy31416 3 місяці тому

    Was Primoz worried about putting too much pressure on his back if he stuck with the 54/40 11-34?

  • @secretagent86
    @secretagent86 3 місяці тому

    Nice shirt Chris

  • @musclelessfitness2045
    @musclelessfitness2045 3 місяці тому

    I liked the video before even watching it 🤣 I love it when you call these knuckleheads out 👌🦋

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      Stage 15 was magical. All entertainment all stage long. 😜🦋👊

  • @mokasusa
    @mokasusa 3 місяці тому +1

    Alberto Contador stood a bit?😅
    Chuck Norris didnt have a saddle at all, because he never even set down at all😂

    • @irondistance4313
      @irondistance4313 3 місяці тому +1

      He probably used the leather to make a vest 😂

    • @savagepro9060
      @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому

      Chuck sat on the seat pole. It was lubricated.

  • @bronzilla5
    @bronzilla5 3 місяці тому

    It is super simple. Roglič arrives at the amateur team Jumbo Visma (Giro mistakes, TDF mistakes) later makes it the best team in the peleton. Roglič arrives at amateur Bora team with again tons of amateur mistakes in two years Bora will be the best team in peleton, just unlucky Roglic syndrome.

  • @powerwindpro
    @powerwindpro 3 місяці тому +1

    The real problem was soudal, they ruined the bora tactics because maybe just maybe bora wanted to give 15 minutes to de break away and have roglic rested,

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      Maybe. Bora love to keep the team rested at literally any cost. 😜🤪🦋👊

  • @jeremystacy5870
    @jeremystacy5870 3 місяці тому

    I love to stand while climbing!

  • @jaskepinski1096
    @jaskepinski1096 3 місяці тому

    It seems absolutely ridiculous to me. Sram has available a 33 front chainring and a 36T rear cassette. Thet would be plenty enough

  • @kylebreier2812
    @kylebreier2812 3 місяці тому +1

    I am a 45 year old 200ish pound dude who can regularly climb a 20 percent grade on a double... and I'm not even that good. I'm sure that Roglic can relatively easily climb a 24 percent grade on a double, especially if my fat old butt can get up the mountains here in upstate N.Y..

  • @iacobogallus2110
    @iacobogallus2110 3 місяці тому

    Change where nobody else does it is badmove. It makes sense only in TT. And Primož admitted that they lost more than gained.
    And the team does not control the race at all....
    Bora needs to hire Chris for DS.

  • @jcoul1sc
    @jcoul1sc 3 місяці тому +1

    Think you and Contador are the last of the uphill standing riders, just not aerodynamic enough

    • @adamfeerst2575
      @adamfeerst2575 3 місяці тому +3

      How much aerodynamics are there at 10%+? Might any additional power from standing more than offset that?

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      I always thought it was strange that there wasn’t more of us. 🤔🦋😱👊

  • @nycheesehead
    @nycheesehead 3 місяці тому +1

    With the gearing on today's bikes, changing bikes makes absolutely no sense.

    • @ernestkrajnc6412
      @ernestkrajnc6412 3 місяці тому

      Maybe commercial things ( money) ? Just guesing
      ..

  • @marylandflyer5670
    @marylandflyer5670 3 місяці тому

    Castrillo def going to be a star - can he time trial decently?

  • @Arby-f6t
    @Arby-f6t 3 місяці тому +2

    Chris what's your opinion that Marc.Soler is the new Thomas de Gendt?

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      Holy moly. I never thought about him like that but Soler probably is in more breaks than De Gendt even was. Now if Soler wins a couple more times I would agree 100% with you.🤔🦋👊

  • @Eirikkinserdal
    @Eirikkinserdal 3 місяці тому

    Contador stood a bit? He stood a lot 😂

  • @stansolo4138
    @stansolo4138 3 місяці тому

    Not sure why Bora let their best climber Vlasov stay at the front instead of pulling Primoz up the steepest climb ?

  • @savagepro9060
    @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому

    Does that give O'Connor the record for holding the Red Jersey for a longest number of stages in a single Vuelta?
    Also, does that give him the record for the longest held GC jersey in ANY grand tour?

    • @Eirikkinserdal
      @Eirikkinserdal 3 місяці тому

      Tadej almost wore the leader jersey in the whole of both the giro and tour

    • @savagepro9060
      @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому

      @@Eirikkinserdal Thanks, I guess I lost track following the ALIEN

  • @robbchastain3036
    @robbchastain3036 3 місяці тому +7

    Or maybe Felix was told to knock it off with dropping Ben and he opted to bail out instead? That was Visma-like disrespect, his leaving Ben in his wake like that. Not every day that a team gets to wear the leader's jersey in a Grand Tour. And with all the good vibes the team has earned for their great season, why embarrass a fan favorite who is leading now as Sepp did last year. And on top of that, he broke the Number One Rule on the Butterfly Effect, something no Chesterfieldlian can cheer. 😀

    • @epincion
      @epincion 3 місяці тому +4

      There are reports that Ben told Gall to go on as he knew he was capable of getting to the finish at his own steady pace and Gall who stays with AG2R next year should be given the chance to see what he could do against the top GC guys.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      Agreed. Ag2R took the business side of the sport instead of the loyal side allowing Gall to leave Ben and broke the #1 rule. I wonder if though what the story is on Ben’s departure. Or more importantly how Ag2R feel about it. Would love to hear that from a few people in the team. 🤔🦋👊👂

    • @epincion
      @epincion 3 місяці тому +1

      @@ChrisHornerCycling Chris you have a high enough profile and professional record as a WT level cyclist such that current riders and DS’s will take your call. I’m sure once this Vuelta is over you could reach out to O’Connor for a conversation.

    • @robbchastain3036
      @robbchastain3036 3 місяці тому

      @@epincion That could very well be the case and I am not here to say one way or the other, just speculate. And so Ben might've said that simply to deflect any drama so he can concentrate on the heavy work at hand, much like Sepp did last year, he had a race to win and didn't have drama time for calling out teammates. And his bosses, my goodness, this is the dream come true, Red at La Vuelta, living the dream. And Ben is total class to be doing his best despite being a short-timer about to leave for another team. He could mail it in but no, he is defending his jersey like a champion. And against the Coyote, no less, complete with his secret roadside Acme bikes. And ha, in case you're unaware of the reference, I am referring to the Road Runner cartoon series, where the Coyote is always trying to derail Road Runner with all sorts of tricks and antics and sideways glances and gizmos from Acme Supplies. 😀 .

  • @roblipton9121
    @roblipton9121 3 місяці тому

    not sure why Roglic needed the bike change, he's the Pogecar of this Vuelta, he just has to be close to Ben and Maas at the last day TT and he'll easily win, everyone knows this - yes Chris, Roglic has an accident or goes full knucklehead, but that's true of everyone.

  • @csarcpab
    @csarcpab 3 місяці тому

    Seems RB Bora watched the butterfly effect cause today they rode for free at the expense of the other Knuckleheads AG2R included! 😂😂😂 Can't wait for tonight's TBE🙌🏻

  • @BlueModro
    @BlueModro 3 місяці тому

    There is no such business as show business. And now everybody talks about Red bull and Rogla what they did or didn't do. So marketing is working ;)

  • @ZENmud
    @ZENmud 3 місяці тому

    Aren't the odds that Roglic has a chance of winning [unwritten] roughly 66% to 50% based on past GT GC results?
    ☮️🤔 ... I'd love to hear a bit more, on the three riders also chasing available podium places: Mas, and (can't recall names, sitting 4th & 5th).
    Ben could hang on to 1st (hoping, but rationale), 2nd place (possibly, if only losing to Primoz by a short minute overall), or 3rd (most likely, if most BE 🦋 🛋 are predicting well?), or worse.
    ("Given")
    Primoz? Six more low knucklehead(s), zero falls, zero mechanicals, and no bad days? 1st or 2nd...
    Six more "only takes one [unwritten]" and he's out of contention.
    Mas, and the 4th through 6th riders are going to be the major players, and "home advantage" might help (from any Spanish speaking country) decide.
    This coming "Six Days of Vuelta" will be #Fiesta 🎉 not #Siesta 💤💤💤

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      That’s up to Ben but third or fourth I would I say. First we all believe is roglic but we all know Roglic has some issues to deal with within him and his team Bora that will affect him winning more then Ben right now and your percentages given above prove that because he should have more Vuelta wins, two Giro wins, and a TdF win. 🤔😱🦋🔥🇪🇸🤞

  • @BinaryClay
    @BinaryClay 3 місяці тому

    I really like Primos as a rider and in my naivity I thought he wasn’t a cheater. I stand corrected. If he wins the Vuelta with a small margin we all know why.

  • @joannaglasby2596
    @joannaglasby2596 3 місяці тому +5

    I just know Primoz was pissed when he saw he got docked for 20 seconds and Ben was breathing a sigh of relief.
    Also how do you feel about our man Victor Campenaerts going to VLAB next year?

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +2

      I have mixed emotions for on that. Overall I think it will be good for Camp and hopefully good for us but we may lose what really makes Camp camp I fear. 😱🤞🦋👊❤️

  • @dennisdeyoung5428
    @dennisdeyoung5428 3 місяці тому

    Berrade had never won a race before, so Cattaneo had as good a chance to win the stage!

  • @gerrysecure5874
    @gerrysecure5874 3 місяці тому +2

    I have long ago unsubscribed from the idea professional athletes have a reasonable understanding of tactics since Rominger switched his brakes and fell. Its mostly power and rarely brains.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      The European races are so hard and long that power is without a doubt important. Here in the US where I grew up though power was not a premium tool like in Europe. The climbs are softer, shorter, few in numbers, and the distance of the races overall about two thirds almost or very often. So racing here in US I had to learn the importance of tactics. While I was racing in Europe I had to learn the important of sitting on the wheel and save, save, and save some more. Then hope you had power left still for the last climb. If you are the best rider in Europe you just had to learn how to use your team wisely and then your fitness always won you the race more often then not, if your team could just get you to the last climb and slightly up it. If you are pogi then just to 81k to go. 🤪😂 ⛰️🤔👊🦋

  • @aghorn
    @aghorn 3 місяці тому

    What blew me away watching Sunday’s stage on Peacock is that Vandevelde and Roll did not notice that Gall was not in the front group until near the end of the stage. I kept scanning the group for Gall and eventually seeing O’Connor isolated after another Decathlon cyclist dropped. I couldn’t believe how long it took for Christian and Bob to notice this.

  • @fastfire04
    @fastfire04 3 місяці тому

    Why didn’t they just have a soigner on the side of the road ahead of the climb with his bike? Couldn’t he have just switched from the front of the group and get right back in the group near the back?

    • @ConsciousBreaks
      @ConsciousBreaks 3 місяці тому +1

      That's against the rules.
      Ganna was disqualified in 2022 for that.

    • @fastfire04
      @fastfire04 3 місяці тому

      @@ConsciousBreaksah okay. That makes sense.

  • @smithandshortdogs
    @smithandshortdogs 3 місяці тому +1

    Chris, I would not normally question your analysis, because you are an expert and I am not.
    In this case (though it doesn't change the poor tactical choices and the consequences of them), I think you are wrong about the utility of 1x.
    1) It is virtually impossible to get an SL7 to 6.8 with 2x. It is easy with 1×. Looking at the choice of wheels, weight was a factor.
    2) I don't recall your exact words but you said 2x has more range. I think you are mistaken here. 2x MAMIL gearing goes from 1 to 1 in the easiest gear to 5 to 1 in the hardest (500%). 1x is available in 520%. As his cassette was larger than his brake rotor it looks like he might have been using a 10-52 mtb casette.
    3) in theory 1x should be virtually immune to chain drop which could be an advantage if you are shifting under load.
    Do these points outweigh putting yourself and your team into the black to catch back if everything goes perfect... probably not. Plus as you point out, nothing goes perfect.

    • @fernandovega5722
      @fernandovega5722 3 місяці тому

      That's not a 10-52. The derailleur cage is too small for a 52.

    • @michaelrandall9034
      @michaelrandall9034 3 місяці тому

      In love with the 1x uh. Not me.
      Regardless it was stupid to switch.

    • @smithandshortdogs
      @smithandshortdogs 3 місяці тому

      @@michaelrandall9034 no... our road bikes are all 2x, just pointing out a minor factual discrepancy.

    • @dcataj5085
      @dcataj5085 3 місяці тому

      Postmortem Aqua Blue 1x drivetrains for road bikes.

    • @michaelrandall9034
      @michaelrandall9034 3 місяці тому

      @@smithandshortdogs 🍻

  • @jcoul1sc
    @jcoul1sc 3 місяці тому +1

    All the races came together after festina affair and said they would implement more rules stringently, variety of stages, variance of climbs rating, no helicopter downdraughts and motorbike slipstream, etc.

  • @recrevs963
    @recrevs963 3 місяці тому

    What happened or where is your Vuelta winning Trek Madone?

  • @randyscorner9434
    @randyscorner9434 3 місяці тому +6

    Roglic and his two teammates should have been sanctioned. Nibali was DQ'd when he held onto the car for an extended time. This is little different from that. Roglic looks more and more like a "win at any cost" kind of guy and I've been turned off from being a fan.

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      I would love to know whose decision it was on Bora. Whether it was Roglic or the DS or maybe even a sponsor that pushed for this. I don’t think Roglic planned to be behind the car exactly the way he did it. I would bet Bora and Roglic thought the caravan would still be there to do all of the drafting which is legal. 🤔🦋👍

  • @cmmoll1
    @cmmoll1 3 місяці тому

    Hopefully Roglic/Bora got a big bucket of money from Sram to advertise 1x, which they’re pushing hard (since they can’t make a good front derailleur). If not, they’re just knuckleheads.

  • @ZENmud
    @ZENmud 3 місяці тому +1

    [2] Gall ended the stage 26min back? Or he "lost 26min" on the descent from the penultimate climb, between summit and valley floor?
    The first seems likely; the latter seems impossible unless he had to sit on a toilet with "the runs"? Chris talked about "26 minutes back after the descent" (if memory serves), and that would be 2min/kilometer (+/-).
    Hmmmm? 😮

  • @michaelrandall9034
    @michaelrandall9034 3 місяці тому

    Stand and deliver!
    Sspd good times…

  • @corneackermann2176
    @corneackermann2176 3 місяці тому

    Bora has not been strategically smart for too many stages so far this race

  • @savagepro9060
    @savagepro9060 3 місяці тому

    4:24 That will be the day when lady riders can do THAT while on the bike. Perhaps they're already doing it. Who knows?

  • @imalec
    @imalec 3 місяці тому +1

    👊🦋❤️

  • @sprez
    @sprez 3 місяці тому

    I have two 1x bikes and one 2x bike for a total of one bike.

  • @ogradar85
    @ogradar85 3 місяці тому

    Wrong again...If Quickstep wouldn't have pulled, you still had 4 teams ready to defend their GC position against Sivakov before Bora. In addition, AG2R was right behind QS and Bora still had 2 helpers in the peloton 9 km to the finish, 1 of them dropped when Cattaneo started his pull in the peloton 9 km to go. Then Roglič had only Lipowitz as his helper who could have pulled from 9 km - 3km to go, that's when the steep part of climb started. Bora had it covered. Besides, I think their plan was to only reduce the gap to BOC, not take the lead. Plenty of climbs left to do that and the team doesn't need to work and control stages for a couple more days.

  • @robbchastain3036
    @robbchastain3036 3 місяці тому

    Somebody should fact-check that. Chris may have started racing on five-speed campus bikes, hence his distaste for 1x. 😀

  • @ronm9357
    @ronm9357 3 місяці тому

    🍻

  • @Phlakaton88
    @Phlakaton88 3 місяці тому

    Should have been penalized a full minute. 20 second. Peh. Planned change. Planned drafting. This isn’t a technical or bad luck and using cars to get back on. This was premeditated nonsense.

  • @tenzingyurme4058
    @tenzingyurme4058 3 місяці тому

    Bora-Red Bull was always going to put Primos in a tough position, because the team is weak and the DS is an idiot......and I don't think his form is good enough to Win in spite of that....the question is, will Ben O'Conner lose? as his form is definitely sus..

  • @jammin_5619
    @jammin_5619 3 місяці тому

    Primoz Knucklehead Roglic . Ridiculous tactics, really what did he even hope to gain with 1x ? Weight? Gearing?
    Surely for the weights gained he could cover Gearing with a 2x . With a bidon and a couple of gels ejected at base of climb

  • @wsbygt
    @wsbygt 3 місяці тому +1

    20 SECONDS... its harsh but doesn´t matter and will not give others the reason to moan about Roglic´s "unfair advantage", Roglic got this one.
    Tomorrown should interesting ... mountain stage finish with well over 10% segments!!

  • @ernestkrajnc6412
    @ernestkrajnc6412 3 місяці тому

    I just don't get it! Is my Slovenian guy so naive or what hapended there?? A pro with 10 years of expdrience does this??? There must be some other explanation

  • @jcoul1sc
    @jcoul1sc 3 місяці тому +3

    1x saves 50grams

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому

      Not as light as Butterfly wings. 😱🤪🦋👊🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋🦋

  • @n.h2786
    @n.h2786 3 місяці тому

    At the end, RBH make what supposed to be a straight forward stage into a complicated one. Trying to get fancy with bike change in the middle of T-Rex pacing hard upfront. Wondering if they learnt their lesson, and not tyring to get fancy with bike change for Lagos de Covadonga. Decathlon, at least, now Gall will commit to ride for O'Connor. LOL. I guess karma..😂😂

  • @h20s8804
    @h20s8804 3 місяці тому +1

    So incredibly dumb. No reasonable explanation.

  • @mahparraXyt
    @mahparraXyt 3 місяці тому +2

    Well I respect Primoz but I am hoping he makes more mistakes so we have a different winner!! Go knuckleheads!!

    • @ChrisHornerCycling
      @ChrisHornerCycling  3 місяці тому +1

      At least a couple more mistakes so the race stays super entertaining. 🤪🦋👊

  • @goatbloat8233
    @goatbloat8233 3 місяці тому

    roglic 20" penalfication